QMap - Mapping Help

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Mapping Help
Posted by inertia [207.95.173.177], 21/06/2000 19:15 GMT
This thread is for mapping related technical questions. When posting a question, please include the following in addition to your problem; - What game you're trying to edit for - What editor you're using - Any error messages you've recieved Including these points will help people answer your question. To save the same questions being repeated time after time, some common questions are listed below. Q: Which is the best editor to use? A: There is no best editor, use the one that works best for you. Try out a variety of editors and then make the choice for yourself. Some of the common editors available are; - Worldcraft: Used for , and (although for it's now called Valve Hammer Editor) - QERadiant: Used for (and if you use the conversion tool provided by SleepwalkR) - GTKRadiant: Used for , RTCW and most other QIII engine games (and if you use the conversion tool provided by SleepwalkR and change the default texture scale) - Qoole: Used for , , , Heretic II, Hexen II and Sin - QuArK: Used for , , , , Elite Force, Kingpin, Sin, Heretic II and Soldier of Fortune - UnrealEd: Used for Unreal and Q: How do I set the message that's displayed when I enter my level? A: You need to set a value for the 'message' key under the worldspawn entity. How this is done depends on which editor you use, but it is generally found under 'Map Properties' (or similar). Q: Where can I find new textures to use in my level? A: You can try either the BigHouse textures page or for WADs, try the TFQLR textures page. Q: How do I extract textures from a .map or .bsp? A: You can't do this with .map files, only .bsp files as .map files are just plain text. Open the .bsp into TexMex and then simply go to File->Save As and save it as a .wad And please, let's try to keep this professional and without any flaming.

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About Compiling

#1 Posted by inertia [207.95.173.177], 21/06/2000 21:30 GMT

Well, I was wondering, when you compile a q1 map, does the order go BSP, Lite, then VIS? Or BSP, VIS, then Lite? Help would be appreciated.

BSP; LITE; VIS

#2 Posted by GrindSpire [193.113.185.164], 22/06/2000 08:03 GMT , Refers to Post #1

Thats just for Q1 tho...

RE: BSP; LITE; VIS

#3 Posted by inertia [199.35.235.37], 22/06/2000 08:17 GMT , Refers to Post #2

thanks, right before you posted i'd talked to some folks on #tf about it too :) (also right before you came into #tf, hehe)

RE: About Compiling

#4 Posted by Tyrann [203.56.239.200], 22/06/2000 12:56 GMT , Refers to Post #1

Actually, as long as you do QBSP first, it doesn't matter which order the other two are in. The "traditional" order is QBSP, LIGHT, VIS; but if you are mucking around with colored lights, you may need to have the order QBSP, VIS, LIGHT.

#5 Posted by Psycotic [195.5.73.179], 24/06/2000 12:26 GMT

I need gothic textures for q3:A Please if somebody know where I can find them toll me.
thanks.

Grey Surfaces

#6 Posted by Gilt [154.5.69.4], 24/06/2000 21:02 GMT

I have this problem in Q1 where a surface is consistently grey. It is not affected by r_speeds and it is always the same surface.

Sometimes it will disappear after I continue mapping, but then it will come back again on the same surface and maybe another one too, after some more editing. It is hard to pinpoint the reason because the changes are on the other side of the map and there is seemingly no connection between the two.

Thanks if you can shed any type of light on the problem, or how to fix it.

RE: Grey Surfaces

#7 Posted by CZG [130.67.143.117], 24/06/2000 21:22 GMT , Refers to Post #6

Sounds like you've got some greyflash there. Greyflash usually comes from that the surrounding area is a bit to complex, or that your Vis program is doing some bad stuff. Try switching to another Vis, and if that doesn't work, try to simplify that area.
There is one more thing that might be wrong though, but I really doubt it. If you make your map with custom textures, but forget to make submips (smaller versions of a texture,) for one, that texure will show up as grey from a distance. Doubt this is the prob though, as most wad tools these days create submips automatically.

Good luck
-
CZG

RE: Grey Surfaces

#8 Posted by Fat Controller [203.96.101.219], 25/06/2000 03:25 GMT , Refers to Post #6

Sometimes, with fairly complex architecture, VIS will clip away part (or all!) of a brush face. The result is a window into the Grey Void (and any other bits of map in that direction).

One way to get around the problem is to "merge" a couple of textures together to use less brushes.

I had this happen with VIS removing the "baseboards" on some walls in one atrium. So, I made a wall tex with baseboards built right in. Not only did this fix the problem, but reduced brushcount as well. So the level ran faster :)

RE: RE: Grey Surfaces

#9 Posted by Gilt [154.5.69.205], 26/06/2000 04:24 GMT , Refers to Post #7

Thanks both of you for your answers, much appreciated. The info you've given me has helped me at least try to fix the problem, but the whole VIS process sounds like it can be a bit chancey at times.

Now I've got a new question.
CZG said that the problem might be with the compiler. My question is which compilers are best for QBSP and VIS? and where can I get them?

#10 Posted by Vondur [194.87.189.190], 26/06/2000 06:42 GMT , Refers to Post #9

Well, my favorite compilers are:

WQBSP 1.65 - supports transparent water, you can get it from The Forge [files section]
http://www.planetquake.com/worldcraft/index2.shtm

RVIS+ - A faster vis program... with a progress indicator [modified by Tyrann].

Tyrlite - Modified lite prog... with a progerss indicator [modified by Tyrann].
This compiler contains all features from iklite and arghlite. Very useful.

You can get rvis+ and tyrlite from Tyrann's page: http://www.planetquake.com/tyrann/

Good luck

RE: RE: Grey Surfaces

#11 Posted by Tyrann [203.56.239.113], 26/06/2000 07:19 GMT , Refers to Post #8

Sometimes, with fairly complex architecture, VIS will clip away part (or all!) of a brush face. The result is a window into the Grey Void (and any other bits of map in that direction).
Actually, this problem shows itself at the QBSP stage, before VIS has even been run (assuming we are both seeing the same effect). I think it is to do with QBSP incorrectly spliting brush faces or trying to merge some that shouldn't be. Sometimes deleting the problem brush and redrawing it works (changing the order of brushes in the map file), or you can try spliting the face into triangles yourself to save QBSP the trouble.

#12 Posted by CZG [130.67.142.104], 26/06/2000 14:31 GMT , Refers to Post #10

I've actually had times where I had this greyflash (or Hom in GlQuake) go away after I switched from rvis to Hvis which I use now. Hvis isn't quite as fast as rvis though, but it has got this cute little porgress thing with portals done and portals in total and percentage and estimated time and all the cutsy bits

Now where did I get Hvis from? I don't think it's up for download, LordHavoc that made it sent it to me on IRC so...

RE: Compilers.

#13 Posted by Vondur [194.87.189.190], 27/06/2000 11:25 GMT , Refers to Post #12

hmm, i have to catch LH then =]

Newbie Map Maker..

#14 Posted by daishi [195.92.67.68], 02/07/2000 00:20 GMT

Hi I've just started using Radiant and I've started my very first map (woohoo) but when I compile it and try to see it in Q3 it gets as far as loading the map then dumps me out into the main menu ... which after a day of doing this is becoming a pain in the ass

#15 Posted by killazontherun [203.164.3.164], 02/07/2000 06:06 GMT

In the console type sv_pure 0 first then try loading your map.

#16 Posted by daishi [195.92.67.76], 02/07/2000 17:28 GMT , Refers to Post #15

Also, Daishi

#17 Posted by Lunaran [152.163.213.183], 02/07/2000 18:08 GMT , Refers to Post #14

Remember to put a player start in, because that can do it also.

I went nuts once before trying to find why my map wouldn't load, and it turned out there was no info_player_start.

#18 Posted by GrindSpire [62.7.115.79], 02/07/2000 20:27 GMT

OK, on my new Q1 map I get the following from my compile tools...
** Executing...
** Command: C:Program FilesWorldCraftQToolsQbsp.exe
** Parameters: D:QUAKEID1mapsGSDM3

Transparent water QBSP with Hipnotic extensions
MultiWAD version 1.65
by Ken Alverson based on original code by John Carmack

outputfile: D:QUAKEID1mapsGSDM3.bsp
--- LoadMapFile ---
D:QUAKEID1mapsGSDM3.map
352 brushes
4 entities
7 miptex
20 texinfo
building hulls sequentially...
--- Brush_LoadEntity ---
351 brushes read
---- CSGFaces ----
2837 brushfaces
11327 csgfaces
2090 mergedfaces
----- SolidBSP -----
3123 split nodes
1453 solid leafs
1671 empty leafs
0 water leafs
5051 leaffaces
4694 nodefaces
----- portalize ----
----- FillOutside ----
2302 outleafs
----- SolidBSP -----
866 split nodes
540 solid leafs
327 empty leafs
0 water leafs
2303 leaffaces
2078 nodefaces
MODEL: *1
--- FinishBSPFile ---
WriteBSPFile: D:QUAKEID1mapsGSDM3.bsp
added 0 texture frames
1112 planes 22240
4066 vertexes 48792
2161 nodes 51864
20 texinfo 800
3969 faces 79380
1629 clipnodes 13032
1347 leafs 37716
4372 marksurfaces 8744
15633 surfedges 31266
9772 edges 39088
7 textures 139032
lightdata 0
visdata 0
entdata 378
30.0 seconds elapsed

** Executing...
** Command: C:Program FilesWorldCraftQToolsrvis.exe
** Parameters: D:QUAKEID1mapsGSDM3

---- vis ----
LoadPortals: couldn't read D:QUAKEID1mapsGSDM3.prt
No vising performed.

Can someone tell me why it won't VIS? Please...

#19 Posted by CZG [130.67.142.101], 03/07/2000 00:36 GMT

For some oddball reason the Qbsp doesn't go through the MergeAll bit of itself, and thus doesn't write a portalsfile, even though it doesn't leak. I see you're running this from within WorldCraft. Maybe try to run it from a normal Dos prompt. If that doesn't help, try a diffrent Qbsp. You're using WQbsp, which I also use and have had no troubles with, but you never know.

CZG

I Forgot Sumthin'

#20 Posted by CZG [130.67.142.101], 03/07/2000 00:39 GMT , Refers to Post #19

Try running WQbsp with the -verbose command. Maybe that'll reveal some details on your problem.

It Looks To Me

#21 Posted by Lunaran [205.188.192.39], 03/07/2000 01:02 GMT

like that "Fill Outside" part doesn't belong there. It's not supposed to fill outside, it's supposed to fill just the inside.

... is it? Spog?

Dodgy Qbsp'ing

#22 Posted by Tron [203.12.165.144], 03/07/2000 02:37 GMT

I seem to remember having the same problem once myself where it wasn't leaking but still wouldn't compile. Try using a dif version of qbsp, I think that fixed it up for me.

Tron

Q3map -vis Just.. Crashes?

#23 Posted by ->2k<-Seb [212.54.69.132], 03/07/2000 04:25 GMT

yeah, I can bsp and light just fine, but vis just comes up with this:

Q3map has caused an error in Q3MAP.EXE.
Q3map will now close.

The output is here, with verbose on..:

Q3Map v1.0m (c) 1999 Id Software Inc.
---- vis ----
verbose = true
1 threads
qdir: d:quakei~1
gamedir: d:/quakei~1/baseq3/
reading d:quakei~1baseq3mapsctf_22.bsp
reading d:quakei~1baseq3mapsctf_22.prt
1203 portalclusters
3436 numportals
4363 numfaces
6872 active portals
1034 hint portals
visdatasize:182864
0...1...2...3...4...5...6...7...8...9... (38)
7 average number of passages per leaf
22 MB required passage memory
0...1...2...3...4...5...6...7...

Then it crashes. =(
I've spent all night trying to fix it, but have had no luck..

#24 Posted by ->2k<-Seb [212.54.69.249], 03/07/2000 04:54 GMT , Refers to Post #23

then I simply disconnect from the internet, and then it just vis' perfectly? ..rofl

FUCKING MUTHA...

#25 Posted by than [212.49.240.232], 04/07/2000 10:58 GMT

FUCKING SPARKLIES!?!!?!?!?!??!

what the causes two curves which are aligned perfectly in the editor to become slightly misaligned in game which in turn causes small cracks to appear between them allowing you to see into the hall of mirrors that lies beyond!? WHY DO WE HAVE TO PUT UP WITH THIS CRAP!? I tried moving some vertexes along a little bit but the problem still occurs. It only happens on two curves in my map and once of them is a copy of the other anyway so it's more like one. I know you have all (q3 mappers anyway) had this problem at one time or another so can someone give me some help?

please?

-than

RE: FUCKING MUTHA...

#26 Posted by GrindSpire [193.113.185.164], 04/07/2000 21:35 GMT , Refers to Post #25

It doesn't help but I had this problem in Q1, bloody annoying isn't it!

RE: FUCKING MUTHA...

#27 Posted by Maj [193.128.238.146], 06/07/2000 20:38 GMT , Refers to Post #25

Than, you have put caulk behind the curves right?

#28 Posted by than [212.49.252.58], 06/07/2000 21:34 GMT

it's not a caulking prob

RE: FUCKING MUTHA...

#29 Posted by VooDoo6 [24.161.240.62], 07/07/2000 06:33 GMT , Refers to Post #25

Do you have one of the later versions of q3r?
im not completely sure on this, but i think that might have somthing to do with it.

Im prolly wrong but thats the only thing i can think of.

#30 Posted by than [212.49.235.132], 07/07/2000 07:40 GMT

I have q3r 201. Lun already told me the prob was to do with the lod calculations done on the two adjacent patches (I had an inkling of a feeling that this may have been the prob (honest :)). I haven't done this yet but Lun said increasing the patch density of one of the patches should help. Still, I know that will just cause more problems because I am using this patch for a floor, two trims and walls on both sides. The problem only occurs between the floor and the innermost trim on the curve.

Such is life eh?

-than

Grid W/vodoo

#31 Posted by Froasty [208.35.37.13], 07/07/2000 15:51 GMT

I know I've seen this on other boards, but I can't find em' and i could use a hand. Just put a brand spanking new, default load of q3r and vodoo drivers, etc. on my machine. Now I can't see the grid when I open my maps. Is this drivers? Thanks all.

#32 Posted by Lanzelot [212.209.5.155], 08/07/2000 04:57 GMT , Refers to Post #30

If you have multiple curves stacked onto each other, try to break up the caulk brush where the curves are meet. That have helped me and is sugested in the manual under t-junktion cracks.

#33 Posted by than [212.49.241.98], 08/07/2000 12:04 GMT

that's not possible since the curves run along a curve where they meet.

I'm just going to restart the map again anyway so it doesn't matter.

fucken q3 :)

-than

Q3r Problem

#34 Posted by werewolf [212.181.179.231], 09/07/2000 14:19 GMT

i would be very pleased if somebody can help me with a problem i are having with my q3r,
my supporting grids has dissapear , if i scroll over the map it apperas in like a one ms,
to sole this problem i had tried this:
- reinstall q3r(v181 and v191 )
- deleted the register folder and reinstalled the prog again in deafult options.
- reinstlled my 3d-card (voodoo3 2000 pci)
- reinstlled opengl
- ate a big mac (and co!)

observe that a do not have any other grafic bugs , in varius games

RE: Q3r Problem

#35 Posted by Auhsan [212.166.137.162], 09/07/2000 14:53 GMT , Refers to Post #34

go to www.glsetup.com and download the latest glsetup. I had the same problem with my Voodoo Banshee and the latest glsetup drivers solved it.

My Maps Are Too Big :-(

#36 Posted by Tyrann [203.56.239.112], 10/07/2000 16:40 GMT

Ok, I just started getting the error PF_precache_model: overflow when I load my map (Quake 1). I checked the Quake source and it seems the limit is 256 models.

Could someone familiar with the quake source code please tell me if this is 256 unique models, or do I need to start taking out monsters and items and such?

I guess I can start by converting some of my func_wall entities back into solids - at the expense of r_speeds. Such is life <*sigh*>

#37 Posted by than [212.188.139.25], 10/07/2000 17:49 GMT

try regrouping func_walls that are close by into singular func_walls. that should save on a few.

-than

RE: Suggestion

#38 Posted by Tyrann [203.56.239.200], 10/07/2000 18:24 GMT , Refers to Post #37

Yeah, good suggestion. I'll do that where I can. Thanks.

RE: My Maps Are Too Big :-(

#39 Posted by CZG [130.67.142.180], 10/07/2000 19:12 GMT , Refers to Post #36

I had that prob in my level, too, and it is 256 unique models yes. I did as than said (although he didn't say it then) and grouped my func_walls and func_illusionaries together, but then I got a "Too many Efrags" warning. (The entities span over too many leafs.) Finally I ended up with me turning all the func_s into ordinary brushes. The errors went away, and the compile time doubled.

RE: RE: My Maps Are Too Big :-(

#40 Posted by Tyrann [203.56.239.116], 10/07/2000 22:02 GMT , Refers to Post #39

After way too much prodding and poking at the map file, I discovered that the QC file that I have been using in BSP for the last four years has an error in it. It causes trigger_relay's to have a brush model associated with them. Well, since I had 42 trigger_relays, changing them over made the problem go away - for now. I'll just have to watch how many models I add now.

Just too annoy me some more, now I have to chase down one of those leaks where the pointfile goes straight through a solid brush

Don't Know Where...

#41 Posted by maiden22 [216.154.2.246], 10/07/2000 22:18 GMT

...to post this, but can anyone recommend a good mouse for Quake??

Can Anyone...

#42 Posted by ScopoiD [142.163.71.118], 10/07/2000 23:56 GMT

help me out with an idea for a teleporter for this

map I'm working on? I've been pouring over it for 2 or 3 days and all the ones I've come up with don't really match the style...
screenshots of the map
the 3rd shot shows a teleporter I tried, but wasn't satisfied with it.

RE: Can Anyone...

#43 Posted by Lunaran [152.163.194.181], 11/07/2000 01:41 GMT , Refers to Post #42

Go with something bright orangey-red, like a wall of flame or somesuch. That's what I'd do.

Or just use the standard q1 teleporter texture with the beige dots.

RE: RE: Can Anyone...

#44 Posted by ScopoiD [142.163.71.118], 11/07/2000 01:52 GMT , Refers to Post #43

Thanks Lunaran
Bah it's hard to be original :)
Maybe I should be eating more

RE: Don`t Know Where...

#45 Posted by Vondur [194.87.189.190], 11/07/2000 06:46 GMT , Refers to Post #41

1. Razer Boomslang 2000 =) ~100$us - the perfect mouse for the Quake
2. Logitech. There is one model M-UB48. This one has a wheel, but there are mice that have no that wheel if you don't need it. This mouse rocks too. It costs ~8$ ps/2 and ~20$ usb.

Gaming Mice?

#46 Posted by Lunaran [152.163.194.183], 11/07/2000 15:43 GMT

Who needs 'em? I've still got the same old vanilla 3-button dark blue Logitech MouseMan Sensa I've had for years and as long as I keep it clean and happy it works fine. Sure didn't cost no $100 either.

RE: Don`t Know Where...

#47 Posted by Johnny Law [207.17.136.129], 11/07/2000 17:33 GMT , Refers to Post #41

Go to this thread, almost to the bottom, you'll see my opinions about mice.

http://www.quake3world.com/ubb/Forum6/HTML/006323-2.html

RE: Gaming Mice?

#48 Posted by Fat Controller [203.96.111.201], 12/07/2000 04:21 GMT , Refers to Post #46

I have this image of lab animals refusing to run mazes; instead they prefer to frag each other in DM4... :)

#49 Posted by maiden22 [216.154.13.120], 12/07/2000 05:07 GMT

thanks Von and JL

RE: Gaming Mice?

#50 Posted by maiden22 [216.154.13.120], 12/07/2000 05:09 GMT , Refers to Post #46

sure, there are better ways to spend $100.. I was just thinking, since I have to buy a new mouse, I thought I might as well get one that's good for Quake. That's all.

RE: RE: Gaming Mice?

#51 Posted by maiden22 [216.154.13.120], 12/07/2000 05:11 GMT , Refers to Post #48

damn you and I have the same colours. Either that or I'm blind.

Those Damn MD3's

#52 Posted by Evicerator [209.209.19.24], 12/07/2000 08:15 GMT

I don't know if any of you have noticed those tight ass shadows in ztn3dm1 (Blood Run) that use the timlamp model to create spidery shadows in the ceilings (you can kinda see them in the upper right area of his screenshot), but I'm trying to recreate that same effect in my map. Unfortunately, I can't figure out how the hell he did it. For starters that damn model doesn't even emit light and secondly, those idiots at ID didn't allow models to be solid (for bullet marks, etc.).

So far:
1.---> I spent literally half a day checking every goddamn website for a clue...nothin'.
2.---> I checked out ID's timlamp shader file. It uses surfaceparm alphashadow which supposedly allows light to be emitted through the alpha portions of the texture, but of course it doesn't. I've never got this to work on anything anyways.
3.---> I tried putting a light entity in the middle of the md3, but again no light emitted.
4.---> Regarding making models solid, the only solution I've heard of is to place a similarly shaped brush around it and apply the cushion texture but this seems damn sloppy.
5.---> I emailed the man himself, ztn.

If any of you guys got the solution or a workaround/trick/idea of some kind please lemme know. Sorry 'bout the long post.

Clipping Solution

#53 Posted by Evicerator [209.209.19.24], 12/07/2000 10:10 GMT , Refers to Post #52

I was looking through the sample maps ID provided and q3dm7sample.map happened to also use this model in the manner I would like to use. Unfortunately they neglected to provide the part that creates the shadows. I did, however, find that the only way to make a md3 "solid" is to, indeed, place a similarly shaped brush around it and apply weapon clip (no telling why they designed it this way but I'll live). Well, one down, one to go.

ShoveL Thought A Title Wasn't Needed

#54 Posted by ShoveL [134.148.24.16], 14/07/2000 06:15 GMT

What does -vlight do? for q3map.exe
I need curvs to cast shados ? :-/

#55 Posted by Jimbo [164.106.40.170], 14/07/2000 16:36 GMT

What exactly does func_wall do?
(In q1

)
How does it lower r_speeds?

Jimbo

RE: Func_wall?

#56 Posted by CZG [130.67.142.55], 14/07/2000 17:43 GMT

A func_wall is just a entity that does nothing bu sit there. (OK, if you trigger it it can change texture but that's it.) If you turn the itty bitty details of your map into func_walls, thy won't split up the bsp into so many leafs, (I better get the terms right or SPoG will have my head,) thus making it vis a lot faster, that's what detail brushes are for in q2 and q3. It would prolly cut down on your r_speeds too, but maybe you'd have to pay for it since you get extra epolys to render. Remember that entities don't block vis, so only turn the little unneccesary bits into them. Basicly they are the same as func_illusionaries, only solid.

That seemed terribly incoherent. Sorry 'bout that.
CZG

#57 Posted by Jimbo [164.106.40.79], 14/07/2000 19:17 GMT , Refers to Post #56

OK that clears up the func_walls.
But what is a leaf exactly?<?>
Is there a glossary somewhere that has all these terms?

<?>Maybe Peej should put one up?<?>

Yes There Is:

#58 Posted by CZG [130.67.142.55], 14/07/2000 19:23 GMT

It's long, complicated, and mostly about Q3, (but applies to Q1 too,) and it's written by SPoG and is located here:
http://www.planetquake.com/spog/stuff/technical.html
Read and weep.

CZG

R_speeds In Q1

#59 Posted by dr0KheaD [62.156.45.31], 14/07/2000 23:29 GMT

I search a FAQ or tutorial about r_speeds in Q1. Can anyone give me a link or some tips how to prevent high r_speeds?? Thanx
-dr0K

RE: R_speeds In Q1

#60 Posted by Lunaran [205.188.192.27], 15/07/2000 14:51 GMT , Refers to Post #59

Two things:
- Don't go mad on the detail. There's only so much stuff you can cram onto the screen in Quake1 no matter how powerful people's computers are getting. Build the map *for quake*.
- Use vis blockers. These are S, L, Z or -O- shaped hallways between rooms that make it impossible to see from one room to another.
- Use func_walls and func_illusionaries. Since they're entities, they won't intersect the rest of the brushes around them and split them into more faces the way they would if they were normal brushes.
- Build smartly. Don't carve, don't use more brushes than you have to, and don't carve.
- Don't carve.

RE: RE: R_speeds In Q1

#61 Posted by Auhsan [212.166.156.9], 15/07/2000 15:28 GMT , Refers to Post #60

there's one thing I haven't understand...

can we carve?

#62 Posted by Lunaran [152.163.204.187], 15/07/2000 17:19 GMT

1) I hate shaders.
2) I hate Q3World.

Does anyone HERE who can actually ANSWER me know how to fix this problem?

RE: RE: RE: R_speeds In Q1

#63 Posted by GrindSpire [193.113.185.164], 15/07/2000 21:09 GMT , Refers to Post #61

Um... I don't think so, but I'm not sure, it's kinda vague...

RE: RE: RE: RE: R_speeds In Q1

#64 Posted by CZG [130.67.142.3], 15/07/2000 22:03 GMT

CARVING IS EVIL.
CARVING MAKES YOUR INTESTINES COME ALIVE AND TIE KNOTS AROUND YOUR AEORTA.
Or at least make your map messy...

RE: RE: RE: RE: RE: R_speeds In Q1

#65 Posted by Tron [203.12.165.243], 16/07/2000 06:34 GMT , Refers to Post #64

heh, this reminds me of a tutorial I read a few days ago for some other game on how to make you first room. Basically it went "make a cube, hollow it, then carve holes into the walls where you want doors and windows.

Tron

RE: RE: R_speeds In Q1

#66 Posted by dr0KheaD [62.224.20.179], 16/07/2000 10:10 GMT , Refers to Post #60

Thanx Lun!!!
BTW: Coriolis Storm Rocks!!!

RE: RE: RE: RE: RE: R_speeds In Q1

#67 Posted by Auhsan [212.73.46.15], 16/07/2000 13:45 GMT , Refers to Post #64

Carving is evil, but it's soooooo fun. Try to make and sphere carving a 8 sides poligon.

RE: RE: RE: RE: RE: RE: R_speeds In Q1

#68 Posted by GrindSpire [62.7.78.43], 16/07/2000 16:47 GMT , Refers to Post #67

OK, tried that, and half my RAM has just burnt out! (that bit is serious) :-(

RE: RE: RE: RE: RE: RE: RE: R_speeds In Q1

#69 Posted by Auhsan [212.73.45.29], 16/07/2000 19:16 GMT , Refers to Post #68

hehe!stop mapping in a gameboy

RE: RE: RE: RE: RE: RE: RE: RE: R_speeds In Q1

#70 Posted by GrindSpire [195.99.46.254], 16/07/2000 19:26 GMT , Refers to Post #69

OK, I'm not serious about the mapping bit, but I did burn out half my RAM last night!

#71 Posted by Vondur [194.87.189.208], 16/07/2000 19:27 GMT

Carving is the useful feature, use it wise.
For example: if you want to make a square window, you can carve it using one brush instead of drawing 4 brushes manually. It won't mess your map since this is the simple form.
So, use carving wise.

And of course, build with speed in mind.

Wad File Needed

#72 Posted by IsmiteU [24.26.89.219], 16/07/2000 23:24 GMT

I've looked everywhere and I'm attempting to locate both a Plywood & Pine 2X4 textures. If anyone knows where I could find these pls let me know ASAP. :)

Here I Go Again!

#73 Posted by Biff_Debris [152.163.205.78], 17/07/2000 02:42 GMT

I'm attempting to rebuild that Q1SP map with the trigger_counter and trigger_relay and the message on the door again. Confused? So am I -- after I deleted the old (working) version:

Okay. I've got three sets of doors -- one to the left and the right, and one in the middle. The middle set of doors has the trigger_multiple which brings up the message "go thru the other doors before here". The idea is to have the trigger_counter count off the passing of the other two rooms beyond the other sets of doors before the middle set opens, and the message becomes inert. Bare in mind also that a trigger_multiple doesn't allow a "targetname" key, so you can't name the trigger brush, and that while the door itself can have a message display, it'll only do so when the door itself is triggered.

I thought I had it all down on a document file, but I didn't. I suck so fucking hard, I know.

I promise I'll never bring this up again if someone can tell me how to do this. Scout's honor (even tho I never was one).

RE: Here I Go Again!

#74 Posted by Biff_Debris [205.188.199.204], 18/07/2000 00:48 GMT , Refers to Post #73

Ignore that post. With help (CZG, Ray, Fats), I got it beat.

Mapping Advice!

#75 Posted by GibFest [212.38.174.60], 18/07/2000 18:35 GMT

Right to start off, I`d like to know how everybody goes about making a map (Q1)...

I mean like when WorldCraft boots up, what is the first thing you do, coz I myself start from the floor and work up and never ever seem to be able to finish a map coz a new idea comes along I just gotta try and it won`t fit into the current level so as a result I`ve ended up with about 50 bits of level.

So....

What I want to know is how u go about mapping e.g. Do you make preparations or just jump into worldcraft, and how do you stick with such a map when all these new fangled images come into your mind.

Ohh yeah and what music do you listen to when mapping, anything would help.

It is the most annoying thing in the world to not be abled to finished a map.

Ohh yeah and I was seeing what my nice new coloured name would look like.

Better Colour

#76 Posted by GibFest [212.38.174.60], 18/07/2000 18:40 GMT

This should be a bit better colour hopefully...

phew

RE: Mapping Advice!

#77 Posted by IsmiteU [168.213.1.134], 18/07/2000 18:50 GMT , Refers to Post #75

ewww soooo Green :) I'm mapping "On the Fly" cuz I have no freaking idea what I'm doing. Music? what music I listen to explosions and large ammounts of ammunition going offfrom my son's PC :P

#78 Posted by IsmiteU [168.213.1.134], 18/07/2000 18:51 GMT

I've realized I am the worlds worst speller.

RE: RE: Mapping Advice!

#79 Posted by GibFest [212.38.174.60], 18/07/2000 19:00 GMT , Refers to Post #77

I`m trying to make the transistion from Reviewer to Reviewer and Mapper and am finding it quite hard.

Damn fast reply tho Izzy 8)

as for the music, I find it hard to map without. Cypress Hill are a prime example of music to map to or some Drum and Bass.

Which brings me to another query... How do I get a music track to play in a Quake1 level like a *.wav or *.mp3 not CD?

##------------------------------##

Ohh BTW D&B fans hit THIS SITE, just a blokey who makes music but some of his D&B and Experimental stuff is the bollox.

#80 Posted by CZG [130.67.142.189], 18/07/2000 20:34 GMT , Refers to Post #79

How do I get a music track to play in a Quake1
level like a *.wav or *.mp3 not CD?
You can't, No waw without modified QC, no mp3 without modified exe.

RE: Mapping Advice!

#81 Posted by dr0KheaD [62.156.20.45], 18/07/2000 21:42 GMT , Refers to Post #75

I just do, what comes into my mind. When I get an idea that won't work in my current map, I do a new one. So far it's just like you do, but:
After a while I return to one of my unfinished maps and complete them (or bring them closer to completeness at last)
I usually have 3-6 unfinished maps on my drive.
About the music:
Industrial!!!! Industrial fits best to Q1 DM. Or electronical stuff, but that just for the mapping, not to play by.
Some Bands: FearFactory, Nine Inch Nails, Triggerpimp, The Shizit, Die Krupps, Corpse #87

RE: Mapping Advice!

#82 Posted by Biff_Debris [152.163.206.177], 18/07/2000 22:53 GMT , Refers to Post #75

Try to keep yourself focused by drawing out some ideas on graph paper or whatever. This especially helps with DM, since you have to remember to keep things compact and up to speed. Once you get a *basic* idea for the overall design, you can be real flexible as far as improvising any extra areas or arch. details.

Don't worry about starting over! On my current Q1 (formerly q2, formerly Unreal) DM map, I've done just about everything I can think of, and rebuilt it at least five or six times! It's almost like "meditiating upon a theme", if you wanna get the boots out. You learn how to cut corners in certian areas, and embellish upon others. THAT'S what helps you as a mapper, IMHO -- just doing it.

Take yout time with it. Nothing worse than a rushed map, since once you've released it, everyone says "why didn't you do this or that?" and you know they're right -- and you would've thought of it had you taken more time. Believe me, I've had experience in this dept...

Hope this helps -- it's what the best mappers I know have been telling me, and they're right.

btw I've listened to King Crimson, Manson, and NIN when mapping -- just really intense stuff, which goes well with frenetic gaming.

RE: RE: Mapping Advice!

#83 Posted by Biff_Debris [152.163.206.177], 18/07/2000 22:56 GMT , Refers to Post #82

Hehe -- nothing worse than a RUSHED POST either!

#84 Posted by IsmiteU [24.26.89.202], 19/07/2000 01:54 GMT

It's nice to hear someones taken the same map and redone it a bunch of times. I don't know I feel really pressured to put a map out. I know I create my on pressure but then again I feel like if I don't get it out no one will ever take a look at it.

#85 Posted by Biff_Debris [205.188.200.58], 19/07/2000 09:43 GMT , Refers to Post #84

Yeah, I know what you mean -- but it's better to have a few good maps than a bunch of shitty ones.

IMO, if you're anxious for someone to see what you've done, just mail a buddy and see if he wants to beta an early version -- mebbe get a few tips out of them. That way you can get feedback immediately, and help with your map at the same time.

#86 Posted by than [212.188.147.142], 19/07/2000 10:50 GMT

I need to find somewhere or someone that has the custents for quake file. I have been to the custents homepage but the file is not there (ARGH!!!!). I need a version that works with worldcraft so if anyone has the latest custents the PLEASE send it to me/upload it/tell me another url I can get it.

This is for a q1sp. I could use the following:
 better ambient sound support
 perhaps a couple more base enemies
 breakable stuff
 earthquakes
 rotating stuff would be nice

HELP ME!!

-than

#87 Posted by than [212.188.147.142], 19/07/2000 10:53 GMT

I was sure the thingy characters worked.



I bet it works now.

-than

#88 Posted by GibFest [62.7.50.140], 19/07/2000 17:19 GMT

#89 Posted by inertia [199.35.236.57], 19/07/2000 22:27 GMT , Refers to Post #88

GIBFEST!!!

Erm, just thought I'd let you know your color is nearly identical to NotoriousRay's :)

RE: Custents

#90 Posted by Biff_Debris [152.163.205.61], 19/07/2000 23:44 GMT , Refers to Post #86

I wanna use that Q3 chant sound in me Q1SP! Damn, but it would kick ass...

RE: Custents

#91 Posted by Nightbringer [203.109.252.15], 20/07/2000 01:53 GMT , Refers to Post #86

I'm not sure where to find CustEnts; you could try Zerstorer though, it's got at least breakables and extra base enemies (mega-enforcer, turret).

Awhile ago I was messing around with this sort of stuff, and ended up adding a bunch of miscellanea to q1, including some of what you're looking for. I've dug it out, fixed the fgd, and uploaded it. Not sure how useful it'll be (not very, is my estimate); but you can grab it from here.

Than Wuz Axin Me

#92 Posted by Fat Controller [203.96.111.202], 20/07/2000 08:06 GMT

...earlier, so I'll send him my Custents zip, and tell him to:

1) Look up the word "Cranked" on filePlanet, for monster powerups

2) See the PainKeep site for a pak full of nice sounds

Now where are my pants!?

It's Ok!!!!

#93 Posted by than [212.49.230.33], 20/07/2000 08:52 GMT

I found custents and have decided that zerstorer is probably the better bet. thanks for everyone's help anyway.

-than

RE: RE: Custents

#94 Posted by Lunaran [152.163.197.81], 20/07/2000 14:54 GMT , Refers to Post #90

Which sound, biff? Don't you have q3?

On Q3dm14 (?)

#95 Posted by than [212.49.229.110], 20/07/2000 15:38 GMT

when you walk near the jesus statue you can hear chanting. Thta's prolly the sound he means.

-than

RE: On Q3dm14 (?)

#96 Posted by Biff_Debris [205.188.198.177], 20/07/2000 23:14 GMT , Refers to Post #95

Yes, yes -- that'n. I'd have to do some pak file surgery wouldn't I? Rename it to one of the already-existing ambient sounds? Right?

RE: RE: On Q3dm14 (?)

#97 Posted by GrindSpire [212.126.144.12], 20/07/2000 23:40 GMT , Refers to Post #96

Yes, that's right

Q1 Func_train Prob

#98 Posted by than [212.49.236.160], 21/07/2000 13:12 GMT

In my map I have a hollow crate with an item/monster (not decided yet :) inside it. The crate consosts of two func_trains, the crate and it's lid. These are triggered separately by a couple of trigger relays (which are triggered by a button). The whole thing moves along a path then stops by using a wait key of -1 at the end path corners to stop them. When the player gets around to where the crate has ended up there is another button. This triggers the lid of the crate and also a bar which carries the lid off. The problem is that the bar will move but the lid just stays where it is.

I have gotten all the names and path corners set up correctly as far as I know (I have checked). Is quake capable of restarting a func_train or not? Should I be using a different wait key? (is -1 correct if I want to retrigger it?) ARGH! help!

btw, I plan on using Quake c mods for other things so perhaps there is a func_train capable of being retriggered?

Also, is there a qbsp which lets you tie clip brushes to solid entities?

-than

RE: Q1 Func_train Prob

#99 Posted by Tyrann [203.152.232.29], 21/07/2000 15:41 GMT , Refers to Post #98

You cannot restart a func_train in Quake once it has stopped. Ever (well, not without your own QC).

#100 Posted by than [212.188.130.219], 21/07/2000 15:58 GMT

#101 Posted by than [212.49.251.250], 21/07/2000 21:03 GMT

doesn't matter aboot the func_train stuff now anyway as I set it up with perfect timing instead so it now all happens with one button press but looks much cooler.

Hopefully Fatty will let me use the OUM code so I can use earthquakes, breakables and forcefields. As well as thos extra base monsters.

-than

#102 Posted by Fat Controller [203.96.111.202], 22/07/2000 05:26 GMT , Refers to Post #101

Only if you let me stick you between Tyrann and Tronyn, sunshine :)

I'll tell you when a vaguely playable alpha of Towne is ready.

#103 Posted by than [212.49.232.66], 22/07/2000 09:01 GMT

that means presumably you want me to help with oum if I am using the oum code and stuff? well, my map is kind of designed to be a self contained map but if you wanted I could make a separate version for oum (if you let me redistribute the oum progs.dat with a separate version of my map). My map is probably about 60-70% complete at the moment with most of the time consuming stuff out of the way.

-than

#104 Posted by Fat Controller [203.96.111.202], 22/07/2000 12:21 GMT , Refers to Post #103

Depends what you want to use from the OUM QuakeC. Mail me with your requirements and I'll whip up a custom version - sort of like DaMaul and his Bestial Devastation for Zerstörer.

#105 Posted by Asriel [203.96.152.184], 23/07/2000 01:40 GMT

The mean arena Q3 - UT mod thingy copied my map idea... which I copied off UT, but still! :)
But mines for q2.

#106 Posted by Jimbo [216.12.53.19], 23/07/2000 22:08 GMT

What func_ is the one to make it easier for players to walk around "decorative" protrusions in <q1? DM maps?
Is it fun_illusionary?

RE: Func_???

#107 Posted by Jimbo [216.12.53.19], 23/07/2000 22:09 GMT , Refers to Post #106

hmm...
Such atrocious spelling.
One might think I was public schooled.

RE: Func_???

#108 Posted by kanaeda [207.208.137.146], 23/07/2000 22:18 GMT , Refers to Post #107

yeah. func_illusionary is what you are after. either that or some clip brushes.

#109 Posted by Biff_Debris [152.163.204.193], 23/07/2000 22:24 GMT

Has anybody had any problems compiling spotlights with Arghlite? I'm using a light with a mangle key (0 -90 0, pointing downwards), and Arghlite completely ignores this (produces a normal light). Only Tyrlite will take any notice, but I'd have to redo all the lighting values on the map, since its considerably dimmer than Arghlite compile.

#110 Posted by kanaeda [207.208.137.146], 24/07/2000 02:21 GMT , Refers to Post #109

if it works anything like arghrad, then you don't need 3 values in there. it should just be _mangle = -90 0 (if memory is serving me properly tonite).

RE: RE: WTF?

#111 Posted by Biff_Debris [205.188.199.36], 24/07/2000 02:49 GMT , Refers to Post #110

Nah -- doesn't work. Besides, you only need the "_" in the keyname for q2 anyway.

#112 Posted by Tyrann [210.8.224.2], 24/07/2000 04:29 GMT , Refers to Post #109

Try playing with the "-dist n" and "-range n" parameters to tweak the brightness (I mean in TyrLite of course).

#113 Posted by kanaeda [207.208.137.146], 24/07/2000 04:45 GMT , Refers to Post #111

but do you need all three of those values is what I was talkin about.

#114 Posted by Tyrann [203.56.239.116], 24/07/2000 08:38 GMT , Refers to Post #113

but do you need all three of those values is what I was talkin about.

Yes you do, but the third value doesn't do anything - it's just a placeholder to make it look like the regular mangle values. As you might know, the values represent "yaw pitch roll" - and of course it doesn't make sense to "roll" beams of light ;-)

#115 Posted by Biff_Debris [152.163.207.186], 24/07/2000 13:21 GMT , Refers to Post #112

That's some of that DOS box stuff, isn't it? I avoid that thing whenever possible. I know, I know -- I'm a DOS wuss.

#116 Posted by kanaeda [207.208.137.127], 24/07/2000 18:00 GMT , Refers to Post #114

ok, then it does act a little bit differently than arghrad does.

Curved Ramp

#117 Posted by Evicerator [209.209.19.122], 25/07/2000 01:53 GMT

I've added a half circle ramp that fits the area correctly but the sections are torqued so that the texture is warped in some pie shaped sections. When you run up it you bounce like you're running up stairs. What gives?

RE: Curved Ramp

#118 Posted by Lunaran [205.188.198.48], 25/07/2000 03:40 GMT , Refers to Post #117

If we're talking q3 here, which I think we are, I've got a curved ramp in lun3dm2 that does the same thing. Couldn't find a good way around it. The only solution is a higher detail level, which smooths out the polies more. If the ramp is a full semicircle, I'd try to go as high as a width of 9 (that's four segments).

RE: RE: Curved Ramp

#119 Posted by Evicerator [209.209.20.9], 25/07/2000 22:36 GMT , Refers to Post #118

I've played that map many a time on my clan's custom server and I noticed how clean your ramp looked which is partially why I asked the question. Thanks for the reply; a big help.

#120 Posted by GibFest [193.113.185.163], 29/07/2000 13:39 GMT

How would I have a different skin on a grunt or any monster which I place in my SP map?

I am making a Storage Facility using the IKBase Tex and I need more Army type looking people on the main base e.g. the Doom bloke and I am gonna use the normal monster skins on the underground genetic experiment type level.

#121 Posted by BARiUM [62.20.133.147], 29/07/2000 14:28 GMT , Refers to Post #120

you'll have to make your on game dir (ie not id1) then you will have to copy the monster there and extract the skin from the model (you can do that with quark if you want..) then you'll just skin it.. kinda..

#122 Posted by kanaeda [207.208.186.127], 29/07/2000 22:12 GMT , Refers to Post #120

if both levels are part of one bigger batch of maps, then you are going to have to create a new monster type or sumthin like that, too. would probly require a bit of coding and some renaming of files.

then again, i could be way off and it could be pretty easy.

#123 Posted by Fat Controller [203.96.111.200], 29/07/2000 23:14 GMT , Refers to Post #120

First, I'd recommend getting some model viewer like, um, QuakeMe. It's old as hell, and clunky as f00k, but it allows you to add skins in a two-step process (first you have to increase the number of skins allocated to your model, then import the desired skin as a BMP.)

The grunt's mesh is much like the player's, but the skins may have to be cropped or resized slightly as the grunt skin is a little smaller. If you don't you'll get nasty black patches in places - not good.

Finally, once you've got your model skinned, open up the SOLDIER.QC file, and right at the bottom, you type in monster_army:

if (!self.dmg)
self.skin = 0; // base skin
else
self.skin = self.dmg; // select-a-skin

Admittedly all this does is give you the same old grunt in different clobber. Fortunately there are patches around (I can't remember where) which give grunty-poos more power; it's just cut and paste.

#124 Posted by Jimbo [216.12.50.6], 30/07/2000 03:46 GMT

Can ANYONE HELP?
Using "iklite.exe" to lite a

q1 map
and I'm getting the following error...

*** BEGIN LIGHT ***

76 entities read
Starting lighting thread.
Lighting 7213 faces total.

*** Error ***
Bad surface extents

What does "Bad surface extents" mean?
(I'm using txqbsp for the main compile
and rvis for the vis.)

#125 Posted by Tyrann [203.56.239.116], 30/07/2000 05:33 GMT , Refers to Post #124

It usually means there's some kind of invalid brush in your map. If not then some particular part of your map is confusing QBSP.

Try to either:
1. find and eliminate the problem brush(es) 2. perhaps just a diferent QBSP will help (but probably not).

#126 Posted by GibFest [62.7.115.172], 30/07/2000 13:58 GMT

.. You lot.

Here is another Query for everyone 8).

I hope this doesn`t sound stupid but how do I get a door to open only if I`ve already picked up the key?

I don`t want it to open when I get thew key just let me through if I have it.

Also if I don`t have a key I want it to say "Get The Silver Key".

#127 Posted by GibFest [62.7.115.172], 30/07/2000 14:36 GMT

..How would I get one of those forcefields into my levels to be like the chambers for the shamblers etc

#128 Posted by BARiUM [62.20.133.204], 30/07/2000 15:24 GMT , Refers to Post #126

spawnflags... 8 is gold key 16, is silver ( i think )

#129 Posted by Auhsan [212.73.46.145], 30/07/2000 22:09 GMT

Uhm... got problem compiling my q3map

I can compile it with fastvis but when i try to compile it with fullvis i cant. fullvis have been 6 hours compiling in my PII-400 128 Mb. I have try it in a K7-600 and it gave me the same problems. There are no warnings or problems in the q3r log...=(

If someones want the map to compile it i would be happy, or if somebody knows the solution give it to me.

argh!

RE: To Fatty..

#130 Posted by Fat Controller [210.55.84.191], 31/07/2000 07:33 GMT , Refers to Post #127

Forcefields (in OUM, Ritual or Custents) are actually comprised of at least three elements:

1. func_togglewall - the thing doing the actual blocking. Set to "start on" and "toggle" with a targetname.

2. func_particlefield - makes the pretty flashes. Powered by a func_counter. Set the "use count" flag and set it to fire on the count of one.

3. func_counter - actually a point entity. Shares the same targetname as the func_togglewall. Set to loop, start on and toggle, with a count of 2 and a time step of 0.5-1 second.

Multiple func_particlefields can be arranged for a working forcefield, running off the one counter. Nice wave effect.

#131 Posted by Jimbo [164.106.40.169], 31/07/2000 16:43 GMT , Refers to Post #125

I tried another qbsp(qbsp256) but got lot's of little gaps in the walls I'm thinkin it's the floating point textures so I've decided to:
<br>
1. find and eliminate the problem brush(es)
<br>
By the simple expedient of restoring from backup and rebuilding that section of the map
(`bout 200 brushes).

A Few Mapping Questions:

#132 Posted by Grahf [209.145.68.56], 02/08/2000 02:33 GMT

I'm trying to light my Q1 map with the mac port of Tyrlite (though that shouldn't make a difference). I get the following output; the map lights fine without -extra.

----- TyrLite v0.3beta -----
extra sampling enabled
14 entities read, 8 are lights.
There are 719 faces to light
************ ERROR ************
light < 0

No more lighting is performed. Light less than 0? I'm not using antilights or anything. Annoying thing is, sometimes this happens part of the way through lighting, sometimes at the beginning, and sometimes not at all. Is this a common problem?

Also, has anybody conclusively figured out what the infamous "cutnodePortals_R: new portal was clipped away" actually means? I've read several different explanations. Sometimes my map won't seal when I get the error, sometimes it will.

Q3Radiant Woes

#133 Posted by Kayin [216.127.1.149], 02/08/2000 04:28 GMT

embarking down the road to deflowering my q3radiant ways... (first time) and i'll be damned if it REFUSES to work.

i get a dialog asking for a .prj file upon starting q3radiant and then it shuts down with an error? i config'ed everything fine as far as i can see and NOTHIng seems to work.. (snagged the recent version)

anyone mind telling me how they got radiant to peacefully coexist? i want to get dirty with q3 but can't even find the hole...

this keeps up and i'll be back to mapping for q1 again with my dirty whore worldcraft...

Q3Radiant Woes (cont)

#134 Posted by Kayin [216.127.1.149], 02/08/2000 04:29 GMT

running win2k btw

RE: Q3Radiant Woes

#135 Posted by Maj [193.128.238.146], 02/08/2000 13:14 GMT , Refers to Post #133

Which version are you using? Some are actually upgrades to a previous version rather than a full install.

The latest recommended version is Build 201, available at http://www.qeradiant.com/files.cgi?dirin=Q3Radiant/

RE: RE: Q3Radiant Woes

#136 Posted by GrindSpire [213.120.62.67], 02/08/2000 19:12 GMT , Refers to Post #135

Don't forget you will still need full install. I think the last full install was build 181, then just stick whatever over that. I am using the 202 beta and it is fine for me, plus the new compact texture menu rocks :-)

RE: A Few Mapping Questions:

#137 Posted by Tyrann [203.56.239.113], 03/08/2000 13:37 GMT , Refers to Post #132

----- TyrLite v0.3beta -----
extra sampling enabled
14 entities read, 8 are lights.
There are 719 faces to light
************ ERROR ************
light < 0

I can't really see where this could happen. In fact I'm pretty sure that it can't happen (but obviously it did). I assume you aren't using minlighting, so just add the key "light" "1" to the worldspawn and the problem should go away. If you are using minlighting, then something wierd is going on...

Half-life Editior??

#138 Posted by ][v][aster [206.170.65.10], 03/08/2000 22:43 GMT

Hi, I was wondering if someone could be kind enough to give me a link to a page where I can learn about and download a level editor for Half-life/Counter-strike?? Any help would be appreciated...

RE: Half-life Editior??

#139 Posted by Lunaran [152.163.195.188], 04/08/2000 14:49 GMT , Refers to Post #138

The half-life ERC

Minlight Doesn'y Help...

#140 Posted by Grahf [209.145.68.211], 04/08/2000 22:48 GMT , Refers to Post #137

----- TyrLite v0.3beta -----
extra sampling enabled
Using minlight value 1 from command line.
14 entities read, 8 are lights.
There are 719 faces to light
************ ERROR ************
light < 0

I ran tyrlite again, with -light 1, and the results were the same. Note that this is with the mac port of tyrlite, which may well have issues not present in the PC version.

I'll editing the worldspawn next.

Hmm, No Title

#141 Posted by Grahf [209.145.68.211], 04/08/2000 22:49 GMT

Err, I'll try editing the worldspawn next.

Spellchecking is a virtue.

Hmm, No Title

#142 Posted by Grahf [209.145.68.211], 04/08/2000 22:49 GMT

Err, I'll try editing the worldspawn next.

Spellchecking is a virtue.

How Did I Manage That?

#143 Posted by Grahf [209.145.68.211], 04/08/2000 22:51 GMT

RE: Minlight Doesn`y Help...

#144 Posted by Tyrann [203.56.239.116], 05/08/2000 03:14 GMT , Refers to Post #140

Ok, I didn't realise it was on the Mac.

That version of Tyrlite is pretty old, and was ported to the Mac by a guy called Phaedrus Qtensilius (I hope I got that right). I don't know if he's still around, since his wadtool site seems to be missing [ http://wadtool.quakeintosh.com ], but I found this email address on MacQuaker.com if you want to try and contact him.

Q3R Blues..

#145 Posted by maiden [216.154.4.126], 06/08/2000 05:45 GMT

I SUSPECT Q3RADIANT IS B0RKED AGAIN!!! The red flag (on one of the walls in the main atrium in Q3TOURNEY4) has a black triangle around it and no longer moves/vibrates since I installed v2.02. Fuck not again!!

Hmm, No Title

#146 Posted by Grahf [209.145.69.99], 07/08/2000 01:45 GMT , Refers to Post #144

Hmm, thanks for the email address. Quakeintosh has been down for quite some time (replaced by some UT clan site, bleh), btw.

Now here's something really wierd: I built another map just to make sure it was a problem specific to the map. The first time I tried lighting, it failed with the familiar light < 0 error I had been seeing on the 200th or so face. I tried it a few more times out of frustation. Oddly enough, it compiled all the way on the 4th try.

----- TyrLite v0.3beta -----
extra sampling enabled
light entity compression enabled
Using minlight value 2 from command line.
98 entities read, 5 are lights.
There are 2088 faces to light
Lighting face 2088 of 2088
Lighting Completed.

lightdatasize: 23558
0 switchable light styles
50.0 seconds elapsed

Perfect. Of course now the map won't vis, but that's unrelated. =)

What Is The Best Version Of Radiant...

#147 Posted by -=Blitz=- [63.214.106.248], 07/08/2000 02:17 GMT

Latest QERadiant

#148 Posted by kanaeda [207.208.188.110], 07/08/2000 04:21 GMT , Refers to Post #147

is build #147. it's here

Q1 Trigger_monsterjump Entity

#149 Posted by than [212.49.235.70], 07/08/2000 10:03 GMT

I have a bit in my map which overlooks an area you reach early on and it is to house 2 enforcers. Later the player reaches this area and I want a fiend to teleport in and jump out at the player from beleow (the player appears from above when he/she comes round to it). This would need a trigger_monsterjump entity to work properly. The thing is, as the place is formerly occupied by enforcers, they would end up jumping aorund and looking fucking stupid. Is there a way to make the trigger work only with certain monsters?

-than

btw, I know about the hipnotic cnt key but this would be no use as it only sets the amount of times it can be used so an enforcer would trigger it, look dumb and then the fiend wouldn't jump at all as the trigger would be killed by then. Grr

Do I Need 135 Too? Or Can I Jus Get 147?

#150 Posted by -=Blitz=- [63.214.69.216], 07/08/2000 17:15 GMT , Refers to Post #148

#151 Posted by kanaeda [207.208.187.229], 07/08/2000 17:54 GMT , Refers to Post #150

it says so in the file descriptions on their d/l page that you need both 135 and 147 since 147 is just an .exe update.

I'm Gunna Take This Space To Ask....

#152 Posted by -=Blitz=- [63.214.109.137], 07/08/2000 20:31 GMT , Refers to Post #151

another technical question. When I use OpenGL mode for Quake 2, I get a wicked crappy framerate. (10-20 FPS) But I like the lighting and texturing way better on it. I think that my system is good enough to run OpenGL smoothly, but I guees not. AMD - k6 466 mhz 64MB RAM 10 GB hardrive? Is there a patch or something I could get to make it run faster?

#153 Posted by kanaeda [207.208.187.229], 07/08/2000 23:10 GMT , Refers to Post #152

what kind of 3d card do you have?

if you don't have a 3d accelerator that supports OpenGL rendering modes, then it is forcing your cpu to not only run the game, but do opengl rendering (which is waaaay more than it should be doing at once). If you have a 3dfx voodoo/voodoo2 then you do not have a 3d card with OpenGL support (they have a hacked, very shabby opengl driver to achieve q3 support).

#154 Posted by -=Blitz=- [63.214.72.185], 08/08/2000 00:29 GMT , Refers to Post #153

I have MMX rendering. I guess my question is...is 30 FPS good for OpenGL.

#155 Posted by kanaeda [207.208.187.229], 08/08/2000 02:37 GMT , Refers to Post #154

but if you're getting a steady 30 FPS thru cpu rendering, then your doin alright. MMX rendering of OpenGL is nothing that you should be playing games on.

#156 Posted by NotoriousRay [199.75.226.95], 08/08/2000 16:58 GMT

i remember hearing this problem early on when q3 tools were released, but now i'm encountering it now that i started my ra3 map. see since the first arena is so small (and the only one partially built) it is fullbrite ingame. how do i fix this, or can i?

#157 Posted by Lunaran [205.188.192.26], 08/08/2000 17:01 GMT , Refers to Post #156

Sometimes pulling down the console and putting it back up again gets the lighting going.

You could also just make the map bigger by putting in a huge hollow box next to it with 2 or 3 2000-watt lights in it.

#158 Posted by GrindSpire [62.7.61.149], 08/08/2000 17:53 GMT

Type vidrestart or something like that...

Borked Colours

#159 Posted by Tron [203.38.138.22], 08/08/2000 23:51 GMT

This isn't really a problem as such but does anyone know what the deal is when occasionally you load up a map and all the palattes stuffed up. Bringing down teh console then putting it back up fixes it, but it looks really trippy. Does anyone know what causes it?

Tron

#160 Posted by NotoriousRay [4.17.66.144], 09/08/2000 01:47 GMT , Refers to Post #157

thanks for the tip, i'll try the big light box idea and see if that works, cuz the console doesn't do anything at all

Q2 Textures

#161 Posted by Asriel [203.96.152.184], 11/08/2000 00:57 GMT

I need some 'future' textures to make the map im doing look good. Its set in space btw.
Some links for good techy textures for Q2 would be nice
Ta in advance

Q2 Textures

#162 Posted by Friction [193.229.255.17], 12/08/2000 14:29 GMT , Refers to Post #161

The Reckoning by Xatrix (q2 addon) has some really nice unused techy textures. Im not sure if aynone has them online for DL though.

Q2 Textures

#163 Posted by Asriel [203.96.152.184], 14/08/2000 01:01 GMT

Thanks Friction, I think I know where to get them from
Opiates Warehouse

#164 Posted by CZG [148.122.66.52], 14/08/2000 15:36 GMT

As we all know, the lush Small Pile of Gibs SPoG, (and I think mister Fingers had something to do with that too,) has schemed a failsafe method of creating complex curves in Q1Q2 by using 12 sided and 24 sided cylinders.
Now I've memorized the 12 sided cylinder plan; 0:1 1:2 2:1 1:0
But I have no recollection at all of how the 24 sided cylinder bit was.
So could some enlightened being be so kind as to please type it here, so I may use it at my will.
Thank you.

CZG

Re: SPoGism

#165 Posted by CZG [148.122.66.52], 14/08/2000 22:07 GMT

I'll just reply to myself here for future reference, as I got the answer from the man himself in #TF :
0:2 1:4 2:4 3:3 4:2 4:1 2:0

CZG

Is It Just Me

#166 Posted by Peej [194.83.240.36], 15/08/2000 01:28 GMT , Refers to Post #165

or does anyof this make any sense to anyone??

Makes Sense To Me.

#167 Posted by Lunaran [205.188.199.22], 15/08/2000 02:18 GMT , Refers to Post #166

Those are the ratios of the angles of the sides of one-quarter of a 24-sided cylinder.

First side is vertical in the xy view - ration 0:2. The next side slopes in at 1/4, then another side slopes in at 1/2, etc.

#168 Posted by than [212.188.153.73], 15/08/2000 08:07 GMT

makes sense to all those who use those types of cylinders for simulated curves in q1/q2 ... an Lunaran, obviously :)

-than

/me Understood It...

#169 Posted by GrindSpire [193.113.185.164], 15/08/2000 14:29 GMT

personally I use:

1:4 3:3 4:1

No No No....

#170 Posted by Akaroo [169.207.115.80], 15/08/2000 18:41 GMT

Bah, you don't know who I am but i would go with 0:2 1:4 2:4 3:3 4:2 4:1 2:0

Oh.. and half-life mappers are better =P

#171 Posted by kanaeda [207.208.188.2], 15/08/2000 20:34 GMT , Refers to Post #170

Oh.. and half-life mappers are better =P

yeah, sure. whatever. at least I got a good laugh today.

Aaaaaaargh!!!

#172 Posted by Auhsan [62.82.136.161], 15/08/2000 21:27 GMT

just carve a cube with a cylinder and shut up =].

And remember that carve it's evil, but so fun.

#173 Posted by kanaeda [207.208.188.2], 15/08/2000 21:32 GMT , Refers to Post #172

but then you lose the nice, easy scalability that comes along with the ratios that SPoG, Lun, and many others have stumbled on to.

go ahead and carve that bitch. now lets see you clone and scale the entire thing to 2x the size it once was. icky mess.

Carving Cylinders.

#174 Posted by Tron [203.38.138.22], 15/08/2000 23:43 GMT

I was once a sad little man who used carve excessively. I used it a lot in trondm1 to do all those curves, as a consequence texturing was a bitch and the thing was full of leaks.

Carving = Evil
Vertex Manipulation = Good

Tron

#175 Posted by Lunaran [205.188.192.28], 16/08/2000 02:01 GMT

Curve Patches = Better.

I am not going to ask what makes HL mappers "better". I know in akaroo's sentence "better" doesn't have any applicable definition (better game? no. more skilled? says who?) and this thread doesn't need that bullshit anyway.

Personally...

#176 Posted by GrindSpire [193.113.185.132], 16/08/2000 08:08 GMT

I feel that the more skilled mappers are the ones pushing the engines to the limits. Yes, you may have made a nice map. But that takes less skill than someone who uses the engine to produce something amazing that is far beyond what is expected. Examples of this are some of the newer Quake maps, the authors have used the engine's full capicity. Yes, a Quake 3 map may look nicer but the person who made a Quake map that doesn't look quite so good is still more skilled as it requires less skill to make a nice looking Quake 3 map...

Hmm... I think I have a subject for my next column update :-)

Grindspire...

#177 Posted by Auhsan [212.166.137.243], 16/08/2000 12:57 GMT , Refers to Post #176

arent so easy to use, It's easier to do a curve with brushes cos the textures are easier to align, in patch curves its fucking annoying.

And light your map it's easier in q1 cos theres no color lights. Color lights can fuck your map if u use it bad, as happens many times...Examples of color lights used well: lun3dmx, bal3dm2, yogi's map (dont remember the name)...and...and..uhm...not much more.

I'm not saying that mapping for q1 its easier than for q3... it's just different.

#178 Posted by Auhsan [212.166.137.243], 16/08/2000 13:05 GMT

arent so easy to use
I was refering to patch curves =]

Curve Patches

#179 Posted by Lunaran [205.188.195.33], 16/08/2000 16:32 GMT

They're pretty easy to align if you're used to how it works and are familiar with what the different functions like set and cap will do.

Maybe I should write a brief tutorial on how it works to post here ...

#180 Posted by kanaeda [207.208.138.161], 16/08/2000 17:04 GMT , Refers to Post #179

I think it's pretty easy to align textures on a patch. it might take a bit of time, but it surely isn't that hard. one important thing to remember is that the cap alignment only works on horizontal caps. took me forever to catch on to that one. ;p

Oh, Kanaeda

#181 Posted by Lunaran [205.188.192.23], 16/08/2000 21:25 GMT , Refers to Post #180

you have so much yet to learn. :)

Pressing shift-control-N changes the application direction. It cycles through all three axes, positive and negative.

#182 Posted by kanaeda [207.208.188.140], 16/08/2000 22:05 GMT , Refers to Post #181

I didn't even know that shortcut was there. thanks man. saves alot of hassle. :)

/me HUGS Lun

#183 Posted by GrindSpire [193.113.185.132], 17/08/2000 06:42 GMT , Refers to Post #181

That Shortcut

#184 Posted by than [212.49.249.103], 17/08/2000 09:09 GMT

I know about it but when I try and use it I get WIDNOWS FUCKING STICKY NOTES! I have no idea how to disable windows shortcuts so I have to keep going through the fucking menu all the time when I want to align a texture on an end cap (which I almost ALWAYS want to be non-aligned to the cap and look normal - but does it ever start that fucking way!? no).

Anyway, back to the point, does anyone know how I can disable stupid shortcuts in windows such as sticky notes and also how do I stop CQ from wasting all my shortcut keys without closing it. Actually scratch that last one, ICQ IS SHIT, I'll close it :)

-than

Shortcut Keys

#185 Posted by Nightbringer [203.109.138.221], 17/08/2000 09:38 GMT , Refers to Post #184

To stop icq gobbling all the shortcut keys, go icq|prefs|contact list tab and uncheck "use icq shortcuts".

Not sure if there's a way of disabling windows app lauch shortcut keys; but as far as I can see, the shortcuts have to be on the desktop or in the start menu for the keys to have any effect (anyone know for sure?); so it should be fairly easy to find the offending one and remove it.

#186 Posted by Lunaran [152.163.204.53], 17/08/2000 14:36 GMT , Refers to Post #184

You can change the q3r keybinding in a user ini file. for a full list of rebindable commands, look under Help|Command List.

Add this line to your ini file.
CycleCapTexturePatch = <whatever key>

If you don't have an ini file, add this line before that line:
[Commands]
and save it as than.ini. Then open q3r prefs and select that as your user ini file (at the bottom).

Disabling Shortcuts

#187 Posted by kanaeda [207.208.188.57], 17/08/2000 18:40 GMT , Refers to Post #184

the basic ones like alt+tab should be in the properties for the q3r shortcut. you can disble them there. not sure about that silly sticky notes shortcut... i've never ever seen the windows sticky notes. ;p

Sticky Notes

#188 Posted by than [212.188.153.64], 17/08/2000 19:03 GMT

I think they were with office 2k. not sure. but I think it's FUCKING RUDE of any software developer to use windows general shortcut keys without asking you if you want them because it can mess up shortcuts in other programs and it PISSES ME OFF (as does everything).

-than

ps. FUCK (what an excellent collection of letters).

General Stuff...

#189 Posted by Johnny Law [171.66.164.29], 17/08/2000 20:17 GMT

I'm pretty sure the HL comment was a joke, note the smiley, don't be so prickly. :-)

As for the assertion that it takes more skill to make a map for a somewhat limited engine than for an engine with more features: sure, if you're talking about a map that looks exactly the same in both cases. But that seems like a pretty arbitrarily constructed point of comparison.

It doesn't take "less skill to make a nice looking Quake 3 map", because the bar is higher.

Yes, But...

#190 Posted by GrindSpire [193.113.185.164], 17/08/2000 21:26 GMT , Refers to Post #189

...Because of newer games looking better, people are expecting more from the older games. For more thoughts on this see my column.

#191 Posted by Wiebo [195.193.202.50], 18/08/2000 10:27 GMT

...Because of newer games looking better, people are expecting more from the older games. For more thoughts on this see my column.

?? Then those are irrational and not straight thinking people. What have good looks of a new game got to do with an older game which an aged engine? I don't see why Q1 maps have to look as good as q3 maps. That's just plain madness.

I Didn't Say It Was Sensible...

#192 Posted by GrindSpire [213.123.24.98], 18/08/2000 10:30 GMT , Refers to Post #191

It's just what people expect

#193 Posted by Wiebo [195.193.202.50], 18/08/2000 13:56 GMT

...there is only so much you can do with an old game. Pleasing 'people' who expect their q1 game to look like q3 is impossible and should not be your aim. please yourself, i say.

#194 Posted by Wiebo [195.193.202.50], 18/08/2000 14:03 GMT

what i forgot: if you can please yourself mapping and you know you've made a better map then that's all you can do, right? To hell with other people's expectations! =]

#195 Posted by Lunaran [152.163.205.17], 18/08/2000 15:03 GMT

If I had used some lighter reddish and brown rusty textures and made an abandoned desert fortress map for Q1, it would still rock even if I didn't include flying birds, dust, waving canvas sheets and curved sand dunes. It wouldn't be any harder to give the map an immersive theme in q1 than it would in q3 - q3 having more "features" doesn't mean it's easier to map for, because I've then got to use all those features. In Q1 I don't have to worry about them, and I don't think anyone will expect me to write my own GL port with fog and shaders just to keep up with another game.

Remember, these are people that still play Q1 even though Q3 is out. Would they worry that maps aren't up to q3 standards? If they did, they'd be playing Q3.

Archs And Fog

#196 Posted by IkYiolul [206.158.235.198], 18/08/2000 17:42 GMT

Hey guys, I need some help, I'm in the process of making a map. I need to know how to do archs in Quark6. You see, my map is based on a Cathedral, and I need to make lots of archs. Can ya help me out? Oh and how do you make that cool animated thing that looks like a huge part of a snake? (that map with two of em comin out the ceiling,damn forgot what it's called) Oh and what about fog?

Thanx-
-IkY

#197 Posted by Asriel [203.96.152.184], 19/08/2000 06:24 GMT

grrr, i made some of a map in qoole, then to compile it only to find out that it is pitch blac (i only qbsped it, no lighting or anything) then i decided to export it to thread, But now it has leak in it for no apperent reason. So im trying to maek my move from QOOLE to something else,
which editor would u guys/girsl reccomend for q1 and q2 map making?

#198 Posted by GrindSpire [193.113.185.164], 19/08/2000 10:58 GMT

Q1 go for WC1.6 (www.planetquake.com/worldcraft/)

For Q2 use QERadiant (www.qeradiant.com).

You could always use the QER plugin to allow for Q1 support but it's your choice, get the plugin from www.planetquake.com/rem/

It's Not A Plugin

#199 Posted by kanaeda [207.208.189.75], 19/08/2000 17:22 GMT , Refers to Post #198

it's a converter program that sleepwalkr wrote to remove all the quake 2 specific information in a .map file, turning it into the quake 1 format (it removes the texture directory and surface properties from each surface). :)

#200 Posted by Asriel [203.97.31.106], 20/08/2000 04:05 GMT

thank you, i forgot about WC. I might get QER as well :P

#201 Posted by Seth [195.157.160.166], 22/08/2000 16:35 GMT

can someone tel me what it means when i get booted out of quake with a allocbloc error when i try and load my map... i seem to have a big fuck-off leak that has no right to be there and i havent done anything psycho to the map... i only clipped a few brushes and it all went a bit pete tong :(... help me pleeeeeassse :)

Coincidence:

#202 Posted by CZG [130.67.142.100], 22/08/2000 20:46 GMT , Refers to Post #201

Even though I know Shambler's away, I popped into TSQLRFPSDTS or whatever you abbreviate that with, the Q1 one anyway, and for some weird reason, prolly a brain spasm, I clicked on the Help link. And then for some fucked up reason, I read through the whole thing, and the last paragraph there, was exactly about this problem of yours, and if I can just quote Shamblah here:
You're screwed!! I've encountered this on 2 Quake levels so far, and despite asking repeatedly around the net, no-one has been able to help or explain it. You'll just have to play the level in software mode. If by any chance you do find out how to solve this, please email me.
And there you have it, straight from the white things mouth, aand frankly, I can't think of any better to say either...

CZG

#203 Posted by Asriel [203.96.152.184], 23/08/2000 06:42 GMT

does WC have resizeable windows 0 where u put in brushes etc, i like a large viewing area

#204 Posted by than [212.49.246.41], 23/08/2000 09:21 GMT

you can resize the windows in wc1.6 and below (just drag the window divider bars about) .If you are using wc3.3 then I think there are more viewport config options available.

-than

WHAT THE FUCK!?

#205 Posted by than [212.49.246.41], 23/08/2000 09:22 GMT

here, I copied my question from irc sionce no bugger answered it:

*** Now talking in #qeradiant
<than> hello
<than> could someone tell me wtf a light grid mismatch error is? this appears at the console when I compile a map which contains a certain texture of mine. The shader for the texture is the same as for another texture (which works fine) and the texture displays fine in curry... it just won't display right in q3. It's meant to be a masked texture btw.
<than> I think it may be a problem with the texture itself but I cannot see wtf the problem could be. It's saved as a 32bit tga with an alpha channel.
<than> you are all very lively in here, aren't you?

So, if anyone can help me with my prob then I wil buy them a pickle or something. k?

-than

Re: WHAT THE FIDDLESTICKS!?

#206 Posted by Maj [193.128.238.146], 23/08/2000 12:04 GMT , Refers to Post #205

A quick search over on q3world threw up that this is a known problem, and to email tools@idsoftware.com. Unfortunately a reply from there is about as likely as, say, Wales spontaneously exploding.

Theres a few suggestions in the other threads tho:

1) Have you have done a full light (Yeah, it's patronising, but I gotta ask)
2) Use -vlight
3) Make sure that the shader is being used in q3map _and_ q3. e.g. if it's not in shaderlist.txt, or you've got another .shader in a .pk3 that's overriding it in q3 but not q3map.

Grid Mismatch/vlight

#207 Posted by GlassMan [195.184.253.80], 23/08/2000 14:54 GMT

hmm..the only time I've ever seen that is when using -vlight so if you are using that I would try it without.

Also if the texture is on a patch you could try remaking the patch.

Light-grid Mismatch

#208 Posted by DeFrag [207.227.185.14], 24/08/2000 04:01 GMT

Same here tonight.. I think its related to the texture with or w/o a referenced shader on a patch or in my case a cap.

Fuck all.. 'bout ready for a final-compile too! >:

#209 Posted by than [212.188.143.89], 24/08/2000 09:38 GMT

afik it's a problem with the texture itself but I cannot see what. There are no clashes with other shaders, it's on a standard playerclip brush (the shader also has player clip surfaceparms). I have done full light, no light and the error occurs whatever.

Why does q3 always have to give me this kind of shit? If I was doing it for hl all I would need to do is make the parts I want to not appear a solid blue colour and it would work. Q3 just appears to be a fussy bastard.

If you want I can upload the texture and shader for the texture (or entire shader file if you want to see it).

-than

er... btw, the shader file is in shaderlist.txt and I am not using -vlight to my knowledge. I just select light/fullvis from the q3 bsp menu. The shader works fine in curry but not q3 and I also have shaders which are identical except for the texture used which work fine... even on the same map so it's almost certainly a texture problem afaik.

Re: Coincidence

#210 Posted by Seth [195.157.160.166], 25/08/2000 12:25 GMT , Refers to Post #202

ok... cheers CZG.....

#211 Posted by Maj [193.128.238.146], 25/08/2000 14:17 GMT , Refers to Post #209

You can send it to me if you want, I'll take a look. Btw, are you sure that there isn't a .pk3 file about with a .shader file of the same name inside? You didn't mention it in your post...

AllocBlock Error

#212 Posted by aguirRe [195.100.152.210], 25/08/2000 17:40 GMT , Refers to Post #202

I was recently confronted with this error in a very small map and I thought I should give it a try to change the map until the error disappeared.

I tried a lot of things but the only thing that seemed to help was to get rid of the *very* large brush structure and replace it with a simple box around all the entities.

Now the map was playable in GLQuake. However, the most interesting thing was that if I increased the size of the box to a certain extent, I would get the "AllocBlock" error again.

To sum it up, one of the possible causes of this error seems to be one or more large objects (probably brushes) in the map.

Might Be A Leak...

#213 Posted by GrindSpire [193.113.185.164], 25/08/2000 18:15 GMT

If surrounding the entities in a box works then it is likely to be a leak.

Re:Might Be A Leak...

#214 Posted by aguirRe [195.100.148.127], 25/08/2000 19:32 GMT , Refers to Post #213

A leak in the map might also be a cause for the AllocBlock error, but in the map I was testing there were no leaks at all, just a simple box with the player entity inside. No lighting either.

By just increasing the size of the box, I received the AllocBlock error (in GLQuake, DOSQuake was fine). There are probably also other scenarios that will trigger this error.

Qbsp Error...

#215 Posted by SkLERoS [212.151.186.108], 25/08/2000 19:48 GMT

OK,I need some help with the invisble clip bug which can happen sometimes. In Quake aswell in HL. Well I have approached ppl at #terrafusion and I haven't gotten an answer to how to solve this pain in the ass. Is there or isn't it any way to get rid of the invisible clip brushes ? Please tell me if you know of ANY way to hinder or prevent them from appearing.

#216 Posted by kanaeda [207.208.137.146], 25/08/2000 19:58 GMT , Refers to Post #215

If I'm thinking of the same bug you're talking about (strange clipping where there is no clipping brush at all) then you should try playing around with the brushes in the immediate area of the problem. try moving an edge, deselecting the brush, re-select the brush, then move the edge back where you want it. this will force a change in the .map. re-compile and see if it is still there.

if it doesn't go away, repeat the same process with a different brush in the same area.

#217 Posted by than [212.188.139.101], 25/08/2000 20:31 GMT

I fixed the shader bug. I had an old version of teh shader file I was using nestling ina pk3 file. Still, I always get light grid mismatch on EVERY map I compile and I cannot figure out why. It's driving me mad. AND NOW THERE IS A FUCKING GAP ADVERT ON TV IN THE BACKGROUND AND I I AM TYPING AND AM THEREFOR POWERLESS TO TURN IT OFF! Ah, finished now... er, yeah, so I'm getting this error and I can't fathom it. To be honest though, apart from the extra polys I don't know why I want to map for q3.

-than

Invisible Clips

#218 Posted by Lunaran [205.188.195.38], 25/08/2000 22:10 GMT , Refers to Post #215

Those are caused when brushes meet at certain angles. If there are any brushes that you can merge, even if it means changing their shape, do it.

I found this bug while making cliff walls. If you change the dimensions in the back of the brushes so you can merge them, the error goes away.

Level Editing

#219 Posted by The_Gamer [194.65.14.67], 28/08/2000 17:12 GMT

How do I make maps for Q3?
Please tell me where can I find tools and tutorials to make them to...

The_Gamer

Man U Are A Bit Lost

#220 Posted by Auhsan [62.82.139.147], 28/08/2000 17:27 GMT , Refers to Post #219

u need q3r (map editor):
http://www.qeradiant.com
u can find the radiant manual there (i think)if it isn't there go to http://www.quake3world.com

#221 Posted by GrindSpire [195.99.57.109], 28/08/2000 17:36 GMT , Refers to Post #219

...Well Q3Radiant would be a good start:

http://quake3.qeradiant.com/

Then work from there, a good place for tutorials would be rust (http://www.gamedesign.net/)

Hope that helps

Huge Tracts Of Land

#222 Posted by Perselicas [172.162.0.4], 30/08/2000 20:19 GMT

First question. It's probably hell on compile time, but would drawing a huge box around every brush in a Q1 map as a quick fix for invisible leaks actually make a level run slower within the game? A box would only have 24 faces total and 12 (I think) that would be invisible from any point within the box so I can't see how drawing the faces would bog down the framerate that much. I'm running an extremely high spec PC so it's impossible to tell whether my level runs slow or not (at lower vid_modes, the framerate seems to regularly top 125.00)
Thanks for any answers :)

Incidentally, has anyone ever managed to register Worldcraft? I hate having unregistered software on my computer but I called ACD Systems and they didn't know what it was. "World what? Wonderworks? What?"

~Pers

One Word: Yes

#223 Posted by Fat Controller [203.96.101.195], 30/08/2000 22:36 GMT , Refers to Post #222

This "quick-fix" is known as a "daiper" in some circles, and doesn't really solve anything.

Basically, as well as rendering the inside of the daiper box, the engine will be rendering the outside surfaces of any brush visible from your location. That can be a lot of extra polys, and almost certainly will slow your map down.

If you absolutely must apply a daiper, find out where the leaks are and apply the daiper solely to that area - see my Swamp for an example.

Level-wide boxes should also be avoided for ego reasons.

As for WC, I got my registered version from someone else, and I'm not saying who. There. Two dirty secrets out.

#224 Posted by Johnny Law [207.17.136.129], 01/09/2000 08:23 GMT

Doesn't Quake split up large polygons, too? So if your box was large, there would be a more than 12 tris involved... potentially a lot more.

Maybe I'm misremembering about that, though.

Registering Worldcraft

#225 Posted by Tron [203.12.165.8], 01/09/2000 09:45 GMT , Refers to Post #222

It's not possible anymore. Valve bought the rights to worldcraft and so ACD stopped selling it.

Tron

Re: Daipers

#226 Posted by Maj [193.128.238.146], 01/09/2000 11:02 GMT , Refers to Post #224

Yup. IIRC it was 256x256.

The Allocblock Error.

#227 Posted by Scampie [205.243.60.13], 03/09/2000 01:22 GMT

Occurs when a brush has a face that's way too large. GlQuake doesn't like it. dos/winquake accepts it. This can sometimes be cuased by a bad brush... it will make the face extend to infinity in one or both directions... Best suggestion... remake the map. I once deleted almost all of a map trying to fix it... Eventually I just said "aw fuck it".

#228 Posted by Nightbringer [203.109.252.15], 03/09/2000 05:20 GMT

If you find the error in the middle of an editing session and would rather not restart your map, the offending brush is usually valid in the editor - which means you can manipulate it just like a regular brush. Search for it - hide/region off one half of the map (or the portion you suspect the brush to be lurking in); compile; test. If you still get the error, halve the current region, and repeat.
Once you get down to a few brushes, you can generally remove them all with minimal impact to the rest of the map.
(compile toolchain experts - is it possible to eyeball the offending brush by checking the map file?)

#229 Posted by Killjoy [129.170.58.40], 03/09/2000 20:22 GMT

anyone know where i could get a really big q1 ship prefab? not quite as big as that UT level, big enough to fit in a large bay in a q1 map. medeival style wooden ship, not modern steel ship.

thx
-killjoy

Those Gates

#230 Posted by Perselicas [152.163.207.206], 03/09/2000 22:43 GMT

With the way perssp1 is coming, I'm probably going to finish it with a runegate instead, but how in the world does anyone create those huge doors using wexit and wenter textures (at the end of e1m2 and e2m2 for example)? It looks like one half of the arch needs to have a mirrored texture on it, but if it's possible to do textures backwards, I don't know how :)

~P

To Flip Textures...

#231 Posted by CZG [148.122.66.52], 03/09/2000 23:32 GMT

...simply scale them by -1
As easy as that, though I still think id were bitches for just making half of those textures!

Invalid Brushes

#232 Posted by Gilt [154.5.31.57], 04/09/2000 00:25 GMT , Refers to Post #228

Like Nightbringer said, usually the invalid brushes still look valid in the editor. With worldcraft (I'm not sure about the others) if you export the map to a .map file and then reload the .map, it'll make the brushes look like they do in the game.

It's a lot easier looking for infinite length brushes this way, and the really bad brushes will just disappear.

I Hate Invalid Brushes

#233 Posted by Fat Controller [203.96.101.248], 04/09/2000 01:23 GMT

...especially when you're trying something like a puddle which you don't want to splash.

In OUM2 I had a sealed door with a puddle of water in front of it; the idea was you'd try to open the door and be informed that it was sealed due to flooding.

Unfortunately, I'd evidently made the water brush 0 units tall. Uh oh.

So I gave up on that.

Now I need to work on ideas for a nuclear incinerator instead.

We need a "load of shit" icon, really.

-100% Flip Textures

#234 Posted by Perselicas [152.163.206.213], 04/09/2000 04:31 GMT , Refers to Post #231

/me kicks himself very hard for not figuring that out.

It Was A Smart Move

#235 Posted by kanaeda [207.208.186.62], 05/09/2000 07:10 GMT , Refers to Post #231

at the time, they needed all the available memory bandwidth they could use. making only one half of a door cuts the texture memory in half. then again, you most likely new this already so i'll shut up now. hehe

Animating Flame Texture.....

#236 Posted by ]DR[Sozo [24.43.84.117], 08/09/2000 13:16 GMT

Hi all, great to see such good questions posted up here, this room is a lot of help!
Well anyway, i am wondering if someone can tell me how to animate my flame texture, i am trying to add some floating blue flame to myt map and i dont know how to have it actually flickering and wavering.....not sitting there looking like it is frozen in a time warp...unmoving. I already have it textured to the face of a no-draw brush, and cloned and intersected to give it the 3rd dimension, but no life! it just sits there....pitifully. hehe, any takers? Thanks all.....

Animating Flame Texture.....

#237 Posted by ]DR[Sozo [24.43.84.117], 08/09/2000 13:19 GMT

LOL BTW< I AM USING Q3RADIANT HEHE SORRY!!!

Re: Animating Flame Texture

#238 Posted by Maj [193.128.238.146], 08/09/2000 14:01 GMT , Refers to Post #237

http://www.heppler.com/shader

Read. Learn. Use.

#239 Posted by Clueless [130.238.7.35], 08/09/2000 20:11 GMT

Why do I get this error? I get it on the maps that come with Q3Tools aswell, I get it when I try to load the map in Q3 after doing a FulLVis:

ERROR: RE_LoadWorldMap: maps/q3dm1sample.bsp not found

But it's THERE, under baseq3/maps...

What's wrong??

#240 Posted by Lunaran [64.12.105.166], 08/09/2000 21:57 GMT , Refers to Post #239

Check c:/win/temp/junk.txt for errors, and make sure your quake3arena folder has the word "quake" in it.

#241 Posted by than [212.188.154.90], 09/09/2000 09:51 GMT

does q3 and q3r leave files all over the fucking computer. why can't they just keep them in their own god damn directory?

#242 Posted by Lunaran [152.163.195.208], 09/09/2000 15:37 GMT , Refers to Post #241

because that would make sense.

Q3R is basically still a developer's program, hence the gobs of ram needed and so forth. It was inteded for a computer that had little on it except an OS, Q3A and Q3R, and maybe a few graphics programs.

~Lunaran

Curves In Pipes

#243 Posted by GlassMan [193.113.185.132], 10/09/2000 21:50 GMT

I'm looking for a bit of help on how to make 'curved' bends in pipes like in spogsp1. I've done a simple curve with just a single 45 deg piece as in
-

|
with 3-point clipping but it was a bit tricky & not perfect. I browsed the old qboard & came up with this comment from than..

"Used a couple of curvy pipe like yours in SPOGSP1 but nothing like as many or as complex (I used your technique though - 1.25 stretch across the pipe then shear 2:1 and clip (actually works in WC)."

If anyone could expand on that a bit or provide any other shortcuts I would be grateful :)

(This is for q1 so no q3 curves)

Ascii Screwed Up

#244 Posted by GlassMan [193.113.185.132], 10/09/2000 21:51 GMT

but u know what i mean.

F* F* F* F*ING M*F* GODDAMN!

#245 Posted by Fat Controller [203.96.111.202], 11/09/2000 08:55 GMT

Towne is too damn big. Here's what happens atm after BSP and a fast vis:

1. Tyrlite crashes with a closebrace without data error (something like that)

2. Load the map? hah! a flurry of b0rky-looking "spawn parms" appear, then Quake crashes with much the same error.

Now, these errors may be because the map's too big even with a fast vis. Before I give Mike Woodham a tinkle...

Do you guys reckon that running a full vis might help things?

-Fatty
(Who's gonna be royally pissed if he can't get the damn map working again)

Curvy Pipes...

#246 Posted by Tron [203.12.165.232], 11/09/2000 11:18 GMT

I've been trying to do exactly the same thing recently but gave up in the end, I'd be interested in knowing the secret as well (my pipes look perfect in worldcraft but have cracks in quake)

Tron

Re: F* F* F* F*ING M*F* GODDAMN!

#247 Posted by Tyrann [203.56.239.115], 11/09/2000 15:36 GMT , Refers to Post #245

Oh no, this error is a real bitch.

I had this error while making actaltrz. From what I could tell, it is simply because the BSP file is too big. Do whatever you can - reducing the number of textures is probably your best bet. If not that, you'll have to attack some geometry...

Actaltrz was so close to the limit that I had the followig situation:

1. QBSP + Light = OK
2. QBSP + Vis = OK
3. QBSP + Light + Vis(fast) = Crash
4. QBSP + Light + Vis(level4) = OK.

So, the fact that level 4 visdata compresses
better was the deciding factor. What you need to do will depend on how close to the limit you are...

#248 Posted by Fat Controller [203.96.101.221], 12/09/2000 04:27 GMT , Refers to Post #247

Not even full vising (for 17 hours yet) helped!

Oh well, I'll have to break the map into three bits instead.

Anyway, the way I've built the map was incremental, so there're some built-in seams I can work on, I suppose.

Full VIS Seeing More Polygons Than Usual

#249 Posted by Browser [L3M] [198.235.69.172], 12/09/2000 13:29 GMT

Hi, I've been starting to do Quake-1 maps for about 2 months now. I've noticed something after doing a full VIS compilation. It looks like VIS is seeing more polygons than what there are actualy. I mean, when I have my nose against a wall for example, the numbers from R_SPEEDS are telling me that it is seeing through the wall (numbers like >+100).

Now I don't know much about Q1 RVIS (I'm using an RVIS modified by Antony Suter that came in a build package within my Map editor QuarkV5.10), but the one I used for Q2 didn't have that problem. So is it a limitation of Q1 RVIS or is there a way to fix this ?

P.S. : my editor is calling RVIS this way
Rvis.exe -level 4 mymapname

Error Message In TXQBSP

#250 Posted by Browser [L3M] [198.235.69.172], 12/09/2000 13:32 GMT

Can someone tell me what the warning error message below means ? I've started having this when I added teleports in my Q1 map. So far, nobody answered me on this in other newsgroups.

TXQBSP 0.6 - based on QBSP by John Carmack. Modified by Armin Rigo
--------------------------------
with extensions for QuArK (Quake Army Knife) :
floating-point coordinates and enhanced texture positionning
http://www.planetquake.com/quark
--------------------------------
outputfile: ./maps/l3mdm1.bsp
--- LoadMapFile ---
./maps/l3mdm1.map
...
...
---- MergeAll ----
1982 mergefaces
writing ./maps/l3mdm1.prt
WARNING: CanonicalVector: degenerate
...
...
WARNING: CanonicalVector: degenerate
MODEL: *1
...
...
MODEL: *25
--- FinishBSPFile ---
WriteBSPFile: ./maps/l3mdm1.bsp
added 4 texture frames
1214 planes 24280
4848 vertexes 58176
1170 nodes 28080
1669 texinfo 66760
3283 faces 65660
4190 clipnodes 33520
800 leafs 22400
4223 marksurfaces 8446
16332 surfedges 32664
8393 edges 33572
56 textures 484248
lightdata 0
visdata 0
entdata 13939
63.0 seconds elapsed

Canonical Vector Degenerate.

#251 Posted by CZG [130.67.142.213], 12/09/2000 16:53 GMT , Refers to Post #250

I have no idea what the error actually means, but I think you should say yourself lucky as it didn't crash the compile as it usually does to me.

Anyway, the best way to get rid of them is to try to compile only half of the map, (can you do that in QuArK?) and see if the error appears then. If it doesn't you'll know that it is in the other half of the map, and you can then compile half of that, and half of that again, until you've narrowed it down to as few brushes as you like. It is most likely some overly complex brush, and when you find the cause of the problem, you'll just have to either delete it and maybe rebuild it, or just try to replace it with something else that works... Sorry I can't be anymore accurate, but I really don't know what this error really means. Maybe some of the engine wizards hanging out here knows? <nudge nudge>

As for the Vis query, I don't find that much strange at all. Vis works in mysterious ways.

Curvy Pipes

#252 Posted by GlassMan [193.113.185.132], 12/09/2000 22:52 GMT , Refers to Post #246

Tron..I cracked it in the end see this post on the old board:

http://www.coremedia.de/qboard2/thread.asp?threadid=153

Fingers & Spogs exchange has all you need.

From my experience tinkering with it tonight, make sure before you start that your pipe has all its vertices on the grid..on the inside of the pipe & the outside. (Use Spogs 12-sided cylinder to make the pipe & scale it by 1.5 to provide a reference for the inside & outside of the brushes). Everything should stay on the grid but if it drifts off be sure to snap it back.

Making the angled bits should then go smoothly if you follow Fingers instructions (post 59).

#253 Posted by Asriel [203.96.152.184], 13/09/2000 05:46 GMT

Im a newbie to WorldCraft, so i have some questions
How do i appl a player start entity?
I read the help, but it didn't work :(

#254 Posted by Fat Controller [203.96.111.202], 13/09/2000 08:02 GMT , Refers to Post #253

There's an "entity apply tool" icon - looks like an axe. Turns your cursor into a little axe with a crosshair.

By default WC assumes that the first entity to apply in a session is a info_player_start - look to the right for a dropdown box that has all the monsters and lights. If it doesn't read "info_player_start", click it and select same.

Then click in the map to place it. Select the pointer tool and move it where you wish.

Info_player_bollocks

#255 Posted by than [212.188.131.127], 13/09/2000 09:47 GMT

you can change the default pointentity and solidentity classes. There is a scrolly menu at the side which lets you select what entity you want to place and also, if you select the entity you created (remember to right click on the little green box and select create entity :) and right click and select properties, you can change the entity from there as well as edit it's attributes.

-than

#256 Posted by Seth [195.157.160.166], 13/09/2000 16:41 GMT

cheers 4 all ur help guys... i just hope i dont havce to start the whole friggin level again :-(

c yas

To All You Curvies!

#257 Posted by CZG [130.67.143.53], 13/09/2000 17:31 GMT

As if the Fingers/SPoG conversation wasn't enough, I hax0red up a tiny .map file that demonstrates the wonders of teh 12 sided curve.
I also took a shot of it in WC so you can glare at it as a .jpg, but the .map file is a ctually smller than the .jpg, so you migh be bes toff having a looksie in the editor. This by no means demonstrates the full joy of curves, but it's a pretty good start to get you going. And beleive me, once you get the hang of those curves it'll be a curse! I can't make a single wall without curving it into the most awkwards shapes. Anyway, here are the warez:
Curve12.jpg - 75 Kb
Curve12.zip - 5 Kb
Yay!

#258 Posted by CZG [130.67.143.53], 13/09/2000 17:34 GMT

I am utterly baffeled by the amout of typos in my last message. I'm really sorry, I'm not really a retard you know...

HOLY FUCK BATMAN!

#259 Posted by CZG [130.67.143.53], 13/09/2000 17:36 GMT

And another one!
Hmm, this must mean I'm really a retard! Wow, I never knew...

You Retards

#260 Posted by pjw [208.192.72.77], 13/09/2000 17:40 GMT

are always the last to know. (It's just because you're quite slow, really...)

(couldn't resist)

#261 Posted by Asriel [203.96.152.184], 13/09/2000 19:11 GMT

ta Fat Controller and Than

Rotate Scrip! Argh!!

#262 Posted by Deathmonger [212.14.102.72], 13/09/2000 19:27 GMT

I've made a 128*128 texture with a light swirling (128*128 too)1arround a circle that works fine, bu when I apply this to a texture
256*256 and a 256*256 light everything goes messy and the effect doesn't apply where it is supposed to, can anyone help me, i call

, I want to make the same effect he did in lun3dm2 bouncepads.

Aaaaaarghhh! Deathmonger.

#263 Posted by CZG [130.67.143.53], 13/09/2000 19:40 GMT

I forgot to mention, about those curves of mine, they are all fully scalable by 1 and 2 and 0.5 and 0.25 and pi. (Okay, so not by pi, but you get it right?)

#264 Posted by Asriel [203.96.152.184], 14/09/2000 03:33 GMT

There is no drop down list, but i think i have to set some more stuff up :(

#265 Posted by BlackPope [209.52.215.11], 15/09/2000 03:55 GMT

K... I've Completed a Q1DM map and need to upload it somewhere...
I tried cdrom.com in the pub/idgames2/incoming/ dir and it says I don't have permission to... (I've done it before I don't know why not now)
So I'm wondering where else I may be able to send my map around...
In hopes of eventually getting it reviewed somewhere...

Thx Muchos... BlackPope

Bad News Mate

#266 Posted by Fat Controller [203.96.99.199], 15/09/2000 06:34 GMT , Refers to Post #265

cdrom.com is now a profit-seeking group and doesn't accept public domain stuff anymore.

I recommend getting some web space of your own (say with Xoom) and setting up your own webby. Even if it's just a "Download my map/s here" single page, that's what you'll need.

Apart from a good FTP program and an understanding of HTML.

Or You Could....

#267 Posted by GrindSpire [212.126.144.12], 15/09/2000 06:53 GMT , Refers to Post #266

Send it to me and I will stick it up for you on my PQ/FP ftp (click my name above for my email address)

Problems With OpenGL Accelerated Editors

#268 Posted by Top Cat =^..^= [192.187.17.66], 15/09/2000 13:45 GMT

I have problems with all editors that use OpenGL visualization. Qoole 99, Tread3D, Worldcraft... generates a memory protection error. I think that origin of my problems is the screwed ICD that 3Dfx supplies for the Banshee, not good for windowed applications. Same results in different Win32 systems... W9x, WinNT ,Windows 2000...
There is an exception... QEradiant and Q3Radiant. Here all works almost fine, but... Can I use this editor for Classic Quake or maybe I should think in a new nVidia card?

Excuse my weird english... I'm from Spain... (No! I'm not a Bullfighter! =:��

Paixa Colega...

#269 Posted by Auhsan [195.57.233.74], 15/09/2000 13:59 GMT , Refers to Post #268

I'm from Spain too, and I got a banshee too(well until I receive my gf2)...I got a Guillemot Phoenix and the only driver that supports windowed mode was the first version...anyway contact me via ICQ at 72082991

Or You Can Use...

#270 Posted by GrindSpire [193.113.185.166], 15/09/2000 17:16 GMT , Refers to Post #268

Sleepwalkr's program, get it from http://www.planetquake.com/rem/

It converts maps made using QERadiant to Q1

Hope this helps

Thanks, GrindSpire...

#271 Posted by Top Cat =^..^= [155.54.1.247], 15/09/2000 18:28 GMT , Refers to Post #270

Thanks for your pointer...! I'll try it.

By the way... Anyone knows when Team Fortress II will be released?

---whooo---

#272 Posted by BlackPope [209.52.215.26], 15/09/2000 20:58 GMT , Refers to Post #267

Thanks Grindspire for your generosity

#273 Posted by Tron [203.12.165.8], 16/09/2000 00:40 GMT , Refers to Post #271

That's like asking how long is a piece of string. I'm guessing 2007 as the release date. 8)

Tron

Some Things I Need

#274 Posted by Speedy [213.221.48.20], 16/09/2000 01:03 GMT

1. Tutorial on making rotating geometry for Q1 (with hipnotic ents). Text and a map file - like the one that used to be on WC forge site (now it`s not there due to cdrom.com`s problems)
2. The latest version of Quest editor (their site is down for some months)
3. WinQoole 2.5 (not 99!) lmited sharewere is OK.
4. q1 model editor.
PLEASE! Answer by e-mail, as I dont have internet access. But mail me only links, not the files. Thanks in advance.

#275 Posted by than [212.188.128.176], 16/09/2000 14:04 GMT

check out czg's site.

Donkey Lovin'

#276 Posted by BlackPope [209.52.215.74], 17/09/2000 00:04 GMT

Grindspire May I send you yet another map to post up?!
Please and thankyou...

BP

#277 Posted by Asriel [203.96.152.184], 17/09/2000 02:56 GMT , Refers to Post #274

iv got it one cd. but i don't have the cd atm
sorry :(
If you still need it when i get the cd back, ill put it on the net for u, or something like that

#278 Posted by Speedy [213.221.48.8], 17/09/2000 03:28 GMT , Refers to Post #277

When you get it, put it on the net and mail me the link.
Speedy_man@mail.ru

Rotating Geo And Textures (Q1)

#279 Posted by Speedy [213.221.48.8], 17/09/2000 03:43 GMT

rotate_objects get their textures misaligned
Any technique to fix this ?
(I have a nice texture for a fan, but cannot align it )

Qbsp Error, & A Question

#280 Posted by Gilt [154.5.69.131], 17/09/2000 05:14 GMT

numbrushplanes == MAX_MAP_PLANES

That's the error that I get while qbsp is trying to build my map. Anybody know anything about it?

I found a little info on it in quakelab, but it basically said that they know it exists, but they need to look at a map with the problem to actually figure out what it means...

Also, how big can you make a level? What are the limits? I don't want to get into the same situation that Fatty is in.

#281 Posted by Asriel [203.96.152.184], 17/09/2000 05:49 GMT , Refers to Post #278

Leak From Info_player_start

#282 Posted by Asriel [203.96.152.184], 17/09/2000 05:51 GMT

wtf!?! im getting a leak from my info_player_start , this is so annoying!

Is there a cure for this weird fault?

#283 Posted by Asriel [203.96.152.184], 17/09/2000 05:52 GMT

its not just from the player start, its from all entities
grr!!

#284 Posted by Asriel [203.96.152.184], 17/09/2000 05:53 GMT

this is from using WC

#285 Posted by Fat Controller [203.96.111.201], 17/09/2000 08:11 GMT , Refers to Post #284

Alrighty, what you have to do is run the map (the BSP file should exist) in Quake, then pull down the console and type POINTFILE. This will create a string of dots through the level that should pass through the leak's position.
Also use NOCLIP, GOD and NOTARGET as required to follow it.

Then make a note of where the leak is, and fix it. Sad but true. I found this info in WC's help file, BTW...

PS. See General Thread for what went worng with Towne.

Yeah Sure...

#286 Posted by GrindSpire [195.99.55.220], 17/09/2000 08:43 GMT , Refers to Post #276

...Just send it over

Leaks Pt. 2

#287 Posted by GrindSpire [195.99.55.220], 17/09/2000 08:45 GMT , Refers to Post #285

You may need to run Quake with -particles 10000 as sometimes Quake can't display the full line

The Thing Is...

#288 Posted by Asriel [203.96.152.184], 17/09/2000 09:12 GMT

That there is no leak when ther are no entities in the map. (i just read that pointfile thing too )

Ok , Im Sorry

#289 Posted by Asriel [203.96.152.184], 17/09/2000 10:00 GMT

i jsut got taught some entity/leaks stuff, so u neednt worry bout my last posts
sorry

inertia Is Still Working On A Title

#290 Posted by inertia [207.95.174.107], 17/09/2000 14:55 GMT

HA!

im sorta back-ish (for today :/ )

Re: Spinning Brushes Of Terror

#291 Posted by CZG [130.67.143.93], 17/09/2000 17:44 GMT , Refers to Post #279

Sorry, there is no fix that I know of for making the textures on a rotate_object stay aligned. However, it is misaligned by the same amount every time, so if you play your level, and look really closely on the rotate_object (preferably when it's standing still) you can figure out that it, like needs to be about 16 or so units lower and eight units more to the left. Then do those changes, compile it again, and see if you were correct. If not, then just keep on tweaking it until you've got it sorted.

Re: Spinning Brushes Of Terror

#292 Posted by Tyrann [203.56.239.115], 17/09/2000 19:34 GMT , Refers to Post #291

I have found that the positioning of the "info_rotate" entity affects the texture alignment. Try moving it and you'll see what I mean.

Re: Spinning Brushes Of Terror

#293 Posted by CZG [130.67.142.203], 17/09/2000 21:46 GMT , Refers to Post #292

Mmm, I have this wacky theory. that goes about as follows:
Since there is no such thing as an origin brush in the Q1 engine, the Qbsp is moving the rotate_object to the center of the level, according to the info_rotate, so the origo of the level acts as sort of a center of an imaginary origin brush. I am most likely way off though, but if any code hax0rs can elaborate, or even better; explain, please do...

Oh, And I Forgot:

#294 Posted by CZG [130.67.142.203], 17/09/2000 21:48 GMT , Refers to Post #293

That would then explain to me why the textures come out misaligned...

Your Best Bet...

#295 Posted by kanaeda [207.208.138.91], 18/09/2000 03:31 GMT , Refers to Post #293

would be to hope that whoever worked on the code for the ritual/hynotic mission pack (that's where the entity is from, right? ;p) is still at ritual. send em an email and simply ask them. you could also try sending an email off to a couple of the ritual level designers (paradox and levelord both worked on their q1 pack) and ask them.

then again... this could be from the rogue mission pack and then you'd want to get ahold of them instead of ritual.

Re: Spinning Brushes Of Terror

#296 Posted by Tyrann [203.56.239.112], 18/09/2000 04:43 GMT , Refers to Post #293

That is my theory as well. It is also supported by the behaviour of dynamic lighting on rotating entities. I made up a set of test maps and a rather lengthy explanation of all this for Fatty a little while ago. I'll see if I can find it and I'll post a link here...

Re: Spinning Brushes Of Terror

#297 Posted by Tyrann [203.56.239.200], 18/09/2000 05:05 GMT , Refers to Post #296

Ok, I got it and uploaded it to my website. You can get the zip with maps and text here or you can just read the text here - Although you probably need the maps to follow what I'm saying.

Texturing Rotating Brushes

#298 Posted by Fat Controller [203.96.111.201], 18/09/2000 09:26 GMT , Refers to Post #291

Sorry, there is no fix that I know of for making the textures on a rotate_object stay aligned.

Which is why I only use "grainless" or "flat" textures for coating spinning stuff...

Water Using Qoole

#299 Posted by Mr. EviL [165.228.129.12], 25/09/2000 06:33 GMT

Could Someone please send me a link where i can get a tutorial on how to make water, and lava.
thanks

Who Needs A Title Anyway

#300 Posted by BARiUM [213.64.109.22], 25/09/2000 13:16 GMT

what game ??
in quake, just use a *lava texture or a *slime testure...
in quake2 there are surface properties (slime and lava)

#301 Posted by BlackPope [209.52.215.33], 25/09/2000 18:23 GMT

After exploring many many of the wonderful

DM maps out there I realized something...
Most (like 90%) of the lifts being used in the maps are func_door entities...
I'm just wondering as to why people prefer to use doors instead of the func_plat (which I prefer) , is it because you can get other sound effects? does it somehow affect the fps? Im at a loss here...

fill me in...
-=

The Fact Is...

#302 Posted by Deathmonger [62.36.170.240], 25/09/2000 18:46 GMT , Refers to Post #301

When func_plat is placed in map editor what you are edoting actually is the final position of it, it will star "closed" at a lip distance acording to the group brush altitude. func_door are appear in the game as you have edited them in the editor.

So people who wants to place a plat and waste no time experimenting with the lip choses the func_door.

(well, that's what i can remember, I haven't used the worldcraft since... )

Deathmonger

Bleh, This Txt Box Is Too Short.

#303 Posted by CZG [130.67.142.223], 25/09/2000 21:19 GMT , Refers to Post #301

Because this is my real topic:
There are other advantages with func_doors too!
With func_plats, you are just slapping some brush in the level, and let the QC take care of how it operates, and thus you can only have a plat that starts down, and goes up when stepped on. (Well, you could trigger it to wait in the upright position, but why would you want that in a DM map?)
And now there was a bunch of great stuff I was going to say here about the advantages of func_door, but Blitz in #Terrafusion made me forget it just now!

Well, at least you can trigger them and have some funky sound effects, and you can delay how long it takes from stepping on them 'til they start moving, and some other stuff too.
This was supposed to be a really helpful and all out fabulous post, but the topic txt box being too short and the Blitz thing prevented that...
Boo

The Clouds Have Parted...

#304 Posted by BlackPope [209.52.215.10], 25/09/2000 22:31 GMT , Refers to Post #303

interestink... I personally have never had a need to use a trigger on my lifts but I see how it would be useful in ...

/me has a brain fart and forgets the name
... damn who's map is that... the lift takes up an entire corner section of a hallway (maybe its a couple maps) so a button would be needed because everone doesn't want to go up...

I'll just stick with func_plats... it's what they're for!

NEXT question....

... I rarely see the ring of invis in DM maps... it's not an all powerful item...so why does nobody like it?
/me makes a point to sneak it somewhere in his next level...

BP

Doors As Plats

#305 Posted by Fat Controller [203.96.111.201], 26/09/2000 01:47 GMT

func_plats (in Q1, at least) generate a trigger that spans from the "top/spawning position" to the bottom end of the plat's travel, about 16 units in from the edge.

This means that when you walk right up to the top of a plat's "shaft", it automatically rises to greet you. If you wanted to get down the shaft, that could be a problem ;)

Triggering the plat with a button simply causes the thing to stay "elevated" until button is pressed, then it's annoyance as usual.

Using a func_door triggered by buttons top and bottom offers more avenues of descent, and more control for players. It also offers some strategic fun, eg. laying a grenade on the lift, then sending it up for them upstairs to enjoy... or laying a trap if the lift has to be triggered at either end.

/me Was Gonna Answer

#306 Posted by kanaeda [207.208.137.246], 26/09/2000 03:34 GMT

but you guys are just too damn fast.

/me uses func_door instead of func_plat because it is more versatile and altogether more controlable by the designer.

#307 Posted by than [212.188.147.22], 26/09/2000 10:26 GMT

I'm not sure you can do this with lifts but you can use func_doors to trigger other things by giving them a target and also add a delay to the triggering of this with wait (or delay, I don't remmeber). If you wanted a lift to rise up and always open a trapdoor above (for example) you could use this method rather than the slightly daft method of putting a trigger_multiple on the lift. This means the trapdoor would always open, wouldn't need extra triggers and if a player wasn't on it you wouldn't see a lift go through a solid door :)

I used this in apsp1 (although for doors and a drawbridge thing) where you trigger the first door with the gold key button which opens and halfway triggers the drawbridge which in turn triggers the second door as it gets about halfway.

-than

Leak Help, Pls

#308 Posted by OneDead [166.82.233.10], 26/09/2000 20:08 GMT

I'm new to qmap.com, and fairly new to Worldcraft, for quake1. While compiling my 3rd map, i'm repeatly getting "...leak found..." anywhere i place my "info_player_start" entity?! The cords in my process window show my player start entity every time! Any ideas...help!! Previous maps didn't do this...

Ooh, A Leak!

#309 Posted by CZG [130.67.143.112], 26/09/2000 20:22 GMT , Refers to Post #308

(Note: I know the Quake engine doesn't work at all like this, but this is a model of it that works fine for explaining things for me, so STFU all you engine wizards!)

OK, if you imagine that you are the Quake engine, and you have to remember an entire level, it'd be much easier for you if you knew that you could only walk around on the inside of it, because then you could forget completely about what's on the outside. No if your map leaks, it means that somewhere there is a hole from the playing area of your level and out into the big grey void outside. This would then mean for the Quake engine that you theoretically can get out that hole and see the entire level, outsides and all, all at once. This isn't good, because that's a lot to remember.

So basicly, there is a hole somewhere in your level, and it doesn't neccesary need to be your info_player_start that causes the leak, but the compiler tells you the coordinates of the closest entity to the leak.
Now to fix it, you msut first find the leak. Sometimes it is a big gapig hole that you just forgot to fill, and sometimes it can be a tiny crack hidden away in a corner somewhere.

The compiler shold when it reports a leak, also make a pointfile (*.pts) along with your bsp. Make sure both of those files are in the id1/maps/ directory, and then run you map as normal. (you are still able to play your map, only that it will run slower.) Now pull don the console, and type pointfile. Quake will then create a trail of dots from your leaking entity, through the leak, and into the void, that you can follow and then find the leaking area. Then it's just a matter of plugging the leak in your editor, slpa a brush infront of it or strech the surounding brushes together, just get it tightened up.

A lot of nonsense that maybe will help you...

Thanks, CZG!

#310 Posted by OneDead [166.82.233.85], 27/09/2000 02:13 GMT

hey, problem fixed now! I honestly knew about pointfile, but forgot about it! Brain cramp, ya' know! But without your reminder, I probably would have torn it about, so thanks for saving me about 2-3 hrs more work, CZG!!

Ring And Platforms..

#311 Posted by Kell [194.105.160.225], 27/09/2000 09:46 GMT

There are 3 reasons I can consider that incline people not to use The Ring in Q1DM;

Although it has zero effect on gameplay, the Ring Of Shadows' design is based on the defining artifact of Lord Of The Rings and therefore feels medieval; it looks out of place in an industrial map.

The Ring, like the Pentagram, takes -ages- to respawn, so one wonders if it's worth including at all, since some matches may be over before it reappears.

Although not as overtly powerful as the Quad,
invisibility in Quake does not have the funky 'refractor-field' effect of Q3A, just the floating eyeballs. Invisibility really means invisibility, which can give a skilled player as many free frags as he/she can scoop in 30 seconds.

As for the platforms...
I use platforms if I want a structure to function in a straightforward way. Players in the map quickly learn that standing on it means going up...and that's all. Simplicity can help gameflow. You can also check a flag that sets 'low trigger' meaning players can jump over a plat or even drop down a lift shaft without triggering it at the top.

Enough gibbering, I have a proper question, but I'll start a new post.

QDM Changelevels

#312 Posted by Kell [194.105.160.225], 27/09/2000 10:01 GMT

My earlier DM levels (some of which are available here) are designed to be connected via a start map. An unconventional idea maybe, but the idea was to allow players to select a map they like, rather than playing in a restricted linear sequence.

The problem is, by default players carry all armour and weapons when the frag/timelimit is hit from one map to the next, and this screws up the gameplay. A rocket launcher in a perforator only level? I think not.

I tested this in Scourge Of Armagon; if you progress through the SP Armagon maps in deathmatch mode, there are breaks between each 'episode'. Within an episode, the tech levels say, all weapons go with the player: but jumping onwards to the medieval episode, the player starts with only s-gun + axe.
How do I get this to happen with my levels?

I thought it might be the func_command entity from Armagon. The way I assume it should work is that the entity creates an invisible trigger box; when the player enters it, a console command is automatically executed. If I set the console command of the func_command to be [map blah] it should work...but nufffin happens. At all.

Any suggestions? Help me keep rocket launchers out of kdm4 :)

Re: QDM Changelevels

#313 Posted by CZG [130.67.143.95], 27/09/2000 15:58 GMT , Refers to Post #312

It is coded into the QC, something like
if(self.model) = hip1m2.bsp then give IT_shotgun IT_axe
I don't know exactly how it's written, I don't do QC, but it is there it's done, so sorry, you can't do that in custom levels without custom code too.

#314 Posted by Kell [194.105.160.225], 28/09/2000 09:46 GMT

dammit!
dammit!
dammit!

:(

thanks for the help, though, CZG

#315 Posted by Speedy [213.221.51.16], 30/09/2000 01:19 GMT

Big thanks to Tyrann and CZG for help.

Kell, Read This

#316 Posted by XeNoN [195.8.75.49], 01/10/2000 12:11 GMT

If you set the changelevel parameter on all the main maps to a small map with a few dm starts, a rune, and an exit leading to the start map, it should work; Someone enters the small intermission map, grabs the rune, and leaves, (preferably the server) then everyone will restart at the start map with no weapons except the shotgun & axe.

I'm not sure it will work, but its worth a try.
--------
>>XeNoN<<

Who Needs A Title Anyway

#317 Posted by Kell [194.105.160.225], 02/10/2000 15:47 GMT

It's certainly worth a try; I'll give it a go.

I have another query, whilst I'm on a roll.

The business of placing info_player_deathmatch entities at least 64 units from their centre to the nearest wall; is there a minimun distance vertically? How low can I make the roof above them?
I've got a few in my latest map: all the player starts are recessed in 'spawnboxes' but I occassionally get that 'respawn where you just died' problem?

Textures... N Stuff

#318 Posted by BlackPope [209.52.215.57], 02/10/2000 23:46 GMT

Occasionally I run Qbsp and I get an error... well not excactly and error it just stops responding...
It decides to stop responding on the "added 0 textures frames" line... (i think i got that right)
this only happens however when I have certain texture wad's loaded into WC... The Xatrix KP textures and the HExen2 + expansion textures are the ones that seem to be causing the problems...im geussing its something to do with the animated ones...due to the line it stops on...

It's not a critical problem because I just Use Texmex to pull out the textures I want to make a map with anyway and put them all into one .wad

I'm just wondering if anyone has a problem similar to this and if there is an easier way to get around it...
THX
BlackPope

#319 Posted by Asriel [203.96.152.184], 04/10/2000 00:04 GMT

Where can i get stoneless?

The Invisible Map!

#320 Posted by Biff_Debris [152.163.204.213], 04/10/2000 01:48 GMT

Hey guys, I'm working on my (second) Q3A map (with Quark, which is SWEET), but even though I haven't a single leak and all seems well enough, the sky shader seems to have run berserk and covered an entire section of the map (rendering it almost invisible). Has anyone else run into this prob, and know what might be causing it?

#321 Posted by SPeedy [213.221.48.89], 04/10/2000 02:27 GMT , Refers to Post #319

http://netspace.net.au/~jewsbury/stoneless/

#322 Posted by Asriel [203.96.152.184], 04/10/2000 04:37 GMT , Refers to Post #321

Thanks Speedy
WC has usless texturing, QER is too complicated ( :) QOOLE sux, time to try another..

#323 Posted by pjw [208.192.72.77], 04/10/2000 06:22 GMT , Refers to Post #320

Don't know if I can help you too much in Quark . . . does it "run berserk" in-editor, or in-game, or both? Maybe a screenshot? Do you get any error messages at the console when the map loads?

#324 Posted by Biff_Debris [205.188.198.157], 04/10/2000 09:34 GMT , Refers to Post #323

No man, this is the compiled map which is doing this (although I've typically only been running it without vis or light, but even with a full vis, it looks the same). You can get a zip of four screenies I've made here:

http://members.aol.com/biffdbree/q3files/imp3dm2shots.zip

#325 Posted by pjw [208.192.72.77], 04/10/2000 17:19 GMT , Refers to Post #324

That's some serious HOM (hall of mirrors) you got going on there . . .

Sometimes levels just seem to do this for no (obvious) reason in a single area, especially when the geometry starts to get a bit complex, but there usually is an obvious reason. Some of the below possibilities are sort of dumb, and I'm not sure how much you know or don't know, so forgive me.

I assume that you don't have any leaks--this would be the simplest thing (i.e. have you checked your junk.txt output to make sure that you aren't getting any leaks? A level will still compile and run, even with a leak, just badly. It's a good idea to check your junk.txt anyway, just to see if you have any other errors).

I also assume that everything looks fine in the editor, and that brushes are textured as they should be (no nodraw, etc.) and that when you load the level, you don't get any error messages at the console.

If all of the above checks out okay, then it's one of those less-obvious situations. Is your sky in that area unusually complex for some reason? (i.e. Is it more then just the typical roof w. maybe a couple of walls coming down from it?)

I have heard that sometimes hint brushes can get rid of odd vis errors, but I don't have any experience using them for this purpose, so can't really be more specific.

Is there something specific that you did in your last editing session that may have made this happen, and can you undo/redo it? The final resort (unfortunately) for this kind of shite is to simply rebuild the offending area, and fast-vis regularly to determine at what point your problem occurs. Hope this helps, and I wish I could have given you a more specific solution . . .

#326 Posted by Biff_Debris [205.188.199.34], 05/10/2000 00:29 GMT , Refers to Post #325

While Quark doesn't have an equivalent of a junk.txt, it does point out any leaks the map has, and even guide you to them. The sky brushes aren't necessarily complex (one section is made of of three regularly shaped brushes, so no fancy vertex manips are going on) -- however the ceiling and floor in that area is a little complex (mainly due to the area's odd shape). This is probably the culprit, and will probably have to be rethought (with several brushes simply going thru each other, rather than avoid this in the build). It may not be pretty, but hopefully I'll be able to see it. Thanks for all your help anyway, man -- I'll probably have more questions soon!

Re: Junk.txt

#327 Posted by pjw [208.192.72.77], 05/10/2000 04:29 GMT , Refers to Post #326

Yeah, I think I forgot you were using Quark about halfway through my post . . . the onset of senility is a scary thing.

Happy to (try to) help any time.

Heard Of Arghrad

#328 Posted by OneDead [166.82.233.20], 06/10/2000 08:10 GMT

Hey, has anyone heard of the lighting tool Arghrad, for the original quake? I stumbled across a site a while back that used this (or a similiar named lighting tool), and man what a difference. (he had before and after pics) But, now that I'm a little more interested in quake level editing, I can't find this web site again. I am aware of Arghrad3, for q2, but I'm sure there's one designed/coded for reg. quake.....help!? :))

It's Called Arghlite

#329 Posted by Tron [203.12.165.8], 06/10/2000 11:34 GMT , Refers to Post #328

The original tool was called arghlite for quake, you should be able to find it easily enough by just searching on http://www.fileplanet.com for "arghlite" Hope this helps.

Tron

Or Try TyrLite

#330 Posted by Speedy [213.221.51.32], 07/10/2000 02:05 GMT

It seems to be the best light prog for q1

http://www.planetquake.com/tyrann

Attenuation formulas, coloured lights, sunlight, anti-lights and some other features.

#331 Posted by Kell [194.105.160.225], 08/10/2000 14:59 GMT

I know this isn't really a mapping question, but you guys know what you're talking about so I thought I'd ask.

Is there a way to listen to my own mp3's or CD's while playing Q3A?

I wanna rail Klesk ]:= in time to Ministry :)

Q3A Beam Lighting

#332 Posted by Biff_Debris [152.163.195.204], 08/10/2000 23:38 GMT

I've got these four brushes using the "sfx/beam" shader, but they don't radiate light on their own. Do I have to use a really tight spotlight on them or what? Yeah, I'm still using Quark, so don't get too Q3R on me.

Re: Beam Lighting

#333 Posted by Nightbringer [203.109.252.13], 09/10/2000 01:59 GMT , Refers to Post #332

If you want the beams to emit light, copy the shader and add a q3map_surfacelight parameter.

Rere: Beam Lighting

#334 Posted by Biff_Debris [152.163.195.193], 09/10/2000 02:59 GMT , Refers to Post #333

You mean, copy the beam entry on the sfx shader file to a seperate file, including the _surfacelight param, and include it in the (eventual) .pk3 file for the map? How would I include it ("baseq3/scripts/sfx", or "baseq3/scripts/impfx", for instance)? I just don't wanna tinker too much and screw something up, here...

Re: Beam Lighting

#335 Posted by Maj [194.83.240.23], 09/10/2000 05:21 GMT , Refers to Post #333

I'm confused. Why would you want the beams to emit light? Surely they're positioned next to a light shader that's doing all the lighting work?

Don't Bother With Arghlite..

#336 Posted by ELEK [199.179.175.178], 09/10/2000 12:24 GMT , Refers to Post #328

Go straight to Tyrlite. It is a much better compiler, and you will get better results quicker. There are some excellent features in Tyrlite which arghlite doesn't support. Everything Arghlite has Tyrlite has and more.
-ELEK

Rere (Maj):

#337 Posted by Biff_Debris [152.163.197.184], 09/10/2000 12:30 GMT , Refers to Post #335

Well, something isn't working then, since the beams ARE NOT lit. I've selected "sfx/beam", and everything looks fine in a fullbright build -- is there anything else I need to select/use/add to get them to light?

#338 Posted by Lunaran [152.163.204.206], 09/10/2000 15:58 GMT , Refers to Post #337

Check the beam shader in question, as well as the texture alignment on the brush. If there's a lightmap stage on the beam shader, it's probably an unused broken shader (since it's not supposed to be darkened by surrounding light).

#339 Posted by Biff_Debris [152.163.195.193], 09/10/2000 20:26 GMT , Refers to Post #338

I wasn't sure what you meant by a "lightmap stage" for the shader, but I did notice that Quark has listed two identical entries for sfx/beam -- one under a texture folder, and the other under a shader folder. I had been using the one under the shader folder to texture the brushes in question, which I think might have been going about it back-asswards, since when I used the texture folder version, it lit up just fine in q3. They look don't look nearly as good as I would've thought, tho -- more like little see-thru cubes than lights. May have to go with spots.

So mebbe you helped =)

That Was The Point...

#340 Posted by GrindSpire [193.113.185.164], 10/10/2000 15:58 GMT , Refers to Post #339

The beams aren't supposed to produce light, they are placed next to actual lights in order to produce the effect of it shining through fog

#341 Posted by Biff_Debris [205.188.199.136], 10/10/2000 23:49 GMT , Refers to Post #340

They aren't affected by the lightmap, so in a way they ARE lit. But yeah, the light entities do do the trick.

I Still Think You Got It Kinda Goofy

#342 Posted by kanaeda [207.208.189.216], 11/10/2000 04:15 GMT , Refers to Post #341

you place a light somewhere, apply a light texture (shader) to the surface. then you make your foggy beam effect directly underneath/above the light that you built.

i would imagine it would look quite odd to have a like and a foggy cone, but no actual light texture to be found. ;p

Vis-blocker

#343 Posted by OneDead [166.82.233.42], 11/10/2000 10:51 GMT

Does anyone know what produces a good vis-blocker w/ reg Quake? I thought I read somewhere that a door, at least 32 units wide, provides a good vis-block!? I have one room that is small, with a few brushes in it, then I have another huge room beside it that has lots of brushes, and both room's floors are on same gridline (no steps down or ramps upward). Any ideas, without tearing up both rooms??

#344 Posted by Deathmonger [62.36.167.148], 11/10/2000 19:56 GMT

I've made different shaders for some weapon spot textures and I have a problem.
All of them use the same cut'n'pasted source code (from

lunbase jumpad)

and amazingly only one two out of six work!!
I've made some tests and I've find out that some apply correctly only in the XY axis, others in the ZX and so on.
My question is:
WTF?

Thanx in advance, Deathmonger.

Hmm, No Title

#345 Posted by XeNoN [195.8.75.176], 11/10/2000 20:38 GMT , Refers to Post #343

Um, No, you cant use a door or any entity as a VIS block, cos the Quake engine simply sees though them in game, and VIS ignores them, so you'll have to either reduce the amount of detail in the rooms, or use a sort of "donut Hall" where you exit one room, and have to follow a corridor round in a sort of donut shape (the idea is that a wall of some sort stops you from seeing both rooms at the same time)

NEways, try it and use the "R_draworder 1" command in game and see if the block has worked.

>>XeNoN<<

Waitaminute.

#346 Posted by Biff_Debris [152.163.205.69], 11/10/2000 23:09 GMT , Refers to Post #342

WTF are you talkin', Kan? Are you talking about texturing a light entity with a shader or what? If you are (???), I can't do that in Quark, anyway, since it just has this little dinky icon and a crosshair for positioning a light entity.

What I did (or have done so far) is have a brush textured with the shader, and stick a light inside of it. The light is weak enough to dupe whomever sees it into "assuming" that it and the shader are one and the same thing in the map. If there's some other way to do it than that, believe me, I'm ope to suggestions...

#347 Posted by kanaeda [207.208.188.73], 12/10/2000 00:23 GMT

first you need to get a clear mental understanding of shaders and textures and the difference.

a shader is nothing more than an OpenGL script. this script manipulates one or more textures into combinations and effects that you see in game. shaders are as simple as the metal footstep sound or a light emitting surface, or as complex as animated flames or alpha-masked effects.

I don't have any idea how quark has them seperated. your description sounded really... confusing. if you open the directory of textures called gothic_light you will find a bunch of light textures, some with similar names but a different number associated to them. if you don't, well... try loading the shaders for gothic_light.

what you should have is simply one brush with a light texture on 1 face. this light texture has a shader linked to it that causes it to emit light. next you place your foggy beam brush directly under the face of the brush with the light shader. apply your beam effect to the new brush with nodraw on the unwanted sides. you should now have a working light witha foggy beam. no light entity needed.

if you really are lost still, let me know. I'll send ya a quick example to show you what textures or shaders you should be applying where.

I Theenk I Got It

#348 Posted by Biff_Debris [205.188.197.152], 12/10/2000 23:25 GMT , Refers to Post #347

So "sfx/beam" isn't a shader but a texture, and the shader file attached to it is what you're talking about. I've obviously made the mistake of referring to the light textures as shaders -- I was thinking of the shader files and their accompaning textures as the same thing, or rather working together for the same goal. So what you're saying is that I would also need a light texture to provide the light, and the beam texture to simply accentuate it. Right?

#349 Posted by kanaeda [207.208.188.108], 13/10/2000 01:00 GMT , Refers to Post #348

but they would be applied to seperate brushes. if you load up a couple of q3 maps that have that effect in them (addict from peej or yogi's reloaded come to mind) you will see what i mean. you don't need a light entity at all.

#350 Posted by Biff_Debris [205.188.198.174], 13/10/2000 22:59 GMT , Refers to Post #349

Well, that's one hurdle down the pike...

Help Needed > Q2 Editors

#351 Posted by XeNoN [212.126.135.104], 14/10/2000 17:58 GMT

Which is the best, easiest free Quake2 Level editor out there? I am familiar with Q1 mapping, and would like to give Q2 a try.

Thanx,

XeNoN

#352 Posted by kanaeda [207.208.186.136], 14/10/2000 19:44 GMT

best and easiest to use generally don't go hand in hand, but there are comprimises to be found. i'm not sure on URLs for all these but you should be able to track them down.

worldcraft (not free, but you can get help with that here on qmap since they don't sell it anymore anyways)

qeradiant (definitely not the easiest to use, but arguably the best there is and also would open up q3 design for ya)

BSP (i know it's still out there somewhere :p)

Quark (also has q3 support now)

tread (never bothered with it, had radiant)

Qoole (not free, but has a nice interface which makes it easier to learn. has some icky bugs)

I've used all of those except tread at one point or another. All of them will allow you to make quake 2 maps. If you can fight thru the learning curve i suggest you try qeradiant. It rocks. :)

#353 Posted by Vigil [212.38.225.115], 14/10/2000 20:38 GMT , Refers to Post #351

Don't listen to kanaeda :). The best editor out there is the one you know best, you know how to use effectively and fast. So try different editors, see what like and use that. Say, I use WorldCraft and I like it. I have tried QERadiant but it would probably take ages for me to learn it as well as WC, so I can't be bothered right now. You may not like WC's system, if you don't, try out some other editor.

I'd say that's a pretty good list though.

Most games these days have one specific editor (HL with WorldCraft 3.3 being one example), but Quake 2 fortunately has some variety.

Yes, QEradiant is the way to go if you want to try Q3A mapping at some point, though if you like HL more, get WorldCraft. So the decision is up to you. Heh, it would probably be easiest just to use the editor you have used though, unless it's the piece-of-shit Radiant (remember to edit before posting).

Enough of me mumbling on my own.

Thanx Guys,

#354 Posted by XeNoN [212.126.131.77], 14/10/2000 23:30 GMT

But where do I get QEradient? Does anyone know the UrL?

Qeradiant.com?

#355 Posted by Auhsan [62.82.208.137], 14/10/2000 23:42 GMT , Refers to Post #354

Like He Said Already...

#356 Posted by kanaeda [207.208.186.136], 15/10/2000 00:13 GMT , Refers to Post #354

http://www.qeradiant.com

you want the build 135 install and the 147 update. the rogue brush repair plug-ins are pretty bad-ass, too. :)

#357 Posted by Speedz [213.221.51.19], 15/10/2000 06:00 GMT

Can you change the radial angle of spotlight (I use tyrlites mangle) I mean the thiknes of light cone

#358 Posted by GrindSpire [195.99.52.104], 15/10/2000 08:27 GMT , Refers to Post #357

What you set the normal angle of the light to is the width.

#359 Posted by Speedz [213.221.48.39], 17/10/2000 04:55 GMT

Can I change the hotkeys in WC 1.6
And how can I get registered ? No answer from their site..

And is there a 3d (3 point) plane-clipping?

#360 Posted by XeNoN [212.126.135.250], 17/10/2000 19:34 GMT , Refers to Post #359

Umm, I think they've stopped selling it now; and I'd recommend a different editor anyway, such as qED2, which is far easier to use and more versatile than Worldcraft.
Get it at www.3dmatrix.com , if yer interested

Mapobjects And Textures--export Problems

#361 Posted by G A Z E B O [24.114.57.190], 17/10/2000 20:36 GMT

I'm having a problem getting custom .md3s to show up with textures in Q3Radiant...

I've tried using Milkshape, hacked the .qc file, Npherno's GL Viewer, PakRat (on the Mac), SkinLinker, and generally thrashed around with this for so long that I think it's time to admit defeat... I wind up with wireframes (the id models load fine... sigh). I know with Q2 there was a nice 'bind skin' thing in Q2MDL I used to use...

I am obviously missing something here.
Most of what I find on the web applies to character models, but there is no control/.skin file for mapobjects, so I am inferring that the texture is bound in the .md3 compile/export process. But damned if any of the little proggies I have found will do the trick... I can't even hack the .md3, because, unlike Q2, it's not ASCII :-(

Help!

love,
G A Z E B O

Progetto Genoma .MAP File Available

#362 Posted by Mark Shan [212.216.23.248], 17/10/2000 21:36 GMT , Refers to Post #351

On my page http://utenti.tripod.it/shanks/genoma.htm the source .MAP file of "Progetto Genoma" is available for QEradiant : every newbie Q2 mapper can use it as base for addictional levels or personal modifications

Click here for more...

#363 Posted by Biff_Debris [205.188.200.33], 17/10/2000 23:21 GMT , Refers to Post #360

Yeah, it's very similar to WC -- or at least the original one was. I was such a doofus back then: when I'd get a leak in my map, I thought it was the editor, and NOT me (/slap to the forehead). Then I went to Deathmatch Maker, and totally fucked up...

Error In Linkdoors:

#364 Posted by Speedz [213.221.51.38], 18/10/2000 00:28 GMT

interconnected doors

(error in quake when i try to load a map.. )wtf?

#365 Posted by Speedz [213.221.51.38], 18/10/2000 00:36 GMT

its cross-connected doors error

#366 Posted by metlslime [63.84.192.10], 18/10/2000 00:45 GMT , Refers to Post #360

i used to use QED 1 & 2, before switching to Radiant. QED has a nice way to organize all brushes and entities into groups, and that is it's selling point i think. As for actual brush control, it falls behind QER. It has no vertice/edge/face manipulation, other than what you get from scaling the entire brush along one or more dimentions.

It also seemed slower than QER in general. It certainly was a step uip from Thred, which is what i used before QED. But if you are looking to learn a new editor, i would suggest QER over QED.

I Don't Really Know Much About

#367 Posted by pjw [208.192.72.77], 18/10/2000 02:09 GMT , Refers to Post #361

the Q3 model process, but this thread on the Q3World editing forum seemed like it might provide some useful information. Hope this helps.

User-friendly Mapping Programs

#368 Posted by Jesse [63.29.237.104], 18/10/2000 22:05 GMT

I'm a newbie to mapping, and I want to know what kind of map is very powerful with making Q1 maps. I tried the worldcraft.com link, but it doesn't work for some reason.....

#369 Posted by killazontherun [203.164.3.167], 19/10/2000 07:11 GMT

Look under cdrom/quake/utilities/level editors/(I think) and wc should be there.

#370 Posted by Asriel [203.96.152.184], 19/10/2000 18:38 GMT , Refers to Post #368

is at www.planetquake.com/worldcraft

#371 Posted by Speedy [213.221.51.58], 20/10/2000 02:05 GMT

Visit http://www.gamedesign.net/links.shtml
for a list of everithing, including some editor sites (q1/q2)

BSP 2 MAP Converter

#372 Posted by Perselicas [141.222.155.39], 20/10/2000 18:48 GMT

Is there a useful q1 BSP to MAP converter anywhere out there? The only one I can find generates a seperate brush for each face and gives a ridiculous number of brushes, but I doubt all the hacked maps I've seen were using it.

Thankx
~Pers

Why Do You Want It?

#373 Posted by GrindSpire [62.7.7.94], 20/10/2000 22:29 GMT , Refers to Post #372

That be the question.

#374 Posted by Tron [202.7.186.34], 21/10/2000 02:27 GMT , Refers to Post #372

There is one around called winbspc that does the job reasonably, all converters will give you a bit of a dodgy .map file though due to the way they work. ASking for one of those around here isn't really safe either, there was a big argument over them once when there was the whole fiasco of people coverting maps to quake 3 without permission. 8)

Tron

Converting Maps? Ack

#375 Posted by Perselicas [141.222.155.39], 21/10/2000 06:24 GMT , Refers to Post #374

No I just had a few plans involving the id deathmatch arenas. Quake 3? Y'all have nothing to fear from me ;)

~Percy

Extremely Frustrating Q1 Question

#376 Posted by Perselicas [141.222.155.39], 22/10/2000 15:17 GMT

How do you get a trigger_secret triggered by another trigger like a button or a counter? I'm thinking of e1m4 where the first secret appears to get triggered by a counter without the player walking over it.

Thanks ;)
~Perselicas

Where Is...

#377 Posted by Killjoy [198.115.164.149], 22/10/2000 17:47 GMT

where is that tutorial by danimal for making a weapon that floats in midair? i'd like to mess around with this in my next q1dm.

thx
-killjoy

I'll Take Them Both!

#378 Posted by CZG [148.122.66.52], 22/10/2000 19:06 GMT , Refers to Post #376

Perselicas:
Simply give the tirgger_secret a targetname that matches what you want to target it with. You might also want to set spawnflag 1, as that will keep anyone that enters the actual trigger (Yes you still set it up as usual) from making it go off.

Killjoy:
I heard from vondur that you place a func_wall under the weapon, and then kill it with some trigger with a "killtarget" field when the level loads or before you get to the place with the the func_wall in it.

I Don't Think That Was It

#379 Posted by Perselicas [141.222.155.39], 22/10/2000 22:27 GMT

If I give the trigger_secret a target, it works as a normal (walkover) secret and triggers the object.

If I set spawnflag 1, it just sits there and does nothing, ditto if I do both.

I'm trying to figure out how to get the secret to tally when a button is shot because the secret is similar to the dropping ceiling in e1m4 which, as far as I can tell, is getting triggered by the buttons that drop the ceiling and not by walking over anything. A trigger that targets the same target as the secret doesn't trigger the secret, at least not when I do it :) And Worldcraft isn't giving my secrets a "name" field. When I try to add it myself, Quake tells me that "'name' is not a field."

Sorry
~P-funk

#380 Posted by Asriel [203.96.152.184], 23/10/2000 00:43 GMT

im having trouble compiling maps: ie. i cant compile maps.

QBSP runs, gets down to writing a pointfile, then crashes. The weird thing is though, that it doesn't do this in QUARK (but it does in WC and the normal qbsp).

Anyone know how i can fix qbsp?
BTW, I dont think it is the maps fault, because i made a hollow square, with a default texture and a player start and it still did the same error.

#381 Posted by than [194.82.103.36], 23/10/2000 01:44 GMT

As CZG said, "targetname" is the field, not "name". If you don't want to set spawnflag 1 you can also place the trigger_secret in a brush where the player can't get to it (cept in noclip).

-than

Perselicas Is F00

#382 Posted by Perselicas [152.163.201.181], 23/10/2000 03:17 GMT , Refers to Post #381

I know CZG suggested targetname and not "name." I was only using name because I tried what I thought he was suggesting and it didn't work.

so far...

1) I created a trigger with the targetname "secret," created a button with the targetname "secret," ran the game and pressed the button, nothing happened.

2) Tried the same thing with spawnflag 1, nothing happened.

3) Created a trigger and button with the targetname "secret," created a door with the name "secret," ran the game and pressed the button. Nothing happened

4) Tried the same thing with spawnflag 1, nothing happened

Am I misunderstanding completely or is something really fucking weird happening here? :)

~plc

#383 Posted by Nightbringer [203.109.252.15], 23/10/2000 04:11 GMT , Refers to Post #382

Set the key "target" on the activator to the value of the key "targetname" on the thing you want to activate:
func_button "target" = "secret1"
trigger_secret "targetname" = "secret1"

Okay, I Did Exactly That...

#384 Posted by Perselicas [141.222.155.39], 23/10/2000 06:16 GMT , Refers to Post #382

And nothing happened. :( I made a test map using the directions if anyone's as curious or stumped as I am. The map contains a button, a door, and a trigger_secret. The target of both the button and the trigger and the name of the door are all the same. Noclipping through the trigger (above the switch) opens the door and tallies the secret. Shooting the button opens the door but does nothing to the trigger_secret like it's supposed to.

The URL is http://members.aol.com/suspenlute/notrig.map

This is extremely frustrating, I know it's possible. Argh...

~P

No You Didn't!

#385 Posted by GlassMan [195.184.253.80], 23/10/2000 12:55 GMT , Refers to Post #384

The trigger_secret should have "secretdoor" as its targetname, not its target.

DOH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

#386 Posted by Perselicas [141.222.155.39], 23/10/2000 13:26 GMT

Yeah that works. I really did completely misunderstand everything. ugh. sorry. Thankyou CZG, thankyou than, Thankyou Nightbringer, Thankyou GlassMan.

/me turns red and goes back to work

Q1/Q2 Model Usage ...

#387 Posted by FragMental [198.103.146.133], 25/10/2000 16:39 GMT

Does anyone know if Q2 models/textures can be converted and used in Q1? I've seen some Q2 textures used in Q1, but no models ...

Floating Weapons...

#388 Posted by Jaj [62.83.9.143], 25/10/2000 23:59 GMT , Refers to Post #377

This is another way to do it.
Ok, first of all you must create a func_door with the height you want the weapon (or another item)appear, this func_door must be touching the floor. You must give it these parameters:
Name:dest1 (for example)
Sounds: 0 (no sound)
Delay before close :stays open
Speed: 10000 (a brutal speed ;) )
Lip: -1 (very important!, lip must be a negative number, this makes disappear of view, the func_door totally)
Angle: Down.

Place the weapon, over the func_door.

In the Info_Player_start and all Info_Player_Deathmatch you must create
a brush rounding them with a height you want (1 is enough).
An alternative could be to create an enormous box around all the map.
(I prefer the first way).
Convert the brushes or THE BIG BRUSH to trigger_once and give it these
parameters:
Target:dest1

If you have more than one item floating in the map, its just the same method. Give them all (func_door) the same name (dest1) and of course all trigger_once (or the big trigger_once) the same target (dest1), it works!.
I've uploaded a little example map, if you want you can download it here.
There could be more refined methods to do this, but this one works perfectly. :)

#389 Posted by nanospawn [62.36.139.44], 26/10/2000 20:48 GMT

A question
Dunno who of you has played my last map, spwn3dm2d (in beta, and save it by right-cliking, it's geocities >:(, the map weighs 1,5 megs ).

Near the RG there is a glass on the floor (with some pipes in) covering a hole. That glass is non solid (I had to add some clip texture).

Why is non-solid? the window over the RG has the same texture and it's solid...

Why the hell don't work Fullclip of missile clip textures, it's cos they are filling exactly the same space of the glass brush?

I can't guess why, and I'm wondering... plz help

Floating Weapons A Bit "cleaner" Way

#390 Posted by Jaj [62.83.45.204], 26/10/2000 22:49 GMT , Refers to Post #388

Another option is:
Forget all the parameters i said you must give the func_door, only give it a name (dest1) in that parameter.
Then, in the trigger_once add a new parameter called killtarget and its value must be dest1, of course.
This method is more simple and you put func_plat instead func_door. I've only applied what CZG said in his response but it didn't work on a func_wall (or i did something wrong... don't know), but it works in func_door... .

This Should Be Simpler...

#391 Posted by Perselicas [141.222.155.39], 29/10/2000 15:01 GMT

Than a secret with a targetname, I hope (still sorry about that) :)
How do you create a nice particle field like the one in A3 by Pingu or in some Q1 servers with invulnerable respawns?(screenshot here) Yes I'm already working on another map using the rubicon texture set (I think) :)

Thanks!
~Pers

#392 Posted by GrindSpire [62.7.52.178], 29/10/2000 16:13 GMT , Refers to Post #391

You make a key called effect or effects for the entity you want to have the field around. You then give it a value. From memory only odd numbers work and different numbers give slightly different effects. And because of engine restraints, you can only have this once per level.

#393 Posted by Biff_Debris [205.188.198.37], 31/10/2000 00:18 GMT

I've got two trigger_teleports in my q3 map, one targeting a destination named "t1", the second targeting a "t2". The prob is that both teleports end up at "t1". WTF is up with that?

Rebuild 'em

#394 Posted by DeFrag [207.227.185.5], 31/10/2000 01:21 GMT , Refers to Post #393

#395 Posted by Biff_Debris [152.163.206.207], 31/10/2000 01:40 GMT , Refers to Post #394

I was figured someone would say that.

#396 Posted by Biff_Debris [152.163.206.207], 31/10/2000 01:41 GMT , Refers to Post #394

Sorry -- "I figured someone would say that". Jeez...

You Probably Don't Have To

#397 Posted by pjw [208.192.72.77], 31/10/2000 06:48 GMT

really "rebuild" 'em, try just deleting the key values w. the button on the entities dealie and then reconnecting them w. Ctrl-K.

#398 Posted by GrindSpire [194.164.208.102], 31/10/2000 07:57 GMT , Refers to Post #393

You haven't given t1 two different targetname values have you?

#399 Posted by Biff_Debris [205.188.198.28], 31/10/2000 10:10 GMT , Refers to Post #398

As I mentioned above, "t1", being a destination, is a targetname. And no, the other destination is named "t2". I'll just try rebuilding them, and hope for the best(?).

#400 Posted by Biff_Debris [205.188.198.28], 31/10/2000 10:11 GMT , Refers to Post #397

That sounds a lot better, man.

Had To Rebuild 'em

#401 Posted by Biff_Debris [205.188.198.176], 01/11/2000 01:51 GMT , Refers to Post #394

And they work, by cracky! All I've got to do is place some goodies, compile for an aas, do some test runs with bots, and mebbe I'll be ready for a beta. Right?

Play Testers Needed

#402 Posted by Paul "palldjon" Bros [203.29.11.38], 01/11/2000 02:27 GMT

I've got a new Q1 SP level on the boil (my first) and would like it tested and picked apart. I'm pretty happy with the layout, theme and architecture but I'm not a real player's player, so some help with item and monster placement over skill variations would be greatly appreciated. Any seasoned mappers/players want a crack?

Of Course! :)

#403 Posted by Perselicas [141.222.155.39], 01/11/2000 03:20 GMT , Refers to Post #402

Always good to see new maps. I'm not the best judge out there of Q1 gameplay and difficulty, but I'd be glad to beta test the map, especially for visual stuff and stupid ass crushing wall bugs ;)

~Pers

#404 Posted by Gert [62.4.174.205], 02/11/2000 17:13 GMT

I want to use glas in Q3radiant for a brush.
How do i have to do it. Which texture?

#405 Posted by Johnny [209.122.228.130], 03/11/2000 00:50 GMT , Refers to Post #404

The texture is base_wall/glass01. You must texture only 1 face of the brush with this texture. The other sides of the brush should be textured with common/nodraw.

Portal Camera Roll - Help!

#406 Posted by G A Z E B O [24.114.57.190], 03/11/2000 14:43 GMT

Anyone know how I can stop/cancel/kill the rolling of the portal camera? I have messed as much as I can with the properties of the camera entity, and tried to compensate/futz with a portal_surface shader, and so far have had no success... I just want a portal that looks onto a place without the silly sea-sickness effect ;-)

love + rockets,
G A Z E B O

Simple Glass Shader

#407 Posted by G A Z E B O [24.114.57.190], 03/11/2000 14:58 GMT , Refers to Post #404

Glass shaders can also be created by using a .tga file with an alpha channel.

A simple shader might look like this:

snip -->

textures/yourMap/yourWindow
{

cull twosided
qer_editorimage textures/yourMap/yourTex.tga

surfaceparm trans
surfaceparm nomarks
surfaceparm nonsolid
surfaceparm nolightmap

{
map textures/yourMap/yourTex.tga
blendFunc add
}

}

<-- snip

The alpha channel controls the transparency. I can post some URLs if all this sounds a bit greek to you ;-)

The nice thing about this shader is that it's two-sided, and it also doesn't have the added processing overhead of environment effects.

love + rockets,
G A Z E B O

#408 Posted by Maj [194.83.240.35], 03/11/2000 16:53 GMT , Refers to Post #406

There is no way of stopping the portal roll without a mod, unless it's been changed for 1.25.

Oh, and blendfunc add means that the alpha channel is (effectively) ignored.

#409 Posted by G A Z E B O [24.114.57.190], 03/11/2000 21:31 GMT , Refers to Post #408

Thanks Maj...

Too bad about that roll thing... I had a nice 5-dimensional room happening, but the roll ruins the effect...

And glad you caught the oops on the portal shader. I think I have too many hacked up scripts lying around ;-)

#410 Posted by Asriel [203.96.152.184], 03/11/2000 22:14 GMT

When a map (Q1) ends, by fraglimit or time end, how do you make the players view goto a certain place
eg. on p3a when the map ends it goes to a view of the whole map.

how do i do this in my map?

Info_intermission

#411 Posted by Fat Controller [203.96.111.201], 03/11/2000 22:23 GMT , Refers to Post #410

place this point entity where you reckon a good view resides, then give it a "mangle" field to set the viewing angles. The default value "0 0 0" has the intermission facing due east.

Mangles are evil. I can never remember which way around the axes the damn things rotate

Mangles As They Work For Me: (usually)

#412 Posted by Perselicas [141.222.155.39], 03/11/2000 23:15 GMT , Refers to Post #411

-the order of the values is pitch, yaw, roll
-they all need to be three digits (no negative values)
-I think pitch was mysteriously working in reverse the last time I had to place an intermission :)

~P

#413 Posted by Asriel [203.96.152.184], 04/11/2000 04:36 GMT , Refers to Post #411

thanks very much Fat Controller

Arches (q1)

#414 Posted by Asriel [203.96.152.184], 04/11/2000 06:41 GMT

How do you all make arches for q1?
Vertex manip, carving/CSG subtraction, skewing?

Or could someone point me in the direction of some arch prefabs, for ideas of course

#415 Posted by BARiUM [62.20.133.10], 04/11/2000 14:38 GMT

in q1 is preferably done with vertex manip...
and with the following info from SPoG...

12 sided 0:1 1:2 2:1 1:0
24 sided 0:2 1:4 2:4 3:3 4:2 4:1 2:0

Those are the ratios of the angles of the sides of
one-quarter of a 24-sided cylinder.

First side is vertical in the xy view - ration 0:2.
The next side slopes in at 1/4, then another side
slopes in at 1/2, etc.

#416 Posted by Asriel [203.96.152.184], 04/11/2000 21:40 GMT , Refers to Post #415

Thanks, BARIUM,

#417 Posted by Speedy [213.221.51.42], 05/11/2000 04:37 GMT , Refers to Post #415

why 12, not 16 sided?

#418 Posted by BARiUM [213.64.109.147], 05/11/2000 13:10 GMT , Refers to Post #417

i realy don't know.. thou shalt not question SPoG, for he is the allmighty!

For Ease Of Use

#419 Posted by kanaeda [207.208.188.91], 05/11/2000 19:20 GMT , Refers to Post #417

it's harder to scale 16 sided cylinders and keep them on a clean grid. it also reduces the number of polys in the scene, and helps to simplify the vis table in that area. :)

What Are Clipnodes?

#420 Posted by Gilt [154.5.31.53], 05/11/2000 20:41 GMT

12-sided Cylinders..

#421 Posted by Fingers [216.201.152.165], 06/11/2000 19:48 GMT

Another nice-looking ratio:
1:4 3:3 4:1

Useful for a 12-sider that has points in the cardinal directions as opposed to "flat" sides, top and bottom... This way the transition to the sides of an archway also occurs perfectly level with the center of the arch... :)

(To make it 24-sided, you simply cut each side in half and move the new edge outwards a bit)

#422 Posted by Fat Controller [203.96.111.200], 07/11/2000 00:48 GMT , Refers to Post #421

Have you seen those shots of that map I did in yer Q3 IKbase tex yet?

http://www.planetquake.com/fatty/rcctf1.jpg
http://www.planetquake.com/fatty/rcctf1a.jpg
http://www.planetquake.com/fatty/rcctf1b.jpg

Lemme know what you think. I'm still having trouble with fullbrights here and there, but I'm trying to fix 'em.

Interesting...

#423 Posted by Fingers [216.201.152.165], 07/11/2000 01:53 GMT , Refers to Post #422

Doesn't look too bad at all... Nice and crisp... I'll definitely check out the map whenever you release it :)

I'd put a border on the side of those stairs though, and a slab on the bottom... No floaty cubes ;p

Oh.. If you need a better rock texture, try working with this one...
http://www.planetquake.com/ikq/stuff/cliffy.jpg

#424 Posted by Palldjon [203.29.11.38], 08/11/2000 05:51 GMT

Vigil, LTH, scraggy, grindspire and than have agreed to beta test c4m1 "Material Demands" so I don't need any more help at this stage. All going well, I'll post the finished level in a couple of weeks. QMAP is superb!

Fullbrights.

#425 Posted by killazontherun [203.164.3.167], 10/11/2000 08:25 GMT

ok, don't laugh at me but how do you get rid of fullbrights in q1?

I've tried texmex to get rid of them but that just adds more.

How I Do It....

#426 Posted by Tron [203.29.136.138], 10/11/2000 09:02 GMT

Basically I just made a new pallete where all teh fullbright colours were black. I first convert textures to the full quake pallate, then load the new pallate which doesn't have any fullbrights in it.

Tron

I'm To Brain Dead For A Title.

#427 Posted by killazontherun [203.164.3.167], 10/11/2000 11:12 GMT

Thanks tron, but I just redid the textures so they didn't have fullbrights in them. :)

#428 Posted by GlassMan [195.184.253.80], 10/11/2000 13:08 GMT , Refers to Post #425

Texmex also has an option to import without using full brites in the colour conversion.
View->Preferences->Workspace.

Q3 Mod Team Seeking Level Designers!

#429 Posted by Jezebel [64.217.234.100], 10/11/2000 22:59 GMT

Any person out there who's interested in creating levels for a laid back Q3 mod team please let me know. Interest in map editing, motivation and the ability to work well with a team is really all we ask. We're comfortable with working around schedules, although we do ask that members attend our weekly Sunday development meetings. However for someone that's devoted, we are more than willing to make exceptions. :)

I would appreciate it if whoever is interested would post some of their artwork for me to look at as well.

Hmm.. what else... well, we're called Artemis Software and the mod is based around a Greek/Atlantis theme. We were originally founded by a group of young ladies but have just recently added a guy to the team. Our current level designers keep running into problems with their personal lives so they are having a hard time keeping up with development. Someone help us out here! ;)

Thanks!
Beth

Click here for more...

Mapping And Running

#430 Posted by Perselicas [141.222.155.39], 11/11/2000 05:51 GMT

I guess this is an aesthetical question... or something. Should a mapper even bother thinking about speedrunning potential while making a map? And if so, is it better to make a running-friendly or running-hostile map?

~P

Who Needs A Title Anyway

#431 Posted by DeFrag [207.227.184.97], 11/11/2000 06:54 GMT

I have a jumppad that I used in Crippled Ice-Cubes. I turned the middle of it alpha so that I could place a round-fan texture underneath. Well... since the fan .tga also has an alpha-chan, I get HOM when I look through MY jumppad. I have a vis-block under both of 'em.. eh?

#432 Posted by Johnny [209.122.226.208], 11/11/2000 07:23 GMT , Refers to Post #431

Make the brush that bears the jumppad texture a detail brush. Then the brush underneath will be rendered, and no more HOM. Be sure to make the unseen faces on that detail brush common/nodraw.

#433 Posted by Nightbringer [203.167.247.214], 11/11/2000 07:58 GMT , Refers to Post #431

Ensure both shaders have surfaceparm trans. If they do, try making both the fan and the jump pad detail. I'm not too sure if/why this works...

#434 Posted by Nightbringer [203.167.247.214], 11/11/2000 07:59 GMT , Refers to Post #432

...Beat me to it

Reached Occupant At...

#435 Posted by RectalPaingGenerator [165.247.131.153], 11/11/2000 23:05 GMT

!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
reached occupant at: (-184,-328, 328)
no filling performed
leak file written to bsdsas1a.pts
!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I receive this lovely error on my map. The entity at this location (a light) is clearly not inside a brush, or outside of the playing area. Deleting this brush merely make WQBSP point at another light/entity.

I recently got this lovely error:

Warning: CutNodePortals_r:newportal was clipped away

but it disappeared seemingly after I moved some vertices.

Anybody know what's going on?

Please?

Sounds Like A Leak...

#436 Posted by Fingers [216.201.152.165], 12/11/2000 02:26 GMT , Refers to Post #435

Run Quake with -particles 99999, Load the pointfile and follow the line of dots... That'll get you to the leak. (Or just look for a small gap between brushes)

Hmm, No Title

#437 Posted by Perselicas [141.222.155.39], 12/11/2000 04:35 GMT , Refers to Post #435

The entity at this location (a light) is clearly not inside a brush, or outside of the playing area. Deleting this brush merely make WQBSP point at another light/entity.

That's because a leak in your map brings the outside into the inside and it's only giving you the location of the first entity the greyvoid hits when it enters the leak (yay visuals) Did you try typing pointfile in the console and walking to the entity?

Speedy Thought A Title Wasn't Needed

#438 Posted by Speedy [213.221.51.24], 12/11/2000 05:50 GMT , Refers to Post #435

Most of the editors have built-in leak tracing, that`s more handy, than ingame one.
What prog do you use?

In Editor Leak Tracing..

#439 Posted by Tron [203.29.136.134], 12/11/2000 08:53 GMT

if he uses worldcraft he's screwed. The pointfil information is useless in that...

Tron

Vertex Manipulation

#440 Posted by Kell [194.105.160.225], 12/11/2000 17:07 GMT

I've had the'cutnode' nonsense before.
It often means that two vertices on a brush have been placed on the same point, or you've used vertex manip to turn a brush inside out, which is considered an illegal 'concave' object by Quake.
Sometimes, all that happens is the offending brush fails to appear in the game.

In general, if you're using vertex manip, consider the shape you want to creat first, then alter only one brush at a time between compiling so if an error occurs, you know what action caused it.

This is the closest I ever get to tech support.

#441 Posted by Vigil [212.38.226.7], 12/11/2000 17:24 GMT , Refers to Post #440

I got that error when I built 2 completely separate areas and the other had a leak.

#442 Posted by RectalPainGenerator [165.247.148.210], 12/11/2000 18:31 GMT

/me looks at that message and makes a mental note not to b0rk up the message this time

Okay, the pointfile is 0 bytes, so it does me no good in the game or in the editor (I'm using BSP and Q3Radiant, BTW. BSP for checking the pointfile and other stuff I can't do in Q3R, and Q3R for all the brush creation and texturing).

I have been doing a lot of vertex manipulation, but only on 4 sided brushes (think something like pyramids) so it's pretty much impossible to have a concave brush, and Q3R won't let you have 2 verts at the same location. I'm not saying it's impossible for there to be a bad brush in this map, just that I don't know which of the 450 brushes to look at (and I edited about 50-100 of those last time I made changes).

Any other information?

Tks Johnny & NightB..

#443 Posted by DeFrag [207.227.185.110], 12/11/2000 19:40 GMT

I'll try those out. :)

#444 Posted by Gilt [154.5.70.231], 12/11/2000 20:57 GMT , Refers to Post #442

I have this same problem in one of my maps I'm working on. Are you mapping for Q3? I only really know about Q1, but it should be similar enough.

It's most likely not so much the brushes problem, as much as how it's positioned along with other brushes. Once you do find it, you'll probably have to rearrange some of the brushes slightly, in the area around the brush.

An interesting thing about this error is that you'll be able see the brush but you can also go through it too, just like a func_illusion, thus the leak and absense of point file because the compiler still thinks that the brush is there. This leads me to theory that it has something to do with screwed up clipnodes... not that that will help you much.

So if you have an area that you suspect might be the culprit, you could use the gl, or whatever the equivlent is in q3, and just launch them around. If any disappear through a brush then you've found it. It might take a while but I'm still looking for a faster way of finding them...

4 sided brushes
If your using them for only one face, as in organic type architecture, I find they can get a bit messy. I prefer just to use wedges :-)

RE: Vertex Manipulation

#445 Posted by Gilt [154.5.70.231], 12/11/2000 21:02 GMT , Refers to Post #440

In general, if you're using vertex manip, consider the shape you want to creat first, then alter only one brush at a time between compiling so if an error occurs, you know what action caused it.

Editing one brush at a time can be a lot of work. If your using wc (I'm not sure if it'll work with other editors), when you have a brush that you've been working on with vertex manip, and you think there could be an error in it, try cliping the brush, but don't actually clip the brush.

To clarify, with the cliping tool, select the brush and then clip right beside the brush but not the brush itself. Also, you might try swinging the clip plane through the brush before cliping, because sometimes it might not work otherwise.

Anyway, this will make the brush valid by changing it's shape, or making it disappear, depending on the severity of it's error.

Leak With No Pointfile

#446 Posted by Speedy [213.221.48.31], 13/11/2000 01:07 GMT , Refers to Post #442

I`v had that when messed around with very complex geometry, thats not grid aligned. Like those holow spheres you can build with bsp, or rotating holow rounded pipes non-90 degree. And it gives that shit menyioned above - brush is there, but you can go through it.

And btw, WC doesn`t save concave brushes to map. If you make one, save to .map and load - you`ll see a regular shape instead of what you`d done.

#447 Posted by RectalPainGenerator [165.247.135.46], 13/11/2000 21:43 GMT

I've been around the level, and I don't seem to fall out of any floors/walls/ceilings.

To clear up a few things:

* I'm using BSP and Q3R to make the map.

* This is for Quake1

* I'm not using WC

If nobody comes up with a solution soon, I guess I'll pretty much start over.

RPG

#448 Posted by Mike Woodham [193.113.185.132], 13/11/2000 22:48 GMT , Refers to Post #447

Don't start over. Sometimes these two things are part of the same error. Check for poorly fitting and densly packed brushes, especially small, pointed ones e.g spheres.

If you really are going to start over, send me the map first and I'll see if I can help: I have some experience with Bsp.

REgards

Mike Woodham

About Leaks....

#449 Posted by Jaj [62.175.124.168], 14/11/2000 01:46 GMT

Sometimes, all brushes seem to be perfect when looking for a leak, when this happens, i use to load the .map, and hehe...yes, then i find some horrible, deformed brush(es) that causes it all. Once you know the guilty or guilties then you can correct them by vertex manipulation or just erase them and create a new brush(es) but slighty different :) .

Thanks Doods

#450 Posted by RectalPainGenerator [165.247.136.249], 15/11/2000 18:09 GMT

I appreciate all the tips and such(especially the offer from Mike Woodham), but none of this has solved my problem. :-/ I think I'll copy all the brushes that I know aren't causing any problems to a new map (200 of the 450 brushes), and start over with that.

Thanks again for the help.

No Vising Performed

#451 Posted by CtM [195.252.52.12], 16/11/2000 20:15 GMT

LoadPortals: couldn't read c:mapsctm04ctm04.prt
No vising performed.
What's wrong?
There is no leak and qbsp didn't give me an error message.

See If There's A Pointfile

#452 Posted by Fat Controller [203.96.111.200], 17/11/2000 03:52 GMT , Refers to Post #451

go to wherever the map is through the DOS prompt and type

dir mapsctm04ctm04.*

if indeed that is your map's name. Otherwise I'll assume you forgot to include the backslash(/)es, so try

dir ?/maps/ctm04/ctm04.*

Where ? is where Quake/ID1 is.

#453 Posted by Vrajgh [212.159.1.3], 18/11/2000 17:47 GMT

hehe A backslash goes the other way () what you've given are slashes!!! never mind lol

#454 Posted by Vrajgh [212.159.1.3], 18/11/2000 17:49 GMT , Refers to Post #453

It seems this board doesn't draw backslashes anyway... sorry \\

#455 Posted by Vrajgh [212.159.1.3], 18/11/2000 17:51 GMT , Refers to Post #454

so it draws them sometimes but I bet not on their own... oh who cares I give up

No Vising Performed

#456 Posted by Jaj [62.83.16.149], 19/11/2000 00:50 GMT , Refers to Post #451

There is another possibility. If there is a 2d brush in the map (it could be created by using carve or a vertex manipulation, i think). If so, qbsp doesn't give any error but it gives a "warning:brush with duplicate plane" message.
I don't know if a brush with a duplicate plane is exactly a 2d brush or any brush with a thickness under 1 unit.
If you get that warning, well you know, try to look for that brush or brushes an erase them. :)

Brush With Duplicate Plane.

#457 Posted by CZG [148.122.66.52], 19/11/2000 01:00 GMT , Refers to Post #456

I think that means that somewhere on the level, there are two brushes that have two identical faces.

Yes..... :)

#458 Posted by Jaj [62.83.16.149], 19/11/2000 02:41 GMT , Refers to Post #457

Definitively i think so, now. I just remembered i've had brushes with a thickness under 1 unit but not 0, and no "warning:brushes with duplicate plane" appeared and the map was compiled completely.

Duplicate Planes

#459 Posted by Fingers [64.123.34.177], 19/11/2000 04:09 GMT

Means that a brush has two faces that are on the same plane. This is generally impossible to see in the editor or the game... The most common cause of this error is dragging vertices/edges in a position that causes the editor to "correct" the brush to keep it convex... E.g. Drag a square brush into a triangle shape, and it'll seem to only have three sides after that, like a "true" triangular brush... But one of the sides will be a duplicate and it'll cause trouble.

#460 Posted by Asriel [203.96.152.184], 21/11/2000 06:14 GMT

I want a button to make two sides of a bridge move out to meet each other. How do i do this?

ie. When a button is pressed two brushes from opposite sides of a 'valley' (i couldnt think of another word) come together and stop, forming a bridge.

#461 Posted by Johnny [209.122.226.132], 21/11/2000 07:08 GMT , Refers to Post #460

How bout specifying which game you want to do that for? That might solicit more helpful responses.

#462 Posted by Fat Controller [203.96.111.200], 21/11/2000 08:54 GMT , Refers to Post #460

Set your button to target two func_door entities.

The doors should have angles that "aim away from" each other. Set the spawnflags for Toggle and Start Open: This'll light the doors in the "closed" position, but they will spawn in the "open" one.

Sounds confusing but... yeah. Result will be a bridge that opens and closes as desired.

Vising Problem

#463 Posted by Tron_school [203.38.138.22], 21/11/2000 22:20 GMT

Okay, I've got a problem with vising this map. It compiles and lights okay, but when I try to vis it it chugs along for about half an hour (it's a big map) before crashing with an error message with something about "sawing into a a leaf" or something like that. I'm at school now so can't remember the exact error message but does anyone know what the problem might be?

Tron

#464 Posted by Asriel [203.96.152.184], 21/11/2000 23:04 GMT

Thanks Fat Controller, I think i had the angles going the wrong way.

q1 - sorry Johnny, I always forget to do that :P

Sounds Like...

#465 Posted by kanaeda [207.208.137.86], 22/11/2000 00:05 GMT , Refers to Post #463

Warning: Leaf portal saw into leaf.

this tutorial here at gamedesign.net should explain what it means and what to do about it.

yes, i realise this is a tutorial for quake 2 compiling errors, but the VIS process is basically the same for the 2 different games. :)

Thanks Kanaeda...

#466 Posted by Tron [203.29.136.248], 24/11/2000 08:18 GMT , Refers to Post #465

I'm checking out that tutorial now, thanks a lot for the link.

Tron

#467 Posted by Asriel [203.96.152.184], 25/11/2000 01:09 GMT

I have a line error, . I haev tried deleteing the brush from a text editor , RPG kindly fixed it in q3r, but then the map didn't load in WC and the brush couldnt be found in q3r (im guessing there is a search function in q3r somewhere).

What can i do, this is so annoying as i am so close to completion.

quake 1 by the way.

Editing Maps Manually...

#468 Posted by Tron [202.7.186.34], 25/11/2000 01:30 GMT

For some reason worldcraft doesn't like it whenever I try to alter maps in a text editor, I'm not sure of the exact reason though. Any techinal programming type people know the reason because I'm interested to know as well.

Tron

Quiver Questions

#469 Posted by high on life [204.210.176.80], 25/11/2000 03:46 GMT

hey, im using quiver (mac q1 editor) and i have some questions. one, i want some monsters to appear once an item is picked up, and i'm not sure what i should do to the item to get that to happen. the other is, once those monsters are killed, i want some more monsters to appear. i dont think i'd have to set targets from each necessarilly killed baddie to the new ones, cause that would be craziness. and then finally, once all the monsters in the level are dead, i want the door to my exit to open.

sorry about the mad ammounts of questions, i want to enter that 100 brush contest, but i usually dont work with monsters in that way. i dont even know how to get it so a key is needed to open a door in quiver :| the read me's that come with it arent really in-depth on the entities, so any and all help would be greatly appreciated :]

`high on life

#470 Posted by Asriel [203.96.152.184], 25/11/2000 06:51 GMT , Refers to Post #469

I think www.planetquake.com/qref will help you, its not for quiver, but it does cover some of the things you want to do.

#471 Posted by biglurch [63.42.204.211], 25/11/2000 21:14 GMT

HOWDY ALL
I've recently started making A q2 map using the sharware version 2.50 of winqoole. A couple of probs, limited to 300 brushes and only two weeks to work with :{
I've gone to many web sites trying to find a place to purchase winqoole and there either dead sites or no info on this product. Any ideas where to find it or info on another good editor {cheap :} would be appreciated.
thanx lurch

Biglurch - Editors.

#472 Posted by killazontherun [203.164.3.167], 25/11/2000 22:00 GMT , Refers to Post #471

Don't buy qoole even if you do find it, it isn't worth the money because of its many little bugs.

My suggestion is www.qeradiant.com (make sure you get the q2 one not the q3 one).
Its a lot better editor, at first it may be hard but its alot faster to use then qoole.
Best of all its free.

#473 Posted by Asriel [203.96.152.184], 27/11/2000 02:15 GMT

pop.gamedesign.net is where you can get a free QOOLE methinks, but i'd get qeradiant if i were you, its harder , but much much better.

Or you could just go for worldcraft : www.planetquake.com/worldcraft

#474 Posted by biglurch [63.42.204.145], 27/11/2000 19:19 GMT

Well in my search for the full version of qoole, I came across a free editor called tread3d. It's took a few days to get used to the different functions. But it seems to work well. It also has A few options that help in the building process.
thanx for all the info
lurch

What Doors?

#475 Posted by palldjon [203.29.11.180], 28/11/2000 00:16 GMT

So, I'm modifying my first ever Q1 map in light of the beta test feedback from Scragbait and The Lieutenant (thanx a whole heap, you are champions). In the process I noticed something unusual.

I'm using Worldcraft shareware version.

1. When I "Check for problems" from the map menu, amongst all the messages telling me that path_corner has unused values (which I ignore, cause I've given it a "wait" of -1 on purpose) I find 5 messages indicating that "func_door has no solid associated with it". When I "go to error", I find all five errors located at 0,0,0 point. However, I don't have a cursor but a crosshair (as if I'm working "inside" a selected object). When the crosshair is placed over the 0,0,0 point it turns red?? and only then can I delete the problem. The number of func_door errors equals the number of test builds. Can I expect to generate one of these errors each time I build?

Texture Request?!?!

#476 Posted by Kayin [216.127.1.63], 29/11/2000 03:59 GMT

i came across the need for a custom texture for my new map in quake 1... but lack the ability to do so. (not knowledge, but skill wot)

it's all about the billboards, baby. i hate them. q3, rocket arena 3, q3f, everyone seems to love billboards. jesus christ quake isn't an advertising revenue, it's a game. so i'm going to make fun of them a bit. =P

gen_o_com3 from the reincarnation series has the perfect look i'm going for, but i need to replace the words. right now it says "watch out for the neocron" or whatnot... anyone be able to edit the text or make me something along those lines in style? i want to make it say "buy panda drinks" and a cute, cuddly wanna kill you panda sitting beside a soda pop can if possible

if you can do this, (hell i might even pay a few $) plz email at kayin@infinet.com

for proof i have a map underway that warrants having to drudge out a tex for, here is a pic of my last build:

http://my.ohio.voyager.net/~keichena/q1/ugf/ugf-sm-01.jpg

here is a shot of that tex i was talking about

http://my.ohio.voyager.net/~keichena/hihi.jpg

#477 Posted by Kayin [216.127.1.110], 04/12/2000 05:20 GMT

anyone able to help me on this gets extra cookies for christmas...

just laid the final architechure for my new dm map and got this bullshit:

--- LoadMapFile ---
C:Mapsugf007.map
646 brushes
126 entities
45 miptex
840 texinfo
building hulls sequentially...
--- Brush_LoadEntity ---
627 brushes read
---- CSGFaces ----
4375 brushfaces
10596 csgfaces
1836 mergedfaces
----- SolidBSP -----
2782 split nodes
1295 solid leafs
1488 empty leafs
0 water leafs
5388 leaffaces
5010 nodefaces
----- portalize ----
WARNING: CutNodePortals_r:new portal was clipped away
----- FillOutside ----
1290 outleafs
----- SolidBSP -----
1310 split nodes
707 solid leafs
604 empty leafs
0 water leafs
3523 leaffaces
3173 nodefaces
MODEL: *1
MODEL: *2
MODEL: *3
--- FinishBSPFile ---
WriteBSPFile: C:GamesQuakeId1mapsugf007.bsp
added 0 texture frames
1094 planes 21880
5829 vertexes 69948
2972 nodes 71328
840 texinfo 33600
5832 faces 116640
2500 clipnodes 20000
1940 leafs 54320
6372 marksurfaces 12744
23175 surfedges 46350
15055 edges 60220
45 textures 609564
lightdata 0
visdata 0
entdata 9074
11.0 seconds elapsed

qbsp generates no .prt file, thus i cannot vis.

wtf? anyone able to help?

Check For A .PTS File

#478 Posted by Fat Controller [203.96.111.202], 04/12/2000 08:13 GMT , Refers to Post #477

I've had QBSP fail to alert me to the presence of leaks while quietly writing pointfiles.

The only thing to do is load 'er up and play hunt the leak.

#479 Posted by Kayin [216.127.0.167], 04/12/2000 09:07 GMT , Refers to Post #478

lo and behold, i had a tunnel archway i sheared off and lowered, but forgot to move the lights down along with it... so they were moping around in the void without telling anyone. yup, a pointfile hunt revealed the culprit.

well, on teh bright side... i snagged a newer version of qbsp (screw that watered down wc copy) and scripted a batch file (something my lazy arse should have done years ago)

also had a wierd anomality of one of my skybrushes doing the void cha-cha, and changing it from a slanted brush to a solid brush with a slice out of it fixed it...

anyways, back to wc. *yawn* good morning, everyone. i have to go to school in 3 hours... YIPEE

#480 Posted by ELEK [199.179.175.141], 05/12/2000 05:37 GMT

Been using Rvis+ for a bit recently, but I am encountering strange results with the status indicator. It just quits after some time and seems to compile the map fine. But the status indicator looks like it never finished. I run the map and all looks like vis has been run on it. here is a copy of the log from the process window
** Executing...
** Command: Copy File
** Parameters: "c:quakemapsoandu.map" "C:Quakeid1mapsoandu.map"

** Executing...
** Command: C:Program FilesWorldcraftQbsp.exe
** Parameters: C:Quakeid1mapsOANDU

Transparent water QBSP with Hipnotic extensions
MultiWAD version 1.65
by Ken Alverson based on original code by John Carmack

outputfile: C:Quakeid1mapsOANDU.bsp
--- LoadMapFile ---
C:Quakeid1mapsOANDU.map
2444 brushes
310 entities
25 miptex
2357 texinfo
building hulls sequentially...
--- Brush_LoadEntity ---
2408 brushes read
---- CSGFaces ----
18649 brushfaces
58476 csgfaces
4293 mergedfaces
----- SolidBSP -----
4511 split nodes
2439 solid leafs
2073 empty leafs
0 water leafs
8791 leaffaces
8140 nodefaces
----- portalize ----
----- FillOutside ----
2316 outleafs
----- SolidBSP -----
1957 split nodes
1308 solid leafs
650 empty leafs
0 water leafs
5428 leaffaces
4590 nodefaces
---- MergeAll ----
4340 mergefaces
writing C:Quakeid1mapsOANDU.prt
MODEL: *1
MODEL: *2
MODEL: *3
MODEL: *4
MODEL: *5
MODEL: *6
MODEL: *7
MODEL: *8
MODEL: *9
MODEL: *10
MODEL: *11
MODEL: *12
MODEL: *13
MODEL: *14
MODEL: *15
MODEL: *16
MODEL: *17

MODEL: *18
MODEL: *19
MODEL: *20
MODEL: *21
MODEL: *22
MODEL: *23
MODEL: *24
MODEL: *25
MODEL: *26
MODEL: *27
MODEL: *28
MODEL: *29
MODEL: *30
MODEL: *31
MODEL: *32
MODEL: *33
MODEL: *34
--- FinishBSPFile ---
WriteBSPFile: C:Quakeid1mapsOANDU.bsp
added 0 texture frames
2666 planes 53320
7315 vertexes 87780
2773 nodes 66552
2357 texinfo 94280
5821 faces 116420
4095 clipnodes 32760
1202 leafs 33656
7153 marksurfaces 14306
25766 surfedges 51532
13154 edges 52616
25 textures 279904
lightdata 0
visdata 0
entdata 24138
216.0 seconds elapsed

** Executing...
** Command: C:Program FilesWorldcrafttyrlite.exe
** Parameters: -nocount -extra C:Quakeid1mapsOANDU

----- TyrLite v0.7beta -----
extra sampling enabled
BSP is version 29
310 entities read, 201 are lights.

Lighting Completed.

lightdatasize: 315337
0 switchable light styles
Writing BSP version 29
1306.0 seconds elapsed

** Executing...
** Command: C:Program FilesWorldcraftrvisVis.exe
** Parameters: -level 4 C:Quakeid1mapsOANDU

---- rvis+ ----
testlevel = 4
997 portalleafs
2658 numportals
Calculating Base Vis:
1 of 5316: 0
2 of 5316: 0
3 of 5316: 0
4 of 5316: 0
5 of 5316: 0
6 of 5316: 0
7 of 5316: 0
8 of 5316: 0
9 of 5316: 0
10 of 5316: 0
11 of 5316: 0
12 of 5316: 0
13 of 5316: 0
14 of 5316: 0
15 of 5316: 0
16 of 5316: 0
17 of 5316: 0
18 of 5316: 0
19 of 5316: 0
20 of 5316: 0
21 of 5316: 0
22 of 5316: 0
23 of 5316: 0
24 of 5316: 0
25 of 5316: 0
26 of 5316: 0
27 of 5316: 0
28 of 5316: 0
29 of 5316: 0
30 of 5316: 0
31 of 5316: 0
32 of 5316: 0
33 of 5316: 0
34 of 5316: 0
35 of 5316: 0
36 of 5316: 0
37 of 5316: 0
38 of 5316: 0
39 of 5316: 0
40 of 5316: 0
41 of 5316: 0
42 of 5316: 0
43 of 5316: 0
44 of 5316: 0
45 of 5316: 0
46 of 5316: 0
47 of 5316: 0
48 of 5316: 0
49 of 5316: 0
50 of 5316: 0
51 of 5316: 0
52 of 5316: 0
53 of 5316: 0
54 of 5316: 1
55 of 5316: 1
56 of 5316: 1
57 of 5316: 1
58 of 5316: 1
59 of 5316: 1
60 of 5316: 1
61 of 5316: 1
62 of 5316: 1
63 of 5316: 1
64 of 5316: 1
65 of 5316: 1
66 of 5316: 1
67 of 5316: 1
68 of 5316: 1
69 of 5316: 1
70 of 5316: 1
71 of 5316: 1
72 of 5316: 1
73 of 5316: 1
74 of 5316: 1
75 of 5316: 1
76 of 5316: 1
77 of 5316: 1
78 of 5316: 1
79 of 5316: 1
80 of 5316: 1
81 of 5316: 1
82 of 5316: 1
83 of 5316: 1
84 of 5316: 1
85 of 5316: 1
86 of 5316: 1
87 of 5316: 1
88 of 5316: 1
89 of 5316: 1
90 of 5316: 1
91 of 5316: 1
92 of 5316: 1
93 of 5316: 1
94 of 5316: 1
95 of 5316: 1
96 of 5316: 1
97 of 5316: 1
98 of 5316: 1
99 of 5316: 1
100 of 5316: 1
101 of 5316: 1
102 of 5316: 1
103 of 5316: 1
104 of 5316: 1
105 of 5316: 1
106 of 5316: 1
107 of 5316: 2
108 of 5316: 2
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as you can see it just cuts off. Sorry it is so long! :P

I Am An Ass!

#481 Posted by ELEK [199.179.175.141], 05/12/2000 05:38 GMT

Sorry I should have just posted the end of the log...kill me later.

#482 Posted by DeFrag [207.227.185.35], 05/12/2000 06:53 GMT

GOTS to be the longest post in the real-world.

Wooooaaaahhhh

#483 Posted by Fern [141.222.155.39], 05/12/2000 07:03 GMT

I got dizzy just holding down the scrollbar on that one.

#484 Posted by Fat Controller [203.96.111.202], 05/12/2000 09:30 GMT , Refers to Post #480

I think there's a limit to the number of characters the process window in Worldcraft can display - once that limit's reached, that's it.

When working in shareware WC I tend to run vis from the DOS prompt. Especially full vis.

Thanks Fats

#485 Posted by ELEK [199.179.177.107], 05/12/2000 15:38 GMT

I don't have much problem running in process window. I guess if I really need to see the readout I should find another means. Will I see the status gauge when running vis in dosprmpt?

Texture Screw-ups

#486 Posted by Iain [208.181.205.10], 06/12/2000 06:12 GMT

. What's the deal with aligning textures in worldcraft? There SOMETIMES seems to be a huge difference in texture placement between editor and in-game veiws (i.e. beveled brushes or on a cylinder). Occasionally the textures are so distorted (rotated, mirrored or misaligned) it's like the editor just gave up trying and said F**K YOU. I understand the mirrored NORTH/SOUTH issues and the extra care needed with rotating brushes.

This problem seems to get worse with each newer version of WC. I thought it might be VIS or the Nehahra.exe but...

Currently using:
WQbsp (already tried TreeQbsp)
Rvis+
Tyrlight
was using registered WCv1.3
now using shareware WCv1.6
& Nehahra to run

Does registered WCv1.6b reduce this problem? If so, I think I'd have better luck finding buried treasure under my house, than findind a copy.

Do I simply have to stop crying

, and get on with it?

Iain

It's A WC Thing

#487 Posted by Fat Controller [203.96.111.202], 06/12/2000 09:24 GMT , Refers to Post #486

Worldcraft uses a slightly different texture alignment system to the original mapping system.

In order to get the texturing right, you can either:
1. Avoid 45� angles from flat to vertical planes. Try stretching these by 2 or maybe even 4 units in one direction - then you'll avoid the problem.
2. Use "flat" textures with no discernible grain on these surfaces.
3. Run WQBSP from the DOS prompt with the -alternateaxis switch - this tells the compiler that WC's b0rked the texture alignment info :)

The BSP format seems to attempt to map textures to the closest fitting cardinal plane; eg. a "west wall" is aligned along the YZ ("north/up") plane, a "north wall" along the XZ plane, and a ceiling to the XY plane. This, when you have complex curves and angles, can be a royal pain in the arse.

Sometimes...

#488 Posted by BlackPope [209.52.215.14], 07/12/2000 08:08 GMT

The map I'm working on has TONS of rotated textures at 45, 35, 27 etc's angles...

the trick is to carve the brush into shape keeping the thickness of the brush similar to whatever your lining it up with (sometimes this cannot be avoided)
on something like 45 degrees it's pretty easy...
then when you get into odd angles like 27 you might have to ajust the width/length of the texture by .2-.5 depending on your brush

It IS possible to align pretty much anything...

Also remember quake bsp doesn't rotate on degrees smaller than 1
eg. 0.5 / 0.25 (understand?) so it won't be perfect if your looking at each pixel up close... but c'mon 0.5 isn't far off!

#489 Posted by ELEK [199.179.175.30], 07/12/2000 22:15 GMT

Make sure you have the most current version of Wqbsp, I think it is 1.3 or something. I was using an older version b4 and having the same tex alignment problems.

#490 Posted by [np]poppycock [66.20.104.40], 09/12/2000 10:51 GMT

I have just one quick question to all you fellow map makers out there. I use the command r_clearcolor to change the color of the outside parts of the map. This command only works in winquake. Now when I want to view some of my levels in GL, you must use gl_clear 1 to get ride of the flickering effect, however, this makes the outside parts a bright red. r_clearcolor would allow me to change this color to maybe grey or black for better viewing but it doesnt work with GL. Is there a command that will allow me to do the same function as r_clearcolor but for GL?

#491 Posted by Iain [208.181.205.8], 12/12/2000 03:10 GMT , Refers to Post #489

According to the Wqbsp readme.txt I'm using version 1.65

Spinning Bits

#492 Posted by The Lieutenant [144.32.177.185], 12/12/2000 12:44 GMT

Quake1 - Hipnotic

How do I create those groovy rotating fans as seen in Rubicon and the Cassandra Calamity? I understand that I need 3 different entities to do it. What are they called, and what fields do each need?

Thanks

#493 Posted by ELEK [199.179.175.169], 12/12/2000 13:42 GMT , Refers to Post #492

CZG has written an excellent tutortial regarding rotater ents in Q1. http://www.planetquake.com/greyvoid. look around it is in there.

Hmmmmm......

#494 Posted by ELEK [199.179.175.169], 12/12/2000 13:52 GMT , Refers to Post #492

What version of WC are you using? This is odd I have never had problems with texture alignment other than on 45degree faces. But this was fixed when I moved to newer version of Wqbsp. I believe it is 1.65 that I am running now. Are you using texture lock when aligning texes? If not turn it on. If so try toggling it off then restart WC and toggle it on. Perhaps the coordinates are fux0red somehow? /me shrugs. Other than that if you are running 1.6 and have hardware acceleration turned on, try turning it off. I have found that running 1.6 with the 3d hardware acceleration turned on produces multiple bugs, errors, and weird problems that just plain suck. If all of that fails, then keep in mind when manipulating faces to use any angle but 45. Try 46 44 etc. use vertex manip and make the grid as small as it can get (hotkeys are [ and ] ) keep the vertex tool snapped to the grid and move the vertice up one or down one grid unit. Then try compiling and see if your texes align.
Good luck

Looking For Beta Testers

#495 Posted by Grahf [209.145.69.144], 13/12/2000 06:58 GMT

Maybe I should've asked in the general thread, but anyway, I'm almost done with my 100 Brush Contest map, and I wanted to get a second opinion before I send it to Aard. Anybody willing email me at

GrahfTheEmperor@SquaresoftRules.com

Preferably, I'd like someone not participating in the contest, but whatever really.

Some One Knows...

#496 Posted by Deathmonger [62.36.150.123], 13/12/2000 18:36 GMT

I've made my own fog shader...

textures/sfx/demo_fog
{
qer_editorimage textures/sfx/hellfog.tga
surfaceparm trans
surfaceparm nonsolid
surfaceparm fog
surfaceparm nodrop
surfaceparm nolightmap
q3map_globaltexture
fogparms ( 0.3 0.2 0.2 ) 5120 //vissible distance

{
map textures/liquids/kc_fogcloud3.tga
blendfunc gl_dst_color gl_zero
tcmod scale -.05 -.05
tcmod scroll .01 -.01
rgbgen identity
}

{
map textures/liquids/kc_fogcloud3.tga
blendfunc gl_dst_color gl_zero
tcmod scale .05 .05
tcmod scroll .01 -.01
rgbgen identity
}
}

It works perfectly but...
It seems not to affect 2 specyfic arches (meshes) in the map.. see this picso that you can get the idea.

Tell me if you know what is it.

Deathmonger

I Got Enough Beta Testers Now

#497 Posted by Grahf [209.145.70.174], 14/12/2000 04:02 GMT , Refers to Post #495

4 to be exact. thanks to those who signed up.

Who Needs A Title Anyway

#498 Posted by The Lieutenant [144.32.177.176], 14/12/2000 12:54 GMT , Refers to Post #493

I got Frika-C to explain it to me since I posted that. Thanks anyway.

Figured It Out Ta...

#499 Posted by palldjon [203.29.11.38], 21/12/2000 05:48 GMT , Refers to Post #475

No need to stress about the "func_door has no solid" iteration at post #475. I worked out what was going on during the construction of my 100brush entry.

Spawnflags...

#500 Posted by XeNoN [195.8.76.78], 22/12/2000 19:10 GMT

Right. If there are any expert mappers who can help me here, then I would be very grateful.

In certain editing mods, such as custents and nehahara, there are loads of different "flags" which you can add to custom entities.
The problem is, with my editor, you cannot add flags seperately, and instead have to just manually enter the "spawnflags" value.
Because of this, I have NO idea how to add multiple flags to an entity (eg. A crucified zombie that only appears on HARD skill).
Is there some sort of calculation you can use between spawnflag values in order to create multiple flags for an entity???

If you ARE an expert mapper and that seemed like complete bollox, then let me know, but if you could help then that would be great. Thanks!

Well, Sorta

#501 Posted by kanaeda [207.208.187.224], 22/12/2000 21:01 GMT , Refers to Post #500

you need to figure out the values for the various flags like the setting for hard diff. only. then add up the values that you want and plug that in.

if i'm remembering right, the spawnflag values are all binary values (1,2,4,8,16,etc), or they are all exponential values of 2. at least, that's how they go in quake 2 mapping. i can't imagine that would have changed between the 2 different games. with it set up this way, it equals out as each different flag represents a seperate bit value (1 or 0) in a binary representation for a single byte of data. yeah, i'm probably strafing off into stuff that doesn't matter, but it does help to understand how they work and why they are numbered that way. :)

anyway, hope at least some of that helps in some way or another.

Re:spawnflags

#502 Posted by Gilt [64.20.60.71], 22/12/2000 21:09 GMT

First off, I would suggest using an editor where it's easy to select the flags.

Anyway,to set multiple flags all you do is add the values together and use the sum as your value. They're binary numbers so they won't overlap.

#503 Posted by Gilt [64.20.60.71], 22/12/2000 21:11 GMT

I type too slow...

#504 Posted by XeNoN [195.8.76.208], 23/12/2000 17:07 GMT

Thats all I needed to know, the adding-together stuff. I dont want to change editor since I'm used to qED now and prefer it to WC and Stoneless.

No Clipping

#505 Posted by [np]poppycock [63.24.243.191], 23/12/2000 17:30 GMT

I have just one quick question to all you fellow map makers out there. I use the command r_clearcolor to change the color of the outside parts of the map. This command only works in winquake. Now when I want to view some of my levels in GL, you must use gl_clear 1 to get ride of the flickering effect, however, this makes the outside parts a bright red. r_clearcolor would allow me to change this color to maybe grey or black for better viewing but it doesnt work with GL. Is there a command that will allow me to do the same function as r_clearcolor but for GL?

Re: Huhkjhkjl

#506 Posted by CZG [148.122.66.52], 26/12/2000 01:25 GMT , Refers to Post #505

No. There is not.
hint: use gl_clear 0 and bind a key to the command BF
Whenever you hit this key the screen will flash (like when you pick up something) and clear out the HOM effect.so keep on hitting that button, and you can have the same effect as gl_clear, only with a garish, bright yellow colour.

Hi Mappers..

#507 Posted by maiden [216.154.14.26], 26/12/2000 16:18 GMT

Just wondering...what causes HOM's in maps and can it be attributed to using a particular (shitty) video card??

Thanks!

Depends On What Game

#508 Posted by Fern [24.147.243.193], 26/12/2000 18:21 GMT , Refers to Post #507

#509 Posted by maiden [216.154.9.25], 26/12/2000 19:56 GMT , Refers to Post #508

Quake III for example. And Quake II too. I've seen some HOM's in custom maps as well as levels that came with the game for both Q3A and Q2.. Sometimes the author is aware of the problem, just doesn't know how to fix it, and sometimes it only appears on some setups (like my aging TNT1 card).

Long Map Load Time ?anything Wrong

#510 Posted by samroski [194.125.133.245], 27/12/2000 00:06 GMT

Have just compiled a ctf level, and it is now ready for playtesting- no leaks, took like 3 hours (celeron 400) to vis/light/aas, and runs fine in q3- but it takes about 5 minutes to load when I open it in q3. The thing just jams on "awaiting connection", but runs fine when loaded.
Is this normal? Should I release it?

Long Map Load Time ?anything Wrong

#511 Posted by samroski [194.125.133.245], 27/12/2000 00:16 GMT

Have just compiled a ctf level, and it is now ready for playtesting- no leaks, took like 3 hours (celeron 400) to vis/light/aas, and runs fine in q3- but it takes about 5 minutes to load when I open it in q3. The thing just jams on "awaiting connection", but runs fine when loaded.
Is this normal? Should I release it for playtesting?

btw if interested screenshots at
http://icns.com/~samir/s2.jpg
http://icns.com/~samir/s1.jpg

CTF Level For Playtesting

#512 Posted by samroski [194.125.133.245], 28/12/2000 00:38 GMT , Refers to Post #511

have the above problem sorted and the level is ready for playtesting. Those interested:

http://icns.com/~samir/maps/ctfsrq.zip

3MB

#513 Posted by Stareye [192.121.70.242], 28/12/2000 11:48 GMT

Does anyone have any tips on archways, when making one, I either get a slow map (ie too many brushes) or the texture covers everything like a wall. What should I do? func_illusionary??

/Stareye

What Engine?

#514 Posted by kanaeda [207.208.137.203], 28/12/2000 19:11 GMT , Refers to Post #513

I'm assuming that you're working with the original quake based on the func_illusionary reference.

if so, my best suggestion is to run around in other maps to try and pick up whatever hints/ideas you can from studying the surrounding brushwork. i'd start with the original game maps. plenty of cool arches in the game. :)

What Kind Of Arches?

#515 Posted by Grahf [209.145.70.194], 28/12/2000 21:54 GMT , Refers to Post #513

A month or so ago, someone (fatty i think) posted some excellent 12 sided cylinder prefabs to this thread. They align perfectly, have a reasonably low poly count, etc. If you need a standard gothic-ish arch, just chop one of these cylinders in half, rotate, and place where you need it. In their unmodified form, a 128*128 texture aligns perfectly on the inside.

Or make your own... There are a number of ratios that will build perfect arches. I believe the prefab uses:

0,2; 2,4; 4,2; 2,0

If that doesn't make sense, don't sweat it.

If you build them right, the arches shouldn't cause excessive bsp/vis times, so making them solid entities should be unnecessary.

Not quite sure what you meant by the texture covering everything. Flat, non-detaiedl textures should work best in most cases.

Does that answer your question?

Shrunk Textures?

#516 Posted by Grahf [209.145.69.98], 28/12/2000 22:24 GMT

I've been working on a q1dm map using some large q3 style textures (evil_lair's set 5, actually). They work, and look, a lot better when shrunk by 50%. However, I recall someone saying that shrunk textures are in some way bad. Could someone enlighten me as to the potential problems in doing this?

#517 Posted by CZG [148.122.66.52], 29/12/2000 02:37 GMT , Refers to Post #516

Shrinking the texture also shrinks the resolution of the lightmap added to it, thus taking longer to light.
Also shrinking a texture increases the area that is to be textured. (If all the textures in the level are scaled .50, essentialy the entire level with everything in it is scaled to 200%.
Furthermore as for Q1s sake, Qbsp sometimes split faces where textures repeat, and so having the texture repeat more times makes the face split more.

All of the statements above are totally unproven and unsupported.
CZG takes no responsibility for any misconceptions that are inflicted upon the reader by this post.
CZG is a complete and total dork.

Software Quake Has A Heart Attack...

#518 Posted by Tron [203.12.165.8], 29/12/2000 02:57 GMT , Refers to Post #517

I've tried using high resolution textures as well but software quake just can't handle them, it get's really chuggy and dies a slow horrible choking death.

Tron

Q3 - Q1 Textures

#519 Posted by Kell [194.105.160.225], 05/01/2001 17:57 GMT

If the textures look huge, resize them to 50% in PSP or Photoshop first then load them into a new texture wad.
The resolution of Q3 textures is double that of Q1 because it can handle far more information.
I noticed a similar problem some time back when some of Rhorsach's textures were converted without scaling for Q1; the result was trim features twice the height of the player etc. A Q3 texture 128x128 does the same job as a 64x64 texture does in Q1.

Personally, I don't double the scaling of a texture except for details, e.g. something which the player will be looking at very close up, where the extra pixels will make a better looking object - switches are a good example; the H.E.V. chargers in HL had textures double the scale of the box they would be applied to. This is because the player spends an unusually long time pressed up against the charger, so it looks cooler to have extra detail.

Don't do this across a whole level. Otherwise you get, as Tron so elonquently phrased it, a slow horrible choking death...

Good News, Bad News

#520 Posted by Biff_Debris [152.163.204.194], 06/01/2001 15:17 GMT

The good news is -- GTKRadiant works with my PC! WOOP!

The bad news is, I've built the usual one-room test map in trying to learn the editor, and I keep falling thru the floor. Ricebug over at gamedesign.net said to check the texture with Curry for nonsolid params, which I did -- and it does, but what I want to know is this: can I just delete the param with Curry, or will that screw something up (btw, the tex is killtrim_trans, which I really like)?

Biff Biff Biff

#521 Posted by Lunaran [172.168.63.81], 06/01/2001 21:02 GMT , Refers to Post #520

If you delete the shader parm with curry it'll still be a nonsolid floor on every other person in the world's computer.

Open it up instead and see what texture it uses, and just use that texture. Else you're going to have to include a custom biff3dm1.shader with your map.

Dammit, I Was Afraid Of That.

#522 Posted by Biff_Debris [205.188.199.167], 06/01/2001 21:47 GMT

But how do I select the texture and NOT the shader in Curry? I tried to highlight it, but it only put a box around the selection.

#523 Posted by Shallow[BAP] [212.229.87.1], 06/01/2001 22:18 GMT , Refers to Post #522

In this case it's easy. You don't need to hack the shader or use Curry or anything like that.

Apply the texture to the surface/whole brush, make sure it's selected, then open the surface inspector (S). Delete the '_trans' bit from the end of the texture name. This seems to work although I haven't tried compiling the map, it ought to though.

In some cases you can't do this though because the shader name is exactly the same as the texture name

#524 Posted by Biff_Debris [205.188.198.161], 06/01/2001 23:35 GMT , Refers to Post #523

I hadn't even thought about the surface inspector (actually, I've only used it once so far). Thanks, man.

Another Potentially Dumb Question

#525 Posted by Biff_Debris [205.188.198.161], 06/01/2001 23:37 GMT

How can I change the particulars of existing entities in the map? All I've been able to do is right-click and bring up the entity menu to create new ones.

#526 Posted by GrindSpire [62.7.39.103], 07/01/2001 00:03 GMT , Refers to Post #525

You select the entity (easiest in the 3D window) by shift + left clicking on it. Then just press N to bring up the entity properties. Or if it is a light press K to set the colour of the light.

#527 Posted by Biff_Debris [205.188.199.188], 07/01/2001 03:04 GMT , Refers to Post #526

Thanks, GS. I'm getting the hang of Radiant's basic commands (moving, stretching, clipping, copying and pasting brushes), and am beginning to understand why you've all been playing it up it so much...

Back To Tex Fixing

#528 Posted by Biff_Debris [152.163.207.197], 07/01/2001 05:18 GMT

Is there any way to do the above suggestion by Shallow (remove the '_trans' part from the killblock texture) on more than one brush simultaneously? I tried it with the replace textures menu, but everything stayed the way it was.

Why Oh Why Does VIS Suck My Nuts?

#529 Posted by Grahf [209.145.71.115], 11/02/2001 02:49 GMT

Alright. I'm building a city/town map. It's gonna be cool. Right now I have a large dock area, and a street behind it, separated by rather high walls and houses (768 high, at least). The only way to get from the dock area to the street is a 256 wide hole in the wall at one end of the street.

So I load the map up in software quake to test visibility, and as far as I can tell, I can see the whole dock from the street, and vis versa.

As far as I can tell, VIS makes some kind of distinction between seeing around corners and seeing over walls.

Possible solutions: yes I could have the roofs of the buildings join with the sky brush (in fact they're only 64 apart I think), but I wanted to know if this was soluble with doing so, because then I couldn't really have varying roof heights. Other possibilty: the street didn't have any detail on it, so the road and the walls on the other side were probbly only one portal (or was it leaf? whatever) that stretched the whole length of the area.

I'm just annoyed because I know the Unreal engine would have no damn problems whatsoever (and DON'T say make the map for Unreal, because I don't have time to learn UnrealEd right now, I'm committed to q1, and I have a dinky Mac, and hell will freeze over before UnrealED gets a Mac port, so there.)

</rant>

#530 Posted by ES [63.20.146.179], 11/02/2001 17:19 GMT

Im a newbie at building q3a maps but i want to get good, any helpful tips?

#531 Posted by GrindSpire [213.122.3.145], 11/02/2001 17:25 GMT , Refers to Post #530

(1) Practise, practise, practise. That is the main way to learn, just keep building small maps and learning new techniques.

(2) Start small. Make small maps to start with, rather than starting some huge ambitious project, that way you can complete something and get feedback on it, one of the most important things.

(3) Don't release the first thing you finish. Your 3rd finished map will probably be the earliest thing you want to release, and even then, you'll look back at it and cringe when you get better.

(4) Ask questions. Don't be afraid to email mappers whose work you admire to ask them questions or to have a look at your work pre-release.

(5) Beta test. Once you think your map is at releasable standard, send it to some people whose work you respect (not your friends) and ask them what they think you should change.

Hope that helps

#532 Posted by ES [63.20.146.224], 11/02/2001 22:22 GMT

ill try that, and ill me sure to send in my first halfway decent map here for everyone to look at :] ALSO, what would be a good editor to use? I have Tread3d and Quake Army Knife, and i prefer qak over tread, but if theres anything else that might be better, please tell me.

#533 Posted by GrindSpire [62.7.68.57], 11/02/2001 22:37 GMT , Refers to Post #532

Since it is for Q3, your choices are Q3R, Quark or Tread. Personally I use Q3R, but try them all out and see which one you prefer.

It Works, Im A Genius! Doh

#534 Posted by ES [63.20.67.16], 12/02/2001 09:11 GMT

im gonna slap myself later on, how do you add a bot the map? Theres a spawn player in quark, but i dont see a spawn bot. I know im missing something, what is it :]

Intermission Story

#535 Posted by Kell [194.105.160.225], 12/02/2001 10:26 GMT

How do I get text to appear across an intermission screen; you know the sort of thing, "As the corpse of the monstrous Cthon sinks back into the lava whence it rose..etc" ?

#536 Posted by GrindSpire [193.193.32.13], 12/02/2001 11:18 GMT , Refers to Post #534

Basically, use info_deathmatchstart at all the points you want players/bots to spawn. Then, compile the map as normal. Once this is done there is a program in your tools directory called bspc.exe run this and it will give you a list of parameters, the one you want is -bsp2ass. That should make a file called mapname.aas in your baseq3/maps folder, now you can add bots via the in game menu.

#537 Posted by ES [63.20.146.198], 12/02/2001 18:18 GMT

well, i completed a fairly nice (for my experience level) arena type level. if any of you want it, just drop me a line, my ICQ# is 70337796.

Who Needs A Title Anyway

#538 Posted by Grahf [209.145.70.90], 12/02/2001 21:36 GMT

kell, I think it might have something to do with the episodegate/bossgate entities. I'm really not sure though.

End-of-Episode Text

#539 Posted by Nightbringer [203.109.252.25], 13/02/2001 01:58 GMT , Refers to Post #535

It's a property of the intermission entity, sort of; it's done in the qc code - ExitIntermission in client.qc.

#540 Posted by infiniface [195.228.218.104], 13/02/2001 02:26 GMT

Hi!

Can everybody say what tha heck is goin' on with my map? I've created a ctf map, it has 4*2 ctf_***spawn points, 4*2 ctf_***player points, the two flags, 3 teleports, 1 intermission, 2 deatmatch spawning points, some trigger_push, and so on, but when I compile it (everything works) i cannot load it with 1.17, but it works with 1.27g!!!

I've created the map with gtkrad 1.1 TA, compiled with gtkbuild...

Puhhleeeazzzeee!!!

#541 Posted by GrindSpire [213.122.212.212], 13/02/2001 07:43 GMT , Refers to Post #540

It is probably because of the new tools. Your map has been compiled with the Q3TA tools, so it only works with 1.27 since that is the patch that takes Q3 up to a level with Q3TA.

This may be entirely wrong though =)

It's QuakeC

#542 Posted by Fat Controller [203.96.111.202], 13/02/2001 08:32 GMT , Refers to Post #535

Basically, there's a routine that's called during an intermission that displays all that text goodness - ExitIntermission() in CLIENT.QC.

The bit we're interested in is...

//
// run some text if at the end of an episode
//
if (intermission_running == 2)
{

Now, after the official episode stuff, slam in this lot:

else if (world.model == "maps/mapname.bsp")
{
WriteByte (MSG_ALL, SVC_CDTRACK);
WriteByte (MSG_ALL, 2); // CD track to play
WriteByte (MSG_ALL, 3); // Dunno
WriteByte (MSG_ALL, SVC_FINALE);
WriteByte (MSG_ALL, "Some freaky shit happened etc.");
return;
}

Decent Quake tracks for in-game episodes are #3 and #10 for a more evil feel.

I Don't Think So

#543 Posted by infiniface [195.228.218.104], 13/02/2001 08:42 GMT , Refers to Post #541

GS:

If this would be the case, the server (in my opinion) have to kick me back with some error messages, which I can dump out with condump, or plainly just check with console. But it freeeeeezzzzes to the hell during "loading map xxx". :) Geez. (I've also tried with my other maps, but they are working...)

#544 Posted by LDB [217.80.127.254], 13/02/2001 18:32 GMT

I have read that i can make BSP files to a editable map file! And it works but i did not see the textures!
please help me!

ps: i extract the textures from the pk3 file but it still not works!

#545 Posted by Johnny [151.202.208.84], 13/02/2001 18:54 GMT , Refers to Post #544

That's the hitch about decompiling maps. All texture information is lost, also all curves are translated into brushes.

Episode Ending Text

#546 Posted by Grahf [209.145.71.89], 14/02/2001 02:44 GMT

Totally offtopic from mapping help, but...

When I played CZG's Insomnia pak, I had The Fragile (left mind you) in my drive for tasty nihilistic background music. CZG had graciously set the episode end music to track 2, which happens to be The Day The World Went Away on The Fragile. And WOW, that and the totally bleak ending text clicked so incredibly well... He must have planned that.

Moral of the story? Plan your Quake music wisely, it makes a difference!

#547 Posted by Fern [141.222.155.61], 14/02/2001 04:59 GMT

Plan your Quake music wisely, it makes a difference!

Unfortunately, I don't think many people who play my maps leave Britney Spears in the cd drive while playing

#548 Posted by ES [63.20.67.166], 14/02/2001 06:57 GMT

frag me baby one more time :]

#549 Posted by Tron [203.12.165.8], 14/02/2001 08:51 GMT

I tried to compile a map I'm working on before and got this error message:

outputfile: c:\quake\id1\maps\TRNSLIDE.bsp
--- LoadMapFile ---
c:\quake\id1\maps\TRNSLIDE.map
159 brushes
40 entities
16 miptex
148 texinfo
building hulls sequentially...
--- Brush_LoadEntity ---
158 brushes read
---- CSGFaces ----
1290 brushfaces
6698 csgfaces
1309 mergedfaces
--- SolidBSP ---
************ ERROR ************
Ran out of memory allocating 548 bytes

Argh!!!!! I'm really stuck and don't want to have to scrap what I have...

Tron

#550 Posted by Kell [194.105.160.225], 14/02/2001 10:18 GMT

Plan your Quake music wisely, it makes a difference!

And how many Quake players have a copy of 'Zoon' ?

#551 Posted by ES [63.20.67.41], 14/02/2001 20:08 GMT

i dont know a bsp from a pk3, but isnt that kinda sayin you ran outta memory, restart your computer and try it again, you resource monger.

I'm A Total Q3r N3wb

#552 Posted by Grahf [216.12.20.97], 14/02/2001 20:11 GMT

Is there a keyboard shortcut for "Select Partial Tall?" I'm giving myself carpal tunnel syndrome using the silly contextual menu every time.

#553 Posted by XeNoN [195.8.76.35], 14/02/2001 22:37 GMT , Refers to Post #549

you might have to close one or more other programs running on your system to free up RAM, or try adding a winmem xx command to qbsp (i have no idea if this works, its just a random suggestion)

#554 Posted by GrindSpire [213.122.16.83], 14/02/2001 23:09 GMT , Refers to Post #552

Well there is a button for it =)

Memory Errors

#555 Posted by Jimbo [164.106.40.175], 15/02/2001 16:00 GMT , Refers to Post #549

Hmmm, I used to have that sort of problem,
First: check your free memory, both disk and ram, if it's less than 128 megs combined try and free up some more.
Second:try a different compiler, if necessary reboot to dos mode and try the dos qbsp.
I hope that helps.
-Jimbo

"wqbsp.exe"

#556 Posted by XeNoN [195.8.75.59], 15/02/2001 20:11 GMT

If you have trouble with normal qbsp, I recommend tracking this program down. It can handle larger files and has support for transparent water. Try fileplanet.

Q3 Grenade Shooter Model

#557 Posted by Killer [195.8.84.83], 19/02/2001 16:47 GMT

Does anyone know what the name of the Quake III Grenade Shooter model is? You know the one in Q3DM11 - Deva Station near the Quad / Haste. I have checked the PK3 files and can't find the bastard MD3 file, only the textures. If anyone know please post it here or email me.

Cheers,
-Killer

It Is Quite Likely That...

#558 Posted by Shallow[BAP] [212.229.87.1], 19/02/2001 22:18 GMT , Refers to Post #557

... the grenade shooter model was one of the ones that id decided not to release. Since the polys of a mapobject are written into the bsp at compile time there is no need to release the md3 to a mapobject if you don't want to, only the textures. id put a selection of mapobjects in the media that was released with radiant, but by no means all of them.

Of course it may actually be hidden somewhere, in the released media, I haven't actually checked. If not you'll need to make your own - either brushes or using milkshape or summat.

(BTW don't bother trying to ask id to release it, they've said no to the last 6 trillion requests to release specific map objects :)

Cheers Shallow

#559 Posted by Killer [213.1.196.82], 20/02/2001 00:08 GMT , Refers to Post #558

Thanks for the info Shallow, I didn't realise that was the situation, I thought if it was in the maps then it had to be in the PK3 files somewhere. Alas I will have to make a shitty replacement out of brushes instead :-(

-Killer

HELP ME PLEASE!!!

#560 Posted by ParboiL [195.131.1.170], 20/02/2001 09:32 GMT

Dear guys! Help me please!
To me is very necessary initial file (*.map) from a card Claustrofobopolis (dm2 Quake1).
Where it it is possible download???
Beforehand is very grateful.

Experiences

#561 Posted by infiniface [195.56.84.209], 20/02/2001 18:03 GMT

So, I wrote lately that I cannot run my compiled map, while it doesn't shown any errors until compiling process. As the general mapping faq at qeradiant.com, the bug was with the shaders. I still dunno where or why or which shader did the crash, but q3a crashed with no message. Weird, eh? I think there was something at the tcGen lightmap stages...

Radient For Q1?

#562 Posted by Vrajgh [212.159.1.3], 20/02/2001 21:31 GMT

Is there a version of radient or something similar for Q1? I currently use BSP and love it but I've heard so much about how good radient is and would like to give it a try if there is such a thing for Q1.

Thanks

#563 Posted by GrindSpire [213.122.166.97], 21/02/2001 08:32 GMT , Refers to Post #562

You have to use QERadiant and SleepwalkR's converter, QER can be found here: http://www.qeradiant.com/ and the converter can be found here: http://www.planetquake.com/rem/. There are instructions to get it all working in the converter's text file.

Leaf Saw Into Leaf

#564 Posted by Vondur [194.87.189.190], 21/02/2001 10:58 GMT

Just felt an urge to type something on qmap.
Well, i just remembered the prob I had when building my current q1sp map.
There was an error like:

*********** ERROR **********
Leaf portals saw into leaf

I was unable to fix it for a long time, vis just crashed... I tried averything, and in the end I 'fixed' it by moving entire map on grid. But error returned after some additions to the map. And I fixed it again with the same method. I'm afraid that it might return again. I just want to find the core of evil there... Yes, I've read info on Quakelab [ http://www.planetquake.com/QuakeLab/vis.htm ], but there is no exact solution for the problem. And yes, I rebuilt the area after which the problem started to appear...no success...

So, does anyone know how to kill this nasty thing? Are there any true killing methods?

Oh, *that* Error...

#565 Posted by Grahf [216.12.20.97], 21/02/2001 18:09 GMT

I think the "leaf portals saw into leaf" error has something to do with bad/concave brushes, or really complex architecture. Yeah, that's not any specific advice, but Quakelab's suggestion to do a higher VIS makes sense. This is just one of those errors that nobody has ever really figured out.

q1sp? Can't wait to see it, Von.

#566 Posted by XeNoN [195.8.76.155], 21/02/2001 21:30 GMT , Refers to Post #564

Ask DaZ, he had the problem before with dazsp3...

Cant wait for the map to be released. If its anything like Solarfall then that cant be a bad thing...

#567 Posted by Vondur [194.87.189.190], 22/02/2001 07:19 GMT

i hope it will be better than solarfall ;)

ya....evil error though

#568 Posted by DaZ [213.123.22.178], 23/02/2001 19:44 GMT

When I had the "leaf portals saw into leaf" error I just moved the map around on the grid like Von, and it never came back...

Strange that it has with you Von, Hmm... Well just keep moving the map around until its done eh?

Curve Lighting

#569 Posted by Biff_Debris [205.188.198.49], 25/02/2001 15:21 GMT

Hey guys -- any tips on getting those odd surfaces in q1 brush curves lit properly? I've got an arch, and everything but the very ceiling (top) lights perfectly -- which in itself amazed me, but it's still off, and adding light just makes the surrounding area brighter. It's nothing major -- just annoying.

#570 Posted by Oxygen [24.163.237.239], 25/02/2001 16:23 GMT

I know this sounds stpuid but I've been working on a map for about 3 months (Q3 radiant)now and I don't know how to test the level.. I mean I compile it then what ?

Biff, Curves

#571 Posted by Fern [141.222.155.61], 25/02/2001 16:40 GMT

Basically you're screwed. That's an extremely annoying bug that just occurs at random times when you use curves in Q1 (see one of the secrets in APSP1 for an example :)). Either use more/less vertices or use a bunch of tiny little lights.

#572 Posted by CZG [195.204.47.81], 25/02/2001 17:21 GMT , Refers to Post #569

Get the source for Tyrlite, (it's available isn't it?) code in support for arghrads phong shading, and voil�! Instant smoothly lit curves.

That is, if you are a 1337 programmer. If not, then there's not much you can do. Except for what the plant said.

Lots Of Little Lights...

#573 Posted by Tron [203.12.165.8], 25/02/2001 21:54 GMT , Refers to Post #569

I've tried doing a fair bit of lighting curves recently and the best way seems to be to use a shitload of little lights to light each face of the curve individually...it;s a bitch to do and takes a lot longer to compile but you can get some good results...

Tron

City Of Tiny Lights

#574 Posted by Biff_Debris [152.163.205.53], 25/02/2001 23:54 GMT

I'm no Code Boy, so that seems the way to go. Whelp, no VIS for me for a while. Thanks guys.

#575 Posted by Biff_Debris [152.163.205.33], 26/02/2001 03:52 GMT

This is driving me nuts. I've even tried spots and simplifying the architecture, but this lighting thing's MAKING ME INSANE. I'm a manic mapper, a loony level-builder. Wish Q1 had the lit surfaces q2 had -- waitaminute -- where's that other thread...

Speedy Thought A Title Wasn't Needed

#576 Posted by Speedy [213.221.48.23], 26/02/2001 06:35 GMT

for inside the arch I just place 1 light with 1 delay in the centre; for outside - small lights with delay 2 or 1 at the edges, to make two faces lit equally on their junction

#577 Posted by Biff_Debris [205.188.199.173], 26/02/2001 17:12 GMT

The delayed lights didn't help much, either. If you guys want to see what I'm talking about, I've got a screenie of it here. As you can see, the top area is considerably darker than the sides. I'd like them to match more, but any lighting continues to seperate the difference, no matter what I try.

Really Biff...

#578 Posted by CZG [195.204.54.107], 26/02/2001 17:20 GMT , Refers to Post #577

I think that lighting looks very realistic actually. The lightsource is the grates in the ceiling as far as I can see, and thus it would be natural if the part of the arch facing down would be darker as it is at the exact same height.
If you'd released that map right now I never would have dreamed you had any trouble there or that that is not how it's supposed to look.
Maybe you're being a bit too perfectionist?

Aah -- Mebbe

#579 Posted by Biff_Debris [205.188.199.173], 26/02/2001 18:35 GMT , Refers to Post #578

It just sucks when you're so used to being able to control the factors in a map, and you come across something that seems out of your control -- not unlike some niggling QBSP message or something. But you may have given me an idea, CZG -- one way to even the lighting is to pull those recessed lights out. Why I didn't think of that before, I have no idea. But if I don't like that, I may go back to the way it looks now.

That Was It.

#580 Posted by Biff_Debris [205.188.192.171], 26/02/2001 18:49 GMT

If it'd been a dog, it'd humped my leg. And I'm sticking with it since it makes those arches more rounded, and arch-like. Have a look here.

#581 Posted by Grahf [216.12.20.97], 26/02/2001 19:32 GMT

Last nigh, I ran up against the weirdest screw-up I've seen in Quake for quite a while. Essentially, my sky texture is totally b0rked.

I was making a Nehahra map, and I wanted to use some skyboxes. So, last night I built a big canyon area, and a one story building contained in the canyon. Compiling gave no errors (although one qbsp I used to try and fix the problem gave me two "brush with duplicate plane" errors), but when I loaded up the map I saw no skybox, but instead a brown and multicolored crap kind of sky. I had put a Hexen II sky in first, and then one from DKT. Neither changed the look of this fux0r3d sky, which resembled no texture in the map. In addition, the vising inside the building was screwed up; I could see straight through the ceiling, as if I had r_drawflat 1 on. But this was Nehahra, not software. The really weird thing was that inside the building, where I could see through the ceiling, the skybox was perfectly visible!

I thought this was a Nehahra problem, but I tried the map in software to no avail. Tried two qbsp progs, 2 VIS progs, always tyrlite, and the problem didn't go away. (the compile utils i used were the qbsp and vis integrated with Quiver and the MacOS ports of the Quest utils, just so ya know). Always a level 4 vis.

I'm really confused. Only possible problem is that the building had a lot of fine detail (aligned on the 4-8 unit grid).

Help!

#582 Posted by Fern [141.222.155.61], 26/02/2001 21:23 GMT

Plat floor textures on the ceiling? Ugh, everyone is so l33t compared to me. :( Can't wait to play this thing :)

#583 Posted by pjw [198.211.32.230], 27/02/2001 04:47 GMT , Refers to Post #570

After you've compiled your map, pull down the Q3 console (with the "~" key), and type "/sv_pure 0" (without the quotes), and hit enter. This allows Q3 to run a bare .bsp without you having to put it in a .pk3. Then type "/map mymapname" (without the quotes) and hit enter. Your map should load.

Maybe . . . just possibly . . . you might consider checking your map in-game more then once every three months?

Those Damn Curves...

#584 Posted by Grahf [216.12.20.97], 27/02/2001 14:10 GMT

I've got the basic 12 sided cylinder down, but making twists in the cylinder is driving me mad. Any ratios/prefabs to point me to?

Worldcraft 3.3 & Q1

#585 Posted by Mook [208.198.103.19], 27/02/2001 16:04 GMT

Has there been a util made -yet- that will convert a WC 3.3 .map file to a Q1-compatible .map file and RETAIN the texture rotation/alignment?

I'd sooooo love to use WC 3.3 for Q1 mapping and texturing...but the only ways I can find to use it for this just toss out WC's wacky new texture keys :/

There's some util for Tribes mapping called MapConverter that seemed promising, but it too just throws out said keys...ugh

I know it -has- to be possible, and I'd make my own util, but I have no idea how you'd convert the keys...

How To Set WAYPOINTS In Quake1CTF Maps ?

#586 Posted by [Cap Quake] [200.190.226.41], 27/02/2001 22:13 GMT

I got many CTF maps, but when i go play with bots, they not atack, because the maps dont'have WAYPOINTS.
What i need to set this waypoints ??

Grahf Thought A Title Wasn't Needed

#587 Posted by Grahf [209.145.69.88], 27/02/2001 22:30 GMT

cap quake, which ctf mod? There aren't many people who do ctf mapping around here, my only guess is that the waypoints are probably entities you need to create.

Tex Help...

#588 Posted by palldjon [203.29.11.38], 28/02/2001 01:50 GMT

Is it possible for a texture wizard to convert:

archprt1
archprt10
archprt9
clmsupbot
clmsuptop

from the Q3Atest.wad (already converted for Q1 at Frib's site) so that they sit with E3. I'm thinking a grey metal conversion might work and I'd be much obliged if someone would take on the task.

I need the modified texz for an upcoming project.

#589 Posted by GlassMan [195.184.224.198], 28/02/2001 06:56 GMT , Refers to Post #586

Try a specialist ctf bot like the one here

http://www.captured.com/ctfbot/

Update On #581

#590 Posted by Grahf [209.145.71.60], 01/03/2001 01:33 GMT

It's not vis. The sky looks wack whether not the map is vis'ed. Also, I took out the complex architecture, that didn't help either. And actually software quake died with a wierd error, which may be related, but I doubt it, as the nehahra entities were likely spit back out by swquake.

here's some pics. Anybody have a clue?

Borked Sky 1

Borked Sky 2

Borked Sky 3

Borked Sky 4

Bluh! Bluh!

#591 Posted by Biff_Debris [152.163.205.66], 01/03/2001 21:03 GMT

In q1, doesn't the trigger_counter use its targetname for those things it counts (say if it counted to two, and had the name of "count", then both the entities it counted would need the same name of "count")?

#592 Posted by Fern [141.222.155.61], 01/03/2001 21:13 GMT

looks like you have a trigger named "count" with a count of two. That means that two things with the TARGET (not name, but target) of "count" must be triggered/killed before the trigger_counter is triggered. cool? :)

Recounters!

#593 Posted by Biff_Debris [152.163.195.181], 01/03/2001 22:06 GMT , Refers to Post #592

What if the two things are already targeting something else (like a teleporter, mebbe)?

Meanwhile...

#594 Posted by Biff_Debris [205.188.192.54], 01/03/2001 23:28 GMT

Okay, I've got the trigger_counter with the targetname of "count", a count of 2 and the target of a pair of doors ("dr"). I've also got a trigger_relay with the target of "count" and the name of "t1", which is also the anme of a teleport_destination, which is passed twice by two different teles. So, with the theory being when "t1" is passed twice, via the trigger_relay the trigger_counter will be activated to open the doors, right?

Wrong -- the thing counts, and with the proper messages (with "one more to go", and "sequence completed"), but the doors don't open. I even when back and tried the "toggle" flag on the doors, but still no go.

#595 Posted by Fern [141.222.155.61], 01/03/2001 23:51 GMT

Why bother using the trigger_relay?

#596 Posted by Biff_Debris [205.188.199.39], 02/03/2001 01:28 GMT , Refers to Post #595

Didn't you say the trigger_counter needed to have its name in the target field of whatever what to be counted? I said the two things I wanted to be counted already had those fields filled, thus the trigger_relay to provide the extra slot.

Are you trying to say that the tele_destination could have a "targetname" key added, and used instead?

I Believe...

#597 Posted by palldjon [203.29.11.38], 02/03/2001 02:35 GMT , Refers to Post #596

what Fern is saying is that the trigger_relay in this setup is redundant.

Start at the back:

The teleport_destination (with targetname "tele1" or some such) targets the trigger_counter with targetname "count", when count is triggered (targetted) twice it targets the func_door with targetname "dr1".

And the entity list looks like this:
teleport_destination, targetname-tele1, target-count.
trigger_counter, targetname-count, target-dr1.
func_door, targetname-dr1.

Hope it works

#598 Posted by Biff_Debris [205.188.199.51], 02/03/2001 03:24 GMT

I didn't realize until I read your post Pal, I meant to put "target" instead of "targetname" (as far as the tele_dest was concerned) in my last post -- but that was what I had meant. No, really!

Anyway, I tried it (targetting the trig_count with the tele_dest -- twice), but it didn't work the counter at all.

#599 Posted by palldjon [203.29.11.38], 02/03/2001 04:18 GMT , Refers to Post #598

Yet in the previous setup, with the tele_dest named t1 the counter worked via targetting by the relay?

So let me get this straight, the entity list is as follows:
teleport_destination, targetname-t1.
trigger_relay, targetname-t1, target-count.
trigger_counter, targetname-count, target-dr.
func_door, targetname-dr.

If the counter is working, this should work. Therfore I don't know what's going on, sorry.

#600 Posted by Fern [141.222.155.61], 02/03/2001 04:27 GMT

So let me get this straight, the entity list is as follows:
teleport_destination, targetname-t1.
trigger_relay, targetname-t1, target-count.
trigger_counter, targetname-count, target-dr.
func_door, targetname-dr.

Even if it doesn't work, you'd be better off not fooling with unnecessary entities :)

teleport_destination, targetname-t1.
trigger_counter, targetname-t1, target-dr.
func_door, targetname-dr.

I would also try removing the target name for the doors entirely and make sure they open correctly when you walked up to them.

#601 Posted by Lunaran [152.163.197.63], 02/03/2001 04:54 GMT

Okay, so say I have a trigger_multiple targetting a door that opens up a teleporter that has to be turned on when the trigger is touched, but I can't use a trigger_relay because the trigger_multiple has to be triggered on by another trigger that's triggered by a trigger_relay set off when someone goes through the first teleporter, but the first teleporter is turned off and another one right there turned on to make it look like the destination is changing, but I can't get the targetnames on the teleport_destinations to work because they both all have to be triggered on by a func_button that opens the first door and enables andother door to be triggered open once the player goes through the second teleport, but only if they go in sideways holding a ukelele and a can of baked beans...

Quite So...

#602 Posted by palldjon [203.29.11.38], 02/03/2001 04:55 GMT , Refers to Post #600

I (doh!) missed that entity rationalization, and yeah maybe the doors just don't work. Would it be an idea to send 'em back the world then re-tie them to the func_door entity.

#603 Posted by palldjon [203.29.11.38], 02/03/2001 04:58 GMT , Refers to Post #601

I just realised how appropriate your nick is.

Second Verse...

#604 Posted by Biff_Debris [152.163.204.197], 02/03/2001 10:17 GMT , Refers to Post #600

Same as the first: No go.

And the doors do work by themselves. Just not when given a targetname!

That's The Funniest Thing

#605 Posted by pjw [198.211.36.117], 02/03/2001 10:47 GMT , Refers to Post #601

I've read all day. Maybe it's just because I've had my head stuck in 3DS Max for about sixteen hours and I despise the buggy POS and I am thus slightly brain damaged, but man, that's funny stuff.

I love this site.

I love Lun.

Hell, I love everyone.

I'm going to sleep.

(I'm not even drunk.)

Second Verse

#606 Posted by Fern [141.222.155.61], 02/03/2001 17:04 GMT

hmm... I'd be glad to look at the .map. hehe :)

#607 Posted by Apollo [213.1.133.107], 03/03/2001 08:58 GMT

More red arrows than a fucking plane convention.<happy>

Fucking Planes?

#608 Posted by Biff_Debris [205.188.198.22], 03/03/2001 12:00 GMT

Now I'd like to see that.

What Was That Show Called...

#609 Posted by Tron [203.12.165.8], 03/03/2001 12:09 GMT

Anyone remember that cartoon Fergie invented..umm budgie the helicopter was it? Anyway, there were guy and girl helicopters in that so there must be a way for planes to have sex!

Tron

#610 Posted by Biff_Debris [205.188.199.151], 03/03/2001 13:24 GMT

Or those old Tex Avery cartoons with the mama and daddy planes, and the little baby plane who wanted to be a jet?

#611 Posted by Vrajgh [212.159.1.3], 03/03/2001 18:17 GMT

I'm mapping for Q1 (or trying anyway!) can someone post a link to a tutorial or something with tips as to how to keep these low. I have a map which has high r_speeds ingrained in the design (which is rather unfortunate) and as that is the case I think I ought to do everything in my power to keep them low.

Thanks a lot.

#612 Posted by Lunaran [64.12.102.172], 03/03/2001 19:55 GMT

I just realised how appropriate your nick is.

You did? Cool.

er ... could you explain it to me then? unless it's the usual moon thing I'm not sure I understand what you mean. :)

#613 Posted by Fern [141.222.155.61], 03/03/2001 20:42 GMT

http://members.tripod.com/~Fribbles/tutorial/qlevels.html <-- this wasn't as helpful as I remembered, but it still has some important information...

My advice on keeping r_speeds low is to make sure there's nowhere in the map where you can see lots of stuff, but I'm sure whoever else will respond to this is going to plug that detail and hint shit :)

#614 Posted by GrindSpire [213.122.21.230], 03/03/2001 20:46 GMT , Refers to Post #612

I would I assume he meant as in lunatics

Evil Testicles Of Doom!

#615 Posted by GrindSpire [213.123.17.61], 03/03/2001 23:40 GMT

What does the error message

Bad Surface Extents 32/826

mean in a HL map?

#616 Posted by Scampie [205.243.60.13], 03/03/2001 23:48 GMT , Refers to Post #615

that it sucks and you shouldn't waste your time with crap games like HL.

#617 Posted by Jaj [62.83.19.88], 04/03/2001 02:05 GMT , Refers to Post #611

This is another tutorial with tricks for reduce the r_speeds, is for Quake2 but what is explained there can be applied to Quake1 too :
It's
Here

Middle Eight

#618 Posted by palldjon@Icafe [144.132.66.135], 04/03/2001 03:26 GMT

Biff - just launched a .zip your way with a possible solution.

Lun - I was thinking of the unusual moon thing.

/me puts "The Hampsterdance" on again and continues mapping.

Biff's Problem

#619 Posted by Fern [141.222.155.61], 04/03/2001 03:45 GMT

has been fixed as far as I know, and the .map file was very tasty :)

#620 Posted by Biff_Debris [205.188.192.176], 04/03/2001 04:05 GMT , Refers to Post #619

I actually got a little more work done today, and might finally get some pics in the screenie thread soon =)

#621 Posted by Vondur [194.87.189.205], 04/03/2001 09:14 GMT , Refers to Post #611

about r_speeds

http://www.planetquake.com/worldcraft/tutorial/speed.html

the tutorial site itself [i very recommend to read it]

http://www.planetquake.com/worldcraft/index2.shtm

#622 Posted by palldjon [203.29.11.38], 05/03/2001 00:43 GMT , Refers to Post #619

hope you enjoyed the .bsp anyway Biff.

#623 Posted by Biff_Debris [205.188.198.31], 05/03/2001 01:34 GMT , Refers to Post #622

I didn't get a .bsp, man. I dunno what happened, but I haven't received anything from you.

#624 Posted by metlslime [140.142.171.194], 05/03/2001 03:47 GMT , Refers to Post #580

Here's a nitpick -- the rivet texture on that curve gets stretched on the slanted surfaces. Try scaling it 0.71 on the 45 degree surface, and closer to 1.00 as you get closer to vertical/horizontal.

That Is A Nitpick

#625 Posted by Biff_Debris [205.188.192.158], 05/03/2001 04:31 GMT , Refers to Post #624

But yeah, I know what you mean -- I'll get around to it eventually.

#626 Posted by Vrajgh [212.159.1.3], 05/03/2001 09:26 GMT , Refers to Post #621

Thanks for the help.

0.72 Dammit!

#627 Posted by The Lieutenant [144.32.177.140], 05/03/2001 16:39 GMT

I always use 0.72 for 45 degree things. Dunno why - I just calculated it again and it should be 0.71 - so why do I always use 0.72? Odd.

And You Were SO Off.

#628 Posted by Biff_Debris [205.188.192.189], 05/03/2001 17:06 GMT , Refers to Post #627

I've Always Used

#629 Posted by Toady [195.163.226.190], 05/03/2001 19:23 GMT

0.75 scale on 45 degree surfaces since it's 3/4ths of the original size, making it easier to align the texture accurately.

How To Release A Map??

#630 Posted by Dr.Shoe [134.147.64.12], 06/03/2001 10:33 GMT , Refers to Post #613

Hi everybody out there!!!

I,ve finished two Q1-Dm-maps and want to release them.
But there is a problem: Everybody says: Upload them to ftp://ftp.cdrom.com and give me the adress!!
It seems that ftp://ftp.cdrom.com doesn`t store q1-levels anymore.

So is there a server out there, where I can store my little maps!!

Please help me!!

Your Dr.Shoe!!"

#631 Posted by Biff_Debris [152.163.204.176], 06/03/2001 13:58 GMT , Refers to Post #630

Does your ISP (internet service provider, like AOL, Earthlink, whatever) provide you with any FTP space? If they do, you can upload your stuff to it, and provide a link to this site (via the board and Map Tracker), using the code featured at the bottom of this page (underneath the icons).

If not, I would suggest you change to a service that does, or find some way to obtain space for your maps (mebbe another mapper here might help you out -- I would, but AOL gives me very little space for my own stuff).

Cdrom.com Stuff

#632 Posted by Fingers [206.63.254.99], 06/03/2001 22:54 GMT

If you get really desperate, you can always upload stuff at fileplanet... :>

Texture Scaling On Slanted Surfaces

#633 Posted by metlslime [140.142.172.150], 07/03/2001 06:41 GMT

texturing the slanted side of a triangle with these dimentions yields this scale factor for the slant:

1:1 -- 0.71
1:2 -- 0.87
1:3 -- 0.94
1:4 -- 0.97

these are basically the only angles i use regularly, so that's all i have. but the formula is pretty simple:

S = ((sqr(A^2 * B^2))/B)^-1

where S is the scaling factor, A is the shorter side of the triangle, and B is the longer side. (sqr means square root)

however toady has a good point -- 0.75 would make it easier to actually *align* the damn things.

#634 Posted by metlslime [140.142.172.150], 07/03/2001 06:53 GMT

mistyped that -- 0.87 should be 0.89.

#635 Posted by metlslime [140.142.172.150], 07/03/2001 07:02 GMT

just did some calculations:

2.00 1.75 1.50 1.25 1.00 0.75 0.50 0.25
--------------------------------------------------------
1:1 1.41 1.23 1.06 0.88 0.71 0.53 0.35 0.18
1:2 1.79 1.57 1.34 1.12 0.89 0.67 0.45 0.22
1:3 1.90 1.66 1.42 1.19 0.95 0.71 0.47 0.24
1:4 1.94 1.70 1.46 1.21 0.97 0.73 0.49 0.24

#636 Posted by metlslime [140.142.172.150], 07/03/2001 07:05 GMT

damn you qmap!!!!!!!!! DAAAAAAMN YOOOOOOUUUUUU!

0:1___2.00__1.75__1.50__1.25____1.00____0.75__0.50__0.25

1:1___1.41__1.23__1.06__0.88____0.71____0.53__0.35__0.18
1:2___1.79__1.57__1.34__1.12____0.89____0.67__0.45__0.22
1:3___1.90__1.66__1.42__1.19____0.95____0.71__0.47__0.24
1:4___1.94__1.70__1.46__1.21____0.97____0.73__0.49__0.24

#637 Posted by Biff_Debris [205.188.192.33], 07/03/2001 10:11 GMT

Why don't we just agree eith 0.75, met? You're getting a bit keyed up over this.

#638 Posted by Dr.Shoe [134.147.64.12], 07/03/2001 10:33 GMT , Refers to Post #632

HiHo!!

My maps (bsdm1 and bsdm2) will be reviewed at
MULTIPLAYERQUAKE!!!

Thank you!!

So long;
Dr.Shoe

#639 Posted by NotoriousRay [141.157.88.67], 07/03/2001 15:57 GMT

doing a map with some curves, i'm interested in these ratios, exactly what do the 1:2, 1:3, etc mean? could someone maybe show a pic or something?

/me confused

#640 Posted by GlassMan [195.184.253.80], 07/03/2001 16:33 GMT , Refers to Post #639

Have a look at this.
The ratios refer to the grid pattern the non-axial sides form.
eg. 2:1 is across 2, up 1
1:2 is across 1, up 2 etc.
This 12-sided circle is particularly good for keeping things on the grid at different scales. You can also turn that one slightly to give you 1:4, 3:3, 4:1 which has a pointy bit at the top rather than a flat bit.

#641 Posted by GlassMan [195.184.253.80], 07/03/2001 16:39 GMT , Refers to Post #640

From trial & error, the texture rotation ratios on those curves are 27 & 63. Is their a formula that would give you that? Metlslime?

#642 Posted by CZG [148.122.66.52], 07/03/2001 20:40 GMT

they are 26 and 64, at least as far as I have calculated figured 'em out...
tan-�(X/Y) or whatever...

#643 Posted by NotoriousRay [141.157.88.67], 07/03/2001 21:07 GMT

i still dont' follow this too much. seems to be too much math being thrown around to decypher a clear way to get the rotation of a texture on a given angle. is there a clear formula some is leaving out?

#644 Posted by GlassMan [195.184.224.77], 07/03/2001 21:22 GMT

27 & 63 definitely looks right

#645 Posted by CZG [148.122.66.52], 07/03/2001 21:25 GMT

so does 26 and 64.
The exact values are
26.5650511771
and
63.4349488229
or something in that manner...

#646 Posted by metlslime [140.142.169.190], 07/03/2001 23:27 GMT

Why don't we just agree with 0.75, met?

Why do we need to agree? use whatever value you want. I just posted a table of values to save everyone else some math. If you don't want to use them, don't.

As for the rotation values, i didn't have to calculate that, i just got them from CZG a while ago. But since you basically want one of the angles of a right triangle, i'd say arctan(X/Y) looks right.

#647 Posted by Biff_Debris [205.188.192.24], 07/03/2001 23:28 GMT

How the tex is rotated (IMO) also is concerned with the texture itself, how it plays out on the surface, and any effects I might try to go for with its position. Now in the situation of the arches I had in that screenie from imp1sp2, this sort of thing would probably come into play (using a continuous pattern, and creating a flush appearance), but I'd probably just go with 0.72, and leave it at that.

Who The Fuck Cares About Calculations?

#648 Posted by than [194.82.103.78], 08/03/2001 15:52 GMT

It's easy to just rotate stuff using the little up arrow things in wcs texture view until it looks right. Then you just remember the number. Not hard.

-than

#649 Posted by NotoriousRay [141.157.92.82], 08/03/2001 18:06 GMT

the scaling is also a factor

#650 Posted by kanaeda [207.67.87.176], 08/03/2001 18:20 GMT , Refers to Post #648

it really is somewhat of a case-by-case thing. values that might "look" right (and we all know that how it looks is what really counts) on one tex might look plain wrong with another tex.

on a side note, i've found that 63/27 tend to work with just about anything. either way, i've decided that particular angle is always going to produce slightly off texturing. it's unavoidable without floating-point precision.

Who Needs A Title Anyway

#651 Posted by zippie [213.17.88.43], 08/03/2001 21:14 GMT

thats why everyone should build everything solely out of curves :) ok and a few caulk brushes

#652 Posted by GrindSpire [62.7.92.5], 08/03/2001 22:40 GMT

* GrindSpire points out the lack of curves in Quake 1/2 to zippie

Or game other than Quake III Arena for that matter

* GrindSpire wonders why he didn't just put Q3A

Texture Problems

#653 Posted by Iain [208.181.205.10], 09/03/2001 05:39 GMT

I had a chance to look at my map INVEIN today. I'm beginning to wonder what I was thinking. Is it just me, or do white textures pretty much suck? It is so much harder to create a scary atmosphere. I'm in need of ideas or comments here.
You've seen the screen-shots, tell me what you think. If you havn't, they are right here => INVEIN SCREENS

Thanks in advance,
Iain <b/>

#654 Posted by palldjon [203.29.11.38], 09/03/2001 06:25 GMT , Refers to Post #653

No, white textures don't suck. "Scariness" comes from a combination of lighting, atmosphere, gameplay and theme.

I once walked around the Big W electric generation plant before it was open...mostly white...very scary. Even though we had to show a hundred different types of clearance to get into the joint, I still expected all sorts of nasties to "come" upon me during the tour.

Go for it!

#655 Posted by GrindSpire [213.122.7.161], 09/03/2001 07:29 GMT , Refers to Post #653

Try mixing in some stuff from the decon.wad, add some greys and blueish things from that and it would look cool. I think your main problem atm is not the colour of the textures but the fact that you are only using the one texture.

zippie Is Still Working On A Title

#656 Posted by zippie [130.161.137.49], 09/03/2001 07:39 GMT

grindy: no need to align textures on any game but q3a, all non-q3a games look ugly anyways :)

/me hides under a rock

#657 Posted by Speedy [194.105.199.193], 09/03/2001 12:45 GMT

/me kicks zippie, unpacks him and repacks with rar

#658 Posted by Speedy [194.105.199.138], 09/03/2001 12:49 GMT

I`v made a really curvy spiral in q1!
Looks awesome and very smooth

#659 Posted by The Lieutenant [144.32.128.132], 09/03/2001 18:25 GMT

The top right screenshot looks great...

... Speedy - how many polys though?

#660 Posted by metlslime [140.142.169.179], 09/03/2001 22:48 GMT

I don't think there is anything wrong with your texture set. Two suggestions:

1) Download and play Anonca Base 3.

2) Use eerie ambient sounds -- these really help. The sunniest day in the cheeriest garden can be spooky with the right soundtrack.

Screens look interesting, by the way.

Thanks To All For The Help

#661 Posted by Iain [208.181.205.10], 10/03/2001 05:20 GMT

Grindspire,
Where can I find this, decon.wad ?

Metlslime,
Is Anonca Base 3, a level for Quake1 ? If so, I haven't been able to find it either.

The white textures will remain... with some adustments.

PERSONAL: I may be in the stone age, but I never did finish Q2 (too

), and have yet to try Q3, although <grin> it looks pretty.

Iain <b/>

#662 Posted by GrindSpire [213.122.225.2], 11/03/2001 00:40 GMT , Refers to Post #661

That it is on Frib's site:

http://www.planetquake.com/frib/

If not try http://deconstruct.terrafusion.com/

#663 Posted by Biff_Debris [205.188.192.181], 11/03/2001 00:57 GMT , Refers to Post #660

I don't think there is anything wrong with your texture set.

Sounds like the beginning to The Outer Limits.

#664 Posted by metlslime [140.142.168.8], 11/03/2001 06:33 GMT

link to anonca base 3 on my website. I'd post a direct link but i have to get offline.

A Not Quake Related Question

#665 Posted by Grahf [209.145.70.125], 12/03/2001 03:54 GMT

Can anybody who has mapped for Unreal tell me which in package all the trees, shrubbery, and leaves textures are? Not I Unreal1.u I hope, as UCC export can't handle that...

#666 Posted by palldjon@uni [131.172.4.45], 13/03/2001 02:50 GMT

I've implemented about 3/4 of the suggestions my betaA testers made for my Q1SP level. I'm using WC1.6. Thought I'd run a quick build to check mechanisms and hunt down any holes.

Set the build to "no light" and "fast vis". Build completed and WC called up Quake. Quake loaded, went looking for the map and crashed with the following:

Error: missing frame O for +1_fall.

Need help...must release level...

Hack Your Wad

#667 Posted by Speedy [213.221.48.61], 13/03/2001 05:18 GMT , Refers to Post #666

and see the animated textures there, the first frame for them MUST be +0, not +1;
so in animating textures sequense just rename one of them into +0_fall,
btw, congrats on post #666 ;)

Palldjon...

#668 Posted by XeNoN [194.207.214.2], 13/03/2001 13:07 GMT

& make sure ALL the frames of the animation are in the wad.

#669 Posted by Scampie [205.243.60.13], 13/03/2001 17:21 GMT , Refers to Post #667

MY #666 post was better

http://www.qmap.org/qthread.php3?id=20000407155800&pos=665

<g0at>

#670 Posted by Lunaran [205.188.195.38], 14/03/2001 03:54 GMT

Why does the phrase "hack your wad" sound really gross to me?

<-- No-one Ever Uses This Icon So I Will

#671 Posted by GrindSpire [213.122.164.18], 14/03/2001 07:45 GMT , Refers to Post #670

Cos you have a perverted mind =)

"Hack Your Wad"?

#672 Posted by Johnny Latex [152.163.204.189], 14/03/2001 10:04 GMT , Refers to Post #670

Actually, I used that tag line in several of my *ahem* -- productions. Tried to turn it into a song, too, but oddly enough I couldn't get a label deal...

Champions One And All...

#673 Posted by palldjon [203.29.11.38], 15/03/2001 01:40 GMT , Refers to Post #667

Thanx Speedy and XeNoN. Will implement your suggestions this weekend. Can't get near my comp till then due to rehearsals for the current stage production. Will let you know what hacking my wad produced.

On an associated note. Can either of you recommend a .wad management tool? Since I've hit the stack overflow limit in WC I'm in real need.

Yep Scampie...

#674 Posted by palldjon [203.29.11.38], 15/03/2001 01:42 GMT , Refers to Post #669

For a general thread, your #666 post was unbeatable.

Texture Wad Management?

#675 Posted by Biff_Debris [152.163.204.189], 15/03/2001 02:20 GMT , Refers to Post #673

TexMex -- no question.

I've Heard Of It...

#676 Posted by palldjon [203.29.11.38], 15/03/2001 02:35 GMT , Refers to Post #675

available at ???

Texmex, Palldjon

#677 Posted by Fern [24.147.243.193], 15/03/2001 04:33 GMT , Refers to Post #676

www.planetwank.com/texmex

#678 Posted by Biff_Debris [152.163.195.183], 15/03/2001 04:42 GMT , Refers to Post #677

Good save, Fern. Sorry 'bout that, Palldjon.

#679 Posted by palldjon [203.29.11.38], 15/03/2001 04:59 GMT , Refers to Post #678

So, I'll find Texmex at PlanetWank and then I'll be able to hack my wad.

This is all getting a bit hard to swallow.

Thanks Fern, no big Biff.

#680 Posted by GrindSpire [213.1.188.175], 15/03/2001 07:21 GMT , Refers to Post #679

That is now two threads with dodgy cum jokes =)

Maxx Aggression Beta

#681 Posted by Dlord8 [65.65.175.57], 15/03/2001 18:19 GMT

I wanted to get your opinions on the boiler room(slime filled area with the mh). Is it to loud, and in need of being toned down. PLease comment.

screen shot 1
screen shot 2
screen shot 3
screen shot 4

Thanks for the input

#682 Posted by Biff_Debris [152.163.197.57], 15/03/2001 20:52 GMT , Refers to Post #681

You mean what's in the second screenie? Oh yeah, it's too busy -- like SalsaQuake! Those ceiling lights in the first shot are a bit too too, as well. A lot about lighting (and particularly colored lighting) is subtlety, so that when you do have something striking, it has more of an effect. Same goes for texture choices -- not too bland, but enough to provide a sense of place (yeah, I need to learn this one too).

The other shots look cool (nice architecture, especially), except for being a little bright.

Biff_Debris

#683 Posted by Dlord8 [65.65.175.57], 15/03/2001 21:13 GMT , Refers to Post #682

Thanks for the comments. I looked at the screens and the map isn't that bright on my dev quake install. That was done on my q3 play install. I'll change the brightness down a notch. I've added some trim in the hallways to offset that bland back and side walls. The boiler room is going to be reworked in the next couple of days.

I've been trying to get feedback on lighting. I think it's too dark, but the screenshots too bright. I want to be somewhere in between. Just want it to be medium for all users as possible with diff cards and settings.

Thanks again !

Lighting Suggestions

#684 Posted by kanaeda [207.67.87.176], 15/03/2001 22:13 GMT , Refers to Post #683

set your dev. machine to the defaul light settings. develop off of that. it's pretty much impossible to get it looking good on a real wide range of setups. i find that sticking to the defaults (what all the id maps were developed around) tends to produce the best results.

also, monitor settings can really throw you off. make sure that a black background in windows is really black on the monitor, not a faded gray color (brightness too high). white should be white, but not overly bright. something like a contrast of around 75-85% and a brightness around 50% should do nicely.

Brightness Monitor

#685 Posted by Dlord8 [24.167.9.139], 16/03/2001 00:02 GMT , Refers to Post #683

Yeah I found out my brightness was 1 tick above middle. That's why map was so bright. Got that fixed.

No Prob, Man.

#686 Posted by Biff_Debris [205.188.198.52], 16/03/2001 00:13 GMT , Refers to Post #683

Hope to see your map posted at LvL soon.

#687 Posted by Grahf [209.145.71.8], 16/03/2001 00:25 GMT

In terms of lighting, the fourth screenshot looks the best. Dynamic swathes of shadows, separated by bright overhead lighting, does generally look good in game. You might want to turn down the green-ness in screenshot two, as it clashes with the red in the tech wall texture.

Need Help About Q2 Animated Textures

#688 Posted by Jaj [62.83.5.91], 16/03/2001 01:03 GMT

Well, i have a problem with the animated textures of Quake2.
I type "map blah" (where blah is the map with the animated texture) and then quake2 gets frozen, then you know... some famous key combinatios and my pc is reinitiating (and me irritating ;) ).
I put in a brush face the first texture frame, +0texname.... quake2 crashed!

Then i put to the rest of the brush faces another tex, BUT one tex from the same place where the animated one is, for example if +0tex is in e1u1, i chose another tex from e1u1 too, anyway quake2 crashed again...

I thought it could be because my worldcraft configuration makes it take the textures from the folder .../textures/e1u1 instead from the .pak directly.... well, i changed this in Wc, so it take the texes from pak0.pak.... but as always quake2 crashed miserably...

When i was about hanging me, i had one final idea, aha!, maybe if i compile the map without lighting and it works then is all caused by the light program....deceived of me.... quake2 .....

I need help, what is happening?, am i forgetting something (as usual in me)?.... i thought i knew how to put an animated texture in Q2, but ...

P.D: Oh! i proved these too:
- Made a brush with the same number of faces as the animated tex had

- Put the +1texname frame instead of +0texname (i was desperated)
None of them worked of course

#689 Posted by palldjon [203.29.11.38], 16/03/2001 01:53 GMT , Refers to Post #680

#690 Posted by Biff_Debris [152.163.204.193], 16/03/2001 03:00 GMT , Refers to Post #688

Are you using a id animated tex for q2, or have you created your own? I was wanting to run a testmap to see what you were talking about, but I'm not sure.

Mapping Question

#691 Posted by sorrow [24.95.16.176], 16/03/2001 18:04 GMT

Um...for some reason I don't see the func_explosive in gtkradiant I need to create a wall that explodes when shot.

Thanks
sorrow[T7S]

Also I'm new to this but I have an idea for a mod, if a good programmer would like to hear about it, and has the time to commit. Feel free to e-mail me.

Func_Explosion

#692 Posted by Dlord8 [65.65.175.57], 16/03/2001 18:14 GMT , Refers to Post #691

Doesn't exist anymore

#693 Posted by sorrow [24.95.16.176], 16/03/2001 18:18 GMT , Refers to Post #692

So what do I do then? I need to be able to make blocks that explode.

sorrow[T7S]

#694 Posted by Fingers [206.63.254.99], 16/03/2001 18:22 GMT

..you switch to some other game than Q3 :P

Seriously Now

#695 Posted by sorrow [24.95.16.176], 16/03/2001 18:24 GMT , Refers to Post #694

there must be a way, I can't believe id would have taken that out.

):

sorrow[T7S]

^---starts digging through his rolodex looking for Carmacks number.

#696 Posted by kanaeda [207.67.87.176], 16/03/2001 18:29 GMT , Refers to Post #695

func_explosive was only good for one use, so it's somewhat pointless in a dm map. q3:a was a dm based game. all included entities are geared toward dm. all sp oriented entities were removed. no func_explosive... unless you want to start writing the code for it. sorry.

#697 Posted by sorrow [24.95.16.176], 16/03/2001 18:48 GMT

Do you know of any way to make a block go away? other then doors

#698 Posted by Biff_Debris [152.163.204.211], 16/03/2001 22:43 GMT , Refers to Post #697

Mebbe q3 has a func_wall, then? You can make it disappear by using a "killtarget" key (giving the wall the name "wall", and using that name as the killtarget to make the wall disappear).

#699 Posted by Jaj [62.175.104.196], 17/03/2001 00:26 GMT , Refers to Post #690

I'm using the original id textures

Something 1337

#700 Posted by CZG [148.122.66.36], 17/03/2001 21:23 GMT

Just discovered a cool trick in Q1, I'm sure you all know of it:

Make an info_notnull.
Target it by something.
Give it a key "use".
Give the "use" key a value of something that is called in the .QC, IE barrel_explode, which calls up an explosion.
When info_notnull is triggered, (used in QC terms) it executes it's self.use, and thus can do a variety of entertaining things.
I tried calling a teleport particle flash too, but that didn't work out too well sadly.

#701 Posted by CZG [148.122.66.36], 17/03/2001 22:05 GMT

Post 700!
Is that cool or what!

HOLY Shit!!

#702 Posted by DeFrag [207.227.185.40], 17/03/2001 23:08 GMT

I just really can't believe I got post #702. Damn that really is the best thing thats ever happened to me!! My mom says good things shall come my way now. CREAM!!

I wish everyone could understand my enthusiasm. I think I'll crouch in the background of ALL these threads just lying in wait to pounce on even-multiples of 100, 333, or 1000.

Hey Peej, if we ever see a Millionth post, what do we win!? hehe

bluh (no offense CZ I still luv ya ;)

Hmm, No Title

#703 Posted by Fern [172.167.172.4], 18/03/2001 00:46 GMT

When info_notnull is triggered i.e. when something targets it's targetname? (btw this is much better than shooting barrels with nails if it actually works :))

Still Having Probs?

#704 Posted by Biff_Debris [205.188.198.27], 18/03/2001 01:38 GMT , Refers to Post #699

I loaded the e1u1 tex for WC, and made a test map using the animated comp10_1 texture -- and only included the "+0" frame in the map, and it ran fine. I dunno what to tell you...

#705 Posted by Biff_Debris [205.188.198.27], 18/03/2001 01:39 GMT , Refers to Post #700

So we can trigger explosions and stuff? That'll be killer for sp maps.

#706 Posted by GrindSpire [213.122.223.99], 18/03/2001 11:00 GMT , Refers to Post #701

*Error* - "Ed_alloc: No Free Edits."

#707 Posted by XeNoN [212.126.135.141], 18/03/2001 12:33 GMT

Not really mapping related, but PLEASE can someone tell me how to increase the max no. of edicts in a Quake level! I tried playing on easy skill on several different Quake engines, but no can do; I get an error while playing hip1m3 (going up the mine shaft), and Quake crashes.

Please Can someone help?

There Is Only One Solution:

#708 Posted by CZG [148.122.66.36], 18/03/2001 16:02 GMT

Get a new exe!
Yes, I'm sorry, but the only way to increase max_edicts is to use a new exe.

#709 Posted by NotoriousRay [141.157.89.33], 18/03/2001 18:34 GMT

should have mentioned that to you guys....

#710 Posted by Jaj [62.83.27.205], 18/03/2001 19:48 GMT , Refers to Post #704

... sure i'm forgetting something, i'll keep on trying until it work :)

Who Needs A Title Anyway

#711 Posted by Grahf [209.145.71.87], 18/03/2001 19:51 GMT , Refers to Post #707

I think that glquake has more edicts than winquake, which has more edicts than dosquake, so that *may* help.

#712 Posted by Biff_Debris [205.188.198.32], 18/03/2001 20:12 GMT , Refers to Post #710

I can mail you the map file if you want.

If you're using WC, after I initially had it extract the texture folders from the paks, I selected e1u1 from the "treed" list it always gives when selecting .wal files. When it askes if it should add the subdirectories as seperate groups, I just put "no", and have never had any probs.

Unlit Models

#713 Posted by GlassMan [195.184.224.74], 18/03/2001 23:11 GMT

A quake monster or weapon spawning (either by 'falling' or teleporting) onto a func model appears to be unlit (at least in gl)..ie totally black. Is there a way round this or do I just need to avoid spawning monsters/weapons on lifts/trains/func_walls etc.?

Re: Unlit Models

#714 Posted by CZG [148.122.66.36], 18/03/2001 23:37 GMT

Just make sure the next level of solid ground under the platform is properly lit.

Look! I used the lightbulb icon for a lighting question!

Free Eddicts !

#715 Posted by Speedy [194.105.199.138], 19/03/2001 09:08 GMT

Now you can do alot of things !
1) Ask Tyrann to give you his proggie that removes static lights after compile
2) do that yourself mannually and recompile bsp -onlyents
3) you need qc patch that has some workarounds for this (like czg07stats by Radix - highly recommended for skill 2 for this map pack, get it at pq/sda); if you make map with modified qc do that yourself(or ask some coder)

Re: Free Eddicts !

#716 Posted by Tyrann [203.56.239.200], 19/03/2001 14:39 GMT , Refers to Post #715

1) Ask Tyrann to give you his proggie that removes static lights after compile

It's not quite that simple, it only helps in some cases. Only lights with targetnames count as edicts. The trick is that if you have multiple lights with the same targetname, then you can remove all but one of them once the lighting is done. You still need one so that the light style can be targeted.

It just happens that there is a map in OUM with around 300 lights that have the same targetname, so it's bloody essential for that map to even run =).

Neh Saved My Life...

#717 Posted by XeNoN [195.8.75.187], 19/03/2001 18:09 GMT

GLquake buggered it up in the first place, and TomazQuake wouldn't even run the map. Then I remembered Nehahra.exe. which worked fine.

But surely ritual would have noticed that before releasing a commercial product?! Anyone else have the same problem?

Who Needs A Title Anyway

#718 Posted by Fern [141.222.155.64], 19/03/2001 23:08 GMT

But surely ritual would have noticed that before releasing a commercial product?! Anyone else have the same problem?

Er, it runs fine for me using dos quake on skill 3. demos recorded on it don't play back though.

BTW. Hehehe

#719 Posted by Fern [141.222.155.64], 19/03/2001 23:09 GMT

Some of the hipnotic maps also have grey flashes and disappearing brush models due to high r_speeds. It was kinda funny when I discovered that :)

#720 Posted by Jaj [62.83.149.206], 20/03/2001 01:30 GMT , Refers to Post #712

Mail me your .map to see if i'm forgetting something, i don't think so but....
I've tried it again doing what you've commented.. and crashed again, then i deleted all e1u*, extracted again from the paks, and selected e1u1 putting "no" to that question, but i didn't work.
I have qbsp3, qvis3 and qrad3 into the folder ...worldcraft\q2tools\, i've compiled manually with the qbsp3 into the ...baseq2\maps\ folder but it didn't work.
If your .map doesn't reveal to me that i'm doing something wrong, well... i'll reinstall quake2 again and maybe worldcraft.
One last detail, i make some cinematics by me

, and put them instead the original ones, i did this to save some disk space, hehe, i think this may not affect to making maps with animated textures, but.. perhaps i'm wrong...

Thanks for all man!

#721 Posted by NotoriousRay [141.157.91.245], 20/03/2001 20:34 GMT

i compiled my q1 sp map today, and when i try to run it i get the error ALLOCBLOCK: FULL or something to that effect. it happens ONLY when i try to load my bsp (nothing to do with the modified qc, glquake, etc), i run glquake @ 1024x768, usually heapsize at 32megs

also, i get 2 degenerate plane errors when qbsping this sucker, anyway to track these/get rid of em? any chance they're whats causing the crash?

/me tries compiling again

ALLOCBLOCK:FULL

#722 Posted by Biff_Debris [152.163.204.187], 20/03/2001 23:04 GMT , Refers to Post #721

Is heapsize the same as Winmem? It's not, is it? I dunno the exact command (I do it thru QuakeOn), but try boosting winmem to 32 -- I think that's your prob, Ray.

#723 Posted by CZG [148.122.66.37], 20/03/2001 23:44 GMT

heapsize is the same as winmem, only in Kb instead of Mb

#724 Posted by Biff_Debris [205.188.198.171], 20/03/2001 23:57 GMT , Refers to Post #723

Is that what's causing Ray's problem?

Allocblock: Full & Degenerate Planes

#725 Posted by GlassMan [195.184.224.73], 21/03/2001 00:37 GMT

Something similar I had was cured (I think) by getting rid of some dodgy vertex-manipulated brushes. They may be causing both errors.

#726 Posted by NotoriousRay [141.157.92.236], 21/03/2001 03:22 GMT

see thats what i thought glassman (btw is your name after the DCI drum corps group? prolly not)... but i deleted my lame ass pseudo-terrain, reducing the map to what i've had built for over a month, and compiled, and it STILL gave the error.

just to check if it was the map file that got corrupted or something, i compiled a different .map file (a part of the sp map i decided to build separately for various reasons) and IT gave the error too. weird.

thing is, after realizing there was an invalid brush in my map, and seeing the error WARNING: COULD NOT BUILD BRUSH FACES, several times during qbsp without any progress, i control-c killed the prog, and afterwards is when the problems began. however a diff qbsp didn't help, even exporting to .map (from .rmf, this is worldcraft ya know) and didn't help.

think i'll reinstall wc, restart, and see what happens. regardless, this is PISSING me OFF.

btw, heapsize had no effect on the crash at all. not that i think it really would, it was only 2000 some brushes, no lights, a few doors, no monsters, plenty for the engine to handle.

#727 Posted by NotoriousRay [141.157.92.236], 21/03/2001 04:19 GMT

weirdest thing e v e r

reinstalled wc, loaded up my finale.map (the second file, separate from main .rmf), saved the .map as .rmf, exported the new .rmf to .map, compiled, worked.

tried the same for the sp.rmf/map. didn't work. damnit. restart (after glquake crashes and hangs for 34643747457567th time), load up wc, open older backup of sp files/compile/don't work. opened up newer version, saw a huge ass infinite plane in my .rmf file that i had never even saw before not to say it was there all along, that cannot be true. anways, it compiled. no idea what happened. bizarre.
weird things like this always seem to happen when i mess with doing decent looking terrain.

ugh.

its been a long day.and i've got a bad feeling the error will come back.
cheers to you guys for offering help though

Curved Cieling In A Curve...

#728 Posted by DaZ [213.1.178.215], 21/03/2001 18:23 GMT

Errr, ok this is probably the hardest thing to do in mapping... I have a curved cieling with three brushes on each side making up the curve and one in the center as the roof. So thats 7 brushes making up the entire curved cieling. Now I have to do a 90 degree turn with this cieling... In a smooth curve... ITS FUCKING EVIL! I swear I've seen other mappers do it so any tips would greatly help... Thanks

#729 Posted by XeNoN [212.126.141.168], 21/03/2001 19:26 GMT

ALLOCBLOCK:FULL

Uh, this is not particularly a small error that can easily be fixed. As far as I know it only happens in GlQuake (or other GL enhanced engines) when the map has heeeeowge areas where the player can see large distances in a straight line. "Source of Power" had this problem, and can only work in Win/Software Quake.

So i recommend adding alot more "visblocks" if this is the case. Anyhow, its due to an overall design flaw fo the map being too spacious (if not, then say so)

#730 Posted by XeNoN [212.126.141.168], 21/03/2001 19:29 GMT

Oh, and people, use daz's post as a reason not to give my beloved editor bad press (i can do that thing easy)!

Bwahahaha!!!

RE: Curved Ceiling...

#731 Posted by Jay [24.147.137.18], 21/03/2001 19:49 GMT

Make a "prefab" hallway segment and subtract a large brush from it at both ends at an angle of say 15'. Then just rotate copies of that segment into position...
The segment should look like..
  /-------\
/---------\

Now For My Question..

#732 Posted by Jay [24.147.137.18], 21/03/2001 19:52 GMT

Roughly speaking, what is the highest accpetable r_speeds value for Quake2. I don't care about software players.

#733 Posted by Tron [203.38.138.22], 21/03/2001 23:03 GMT

Jay: Then you are an evil evil man...

Daz: It's a bitch to make from scratch but on the qboard once headshot posted a link to a .map of his curved tunnel from bless to kill, have a look there if you want. If you can't find it I *might* have it at home and can upload it. I'm at school now tho.

Tron

#734 Posted by kanaeda [64.193.4.77], 21/03/2001 23:22 GMT , Refers to Post #732

the engine *will* show signs of stress once you break about 650 world polys.it usually only shows slight indications during actual dm gameplay at that point. i'm running a p3-450@504 (112 mhz FSB) w/ 256 mb of ram and a geforce ddr, and i can see it when the engine is getting overworked. sure, i might be picky but i don't like to see the framerate dip much at all. if it doesn't stay silky smooth at all times, then something is being stressed and it damn sure isn't the video card.

don't forget to keep an eye on your e_polys, too. it's real easy for those to get out of control and hinder performance just like overloading the world geometry.

now, more to the point... i'd shoot for a max ceiling of 600-650 in all areas where major combat will occur (stand in the middle of your rooms and look all over whie eyeing the r_speeds meter). do the same from the corners of the rooms and obscure angles and make sure they don't pop over around 800-850. keep within those limits and you're almost guaranteed to have a pretty fast running level.

#735 Posted by Biff_Debris [152.163.195.183], 21/03/2001 23:54 GMT , Refers to Post #734

Are you talking generally or for DM maps only?

Curved Ceiling

#736 Posted by Gilt [154.5.69.223], 22/03/2001 00:54 GMT

Pingu has his maps availible.

There are many ways to make them, but his way is probably the easiest. Plus once you realize how it's done it's pretty easy to customize it.

Weirdest Thing Ever

#737 Posted by Biff_Debris [205.188.192.156], 22/03/2001 00:59 GMT

I may have you beat, Ray: My map's been compiling with QBSP reporting a leak, and making a .pts file, but vis still runs!

That Woud Be Dm

#738 Posted by kanaeda [64.193.4.77], 22/03/2001 02:05 GMT , Refers to Post #735

when it comes to sp, i'd probly bump both of these ranges up by about 200 polys or so. maybe a max of 1k in the bad spots and avg. max of 650-800. that should keep things moving along pretty well.

That's What I Was Thinking

#739 Posted by Biff_Debris [205.188.192.152], 22/03/2001 02:40 GMT , Refers to Post #738

God knows id and the mission packs even blew those specs out of the water!

Actually Biff..

#740 Posted by NotoriousRay [141.157.91.250], 22/03/2001 04:43 GMT , Refers to Post #737

my files in question, when they were screwing up, were generating a .pts file AND a .prt file. however tyrlite and rvis crashed upon trying to execute, in addition to several COULD NOT CREATE BRUSH FACES errors

so nyah nyah nyah!

Dammit, Ray

#741 Posted by Biff_Debris [205.188.199.26], 22/03/2001 05:10 GMT , Refers to Post #740

You got me there. I know when I'm beat...

#742 Posted by Speedy [194.105.199.223], 22/03/2001 05:52 GMT

I dont get what you try to do exactly Daz (grin), but just scewl bushes. I dont recommend rotating as editor will go off grid and srew your structure even for 45 deg rotation, not to say some tricky agles, like 30.
And if you want to make really complex real-like curves from brushes you`d need to cut brushes to triangles like the 3degine would actualy do. Dont trust wc`s vertex manipulation.

Speedy Thought A Title Wasn't Needed

#743 Posted by Speedy [194.105.199.223], 22/03/2001 06:07 GMT , Refers to Post #742

sorry for typos...
and btw, you sure should take a look at pingu`s and czg`s .map files

#744 Posted by Eggman [151.202.209.150], 22/03/2001 17:19 GMT , Refers to Post #728

Here I recreated what you asked for in a .map file using convex brushes.

http://www.planetquake.com/johnny/curvycurve.map.zip

Just axe off the .zip on the file, in case that wasn't evident enough.

I've Got Another One

#745 Posted by Biff_Debris [205.188.192.162], 22/03/2001 18:15 GMT , Refers to Post #740

In my map, I can put a monster in an area(correctly, within the space), and -- no matter what it is -- it won't show up in the map when compiled!

#746 Posted by Eggman [151.202.209.150], 22/03/2001 23:31 GMT

I don't know if you got the file before PQ changed my domain but if not here is the file.

File

#747 Posted by Biff_Debris [205.188.199.187], 22/03/2001 23:36 GMT

I put a baddie that already was working in the Bad Place, and all was fine again. I have no idea why, but hey -- it works now.

#748 Posted by Grahf [209.145.70.148], 23/03/2001 02:18 GMT

Base the ceiling off of the standard 0:2 2:4 4:2 2:0 12 sided cylinder, and chop the bottom off. There is a way to make those tubes twistand turn very nicely, but I don't quite understand it. A while back, CZG posted a prefab here to show how it's done. If you don't have it, I posted links to my mirror of the files in the "Mapping Maths" thread yesterday. I guess it is done by skewing...

Question About Importing Files

#749 Posted by Christopher [138.129.19.173], 23/03/2001 03:10 GMT

I am hoping one of you guys might be able able to help me out. I am very new at this, so have a little patience. I am wondering if there is a way to import 3DStudio or .dxf/.dwg files into a level editor. I am interested in constructing a level out of a building that I created. Is there any chance of this? -Thanks

Skins & Mdls

#750 Posted by GlassMan [195.184.253.80], 23/03/2001 13:00 GMT

How do you get more than one skin into an mdl? Is there a special utility needed? I'm using Meddle but it doesn't seem to have a facility for this.

#751 Posted by DaZ [213.122.183.213], 23/03/2001 18:56 GMT

Didn't think I'd get that much feedback! Cheers...

yeah CZG's curve examples helped a lot and I've fixed the offending brushes now

On with the map!

#752 Posted by Speedy [194.105.199.145], 24/03/2001 08:16 GMT

get QME
http://www.quakemods.net/ftp/unsupported/quake/editors/qme30.zip

I Use Quark

#753 Posted by Fat Controller [203.96.111.200], 24/03/2001 09:17 GMT , Refers to Post #750

In Quark it's fairly easy to add skins to a model: just right-click in the window showing little thumbnails of skins and select the load option :)

It may be here but I can't 'member.

Door Without A Sound?

#754 Posted by Hanz [193.229.72.75], 24/03/2001 09:31 GMT

Is it possible to make a door without a sound? I tried putting "sounds" "9". Then the door is completely silent but quake throws some error message on top of the screen about not finding the sound effect..

#755 Posted by Speedy [194.105.199.202], 24/03/2001 12:53 GMT

It is possible
just dont use any "sounds"
not all editors allo that tho

#756 Posted by XeNoN [195.8.76.68], 24/03/2001 14:33 GMT

Value: "0" works as well, suprisingly

Thanks. And Another Question..

#757 Posted by Hanz [193.229.72.75], 24/03/2001 17:34 GMT

Yea thanks I got it working (geetz what a surprise

).

But is it possible to make a rising/lowering water level in Quake? I tried making a door entity out of a water brush, but the water became solid

Moving Water In Q1 Is:

#758 Posted by CZG [195.204.46.8], 24/03/2001 17:35 GMT

Impossible.

You may choose to make your entire level a func_door and lower it into a tank of water, but that is evil.

#759 Posted by Hanz [193.229.72.75], 24/03/2001 18:29 GMT

Yea, I tried that already and it's very evil yeah

. I was just thinking if there would be a less speed-intensive way to do it but apparently there isn't

#760 Posted by Hanz [193.229.72.75], 24/03/2001 18:57 GMT

When I make another door entity inside that huge "whole-map"-door, then neither of the doors work correctly. Maybe Quake thinks they're both the same door since the other is inside the other, dunno.

*sigh* I really wanted to do a map with rising water level..

You Caould Always Use Quake2

#761 Posted by XeNoN [212.126.135.167], 24/03/2001 20:42 GMT

Quake 2 Is Not An Option!

#762 Posted by Hanz [193.229.72.75], 24/03/2001 21:53 GMT

the monsters and weapons suck

Who Needs A Title Anyway

#763 Posted by Speedy [194.105.199.136], 25/03/2001 04:58 GMT

if 2 doors touch quake thinks they are one and operate as unit.
Use func_train/plat for 1 instead

Eggman: your file seems to be b0rked

#764 Posted by Asriel [203.96.152.184], 25/03/2001 05:52 GMT

Where can i get the hipnotic ents?
Or jsut some code for rotating brushes and 'advanced' trains etc ?

**
Also, i have an animated texture, that doesnt animate.. I have put the +0"name" on the brush, but it doesnt animte..

How can i get WC to do this?

#765 Posted by Fat Controller [203.96.111.202], 25/03/2001 06:05 GMT

Remind me to upload my copy of the CUSTENTS file as apparently, from what I can tell, Ol' "watrench" Glaive is abandoned by Telefragged.com.

I'll do that l8r when Im sober, I hope

#766 Posted by Asriel [203.96.152.184], 25/03/2001 06:09 GMT

Hooray, thanks Mr Fatty

Func_doors Touching

#767 Posted by metlslime [140.142.172.22], 25/03/2001 06:33 GMT

i think you can set a spawnflag that is "dont link doors" and i think that spawnflag is 4.

#768 Posted by Hanz [193.229.72.75], 25/03/2001 11:13 GMT

That "dont link" worked perfectly. Thanks

#769 Posted by Biff_Debris [205.188.198.49], 25/03/2001 11:23 GMT , Refers to Post #764

As per the animated tex prob, you need to have all the "frame" tex of the animation somewhere on the map for it to work. Just make a cube somewhere outside the world with the other frames on it, and it should work fine.

#770 Posted by Asriel [203.96.152.184], 26/03/2001 09:12 GMT , Refers to Post #769

Thanks heaps Biff

#771 Posted by Biff_Debris [152.163.197.62], 26/03/2001 10:08 GMT , Refers to Post #770

Where To Get Ogro Textures?

#772 Posted by Hanz [193.229.72.75], 27/03/2001 16:15 GMT

I know http://www.planetquake.com/pandemonium/
but both planetquake mirrors for ogropak.zip are broken :(

Also, where to get the excellent textures GlassMan used in his recent map? Those were from Xatrix's Quake 2 mission pack.

Q2MP1 Textures

#773 Posted by metlslime [140.142.170.139], 27/03/2001 16:39 GMT

Also, where to get the excellent textures GlassMan used in his recent map? Those were from Xatrix's Quake 2 mission pack.

I think CompUSA/Electronics Boutique/Babbages have them still

N/m About The Ogropak

#774 Posted by Hanz [193.229.72.75], 27/03/2001 17:03 GMT

I found ogro textures from here:
http://www.planetquake.com/fatty/default.asp?file=ogro

metlslime, are you suggesting I should buy it? Because that ain't gonna happen

#775 Posted by huF [212.108.194.245], 27/03/2001 21:15 GMT

can ne1 tell me how to make a ladder in quake 1 (ONE) (not 2 or 3)?
OR
alternatively you could direct me to a site where i can find the info
AND
dont tell me to use a clip whatever, cause i have NO clue what that is
thx

That's Exactly It.

#776 Posted by kanaeda [207.67.87.176], 27/03/2001 21:21 GMT , Refers to Post #774

if you want the textures, then you should purchase the mission pack (which is damn good stuff). it's that simple really.

#777 Posted by Hanz [193.229.72.75], 27/03/2001 22:08 GMT

At least 'The Pit' had ladders that were made just by putting the brushes _almost_ vertically. So they were actually stairs but with very narrow steps.

You could also use wind system like in the 'Wind Tunnels'. Dunno if it would work well though.

kanaeda I'm so damn stingy (I hope that's the right word) that I'm gonna rip those textures from glassman's map and just ask his permission. Hahaha

Xatrix Tex (xxx?)

#778 Posted by Biff_Debris [205.188.198.34], 27/03/2001 23:45 GMT

Them boys did some killer texture work (Q2 mission pack and Kingpin). Aren't they Human Head (and doing the new Wolf) now?

#779 Posted by metlslime [140.142.169.53], 28/03/2001 00:22 GMT

Use a clip whatever.

#780 Posted by Fern [141.222.155.64], 28/03/2001 00:39 GMT

the pit and the wind tunnels both had bad ladders. A real ladder is just a visual of a ladder and a small staircase of clip brushes with something like 16 units height difference and one unit length and width difference.

Now This Is A Stupid Question:

#781 Posted by Hanz [193.229.72.75], 28/03/2001 00:57 GMT

How to make a clip brush in Worldcraft?

And Kingpin indeed had great textures. It's the best looking iD engine game I've ever seen (yeah I've seen Q3A!). Dunno about Human Head name but yup they're working on the new Wolf.

#782 Posted by Fern [141.222.155.64], 28/03/2001 01:17 GMT

make a brush with the clip texture. that's all. it works just like any other brush except it's invisible and you can shoot through it :)

#783 Posted by Hanz [193.229.72.75], 28/03/2001 16:29 GMT

Thanks, I actually didn't realize earlier that the texture properties only depend on the texture name..

#784 Posted by Speedy [194.105.199.173], 29/03/2001 05:23 GMT

��... ��...

...��?

#785 Posted by Hanz [193.229.72.75], 29/03/2001 07:22 GMT

You certainly seem to need help, and I'm quite sure you don't need mapping help but psycological or writing help

Not Human Head...

#786 Posted by kanaeda [207.67.87.176], 29/03/2001 18:49 GMT , Refers to Post #778

Grey Matter. and yeah, they're doing the new wolfy game.

They're Gonna Have A Tough Time

#787 Posted by Biff_Debris [152.163.197.61], 29/03/2001 19:05 GMT , Refers to Post #786

Doing a better job than the Metal of Honor guys -- the screenies I've seen of it look like photographs from that "real life" game =P

Altho, I'd guess the Wolfie team would be prone to have more of a fantastic take on things.

Metal Of Honor

#788 Posted by Speedy [194.105.199.179], 30/03/2001 05:36 GMT

is boring realism, castlewolf is surreal/horror thats why it`s cooler

Janus Syndrome Release

#789 Posted by Dlord8 [65.65.175.57], 30/03/2001 22:07 GMT

Hi guys and Gals,

Just wanted to let you know Anwulf has released hi new level The Janus Syndrome. You can download it from our web site Click here for more...

Janus Syndrome Release

#790 Posted by Dlord8 [65.65.175.57], 30/03/2001 22:09 GMT , Refers to Post #789

Sorry set the web address wrong.

Here is the correct one. Teamhuh.com

#791 Posted by Hanz [193.229.72.75], 30/03/2001 22:33 GMT , Refers to Post #790

You also have the wrong thread, this one is called "Mapping Help"

Heh, I Needed A Laugh

#792 Posted by Fern [141.222.155.64], 31/03/2001 23:31 GMT

dont tell me to use a clip whatever, cause i have NO clue what that is
thx

I just saw that in huf's post. heh. LEARN WHAT THE FUCK IT IS!!

24 | 32 Bit Texes: Am I Wrong Or Not?

#793 Posted by Jaj [62.83.19.22], 01/04/2001 00:05 GMT

I've been experimenting a little with the TomazQuake engine using some TGA textures and the result is really good, but i have a dude, or not exactly that, better i need a confirmation of what i'm going to say :) :

I think that if you use 32 bits tga textures or 24 bit ones, the result for your eyes when you load the map it's the same, the human eye can't distinguish more than 24 bits (aprox. 16.000.000 colors).
So i think the 32 bits textures should be only used when it's needed the alpha channel for the transparencies (crystals, water etc...).
Well, then: 32 bit textures must be used for transparent stuff the map has, and the rest must be 24 bit, is that correct or not?

#794 Posted by Asriel [203.96.152.184], 01/04/2001 01:51 GMT

Did anyone else get the custents FGD file in the custents zip that Fatty provided?

#795 Posted by Fat Controller [203.96.111.201], 01/04/2001 07:33 GMT , Refers to Post #794

I can't even remember if there was one in there. I just converted the damned thing from RAR to ZIP format.

Don't tell me, I fucked up again, right?

32bit = Alpha Channel

#796 Posted by Grahf [209.145.70.174], 02/04/2001 02:18 GMT , Refers to Post #793

If you save a TGA as 32 bit, but don't give it an alpha channel, you will usually end up with either an all black or all white alpha channel. As far as I know, TomazQuake has little use for alpha channels, so you're just bloating the file with 32 bit. (unless of course Tomaz adds SimpleShade support into the next version, or something)

Other than that, picture quality is the same.

#797 Posted by Asriel [203.96.152.184], 02/04/2001 04:20 GMT , Refers to Post #794

If you just converted it, then im sure its not your fault.

Oh well

#798 Posted by Speedy [194.105.199.242], 02/04/2001 05:46 GMT

No quake port uses alpha afaik, so you`d better convert to non alpha. And use independent palette pcx - they take much less space.
Jpeg textures are suppoted by some engines aswell (hope JPG loading will be in all ports soon)

QOOLE V097 &0.99 (quake 1)

#799 Posted by Basilisk5 [62.7.40.94], 02/04/2001 21:20 GMT

Does anyone use Qoole? and if so can someone give me some pointers as of how to make something rotate, like in "scourge of armagon" mission pack. i am new to the world of editing, so im fairly lame at this :|

About Textures, Alpha Channel, Formats..

#800 Posted by Jaj [62.83.140.16], 02/04/2001 23:15 GMT

Grahf: Aha!... :) it's what i thought, 32 bit is the same quality as 24... thanks

And thanks Speedy for mentioning the use of .pcx and .jpg formats, i forgot experimenting with those formats ... i've proved them and tomazquake reads both, even the jpg!! :)

Basiliskus Vulgaris Rex

#801 Posted by CZG [148.122.66.37], 02/04/2001 23:47 GMT , Refers to Post #799

Well, to make stuff rotate, you need the Scourge of Armagon entity set. (Read: The Scourge of Armagon progs.dat)
To get the stuff to appear in your map, requires a pretty fucking very complex setup of many awful entities that never should have been invented, it requires you to have some pretty bloody decent good compilers, and quite a good deal of luck.
You may read this to be slightly enlightened though, if you want to give it a shot.

Q2 Engine Maps

#802 Posted by Tronyn(acc2) [142.165.70.20], 03/04/2001 04:25 GMT

I've got several Q2 engine maps that've been sitting idle on my system for several months. Three of them are very large and I cannot compile them. If someone could do me the favour of compiling them, I would be greatly indebted to that individual!

How To Light An Outside Area?

#803 Posted by Hanz [193.229.72.75], 03/04/2001 14:46 GMT

Quake 1 doesn't have surface lights so how do I make a directional ambient light to outside areas? I really wouldn't like to bother adding 100+ small lights..

Hanzi My Boy...

#804 Posted by CZG [130.67.143.49], 03/04/2001 15:04 GMT , Refers to Post #803

You simply use Tyranns delicious little light proggie called Tyrlite, which will let you cast some pretty nifty sunlight just about anywhere!

#805 Posted by DaZ [213.122.241.18], 03/04/2001 19:45 GMT , Refers to Post #796

has support for alpha channels and simple shader effects a.k.a Q3. The list of stuff you can use is a little limited atm but you can create some very cool effects using a combo of alpha channels and moving textures...

/pimp

Hmm, No Title

#806 Posted by Grahf [209.145.68.85], 04/04/2001 12:11 GMT

oh yeah? Interesting. If anyone has a Mac they should check out p0x's eQuake (www.pq.com/paroxysm), it owns.

#807 Posted by Hanz [193.229.255.17], 04/04/2001 15:14 GMT

Now i feel dumb of using dozens of lights to do the job.. quite improperly even.. I just hope fileplanet servers were less crowded and I could actually download the program

#808 Posted by Asriel [203.98.21.44], 05/04/2001 09:06 GMT

You will probably use more than a dozen lights to get your walls the same lightness as your 'sky'. Iv found that Tyraans wicked light proggy doesnt light the walls very well.

#809 Posted by Fern [141.222.155.64], 05/04/2001 14:01 GMT

No it doesn't light the walls at all when the light is pointing straight down

ARRGG Worldcraft 1.6a 3d View Sux00rs

#810 Posted by Hanz [193.229.255.17], 05/04/2001 15:04 GMT

At least 50% of times when I try to pick an object or surface from the 3d view, it picks a totally wrong object. Sometimes the object it picks is not even in the view frustum! Then I have to move the view around so that I can select the object I want.

It's really annoying, is there anything I can do to fix this? I have Geforce DDR so I use OpenGL acceleration for the 3d view.

Or is texturing made better in some other editor?

#811 Posted by Biff_Debris [152.163.204.193], 05/04/2001 19:52 GMT , Refers to Post #810

The only time I've ever had that prob was when brushes were overlapping, or otherwise occupying the same place. Dunno what else would cause it.

#812 Posted by Fern [141.222.155.64], 05/04/2001 20:10 GMT

Are you using the wireframe view? maybe 3-d or textured would be a better idea if you plan on doing hardcore 3d polygon selection :)

SPX (to Daz)

#813 Posted by than [62.64.191.122], 05/04/2001 22:16 GMT

since the hipnotic rotate entities are so gay, why don't you change the code of them for SPX so they are easier to implement and don't require so much other crap to get them to work right? Twould be very nice :)

-than

#814 Posted by Edgecrusher [63.22.128.237], 05/04/2001 23:12 GMT , Refers to Post #802

i'll try to compile your maps if you e-mail them to me. No promises on whether i could complie them though, i don't know how long it would take on my computer.

Biff & Fern

#815 Posted by Hanz [193.229.255.17], 06/04/2001 00:00 GMT

Biff: For me it happens everywhere, not just with overlapping brushes

Fern: I use 3-d solid textured mode of course

But darn, seems like I'm the only one having this problem then :(

You Are Not Alone...

#816 Posted by palldjon [203.29.11.8], 06/04/2001 02:17 GMT , Refers to Post #815

happens to me when the brush count for the level exceeds 1500. My sys looks like a pocket calculator wrt yours so as you can imagine I've got round the problem by developing vast resources of patience.

Sounds Goof Than

#817 Posted by DaZ [213.1.140.114], 06/04/2001 02:33 GMT , Refers to Post #813

Those nitpotyic entities are gh3y in the xtreme...

Speedy Thought A Title Wasn't Needed

#818 Posted by Speedy [194.105.199.228], 06/04/2001 05:24 GMT

oooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo

Rotating Stuff

#819 Posted by arbo [155.101.79.49], 06/04/2001 06:04 GMT

Anybody know a good way to rotate objects like crates and stuff easier? i am getting agitated spending 5 minutes rotating and realigning brush faces, just to have a crate or block sitting at an angle. any suggestions would be highly appreciated.. i use worldcraft 1.6, btw

#820 Posted by Biff_Debris [152.163.204.207], 06/04/2001 09:11 GMT , Refers to Post #819

As far as I know, that's what you've gotta do -- typically you have to rescale the tex, too. It can be a bitch, but it looks cool -- and that's what it's all about (hokey "thumbs up").

#821 Posted by GlassMan [195.184.253.80], 06/04/2001 11:47 GMT , Refers to Post #819

I wouldn't use rotate apart from for 90deg turns. Brushes tend to go off the grid if you use odd angles. Make the brush bigger than you want & then clip its sides to be paralell at the angle you want. You will still need to mess with the texture scale/alignment however.

Grahf Thought A Title Wasn't Needed

#822 Posted by Grahf [209.145.68.212], 06/04/2001 14:10 GMT

In some editors (radiant especially), you can lock the texture for moves and rotations. It will look great, however sometimes the texture alignment will get totally fux0red and use junk values.

Aligning textures on an object that will rotate ingame is probably even tougher though. ;)

#823 Posted by CZG [195.204.54.170], 06/04/2001 18:21 GMT

Try turning the 3D acceleration in WC off. I wouldn't trust that thing with a shotgun to my head. Not that I'd trust anyone with a shotgun to my head, but you get the idea.

And any serious improvement to the hiprots would be difficult to do. The main thing you'd want to get rid of are the func_movewalls, which would require engine hax0ring, the texture alignment problems which would require compiler hax0ring, and the general setup of the stuff, which... hell! That stuff ain't worth fixing! Only way to do it better would be with origin brushes, but that requires compiler/engine Hax0ring too.
Come to think of it, you could specify the origin of the object with a vector from some secret location that you can figure out, like the trains sorta do...
Whatevah'

Cutting Into Water

#824 Posted by The Cream Enjin [195.92.67.72], 07/04/2001 08:29 GMT

I have a pool of water and a square brush cut out of the middle.

How do i stop the lines appearing where the water brushes touch each other?

Czg, That's Very Slow...

#825 Posted by Hanz [193.229.255.17], 07/04/2001 08:52 GMT

but it works. Even though I have athlon 700, the software view is incredibly slow. Maybe I should switch to 640x480 resolution when editing :D

#826 Posted by GlassMan [62.7.249.6], 07/04/2001 09:05 GMT , Refers to Post #824

a) Are you sure you need to cut a square out of the middle? Don't cut a square just to accomodate another brush..have them overlap.

b) If you do put the nodraw texture on the touching sides

#827 Posted by Biff_Debris [205.188.198.56], 07/04/2001 09:06 GMT , Refers to Post #824

You'd need to get your water tex all aligned to the same points (0, 0 -- mebbe).

Damn Q1 Mappers!

#828 Posted by GrindSpire [213.122.24.236], 07/04/2001 09:10 GMT , Refers to Post #824

Can't answer an easy Q3 question =)

Just use the nodraw texure on the sides that touch another water brush (on both brushes). There, easy.

Damned Q3 Mapper!

#829 Posted by Biff_Debris [152.163.204.191], 07/04/2001 09:54 GMT , Refers to Post #828

When will you realize that fad is over?

GRRRRREEAAT

#830 Posted by The Cream Enjin [195.92.67.71], 07/04/2001 12:26 GMT

Thanx guys! superb response. I love this place:-)
saves me combing through all those tuts.

Rotating Brushes...

#831 Posted by necros [172.130.240.69], 07/04/2001 18:55 GMT

ok, ok, i'm sure you've all heard it before, but here it is again.

How the hell do you get Rotating Brushes to display properly in the game?

I have the progs.dat file,

i use TXQBSP.exe v0.6,
rvis.exe and arghlite.exe v2.0 to compile, and yet, when ever the brushes rotate, the flicker between visible and invisible.
What the hell am i doing wrong??? >=O

#832 Posted by CZG [195.204.54.181], 07/04/2001 19:05 GMT

Basicly all could be wrong. The compilers might be fucking up, you might not have the latest version of the exe, your vis has gone awry some way, lots of stuff to annoy you with. Just try switching various things you do and see if anything causes any improvements.
That's the best advice I can give you.

!error Message!

#833 Posted by mute [193.180.245.90], 07/04/2001 22:07 GMT

ive built a q1 map and it compilse without problems[bsp/light/vis] but when i try too run it in quake, quake crashes.
When i try too run it in qwsv i can see it writing out an error message before qwsv crashes but im unable too read the error message because the window closes as qwsc crashes....
Anyone know of a trick too get at this error message so i can do anything about it?
Has anyone ever had the same problem and therefore know of a possible reason for this?
All help greatly appreciated.
/mute

I Will Be Mute

#834 Posted by CZG [195.204.54.65], 08/04/2001 06:32 GMT , Refers to Post #833

I'm not sure, but isn't there an option in the properties for the program/batchfile/shortcut you're running to not close the window when done? Try disabeling/enabeling that and see how it goes.

#835 Posted by Mr Fribbles [61.9.192.142], 08/04/2001 06:49 GMT

quake.exe -condebug

(or whatever you're using, you can do it on qwsv or qwcl too)

dumps the output of the console to qconsole.log file, which you can open in a text editor and read.

What I Know

#836 Posted by Fat Controller [203.96.111.201], 08/04/2001 09:45 GMT , Refers to Post #831

1. You MUST ALWAYS compile the whole level, even for the piddliest of changes, otherwise your rotating gongleheimers spin around the origin.

2. If the center of rotation for the thing isn't dead center of the rotate_object entity, it'll rattle and flicker. Found that out the hard way.

3. Make sure your BSP and light programs handle rotating stuff. Some don't. (Again, found this out the hard way. It's quite a sight to see a pair of door slowly rotate into invisibility!)

See Thru Skybox

#837 Posted by The Cream Enjin [195.92.67.69], 08/04/2001 10:44 GMT

I have part of a map that is surrounded by a sky box, but when playing i can see another part of the map through the skybox (the skybox texture disapears and only re-apears when i move close to it).
What can i do to fix this anoying bug?

#838 Posted by CZG [195.204.54.40], 08/04/2001 11:23 GMT

I duno about Q3, but from what I remember of Q2, skyboxes are drawn behind everything else so that if the vis can see another part of your level through a skybox, that will be drawn on top of it. Block out your vis so that that particular area isn't visible from the area with the skybox, and it should go away.

Grahf Is Still Working On A Title

#839 Posted by Grahf [199.106.218.6], 08/04/2001 12:48 GMT

Wow, lotta new faces around here...

#840 Posted by GrindSpire [213.122.122.70], 08/04/2001 12:54 GMT , Refers to Post #839

That has gotta be a good thing

Thanks For The Help, Now What?

#841 Posted by mute [193.180.245.90], 08/04/2001 13:56 GMT

After CZG's and Mr Fribbles kind words, qwsv finally talked too me. Too little RAM it said. Try heapsize 16000 was its kind reply.
Only problem was i was already running at -heapsize 24000 so i upped it to -heapsize 64000 and voil�! a mere 8 minutes later, qwsv finally loaded the map telling me the REAL problem this time...
Average leafs visible/hearable/total : 8361/8361/8362

This is (at least for me..) an unheard of amount, even for a big map. Any way, other than a complete rebuild, too get this down to an acceptable level? The map is an unsolicited conversion of a q2 Ctf classic and as you might guess pretty large.
As always, any help whatsoever is greatly appreciated.
/mute

#842 Posted by GrindSpire [213.122.122.70], 08/04/2001 14:13 GMT , Refers to Post #841

You did VIS it didn't you?

#843 Posted by mute [193.180.245.90], 08/04/2001 14:29 GMT

could a moderator please destroy my post #841
so that people wont have too read it?
Of course its never run vis cuz it didnt find a .prt file.
Thanx GrindSpire for being so civil about this.
Big excuses.Sorry.

No .prt File...

#844 Posted by DaZ [213.1.63.55], 08/04/2001 14:59 GMT

Means the map has a leak in it...

Load up the map and type "pointfile" into the console then look around the map, you should see a lot of white and black particles in lines *somewhere*, follow this line and it will show you where there is a gap in the level...

Pop back into WC (or whatever you use) and fix it

#845 Posted by Fern [141.222.155.64], 08/04/2001 16:40 GMT

was that a limerick? :)

#846 Posted by The Cream Enjin [195.92.67.68], 08/04/2001 16:47 GMT , Refers to Post #837

I can still see thru my skybox i tried putting hint brushes between and area portals,

this is starting to suck:(

You May Just Have To Rebuild It.

#847 Posted by pjw [24.4.254.112], 08/04/2001 18:15 GMT , Refers to Post #846

Or at least redesign that area in a pretty drastic way. I fought this problem at one point on my current map, even going so far as to try multiple layers of caulk wall with void in between them between the two sections of sky/map, and the sky was still see-through. I suspect this is just a limitation of the engine--sky will be able to see through to sky, period. I finally just resorted to a big stone wall to replace the bit of sky that wasn't being cooperative.

(If someone has another solution to this problem, I'd love to hear it.)

#848 Posted by The Cream Enjin [195.92.67.69], 08/04/2001 18:23 GMT , Refers to Post #846

Thanks anyway...

Seeing Rooms In The Sky...

#849 Posted by metlslime [140.142.169.130], 08/04/2001 18:51 GMT

this is just the way the engine works. it draws the sky, then all polygons in the PVS, back to front. So if that other room is in the PVS, it will get drawn on top of the sky.

Of course, if there's a room up there, doesn't that mean that if the player looks up, he should see the outside of the structure which contains the room? Building spacially coherent maps is probably the real solution to this error.

Radiant Wont Launch

#850 Posted by steve [213.1.63.234], 08/04/2001 20:56 GMT

hi all,

i've decided to get into mapping but my career has not even got off the ground yet.

i've downloaded radiant 201, 202, and gtk, but none of them want to even launch on my system.

i get two error messages (not at once, they seem to take it in turns):

1) 3dfxogl.dll error
2) radiant.exe error

i have tried:

1) removing glsetup altogether
2) trying different drivers for my graphics card (voodoo 5500)

i've been on this now for three days leaving messages on boarsd all over, but no joy yet. here's hoping...

#851 Posted by Biff_Debris [152.163.204.214], 08/04/2001 22:01 GMT , Refers to Post #845

I think it was haiku...

#852 Posted by Biff_Debris [152.163.204.214], 08/04/2001 22:06 GMT , Refers to Post #850

Screw Radiant, man. Get Worldcraft -- come away from the Dark Side ;P

#853 Posted by mute [193.180.245.90], 08/04/2001 22:37 GMT , Refers to Post #851

I used quark this time, cuz it has a function
That editor check verifies my presumption
there are no holes.
nor cracks sized like poles
but my map still reeks of corruption

existant holes fixed
creating pointfile even though
containing nothing

i open my inner eye too see
searching the web with a cup of tea
squeeking like a frog
i found a little prog
that makes dot-prt out of bsp

rvis, admitting file
slowly, processor grinding teeth
time moving slow
/mute

That Was Beautiful, Mute

#854 Posted by Biff_Debris [152.163.197.64], 09/04/2001 00:25 GMT , Refers to Post #853

/me feels like the inside of a freshly-baked "special" brownie

#855 Posted by palldjon [203.29.11.8], 09/04/2001 01:25 GMT , Refers to Post #853

Mute & ~mute

cute.

Leak Finding Can Be Brutal, Mute

#856 Posted by Grahf [209.145.71.127], 09/04/2001 04:03 GMT

I have a map sitting around, which, while I am 99% positive it has no actual holes, and qbsp gives no leak error, it still runs a FillOutside and makes no prt. maybe I should try that bsp2prt thingy...

Nice poetry there... we need Quake haiku, not limericks!

Quake Dm Map

#857 Posted by GlassMan [195.184.253.80], 09/04/2001 13:50 GMT

I have a quake dm map in a kind of 'alpha' state which, having little experience of dm mapping, I'm not sure if its worth the effort to finish.

If a couple of experienced quake dm players and/or mappers have the time to have a quick look at it please mail me.

Thank you.

#858 Posted by GrindSpire [213.122.37.15], 09/04/2001 15:36 GMT , Refers to Post #857

I'll have a look at it (I've emailed you as well btw).

#859 Posted by Speedy [213.158.1.27], 10/04/2001 03:55 GMT

I`ll test DM map

syon Thought A Title Wasn't Needed

#860 Posted by syon [209.254.207.143], 10/04/2001 03:59 GMT

Q3 Textures?

#861 Posted by Kreator [62.66.9.226], 10/04/2001 21:06 GMT

Anyone knows what the glass texture is(texture pack)/name? The base_wall/glass01 is dark as hell (is hell dark?).

And yes, does anyone knows where the barrel texture is?

Is Hell Dark?

#862 Posted by Biff_Debris [152.163.204.209], 10/04/2001 22:30 GMT , Refers to Post #861

Yes, and it smells like ASS.

Episode Gates

#863 Posted by Quaketree [63.28.86.80], 10/04/2001 23:51 GMT

Ok, I give up. How do you get an Episode gate to appear? I tried the setting the e1 spawn flag to everything between 0 to 4 (I even tried setting it to e1) and nothing. I got the player 2 start point to work and I thought that the episode gate would appear but it doesent. Any help would be greatly appreciated.

Episode Gates

#864 Posted by Fern [141.222.155.64], 11/04/2001 00:23 GMT

Episode gates only appear if you HAVE the runes, not if you DON'T have them. Thus you need the E1 rune for the E1 gate to appear, etc. I'm not sure what happens if you pick up the runes ingame in a level that has closed episodegates in it :)

#865 Posted by Fern [141.222.155.64], 11/04/2001 00:27 GMT

I'm not sure what happens if you pick up the runes ingame in a level that has closed episodegates in it :)

nothing

Re: Kreator

#866 Posted by Deathmonger [62.37.163.112], 11/04/2001 05:24 GMT

In order to make a decent glass using that texture make a clip brush and then apply the glass texture to only one face.
If the glass is supposed to be seen from more than one side then make two brushes, so that no more than one glass texture is in the same brush. I had problems with this you mention a few months ago.

#867 Posted by GlassMan [62.7.249.6], 11/04/2001 05:55 GMT , Refers to Post #861

You need to put some pretty bright lights on both sides of the glass to get rid off the black.

I *think* the barrels are models for which the mdls didn't ship. You should find the texes somewhere just not in the regular tex directories. Try the models/mapobjects directory.

Clarification

#868 Posted by Quaketree [63.17.197.160], 11/04/2001 07:45 GMT

Ok, I wasn't clear enough. I thought the clue to y'all was that I got the player2 entity to work. Meaning I HAD the first rune in hand and and then I came back to the start map in the player2 position (as I should). But the episode gate was not present when I got to the start map the second time around with the first rune in hand. Confusing enough?

What I am asking is: What are the spawnflags (with the rune in hand) to make the episode gate(s) appear?

From The Source Itself...

#869 Posted by Fat Controller [203.96.111.201], 11/04/2001 09:36 GMT , Refers to Post #868

/*QUAKED func_episodegate (0 .5 .8) ? E1 E2 E3 E4
This bmodel will appear if the episode has already been completed, so players can't reenter it.
*/

So the spawnflag values are 1 (E1), 2 (E2), 4 (E3) and 8 (E4) respectively.

The Dark Side

#870 Posted by Eggman [151.202.208.149], 11/04/2001 17:37 GMT

Unwillingly I must start to endure mapping for

. Is Worldcraft my only option? I love Radiant and would much rather use this. Is this a possibility? If not where can I d/l everything necessary for Worldcraft/CS mapping?

Rustle!!!! Gooii! Hiss!!!!!!!

#871 Posted by CZG [195.204.46.4], 11/04/2001 17:44 GMT , Refers to Post #870

though, WC would be your salvation I guess.

#872 Posted by GrindSpire [213.122.22.95], 11/04/2001 17:45 GMT , Refers to Post #870

Half Life plugin for QERadiant

And why do you HAVE to start to map for

This Should Be Funny

#873 Posted by Eggman [151.202.208.149], 11/04/2001 17:47 GMT

A company I'm going to start contracting for is going to have a CS-esque gameplay mode in their game. So I have to explore the gametype.

snip...

You can stop laughing now.

&$%# Editor

#874 Posted by Quaketree [63.23.15.49], 11/04/2001 18:51 GMT

Ok, thanks and sorry to bother all who gave me info on episode gates (I already knew what you all were telling me was correct). It turns out that the editor I was using did not know how to assign the spawnflags for the func_episodegate. ie: in the .map file it was...

"e1" "1"

instead of "spawnflags" "1"

/me gotta learn to use WC instead of WQ

(stop laughing ok, it's just easier for my little brain to use that one instead of WC).

Anyway thanks for your time and we now return to our regularly scheduled programming...

Tyrlight Anyone?

#875 Posted by necros [172.162.71.104], 11/04/2001 22:25 GMT

Anyone know where i can get the latest version of Tyrlight?

#876 Posted by Kreator [62.66.9.99], 11/04/2001 22:31 GMT , Refers to Post #862

How would you know? Been there? I always wanted to go somewhere. Maybe I'll just go there then. Warm and cosy.

#877 Posted by Kreator [62.66.9.99], 11/04/2001 22:32 GMT , Refers to Post #866

Ok, thanks. I'll try that.

#878 Posted by Biff_Debris [205.188.192.31], 11/04/2001 23:02 GMT

Is there any way to get a map to fire up in UT without the damned bots showing up and shooting you to pieces? I thought since I didn't have any waypoints or what have you in it, I'd be able to poke around in relative solace -- but NO.

Btw, I'm really impressed with all you can do with UED2 -- port in any music, sound effects, whatever -- it's potentially kickass stuff.

#879 Posted by DaZ [213.122.215.204], 11/04/2001 23:30 GMT

have you actually tried mapping in it?

the fun ends there... :/

#880 Posted by Biff_Debris [205.188.192.48], 12/04/2001 00:12 GMT , Refers to Post #879

It ain't that bad, Daz -- once you get used to the 2d editor, and extruding stuff to your map from it. I mean hell, carving out an area in one click as opposed to slapping together 4 to 6 brushes? It does have some good points...

Yeah, It's Got Some Serious Advantages

#881 Posted by kanaeda [64.193.4.77], 12/04/2001 00:22 GMT , Refers to Post #880

Ued2 is a huge improvement over the original editor. much more stable, speedier, less resource intensive.

as for the editing side... subtractive based level design is *not* the devil, nor is it the greatest tool around. both quake-ish and unreal level design have their own sets of ups and downs. it's a trade-off no matter what you do. at this point, i'm pretty confident that there will never be a perfect engine/editor to work with. In the meantime, i'm really pleased with what's available from both of the major engine developers.

#882 Posted by Fern [141.222.155.64], 12/04/2001 01:29 GMT , Refers to Post #875

<A href="http://www.planetquake.com/tyrann">www.planetquake.com/tyrann

#883 Posted by Fern [141.222.155.64], 12/04/2001 01:29 GMT

Q M A P F A G G ' D

Who Needs A Title Anyway

#884 Posted by Speedy [213.158.1.51], 12/04/2001 03:14 GMT

Peej, make qmap auto replace borked link code with Q M A P F A G G ' D ;)

#885 Posted by metlslime [140.142.172.30], 12/04/2001 09:21 GMT , Refers to Post #884

Do you live in that town where the barber cuts the hair of everyone who doesn't cut his own hair?

The whole reason it's borked is that qmap doesnt recognize it as link code!

#886 Posted by GrindSpire [213.122.25.253], 12/04/2001 10:12 GMT , Refers to Post #878

There is one of the sections when starting a game that contains the number of bots to add as well as bot skill and stuff...

Cs Mapping Again

#887 Posted by Eggman [151.202.207.71], 12/04/2001 22:40 GMT

Do I have to have the

dll in the plugin directory of qeradiant and a halflife directory in my qeradiant directory to map for cs? Can't I just have the cs entities def file and be able to map for cs, without the

#888 Posted by Biff_Debris [152.163.204.187], 13/04/2001 00:01 GMT

Anybody know where I can find a decent tut on how to make water sheets in UED2? The Unrealed.exe tut gives the step by step, but I dunno if it works the same with UED2, seeing as how I can't get it to work. If someone knows how to do it, PLEASE post or mail me, since this is DRIVING ME INSANE!

#889 Posted by Grahf [209.145.68.80], 13/04/2001 03:26 GMT

Only thing I could recommend is to comb PlanetUnreal for UED2-specific tuts, I know there are some out there.

Interesting to know that you're making Unreal engine stuff. I'd be interested to see if you make anything cool.

Random Question:

#890 Posted by Grahf [209.145.68.80], 13/04/2001 03:28 GMT

Should the Rune textures be shrunk by 1/2 to look the best in Quake? i.e, are they too big as is?

#891 Posted by BlackPope [209.52.215.9], 13/04/2001 05:19 GMT

Anyone have the DK textures converted to Q
by each episode?? I know grindspire originally posted them but I also inquired about them and he said he doesn't anymore...

Basicaly I need them because I had a map nearly completed and now I don't have the textures to finish it!
so If anyone has them either reply to this msg or email me pls

I Call It "Autoplay" ;P

#892 Posted by Biff_Debris [205.188.199.31], 13/04/2001 09:19 GMT , Refers to Post #889

It is looking pretty good so far -- ideally it'll be a 1v1 map, given it's size (tiny). I'm using the "decayed" tex set -- which looks excellent -- and once I get the whole thing lit, it should look even better.

You Need The Plugin

#893 Posted by GrindSpire [213.122.52.82], 13/04/2001 11:32 GMT , Refers to Post #887

In order to use the

Advice On Gui Compiler

#894 Posted by The Cream Enjin [195.92.67.67], 13/04/2001 21:28 GMT

1.Is Q3build worth getting?
2.does it speed up the compile process?
3.Is there any compiler that doesn't take 15 hours on a fulvis?

#895 Posted by GrindSpire [213.122.117.19], 13/04/2001 21:32 GMT , Refers to Post #894

1) I don't think so, I use Radiant's menu for mid-work compiles and a batch file for major compiles (betas, final).

2) It's better than compiling Radaint in terms of speed (based on having just rebooted =), but a batch file is still better.

3) Nope, speeding up VIS is down to do optimising in the map.

#896 Posted by The Cream Enjin [195.92.67.67], 13/04/2001 21:36 GMT

That was quick.

batch file ....explain how please

#897 Posted by The Cream Enjin [195.92.67.67], 13/04/2001 21:40 GMT

maybe i have had too much to drink, oh well back to work, my WFA map has to be in by monday otherwise its wrists slapped for creamy:)

What's Taking The Time?

#898 Posted by pjw [198.211.36.117], 13/04/2001 21:56 GMT , Refers to Post #897

If it's lighting, there's not necessarily a lot you can do about it. If vis is taking any significant percentage of that, then have you gone through and "detailed" (Crtl-M) any non-vis-blocking brushes? It's amazing how much this will reduce your vis time.

Speedy Thought A Title Wasn't Needed

#899 Posted by Speedy [213.158.1.5], 14/04/2001 01:45 GMT

link for util that can do
hl wad/bsp to pcx/any normal grfx format ?
(losless)

#900 Posted by Biff_Debris [152.163.204.183], 14/04/2001 10:56 GMT

Okay -- turns out imp1sp2's gotta "leak that isn't a leak", or in other words, a BSP glitch. Tried running Alverson's QBSP on it, and it kept listing "Checkface: Point off plane". What does this mean?

Networked Version?

#901 Posted by The Cream Enjin [195.92.67.69], 14/04/2001 16:02 GMT

I am using Gtkradiant, q3map, i have just done a fullvis and just as it finished i got a message come up saying something about connection timed out make sure you have a networked version of q3map and your map has not compiled.

What is this and what does it mean?

(it is the lighting that is taking so much time on the compile)

Feh (Part II)

#902 Posted by Biff_Debris [152.163.207.189], 14/04/2001 21:52 GMT

What's that q1 console/config command for extra particles (for a pointfile)? I've tried "particles" and "max particles", but they no work.

No matter what I do, the "leak" only shows up in a part of the map that had never leaked before, but it may lead somewhere else, if given enough juice...

Please Help

#903 Posted by The Cream Enjin [195.92.67.65], 14/04/2001 22:29 GMT , Refers to Post #901

any1 there hello? this networked thingy is doin my nut in.
please help

#904 Posted by NotoriousRay [141.157.92.66], 14/04/2001 22:45 GMT

run your executable of choice with -particles hugeassnumberwithlotsofzeros

#905 Posted by Biff_Debris [152.163.207.189], 14/04/2001 23:07 GMT , Refers to Post #904

That doesn't work, either. Thanks though, Ray.

Uhm Yeah It Does

#906 Posted by NotoriousRay [141.157.92.66], 14/04/2001 23:24 GMT

ripped directly from frib's glquake/qw guide.

-particles
This is a command that I have not seen mentioned in any glquake tweak guide, which is unfortunate given how useful it is. Use this command to specify the maximum number of particles to be rendered on screen at once. By 'particles' I'm referring to stuff like rocket trails, blood, the teleport effect, etc. I highly recommend that you use -particles 0 for glquake. Despite the zero, this will not eliminate all particles, which is a good thing... I still want to see the rocket trails and other effects. What it will do is set the maximum number of particles to the lowest possible value (presumably). This won't make a difference in many cases, however in big games, when there is a lot of shit going own, glquake will reduce the amount of particles being rendered, and these big games are precisely when you need that extra performance the most. This is a significant performance boost, for example on my system, a timedemo bigass1 will be literally 10 FPS faster using -particles 0. A nice performance gain with very little real difference in visual effects.

Example: glquake -particles 0

Uhm No It Doesn't

#907 Posted by Biff_Debris [152.163.207.189], 15/04/2001 00:08 GMT , Refers to Post #906

I'm using software Quake only now -- I don't even have GLQuake on my HD.

#908 Posted by Lunaran [64.12.105.41], 15/04/2001 02:48 GMT

you aren't trying to run q3map with -threads are you? That uses multiple processors on a network. That's the only thing in q3map related to networking, so if that's not it you must have some bad mojo going on.

#909 Posted by NotoriousRay [141.157.92.66], 15/04/2001 04:09 GMT

i dunno then. its worked for me in winquake and glquake.
<shrug>

Engine Woes

#910 Posted by Fern [141.222.155.64], 15/04/2001 06:04 GMT

anyone who can figure these out is a genius. an answer to either one would solve my problems:

1) when fullbrights are on in TomazQuake, there are several fullbrights which simply don't show up and get lit like normal textures. They show up as fullbright in Software, GLQuake, QF, the works, just not in TQ

2) When I start QuakeForge after TomazQuake, I get a white void and little white dots all over the map. yuck. rebooting fixes it until I run TQ again.

if any custom-engine-savvy people know what might be up, please respond, thanks. The faster I can test compiles of perssp3, the faster I'll finish it ;)
~Fern

#911 Posted by Fern [141.222.155.64], 15/04/2001 06:47 GMT

when I view a VISed map in QF, all problems disappear... it would still be nice to get the proper fullbrights in TQ though since that's actually a NQ engine :)

#912 Posted by The Cream Enjin [195.92.67.71], 15/04/2001 17:14 GMT

What is a good r-speed value to aim at?

Biff Compile It With Wqbsp

#913 Posted by Mr Fribbles [61.9.192.142], 15/04/2001 17:23 GMT , Refers to Post #902

wQBSP...

- Supports "-leakspace #" option, which allows you to control the spacing of the leak trail particles. 2 is the default, if you want to make the close together you would put in a small number, say 0.5, if you want them more spread out you would put in a larger number, say 4. Do not put in negative numbers or 0!

The particles command has absolutely nothing to do with it.

#914 Posted by GrindSpire [213.122.5.250], 15/04/2001 17:27 GMT , Refers to Post #913

Since I assume you are mapping for Q3...

About 8000 to 10000 tris

#915 Posted by Biff the Relieved [205.188.198.46], 16/04/2001 00:27 GMT , Refers to Post #913

Thanks Frib! I was getting ready to plunge into my new map (see Screenshot Thread), but I guess I'll go back to working on imp1sp2 now.

#916 Posted by Biff_Debris [205.188.198.27], 16/04/2001 14:08 GMT

Tirns out, it wasn't a leak -- it was simply the way I was putting brushes together for a curved surface.

Yeah, I'd seen CZG's tut (I've got it in me WC folder), but was too lazy to redo what I'd already built. Needless to say, I'm not being lazy anymore...

#917 Posted by sorrow[T7S] [24.95.16.176], 17/04/2001 15:52 GMT

What is the climb attribute in Q3 and how do I get to it...like if I want a ladder or something.
thanks guys!

sorrow

#918 Posted by Eggman [162.83.135.148], 17/04/2001 16:32 GMT , Refers to Post #917

does not have ladders. I suggest making clip brushes stacked and 1 unit apart to create stairs that will have a similar effect.

Pick One...

#919 Posted by Quaketree [63.23.7.149], 21/04/2001 00:20 GMT

Ok, let's just suppose that I wanted to make a Black and White Quake level (color-wise, not as in the new game). I can convert textures into grey scale with a program like Paintshop Pro and use Wally or TexMex to extract and place them into a wad. Which export format from the .wad (.tga .bmp ect) will ( in your opinion) retain the crispest texture details when re-inserted into a .wad?

But of course now the monsters, ammo boxes ect. will be in color while the map itself is b&w.

What software tool(s) would I need to use to change the models skins into b&w?

how can I change the textures for ammo ect. that are in the .bsp's in the progs folder in the pak file without having to make my own new .bsp?

I am guessing that I will need to extract the .bsp from the .pak, then extract the textures from that .bsp, then convert the textures into b&w. I think I can get that far, but how do I re-insert (and replace) the new textures into the old .bsp?

I know that I saw somewhere on a web site (a long time ago) a tool that would swap the textures within a .bsp. But "gosh darn it" if I can remember where.

As far as the model's and their skin's go, I have never touched them and I have no idea as to even where I should begin.

Just pointers as to where I can "get" the manual would be good for every one that may be thinking RTFM.

Thank you for your time.

/me hunkers back down into the shadows...

#920 Posted by Biff_Debris [205.188.192.159], 21/04/2001 00:46 GMT , Refers to Post #919

This is like the third time this very question has been brought up recently (B&W Quake), and I believe the solution (someone said) was to simply alter the palette file -- this should allow everything to be greyscale. It'd have to be a seperate pak, far away from your normal Quake stuff, for sure.

#921 Posted by Fern [141.222.155.64], 21/04/2001 01:06 GMT

I had originally planned to do a black and white mission/episode with some lighting modifications and an indiana jones sort of archaeological theme, but that never happened. It's fairly easy to make everything black and white. All you need to do is modify the palette.lmp file. to do this in PSP, you can load a Quake screenshot (PCX) colorize it with a saturation of 0%, reduce it to 256 colors (don't remember if this is necessary) and save the palette. Not sure how to get it back in LMP format though. I think mickey did that.

#922 Posted by Biff_Debris [205.188.192.159], 21/04/2001 01:09 GMT , Refers to Post #921

If you ever want to convert to 256 colors, just re-save the file as a GIF. This works even better than PSPs conversions, for some reason.

#923 Posted by Fern [141.222.155.64], 21/04/2001 04:07 GMT

If you ever want to convert to 256 colors, just re-save the file as a GIF. This works even better than PSPs conversions, for some reason. That's because PSP reduces the image to 256 colors, saves the GIF, and continues to display the original 256+ color image with no visible change. You never see what you saved unless you open it again :)

Well, Those Bastards!

#924 Posted by Biff_Debris [152.163.207.198], 21/04/2001 10:08 GMT , Refers to Post #923

It's all part of their plan, you know...

#925 Posted by DeFrag [208.49.10.49], 22/04/2001 00:57 GMT

would fucking rock!

#926 Posted by metlslime [140.142.172.11], 22/04/2001 09:33 GMT

not only must you modify the palette.lmp, you must also modify colormap.lmp, since you want to support software mode. And you DO want to support software mode, right?

I think i said this last time the question came up too. There ought to be a B&W Quake FAQ.

#927 Posted by Quaketree [63.22.254.129], 22/04/2001 09:50 GMT

Ok, so if I change the pallet.lmp and the colormap.lmp in the .pak then "ANY" Quake level would be B&W all the way through including, say for example, the original id level's?
I had already converted some tex's to b&w, and to be honest they looked like total crap in software Quake (more blue and grey than black and white) but with arghlite and some creative lighting they looked pretty good (and just about what I was looking for) in GLQuake.

#928 Posted by GrindSpire [213.122.77.196], 22/04/2001 09:57 GMT , Refers to Post #927

That is correct

#929 Posted by Fern [141.222.155.64], 22/04/2001 15:17 GMT

errrrrrrr I was playing entirely in software mode at the time and modifying only palette.lmp worked fine for me. what the heck is colormap ?

#930 Posted by GrindSpire [213.122.77.196], 22/04/2001 15:54 GMT , Refers to Post #929

That'd be the GL equivalent =)

#931 Posted by Quaketree [63.22.254.169], 22/04/2001 19:04 GMT

I extracted them and, what opens /converts them into something I can mess with? (psp don't do it:/)and as long as I am asking, what about changing them back into a.lmp when I am done.

thank you for your time.

#932 Posted by Fern [141.222.155.64], 22/04/2001 19:38 GMT

I already described the method for creating a black and white palette above. If you want to know how to save it as an lmp.... /me runs

#933 Posted by metlslime [140.142.172.107], 22/04/2001 23:05 GMT , Refers to Post #929

colormap.lmp is a lookup table that shows what each palette color should look like under each light level. I have no way to explain why your quake.exe didn't use it; to my best understanding that is what software mode uses to draw every pixel.

Hmm, perhaps colormap.lmp is 8-bit indexed, and therefore when you change the palette.lmp, colormap.lmp automatically takes on the new palette. That must be it.

So i guess you can leave colormap.lmp alone.

#934 Posted by Tron [203.12.165.8], 23/04/2001 00:35 GMT

I can remember a while back when I tried messing around with quake to give it the quake 2 so that I could use q2 textures without repallating them...I ended up with psychadelic fluro cloured quake no matter what I did so in the end I just gave up. 8)

Tron

Who Needs A Title Anyway

#935 Posted by Grahf [209.145.69.70], 23/04/2001 03:21 GMT

It must be possible, I mean Hexen II uses an alternate color palette...

Your best bet for editing all that crazy shit may well be id's original qutils; just get the source and compile, eh?

#936 Posted by Quaketree [63.22.254.212], 23/04/2001 18:38 GMT

Ok, I found a program (rgb v1.1 from the chopshop on PQ) that allows me to change any color in the pallet (and colormap as well). I changed the pallet into 16 shades from 0 to 255 in increments of 16, I extracted my original pallet and colormap from pak0.pak and replaced them with the new ones that I just made.

The good news is... it did make everything black and white, the bad news is that some of the textures are pertty good looking, some are really really bad and most are somewhere in between.

While this is definitely a novelty look it was not quite what I was interested in doing.
As per my above post, I was more interested in extracting skins and such from the pak's, turning them into greyscale and re-inserting them into the paks. Then making my own maps with black and white textures. I just am not too sure about re-distributing any propriatary stuff of id's (I would not change the rest of the .mdl but I think I will need to place the entire .mdl in a .pak even though it is just the skin that changed)

If anyone is interested in seeing quake in 16 color B&W I can e-mail you the pallet.lmp and colormap.lmp I made to see what I am talking about.

Why Don't You...

#937 Posted by Tron [203.12.165.8], 24/04/2001 05:33 GMT

make the pallate into 256 different shades of grey with the brightness of the gray depending on the brightness of the original colour? I'd think that would make everything look as though it had been converted to greyscale properly...

Tron

#938 Posted by Quaketree [63.28.86.147], 24/04/2001 07:46 GMT

Ok, I *Think* I got it sorted out: I found that program I saw before that will swap textures in a .bsp. So I extracted the textures from each the .bsp's in episode one (each episode into it's own wad). Then I did a simple greyscale conversion in psp 7.2 on each one and saved them and then put them into a new wad (again separated by episode).

Then I ran the proggie to swap the textures in the E1M1.bsp and BOOM. The levels were in B&W but the models were still in color. So I d\led QMe Lite and used it on the simpler models (Gib's, flames and others that were less than 20 frames) extracted those textures and did the same greyscale thing. Put those back in and *BOOM* even more B&W goodness. So now I guess I gotta get QMe (full version) to get the models with more than 20 frames into B&W. And then I should be about done making Quake B&W.

Now the question. What (if anything) do you all think I can give to people to check it out when I am done? I mean I suppose anyone with Quake could do it on their own if they had the tools and about 10 or 12 hours (or so). Most (but not all) of the models were in the SW release of Quake. It would be fairly ok I think to just put out the converted textures. I would not need to put out the sounds or other non-visual stuff (.dat ect). Maybe just put out the SW version in B&W?

#939 Posted by cyBeAr [213.64.67.243], 24/04/2001 10:15 GMT , Refers to Post #938

All u really need to do is change the palette, but u need to do it as Tron suggested. Infact I still have a working black & white palette from whoever it was that did it before (sorry I don't remember who it was and am to lazy to read all old posts in this thread to find out).

Quaketree: If u want it I can send it to u, it really is much smoother way of doing it than changing all textures and skins.

256 Colors...

#940 Posted by Fern [141.222.155.64], 24/04/2001 12:41 GMT

make the pallate into 256 different shades of grey with the brightness of the gray depending on the brightness of the original colour? I'd think that would make everything look as though it had been converted to greyscale properly...

I've suggested that at least twice. That's what would be generated with my method. No one ever told me what was wrong with it though

#941 Posted by Eggman [162.83.134.164], 24/04/2001 13:19 GMT

Doesn't quake have a certain amount of colors that are static? I think the amount of colors you can actually pick is somewhere around 240 or something. Either that or I am clueless

#942 Posted by Quaketree [63.23.7.54], 24/04/2001 19:22 GMT

When I did the 16 shades of grey pallet I got a colormap that had shades of grey, black and white strewn about higgly-piggly (is that a word) in no apparent order.

While I suppose if I spent enough time I could get the right shade of grey in the correct place on the pallet, but that would be a lot of trial and error and I'm not even sure if it would work equally on all maps (IMO). Plus in GL greys look different than in SW and in order for it to look well in both, the last method I mentioned semed to be the best compromise. Finally, if you were doing DM or COOP, and you changed the pallet, you would not really see any diffrence in the players unless you stopped and looked (which is a bad idea :( ).

But anyway, thank's for all of your input, I definitely learned much more about how Quake handles colors than I ever really thought I would. I'll probably keep dicking with it but I will stop pestering you guy's about it unless I really get stuck again.

#943 Posted by cyBeAr [213.64.67.243], 24/04/2001 20:51 GMT , Refers to Post #942

didn't you notice that I offered to send you a working bw palette for quake? Even though you might decide not to use it, it's probably still work checking out.

How Hard Can You Make This? Use ...

#944 Posted by metlslime [140.142.169.121], 25/04/2001 05:03 GMT

..the palette, Luke. Search your pants: you know it to be true.

Hmm, No Title

#945 Posted by Kell [62.7.249.6], 25/04/2001 16:20 GMT

Yeah, the palette, man...
I made a quake_gray.pal last night in Paint Shop Pro; it took about 8 seconds and I click slowly.

Use the palette and your journey towards the grayscale will be complete.

Mdl Resource

#946 Posted by GlassMan [195.184.253.80], 27/04/2001 14:15 GMT

Custents' func_model entity allows the placing of any mdl model (still or animated) in a quake map. It works like the q3 equivalent - you just supply the path & model name & your model is there looking pretty.

Unfortuntely, unlike q3 there seems to be a dearth of such models available on the net. I dont mean player or monster models but things like lights & wall decorations & other fancy stuff like you get in q3.

So, does anyone know of any resources available where mdl files can be downloaded?

#947 Posted by Biff_Debris [205.188.197.189], 27/04/2001 15:31 GMT , Refers to Post #946

That'd be a great addition to SPX (the func_model thing). I wonder if DaZ has it included or on his to-do list...?

#948 Posted by XeNoN [212.126.141.88], 27/04/2001 17:11 GMT

AFAIK, yes. There will also be a feature for ambient sounds, as well.

#949 Posted by DaZ [213.1.94.65], 27/04/2001 17:12 GMT , Refers to Post #947

Its definately on the to-do list. if everything goes to plan it will be very tweakable as well...

#950 Posted by Biff_Debris [205.188.192.31], 27/04/2001 18:47 GMT

Definitely gotta do a map pack for this thing. Even if they're cheesy "showcase" maps to illustrate cetain features of the mod -- altho I'd hope it wouldn't come to that.

HELP! WORLDCRAFT USERS READ ON...

#951 Posted by XeNoN [212.126.141.39], 27/04/2001 20:19 GMT

Right. I'm quite new to this editor, and am experiencing the most IRRITATING bug ever, which is wasting me great time:

When doing Vertex Manipulation, I click and drag all the individual points about to shape the brush how I want, as per usual. The problem is, if I accidentally mis-click the mouse, and click on part of the screen which isn't a vertex, (while still in VM mode) the editor starts drawing a box, and I can no longer move any of the vertices. I've tried exiting VM mode and entering it again, but the stupod box just reappears, and my brush is stuck the way it is. The only solution I can find is to save+exit the map, but if the unfinished brush is illegal, then the whole thing is screwednext time I open the file, and I have to start the whole thing again

Does this happen to all? If not, how the hell can I prevent it?

Please help, thankyou.

#952 Posted by GrindSpire [213.122.12.30], 27/04/2001 20:32 GMT , Refers to Post #951

You press Esc to get rid of the box...

#953 Posted by XeNoN [212.126.141.39], 27/04/2001 20:57 GMT

Thanks Grindspire loads. I had no way of knowing that...

#954 Posted by CZG [148.122.66.36], 27/04/2001 23:16 GMT

enter to select with the box...

#955 Posted by NotoriousRay [141.157.92.45], 28/04/2001 02:33 GMT

perhaps the 'feature' (i guess) that is most annoying to me, regarding worldcraft

Another Annoying Thing...

#956 Posted by XeNoN [212.126.135.132], 28/04/2001 15:38 GMT

How when you c'n'p a brush, the copy ends up in a random place on the screen, and i have to spend ages restoring it...

ALSO, how the grid keeps going psyco when doing VM...

#957 Posted by CZG [148.122.66.36], 28/04/2001 18:15 GMT

c'n'p: Just use the clonedrag instead. Hold shift and drag object to new location.

Grid: Jesus! How detailed are you being then? Doesn't that only happen at 100x zoom?

There are way more annoying things that will happen to you.

Re: Vertex Box

#958 Posted by Quaketree [63.27.230.59], 28/04/2001 18:44 GMT

Just what in the hell does that blue box do anyway?

Who Needs A Title Anyway

#959 Posted by Tron [203.12.165.8], 29/04/2001 02:18 GMT

You can use the vertec box to select vertices.

czg: you can shift-drag but that only works if the thing you want to stick into your map is in the same map file. If you've made two seperate things and want to combine them you'd better be ready for some tedious realignment action.

Tron

#960 Posted by NotoriousRay [141.157.91.121], 29/04/2001 14:46 GMT

shift-drag? ..never new that existed. AND ALL THIS BLOODY TIME I'VE BEEN COPY AND PASTING

grr, tell me your ancient wc knowledge oh mr. czg

#961 Posted by The Lieutenant [144.32.177.147], 29/04/2001 16:26 GMT

I only found out recently too (before lthsp1 though obviously, or that would have been a real chore).

You Didn't Know About Shift Drag?!?!?!

#962 Posted by Tron [203.12.165.8], 30/04/2001 12:39 GMT

Hehe I think I actually might not of learnt about it until ages after I started using wc either until someone mentioned it on the qboard (god rest its soul) Other things I know of are:
Texturing
shift-click = select whole brush when texturing.

ctrl-click = select single side of brush when texturing (can also be used to deselect sides if a whole brush is selected to start off with)

Brush Manipulation

shift-drag = moves a copy of selected object.

ctrl-click = selects multiple brushes at once
-----

I think that's the main ones, aren't they all in the wc help file though?

Tron

#963 Posted by Biff_Debris [205.188.199.57], 30/04/2001 13:23 GMT

I can't always get it to work, get frustrated, and go back to c'n'p. Sigh. It's no biggie, really -- unless your machine runs WC real slow or something.

It Is Vital

#964 Posted by CZG [148.122.66.38], 30/04/2001 13:38 GMT

that you keep shift depressed all the time from you start dragging the thing until you've released the mouse button and you see that the item has been duplicated. Just dragging it and tapping shift for a brief second has no effect.

#965 Posted by Biff_Debris [205.188.200.37], 30/04/2001 15:19 GMT , Refers to Post #964

I'll go try again (mebbe I'll get some mapping in today, too). Thanks, CZG.

#966 Posted by Scampie [206.152.135.106], 30/04/2001 19:48 GMT

if you don't read this thread for awhile and let it get up to around 200+ posts, your head explodes when you read all the map knowledge hidden here.

/me goesa' shift-dragin'

#967 Posted by Biff_Debris [64.12.102.182], 30/04/2001 20:59 GMT

I just found The Easy Guide To Creating Amazing Maps That Will Demoralize Everyone! Ooh, the knowledge! Ooh -- the moral corruption! HAHAHAHAHAH!

/me dissipates in a clump of dingy smoke

Hmm, No Title

#968 Posted by DeFrag [208.49.10.249], 01/05/2001 01:42 GMT

..in a clump of dingy smoke

hehe is that dinGy smoke or din-jee smoke?
er.. gib or jib? heee

PLEASE, PLEASE, PLEASE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

#969 Posted by XeNoN [212.126.141.143], 01/05/2001 17:10 GMT

Do NOT bring that argument up again!!!

MAX_MAP_VISIBILITY_EXCEEDED

#970 Posted by Fubar [193.217.207.73], 02/05/2001 20:48 GMT

I am moving closer and closer to a finished bunker map, the whole thing is inside a mountain; But; It has too high r_speeds, and low fps... I sorted this out by making an areaportal... I worked fine, i usually compile at night, so i didnt notice this stupid error that sneaked in in the compile...
Max_map_visibility_exceeded
It wont vis... The map is about 4000 brushes, most of the sides are caulked, and i use detail brushes on crates, ladders, cigar boxes, lights, everything thats little, and it wont go away...
What do I do to kill this error?

Fubar - Universal Assault - www.teaminferno.cjb.net
PS: Currently recruiting, so check it out:)

#971 Posted by Biff_Debris [152.163.206.178], 02/05/2001 22:28 GMT , Refers to Post #970

Dunno much about q3 errors, but it sounds like you may need to rethink your design. Been there -- it hurts like hell to redo when you're so close to finishing, but that's usually when these things crop up =\

What He Said.

#972 Posted by pjw [208.192.76.75], 03/05/2001 01:53 GMT , Refers to Post #970

If all your unseen faces are caulked and all brushes that can be made detail without screwing up vis blocking are detail, you probably need to rethink your design (but there's probably more you can do in both these areas). Another thing you might try is making some of the more complex vis-blocking structural brushes detail and using structurally simpler (e.g. cubic) caulk brushes embedded within them to block vis. There have been a few maps that have been built entirely this way--although it's a bit of an unusual way to go about it.

Good luck.

#973 Posted by Grahf [209.145.68.117], 03/05/2001 01:53 GMT

I'm no q3 god, but there's two possibilities I can think of that you've run into:

1) Your map has too much visdata for q3map to handle. In Q1, this problem could sometimes be avoided by running a full vis, as that would compress the data. Too much visdata would mean that your map is too big, with too much fine detail. Not sure if this is even a possible problem in q3.

2) You can see too far at a point in the map. This might be a possible problem. If it is, put in some vis blockers.

Unreal Ed Fu..

#974 Posted by The Cream Enjin [195.92.67.66], 03/05/2001 12:02 GMT

Where can i find some tutorials for this rather boring un fun to use level editor?

Good Luck Fubar!

#975 Posted by Biff_Debris [205.188.200.27], 03/05/2001 13:08 GMT , Refers to Post #974

Go here. Best site I've seen tutorial-wise.

Thankyou Biff

#976 Posted by The Cream Enjin [195.92.67.68], 03/05/2001 13:19 GMT

#977 Posted by Biff_Debris [205.188.200.27], 03/05/2001 13:25 GMT , Refers to Post #976

If you find any other useful sites, lemme know -- I still intend to get back to UED eventually.

#978 Posted by Fubar [193.216.42.186], 03/05/2001 15:53 GMT

So i either must rebuild the whole level, or make some serious big caulk brushes the will block my vis? :*(

#979 Posted by pjw [208.192.76.75], 03/05/2001 16:57 GMT , Refers to Post #978

find some faces that aren't caulked and caulk them and find some brushes that aren't detail (and that don't block vis significantly) and make them detail.

I may be completely full of crap, but I'm guessing that there are further optimizations you can do with caulk/detail. There almost always are.

How big/how many brushes does your map have?

Unreal Debris

#980 Posted by The Cream Enjin [195.92.67.71], 04/05/2001 14:43 GMT

There are some good "foundation" level Unreal tutorials here Biff

My Level Is....

#981 Posted by Fubar [193.217.205.253], 04/05/2001 21:53 GMT

My level is not big... Its medium, it contains some big wallz with gensurf, but they compiled fine from the beginning... Its inside a mouintain, so its a lot of bruses making it "rough"... 4200 brushes to be exact...
:(:(:(

#982 Posted by Biff_Debris [152.163.195.191], 04/05/2001 22:44 GMT , Refers to Post #980

Thanks, man -- "foundation" level, that's me.

#983 Posted by The Cream Enjin [195.92.67.71], 05/05/2001 15:08 GMT

#984 Posted by Lucas [152.163.197.177], 08/05/2001 20:05 GMT

What's your favorite kind of map? Gothic, temple, base? For Q1 of course.

I Like 'em ALL.

#985 Posted by Biff_Debris [152.163.206.187], 08/05/2001 23:17 GMT

They all have their strengths and weaknesses, IMO:

Gothic -- wider variety of monsters, and lots of architectural styles to draw from BUT tends to stick to said influences, and looks odd when too experimental.

Temple -- as above, really -- but with a more narrow focus (iconic forms, more "functional" areas, etc).

Base -- wide variety of architectural styles, bordering on experimental (with CRATES, too!) BUT limited variety of monsters.

This is all SP, anyway. You can go whole-hog in DM regardless of styles, with fairly good results, I think.

#986 Posted by Shallow[BAP] [212.229.87.1], 08/05/2001 23:54 GMT , Refers to Post #985

What about "office" and "pirate cove"?

#987 Posted by Biff_Debris [152.163.197.82], 09/05/2001 00:22 GMT , Refers to Post #986

Office -- Really limited number of monsters there (mebbe some fiends in the typing pool, some grunts around a rotfish-filled water cooler, vores in the executive washroom, and a shambler in the head office), but lots of tight corners and cubicle-frags.

Pirate cove -- Even more limitations on bad guys (mebbe some eyepatches on the ogres?), but a lot of rotfish fun for all.

Hope that helps =)

#988 Posted by Tron [203.38.138.22], 09/05/2001 02:44 GMT

A pirates covewould be a great setting for shamblers nature mapping competition wouldn't it...

Tron

Responding To Multiple Ppl Is Fun

#989 Posted by Grahf [209.145.69.190], 09/05/2001 23:38 GMT

Lucas: My favorite type of map is the one I remember.

Tron: Well, get crackin! <pulls out bullwhip>

Waa-pish!

#990 Posted by Lucas [152.163.201.84], 10/05/2001 03:02 GMT

I was just watching a Quake speed demo early today, and then it gave me an idea for a DM level. The weird part is is that I'll probably be able to have it done by sometime tomorrow.

It's called Symmetrified Death and it's my first DM. As of right now, everything is working...I'm just hoping that the respawning points are working.

I need someone to test it for me. I still have to do the textures and items, but it's pretty much done.

thank-you

#991 Posted by PabloD [207.173.167.130], 10/05/2001 05:29 GMT

I make maps for Doom & Heretic. The prolem is that i'm getting bored. W/ the new source ports and everything is not hard to make a 3d bridge for Doom or slope walls and stuff, but I want somethin new....
...I was wondering which one is the best Q1 level editor. Yes, Q1.
Which one is the most simple one. where can I get it.

#992 Posted by GrindSpire [213.122.108.185], 10/05/2001 06:57 GMT , Refers to Post #991

Worldcraft is a good starting point...

It's Personal Preference.

#993 Posted by Tron [203.12.165.8], 10/05/2001 06:58 GMT , Refers to Post #991

A lot of quake 1 mappers use worldcraft (which I'm biased to because I love it) but there are a ton of other q1 map editors. You can get worldcraft from http://www.planetquake.com/worldcraft/ I'd just have a look around though and try a few different ones to see what editor suits your style best.

Tron

#994 Posted by Biff_Debris [152.163.197.206], 10/05/2001 11:25 GMT

Still use it, still like it bunches. I know, not everyone uses it, and blah blah blah, but I like it, so there.

#995 Posted by Kell [213.120.145.99], 10/05/2001 16:18 GMT

Still have it, still use it, still love it.
Still the best piece of software a Llama like me ever installed :P

#996 Posted by DaZ [62.7.85.121], 10/05/2001 18:17 GMT

There are other Q1 editors??

#997 Posted by GrindSpire [213.122.32.126], 10/05/2001 18:35 GMT

I use QER...

But WC is better for beginners

WC Is Horrible

#998 Posted by cyBeAr [213.64.67.243], 10/05/2001 19:56 GMT

I can't understand it.

#999 Posted by Shallow[BAP] [212.229.87.1], 10/05/2001 22:36 GMT , Refers to Post #997

How easy is it to use QER/Q3R for Q1? Is there much fiddly monkeying and shennanigans involved?

#1000 Posted by Scampie [206.152.135.106], 10/05/2001 22:49 GMT

#1001 Posted by Asriel [203.98.21.44], 10/05/2001 23:27 GMT

does post #1001 count as ownage?

#1002 Posted by Biff_Debris [152.163.205.62], 10/05/2001 23:42 GMT , Refers to Post #1001

That's just more fiddly monkeying.

#1003 Posted by Scampie [206.152.135.106], 11/05/2001 00:06 GMT , Refers to Post #1001

becuase I was waiting all day to get post #1000

#1004 Posted by Lucas [64.12.103.167], 11/05/2001 04:09 GMT

And, of course, I didn't get it done today. I was working with lights within the level and I'm up to 70 lights. To cut down to r_speeds I was going to put sixteen doors in my level. Sixteen doors seems like an aweful lot, but I have sixteen passageways that are nothing but air. Someone can see from one side of the map to the other just by looking through one.

The bad thing is, when I made one door and ran the map, it said that the door didn't have a function. I have made plenty of doors before and didn't have a problem. Can someone give me some help?

Does the door have to have a name to work? I also want to make every door shootable so you have to shoot it to open it up. Is there something I'm doing wrong?

#1005 Posted by palldjon [203.29.11.8], 11/05/2001 05:45 GMT

one doesn't have to name a door. This is only required if the door is to be triggered by a button or the death of an enemy etc. Naming a door and having nothing targeting it will cause all sorts of probs. To make the door shootable - give it some health, say 5 pts. If the door you've got doesn't work try sending it back to the world then re-tieing it to func_door entity and re-setting the parameters.

#1006 Posted by GlassMan [213.121.125.20], 11/05/2001 05:47 GMT

I don't know whats up with your doors Lucas but, in Quake at least, they wont block the visibility of the engine so they wont help with r_speeds. You'll need to put turns in the corridors or some structural brushes in to block visibility.

#1007 Posted by GlassMan [213.121.125.20], 11/05/2001 05:56 GMT , Refers to Post #999

You'll need mapconv.exe from here http://www.planetquake.com/rem/

Its a bit fiddly to use these editors mainly due to the extra stage of setting up the textures correctly for use in the editor (q2 wals for qer & jpgs/tgas for q3r) whereas the level is still compiled using a wad.

The good thing is you are relatively future proof as worldcraft wont edit any modern games whereas most q3 based games use a radiant type editor.

#1008 Posted by PabloD [207.173.167.80], 11/05/2001 07:38 GMT

Thanks dudes, I'll try to make a great map.

Rock Tutorials?

#1009 Posted by Kreator [62.66.9.56], 11/05/2001 20:54 GMT

Anyone know a good way to make good-looking montains in Q3? A turorial would be nice.

#1010 Posted by Shallow[BAP] [212.229.87.1], 11/05/2001 22:04 GMT , Refers to Post #1007

Cheers GlassMan, I'll check that out.

#1011 Posted by Lunaran [152.163.197.59], 12/05/2001 02:40 GMT

Making a Q1 map in Q3 is impossible. I've tried.

Even with fiddly monkeying with textures/wads and special compiles and map ocnvertors, Q3R still makes it impossible to make a Q1 map because the default texture scale is 0.5. You COULD set Q3R to Quake2 editing mode, which I didn't want to try because it fucks up all your settings if you've got another instance of Q3R installed somewhere else for Q3 editing, and requires further borking around with map convertors and wals and texture buggery.

However, there is a q1 entities.def file for q3r floating around somewhere (can't remember where I found mine), and since Sleepwalkr's map converter is specifically written to convert q2 map files to q1 by stripping out the surface properties, that's the ideal way to go, as long as you don't want to make q3 maps at the same time.

So Was I....

#1012 Posted by Asriel [203.98.21.44], 12/05/2001 09:16 GMT

well... maybe not then

#1013 Posted by Shallow[BAP] [212.229.87.1], 12/05/2001 10:22 GMT , Refers to Post #1011

I've got Win98 and 2K on my system so I was going to slap QER under 2K so as not to mess things up in 98 where I do my Q3 editing.

(...wonders why SiN runs so well in 2K when even the latest patch still fks up constantly in 98...)

Qer Won't Mess Up Q3r

#1014 Posted by cyBeAr [213.64.67.243], 12/05/2001 10:48 GMT

At least I haven't noticed anything.

#1015 Posted by Shallow[BAP] [212.229.87.1], 12/05/2001 12:08 GMT

I've always been wary of installing different radiant flavours... out of interest, have people had EFradiant etc. installed at the same time? Any probs?

#1016 Posted by GrindSpire [213.122.72.78], 12/05/2001 16:58 GMT

I currently have:

QERadiant
Q3Radiant
GTKRadiant
EFRadiant
FAKK2Radiant
DKTRadiant

Installed... I think I should get some kind of prize =)

#1017 Posted by The Lieutenant [144.32.177.152], 12/05/2001 17:02 GMT

Is Q3R just a l33ter version of QER then?

Who Needs A Title Anyway

#1018 Posted by Grahf [209.145.69.67], 12/05/2001 17:43 GMT

Lieutenant: Yup. The QER builds go as high as version 147, the first public Q3R was build 181, and the latest is 202. Q3R isn't being developed anymore, in favor of GTKRadiant, which picks up where Q3R left off. FAKK2Rad, DKTRad, EFRad, etc, are all branches off the QER/Q3R source tree.

Constant evolution, man. ;)

(OK, so maybe with GTKRadiant it's a step sideways, but whatever.)

#1019 Posted by Grahf [209.145.69.67], 12/05/2001 18:38 GMT

You have two choices for mountain-making: by hand or with Gensurf.

Gensurf is a natural terrain generation program that comes as a plugin with recent Q3Radiant and GTKRadianr builds. The results will look very "natural," but they may be too high in polycount, and you have little control over exactly how the program forms the terrain. id software used Gensurf to make the massive terrain levels in Team Arena.

Doing it by hand is probably harder to make look "good," will take longer, but your results are ultimately in your hands, and if you take the time to learn the techniques, it'll look damn fine too. Rust has some excellent tutorials. The tuts are written with QERadiant and Quake 2 in mind, but the concepts stay the same for any editor and any game.

Try this:
http://www.gamedesign.net/style/terrain/index.shtml

Personally, I don't like the method described for cliffs faces, but whatever floats your boat.

#1020 Posted by Kreator [62.66.9.37], 12/05/2001 23:00 GMT

Well, don't like the rust either, have tried it. Guess by hand is the only thing left (at least I know what I'm gonna be doing the newxt 3 days). GenSurf isn't an option for me. Need to keep the r_speed down.

#1021 Posted by Biff_Debris [152.163.195.182], 13/05/2001 02:51 GMT , Refers to Post #1016

Like what -- more HD space?

#1022 Posted by Speedy [213.158.1.109], 13/05/2001 04:15 GMT

I recomend to try Quark (http://www.planetquake.com/quark) - good modern editor, constantly updated, supports all major games (q3 included), very powerfull and relatevely easy to learn.

But radiant/bsp(another nice q1/q2 qer-like editor) own with its ability to adjust textures right in 3d window with your mouse.

btw, is it possible to have textures displayed as 64 square tumbnails in any radiant ?

#1023 Posted by GrindSpire [213.122.38.45], 13/05/2001 11:28 GMT , Refers to Post #1021

I have enough space =)

Oh, and I forgot, I have a second QERadiant install which has been set-up for Half-Life.

So that'd be 7 different versions...

#1024 Posted by Lucas [205.188.193.23], 13/05/2001 22:16 GMT

I was wondering if a kind individual would do the honor of vising my map for me. Of course, it could just be the fact that I'm impatient. I waited two hours, then when I pressed ctrl-alt-del to exit out of it, it said that it was no longer responding.

My computer is a 100 mhz pentium with only 32 ram and 4 mb graphics card. I need someone with a fast pc to vis for me. Could anyone be willing to do this for me?

#1025 Posted by Biff_Debris [205.188.199.168], 13/05/2001 22:24 GMT , Refers to Post #1024

If your map's q1/q2, I can do it. Send me the .map file and whatever textures you're using (if they're standard id stuff, just lemme know).

Meanwhile, get a new PC (hehe).

Who Needs A Title Anyway

#1026 Posted by DeFrag [208.49.10.160], 14/05/2001 04:25 GMT

When It Says Not Responding...

#1027 Posted by Tron [203.38.138.22], 14/05/2001 04:48 GMT , Refers to Post #1024

when it says not responding when you ctrl-alt-delete it doesn't mean anythings wrong, it always says that.

Tron

#1028 Posted by The Lieutenant [144.32.177.167], 14/05/2001 11:03 GMT

but why compile on a 100Mhz when you can get it done on a 1Ghz? Unless you're going for the vis record of course.

Hey, I wonder if vis would run on my Amstrad 1512?

#1029 Posted by Biff_Debris [205.188.192.56], 14/05/2001 15:34 GMT

His map's only got 540 brushes, but after over an hour, I cut VIS off, too. I mean shit, my 2000 brush sp map only takes around 10 minutes (400 mhz AMD K6-2, btw)!

I told him to get a second opinion, but I think he may want to redo the design.

Map Lighting Probs..

#1030 Posted by Dominion [212.228.46.214], 14/05/2001 23:03 GMT

Hi all,

I've kinda started mapping again after a long break, and thus have started learning GTK Radiant. Everything is going well - i've created my 'hello world' of mapping (2 connected rooms .. like woah).

The problem being is that when I add a light entity (the basic no frills one) and do a compile (i've tried various - the usual one I use is 'BSP_FastVis (light -extra)). When I load the map it is fullbright - and there 2 errors listed when I drop to the console:

Couldn't find image for shader dom/levelshots.tga
WARNING: light grid mismatch

Any ideas anyone? ://

Mapping Probs Continued..

#1031 Posted by Dominion [212.228.46.214], 14/05/2001 23:19 GMT

Just a FYI that i've followed the advice given here:

http://quake3.qeradiant.com/q3afiles/fbright.htm

and still have no joy .. :(

#1032 Posted by Scampie [206.152.135.106], 15/05/2001 00:06 GMT , Refers to Post #1030

the first error you have there just means you haven't made a levelshot for the map yet, which is no big deal.

the second means that there is no lightmap, therefore you're map is fullbright as you can see. you need to add complexity to the map to make it compile the light right. even if you've tried "the spur", you may want to try adding multiple "spurs".

Light Hates Me :p

#1033 Posted by Dominion [212.228.46.214], 15/05/2001 00:21 GMT , Refers to Post #1032

Cheers Scampie - i've since added two curve meshes and there are now 8 "spurs". I'm starting to wonder if my light.exe or whatever is used these days is broken.

I guess downloading a test map from somewhere and bsping that should be a good enough test. Anyone got a 'test' map that _definitely_ lights ok handy? :)

Grouping Etc

#1034 Posted by Dominion [212.228.46.214], 15/05/2001 00:26 GMT

I've also been trying to find where you 'group' brushes together and add 'visgroups' as per the days of Worldcraft .. are these still around?

I'm gonna get me a print out of the Q3R manual tomorrow so hopefully I won't waste too much more of your time :)

Ok, Q3R has me beat t'night - i'll be back for more tomorrow. Did everyone have this much agro converting from Worldcraft/Qoole etc? or is it just me? ;o)

#1035 Posted by Biff_Debris [205.188.198.181], 15/05/2001 01:00 GMT , Refers to Post #1034

I never had a problem with Q3Radiant or GTKRadiant -- but my machine did. Learning to use Radiant never seemed to be that big of a deal.

If You Want . . .

#1036 Posted by pjw [24.4.254.112], 15/05/2001 01:54 GMT , Refers to Post #1034

I could just email you the current thing that I'm working on that I started on Saturday . . . it lights fine in about two or three minutes . . . and you could throw that into your map file. Let me know.

I converted over from Qoole and it wasn't too much of a problem--and I now like it much more.

Lol @hello World

#1037 Posted by NotoriousRay [141.157.90.68], 15/05/2001 01:56 GMT

heh, didn't realize that was such a universal thing

printf("Hello World!\n");

only funny cuz i had to do it this semester

#1038 Posted by GrindSpire [213.122.11.89], 15/05/2001 06:40 GMT , Refers to Post #1030

Just bring down the console, or failing that use the vid_restart command. That tends to get it to display the lightmap.

#1039 Posted by Maj [194.82.103.140], 15/05/2001 07:20 GMT , Refers to Post #1033

starting to wonder if my light.exe or whatever is used these days is broken.

Your light compiler is fine, it's an known engine problem. Should be fixed in the next point release.

#1040 Posted by Dominion [194.203.177.122], 15/05/2001 09:25 GMT

for all the responses guys! - a big help :)

pjw please do send me that small map and i'll give it a compile when I get home t'night. Cheers!

NotoriousRay ahhh the joy that is hello world eh? - a tradition that will never be truly ended and one that can be applied to mapping for sure (when your map looks like mine does at the moment anyways :p)

I have to admit that besides these niggles the Radiant learning is going well - still looking for that group button though :o)

Thanks again all.

Try This...

#1041 Posted by mortn [129.187.208.100], 15/05/2001 12:11 GMT , Refers to Post #1030

Try making the map more complex. It�s a known bug. Just add things, after a while it will be properly lit.

Fullbright Bug

#1042 Posted by Shallow[BAP] [212.229.87.1], 15/05/2001 21:13 GMT

This is much worse in the current version of Q3A than in older ones. The old tricks like console toggling and vid_restart don't work. Basically until memory usage for the map hits a certain level (typically when the bsp size gets over 200K, but it can need as much as 400K sometimes) the lightmap IS compiled but for reasons unknown the engine does not render it.

I had a test box-map recently that suddenly started showing the lightmap, without me actually rebuilding the bsp, when I added an extra stage to one of the shaders I was testing.

As has been said already, add more stuff, but it seems that loading more textures helps too.

Not Really "mapping", But

#1043 Posted by Biff_Debris [152.163.205.73], 15/05/2001 23:21 GMT

I still need help. I can't get GL support for Quake 2 and GLQuake (Q2 just displays "no acceleration hardware detected" and GLQ has a mighty bizarre purple half-screen), even after reinstalling video card drivers and DirectX (for what it's worth). I got it to work befroe, but cannot remember for the life of me. Help, or else my Q2 project may go to Doom2.

Paper Thin Glass

#1044 Posted by The Cream Enjin [195.92.67.68], 16/05/2001 00:01 GMT

In radiant how do i get nil thickness glass that draws on both sides of brush or patch? ive seen it done just wondered how..

Pick The Right Shader

#1045 Posted by Lunaran [205.188.199.26], 16/05/2001 00:19 GMT

some glass shaders don't cull the backsides of faces. look through sfx.shader and find a glass shader that has one of the following lines in it:

cull none
cull disable

then put that texture on one face of a brush, and texture the other faces with "nodraw".

Who Needs A Title Anyway

#1046 Posted by The Cream Enjin [195.92.67.69], 16/05/2001 00:27 GMT

And Remember

#1047 Posted by Lunaran [205.188.199.26], 16/05/2001 00:35 GMT

if you find a glass shader you want but it doesn't have that line in it, just writing it in won't fix it. You're only changing the shader for yourself, everyone else will see it the original way.

Waitaminute.

#1048 Posted by Biff_Debris [152.163.207.197], 16/05/2001 00:36 GMT

What about my GL problem? Daaang.

Opengl Problems

#1049 Posted by Shadowdane [64.20.68.245], 16/05/2001 00:37 GMT , Refers to Post #1043

seems u have an opengl problem.. well most likely that is. :)

first go search for
opengl32.dll
glu32.dll

these should only be found in c:\windows\system\
if you find those files anywhere else you can probably delete them. just make a backup of anything you are about to delete incase it breaks some other game. ;)

now that u have cleaned up any unauthorized dll files.. try running it again. If you still have the problem, try installing these .dll files.

openGL32.dll & GLu32.dll Download
these are drivers from a WinME install.. they also work on Win98 system i tested it.

just unzip them in c:\windows\system
reboot then try running again.. if still no luck I would reinstall the video card drivers.

if you have an nvidia video card I have provided instructions on how to remove and reinstall those drivers in WinME. Win98 isn't that different..

ok first off.. goto the Display Properties, Settings Tab, then Advanced Options.. goto the Adapter Tab and change your Display Adapter to: Standard PCI Graphics Adapter (VGA). Now reboot

after your system reboots, open the file search tool.. and search for nv*.* you can safely delete these files.. make a backup if you wish.
c:\windows\system\
NVARCH16 DLL
NVARCH32 DLL
NVCORE VXD
NVDISP DRV
NVINST32 DLL
NVMODE DLL
NVDD32 DLL
NVMINI VXD
NVMINI2 VXD
NVOPENGL DLL
NVCPL DLL
NVDESK32 DLL
NVDMCPL DLL
NVQTWK DLL
c:\windows\help
NVCPL HLP

after erasing the files, you can reboot if you wish but you shouldn't have to. The standard VGA driver should still be installed. Now lets reinstall the nvidia display driver.

I highly recommend the v11.01 drivers - yes these are beta/leaked drivers. But I have found them to be the fastest, and most stable. To be safe you can use the standard v6.50 drivers off nvidia's website.. just grab the .exe version and run it to install the drivers.

Download v11.01 Detonators

If you wish to install the v11.01 drivers, unzip these to a temp directory.. c:\nvwin9x_1101 is what i use.

Then go back to the adapter settings on the display properties.. and click Change, then "Specify the location of the driver (Advanced)" and click next. check the "Display a list of all the drivers in a specific location, so you can select the driver you want." then click next. Click the "Have Disk" option, and point it to the c:\nvwin9x_1101 folder, and select the .inf file in that folder.

now click ok.. until is installs the drivers. :)
after your reboot, you should be up and running.. if not then i would try reinstalling Q1/Q2.

good luck..
-Shadow

Impatient Little...

#1050 Posted by Shadowdane [64.20.68.245], 16/05/2001 00:41 GMT , Refers to Post #1048

hehe.. impatient aren't we.
it took me a long time to type that... it better work otherwise i'll have to kill you.

hehe

#1051 Posted by The Cream Enjin [195.92.67.69], 16/05/2001 00:44 GMT

Some one DOES care Biff

#1052 Posted by DaZ [62.7.115.128], 16/05/2001 00:53 GMT

I can understand you getting upset about Q1 not working, but Q2, ppfffft

#1053 Posted by Biff_Debris [205.188.199.167], 16/05/2001 00:59 GMT

Thanks SD. But I already have both the .dlls in the windows/system directory, and have repeatedly re-installed my drivers and the game (Q2, at least -- couldn't really give a shit about GLQuake). Oh yeah, I wish I had a nvidia card (ATI Rage Pro).

#1054 Posted by Shadowdane [64.20.68.245], 16/05/2001 01:04 GMT

ati.. hmm
never owned one so i really dont know, if you can download the ati drivers and unzip them into a folder so u can see the list of files.

after install the VGA driver, delete the ATI files in c:\windows\system and try to reinstall the ATI drivers.

does any other opengl games work?? Q3, Half-Life, Serious Sam?

if you cant get it working i really dont know.. maybe time to format/reload? yuck!

Biff_Debris

#1055 Posted by Speedy [213.158.1.58], 16/05/2001 02:50 GMT

Win shambler`s contest to get a proper 3d card ;)

#1056 Posted by pjw [24.4.254.113], 16/05/2001 04:05 GMT , Refers to Post #1040

I sent it. My mail server's a bit screwed at the moment, so I hope you get it.

#1057 Posted by pjw [24.4.254.112], 16/05/2001 04:11 GMT , Refers to Post #1044

Lun said: if you find a glass shader you want but it doesn't have that line in it, just writing it in won't fix it. You're only changing the shader for yourself, everyone else will see it the original way.

Unless, of course, you include your altered shader in your pk3--but if you do so, please rename the shader (.shader name and the name of the shader itself) to something specific to your map (e.g. creamglass) to avoid potential conflicts with id shaders and other custom shaders.

Sorry if you know that already, but a lot of people are unclear on the concept, so I erred on the side of being obvious.

Why? (Not Really Offtopic)

#1058 Posted by Kreator [194.17.220.2], 16/05/2001 09:32 GMT

Why did I go o school today, I could have been up all night mapping instead. Woken up at three and started mapping again. But no, I'm sitting in my schools computer room waiting for the bus to come and take me home... Only onw hour left now.. =(=(

Well, at least I can check the mapping community.

Cheers!

School Sucks.

#1059 Posted by metlslime [140.142.171.94], 16/05/2001 20:03 GMT

drop out like i did!

#1060 Posted by park [47.230.0.42], 16/05/2001 21:12 GMT

creamglass...

sounds like an interesting 'shader'...

#1061 Posted by XeNoN [62.7.185.150], 16/05/2001 21:27 GMT

drop out like i did!

just 33 more days.... just 33.....

#1062 Posted by Biff_Debris [205.188.200.59], 16/05/2001 22:42 GMT , Refers to Post #1054

yuck!

Yuck is right. More like FUCK, really. I think I'm coming closer to taking the plunge again, and getting a P4/GeForce Ass-Kicker.

An Idea Of Mine...

#1063 Posted by Lucas [152.163.207.72], 17/05/2001 02:42 GMT

I know...it's bad to get ideas in a persons head, but this has been rolling around for a while.

Consider a deathmatch match...it has a certain layout and item placement. What if we made a deathmatch that was almost completely interactive...

Just think...a deathmatch map that is only one room, but there are numerous buttons on the walls. Depending on which buttons you press or shoot at, walls emerge within the little room or the ground raises up. In this kind of a deathmatch, you couldn't rely on brute force totally, but your brain...another scary thought. You'd have to think of a way to kill your opponent. Before he shoots you do you:

a) push a button that actives a wall inbetween you too...
b) push a button that raises him off the ground

or..

c) push a button that kills him instantly

Of course, this would all depend on your locations in the room and you'd have to think fast to implement strategy.

Am I the first one who has thought this up? I doubt it, but can anyone comment on this? Would it be neat...is it possible?

#1064 Posted by Biff_Debris [152.163.197.76], 17/05/2001 03:28 GMT , Refers to Post #1063

I don't think I've ever heard of that before -- neat idea Lucas, except mebbe the insta-kill button. That might be the equivalent of a BFG in Q2. But a manipulated environment, toggled by remote control, is actually pretty tempting. It's not like it's never been done before, to a smaller degree, but an entire map devoted to a Machivellian theme -- wicked. And probably possible to some degree, even with standard entities.

Definitely a brain-muncher.

Dark City...

#1065 Posted by palldjon [203.29.11.8], 17/05/2001 03:48 GMT , Refers to Post #1064

yes, yes, yes! Go for it Lucas.

Hmm, What Game?

#1066 Posted by Tron [203.30.236.72], 17/05/2001 04:04 GMT

That sounds pretty cool but you'd have troubles playing over the net with that many entities in the level, if you can do it it sounds really fun though.

Tron

That's True

#1067 Posted by Biff_Debris [205.188.199.34], 17/05/2001 11:43 GMT , Refers to Post #1066

but you'd have troubles playing over the net with that many entities in the level

Mebbe a small map, or a larger version for LANs and such?

#1068 Posted by Grahf [209.145.70.156], 17/05/2001 23:46 GMT

33 more days for you? I pity ya, I got like 21. ;)

#1069 Posted by The Lieutenant [144.32.177.102], 18/05/2001 13:48 GMT

I'm at Uni for another 6 weeks - but at least I get a T-3 to play with while I'm here...

#1070 Posted by Lunaran [206.68.160.2], 18/05/2001 14:17 GMT

#1071 Posted by GrindSpire [213.122.125.46], 18/05/2001 14:32 GMT , Refers to Post #1070

7 days...

But I then have another year =)

#1072 Posted by The Lieutenant [144.32.177.102], 18/05/2001 14:55 GMT

OK, so I probably lose cos I have another 3 years to go, but hey...

Hee Hee Hee

#1073 Posted by Lucas [205.188.197.36], 18/05/2001 17:17 GMT

I was out of school for the summer on April 20th!! Can anyone beat that?

Hmm, No Title

#1074 Posted by XeNoN [213.120.56.57], 18/05/2001 17:55 GMT

well, I finished last week... my exams finish in 31 days from now, then it's on to college

I Bet Shambler Could

#1075 Posted by Lunaran [172.159.129.71], 18/05/2001 23:00 GMT

isn't he a 41 year old in his undershirt living in a trailer park?

#1076 Posted by Biff_Debris [64.12.101.152], 19/05/2001 00:06 GMT , Refers to Post #1075

Yeah -- he pays rent with downloaded pr0n and mp3s.

#1077 Posted by The Lieutenant [144.32.177.156], 19/05/2001 15:10 GMT

Shambler's English isn't he? We don't have "trailer parks" here.

That's What You Think

#1078 Posted by Lunaran [172.128.5.126], 19/05/2001 16:10 GMT

#1079 Posted by The Lieutenant [144.32.177.156], 19/05/2001 16:57 GMT

that's just what I thought.

Anyone else like to enter this (un)informed discussion?

#1080 Posted by Biff_Debris [205.188.192.41], 19/05/2001 20:50 GMT , Refers to Post #1077

Sure you do, you've probably just got a much more polite name for them.

I Need Some People To Look At My Map.

#1081 Posted by Austin [213.104.168.254], 19/05/2001 23:09 GMT

It is a Quake 1 map for deathmatch, probably fit about 4 to 8 players in, but I'd need suggestions on that as I've never played it with anyone else.

ABCool3 is the name and this is my third attempt(Not completely finished yet, this is why I'm asking for ideas on what to put in)

EMAIL ME with your comments on it and ideas on what I could add to it, as I won't be returning for a while. ( tiger_chicken@hotmail.com )

Download it at http://homepage.ntlworld.com/brocks/ (you can find my other maps there too :o))

Austin

#1082 Posted by Speedy [213.158.1.141], 20/05/2001 04:23 GMT , Refers to Post #1075

is not "he"
I bet she is a woman

#1083 Posted by GrindSpire [213.122.195.106], 20/05/2001 09:00 GMT

Actually, the fact that Shambler is male and lives in south England are the only two things we know...

And we call them caravan sites

#1084 Posted by Apollo [213.123.26.119], 20/05/2001 10:20 GMT

Yes it does sound more polite

#1085 Posted by The Lieutenant [144.32.177.154], 20/05/2001 13:45 GMT

Fair enough, caravan sites. I'd forgotten about that hideous part of British culture, populated mostly by humanities teachers and retired humanities teachers.

#1086 Posted by Grahf [209.145.71.91], 20/05/2001 15:24 GMT

Try it with some Omibots, perhaps?

Caravan Sites

#1087 Posted by Biff_Debris [205.188.197.172], 20/05/2001 19:24 GMT

Do they attract tornados like our trailer parks do? Or do you guys have a nice name for those too ("blusters", "blathers" or "bothers")?

#1088 Posted by The Cream Enjin [195.92.67.69], 20/05/2001 20:12 GMT

Does any1 know where i can find a decent lift tutorial for Q3?

New version of GTk is rather good!

Biff You Tart

#1089 Posted by The Lieutenant [144.32.128.132], 20/05/2001 20:54 GMT

We don't get tornadoes. Just rain.

Lifts Again

#1090 Posted by The Cream Enjin [195.92.67.72], 20/05/2001 22:08 GMT

Can any1 tell me how to make a simple lift, I have a good understanding of radiant so it doesnt have to be too in depth.

#1091 Posted by GrindSpire [213.122.136.46], 20/05/2001 22:19 GMT , Refers to Post #1090

Use a func_plat

(That shallow enough for you? =)

#1092 Posted by The Cream Enjin [195.92.67.72], 20/05/2001 22:28 GMT

That'll do :)

THANKS

#1093 Posted by Biff_Debris [152.163.197.197], 20/05/2001 23:05 GMT , Refers to Post #1089

Well I guess it's good that things are predictable, at least =)

Vrajgh Thought A Title Wasn't Needed

#1094 Posted by Vrajgh [213.1.129.67], 21/05/2001 20:11 GMT

umm.... we do get tornadoes occassionally, just they are very small ones. Didn't you see the pics after the storms last september? There was one on the Kent coast I think.

#1095 Posted by The Lieutenant [144.32.177.186], 21/05/2001 21:27 GMT

I don't hold with any of that freaky southern 'weather'.

TOO MANY EFRAGS!

#1096 Posted by palldjon@uni [131.172.4.45], 22/05/2001 00:13 GMT

Game = Q1SP
Editor = WC

"Rumours" is ready to send off to Speedy, Biff and Scraggy for final testing but when I load the .bsp "TOO MANY EFRAGS!" goes scrolling down the console. The level runs, if somewhat jerkily. Is it an entity problem?

Also, I'd like to include a co-op start. Is it just a matter of placing a "player2start" in the appropriate place?

#1097 Posted by Biff_Debris [152.163.197.47], 22/05/2001 01:04 GMT , Refers to Post #1096

Have no idea what the "efrags" thing is about -- or co-op starts for that matter, but I still can't wait to see the map.

/me hates being so useless!

Whatsdiz???

#1098 Posted by infiniface [195.56.84.209], 22/05/2001 01:33 GMT

I can't compile my map, though I tried every brush repair tool I have... The VIS phase says:

9581 portalclusters
34201 numportals
37692 numfaces
************ ERROR ************
MAX_MAP_VISIBILITY exceeded

aaaaahhhh!!! pleaseeee!

Sounds Like You're Not Using Detail.

#1099 Posted by pjw [208.192.76.75], 22/05/2001 01:49 GMT , Refers to Post #1098

Detail brushes, that is. This will cause the visibility calculations (especially on large maps) to become too complicated.

Words of wisdom, cut-and-pasted from Johnny Law:
The surfaces of a detail brush are not involved in defining the BSP tree for the map.

Since the whole concept of visibility in Q3 revolves around using the nodes of the BSP tree, this means that detail brushes do not block visibility. If you make a wall detail, then as far as the visibility calculations for Q3 are concerned, that wall might as well not be there.

This reduces the amount of visibility information that has to be calculated and stored for your map (the "visdata"), but it's a power you must use wisely or else your r_speeds will increase.

In many cases the use of detail brushes is a no-brainer. For example, if you've constructed a small decorative doodad out of brushes, something that is to be attached to the wall/ceiling/floor, then make all of its brushes detail. There is absolutely no reason that q3map should have to think about that doodad when figuring out the visibility information for the map.

For larger things though... before you decide to make them detail, you should really understand the compile process and how detail is involved in it. There's probably several links about this on claudec's tutorials page. The two I usually recommend are SPoG's and Geoff DeWan's. Note that Geoff DeWan's tutorial covers both Q2 and Q3 -- the two engines are a bit different, so pay close attention when he explains the differences (those instances are marked with a little Q3-Quad symbol).

It's also a subject that has been discussed many times on this board, so do a bit of searching.

In any case, remember this: Always caulk all hidden faces on detail brushes. And also, always caulk any hidden faces on other brushes if those faces are at least partially hidden by detail brushes. The reasons for this are explained in the tutorials and etc. Just don't forget to do it. Actually if you just make a habit of always caulking all hidden faces, you should be cool, no matter what you make detail.

#1100 Posted by infiniface [195.56.84.209], 22/05/2001 01:57 GMT

Thanks. I think it will help. It 'll take some time to work out :)))

Tomorrow Biff...

#1101 Posted by palldjon@uni [131.172.4.45], 22/05/2001 04:13 GMT , Refers to Post #1097

and I reduced the number of entities to 599 (I seemed to remember 600 as some sort of magical limit for some reason) and the EFRAGS! message didn't scroll. None of the bitey, spitting, tearing ents were deleted.

Still need an answer on the co-op start. As I'd like it tested.

Re: TOO MANY EFRAGS!

#1102 Posted by Tyrann [203.56.239.200], 22/05/2001 04:23 GMT , Refers to Post #1096

...when I load the .bsp "TOO MANY EFRAGS!" goes scrolling down the console. The level runs, if somewhat jerkily. Is it an entity problem?

I had this problem with Moonlight Assault and I emailed Carmack about it. I don't seem to have a copy of the message any more, but what he said was something like this...

He said that "efrag" stands for entity fragment and that when an entity is placed in a map it generates one or more entity fragments (only entities with models count I think - i.e. not lights and stuff). Usually an entity only generates a few of these, but if the goemetry in the immediate error is complex, then it could generate dozens.

What caused the problem for me (I think) was that the large number of flames that I placed directly over my "flame holders" all around the map. Removing a few of these flames got rid of the problem.

Hopefully that helps you in some way.

Grahf, Texture Hunter

#1103 Posted by Grahf [209.145.79.34], 22/05/2001 05:02 GMT

Alright, I'm looking for Arabian-themed textures. I've been inspired to try my hand at Q3 editing, so I'm courting something that is one part Arabian Nights, one part Lovecraft's excellent "Imprisoned With the Pharaohs," and one part The DooM That Came to Dunwich.

That, or I'll do the most depressing, opressive, dirty, and industrial arcane factory I can conjure up. Haven't really decided yet. :)

So, pray, can ne-one point out some good textures for such ventures? (I've got the industrial covered already. /me spooges on HH3 Vendetta)

Tyrann Rules...

#1104 Posted by palldjon@uni [131.172.4.44], 22/05/2001 06:59 GMT , Refers to Post #1102

although I'm wondering when you got the opportunity to peek at my level

. It was too many

s in the way of torches in torch holders. I'm heading home and offline now, so I guess the co-op implementation will have to wait until after the testing - although I'd still like the know how.

#1105 Posted by The Lieutenant [144.32.177.126], 22/05/2001 08:35 GMT

Just put in info_player_coop's in the appropriate area. If you don't have any it'll use a info_player_start instead, but if you have one it will *only* use that one, so put in more than one.

I *think* that makes sense.

#1106 Posted by GlassMan [195.184.253.80], 22/05/2001 10:21 GMT

The problem can also be caused by having too many brushes in a brush model or very complex brush models. I don't know what the limit is though.

On the subject of limits I don't know where the figure of 600 comes from. I found that the limit on brush models is 256 & the limit on total entities (brush & point) is 2048. This is with v1.08 is quake.exe or later. v1.06 may have a lower limit on the total number.

Entity Limit

#1107 Posted by The Lieutenant [144.32.177.157], 22/05/2001 10:45 GMT

The maximum entity limit of 600 is hard-coded into the engine.

#1108 Posted by GlassMan [195.184.253.80], 22/05/2001 14:35 GMT , Refers to Post #1107

I had 2039 entities in gmsp1 so it can't have been hard-coded very well

That map used custents but afaik that doesn't have code to up the entity count.

#1109 Posted by GlassMan [195.184.253.80], 22/05/2001 14:36 GMT

includes lights of course..maybe theres a separate limit for non-light entities?

The 600 Limit...

#1110 Posted by Tyrann [203.56.239.111], 22/05/2001 17:52 GMT , Refers to Post #1106

I think the figure 600 people are referring to is the hardcoded limit on "edicts". These are basically entities that do have a model or get triggered. For example, static lights don't count but switching lights do.

If you want to check how many edicts you are using, type "edictcount" at the console.

More On Efrags:

#1111 Posted by CZG [195.159.54.18], 22/05/2001 21:57 GMT

also if you're making a large level and turn all your tiny bits and bobs into one gigant func_wall or func_illusionary, you get the same thing because the boundingbox of the entity spans, well probably your entire level. (I did this in czg07 a lot.)
I fixed it by splitting the large entity up into many small ones or just by reverting them back to world.
I had no idea you could get this with 'model models' though, I learn something new every day. Except for yesterday...

XeNoN Is Still Working On A Title

#1112 Posted by XeNoN [213.120.56.57], 22/05/2001 22:03 GMT

func_wall or func_illusionary

what are the advantages of these? i dunno why they are used so much

#1113 Posted by XeNoN [213.120.56.57], 22/05/2001 22:05 GMT

Oh and I know what they're used for, I just dont see the point in putting detail in them unnecessarily, like illusionary teleport brushes, or certain brush groups as a func wall (like the exit in CZG's 100b2 moon map)

Who Needs A Title Anyway

#1114 Posted by metlslime [140.142.172.133], 22/05/2001 22:11 GMT

efrags: if an entity occupies more than one bsp leaf, it probably has to be split into pieces so that the bsp visibility method works.

func_wall: doesn't cut up the bsp tree, thereby simplifying compiling and sometimes lowering r_speeds. Can be removed by killtargeting.

func_illusionary: it's not solid, silly. Therefore, you can walk through it. Aside from using it for a secret, you can use it to make things like little blades of grass that dont trip up the player. (i think A3 had this)

Hmmmm Problems

#1115 Posted by The Cream Enjin [195.92.67.67], 22/05/2001 23:23 GMT

I am having a problem with radiant (all versions). If i load a map with radiant and select any brush i can see a mirror image of that brush just behind it(mirror image is upside down). the 2 brushes are joined by 2 lines that cross over and the closer i try to move to the mirrored brush the further away it gets.
If i "load" a map in radiant i can see 2 versions of the same map and all the brushes are joined.

I have tried adjusting the views and Edit/prefferances settings, uninstalling both Q3 and radiant deleting all files then reinstalling but with no luck.

What have i missed?
Am i a fool?
Or is radiant being wierd?
Can someone please help me before i start braking things?

#1116 Posted by The Cream Enjin [195.92.67.67], 22/05/2001 23:30 GMT

The grids have just 1 slanted line sometimes

#1117 Posted by Lunaran [152.163.213.189], 23/05/2001 00:48 GMT

That sounds seriously fucked up. Report it ASAP.

#1118 Posted by The Cream Enjin [195.92.67.66], 23/05/2001 01:20 GMT

Man do i feel stupid...
Updated Radeon drivers for win2k, problem sorted.
But the drivers i was using were only about 3 months old.

Be warned radeon users!!!

Terrain Editor Here

#1119 Posted by The Cream Enjin [195.92.67.70], 23/05/2001 02:29 GMT

Stumbled accross an easy to use terrain generation tool for Quake 3. Get Easygen here

ARGH! ! WTF Is A Leafnode?

#1120 Posted by Jimbo [216.12.59.47], 23/05/2001 03:22 GMT

The Quark qbsp (txqbsp.exe) gives me this error when compiling my Q1 map.

************ ERROR ************
Mixed face contents in leafnode

all the other qbsps i have (qbsp.exe, wqbsp.exe, and the open quartz qbsp.exe)
give me this error...

************ ERROR ************
numtexinfo == MAX_MAP_TEXINFO

Does it have something to do with textures?
What is does that mean?

How does one fix it?

-Jimbo

Buggery Fuck

#1121 Posted by Seth [213.1.95.198], 23/05/2001 04:32 GMT

you know that thing when qbsp crashes when compiling from wc1.6? good, cos i fekin dont

it gets to
building hulls sequentially
Brush_LoadEntity then dies... any ideas? up to about 5 mins b4 i had no probs.. and all i did since the last compile was align some tex afaik so im a tad lost...
.rmf or .map available if u can check it out... cheers

Re: ARGH! ! WTF Is A Leafnode?

#1122 Posted by Tyrann [203.56.239.111], 23/05/2001 06:45 GMT , Refers to Post #1120

I'm not sure about the texinfo error but I know you can have up to 255 textures in a bsp. That's probably not your problem...

The mixed contents in leafnode means that the compiler couldn't tell whether to make a leafnode solid, slime, lava, water or sky. This usually means you have done one of two things:

a) You have a brush with different kinds of faces, like one solid and one water/sky/whatever.

b) You have two different kinds of liquids touching - e.g. a water brush touching a sky brush

#1123 Posted by palldjon [203.29.11.38], 23/05/2001 07:57 GMT , Refers to Post #1105

sorry I'm a bit brain dead at the moment. Could you please re-phrase that, I didn't understand.

#1124 Posted by The Lieutenant [144.32.177.129], 23/05/2001 12:18 GMT

Where you want your co-op starts, put info_player_coops.

Palldjon...

#1125 Posted by XeNoN [213.120.56.41], 23/05/2001 17:45 GMT

Where you want your co-op starts, put info_player_coops.

That's the enitity entitled "info_player_coop" in the plural

Hmm, No Title

#1126 Posted by Jimbo [164.106.40.96], 23/05/2001 19:06 GMT , Refers to Post #1122

OK thanks,
I'll look into that when i get home.

Further Explanation

#1127 Posted by The Lieutenant [144.32.128.132], 23/05/2001 22:58 GMT

Just to belabour the point:

X X X X

0

X = info_player_coop
0 = info_player_start

In coop games, only X's will be used, and not the 0, unless all the X's have been taken (maybe).

#1128 Posted by The Lieutenant [144.32.128.132], 23/05/2001 22:59 GMT

it removed my spaces!!!

X---X---X---X
-------------
------0------

#1129 Posted by The Lieutenant [144.32.128.132], 23/05/2001 22:59 GMT

anyone know a good fixed width font?

#1130 Posted by The Lieutenant [144.32.128.132], 23/05/2001 22:59 GMT

That's three posts in a row!

#1131 Posted by The Lieutenant [144.32.128.132], 23/05/2001 23:00 GMT

Hang on, no, that makes four....

...and this makes 5!

#1132 Posted by palldjon [203.29.11.38], 24/05/2001 00:23 GMT , Refers to Post #1127

NOW I've got it. Your a champ Lieutenant.

#1133 Posted by Biff_Debris [152.163.205.84], 24/05/2001 01:04 GMT , Refers to Post #1129

How 'bout "Spaceage Round", from the boys at House Industries? Just read an article about them in Juxtapoz, and they kill.

And the font's neat, too =)

#1134 Posted by Biff_Debris [152.163.205.84], 24/05/2001 01:04 GMT

www.houseindustries.com

Map_map_texinfo Error

#1135 Posted by Grahf [209.145.69.52], 24/05/2001 03:01 GMT

************ ERROR ************
numtexinfo == MAX_MAP_TEXINFO

I am reasonably positive that a quake map can have a maximum of 2 megabytes of texture data in the bsp. Upon a successful compile, qbsp will spit out the amount of entdata and visdata, along with texdata or somesuch, all in bytes. If that texdata number surpasses 2 megs, well then you're out of luck. Shrink a few textures, consolidate your texture usage, etc.

I just hit this error today, as I plough ahead on a massive Rune-textured city, clothed in those massive Rune textures. ;) I'll need to shrink a few, methinks.

Hey Seth...

#1136 Posted by palldjon [203.29.11.38], 25/05/2001 06:19 GMT , Refers to Post #1121

did you get some help on that prob? I have a notion as to what might be going on if you heven't had a response yet.

#1137 Posted by Biff_Debris [152.163.207.211], 25/05/2001 09:24 GMT

I looked at his .rmf, and according to WC there's an "invalid solid structure", which means some heavy vertex amnipulation went for the worst. I'd recommend at least a backup version you could mebbe diddle with, Seth.

#1138 Posted by Seth [213.1.139.159], 26/05/2001 01:30 GMT , Refers to Post #1137

yeah i popped into #tf and got some help in there... seems i b0rk3d up a brush somehow... just exported to .map and reimported... cheers tho biff/palldjon

Maths !!!!NO!!!!

#1139 Posted by DaZ [213.1.93.85], 26/05/2001 17:57 GMT

Ok, I have a 64x64x64 curve with 8 segments in Q1, and I want the textures to curve with the brush (instead of going strait up

) but I just cant get it to look right.

Could someone help a very frustrated man out and tell me how much I should rotate the texture on each segment of the curve PLEASE

#1140 Posted by XeNoN [212.126.141.179], 27/05/2001 00:40 GMT

Firstly, I'd highly recommened using 7 segments in curves instead of 8, as no-one notices the difference in game. Then, rotation values are simple: 0, 15, 30, 45, 60, 75, 90 (is that 7 or 5?)

Hope this helps.

F33r M� 1337 M4th Sk1llz

#1141 Posted by Grahf [209.145.68.66], 27/05/2001 00:59 GMT

I don't know Xenon, but what I DO know is that if DaZ bases his curve off of the holy 0:2 2:4 4:2 2:0 aspect ratio (subset of the Most Holy 12 sided cylinder) then the rotation values will always be 0, 90, 27, 64, -27, or -64 (positive or negative depends on how the curve is oriented).

DaZ, post a picture of the non-cooperative curve, then I'll have a better idea if I'm being any help here or not.

Oh wait... is the curve a 0:2 1:4 2:4 3:3 4:2 4:1 2:0 ratio? If so, then

A) the ratios should be very similar to the above, but with +-13.5 and +-77.5 on the 1:4 and the 4:1. I *think*.

B) that's way to high-res for 64*64*64. 256*256*256 would be a bare minimum for that much detail.

Confused yet?

Or just use a flat noise texture...

#1142 Posted by GrindSpire [213.122.193.187], 27/05/2001 08:06 GMT

That's off the Most Holy 16 sided cylinder Grahf =)

Personally I always use 3 sides per 90 degrees, ie, 1:4 3:3 4:1

#1143 Posted by Biff_Debris [152.163.205.64], 27/05/2001 15:06 GMT

Has anyone had the thing where you turn around a corner or something in a q1 map, and all of the sudden you're ninety yards away from the rest of the map in the Grey Void, with a collection of baddies from the area you had "meant" to go to? Hmm?

More importantly, is this necessarily my fault? Say it ain't so.

Right.......

#1144 Posted by DaZ [213.122.88.133], 27/05/2001 15:44 GMT

I'll go try that then

if I go all bodged again then I'll post a screenie... Thanks all

Hmm, No Title

#1145 Posted by Grahf [209.145.68.49], 27/05/2001 15:59 GMT

grindspire: yes, but I don't think the textures align quite as easily to that.

biff: no. You mean a trigger_teleport massively misfired, and sent you and a bunch of monsters into the void? Or is there just a big hole in your map?

Either way, make it a major plot element in your map!

j/k

#1146 Posted by Biff_Debris [205.188.197.161], 27/05/2001 16:27 GMT , Refers to Post #1145

<q?You mean a trigger_teleport massively misfired, and sent you and a bunch of monsters into the void? Or is there just a big hole in your map?

Naw -- everything should be hunky-dory, here. I'm thinking it might be too many baddies (entities) in the area (five in practically one place), or something -- I dunno, tho. Arrgh.

#1147 Posted by Biff_Debris [205.188.197.161], 27/05/2001 16:28 GMT

Why am I posting in Times New Roman?

Oh -- Silly Me.

#1148 Posted by Biff_Debris [205.188.197.161], 27/05/2001 16:31 GMT

You mean a trigger_teleport massively misfired, and sent you and a bunch of monsters into the void? Or is there just a big hole in your map?

As usual, Biff fucked up with his code.

#1149 Posted by CZG [148.122.66.36], 28/05/2001 19:27 GMT

I'm pretty sure it's just Biffs map that extends out over the 4096 unit border. Passing over that borde wil place you on the other side on the map, for you to see the whole spectacle from afar...

#1150 Posted by Biff_Debris [205.188.192.46], 28/05/2001 21:14 GMT , Refers to Post #1149

That's what Biff was afraid of. It might be easily amended, but a lot of brushwork nonetheless...

#1151 Posted by Dimebag [24.4.252.129], 28/05/2001 21:29 GMT

I need to see my custom maps in the single player setup screen. I used to be able to do this, but I formatted and lost it. It was a .pk3 that let me do this. Anyone know where I can find this?

Biff Is A Doofus.

#1152 Posted by Biff_Debris [205.188.192.31], 28/05/2001 21:41 GMT

Biff only had to move the map -- and all is well. Biff breathes a sigh of relief -- and discontinues speaking of himself in the third person.

#1153 Posted by ^ian [63.62.170.182], 29/05/2001 05:24 GMT , Refers to Post #1151

To get the maps to show up in the skirmish view(if I am understading you correctly..)you need a .arena file for each map..

you might want to search on the quake3world.com levelediting forums...since almost every question about q3 editing has been asked there already.

#1154 Posted by palldjon [203.29.11.38], 29/05/2001 08:52 GMT , Refers to Post #1152

I wanted to be Lord God King Bufu.

Thanx Biff, report arrived safely.

#1155 Posted by Biff_Debris [152.163.207.198], 29/05/2001 09:22 GMT , Refers to Post #1154

Oh yeah -- that title goes to CZG (big surprise, huh?)=)

#1156 Posted by CZG [148.122.66.36], 29/05/2001 17:57 GMT

Lord God King Bufu? WTF?!

#1157 Posted by Biff_Debris [205.188.199.173], 29/05/2001 22:56 GMT , Refers to Post #1156

Don't worry about it. Like all things, it will pass =)

Maximum Size?

#1158 Posted by Tronyn(acc2) [24.66.252.239], 30/05/2001 22:57 GMT

Is 2800 brushes too big for Quake? IT WOULD SEEM LIKE IT.

Seriously though, how big can wqbsp handle, because I cannot get a 2800 brush map compiled.

Tronyn

I'm Not Sure But....

#1159 Posted by Jaj [62.83.11.232], 30/05/2001 23:17 GMT , Refers to Post #1158

.... i think wqbsp165 can handle up to 8192 brushes.

Doom3 Thing For A Map

#1160 Posted by neomatrix [24.128.46.69], 31/05/2001 02:24 GMT

I just looked at the Doom 3 movie again and thought it would be 1337 to put a lift like the one that corkscrews down and sets out a bridge in a quake 1 or 3 map. It might need alot of extra QuakeC code to work.

I Wanna MAP!

#1161 Posted by Kreator [194.17.220.2], 31/05/2001 09:34 GMT

Damn, have my teory-driverlicence test in a week. Don't have to do do anything else but to studie. Well once I'll get my driver licence in like one to four munths it will be worth it.

#1162 Posted by XeNoN [195.8.75.76], 31/05/2001 17:32 GMT

.... i think wqbsp165 can handle up to 8192 brushes.

8192? I think you're getting confused with the maximum boundary limits Quake can handle.

#1163 Posted by CZG [148.122.66.37], 31/05/2001 18:20 GMT

WQbsp can handle way more than 2800 brushes, apsp1 had 5000+-500 iirc. (Though I'm not sure if than used Wqbsp. Oh well, czg07b had 4400 or something, that compiled.)

The corkscrewing lift from the doom3 vid is the source for a lot of inspiration. Though it would be wrong to make a map and QC for it and it only. Though making a map that it fits in, that's a whole other story. Extra QC? Hipnotic can do it if you're clever...

#1164 Posted by NotoriousRay [141.157.89.227], 31/05/2001 19:25 GMT

are there any editors one of you guys could point me to that aren't as shitty as worldcraft is with regards to rotating textures. i have alot of angles in my sp map and i'm trying not to have to use -alternateaxis as it messes up stuff that already looks fine in game. anything that doesn't have the wc-axis problem would be idea, as all i'd be doing is loading my .map file and fixing textures before final compile probably (note: this is not to say final compile is anywhere near completion)

#1165 Posted by Grahf [209.145.79.10], 31/05/2001 20:55 GMT

Try Radiant or Quark (maybe Tread3d too).

#1166 Posted by Jaj [62.83.138.202], 31/05/2001 22:54 GMT , Refers to Post #1162

Oh, well... the number coincides with the limits.

But i was referring to the MAX_MAP_BRUSHES wqbsp was able to handle...
oh and it can handle that number since version 1.50 or so, not sure :)

#1167 Posted by NotoriousRay [141.157.89.63], 02/06/2001 04:15 GMT

so now my map (q1sp) crashes glquake.exe upon loading. invalid page fault. anyone seen this before? all i had changed from a previous compile is a few textures replaces, maybe a few brushes, but nothing drastic at all. runs winquake fine, runs tomazquake fine, crashes in glquake and nehahra.exe. only about 1mb texture info (loaded and exported as .wad in texmex) is in the .bsp, the map is about 2200 brushes, has large holes in it, and compiles fine using alverson's wqbsp. no light or vis run, just fullbrite .bsp, and crash.

argh. things like this really make me want to stop working on this damn map.

also: i loaded the .map, saved as .rmf, saved as .map, same thing.

#1168 Posted by NotoriousRay [141.157.89.63], 02/06/2001 04:35 GMT

spoke too soon.
nevermind, just messed with the same textures and recompiled (even though i'm 100% sure the .map file was identical than what it was before) and it runs ok now. i do have a feeling i haven't seen the end of these such errors.

bah

#1169 Posted by Biff_Debris [152.163.206.194], 02/06/2001 04:39 GMT

Ain't mapping FUN?

#1170 Posted by Tronyn(acc2) [24.66.252.239], 02/06/2001 06:19 GMT

Yes but you're CZG, maybe YOUR wbqsp can compile maps like czg07b... hehe.

Seriously though, my system ain't the greatest, so 3000 brushes is my realistic if not technical limit. Anyhow, here's the series of fun phrases that wQbsp currently likes to give me:

2797 brushes
18211 faces

'************ERROR**************
numbrushplanes == MAX_MAP_PLANES'

and:

1059 brushes
7027 faces

'splitface: numpoints > MAXEDGES'

Oh and while we're at it, anyone have any guesses as to what would cause Quake, upon loading the map (it is in the map for 0-10 seconds), to kick the player into DOS with this error:

"General Protection Fault at eip=00030774
eax=ffffffff ebx=00813c9c ecx=000c0d20 edx=0076b4c4 esi=00000008 edi=000000e0
ebp=00813c9c esp=000ea250 cs=00af ds=00b7 es=00b7 fs=00d7 gs=00d7 ss=00b7
Call frame traceback EIPs:
0x00030774
0x00000004

C:\quake>"

Yes, mapping is FUN.

Tronyn

General Protection Eats Lard.

#1171 Posted by CZG [148.122.66.37], 02/06/2001 13:00 GMT

I struggled a whole fucking lot with that error when I first got Quake. It turned out to be that one of my RAM chips were b0rked. I got it replaced, and it worked fine. There might be something else to it too though...

All the other errors are stuff that noone bothers to know exactly what they mean, they just fix them somehow.
Try isolating the bug by exporting half the map, compile; if still buggy: export half of that map and compile; if not buggy: export half of other half of map, continue until you've narrowed it down to the brush(es) that causes your headache.
If the error only occurs when the entire map is exported, there is obviously somethng wrong with the size/complexity of the map, or some brushes intersecting in an awkward way...
Try the best you can.

#1172 Posted by NotoriousRay [141.157.91.102], 02/06/2001 14:35 GMT , Refers to Post #1170

from the quakelab problems and solutions page here:

You have too many faces on a single brush. The normal QBSP released by id has a limit of 16 faces per brush, which makes objects like spheres very difficult to create. However, there are several versions of QBSP (like QBSP256b), for which this limit is much higher. These versions should also be just as fast and take no more memory than the original.

invalid page fault is usually a memory error, used to get those all the time when i would try to load big sp or dm maps on my old cyrix100 with 2meg vid card.

16 Faces A Brush?

#1173 Posted by Biff_Debris [205.188.199.181], 02/06/2001 14:39 GMT , Refers to Post #1172

Hmm -- learn something every day around here...

16 Faces/brush?

#1174 Posted by CZG [148.122.66.37], 02/06/2001 18:25 GMT

Biotoxin had as many as 34 iirc...

Now count the number of faces you'd need to make a cheese.

(If this gets doubleposted, I suck)

MAX_MAP_PLANES

#1175 Posted by Gilt [154.11.172.187], 02/06/2001 19:18 GMT , Refers to Post #1170

Do you have a leak in your map?

I find that if qbsp is able to take away all the planes that shouldn't be seen in game (ie:touching the void) the amount of planes in your map decreases a lot.

#1176 Posted by Biff_Debris [152.163.197.178], 02/06/2001 20:54 GMT , Refers to Post #1175

Doesn't it always do that?

Maximums...

#1177 Posted by Jaj [62.83.27.29], 03/06/2001 00:34 GMT

Seeing the error that says :numbrushplanes==MAX_MAP_PLANES , it could be referred to the number of faces, that is 18211 and wich is higher than the MAX_MAP_PLANES Wqbsp165 can handle and wich is 16384 (hey... i've read this, my memory is volatile :).
And the error that says splitface: numpoints > MAXEDGES , i don't know what could it be...
anyways here it goes another limits of Wqbsp165, i hope it could help:
MAX_HULL_POINTS 64
MAX_HULL_EDGES 128

Qbsp256c, has its limits enhanced too, but it doesn't especifies the numbers, also it supports more faced brushes...

But it could be that although the map had been compiled perfectly with these tools, it'd crash in the quake engine. (I've read this too hehe :)

Doesn't Qbsp Always Take Out Planes?

#1178 Posted by Gilt [154.11.95.166], 03/06/2001 13:50 GMT , Refers to Post #1176

I don't think so. But don't take my word on it.

Try compiling a map with a leak and without one, making sure you still have the same amount of brushes and stuff in your map, and then compare the amount of planes in the maps.

Hmm, No Title

#1179 Posted by Grahf [209.145.68.186], 05/06/2001 17:12 GMT

As long as we're talkin about random weird errors, anybody ever have a map that, when compiled, shows no leak errors, yet qbsp still performs a "FillOutside" and doesn't make a .prt? I'm worried that it's due to a skip brush on the outside of the map...

I'm using the mac port of Alexander Malmberg's Quest compilers, btw.

I've Had That

#1180 Posted by The Lieutenant [144.32.177.156], 05/06/2001 19:01 GMT

I've had that problem... it was due to lots of carving with cylinders.

Someone Likes My Textures At Last!

#1181 Posted by Dilvish [172.131.58.249], 08/06/2001 13:14 GMT

Somebody's asked me to do levels for a TCF quake patch and I'd like to know if there's a mod that allows making walls and things explode in Quake.
If I ain't clear enough, just tell me.
Dilvish

Exlposive Shizzaz

#1182 Posted by CZG [148.122.66.37], 08/06/2001 15:52 GMT

Hipnotic has those entities, I cannot be arsed to dig up a download link for you though...

#1183 Posted by Dilvish [172.167.67.3], 08/06/2001 20:33 GMT

Maybe I should have begun by that: what is exactly TFC? And are there specific ways and method to map in this genre? If so, which?
Thanx
Dilvish

Team Fortress Classic.

#1184 Posted by Biff_Debris [152.163.204.186], 08/06/2001 21:19 GMT , Refers to Post #1183

Y'know -- all that "we've got the flag" stuff =)

I Really Shouldn't Say It....

#1185 Posted by Tron [203.12.165.8], 09/06/2001 06:26 GMT , Refers to Post #1184

I shouldn't say it....it's horrible....but it fits......it burns my eyes to read it anymore though...ack I can't resist...all your base are belong to us...that's basically what tf is...

Tron

All Right, You've Won

#1186 Posted by Dilvish [172.149.95.186], 09/06/2001 06:51 GMT , Refers to Post #1185

The brooms and cleaning things are in the closet left of the entrance. Do use them or my wife will be very unhappy that I've let my base into such untidy hands!
Thanx
Dilvish

House Textures?

#1187 Posted by Kreator [62.66.9.31], 09/06/2001 09:30 GMT

Well, anyone got any house/club/city textures anywhere? You know, like Duke Nukem 3D (God bless!) or similar.

#1188 Posted by Kreator [62.66.9.31], 09/06/2001 09:32 GMT

For Q3 that is... Wohoo! End of school!!! Now I just have to go up earlier and work all summer. =(=(

Get Ikurret...

#1189 Posted by Jimbo [216.12.62.73], 09/06/2001 17:47 GMT , Refers to Post #1181

included in the ikturret.zip is a file called
xwall.qc you make a func_xwall and give it
health and it explodes when you shoot it.
heres a link from somewhere.

cut-the-brown-wire.zule.com/fenrir/ikturret.zip

also try at www.planetquake.com/ikq

I tried it once and its Very easy to use.
-Jimbo

Q1DM - BETA Testers Wanted!

#1190 Posted by Jimbo [216.12.62.73], 09/06/2001 17:59 GMT

I need some help testing my Map,
Cobalt Cathexis.

If you want to help me:
1. download the beta [CLICK] (251k)
2. Email me what you think (Be Specific).
3. Thanks.

There are some screenies here.

-Jimbo

Oops Borked The Links

#1191 Posted by Jimbo [216.12.62.73], 09/06/2001 18:01 GMT , Refers to Post #1190

Can some kind moderator fix those?

[CLICK]
Screenies.

ARGH!! Mucho Borkage

#1192 Posted by Jimbo [216.12.62.73], 09/06/2001 18:03 GMT , Refers to Post #1191

Well try and cut-n-paste those
http://www.geocities.com/jimbos_mappage/cathexisB1.zip
http://www.geocities.com/jimbos_mappage/

A Mod Might Want To Fix That Link...

#1193 Posted by Tron [203.12.165.8], 09/06/2001 18:04 GMT

you mispelled geocities in the link. 8) Strangely though, it takes you to a yahoo/geocities page basically telling you "That's not how you spell geocities, spell it like this instead" Why they don't just auto recdirect you is a mystery...

Tron

p.s. nice pics btw.

#1194 Posted by Dilvish [172.159.146.142], 10/06/2001 05:37 GMT , Refers to Post #1189

There seems to be something bOrked in the kingdom of Fileplanet, as i've never been able to d/l ikturret.zip; and it's not the first time, either.
Me goes away crying against totally non-explosive walls. Sigh.
Dilvish

#1195 Posted by XeNoN [212.126.131.178], 10/06/2001 10:59 GMT

There seems to be something bOrked in the kingdom of Fileplanet

MY GOD!!! HOLD THE FRONT PAGE!!!

#1196 Posted by mute [193.180.245.90], 10/06/2001 11:33 GMT

http://freshmeat.netc.pt/pub/planetquake/ikq/
if this link doesnt work for you, go to google and search....

Compilation Fun Part II

#1197 Posted by Tronyn (2) [24.66.252.239], 13/06/2001 22:26 GMT

Thanks for the advice guys, a lot of it has helped. I've also gotten a hold of Qbsp256c, which I figured would solve the remaining problems, however, it simply complains that it cannot open any of the wadfiles specified by the .map.

As well, the enigmatic and much-beloved General Protection Fault does persist. Description follows:

If the size of the map is decreased signifigantly, by 200-300 brushes, the error no longer occurs, though for some odd reason it takes 3-4 times the time to compile with less brushes.

The bloody strange thing is that the map is only 2100 brushes, and it ran fine immediately prior to pasting on the end section of about 250 brushes. Now, that section compiles and runs fine by itself, and the other portion of the map compiles and runs fine by itself, but both together won't run in Quake. HOWEVER both together if, say, the start area is deleted, will run fine in Quake. But it's only 2100 damned brushes and not even all that complex.

I've checked in several editors for errors of all sorts, I especially thought bad brushes to be suspect - to no avail. There aren't any leaks either so that's out. This is really an odd occurence, it just doesn't make any sense.

Any help appreciated...

All I Can Say Is

#1198 Posted by Biff_Debris [205.188.197.152], 13/06/2001 23:09 GMT , Refers to Post #1197

Make sure the map isn't hanging over the edge of the overall grid =)

#1199 Posted by DaZ [62.7.35.168], 14/06/2001 02:03 GMT

Tronyn's Not The Only One

#1200 Posted by Fat Controller [203.96.111.201], 14/06/2001 09:10 GMT

I just had to drop the nice intermission scene (basically a box with a feature on one wall) for a map because it gave QBSP the shits - before, it'd compile in about half an hour, but then... two hours plus of nonstop grinding.

Had to rewrite the intermission text as well. Phooey!

Mind you, I have a fair chunk of areas with rough Schmerm-style rock walls, so the brush count's 2200+. Probably just went clean over QBSP's limits...

#1201 Posted by Kell [213.120.146.110], 14/06/2001 11:53 GMT

How do I bind levels, sounds and skins into a .pak file for Quake 1?

#1202 Posted by The Lieutenant [144.32.177.126], 14/06/2001 12:48 GMT

Get adquedit. Put all the stuff you want into one directory and select 'create pak' from the file menu.

Another Hypothesis...

#1203 Posted by Jaj [62.83.7.143], 14/06/2001 23:41 GMT , Refers to Post #1197

Mmm... i'm not sure but, it seems the limit brushes isn't the problem, but what about the faces limit?, if the map has a lot of multifaced brushes (a supercurved or a very detailed map :), then the face limit could be the "guilty" ... i can't think of anything else for now...

Where Is Everyone?

#1204 Posted by Kreator [62.66.9.84], 15/06/2001 17:53 GMT

Hell, is't only 19:50 on this sonny friday evening. Why aren't anyone on my ICQlist online? =)=)

Well, work starts at 07:00 tomorrow, gonna go to bed in 2Hs. Why is it so hard to find the time I need to do some serious mapping?Night all!

Compilable Area...

#1205 Posted by necros [152.163.207.137], 17/06/2001 21:02 GMT

What are the max limits of room that you can compile? and do different compilers change this, or is it something within the quake engin?

just wondering... cause i noticed that around 1800 to 2000 away from the origin will go off the area, but i'm not sure about it...

#1206 Posted by XeNoN [213.120.56.57], 17/06/2001 21:05 GMT

Well, imagine a hollow cube 8192cubed around the origin, If you go outside that area then it wont vis and the map'll screw up.

#1207 Posted by necros [152.163.194.137], 18/06/2001 00:14 GMT

say +4000 or -4000 away from the origin?

i dunno, cause for me, 2000 seems to be the limit... i'll have to try that out...

does anyone know why it's that size?

D-Day: Normandy

#1208 Posted by syon [63.254.26.202], 18/06/2001 00:51 GMT

D-Day: Normandy, a Q2 Multiplayer mod based on the Second World War.

Players & freelance mappers wanted!

http://www.planetquake.com/dday

Click here for more...

#1209 Posted by Grahf [209.145.69.53], 18/06/2001 04:11 GMT

As I understood it, the max boundaries were 4096*4096*4096. Though it could be 2048 for certain compilers...

Q3TA raises that to 128k*128k*128k... One the most fun things to do in GTKRadiant is to zoom ALL the way out, and prove that your map is still flea sized.

#1210 Posted by Dilvish [172.191.162.93], 18/06/2001 20:10 GMT

I'm working with someone who is making a mod for CTF Quake, and he asked me to map for him. As i'm a complete newbie in this genre, could some of you who mapped for CTF give me some advice about - well, how the map should be (SP or Dm or something else). I suppose it's a multiplayer game, so I have to install playerstarts, so how many, where, well you see the kind of advice I'm asking for.
Any help would be greatly appreciated.
Thanx
Dilvish

#1211 Posted by necros [172.175.0.85], 18/06/2001 21:23 GMT

4096^3 because, it's 2048 away from the origin (middle), so that's why i can never build more than 2000 away from the origin! thx... that cleared things up a lot. =)

#1212 Posted by XeNoN [195.8.75.173], 18/06/2001 22:36 GMT , Refers to Post #1211

That cant be right. In fact, I know it isn't, I've built twice that distance away from the origin before having parts of the map cut off... you are on about q1 aren't you?

#1213 Posted by necros [205.188.199.13], 19/06/2001 00:09 GMT

yes, i automatically assumed everyone was refering to q1 (i keep forgetting about those other quakes...

)

I know the Q2 boundaries a much larger, and q3 is just insane (you can build, and build, and build...) I'd like to see an map for q3 which spans the entire compilable space... whoa...

Wqbsp Error....

#1214 Posted by necros [152.163.213.43], 19/06/2001 03:36 GMT

ok, it's 11:30 pm right now, and i'm tired...
anyway, i just combined two sections of my map together into one file, but when i tried to compile the sucker, wqbsp crashed right after doing the models with
something like
"map_max_mip_tex" i forget the exact words...

anyway, if anyone knows what the hell this is... i suspect it has something to do with to many textures? i hope not...

i compiled with WQBSP, on an AMD Athlon computer... with lots of RAM 256, so i'm not running out... um... there is only 1560 something brushes... anyway, any help would be appreciated...
thx.

Ah, Here Is The Exact Error

#1215 Posted by necros [152.163.213.43], 19/06/2001 03:39 GMT

(off of Quakelab)

--- FinishBSPfile ---
WriteBSPfile: map.bsp
Added 0 texture frames
********ERROR********
Textures exceeded MAX_MAP_MIPTEX

but there is no solution!!!

#1216 Posted by Grahf [209.145.69.86], 19/06/2001 04:08 GMT

Your machine isn't the prob. The map is. A BSP file cannot have more than 2 megs (2048 kbytes) of textures in it. I hit this problem while using a bunch of 256*256 textures in a map once. (given the diverse nature of your map, I was afraid of this)

Solutions:

- consolidate your texture usage and themes.
- Shrink some textures. The Q3 ones were designed to be viewed at half size anyway (that's why the q3 map editors shrink all their textures by 1/2 by default).

Two Questions

#1217 Posted by Hanz [193.229.72.75], 19/06/2001 20:35 GMT

1. What causes "GL_LoadTexture: Cache mismatch"-error and how to fix it? If I start Quake directly in my map (i.e. quake +map mymap) I don't get the error.

2. How does the WorldCraft "replace texture" thing work? I tried selecting the two textures and pressed OK, but nothing happened. I tried it several times with no luck. I have WC 1.6a (shareware version).

Thanks in advance :)

#1218 Posted by GlassMan [213.123.236.25], 19/06/2001 20:49 GMT

1. When a map has a texture with the same name as one in a previous map. Change the name of the texture to something more obscure :)

2. Dunno, don't use WC.

Thx Grahf...

#1219 Posted by necros [152.163.194.137], 19/06/2001 20:55 GMT

...
Anyone know why the 2mb limit it there?

#1220 Posted by Hanz [193.229.72.75], 19/06/2001 21:24 GMT

Thanks for the reply, now I know what texture causes the error. It's called "clip". But I thought that clip texture always has to be called "clip" or otherwise it'll show up as an ordinary texture in the game. So how can I fix it? :/

#1221 Posted by Grahf [209.145.71.66], 19/06/2001 22:07 GMT

You could probably raise it easily by modifying one or two lines in the QBSP source code, but whether the maps would still load into Quake is anybody's guess.

#1222 Posted by Biff_Debris [152.163.207.186], 19/06/2001 22:45 GMT , Refers to Post #1217

Make sure you don't have any brushes selected when trying tex replace -- it screws it up for some reason =)

#1223 Posted by Hanz [193.229.72.75], 19/06/2001 22:45 GMT

I think the limit could be there just to prevent mappers from using too many/big textures. When Quake came out, many had only 8-16 mb of ram and ID wanted the game to work with most computers (dos quake allocates 8 megabytes by default). They had no idea ppl would be making maps for the game several years later when everyone has at least 128 mb ram. This is just a wild quess though :)

Doesn't Work In Wcsw

#1224 Posted by Tron [203.38.138.22], 19/06/2001 23:38 GMT , Refers to Post #1217

Hanz: You need to full version of worldcraft to use the replace textures button.

Tron

#1225 Posted by necros [152.163.201.142], 20/06/2001 00:20 GMT , Refers to Post #1223

ok, well it looks like i'll have to split the sucker up... ugh...

it'll make sense tho, since the second part has a lot of tech-y stuff in it...

well, thx....

Oh, and Grahf: There's no way i'm touching the qbsp source code... (besides the fact that i don't have a clue when it comes to C/C++) it'll probably come back and bite me on the ass sometime or another...

Re: GL_LoadTexture: Cache Mismatch

#1226 Posted by Seth [62.7.7.25], 20/06/2001 01:50 GMT

necros: iirc this is caused when you have 2 textures in different maps with the same name that are different sizes. so if its a clip tex, as long as its the same size as the default id one it should b ok, unless u play someone elses map with a funny sized 1, in which case its their fault!
[Reply]

#1227 Posted by GlassMan [213.123.236.25], 20/06/2001 05:51 GMT

should always be 64x64.

R_speeds In Q3

#1228 Posted by H-Hour [216.17.140.47], 20/06/2001 09:56 GMT

Hey. As I've only ever done mapping for Q2(and some experiments with Q1 way back), I was wondering what are general r_speeds in Q3? Just curious how much room you guys have to work with...

#1229 Posted by Shallow[BAP] [212.135.236.122], 20/06/2001 11:27 GMT

I aim to mostly have 5-6000 although the theoretical maximum you should allow yourself is 8000 with no items. For Team Arena it's a bit higher, and around 10,000 is not uncommon in TA maps. (There are places with much, much worse r_speeds than that in some TA maps, notably in mpterra1, but Paul Jaquays has said on Quake3world forums that he was somewhat unhappy with this)

If your design has higher r_speeds than 8000 you should say it's a high-spec map it on your download pages and read me, and do your best to ensure anywhere that reviews it does too.

#1230 Posted by Hanz [193.229.72.75], 20/06/2001 15:12 GMT

My clip texture was 32x32..weird, cause I ripped it from somewhere :P. Anyway, now it works =)

A Couple Strange Things

#1231 Posted by Tronyn(2) [24.66.252.239], 20/06/2001 22:52 GMT

The reason I've got so many unique errors isn't that I'm just error-prone, it's more because I've got about 35 BSPs in the works right now so it's proportionate ;)

Here's a couple of my current erorrs:

Artifacts not appearing in Quake. Oh look, Quad damage, Pentagram, even biosuits, but for some reason they don't show up in Quake. Grr.

'Too many static entities' upon attempting to load a map in Quake. I believe that static entities means models that just sit there, and the only thing like that in this map is torches/flames. Is that the case, and if so, can I just change a bunch of flames to invisible lights to fix it?

#1232 Posted by The Lieutenant [144.32.128.132], 20/06/2001 23:46 GMT

The second problem is caused by the use of walltorches, ambient sounds, anything that in the QC uses the makestatic() function as part of its declaration. You should be able to hack this in the QC quite simply by commenting out this line and replacing it with 'self.movetype = MOVETYPE_NONE'. Or you could do what you suggest by removing some of the visible lights.

Lieutenant...

#1233 Posted by necros [205.188.192.113], 21/06/2001 00:33 GMT

can you do the Movetype_None trick on torches? or only ambient sounds...

but won't that make you run out of edicts?

#1234 Posted by DeFrag [208.49.10.152], 21/06/2001 02:06 GMT

wots this Rail-thingy do? ;)

#1235 Posted by DaZ [62.7.22.145], 21/06/2001 02:10 GMT , Refers to Post #1232

Does that "Too many static entities" error include func_illusionary brush models?

Oh and does anyone know the name you need to give brushes to make them detail brushes for the supporting compiler? I cant find the damn readme :/

Thanks in advance to anyone that knows...

Re: A Couple Strange Things

#1236 Posted by Tyrann [203.56.239.112], 21/06/2001 04:41 GMT , Refers to Post #1231

Artifacts not appearing in Quake. Oh look, Quad damage, Pentagram, even biosuits, but for some reason they don't show up in Quake. Grr.

Try placing them a little higher above the ground. I saw a couple of instances where your powerups were stuck in the ground (I think it was only 16 units down or so) when I took over TOUM. It was obvious in my editor (BSP), but I guess worldcraft uses a different set of entity defs.

Item Movement...

#1237 Posted by palldjon [203.29.11.28], 21/06/2001 06:10 GMT , Refers to Post #1236

Hey Tyrann, it took me a little while to work out that situating items 4 units above the "ground" solved a lot of item drop out probs. However, what I did notice with WC was that items such as health and ammo "move" 16 units north and east in the .bsp as opposed to the .rmf

Biosuits and armour don't "move". Is this movement standard for some items?

#1238 Posted by Biff_Debris [152.163.205.84], 21/06/2001 09:05 GMT , Refers to Post #1237

Biosuits and armor don't rotate, do they? At least I dont think they do...

Item Movement

#1239 Posted by Kell [213.120.145.200], 21/06/2001 09:21 GMT

Worldcraft has a well-known habit of screwing the placement of items: ammo and health only, though. You have to set the grid size to 16 units to get the items in place. In spite of the entity 'crosshair' being off, the colored boxes show the correct final position for the ammo/health...except for the 5 rockets box, which I think is just totally buggered :(
When placing powerups in Worldcraft, I usually place it 32 units above the ground, in line with the middle of the playerbox; it automatically drops the correct distance to the ground when the level is spawned.

Q1 Mapping Help

#1240 Posted by Dazza [212.28.12.101], 21/06/2001 10:59 GMT

I have just started looking at mapping for Q1, I am using BSP 0.93b and working through the tutorials for that program. I have created the room, compiled it in bsp 0.93, but when i try to run it in Quake I get a 'could'nt spawn server' error. I have looked at the troubleshooting but no help there. I am assuming from the documentation that the program has QBSP, light and vis included, is this the case. Any help, suggestions would be greatly apreciated.

Thanks in advance

Info_player_start

#1241 Posted by GlassMan [195.184.253.80], 21/06/2001 12:11 GMT

Do you have a info_player_start entity in the room?

#1242 Posted by GlassMan [195.184.253.80], 21/06/2001 12:15 GMT

could be that the bsp name is longer than 8 characters & you're trying to run it in software quake.

Item Troubles

#1243 Posted by The Lieutenant [144.32.177.148], 21/06/2001 13:04 GMT

Worldcraft *has* buggered the placement on *all* .bsp style items. The problem is that the models' origins are not in the centre of the object; rather, they are in the bottom left corner, meaning that as someone mentioned, you have to offset your positioning by 16 units in all 3 dimensions.

On the powerups front: WC assigns a very small bounding box for the powerups but actually they have the same size bbox as the player / armour.

Daz: func_illusionaries do indeed count as statics, although bizarrely func_walls do not.

Necros: yes indeed it does work on torches.

On the point of increasing the total number of edicts; i dont think this is the case, all those torches count as edicts - they are after all, entities with a visible model.

Re: Q1 Mapping Help

#1244 Posted by Tyrann [203.56.239.115], 21/06/2001 14:39 GMT , Refers to Post #1240

I am assuming from the documentation that the program has QBSP, light and vis included, is this the case.

No, you'll need to download them seperately. I suggest you try these programs:

TreeQBSP
TyrLite
RVis+

WorldCraft Woes

#1245 Posted by Lunaran [64.12.102.151], 21/06/2001 15:14 GMT

why is everyone still whining about offset items? Just open the FGD and fix the two bounding box values on anything that breaks.

If Anyone Cares.

#1246 Posted by CZG [148.122.66.36], 21/06/2001 17:51 GMT

I'll be home in three days and I'll upload a FGD for you to use in Worldcraft that has all bounding boxes (except for the rockets, I can never figure those out!) and all possible keys you can set on an entity.

Lth: func_illusionaries are static because there is nothing you can do to them. You can't kill them, you can't change textures on them, you woun't clip on them, nothing. Func_walls however, need to be non static so you can do thse things. If you hax0r the czg07 QC, you'll see I made a func_illusionary2 entity that wasn't static, because I needed to kill one in the endgame map. (That never was released.)

Dazza: from the wya you said your error was 'cannot spawn server', It sounds like bsp is trying to run quake without any mapname. When I first got quake, someone told me you could bring up a map if you typed 'map' in the console, (I thought like an overhead map, ala Doom or DN3D,) but if you just type map in the console you get that cannot spawn server error.

Typos Galore!

#1247 Posted by CZG [148.122.66.36], 21/06/2001 17:54 GMT

Sorry, being here causes the brain to rot.
What I was trying to say was that my fgd has all the correct bounding boxes, ...

I guess most people understood that anyway though...

the

#1248 Posted by Dilvish [172.189.19.31], 21/06/2001 19:52 GMT , Refers to Post #1244

TyrLite, I know, as I use it and like it a lot (pretty good work, man!), but the other 2 are unknown to me. What more do they add to the previous QBSP and RVis?

#1249 Posted by DaZ [62.7.3.151], 21/06/2001 19:59 GMT

I had to many func_illusionaries in my map. I converted them all to detail brushes and compiled with a suporting compiler. But cheers for all your help.

#1250 Posted by necros [152.163.213.137], 21/06/2001 20:12 GMT

Simply adds a % counter telling you how far it's gone in the vising process. just really helps you guage how much more time it's going to take.

As for BSP compiles... i myself prefer WQBSP... it's never failed me yet!

#1251 Posted by Biff_Debris [64.12.104.58], 21/06/2001 23:36 GMT , Refers to Post #1246

/me plans construction of monument to CZG...

#1252 Posted by necros [205.188.199.13], 21/06/2001 23:48 GMT , Refers to Post #1250

Use tree BSP, i just found out it gets rid of all those MAX_MAP_ errors, like MAX_MAP_MIP_TEX (!)

#1253 Posted by palldjon [203.29.11.28], 22/06/2001 01:12 GMT , Refers to Post #1251

/me plans pilgrimage to same.

But not while Biff is there sp00ging, euwh!

Quake 1 Respawn

#1254 Posted by Hodaly [62.64.191.187], 22/06/2001 19:41 GMT

hi there, I was just wondering if there is any way to make an entity respawn? that is make it so that once you pick up, say some shotgun shells, they re-apear (like they do in the re-arming rooms in TF). I know it's possible to do it with monsters by having a store of 'em, but the trouble is after a while the store runs out..

any help will be warmly welcomed :) btw: i'm using Qoole.

thanks guys!

-Have a nice day

Quake 1 Respawn; The Terror

#1255 Posted by CZG [148.122.66.36], 22/06/2001 19:51 GMT

I think you oughta hack the QC code for that. I managed to do it myself, so it wasn't that hard, somewhere in world.qc and items.qc I think...

You could make some funky setup in the map too, so you have a little hole in the floor that opens up and places a new set of ammo there when you pick it up, takes an uneconomic time of work though...

Notice how I didn't comment anything on what editor you were using, because just about NO entity work is editor specific. A lot of other people here would instantly submit an oneliner below stating something like 'Don't use Quoole' or 'WorldCraft suxx0rs' (If you were using WC). I don't get why people do that; all editors I have touched upon have the exact same entities to use, it's all for the same game. Having difficulties with an entity has nada to do with the editor. So shut yer pieholes!

Why yes I am kinda pissy today.

#1256 Posted by Biff_Debris [152.163.197.77], 23/06/2001 00:48 GMT , Refers to Post #1253

I'll try to clean up before you drop by, pall =)

Movetype_none

#1257 Posted by necros0 [24.112.158.244], 23/06/2001 01:56 GMT

uh, a while back, someone mentioned changing the qc for the light entities to movetype_none, instead of makestatic()...

could someone give me an example of exactly how to do this?

#1258 Posted by CZG [148.122.66.36], 23/06/2001 17:14 GMT

I haven't got the original QC here atm, so this will be off memory only, but it might work.
Open world.qc if I remember correctly, it might have been misc.qc but the light animation tables are in world.qc, so I think it's there.

Then find a line that should be something like
void() light =
{
something something something
};

Somewhere between those two {}'s, there should be a line that says makestatic{};.
Simply replace that with the line self.movetype == movetype_none.
There might be some more punctuation there, and some more brackets, but have a look at other entities to figure out the correct syntax.

Visit Nilbog this summer and see the world!

When I Look At This Now

#1259 Posted by CZG [148.122.66.36], 23/06/2001 17:18 GMT

It all seems horribly wrong... Someone please help this fellow so he isn't totally confoosled.

And btw: Whenever I hit submit on a post, I get to a page with a 302 warning/error that says
FOUND
The page has been moved here.
...with a link to the thread I posted in.
This isn't supposed to happen is it?

CZG / Necros

#1260 Posted by The Lieutenant [144.32.177.189], 23/06/2001 18:51 GMT

The lights are in misc.qc I believe (for the walltorches / lights with models anyway). You have to type MOVETYPE_NONE in caps. Other than that, CZG is correct.

Um... CZG/Lieutenant...

#1261 Posted by necros [152.163.207.43], 23/06/2001 23:43 GMT

Ok, I just consulted the QC Manual, and it says the proper syntax is:

self.movetype = MOVETYPE_NONE;

so, your both wrong!!

thx anyway.

302 Error... that's definatly not supposed to happen... well, it hasn't happened to me anyway...

#1262 Posted by Dilvish [195.93.33.192], 24/06/2001 01:42 GMT

I've just d/l it because there seems to be lot of cool features in it, but is TomLite necessary to get colored lightings? I thought
TyrLite did that already, didn't it?

Re: TomazQuake

#1263 Posted by Tyrann [203.56.239.113], 24/06/2001 02:11 GMT

...is TomLite necessary to get colored lightings? I thought TyrLite did that already, didn't it?

Yes, but TomLite is Tyrlite - it's just been modified to place the colored lightmaps in another file (a ".lit" file) outside the bsp. I'll probably incorporate the changes one of these days...

#1264 Posted by The Cream Enjin [195.92.67.69], 24/06/2001 02:13 GMT

Does anyone know where i can find a decent tank (or military vehicles) map object (pfb) for q3? of some tank textures?

#1265 Posted by The Cream Enjin [195.92.67.69], 24/06/2001 02:15 GMT

sorry i meant "or some tank textures"

its late *yawn*

I Wish You Would!

#1266 Posted by necros [205.188.192.137], 24/06/2001 15:27 GMT , Refers to Post #1263

since Tyrlite doesn't require 2 (!) lightings to get the colors right (hint hint)

Some Help Please?

#1267 Posted by necros [205.188.192.137], 24/06/2001 15:32 GMT

Ok, well, I'm just wondering what are the common amount of Portal Leafs and NumPortals in a map with about 1800 brushes?

Currently, I have 6758 Portal Leafs and 20760 Numportals, with Previously said amount of brushes.
Since this is the first time i've ever done something of this size, I'm wondering if it's customary to have this high amount of portals... since i've had experiences where QBSP would create a portal file even though there was a leak, and vis ended up having to Vis the entire outside area...

anyway, back to work...

#1268 Posted by Dilvish [195.93.33.192], 24/06/2001 18:50 GMT

To Hell, Sidon! (This was our cultural message)

#1269 Posted by The Lieutenant [144.32.177.189], 24/06/2001 19:21 GMT

i didnt spot CZG's double equals sign... and what i meant was what you said.

Some Help Please?

#1270 Posted by Tyrann [203.56.239.200], 25/06/2001 05:15 GMT , Refers to Post #1267

Currently, I have 6758 Portal Leafs and 20760 Numportals, with Previously said amount of brushes. [~1800]

<assumption game="quake">

That sounds high to me, but it really depends on your build style. If your architecture has lots of sticky-outy-bits (mapper's technical term) then that can bring up the portal count very quickly. In my experience, my maps don't seem to hit 20000 portals until around the 4000 brush mark.

So either your architecture is not very vis-friendly, or there is some micro-leak weirdness going on.

</assumption>

#1271 Posted by palldjon [203.29.11.28], 25/06/2001 07:01 GMT , Refers to Post #1267

That sounds monstrously high: even with pillars and torch holders cutting up the bsp like crazy in pdbq_sp1 (~2000 brushes) I never got figures like that. Does the .pts file = > 0 ?

Still Looking For A Tank

#1272 Posted by The Cream Enjin [195.92.67.67], 25/06/2001 11:23 GMT

Does anyone know where i can find a decent tank (or military vehicles) map object for q3? or some tank textures?

#1273 Posted by Dilvish [195.93.33.192], 25/06/2001 12:10 GMT

I have 1 wife, 3 children (1 genetically altered, and thats no joke), 6 cats, 12563982 fleas and more than two googolplex of acarians in my house.
Is that normal?
Assumption: this is in Real Life(TM).

Afraid To Ask, But...

#1274 Posted by Biff_Debris [64.12.102.154], 25/06/2001 12:52 GMT , Refers to Post #1273

What's an acarian?

#1275 Posted by Dilvish [195.93.33.192], 25/06/2001 17:54 GMT , Refers to Post #1274

It's a microscopic bugger that lives almost everywhere, and particularly in human homes, in the carpets, the mattresses, even on you! as they feed upon everything we inadvertently let down, such as tiny bits of skin and things like that. There are litterally billions of them in your bed and in your whole home and on yourself.
Don't you ever wash yourself? How dare you speak to me? I don't answer questions from walking zoological gardens.

Tyrlite Update Feature!

#1276 Posted by DaZ [213.123.17.83], 25/06/2001 18:17 GMT , Refers to Post #1263

Tyrann, a nice new feature for Tyrlite would be a falloff for the sunlight. As atm surfaces not being hit by sunlight but in the same area are pitch black.

Could you make the light work spotlight style like Half-life's skylight? That way works nice cos then you can edit the falloff, angle etc...

Half Life Q1 Or Q2

#1277 Posted by The Cream Enjin [195.92.67.65], 25/06/2001 21:57 GMT

Can some1 please sort this out. I say or have heard that half life runs on q1 engine technology but a friend of mine thinks that it maybe q2 becuase it was released after q2.
So is halflife q1 or q2?

#1278 Posted by GrindSpire [213.122.123.19], 25/06/2001 22:10 GMT , Refers to Post #1277

I Thought It Was Based On Q2 Engine...

#1279 Posted by XeNoN [213.120.56.57], 25/06/2001 22:15 GMT

Am I wrong? I mean, engine modified from the q2 one...

#1280 Posted by GlassMan [213.121.124.27], 25/06/2001 22:36 GMT , Refers to Post #1277

Its q1 that they originally licenced but they had access to the updates to the code that id made as they made q2.

#1281 Posted by DaZ [62.7.106.177], 25/06/2001 22:37 GMT

I've gone up like 30 posts and cant see what your talking about in that above post. Please enlighten me

#1282 Posted by The Lieutenant [144.32.177.157], 25/06/2001 22:37 GMT

It's definitely Q1. HOWEVER, Valve licensed the Q2 engine too I think, and cross-pollinated some of the ideas as they were put into the Q2 engine. But it is based on good ole' Quake1

I Seem To Remember

#1283 Posted by pjw [208.192.76.75], 26/06/2001 01:27 GMT , Refers to Post #1277

that there were some bits and bobs of code that were pulled from Q2, but the majority is Q1 based . . .

Hang On....

#1284 Posted by The Lieutenant [144.32.177.157], 26/06/2001 01:36 GMT

I think there's a glitch in the Matrix...

Re: Tyrlite Update Feature!

#1285 Posted by Tyrann [203.56.239.200], 26/06/2001 02:29 GMT , Refers to Post #1276

Could you make the light work spotlight style like Half-life's skylight? That way works nice cos then you can edit the falloff, angle etc...

Well I never mapped for Half-Life, but if it's something like the way Quake spotlights work, then yes, I have an idea of how it can be done. The tricky part will be making the thing run at a decent speed. The current algorithm makes sunlight pretty much "for free", in that it won't slow down compilation of your map noticably.

I'm planning to do a bit of work on TyrLite in the next few weeks where I can find some time, so I'll see what I can come up with. It does sound like a useful feature.

HL = Q2 + Q1 + EVIL

#1286 Posted by Grahf [209.145.69.14], 26/06/2001 06:06 GMT

HL is really an unholy combination of the two (I've heard 20% id code, 80% custom Valve code quoted). Very early versions of Half Life were pretty much entirely q1 based, though obviously q2 influences crept in later. The model code seems almost unchanged from q1 (same .mdl format, 8 bit skins), and all the rest is just whack.

#1287 Posted by Dilvish [195.93.33.192], 26/06/2001 06:27 GMT

Post censored by moderator (GrindSpire).

Nehahra (2)

#1288 Posted by Dilvish [195.93.33.192], 26/06/2001 06:33 GMT

Err... sorry, boys, the prior message belongs to "General Abuse". <Flush>

Gl Quake Error

#1289 Posted by julian [24.25.177.219], 26/06/2001 12:43 GMT

please someone tell me how to fix this damn error when i try to load my map in gl quake. "sys_error: Alloc block:full"
the map loads in software and used to before today in gl quake. does any body know what this error means?

#1290 Posted by CZG [148.122.66.36], 26/06/2001 14:16 GMT , Refers to Post #1289

It means you're allocating too little RAM. By default, Quake only allocates 8 megs, which in many cases is too little. I don't know how much RAM you've got, but I've got 64 megs and alllocate 56 of them. You may do this by adding to your quake command line (in the windows shortcut that is) the following stuff:
-heapsize 56000
...where you replace 56000 with the number of kilobytes you want Quake to use. (Yes I know that 56 Mb = 57344 Kb, but who gives a flying fuck...)

#1291 Posted by julian [24.25.177.219], 26/06/2001 14:47 GMT , Refers to Post #1290

um i just switched to the windows os how do u add a coommand line to the short cut?

#1292 Posted by CZG [148.122.66.36], 26/06/2001 14:53 GMT

Right click on the shortcut and select properties. From there, select the second tab on the top (Shortcut), and in the Target field (I think that's what it's called in english windows) is where the command line is located. You can enter any additional parameters like -game, -heapsize, -width and -bpp right behind the GlQuake.exe bit...
So in the end, yours may loks like this:
D:\QUAKE\glquake.exe -width 512 -bpp 32 -heapsize 56000 +gl_flashblend 0 +map e2m10
That's what it's looking like for me atm...

Thanks But...

#1293 Posted by julian [24.25.177.219], 26/06/2001 15:20 GMT , Refers to Post #1292

it still wont work the target path is correct but i still get the alloc full error, but thanks for the help

#1294 Posted by Dilvish [172.190.51.13], 26/06/2001 16:40 GMT

The "heapsize" thingy is used with WinQuake. With GlQuake, you might try "-winmem XX", where XX is the number of megs you want to allow.
You'd get something like
D:\QUAKE\glquake.exe -width 512 -bpp 32 -winmem 56 +gl_flashblend 0 +map e2m10

No No No...

#1295 Posted by XeNoN [212.126.135.203], 26/06/2001 17:10 GMT

please someone tell me how to fix this damn error when i try to load my map in gl quake. "sys_error: Alloc block:full"

Sorry, but there's no way of fixing it actually. It's usually down to the original map design. If your map is very large, spacious and contains vast flat surfaces then this is probaly what is causing the error. It crops up only on particular maps, and in all GL-based engines, like panquake,tomazquake, and nehahra too. You'll just have to resort to winquake/dosquake.

And dilvish, it's the other way round... heapsize is for GL, winmem is for software...

#1296 Posted by Lunaran [205.188.198.138], 26/06/2001 17:43 GMT , Refers to Post #1281

#1297 Posted by julian [24.25.176.51], 26/06/2001 17:54 GMT , Refers to Post #1295

i had that happen in a nother large map so that must be the problem, the map is to big. I did get it to run in gl quake but after deleting a few hills :)

#1298 Posted by Dilvish [195.93.50.192], 26/06/2001 19:13 GMT

So heapsize works for GL and WinQuake?

#1299 Posted by DaZ [213.122.222.220], 26/06/2001 19:22 GMT , Refers to Post #1296

#852 in the screenshot thread.

#1300 Posted by Lunaran [205.188.199.212], 27/06/2001 03:27 GMT

OH. I was responding to the screenshots from drannerz' latest map and managed to confuse you two. :) You only proceeded to confuse me further by posting about it HERE.

Wasted Time

#1301 Posted by Iain [208.181.205.23], 27/06/2001 03:46 GMT

I spent about three hours removing a sloppy brush section in INVEIN. I reworked two sprial staircases, replacing cylinders and steps containing detail as small as 4 units, with new, cleaner measurements of 16 units. Along with that, some 25 brushes were no longer needed. But upon compliling this new beauty, the r_speeds jumped from 700 to 1000.

so... huh?

Quake 3 Textures

#1302 Posted by julian [24.25.176.51], 27/06/2001 21:43 GMT

have any of u ever tried to convert quake 3 textures to quake 1?

Yes We Have

#1303 Posted by CZG [148.122.66.36], 27/06/2001 23:37 GMT

some of them, especially the gothic ones, convert quite nicely...

#1304 Posted by julian [24.25.176.51], 28/06/2001 00:34 GMT

i also like to convert ut textures. i think they are good for castle/temple type things

#1305 Posted by cyBeAr [213.64.67.243], 28/06/2001 01:21 GMT

or you might consider not converting them.

#1306 Posted by Julian [24.25.177.219], 28/06/2001 03:57 GMT , Refers to Post #1305

they look a lot better than normal quake textures so why not.

#1307 Posted by julian [24.25.177.219], 28/06/2001 03:59 GMT

they look a lot better than quake textures so why not use q3 and ut textures.

#1308 Posted by cyBeAr [213.64.67.243], 28/06/2001 04:38 GMT

When walking down a street and stumbling across a car much nicer looking than the one in your garage -why don't you steal it?

#1309 Posted by The Lieutenant [144.32.177.130], 28/06/2001 13:06 GMT

I get that feeling too, if I go out driving too soon after playing GTA.

#1310 Posted by julian [24.25.177.219], 28/06/2001 14:32 GMT

there is a big dif between free quake 3 textures and somone elses car.

#1311 Posted by Dilvish [172.190.123.124], 28/06/2001 15:33 GMT

I do agree with u on that, Julian. This smells a bit of puritanism, IMHO.

#1312 Posted by The Lieutenant [144.32.177.160], 28/06/2001 17:15 GMT

Why is stealing textures any different to stealing anything else?

#1313 Posted by pjw [208.192.76.75], 28/06/2001 18:14 GMT , Refers to Post #1310

There's a big difference in degree? Yes.
Is it still illegal? Yes.

More importantly, is it still wrong? Yes.

/me commits his $0.02 to another endless texture ripping discussion which will likely have no effect whatsoever, as people who don't care will continue to not care until they receive a "please remove the link to your map" letter from id and proceed to call them petty, money-grubbing bastards.

We need a <rolleyes> icon.

There Is A Thread For This

#1314 Posted by Grahf [209.145.69.181], 28/06/2001 18:14 GMT

If you want to argue about intellectual property/copyright, I would be much obliged if you resurrected Peej's thread.

Though actually, if we listen to Paul Jacquay's latest postings about id texture usage (on q3w), making texture packs and distributing them is the "evil" here, not the usage of converted textures.

Either way, the argument has been beaten into the ground.

#1315 Posted by julian [24.25.177.219], 28/06/2001 19:40 GMT

its not like id says u cant use there textures in custom maps. converting them to work in quake 1 is not stealing att all.

#1316 Posted by The Lieutenant [144.32.128.132], 28/06/2001 20:42 GMT

because then people can see Quake3 textures in Quake1, without having to pay any money for Quake3. How about if people converted the levels too? and the models? you could play Quake3 without actually having to pay for any of it.

This will be my last post on the issue (unless someone else says something stupid enough to make me respond).

Quake 3 Textures In Q1

#1317 Posted by Boots [203.79.102.64], 29/06/2001 01:04 GMT

There's a gplQuake engine called Phoenix quake that has suport for TGAs and a lot of the Q3 shader comands.
Unfortunately he never finished off the full support like he planned, (jpgs and zip suport and all) :(
Any hoo I hunted down a normal q1 map that used converted quake3 textures called jexdm1, then copied over the original quake 3 textures and shaders (had to convert the jpgs to tgas tho), and voila, a quake 1 map with lovely 24bit hi res textures.
If you're interested grab the file
"Phoenix R6 - Jexdm1.bsp Shaders"
from
here
It has instructions and links in the readme.

Aditional notes to that readme I have to make looking at it now, I made this file a fair while ago, when I only had the q3 test.
Instalation:
Step 2: or look into the jexdm1.shader to get the specific texture names
Step 2a: Convert any jpg textures to tga. (early q3tests only used tga not jpgs)

There is also a texture in jexdm1 that he used that was in the Q3test but not the final, I can't remember the name tho.

Known bugs: The first one I mentioned is because of thus: "The inner ring does not show because all textures in Quake 1 have coordinates equivalent to
'q3map_globaltexture' which does not work at all with 'clampmap'."
Thats was from phoenix himself.
I was right in asuming the cause of the second bug, Phoenix told me about it as well.

If I have time I might re-do the file to make it clearer.

Who Needs A Title Anyway

#1318 Posted by Boots [203.79.102.81], 29/06/2001 02:45 GMT

Just re-installed my own file. Eech lots of problems.
I've fixed up what I could and added the bits to the readme.

It's
"Phoenix R6 - Jexdm1.bsp Shaders - Release 2"
here

Who Needs A Title Anyway

#1319 Posted by TheToadWarrior [64.91.156.169], 29/06/2001 07:23 GMT

Using converted and inferior Id textures in Id's other games may technically be stealing but I doubt Id really cares. Converting Q3 maps and models to Q1, won't make anyone give up Q3. Have you see the maps that hae been converted? They're ass compared to the originals.

New Mapper In The House!

#1320 Posted by CaptainZod [12.145.226.51], 29/06/2001 08:05 GMT

Whats up!

I am here to post a bit of blurb on a map o' mine called RotoSpawn. Its a Q2 map, and it rocks on LAN so for 2-4 players. If you like up close and personal in your face deathmatch... try it out!

Download RotoSpawn

Mephisto's Q2 maps

Thanx all...
CaptainZod aka"Mephisto"

Lighting Of Player Models In Quake

#1321 Posted by GlassMan [195.184.253.80], 29/06/2001 13:35 GMT

Can someone explain how the player model (& dropped backpacks) are lit in quake. I understand how lightmaps are precalculated for the surface area of the 'world' but obviously moving models have to have their lighting calculated dynamically & I'm a little unsure how this is achieved.

Is it done in basically the same way as lightmaps but in real time? ie. rays thrown from all light entities in the map/locale & added together to give a value for that point in space? or something..??? OR is it by taking a value from the nearest bit of floor (world brush) they happen to be standing on?

Thx if you can explain or point me to a relevant url.

Now I Think About It..

#1322 Posted by GlassMan [195.184.253.80], 29/06/2001 13:41 GMT

I asked a similar question before but in relation to a problem I was having with monster models. I believe CZG said they got the light value from that of the first normal brush beneath them. Is that right?

#1323 Posted by Toady [195.163.228.243], 29/06/2001 14:54 GMT , Refers to Post #1322

model light value is that of the lightmap directly beneath it...

It's not based on lights in the world, which I believe wouldn't be possible as non-model light entities are removed after BSP LIGHTing(aren't they?)

#1324 Posted by CZG [130.67.143.121], 29/06/2001 16:13 GMT

They are not removed by default by the compilers, but there are options in say, Tyrlite to have them removed. Not always a good thing if you have triggered lights and such...
Some of the newer (And perhaps the older ones too, I dunno really) Quake ports actually add some 'specularish' lighting from the closest pointlights to add some more depth to the original light from the floor.

Grahf Is Still Working On A Title

#1325 Posted by Grahf [24.51.158.57], 29/06/2001 22:47 GMT

Standard GlQuake model lighting does have several degrees of direction, 8 I believe. i.e., I assume taht means light can appear to be striking a model from 8 different directions (?).

#1326 Posted by Biff_Debris [205.188.192.188], 29/06/2001 23:02 GMT , Refers to Post #1320

I think the Mephisto thing's better =) btw that first linkie no werk =\

Just A Quick Question...

#1327 Posted by necros [172.159.158.65], 30/06/2001 02:40 GMT

When using tyrlite, and trying to compile my level, it gives me the error 'not 3 values for colour' and i'm not even compiling with the -colored command.

what the hell?

had no errors from other programs (vis/qbsp)

Re: Just A Quick Question...

#1328 Posted by Tyrann [203.56.239.111], 30/06/2001 02:52 GMT , Refers to Post #1327

When using tyrlite... it gives me the error 'not 3 values for colour'...

Use version 0.9 and it'll you'll just get a warning. The level will compile fine. The problem is that some custom entities use the "_color" key with just a single value. The simplistic entity parser doesn't have enough state to know if it's looking a light entity or not, so I give a warning in case it is.

#1329 Posted by necros [172.135.59.196], 30/06/2001 13:54 GMT

Yeah, I kinda had a feeling it was that. (Had the color key on some models, like ya said)

Interesting...

#1330 Posted by CaptainZod [12.145.226.218], 30/06/2001 21:22 GMT , Refers to Post #1316

You know its the engine that makes about 75% of the gaming experience for me...
And another thing... I don't see any copywright on those textures anywhere... its on the game as a whole... therefore it isn't a violation of said copywrite to use them in anything, Just to copy the game as a whole.
And if someone did a q3mod for q1 and didn't call it quakeIII arena mod... then ID would have no legal ground there aswell, unless they have a patent on the Quake franchise in which case all the other 1st person ID clones would be in jail =P

#1331 Posted by GrindSpire [213.122.68.78], 30/06/2001 21:25 GMT , Refers to Post #1330

Just Wondering...

#1332 Posted by necros [172.175.109.249], 01/07/2001 00:01 GMT

Where do most of you people (I'm refering to Q1 Mappers) go to get Beta Testers. Having no immeadiate familly interrested in quake, i don't have any one to inflict my levels on. This is also a question If anyone here would be willing to Beta test my map ...

btw: it's not done yet, but I wanted to see if anyone would be interrested...

#1333 Posted by Biff_Debris [205.188.198.28], 01/07/2001 01:28 GMT , Refers to Post #1332

Why, you can find testers right here! I would meself, but I'm getting a map into beta right now (actually, gotta update the tracker on that, too) =)

#1334 Posted by palldjon@icafe [61.9.128.142], 01/07/2001 05:19 GMT , Refers to Post #1332

I'm up for it. Just email me the .bsp zipped up tight. I'm still developing as both a mapper and player but can offer constructive criticism.

#1335 Posted by Lunaran [152.163.204.49], 01/07/2001 17:20 GMT

You know its the engine that makes about 75% of the gaming experience for me...
And another thing... I don't see any copywright on those textures anywhere... its on the game as a whole... therefore it isn't a violation of said copywrite to use them in anything, Just to copy the game as a whole.

If you've convinced yourself of that then you are a complete dumbass.

Have a nice day!

#1336 Posted by necros [172.142.131.67], 01/07/2001 18:13 GMT

palldjon/biff. it's nice to see some enthousiasm... and I might just send you that map, pallgjon...

now... if i could only find a sprite editor... =)

btw: next person to post will be #1337!

Oops, Typo:

#1337 Posted by necros [172.142.131.67], 01/07/2001 18:14 GMT

pallgjon = palldjon

Grahf Thought A Title Wasn't Needed

#1338 Posted by Grahf [24.51.158.57], 01/07/2001 20:30 GMT

not a very 1337 post for post no. 1337

#1339 Posted by necros [172.138.240.123], 01/07/2001 20:58 GMT

mods, feel free to delete 1337 and assign some one who is...

#1340 Posted by GrindSpire [213.122.175.103], 02/07/2001 06:00 GMT , Refers to Post #1338

I dunno, I think it's a brilliant post for 1337 =)

#1341 Posted by palldjon [203.29.11.28], 03/07/2001 00:54 GMT

I'm almost convinced I should change my nick right away

Beta Testing Anyone?

#1342 Posted by Mark [131.247.167.78], 03/07/2001 03:32 GMT

If anyone would be interested, I have a q1sp level to be beta-tested at chuma.cas.usf.edu/~mmcclure/lm231.zip

Shambler didn't like it, but I'd like some second opinions. Play it; enjoy it; tell me how I can make it better.

Thanks!

#1343 Posted by JB [202.80.33.14], 04/07/2001 00:17 GMT

newbie here, how do launch jumps that curve like Nunuk's plutonians launches??? or is this a trade secret... I'm using Gtkradiant 1-1 beta

JB

Top Secrety Secret Jumping Secret Stuff

#1344 Posted by Shallow[BAP] [212.135.236.122], 04/07/2001 08:28 GMT , Refers to Post #1343

You build little chute/bevel thingies out of common/clip at the 'corners' of the jump (or it might be common/slick, I forget). Obviously getting them in the right place can involve a lot of trial and error.

#1345 Posted by killazontherun [203.164.3.167], 04/07/2001 10:17 GMT

JB, hehe what a name :)

From what I've heard, JB apparently means blow job.

More Questions...

#1346 Posted by necros [172.136.9.80], 04/07/2001 17:21 GMT

Time for me to show my un-1337-ness, again by asking for more answers

Alright: Is there any way to get Sprites to light in quake? Since I've been trying to do some stuff with sprites in my map, but so far, they always turn out fullbright...

I really wanted to use these sprites for trees (having oriented in a star patern or X patern works really well), but it is never shaded properly (well, actually, not at all...)
Is it a setting in the sprite file, or something in the Qc, or is it just plain impossible...

#1347 Posted by DaZ [213.123.29.24], 04/07/2001 20:17 GMT , Refers to Post #1345

I'd Suppose...

#1348 Posted by CZG [148.122.66.36], 04/07/2001 21:30 GMT

that sprites cannot be lit, as they are per definition just a point in space, and you cannot paint a lightmap upon a single point can you?
So Sprites are always destined to be fulbright.
(Try making the trees really dark then?)

#1349 Posted by killazontherun [203.164.3.178], 05/07/2001 05:05 GMT

I know that, but something has started here and JB also means blowjob.. I don't know I don't care..

#1350 Posted by JB [202.139.40.101], 05/07/2001 07:24 GMT

yeah that's what I thought , thingies

JB >) cool huh

Gl-texture-cache-mismatch-error

#1351 Posted by Dr.Shoe [134.147.64.12], 05/07/2001 07:36 GMT

Hi Folks!!

I�ve got a problem: I�m working on a q1dm-map (ffa; 8players ;bsp file size:1173 kb). After compiling and starting it in quake it runs fine. But if I
1. change to another level
2. restart my level
3. start quake with another level and then change to my level
qukae chrashes and I got an "GL-Texture-Cache-mismath-error". When I start it again everything is okay until i do 1-3 again.
Any Ideas what could cause this Error??
(didn�t use to much or missized textures)

Dr.Shoe

#1352 Posted by GlassMan [195.184.253.85], 05/07/2001 08:13 GMT , Refers to Post #1351

This came up a week or 2 ago. Its caused by having a texture with the same name in the 2 different maps where these are different sizes. Compare the names of the textures in the two maps you load & change yours where necessary.

#1353 Posted by Maj [193.128.238.146], 05/07/2001 09:33 GMT , Refers to Post #1348

Ya, you just darken the whole sprite. I vaguely remember DarkPlaces had this feature.

#1354 Posted by necros [172.138.99.154], 05/07/2001 13:53 GMT

So, there's absolutely no way? Is it possible to code something into QC that would adjust the gamma level of the sprite according to the lightmap underneath it (kinda like models are lit)?

Man... I can just see this...

tree0.spr
tree1.spr
tree2.spr ~ tree20.spr

all the same tree, but different lighting? ugh...

Oh well, better start rendering...
But seriously, if anyone knows how to light a friggin' sprite ... please? =/

#1355 Posted by CZG [130.67.219.31], 05/07/2001 16:05 GMT

Mindcrime mentioned a long time ago under Nehahra dev something about a light_lev field, that he thought about using for a weapon that used shadows as it's ammo. I dunno if that light_lev field excists in normal Quake or if it was in some freaky exe, and I have no idea what it would do then either.
So don't ask me.
Although you didn't.
And I still replied.

PS: You'd need 36 sprites to cover all the lightmap levels in Quake I think... Or maybe it was 16, one for each lightness of the colors in the palette.
Anyway. Render the tree once, plonk it into TexMex, and if I'm not mistaking, TexMex' darken/lighten tool will adjust the lightness of the image the same way as software Quake does.

#1356 Posted by Grahf [24.51.158.57], 05/07/2001 18:50 GMT

You're using TomazQuake for your level, right? (I could be talking out of my ass) If you are, then do the trees with alpha channel TGA's, with TQScript. There may even be a function to lighten/darken a shader texture in there, too.

You COULD make the trees a model... Those are lit in some fashion by the game. I'm thinking along the lines of Nehahra/Zerstorer trees.

Grahf, I Did Exactly That,

#1357 Posted by necros [172.142.193.75], 05/07/2001 22:13 GMT , Refers to Post #1356

Although, i didn't use scripts, to keep compatibility with GLQuake, and Software (surprisingly, they look decent in software) Unfortunatly, there's no Shader scripts in TQ yet...

But then...
WTF IS THIS???

Why does GLQuake do that? It's fine in software tho... (couldn't get a screen shot, as for some reason, all shots from software quake are in B&W... hmmmm)

As for models, well, I said it before but I don't have a clue as to how to do them... and anyway, i'm happy with my sprites.

#1358 Posted by necros [172.142.104.215], 06/07/2001 00:51 GMT

I just tried a quick compile of the whole level so far, and I just got another error. Ok, this one only crashed out to the console with the error:

PF_precache_model: overflow
host_error: program error

I suspect it has something to do with the torches which i changed into MOVETYPE_NONEs.

Anyway help...
used:
WQBSP 1.65
TYRLITE 0.9
RVIS+

BTW: I got the error from Software quake, when I ran it in TomazQuake, it just crashed with a 'this program has performed an illegal funtionc call' error. Same with GLQuake.

Oh, and don't tell me I didn't use enough ram, i put a -winmem 128 and -heapsize 128000.

Append This:

#1359 Posted by necros [172.142.104.215], 06/07/2001 00:52 GMT

PF_precache_model

#1360 Posted by GlassMan [213.121.125.130], 06/07/2001 05:45 GMT

I think that means you've exceeded the permitted number of models (which include brush models). (255 iirc)

#1361 Posted by The Lieutenant [152.163.207.73], 06/07/2001 10:01 GMT

there is a way to do trees how you want in Q1, but you have to use TomazQuake or similar - make the tree sprites into textures (with transparent colour in appropriate places), then apply them to thin brushes set 90 degrees apart from one another. Then highlight both brushes and make them into a func_wall. You'll also need to be running custom QC as described in Tomaz's "moding.txt" (sic) file.

#1362 Posted by necros [172.156.37.154], 06/07/2001 16:54 GMT

Lieutenant: That doesn't work at all (I tried it), since the way Quake does visibility, anything behind a func_wall or similar entities is simply not drawn, which means, any other entities, and/or monster will not appear behind the func_walls (i ran into this problem a lot when doing stuff with the illusionaries).

GlassMan: I only have a total of 184 entities in my map (at least, what WQBSP told me), so that can't be the problem.

And once again, I tell you, it's not the trees, as I made them static entities. (no, i'm not getting the 'too many static entities' error =/)

When I first got this problem, I went back into my QC and changed all the torches back to Statics Ents, and left the flame balls as dynamic entities... but didn't help. (but it's why the tree sprites are static)

#1363 Posted by necros [172.156.37.154], 06/07/2001 16:58 GMT

What is the max amount of TOTAL entities? (Excluding doors).

When WQBSP starts, it says 789 entities (so, 789 - 184 = 605 Ents (because I have 184 bspmodels))

So i assume this means I have 605 Ents. (Including lights?)
What's the max?

#1364 Posted by CZG [148.122.66.36], 06/07/2001 16:58 GMT

If the trees are sprites, and you have indeed made many different versions of the sprites for varying light levels, then each sprite would need it's own precache. And most entities have more than one precache too.

Max Numbers

#1365 Posted by GlassMan [213.121.125.130], 06/07/2001 18:32 GMT

The maximum number of entities including lights is 2048 so thats not your problem.

The precache error refers to the number of different models that are precached so a shambler say only counts once even if you have 20 of them. There is a command that will list the precached models in the console but I forget what it is. Someone should know.

I dont know why you want to exclude doors. Each separate func_* brush entity & trigger brushes will count as a model in that tally.

Max Numbers:More

#1366 Posted by Apollo [213.123.10.173], 06/07/2001 18:55 GMT

err, while we're on the subject, how many BRUSHES can a map have (in q1)?

#1367 Posted by cyBeAr [213.64.67.243], 06/07/2001 21:10 GMT , Refers to Post #1362

err? everything behind a func_wall should be drawn all the time, it does not block vis (and not light either I believe).

#1368 Posted by DaZ [213.122.224.116], 06/07/2001 22:52 GMT , Refers to Post #1367

I'm Not Sure....

#1369 Posted by Jaj [62.83.135.236], 07/07/2001 01:52 GMT , Refers to Post #1366

...but i think they were 4096... but if you compile your level with wqbsp165, your map could have 8000 bruhes more or less, but it doesn't mean quake engine could handle that map

One Question....

#1370 Posted by Jaj [62.83.135.236], 07/07/2001 01:58 GMT , Refers to Post #1365

....if for example you have a shambler in your map, wouldn't count apart from shambler himself, the head.mdl, and gibs.mdl.... so the shambler would count as 3, i don't know... just something i had in head and needed to ask

#1371 Posted by GlassMan [213.123.239.151], 07/07/2001 09:28 GMT

Yes & there are 3 gibs models & each of them will count as well as things like the spike model which you may not think of at first. The command you need I think is "mcache" in the console to list them.

On the number of brushes, unless the bsp compiler has a limit then there isn't one as the bsp itself doesn't have any brushes.

#1372 Posted by Jaj [62.83.1.106], 07/07/2001 23:42 GMT , Refers to Post #1371

Heeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee(oops! No "e" Left)lp!

#1373 Posted by Dilvish [172.191.172.105], 08/07/2001 20:39 GMT

I'm laboriously trying to create my first Q1 SP map (with my own tex, I know almost everybody hates them and I don't give a damn, cuz I map for fun), and I nee to know how to make monsters appear unexpectedly (as if through a teleporter.
Could someone kindly explain me how it is done?
Thanx all

Horrid Teleport Boxes

#1374 Posted by CZG [130.67.143.61], 08/07/2001 21:51 GMT

Place your monsters in tiny boxes on the outside of the level, (or one bigass box, doesn't really matter,) and make a trigger_teleport around each one. Set them up as usual, but also give them a targetname. When that targetname is triggered, the monster is teleported to the info_teleport_destination set in the trigger_teleport.
Horrendous amounts of work if you're planning on having many surprises. If you're into QC though, simply place Zer's SF64 code into it, and you'll have a much better time...

#1375 Posted by DeFrag [208.49.10.210], 09/07/2001 01:47 GMT

I've been having problems loading a perfectly good compile of my map in Q3.
It fails & says: "Requested feature was omitted at compile time"

I usually convert my .tga into a .jpg for the levelshot & its worked fine in the past.
But now it only works with .tga WTF??

I pull up Bal's, ztn's, Lun's etc.. they're all different sizes but all in .jpg format.
What should a levelshot for Q3 be according to gospel?
I can't find any reference in the readmes, Q3 World, or Rust.

I'd really hate to use a 2mb .tga damn!

#1376 Posted by Dilvish [172.189.31.12], 09/07/2001 06:59 GMT

#1377 Posted by Shallow[BAP] [212.135.236.122], 09/07/2001 08:26 GMT , Refers to Post #1375

You're not saving as progressively encoded are you? That'll screw it up. Be sure to use standard encoding.

Not much point in making the pic bigger that 640x480, in most cases you can get away with much smaller than that. The id ones are 128x128, IIRC. If you use tiny .tgas the final pk3 can sometimes end up smaller with .tga than .jpg, oddly.

Hmm, No Title

#1378 Posted by Dr.Shoe [134.147.64.12], 09/07/2001 08:37 GMT , Refers to Post #1352

THANK YOU!!!

IT was a 32*32 cilp-texture.

Tks Alot Shallow[BAP]

#1379 Posted by DeFrag [208.49.10.180], 09/07/2001 14:23 GMT , Refers to Post #1377

I'll try non-progressive when I get home tonight.

DeFrag Thought A Title Wasn't Needed

#1380 Posted by DeFrag [208.49.10.180], 09/07/2001 14:23 GMT

btw, what is IIRC?

If I Recall Correctly.

#1381 Posted by Tron [202.7.186.9], 09/07/2001 14:36 GMT

I think that's what it means.

#1382 Posted by Maj [193.128.238.146], 09/07/2001 15:34 GMT , Refers to Post #1375

I vaguely remember it must be square as well. I should certainly be power of 2 just like a normal texture (which, really, it is) as well.

#1383 Posted by Lunaran [172.137.133.185], 09/07/2001 16:08 GMT

Dilvish: nobody doesn't like Q1SP.

DeFrag: Don't make your levelshots excessively big. I fucking hate people who put in 800x600 targa levelshots - it's so wantonly stupid to have a levelshot bigger than your BSP. Always use JPG's, and don't be a goof and put in some huge texture. even if it's JPG in your pak file it'll be converted to 32-bit TGA for the rendering memory, so anything over 256x256 is going to kill your memory limit real fast.

#1384 Posted by Dilvish [172.191.183.161], 09/07/2001 19:21 GMT

This Is Prolly

#1385 Posted by Dilvish [172.191.183.161], 09/07/2001 19:26 GMT

a stupid question, but is it possible to play a level that has func_rotate things and such in it without having Scourge or Dissolution installed? I have those 2 mission packs, but not everyone does, and I wouldn't like to deprive anyone from the immense privilege of playing my most extaordinary map.
Ahem.

You'd Need To Include...

#1386 Posted by CZG [148.122.66.36], 09/07/2001 20:08 GMT

A progs.dat that has been compiled with the hipnotic rotating entites and tell people to install it as a mod. That's how!

#1387 Posted by XeNoN [213.120.56.45], 09/07/2001 21:02 GMT

Use progs.dat from levels like mexx9, mexx10, gmsp1 or um... *mindblock*... yeah, one of those three...

...or Rde...

#1388 Posted by XeNoN [213.120.56.45], 09/07/2001 21:05 GMT

That Simple?

#1389 Posted by Dilvish [172.189.28.166], 10/07/2001 05:55 GMT

All right, thanx a lot, all.

Starting Shooters By Shooting?

#1390 Posted by Decay [194.106.190.202], 10/07/2001 13:41 GMT

I�m a beginner at this quake map building world, but I need this question answered in order to finish this thing that I started. I couldn�t find a solution within the manual. And the question goes:
How do I make a shooter that is activated by shooting at trigger (or something else)???� you know, like in that level with Xaero �The Very End Of You�. I managed to make one get started by passing through trigger_multiple brush �

#1391 Posted by pjw [208.192.76.75], 10/07/2001 16:59 GMT , Refers to Post #1390

You need to give your button a "health" key with a low value (so shooting it will activate it).

A Tricky Question.

#1392 Posted by Tron [203.29.136.45], 10/07/2001 18:04 GMT

Okay it's 3:33 AM and I was just feeling curious. In some speedmap (i think it might have been xenons) theres a big collumn at the end you have to shoot to exit the level. It looks like a func_explosive_wall kinda deal but it's just in a normal bsp without needing any extra qc to run. Anyone know how it was done?

Tron

#1393 Posted by DaZ [213.122.216.166], 10/07/2001 18:08 GMT

XeNoN might, not sure though

/sarcasm

yeah I would like to know as well, CZG used the sme trick (I think) in his 100b2 map.

God Dammit!

#1394 Posted by CZG [148.122.66.36], 10/07/2001 20:54 GMT

I've explained this 5 times already!
Make info_notnull!
Give "targetname" "boom"!
Give "use" "barrel_explode"!
Make trigger_once!
Give "target" "boom"

#1395 Posted by Speedy [213.158.1.76], 11/07/2001 01:43 GMT

possible to mute sounds of some objects, like traps? Get rid of sky/water noise using only map changes (I know hvis can disable water/wind sounds, any other ways ?).

#1396 Posted by Speedy [213.158.1.76], 11/07/2001 02:01 GMT

how to plug any custom texes to quark ?
I dont get all this add-on coding shit...
Any help ?

Starting Shooters By Shooting?

#1397 Posted by Decay [194.106.189.79], 11/07/2001 05:53 GMT , Refers to Post #1391

Thanks PJW ... it works.
Decay

#1398 Posted by pjw [208.192.76.75], 11/07/2001 07:06 GMT , Refers to Post #1397

Glad I could help.

#1399 Posted by necros [172.132.197.3], 13/07/2001 18:45 GMT

You can get rid of the Sky sound by simply making all sky brushes Func_illusionaries (or walls...) , then, of course, you need real brushes behind those...

as for custom textures, well, I use Quark 4.07 (i know it's old, but i just like it), and all you do, is make a 'Custom Textures' thing in the Quark explorer then import your textures there. then, when your in the map editor, just look for the tab named "custom textures" or whatever you named it.

Rotating Ents And The Evil Lights

#1400 Posted by necros [172.132.197.3], 13/07/2001 18:48 GMT

Once upon a time, I tried to light a Rotating Brush, and to my dismay, it went all screwy! For some reason, all the toggleable lights weren't toggled on the ent, they were always on. observe:example

how do you get rotating ents to light properly? can i do like trains, and place the actual brushes somewhere else first to light them?

First Of All...

#1401 Posted by czg [130.67.143.85], 13/07/2001 20:40 GMT

make sure your compilers actually support the rotating bits. Most compilers released after the Rogue (yes, Rogue, not Hipnotic) pak should do so. What I use is Tyrlite and Wqbsp1.65 which works fine

Qbsp Is Demonspawn

#1402 Posted by than [213.1.10.214], 14/07/2001 14:06 GMT

Ok, couple of quick question. Please don't point me to Quakelab for the answers because the solutions offered there aren't terribly helpful in this case.

1. My level is apparently leaking according to wqbsp although it compiles and runs fine. vis runs on it and the outside is filled (the error says no filling performed, then it sits there for a bit (doing the filling but without spewing out the info.)) There are no abnormalities in game. It's just a weird error and is annoying me a bit.

2. CuteNodePortal_r:was clipped away.
Ok, what the fuck does this mean? I've had it lots of times before and managed to fix it by messing about with brushes. It only occurs when there are fairly complex arrangements of brushes but tracking down the offending brush is bloody hard. Anyone else had problems with this and can offer a simple solution?

Cheers,

-than

Re: Qbsp Is Demonspawn

#1403 Posted by Tyrann [203.56.239.113], 14/07/2001 15:54 GMT , Refers to Post #1402

Check if you have a skybrush that doesn't touch any part of the inside of your map.

I had a wierd situation a couple of days ago where hulls 0 and 2 would compile fine, but hull 1 would report a leak. A prt file was generated, but after vising, it would have stupid things like 300 r_speeds with my face right up against a wall. Getting rid of this "detached" sky brush did the trick for me. I have no idea why though...

#1404 Posted by necros [172.165.133.128], 14/07/2001 23:27 GMT , Refers to Post #1401

I use those exact two compilers (well, and RVIS+), yet the rotating ents still light wierd.

Oh, and why does GLQuake display sprites upside down, meanwhile TomazQuake (which is based off of GLQuake) display them right-side up (software does it right-side up too)? like this

this is really all that's keeping me from finish the map...so i'd really appreaciate any suggestions...

Factory Gazelle

#1405 Posted by czg [130.67.143.66], 15/07/2001 00:13 GMT

If neither of that is the case, maybe it's the one about the rotating brushes and the switchable lights. I've never done that myself though, so I have no other suggestions.
As for sprites, well, I don't care about sprites...

#1406 Posted by palldjon [203.29.11.18], 15/07/2001 04:44 GMT , Refers to Post #1402

have you done any "carving" in the level. I gave up using this *cough* technique when it started triggering the nofill/fill response. Likewise with the cutnodeportal error.

#1407 Posted by Grahf [24.51.158.171], 15/07/2001 07:36 GMT

I know that Quake uses different 3d axis orientations than is common (it uses Z for up/down, instead of Y, I think). Regardless of that, It would seem that GlQuake is simply loading models with a different axis orientation than software or Tomaz. I bet it would be solvable merely by hacking the QC, not the engine itself. Perhaps there is a function in the qc for the orientation of a sprite? If there is, then you could either hardcode it to point the way you want, or make a custom entity to manually adjust the direction. I'm no coder, though...

oh yeah, and...

Beware the Rotating Bits! They are the source of Primal Evil! All hail the Rotating Chthulu!

goodnight.

#1408 Posted by than [213.1.29.1], 15/07/2001 09:43 GMT

carving?

hehe, yeah right.

Btw, Tyrann, cheers for the help but none of my skybrushes are the prob. I had no sky brushes in when the leak problem started and now I do there seems to be no extra problem. R_speeds are as I would expect too.

-than

#1409 Posted by StarBUCK [213.122.75.113], 15/07/2001 13:24 GMT

no necros you gotta keep the trees upside down, itd be much more entertaining

#1410 Posted by Decay [194.106.188.210], 16/07/2001 07:55 GMT

I have few more questions.
I don�t get how to make (enviroment) skybox from the manual. Making a shader part I kinda get but what texture do I apply to box surrounding my level? �Q3Radiant doesn�t open �env� folder. (Did I mention that I am a biginner at qmapping?)
If the answer is more complicated you could point me to the site where I could find the answers�
�one more thing� Where can I find how to make custom skyboxes or find some allready made by others?

#1411 Posted by DaZ [62.7.33.5], 16/07/2001 10:59 GMT

Not sure about tutotials, but there are an arse load of cool skybox's at Socks site,

Here

#1412 Posted by Shallow[BAP] [212.135.236.122], 16/07/2001 12:54 GMT

The best tutorial I've come across on these is on claudec.com, which is unfortunately down at the moment. The best thing to do in the absence of that is take a map with a skybox, copy and rename the shader to match your map, then redo the paths to match your images.

IIRC there is a sky related tutorial on Sock's site, but unfortunately it was intended as a supplement to the one on claudec.com

Claudec Link

#1413 Posted by Shallow[BAP] [212.135.236.122], 16/07/2001 12:57 GMT

IP based link

Just remembered... the site is still there but the DNS is buggered... I think the domain reg's expired.

#1414 Posted by Shallow[BAP] [212.135.236.122], 16/07/2001 13:01 GMT

Wrong fecking tutorial!

THIS LINK!

Errors Coming Out Of My Ass...

#1415 Posted by necros [172.152.66.182], 16/07/2001 17:56 GMT

Ok, i'm addressing mainly mappers who have dealt with large, 2000+ brush maps...

------------
CALL1 471 (precache_model)precache_model()
knight.qc
(NO FUNCTION)
PF_precache_model: overflow
Host_error: Program error
------------

I got this error in quake when running my map (which compiled properly, vised and all that good stuff).

before, the line that says knight.qc was world.qc, but i had removed some func_movewalls, and recompiled and that's when it switched to knight.qc.
Now, there's nothing wrong with the knight's code. I didn't add anything new to it, so it can't be that.

Anybody ever encounter this error?

btw, even tho i'm using tomazquake, both other quakes (GL, software) give the same error, so it's not engine related.

#1416 Posted by GlassMan [213.123.239.151], 16/07/2001 20:24 GMT

didn't we just deal with this error? too many precached models. Only 255 allowed including brush models. Remember each individual func_movewall, func_illusionary etc etc will count towards that maximum. Use mcache to list them. The items marked *1,*2, etc are your brush models.

Well, That Would Be The Problem, Except,

#1417 Posted by necros [172.134.124.160], 16/07/2001 20:27 GMT

i only have 195 brush models. (func_XXX)

So that's not it.

Hmm, No Title

#1418 Posted by GlassMan [213.123.239.151], 16/07/2001 20:35 GMT

it will include all the weapon models, health etc etc..use mcache & you will have them listed. 195 is a _lot_ of brush models.

Also Includes

#1419 Posted by GlassMan [213.123.239.151], 16/07/2001 20:48 GMT

trigger_* brushes

#1420 Posted by Speedy [213.158.1.6], 16/07/2001 21:16 GMT

What is the total number of all non-brush models ? Would be handy to know

I Think Someone Said 2048...

#1421 Posted by necros [172.134.124.160], 16/07/2001 22:06 GMT , Refers to Post #1420

but i could be "talking out of my ass".

well, i got rid of the model problem, now, i got a new one...

what does:

can't find function Monster_hknight
Host_Error: ED_ParseEdict: Parse Error

mean?

This doesn't seem map related, but I can't understand, since I can play any other maps with the same Progs.dat i'm using for this map...

#1422 Posted by GlassMan [213.123.239.151], 16/07/2001 23:25 GMT

was the total number of entities (including lights) that quake (or maybe one of the compilers) seems to allow. Don't know if there is a specific maximum for non-brush models.

What I Mean

#1423 Posted by Speedy [213.158.1.6], 17/07/2001 00:01 GMT

What is the total number of standard quake models (all monsters and stuff) so I`d know how many brushmodels I can have in a map

#1424 Posted by palldjon [203.29.11.18], 17/07/2001 05:58 GMT , Refers to Post #1408

didn't really think you still (ever) be using it but...*shrug*

Is That The Actual Capitalisation?

#1425 Posted by Fat Controller [203.79.106.187], 17/07/2001 06:59 GMT , Refers to Post #1421

If it is actually saying Monster_*, then something went wierd with your entity defines somewhere. Entity names aren't normally cap'd; that should be monster_knight.

Apart from that rotating fernackerpans are horrid for sending model counts over the edge.

#1426 Posted by Decay [194.106.188.236], 17/07/2001 08:27 GMT , Refers to Post #1414

I found on Socks site his sky-boxes and in the read-me file that comes with them where all answers I neaded.
Thanks guys (or girls : ) )
Decay

PS. You should watchout for the ultimate space fast and furious jumpad action level that I am about to finish these days. It�s named �Pretorian� and I�ll try to put it out on ..::LVL beta section for second opinions.

#1427 Posted by Lunaran [152.163.204.78], 17/07/2001 15:48 GMT

you spell it "praetorian" before you release it. :p

#1428 Posted by necros [172.146.62.250], 17/07/2001 21:21 GMT , Refers to Post #1425

then something went wierd with your entity defines somewhere

What do you mean? Do you mean the Classname is screwed, or the actual code?

I don't think it's the code, since I can run other maps with Hell Knights in it. So, it must be map-related, but i checked all the monster_hell_knights and there's no caps on em... so unless i misunderstood what you meant...

And I solved the 'rotating brushes sending my model count over' problem, by splittingup the map into two sections. The main body of it, and the ending sequence...

2 Questions, Please...

#1429 Posted by Dilvish [172.191.191.98], 17/07/2001 21:48 GMT

1) Is it possible with one trigger to get lights to go from "off" to "on" one after the other? Meaning light1 goes on after 1 sec, light2 after 2 secs, etc.

2) How do you use the "trigger_monsterjump"? It seems funny, but I dunno what it does or how to use it.
Thx

#1430 Posted by XeNoN [217.158.29.3], 17/07/2001 22:12 GMT

1.) Well, you could try and add a "delay" value to each of the lights (1, then 2, then 3 etc) then give'em all the same targetname and target them with a trigger... but I doubt that'd work. The best way is to set your first trigger to target several other triggers with the same targetname, and give THEM "delay" attributes, with the values representing the time in seconds. Then all you need to do is give each light a different targetname, so each of the delayed triggers will target each one... is that understandable? You can set spawnflags bit 1 on the lights to make them start switched off.

2.) You add a brush to the trigger_monsterjump entity, and when a monster walks or is dropped into it, it jumps :). Set "height" value in quake units to configure how high the monster jumps, "angle" in degrees for the direction (0 = east) and "speed" for how far the monster jumps in that direction (or how fast they jump, same result)

Now if someones already posted on this then I'll be annoyed...

#1431 Posted by necros [172.146.62.250], 17/07/2001 23:03 GMT , Refers to Post #1430

I don't believe that your lights thing will work. it will result in an infinite loop (since the lights will be retriggering themselves via the delay relays).
The best way (IMO) to do lights like Dilvish is describing, would be to use Hipnotic's Func_counter (and func_oncount).

Simply make a counter, and have it count in a loop, resetting when it gets to it's max number. Then, have the func_oncounts target the lights. This adds WAY more flexibility (can have random lights come on, also can have it so you have to trigger it to fire the targets), and it has the added benefit of being very easy to configure, since all you have to do is change one value (func_counter's 'wait' value) to make the timing different, whereas, in the first suggestion, you'd have to change all the 'delay' keys in every one of the relays. (no offense, Xenon).

Beta Testing Anyone?

#1432 Posted by necros [172.146.62.250], 17/07/2001 23:09 GMT

I _FINALLY_ tracked down all those f'ing errors. Now I'm wondering if anyone would be willing to beta test for me? I remember Palldjon had offered, but I hadn't be ready at that time. (If your still up for the offer...)

Tomaz Quake prefered, but GLQuake/Software works as well.

Oops, Sorry Xenon,

#1433 Posted by necros [172.146.62.250], 18/07/2001 00:53 GMT , Refers to Post #1430

i just reread your post, and realised that you were right. i stand corrected, however, i still stick by my func_counter idea.

#1434 Posted by Dilvish [172.188.246.153], 18/07/2001 02:34 GMT

#1435 Posted by palldjon [203.29.11.18], 18/07/2001 05:06 GMT , Refers to Post #1434

I think I've still got a tiny little .map at home where I tested the vore jump for pdbq_sp1. If you want it just say so.

BTW, be careful of how many timed lights you use in a particular area. If say the "room" already has some point entity lighting associated with fixtures, and triggering a switch starts a lighting sequence, then you'll very quickly hit the "too many light styles on a face" limit (4 iirc) as each of the switchable lights counts as a different light style even if you've cloned them.

#1436 Posted by Decay [194.106.188.228], 18/07/2001 10:23 GMT , Refers to Post #1427

Q2 To Q1 Map Converter

#1437 Posted by Tef Johs [148.122.66.37], 18/07/2001 13:44 GMT

I read somewhere about a small program that converts the .map file from Q2 format to Q1 format, making it possible for instance to use QERadiant for Q1 editing.

Can someone please give me a working link to this utility? It would be most appreciated.

#1438 Posted by XeNoN [217.158.29.193], 18/07/2001 17:33 GMT

Well, its at < a http://www.planetquake.com/rem>http://www.planetquake.com/rem if that'll do

Fuck That Tag...

#1439 Posted by XeNoN [217.158.29.193], 18/07/2001 17:35 GMT

#1440 Posted by czg [148.122.66.37], 18/07/2001 18:37 GMT

OK, I can't think of any easy way to explain this, so I'll just make a horrid example. You have two lights. Each can be flipped on/off independently. This setup already uses up the four lightstyles you have available to compile with: 1 - both on, 2 - fist on second off, 3 - first off second on, 4 - both off.
So if you were planning on having a long corridor that lights up as you go along it, you'd have to be pretty clever with "aiming" your lights so they only the faces in their immediate surroundings. And don't even think Quake/tyrlite is clever enough to figure out you're only going to flip them on in that one particular manner so it'd work anyway. Cos it won't!

Thanks Xenon!

#1441 Posted by Tef Johs [148.122.66.37], 18/07/2001 20:26 GMT , Refers to Post #1438

That was exactly the utility I was looking for.

Re: Lumiere

#1442 Posted by Tyrann [203.56.239.112], 19/07/2001 04:39 GMT , Refers to Post #1440

It doesn't quite work like that. Only three light styles would be used in your example - one for the default static lightmap, and one for each different targetname that a light has. When you flip on the lights, the engine combines the lightmaps for all the light styles that are "on".

Nehahra .def File

#1443 Posted by GlassMan [195.184.253.85], 19/07/2001 08:40 GMT

Does anyone have an entities definition file for use with qeradiant/stoneless for the nehahra entities? Failing that any source file that would help me make one.

Thx

#1444 Posted by Bal [213.36.1.110], 19/07/2001 10:58 GMT

what for? Just keep the devkit txt open with ur editor and throw in the entity names and values when u need something, thats how I did for my nehahra maps (and thats how im doing for my in progress maps)
no real need for a def file imho...
(i use qeradiant btw)

#1445 Posted by GlassMan [195.184.253.85], 19/07/2001 11:52 GMT , Refers to Post #1444

..I never realised you could just type classname|func_nehent or whatever. Cool, I wasn't looking forward to having to make that :)

Q1 Emiting Light Texes...

#1446 Posted by Jaj [62.83.142.13], 19/07/2001 23:15 GMT

Does anybody know an utility, plugin or a way to make textures can emit light as in Q2&3?
Some time ago, i downloaded a Q1 map that was compiled with that type of light, i don't remember now wich one of these two, base32b or death32c was, but it's sure it's one of them :) .

Well, what i saw wasn't too expectacular, but i'd like to experiment a little with that... so if anybody knows what tool i need and where to get it, i'd appreciate the info ...

Another Question....

#1447 Posted by Jaj [62.83.142.13], 19/07/2001 23:19 GMT

Well, it seems this night i want to know everything,(... maybe it could be the fever heh :)

The question is: Is possible in Q2 to make a weapon respawn in deathmatch when you want, 5, 10 seconds... what you want as in Q3:Arena?
This could go for Q1 too. :)

#1448 Posted by Grahf [24.51.159.51], 20/07/2001 00:20 GMT

The wacky lighting in death32c was made with an inhouse id tool that never got released, as far as I know. look around cdrom.com archives... you might find interesting and similar stuff.

Q1 can't change weapon respawn times without QC changes; I have no idea about Q2.

Worldcraft 1.6

#1449 Posted by TheToadWarrior [64.91.146.76], 21/07/2001 00:01 GMT

Just a couple quick newbie questions.

For months I've put up with Worldcraft saying it can't find the Quake 2 pallete file and then loading the options menu everytime I start it up. Is there a way to stop it from trying to get me to configure Q2? I'm not gonna be mapping for Q2 anytime soon, if ever, and I'm getting tired of seeing that.

Also, I've made some texture wads for use in Quake maps, is there a way to make it so Worldcraft won't show the file's patch in the pull down menu? The textures that WC extracts from your Q1 directory to make a wad, only has the wad name, not the path. But when I add textures, I get the path and sometimes it can make finding the textures I want a bitch since I can't see the wad names in the pull down menu on WC.

#1450 Posted by DaZ [213.1.92.199], 21/07/2001 19:35 GMT , Refers to Post #1449

Go to Tools > options > Game config.

in the window where it says "Configuration". Click the edit button next to this window, Find "Quake 2" and click remove. Done...

#1451 Posted by DaZ [213.1.92.199], 21/07/2001 19:36 GMT

to question #2. Sorry its not possible, annoying isn't it...

<angry> <grrr> etc...

TheToadWarrior Is Still Working On A Title

#1452 Posted by TheToadWarrior [64.91.147.174], 22/07/2001 03:05 GMT

Thanks!

I should have know that, seeing how the edit button is right there. :)

Radiosity In Q1...

#1453 Posted by Jaj [62.175.113.243], 23/07/2001 00:10 GMT , Refers to Post #1448

Well i found something on cdrom called Suckrad, and for the moment i've been unable to compile a .bsp with that

...
i'll keep on trying

Thanks Grahf :)

Compile Help

#1454 Posted by Erebus [195.92.194.14], 23/07/2001 19:33 GMT

Hi, Can you guys help me out?

I have only just really started mapping for Quake I and I am using the default compile utils that come with World Craft.

1st question - is there a better program thanWorld Craft for map making? What do you lot use?

2nd question - is there any better programs to comple my maps with other than the ones that come with World Craft?

Thanks peeps! :)

#1455 Posted by czg [130.67.219.90], 23/07/2001 21:54 GMT

1st question: it's all up to you. You may try experimenting with Quoole, Quark, err... Stoneless? BSP? Anything realy that suits what you feel is right. A lot of people use WC, and a lot of people don't. I do.
(Sorry for not providing links. Try to search around for them.)

2nd question: Sure:
QBSP: Try to fid WQbsp version 1.65 off some ftp or perhaps even fileplanet. (Boo Hiss!)
Has transparent water support, and also hipnotic extensions.

Light: Get Tyrlite from Tyrann Read there for info

Vis: Get Rvis+ (Also from Tyrann iirc) or if possible HVis by some guy LordHavoc (

)
Both of which are faster, and have progress indicators as well as perhaps more stability.

JGHgOHGHFOI

ToadWarrior...

#1456 Posted by palldjon [203.29.11.18], 25/07/2001 00:56 GMT , Refers to Post #1449

That "guessing" which Tex file one was using given the limits of WC gave me the s#$^75 as well, so I created a folder named "Tex" directly off the "C:" path. Now, combined with TexMex, I can name a .wad whatever I like and when I add it to WC, the drop down texture wad selection box looks like this:

(All textures)
c:\tex\zero
c:\tex\q3atest
c:\tex\ikbase
c:\tex\hfx
etc...

After a while one doesn't even notice the small path, just the wad name which is now visible inside that tiny list box.

Hope this helps.

#1457 Posted by Lunaran [172.162.145.88], 25/07/2001 16:58 GMT

It takes some faffery, but if you're really leet you can use SleepwalkR's q2->q1 map converter proggie to map in QERadiant 147. It involves some dickering about with textures and batch files, but if you're a Radiant junkie like me it's well worth it.

#1458 Posted by Chi [24.42.42.55], 25/07/2001 18:41 GMT

Theres 2 things QW dosint do right..

1. the trigger_push entity;

The "speed" command for the trigger_push ent seems to be non existant in QW. When you load a map into a QWSV that has a t_push with the speed command attached to it, an error appears to the effect of "speed is not a value" (cant remember the exact words used). The map loads fine though but when using the t_push ent its at the default value of 1000.. what is the correct command to adjust the speed of the t_push in QW?

2. the messages command;

Basicly the same problem as no.1 but in regards to a Team Fortress specific entity "info_tfgoal" I used the ent to make a resupply pack that was to echo "resupplying.." when picked up.. Unfortunetly the same "message is not a value" error occurs and theres no msg when the pack is picked up..

any help??

Tomlite Trouble

#1459 Posted by Iain [208.181.205.23], 26/07/2001 20:07 GMT

Does anyone know what this means?

----- TomLite .lit support-----
extra sampling enabled
BSP is version 29
using minlight value 20 from worldspawn.
881 entities read, 473 are lights.
************ ERROR ************
colour 0 < 0

I will continue my search. Luckily, I always give newly added lights their own Vis-Group... that helps.

#1460 Posted by Iain [208.181.205.23], 26/07/2001 20:08 GMT

I had just finished adding a dozen "anti-lights".

Weird Bug Or Quake Feature?

#1461 Posted by Hanz [193.229.72.75], 26/07/2001 21:11 GMT

I was playing sm26_cardo and found a weird thing. A trigger that makes two fiends teleport near you, won't execute unless you're facing in a certain direction (i.e. the direction where the fiends spawn). Now is this a bug or a feature? I haven't seen such trigger before..

#1462 Posted by Grahf [24.51.159.51], 26/07/2001 21:38 GMT , Refers to Post #1460

It is possible that antilights work in tyrlite, but not tomlite (yes, I know they're basically the same). They may not have been tested.

OR, you have a colored light with fux0red keys. I believe it's gotta be

_color "255 255 255"

Or whatever. Mebbe stuff gets messed up if you don't provide all three values.

I dunno, really. Try lighting it in Tyrlite, and see if the same error crops up.

#1463 Posted by Iain [208.181.205.13], 26/07/2001 23:30 GMT

Anti-lights worked fine in a test map, and I checked each lights value (no problems there).

All I can think of is that an anti-light is conficting with a colored light. I will break it down... deleting a group of lights, then compiling the map, until I find the culprit.

#1464 Posted by XeNoN [217.158.29.192], 27/07/2001 00:16 GMT

If you add a trigger entity without a brush, you can set the "angle" attr to a certain direction , and it will only trigger when player faces that way. It might even work with a brush, but i havent tested it...

Brush Triggers Can Have Angles

#1465 Posted by Fat Controller [203.98.21.44], 27/07/2001 08:05 GMT , Refers to Post #1464

I use the "angle" field with a couple of trigger_multiples in RCDM6 (Grader Spader) to briefly trap the player in the RA/RL spawn area. The trick is that if the trigger's supposed to fire when the player approaches from due east, the "angle" value has to be 360.

It's a little documented feature that has some interesting applications, in theory.

Grahf Is Still Working On A Title

#1466 Posted by Grahf [24.51.159.51], 27/07/2001 13:03 GMT

for interesting puzzles at the very least, yes...

Trigger Angles

#1467 Posted by Kell [194.105.160.225], 27/07/2001 15:22 GMT

Yeah, I set the angle for message brush triggers so the player sees them only when walking through a doorway, but not if they backtrack. The skill selection/episode selection messages in the idstart map uses this.

Thanks For The Replies!

#1468 Posted by hanz@elsewhere [193.229.72.75], 27/07/2001 17:21 GMT

Help Me Help Me

#1469 Posted by Mapping [212.119.190.238], 27/07/2001 22:55 GMT

Holy Shit...

#1470 Posted by necros [172.133.28.173], 28/07/2001 21:02 GMT , Refers to Post #1464

you can do that?

/me laughes hysterically at the possibilities

i never once heard about it... But It just gives me an awsome idea for my map!!! =)

Maximum Limitations

#1471 Posted by QuakeTree [63.42.69.45], 28/07/2001 21:17 GMT

Now I know this has been asked before but I was wondering if anyone has all (or at least most) of the brush, entity, lights, map size ect. maximum limitations located in one place. Quake Standards Group was where I though I would find it but I guess that is too logical.

Dfgfggfgfhtjhkujkh

#1472 Posted by czg [130.67.143.97], 28/07/2001 21:56 GMT

Maximum number of brushes: That is completely up to the compiler to decide, as the Quake engine has nothing to do with brushes whatsoever.
Maximum edicts (All non-static entities in the game. The map file may contain many more, though I don't know if there is a limit for that in the compilers. Though if it is, it will probably depend on which compiler you're using.) in normal Quake engine: 600
Map boundaries: 4096 units from the origo in all directions.
The maximum distance that a player can jump and not fall into lava, water, etc.. : 225 units.
The maximum distance that a player can jump straight up and get to another object: 42.5 units.
The maximum distance that a player can fall and not be injured: 275 units.
The minimum gap between brushes the player can fall through: 36 units
The maximum height that a step can be before the player has to jump: 17 units.

#1473 Posted by XeNoN [213.120.56.57], 28/07/2001 23:20 GMT

4096 units from the origo

lol... he meant origin

We Like To Pick On What Czg Says!

#1474 Posted by . [193.229.72.75], 29/07/2001 10:49 GMT

The maximum distance that a player can jump and not fall into lava, water, etc.. : 225 units.
Although with bunny hopping (or actually, a twist jump) this must be something like 300 units.

#1475 Posted by czg [130.67.143.77], 29/07/2001 13:54 GMT

I did mean origo, which is the mathematical term for the point in the center of all coordinate systems. (0,0,0)
And those distances were blatantly c'n'ped from Zie Ancientsky WorldCraft Sitage which probably was made beofore speedrunning was invented. Hell, it probably was made before Quake was even released!

#1476 Posted by Speedy [212.119.190.238], 29/07/2001 14:39 GMT

without bunny its possible to strafejump over 256

#1477 Posted by XeNoN [213.120.56.45], 29/07/2001 17:23 GMT

<XeNoN> what is the mathematical term for the point in the center of all coordinate systems?
<Lun> the origin.
<Lun> you knew that.
<XeNoN> sure?
<Lun> yes, of course.

#1478 Posted by czg [148.122.66.37], 29/07/2001 17:37 GMT

Perhaps origo is some Norwegian phenomenom then...

Fons Et Origo

#1479 Posted by GlassMan [213.123.239.165], 29/07/2001 19:00 GMT

Thats a latin phrase meaning the 'source & origin'

Speedy Thought A Title Wasn't Needed

#1480 Posted by Speedy [212.119.190.238], 30/07/2001 04:50 GMT

sleeptime really..

ship.jpg

#1481 Posted by metlslime [140.142.174.33], 30/07/2001 16:00 GMT

nice pic. Check this one out:

file://c:\quake\id1\quake09.tga

Damn You Metl!

#1482 Posted by czg [148.122.66.37], 30/07/2001 17:05 GMT

You had me c'n'ping that into my browser now!

#1483 Posted by NotoriousRay [141.157.89.179], 30/07/2001 18:22 GMT

have that example .map headshot released showing off how he made the curvy tunnels in bless to kill? i keep looking but can't find it

thanks

3dcamera & Q3R

#1484 Posted by Gilt [64.20.60.155], 31/07/2001 03:21 GMT

I'll admit I didn't look all too hard (I checked the maual though), but can somebody tell me if there is a way to control the camera in Q3R with the mouse like in Worldcraft? I know that if you hold ctr and the 2nd mouse button you'll 'strafe' from side to side but is there any more, and how do I do them?

I'm really hating to use the keyboard for this especially when the keys are placed all over the key board...

Re: 3dcamera & Q3R

#1485 Posted by GlassMan [195.184.253.85], 31/07/2001 08:20 GMT , Refers to Post #1484

Hold the right mouse button down anywhere over the 3-D view. Depending on where you click & drag you will move in that direction.

#1486 Posted by GlassMan [195.184.253.85], 31/07/2001 08:24 GMT

You can change all the key assignments by editing the radiant.ini file (thats what its called in qer anyway, might be different in q3r).

Notray: Pseudo-curved Tunnel

#1487 Posted by Speedy [212.119.190.238], 31/07/2001 15:39 GMT , Refers to Post #1483

www.planetquake.com/speedy/ct.map (decon.wad)

not headshots, but much like that
and look @ czg`s stuff/tuts

Thanks Glassman

#1488 Posted by Gilt [64.20.60.200], 31/07/2001 20:01 GMT

but using the right mouse button like that has never worked for me. only the ctrl/strafe one works... anyway I'll keep on trying stuff, maybe reinstall...

also I can't find radiant.ini. I've looked through some of the files but there's nothing that immidiatley looks like a command list... again I'll keep looking now that I know it might exist

Thanks Speed

#1489 Posted by NotoriousRay [141.157.89.179], 01/08/2001 04:09 GMT

but that .map file does relatively little, if any, good for me

and yeah i've looked at czg's tutorial, i just can't figure out what axis he built that arch on to begin with, as he never explains where his pov is in each section that he adds. (this makes it quite hard for me to try to map along with in wc, obvoiiusly)

Even Though

#1490 Posted by NotoriousRay [141.157.89.179], 01/08/2001 04:23 GMT

now that i think about it it doesn't make a difference too much

still can't come out with anything remotely close to what is in the final product

#1491 Posted by GlassMan [195.184.253.85], 01/08/2001 08:44 GMT , Refers to Post #1488

hmm..R-click & drag should work. Praps you have a video card problem or something.

& no there isn't a radiant.ini with q3r. There is with qer so I thought it would be the same. Guess that means you can't reassign keys unless anyone knows different.

#1492 Posted by Speedy [195.131.50.206], 01/08/2001 23:13 GMT

Ray, I dont see whats your problem ?
and the axis doesnt matter - you can rotate/flip it.
pq/binarishy (I`m sure the spelling is wrong)
contains the best tutorials on "curved pipes"
Imagine: the pipe that`s curved into spiral

An Hour Later..

#1493 Posted by Speedy [195.131.50.206], 01/08/2001 23:15 GMT

I looked closer at`Bless to kill`
It indeed uses diffrent brushwork than that in my previous example.
The result looks smoother, and has extra pollys, but it`s more easy to create btw.
I`v recreated that corridor. It has exactly the same proportions (sounds like I have nothing else to do ;)
www.planetquake.com/speedy/cor.zip

Hope it helps.
You might want to visit Pingu`s site - he has .map files of his levels. He uses the similar technique in creating curvy walkways.

#1494 Posted by palldjon [203.29.11.28], 02/08/2001 07:55 GMT

I've been using CZG style curves recently but THAT was exactly what I've been looking for.

j00 r001

#1495 Posted by XeNoN [195.8.79.153], 02/08/2001 18:12 GMT

A program which can convert static .mdl files to .map format. Is this possible?

And About That Curved Tunnel...

#1496 Posted by XeNoN [212.126.132.116], 02/08/2001 18:53 GMT

That curved tunnel is actually not that different from the so-called "CZG-curve" tunnel. Only from an XY view, the tunnel bends round a curve with edges 1:4, 1:1 and 4:1, rather than the simpler 1:2, 2:1 curves CZG demonstrated in his tutorial. The former may appear to give a smoother curve but when you take 4 of either curve, they both form a 12-sided prism. And seeing as the 1:2, 2:1 curve's vertices meet the grid using twice the grid value as the headshot one, I'd say it was more efficient... and yes I've made my own dumb little demo map showing off czg's style as well... http://www.planetquake.com/xenon/files/cor2.zip

Worldcraft Full

#1497 Posted by Arch [216.67.71.47], 02/08/2001 19:02 GMT

quake loads fine , in q2 when i run map,i keep getting error could not make
bsp or incorrect path,it took me forever to get wc to locate my pak files,but it
finally loaded,not to swift on all of this,thick head i guess,hehe age 68,so if any
one has a big sledge hammer,,maybe ya can help this cogger out

Arch Is Still Working On A Title

#1498 Posted by Arch [216.67.7.198], 02/08/2001 21:14 GMT

help with wc,,please

Xenon, My Dear

#1499 Posted by Speedy [195.131.1.101], 02/08/2001 22:56 GMT

Do you have any problems with arithmetics ?
its 16 sided, not 12
LOL

Fuck All That Then...

#1500 Posted by XeNoN [213.120.56.57], 02/08/2001 23:43 GMT

Heh, I just opened it up in the editor and seen how much balls those dimensions suck

. Anyway... my point is, if you'd used the 3 diagonals: 3:1, 1:1 and 1:3 (not 4:1 as I said before...d'oh) then you would get exactly the same effect as you did with your thing, and I thought it DID use those diagonals. Only then did I notice it had all been done by skewing :/
Really, this isn't the best way to go about it... the flat ceiling is around 4.5 times wider halfway along the tunnel as it is at the ends, AND there are more skewed wedges on the inside than there are on the outside of the curve... If you still want proof: check the comparison...

Speedycurve

XeNoNcurve

Decide for yourself which is more accurate...

#1501 Posted by palldjon [203.29.11.28], 03/08/2001 00:17 GMT

corridoor wars...

Hey Whats The Problem ?

#1502 Posted by Speedy [195.131.96.126], 03/08/2001 01:04 GMT

hey whats the problem ?
It`s not corridor war. use whatever looks best for you. I was just trying to figure out how the one in bless2kill was done, and help Ray (since he didnt like my earlier example).

Btw, both curves are done by skewing. And there is the same number of skewed wedges on the inside and on the outside. Sorry to point you your mistake again ;)

Question For An Experienced Radiant User

#1503 Posted by Golgo13 [64.194.149.245], 03/08/2001 01:30 GMT

Ok.. this is what I'm getting in the console:

entering C Games/QUAKEI~1/baseq3/maps/metro.map

FloatPlane: bad normal
FloatPlane: bad normal
FloatPlane: bad normal
FloatPlane: bad normal
FloatPlane: bad normal
FloatPlane: bad normal
FloatPlane: bad normal
FloatPlane: bad normal
FloatPlane: bad normal
FloatPlane: bad normal
FloatPlane: bad normal
FloatPlane: bad normal
FloatPlane: bad normal
FloatPlane: bad normal
FloatPlane: bad normal
FloatPlane: bad normal
FloatPlane: bad normal
FloatPlane: bad normal
FloatPlane: bad normal
FloatPlane: bad normal
FloatPlane: bad normal
FloatPlane: bad normal
FloatPlane: bad normal
FloatPlane: bad normal
FloatPlane: bad normal
FloatPlane: bad normal
FloatPlane: bad normal
FloatPlane: bad normal
FloatPlane: bad normal
FloatPlane: bad normal
FloatPlane: bad normal
FloatPlane: bad normal
FloatPlane: bad normal
FloatPlane: bad normal
FloatPlane: bad normal
FloatPlane: bad normal
FloatPlane: bad normal
FloatPlane: bad normal
FloatPlane: bad normal
FloatPlane: bad normal
FloatPlane: bad normal
FloatPlane: bad normal
************ ERROR ************
MAX_BUILD_SIDE
Q3Map v1.0p (c) 1999 Id Software Inc.

I've searched around the net for the error and found that is "Caused by faulty vertex manipulation". I deleted everything I had done up to the point I started getting the error... same thing. Deleted like 1/2 the map at this point and still get it. I searched around for maybe a misplaced brush or anything but cant find anything outta the ordinary. No overlapping brushes (that I could find).

Running outta things to try and in a state of hopelessness I ran it through Mapspy (I know, for Q2 but I was in a panic), and it said that there was a problem with my .map file and that it would need to be edited by hand. Yeah right! Have you ever looked at one of those!!!! ... but it is a Q2 prog and could be wrong.

I even reinstalled GTK 1.1 and QR 2.02 to no avail.

Am I doomed? What other things should I be looking for... any troubleshooting advice?

Thanks for anyhelp!!!

- Golgo13

ICQ - 4580012
E*mail - Golgo13@telocity.com
Web - www.alter-ego.cc

Er...? What Is This Again?

#1504 Posted by necros [64.12.102.66], 03/08/2001 02:00 GMT

"Error: SZ_GetSpace: overflow without allowoverflow set"

when crashing from quake.

MAX_BUILD_SIDES

#1505 Posted by pjw [208.192.76.75], 03/08/2001 02:37 GMT

Basically means you have a brush (or brushes) that is too weird for QMap to deal with. Do you have a single brush with a whole bunch of sides, maybe created by mucho clipping?

Sometimes while you're using a lot of vertex manip. in odd ways, a brush can simply be popped out of existence and disappear from the editor view, but still be in the map screwing things up. This might be the case here. Depending on how many brushes you're dealing with, you could try saving your map under a different name, then select all (just hit "I") and give everything one texture (say, caulk). Then select the brushes that you can see by hand, and give them all, say, concrete. At that point the only caulk brush should be the problematic one that you can't see. Check the map file for the caulk brush, make a note of the brush number, then open up your original map, select it by brush number, and delete it. Good luck!

Mdl -> .map

#1506 Posted by NotoriousRay [141.157.89.179], 03/08/2001 02:48 GMT

www.planetquake.com/gg has a mdl to map converter
be warned, its made for modelling low poly terrain and importing in a map editor, not for like, taking the ogre.mdl and converting it to a map

i've tried, mucho errors during compiling

No Problem Speedy...

#1507 Posted by palldjon [203.29.11.28], 03/08/2001 03:36 GMT , Refers to Post #1502

peace, lurv, and friendship to all. Just found it amusing in a *cough* twisted kind of way. I've found both posted methods extremely useful.

#1508 Posted by Abyss [203.29.150.4], 03/08/2001 07:15 GMT

You could go to "The Forge"
www.planetquake.com/worldcraft/index2.shtm
and there you can find Tutorials and all sorts of other stuff which may be of benifit to you. I think there is also a bit there on how to set up Worldcraft. I think I still have it somewhere, if you can't find it, and would like it, I will try to track it down and can send it to you.
Also you could try Z-Axis
http://zaxis.stomped.com/
Where you can also find some tutorials specifically for Worldcraft.
Hope that's of some help.
Good Luck

Mega-question!

#1509 Posted by famillionaire [24.11.172.95], 03/08/2001 08:15 GMT

Is it possible to somehow extract the lightmaps from a bsp after compile and edit them in, say, photoshop, and then get them back into the bsp? Does anyone else think it would kick and incredible amount of ass to be able to do this?

Lightmap Editing

#1510 Posted by Shallow[BAP] [212.135.236.122], 03/08/2001 08:54 GMT , Refers to Post #1509

Yes that would be quite cool but no you can't do it AFAIK... yet. The next version of Q3ASE will support it for Quake 3 and there's been some posts about it on Quake 3 World. Don't know about any other games, but it would generally be a kick-ass tool to have.

Lightmap Editing In Q3

#1511 Posted by Shallow[BAP] [212.135.236.122], 03/08/2001 09:34 GMT , Refers to Post #1509

Quake3World thread

Beta Testing Help!

#1512 Posted by Decay [194.106.188.250], 03/08/2001 13:44 GMT

Ladies and Gentlemen:
My previously mentioned space fast jumpad action map �the Praetorian� is posted out on ..::LVL beta section. It is actually finished and, considering that it is my first map, I would really appreciate some advices and beta testing.
If you need some convincing �Tigger-oN�s first impression was: ��very, very nice��
Here�s a link:
http://www.planetquake.com/lvl/beta/betacomments.asp?id=727
Thanks
Decay
PS Please put your comments there, I don�t think this forum was made for that type of discussions.

#1513 Posted by XeNoN [212.126.132.6], 03/08/2001 17:30 GMT

Sorry to carry this on, but it wasn't a mistake:
http://www.planetquake.com/xenon/img/misc/curve2a.jpg

And its not part of the (now finished) argument, but I've also uploaded a version of my previous curve prefab which curves around 1/4 of a 24 sided prism. Checkit.

Beta Testing For N3sp03

#1514 Posted by necros [172.158.180.180], 04/08/2001 03:25 GMT

Just leave a post here or email me or somethin' and I'll give you the link. (Intended for SP, Vanilla Quake

) with a slightly modified Progs.dat... (Whole thing is about 3~4mb zipped.)

Who Needs A Title Anyway

#1515 Posted by famillionaire [24.11.172.95], 04/08/2001 05:03 GMT

Thanks for the link, shallow, and I also just found this if anyone else is interested in lightmap editing: bspparse, but I haven't figured out how to work it yet. The source is there, anyone feel like writing a GUI for it?

Your Wrong Xenon

#1516 Posted by Speedy [194.84.255.193], 04/08/2001 19:20 GMT

how cant you see the obvious ? ;)

#1517 Posted by XeNoN [212.126.136.31], 04/08/2001 20:28 GMT

a) 12
b) 123

SPOT THE DIFFERENCE!!

Your Hopless..

#1518 Posted by Speedy [194.84.255.193], 05/08/2001 02:39 GMT

bother to look in other view than XY ?

And By The Way

#1519 Posted by Speedy [194.84.255.193], 05/08/2001 02:40 GMT

Why do you argue ? I`v made that shit myself. I know better how many parts are there

#1520 Posted by XeNoN [213.120.56.45], 05/08/2001 16:28 GMT

well, I did say against the CEILING! not the wall! 4 wedges on the outside curve have an edge which is adjacent to the visible ceiling, like i pointed out. I know there are 5 (actually 10) wedges there, but only 4 of which visibly meet the ceiling...

Cant you understand???

#1521 Posted by necros [172.173.70.179], 05/08/2001 23:23 GMT

n3sp03 really needs to get tested. As it stands, it's only 2mb. come on, you know you want to test it. ;)

TheToadWarrior Is Still Working On A Title

#1522 Posted by TheToadWarrior [64.91.144.67], 06/08/2001 06:55 GMT

Just a quick shader question, anyone know of a shader to do a mirror on textures?

Yes, I admit I'm too lazy to look through Id's shaders and since it may not be for a map, I can't just use GTKRadiant.

Toadwarrior

#1523 Posted by Grahf [24.51.159.51], 06/08/2001 18:30 GMT

there must be one somewhere; note the mirror in q3dm0....

Also note that your fps drop like a rock in front of the mirror...

#1524 Posted by zclub.boom.ru [62.118.139.98], 06/08/2001 23:35 GMT

Post censored by moderator (Scampie).

Tyrelight (TomLite)

#1525 Posted by QuakeTree [63.46.241.39], 07/08/2001 03:05 GMT

I was fooling around with tomlite and tried to get the sky brushes to emit "sunlight" but I am getting nowhere. Here is what it looks like in the .map file:

"classname" "worldspawn"
"worldtype" "0"
"message" "in progress"
"wad" "D:\canyon12.wad"
"_sunlight" "100"
"_sun_mangle" "120, -75 ,0"

There is absolutely no light at all emiting from the sky (except of course for the normal "Hey! I can see the sky up there")

I tried various mangle settings with no luck.

Anything helpfull would be appreciated. Thanks.

Re: Tyrelight <- It's TyrLite Actually

#1526 Posted by Tyrann [203.56.239.111], 07/08/2001 05:00 GMT

Try taking out the commas in your _sun_mangle key. There should just be a single space between each number.

Tyr(no"e") Lite

#1527 Posted by QuakeTree [63.42.74.66], 07/08/2001 08:10 GMT

Sorry tyrann, I tried that first (I did RTFM). Then I played around with the comma's Then I came here.

I did find out the source of my problem though...

It was the QBSP program I was using, QBSP256c did not apparently like, understand or even let me know that it ignored the extra commands. I guess I'll have to look for another one to use <sigh>.

Any suggestions out there for the "best" QBSP compiler out there (and plz say why and not just that my favorite is "insert name here" and it is the best one ever).

Thanks again all.

QBSP Compilers

#1528 Posted by Tyrann [203.56.239.115], 07/08/2001 13:55 GMT

There's basically two camps on what is the best qbsp compiler. One is WQBSP and the other is TreeBSP.

I'm in the TreeBSP camp.

TreeBSP has basically no limitations on the size of map that you compile, and it uses much less memory than the others.

I'm not sure what it is that makes WQBSP stand out for others...

Tomlite Is Fucked

#1529 Posted by DaZ [213.122.103.139], 07/08/2001 14:58 GMT , Refers to Post #1525

And sunlight doesn't work, your everything right but Tomlites shoved its own ass up its own nostils... Tomaz says he is trying to fix it (I think).

It is very annoying cos I need tomlite to work on my Bnayni maps... <mad>

#1530 Posted by necros [172.141.113.165], 07/08/2001 18:09 GMT

As it stands, Tomlite does NOT do colored Sunlight, However, it will light uncolored sky light. If you have _color keys on ANY lights in your entire map, then the sky will not work. For the sky to work, either use normal tyrlite (and you won't be able to generate a .lit file) or don't put ANY colored lights in your map. All in all, you basically can't have any color either way if you want to use the sun... sucks eh?

Tyrann, why don't you make Tyrlite output .lit files then? =)

HES GOT A POINT TTRANN!

#1531 Posted by DaZ [62.7.27.3], 07/08/2001 22:20 GMT , Refers to Post #1530

Hmm, No Title

#1532 Posted by czg [130.67.143.70], 07/08/2001 22:23 GMT

And the winner of "Scariest qmap post ever" goes to...
<drumroll>
DAZ!!!!!!!!!!
[Reply]

#1533 Posted by Speedy [195.131.94.84], 07/08/2001 23:27 GMT

It can`t read more than 1 wad from worldspawn
or am I doing smth wrong ?

Actually I use qbs that comes with BSP editor - it has all features wqbsp has and an advanced portal output for leakfinding within the editor.

#1534 Posted by Speedy [195.131.94.84], 07/08/2001 23:30 GMT

older tomlight does everything fine
The lated version is totally fucked imo.
Get tomlighte 1 (or what`s the number)

#1535 Posted by Scampie [206.152.135.106], 07/08/2001 23:32 GMT , Refers to Post #1533

your obviously doing something wrong becuase treebsp fully supports multiple wads.

Is There A Maximum 'light' Value ...

#1536 Posted by Bascule [134.146.9.2], 08/08/2001 03:40 GMT

In Quake 1 light entities, i.e., a light level that equates to 'fullbright'.
I don't seem to get much change after about 800, but is there a true maximum?

Re: Treeqbsp

#1537 Posted by Tyrann [203.56.239.115], 08/08/2001 05:36 GMT , Refers to Post #1533

TreeBSP supports BSP's special leak format. Just run with "-bspleak" on the command line.

#1538 Posted by DaZ [213.1.134.227], 08/08/2001 12:25 GMT

#1539 Posted by Tyrann [203.56.239.116], 08/08/2001 14:05 GMT

Can someone please mail me the TomLite source?
3D downloads isn't working for me...

#1540 Posted by Grahf [24.51.159.51], 08/08/2001 17:08 GMT

I *think* that a light level of 255 is considered "fullbright." Higher light values in your light entity will just cause your light to spread fullbrightness over a larger area.

Help Doors!!

#1541 Posted by Scruffian [24.255.196.47], 08/08/2001 18:42 GMT

I cant make door meshes please HELP ME!!

#1542 Posted by necros [172.139.58.248], 08/08/2001 20:43 GMT , Refers to Post #1540

is indeed the max light level.

Dunno why this is... (would have been more intuitive if max light had bee 100 or something even, but oh well... I mean, look at the ammo counters =)

#1543 Posted by cyBeAr [213.64.67.243], 08/08/2001 21:09 GMT , Refers to Post #1542

#1544 Posted by Tronyn(2) [24.66.244.58], 08/08/2001 21:11 GMT

that the error 'vismap expansion overflow' means that the map is too large and/or complex. I'm getting this and want to make sure that I'm approaching fixing it, the right way.

Who Needs A Title Anyway

#1545 Posted by Speedy [195.131.96.22], 09/08/2001 01:29 GMT

I uploaded an older proper tomlite to my site www.planetquake.com/speedy/tomlite.zip

#1546 Posted by palldjon [203.29.11.18], 09/08/2001 05:21 GMT , Refers to Post #1541

we'll need to know Game, Version and Editor before that question makes any sense.

Quiver Editor?

#1547 Posted by Dan Reynolds [195.99.125.204], 09/08/2001 13:28 GMT

Does anyone know about the editor Quiver for the Mac? I tried to download it from www.quiver.telefragged.com, but I can't get it, and the guy's email doesn't work.
Thanks,
Dan

Hmm, No Title

#1548 Posted by StarBUCK [213.122.54.237], 09/08/2001 13:44 GMT

Hey Dan,
try this LINK

That was the only one i could find that would work for me

#1549 Posted by Grahf [24.51.159.51], 09/08/2001 15:04 GMT

I would imagine that (along with everything else in Quake) there is a limit to the visdata size, and it certainly sounds like you're hitting it. Running a level 4 vis will compress the data, I know but you're probably already doing that, so....

Try using detail brushes. The only PC compilers I know of that support detail are Malmberg's Quest compilers (if you happen to have a spare Mac, try the eQuake utils). I think that both are imperfect implementations of detail brushes; they won't be included in vis calculations, but they will still split the BSP.

Thusly, just make all the pointy and detailed bits in your map into detail, leaving the larger, more important pieces of architecture that DO block lots of line of sight. That alone will reduce vis complexity by a lot.

It's basically the same concept as making stuff into func_wall, it just won't slow thing down the way func_wall does.

#1550 Posted by Tronyn(2) [24.66.244.58], 10/08/2001 04:30 GMT , Refers to Post #1549

Thanks I think that'll work... actually the map is Q2-engine... so I'm trying to cut the area size and implement detail brushes.

But I may trying to make a Q1 version too so thanks in advance :)

Short Sighted Scrags

#1551 Posted by palldjon [203.29.11.18], 10/08/2001 05:16 GMT

CZG03 raised quite a few questions for me as a mapper, and I'll raise them here and there. However, to kick things off:

At one point in the level I popped out onto a ledge and could see two Scrags floating side by side far off in the distance. They didn't react so I assumed they had their backs to me. However, when I hit "zoom" I observed that they were facing my direction. I jumped up and down, moved around, waved my axe at them and called them names. No reaction. It wasn't until I pulled out the shotgun and took a pop at them that they came charging across the intervening distance. So...

1. Can Quake monsters only "see" so far?
2. If yes, how far and does it vary from monster to monster?

#1552 Posted by Fat Controller [203.98.21.44], 10/08/2001 06:52 GMT , Refers to Post #1551

Quake monsters can only see players less than 1000 units away.

To adjust this, edit the range() function in AI.QC to some preferred value. Yes, this means making a mod and compiling a progs.dat.

Another way of getting around this is to use a silent trigger_once to alert the beasties.

#1553 Posted by palldjon [203.29.11.18], 10/08/2001 08:56 GMT , Refers to Post #1552

the obese one does it again

Trigger What?

#1554 Posted by Apollo [213.123.19.33], 10/08/2001 19:13 GMT

The monsters? Give em a target name?

#1555 Posted by Toady [195.163.229.161], 10/08/2001 20:48 GMT , Refers to Post #1554

if you target a monster with a trigger, the monster will "awake" when the trigger is activated...

Gameplay Type Question...

#1556 Posted by necros [172.148.46.95], 13/08/2001 00:56 GMT

Ok, here's the story:

You go on a lift, and it starts going up. When you reach the top, there are two fiends fighting 4 knights. Obviously, the fiends win. You walk up to them, and they ignore you. So you say to yourself, they must be 'nice' fiends. To the side, you see a cage with 6 other fiends, and you guess they are 'nice' as well. Anyway, you continue walking and turn a corner. All of a sudden, you hear the sound of MULTIPLE Hell Knights seeing you.

What I want to do is have a switch which opens the cage and lets the remaining 'nice' fiends out, to fight the Hell Knights. How would I go about doing that without making it too obscure or silly?

Re: Detail Brushes

#1557 Posted by Shadowdane [64.20.3.6], 13/08/2001 12:33 GMT , Refers to Post #1550

always use detail brushes in Q2/Q3 editing.. speeds up compile times, and can sometimes even lower r_speeds.

Hell my map Nexus4, which is about 2100 brushes VISes in about 45 secs.. I believe before using detail brushes it took around ~1 hour.

anyway how big is this map your doing?? must be huge.. ive only run into that error once before on a huge map that took almost the entire map grid. hehe

Gameplay Solution

#1558 Posted by Krash [203.19.8.248], 13/08/2001 14:10 GMT , Refers to Post #1556

Have a simple button (maybe you have to do something to get to it), and put a custom tex above the button, saying "test specimen release" or something to that effect.

- Krash

Re: Detail Brushes

#1559 Posted by Tronyn(2) [24.66.244.58], 14/08/2001 01:22 GMT , Refers to Post #1557

Yes, it is rather massive! Almost 3000 brushes and takes up most of the whole map. And its a DM map too! In addition there are 3 large hollow dome structures made of many vertex-edited wedges(all details now). Still getting the error - suppose I just have to keep making more and more things detail brushes and simplifying the map (me cries).

A Q1 Problem Now...

#1560 Posted by Tronyn(2) [24.66.244.58], 14/08/2001 01:28 GMT

A map. 3304 brushes. 21285 faces. 714 point entities. 153 solid entities.

*Frustration*

Treeqbsp sayeth: "Error 56: line 8: Token too large"

Wqbsp and normal Qbsp both sayeth: "Error: numbrushplanes == MAX_MAP_PLANES"

Qbsp256c doesn't even try compiling, it just complains about the wads (perhaps it doesn't support multiple wads).

Prior to this I had the error "MAX_MAP_CLIPNODES" which I think I solved by clipping a lot of detailed brushes off with cubes.

I thought this might have something to do with 12-sided cylinders (too many faces perhaps) but the same thing occurs when all of the ones in the map have been deleted.

Any ideas?

And I'm *still* getting general protection fault on that goddamn SoE map - it's only 2100 brushes for god's sake!

Oh, the humanity...

-Tronyn

#1561 Posted by Tronyn(2) [24.66.244.58], 14/08/2001 02:17 GMT

I have gotten qbsp256c working with the max_map_planes map, however, *it* merely does its usual compilation process and cuts off like so:

510brushfaces = 517brushfaces = 524brushfaces = 530brushfaces = 536brushfaces = 542bru

(WC then reports 'the file nj2.bsp was not created, do you want to continue, blah blah)

#1562 Posted by Tyrann [203.56.239.116], 14/08/2001 03:47 GMT , Refers to Post #1560

Email me the maps and wads. I'll help.

And Some Other Stuff

#1563 Posted by Tronyn(2) [24.66.244.58], 14/08/2001 05:23 GMT

Tyrann: I really appreciate the offer, but are you sure you want to delve into more technical frustrations, given what your new Q1SP is doing to your sanity?

BTW if there's anything I can do to help with that, I'd be glad to.

And now (drum roll), the strangest QBSP occurrence I've yet come across, in another soe map. There is a leak in the map, and I know where it is. So I try to plug it, I've tried various ways. But no matter which way I plug it, I get a 'mixed contents in leafnode' error.

I know what causes this error. There is no sky or water anywhere near the leak. There are no solid entities near the leak. I have even moved *point* entities away from the leak. I have selected everything near the leak, put the same solid texture on all of it, and bound it all 'to world.' Yet still the error persists! It cannot be, and yet there it is! I say that it is impossible for such an occurence to be, and there it is, right in front of my face! How could that be?

#1564 Posted by Fat Controller [203.98.21.44], 14/08/2001 07:44 GMT , Refers to Post #1556

I have no idea how you're making "nice" fiends. I assume, given you've done some QC work before, that you worked this out.

To raise the bars of the cage, just target a func_door that's made from the bars. Set "wait" to -1 (stays open).

If you want "tame" fiends from scratch, I'd suggest altering the monster start routines in AI.QC and findtarget() to automatically aim for any monster whose "targetname" matches one's own "target". To prevent the monsters from immediately attacking on map startup, try giving them "targetname" values in turn; but then you'd have to alter the monster_use() function so the monsters activated didn't go for you.

When originally writing the OUM code, I wanted the Blues to self-target ordinary monsters and vice versa. However the extra processing required killed that idea real quick!

#1565 Posted by Shadowdane [64.20.3.40], 14/08/2001 14:32 GMT

if i had Q1 installed I would try to help ya.. but man that is quite a big map for Q1.

good luck

#1566 Posted by Grahf [24.51.159.51], 14/08/2001 22:14 GMT

Run to the QuakeLab right now. I just did, and here's what I found:

"Token too large" means that line in the .map file, in your case line 8, is too long for that QBSP too handle. I'd guess that's where your wad paths are.

MAX_MAP_PLANES is a static limit in QBSP, apparently set to 8192. If you have the source code to a compiler, you could of course go in and increase this, which would also increase the memory requirements. But shit, as long as it compiles... ;) What exactly max_map_planes is, and how it could be decreased another way, I don't really know. Quick, someone call SPoG! ;-)

There's also an interesting solution to a recurring "mixed face contents in leafnode" error, the symptoms of which sound similar to yours

#1567 Posted by necros [172.159.31.66], 14/08/2001 22:22 GMT , Refers to Post #1564

i know how to open a door. =)

Actually, I meant what would be a good way to make it obvious to the player that he's got to release the nice fiends to help him out...
But I got it figured out anywhoo...

Also, a good way to have monsters target each other (without much code change) is to create a new trigger (trigger_piss) and have it only get activated by monsters. That way, other monsters can 'activate' each other, and cause infighting without prior damage. (this is what i did, and it works rather well.)

but thx.

#1568 Posted by Grahf [24.51.159.51], 14/08/2001 22:23 GMT

That Q2 map of yours, Tronyn, with the "vismap expansion overflow" error... Now, 1337 Q2 mappers can correct me if I'm wrong, but aren't q2 detail brushes still included in VIS calculations? Cuz, if so, it seems that that wouldn't solve the problem. The only thing I can think of, then, would be to section off the large areas of the map into smaller compartments, so that you wouldn't be able to see so much from the main areas.

Having never mapped for Q2, I don't really know WTF I am talking about.

About Detail Bruhes

#1569 Posted by Jaj [62.83.142.231], 14/08/2001 23:28 GMT

I think Qvis3 ignores detail brushes, that's why the time required to vis a map is lesser.

#1570 Posted by Tronyn(2) [24.66.244.58], 14/08/2001 23:34 GMT

Yeah I did check there not long after posting. I fixed the 'Token Too Large' thing but still run into the Max_map_planes.

So now all I need is someone who can edit a qbsp compiler! heheh...

As for the mixed contents in leafnode, this error hates me personally. In one of my rapture maps it was caused by (drum roll) - a normal block of sky! I think dragging it through the mud is the only way to get through (there is no 'around') this one.

finally, on the Q2 engine map, I think that detail brushes are ignored by vis - otherwise what do they do? And also I have cut visibility much with skywalls. But apparently I haven't done enough of either of these, yet...

That Map Has To Birth!

#1571 Posted by Jaj [62.83.22.212], 15/08/2001 01:03 GMT , Refers to Post #1570

Wqbsp165 has a limit for Max_map_planes of 16384.
You've said you've tried with Wqbsp, but if it wasn't the 1.65 version, then try with this version, maybe... :)
If you don't have it and want it to, i could mail it.

Or... Has To Be Born!

#1572 Posted by Jaj [62.83.22.212], 15/08/2001 01:05 GMT , Refers to Post #1571

well, you understand me... i hope

Re: MAX_MAP_PLANES

#1573 Posted by Tyrann [203.56.239.200], 15/08/2001 01:20 GMT , Refers to Post #1570

Use TreeBSP. It is good for that sort of thing...

Note that there is a hard limit for MAX_MAP_CLIPNODES at 32767, since they are indexed in the bsp using a 16-bit signed number.

#1574 Posted by Jaj [62.83.22.212], 15/08/2001 01:25 GMT

It's what i was to recommend, i found with google here:
Treebsp

#1575 Posted by Tronyn(2) [24.66.244.58], 15/08/2001 01:50 GMT

If leak = true then compile map
Else crash

Re: Other Posts

#1576 Posted by Tronyn(2) [24.66.244.58], 15/08/2001 01:53 GMT

This deals with a completely different problem from post 1575 (on that, God help us all).

I actually do have Treeqbsp, Wqbsp (1.65), Qbsp256c and regular Qbsp. I try bsp'ing with them all.

The clipnodes thing is no problem. Clipnodes can be cut down by using the clip texture to seal things off, which I've done.

It's the max_map_planes which gets me. It seems the only way to get by this is to up the max_map_planes number in the compiler through source code editing. Such a thing is beyond me, though.

Noisy Neighbours...

#1577 Posted by palldjon [203.29.11.18], 15/08/2001 01:59 GMT

n3sp3 has also raised a question for me.

In the silver-key/pent room, after one disposes of the fifty million Knights of various description and the shamblers, try moving into the corners in turn. In one of the corners you can hear the grunts praying..."Arche angel, dark angel etc,etc." However, when one noclips and explores the void, one finds that the prayer room is a long way from the SK/P room.

1. Necros, did you bump the volume on that "prayer" sample in relation to normal ambient sounds?
2. What is the range in units for normal quake ambient sounds?
3. Do all quake ambient sounds have the same range?

thx

#1578 Posted by Grahf [24.51.159.51], 15/08/2001 02:14 GMT

I think that what he did was use a custom entity that is triggered as you open the door to the mucho grunt room, and just plays any sound at full volume.

As for the actual Quake ambients... yeah, they're all the same range, i'm pretty sure, but how far I dunno.

Tronyn: I was wrong; of course detail brushes in Q2 don't block VIS.

Ta Grahf...

#1579 Posted by palldjon [203.29.11.18], 15/08/2001 02:49 GMT , Refers to Post #1578

RC can you help on the range in units?

#1580 Posted by Shadowdane [64.20.68.161], 15/08/2001 02:52 GMT , Refers to Post #1576

hey Tronyn..

if u are still having problems coming that Q2 map.. i have a bit of experience gettin problem maps to compile, either threw using detail brushes, hints/skip, ect...

if you want send the .map source (zipped please).. to shadowdane@planetquake.com

i'll take a look at it.. see what I can do.

#1581 Posted by Tyrann [203.56.239.113], 15/08/2001 04:19 GMT , Refers to Post #1576

Are you talking about soe1m1c by any chance? If so, then there were things that I could see in the compiled bsp I had a while back that should be fixed.

#1582 Posted by Tronyn(2) [24.66.244.58], 15/08/2001 05:42 GMT , Refers to Post #1581

Soe1m1's problem is, to the best of my knowledge, a 'mixed contents in leafnode' error which presents itself UNLESS there is a leak in the map. No matter where the leak is, if there's a leak, the map will compile. No leaks = no bsp. Email me the changes you figure I should make though.

The vismap overflow Q2-engine map I'm sending to Shadowdane, hopefully he can figure it out.

The max_map_clipnodes (fixed), too many static entities (fixed), max_map_planes is a 'Night Journey' map, so no rush on that, but apparently there is no way short of compiler-altering to fix it.

The 'general protection fault' upon trying to load Quake is in soe1m2. Been struggling with this for a while too.

Hmm, what other problems do I have?

BTW, it's not because I'm more error-prone than the next mapper (though that may be) but rather because I have so many damned maps!

TreeQBSP V1.63

#1583 Posted by Speedy [213.221.48.22], 15/08/2001 16:20 GMT

Removed most hard-coded limits (MAX_MAP_PLANES, MAX_MAP_etc)
....
If that doesnt work, then .. uhm
May be its just the case when you better split the map into 2.
And for mixed content you can get it (sometimes) when sky tex is applyed over faces, not the whole brush..

Hope that helps

Ambience...

#1584 Posted by necros [172.138.105.241], 16/08/2001 17:21 GMT , Refers to Post #1577

Palldjon:

All sounds played in quake have different 'attenuation' settings which define how far away you can hear a sound (much like Tyrlite has the attenuation setting for lights). They Are: ATTN_NONE (This plays the sound Full Volume through the entire level)
ATTN_NORM (Normal attenuation for sounds from Monsters and weapons. This one is the one with the longest 'reach').
ATTN_IDLE (Slightly shorter reach, and used for *gasp* Monster idle sounds).
ATTN_STATIC (Used for... waddaya know? Static Ambient Sounds! =) Also has the 'shortest reach'.

The sound clip from the CoF CD is 6sec 68msec, so all i did was make an entity which counts to 6.68sec and plays the sound at ATTN_NORM, then recounts and so on...

Really dumb, since all the entity does is play that one sound... Kind of silly but oh well. I'm not trying to win an QC awards...

Not Dumb...

#1585 Posted by palldjon [203.29.11.18], 17/08/2001 00:43 GMT , Refers to Post #1584

I thought the effect was excellent. I heard the sample and thought, "WTF." Then when the set piece came into view I just stood and gaped for a while. "Hmmmmmmm, this is rather chilling." Thank goodness the grunts weren't triggered whilst I stood there flat footed =)

Only suggestion I would have made would be replace ATTN_NORM with ATTN_IDLE for that particular sample.

Thanx for the heads up on the sound attenuation stuff.../me goes to write in my Quake book of shadows.

Sound Range In Q1

#1586 Posted by Nightbringer [203.97.2.243], 17/08/2001 04:58 GMT , Refers to Post #1579

maximum hearable distance = 1000/attenuation
"everywhere" for atten = 0.
ATTN_NONE is 0, increasing to ATTN_STATIC, which is 3. You don't have to use the constants; use other (floating-point) values if you like, up to 4-(1/64). (it gets sent over the network as (byte)atten*64)

#1587 Posted by Tronyn(@) [24.66.244.58], 17/08/2001 20:46 GMT

Through a combination of doing various things that may or may not have helped, and using the latest version of TreeQBSP, I have gotten my max_map_planes level to compile.

Sweeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeet.

Unfortunately, Quake doesn't like it (crashes). Quake's comments on the subject are as follows:

Error: SZ_GetSpace: overflow without allowoverflow set

hopefully someone knows what this is supposed to mean, because I certainly don't.

Hmm, No Title

#1588 Posted by Jaj [62.83.17.183], 19/08/2001 01:55 GMT , Refers to Post #1587

I can only think that if you're not vised the map, perhaps vising it..... or if it is only vised in normal maybe vising it with full option... and if it's vised it with full, i can't think of anything else, except that the error message could be caused by a lot of people in it?

I say this, because some time ago i experimented putting in a level a lot of soldiers together... the level loaded but when they started to fire Quake crashed and i obtained that error message i think, not sure.

Q3r For Q1 Mappage

#1589 Posted by Speedy [213.158.1.139], 26/08/2001 22:47 GMT

is there a way to setup q3r to have default texturescale 1 not 0,5
like in config or somwhere ? To use it for q1 mapping.

Radiant For Q1

#1590 Posted by Shallow[BAP] [217.158.43.50], 27/08/2001 00:39 GMT , Refers to Post #1589

Is there a map converter for Q3 to Q1 format that I don't know about? The only one I know (SleepwalkR's) about converts Q2 map files. Unless he updated it and I didn't hear.

If you use QER 147 for Quake 2, it has the same texture scaling as Q1 so it isn't a problem

(Er, so I can't actually answer the question you asked, then)

Hmm, No Title

#1591 Posted by Speedy [213.158.1.139], 27/08/2001 00:56 GMT

maps created in q3r convert nice to q1

#1592 Posted by Lunaran [172.156.158.147], 27/08/2001 01:56 GMT

It's been asked in this thread before, so root around a bit for links to SleepwalkR's map convertor and the necessary steps. Editing Q1 in qer147 is quite nice. doing it in q3r or GTKr would be even better since the map format, afaik, is identical to q1 (no surface properties - and only as long as you don't put in any curves

) except for the texture scale thing.

However ... I do believe that if you compile a map with a 256x256 texture fit to a 128x128 wall, and then swap the texture for a 128x128 one, it will still fill the same amount of space (it isn't pixel-specific, just dimensional) so you may actually be able to get away with using scaled-up placeholder textures and then just swapping the wads after you compile. not sure, this would take a bit of experimentation which I will leave up to you. :)

This Is Really Strange...

#1593 Posted by necros [172.149.102.84], 27/08/2001 02:12 GMT

For some reason, WQbsp tells me there is a leak in my level, with the common leak error, then right after, it makes a .prt file. However, if i noclip outside the level, then turn off noclip, i'll start to fall as if the level hadn't been filled... I used the coordinates that WQbsp gave me from the error, and the entity turned out to be a light which is inside my level... Any clue as to what this is?

#1594 Posted by Nightbringer [203.97.2.243], 27/08/2001 03:34 GMT

Q3R's map format differs very slightly to what's expected by qbsp - three extra values per brush side. Only one is actually used (and that only for one thing - marking brushes as detail). The id standard qbsp (at least) won't parse maps like this.

Q3R 202 seems quite happy about loading q1 maps; gtkr1.1-ta-beta doesn't. (may be different for 1.1 release or 1.2)

There's a couple of wrinkles over and above the format issue:
- Textures have to live in \textures, since q1's textures don't have paths attached (unless you add them yourself)
- Textures that are animated a la water must begin with '*', which is an illegal character in filenames. You'll have to use a differently named texture in the editor, and change it in the .map file before compilation.

Necros Error

#1595 Posted by Iain [208.181.205.7], 27/08/2001 06:54 GMT

I came across that problem once...

When I deleted the entity, and recompiled the map, the leak was still there, only pointing to a different entity. One by one I removed every entity in my map, until all that was left was info_player_start... then THAT became the leak.

Very frustrating, to say the least.

As it turned out, it WAS a brush, but not brush one sealing out the void. It was a silly little brush INSIDE the level that was causing the problem. I deleted it, and all was fine.

Personal note: Level Lord was once asked about this "leak" problem. He shook his head, and walked away in disgust.

#1596 Posted by killazontherun [203.164.2.199], 27/08/2001 07:03 GMT

I couldn't find a way to convert the default texture size from 0.5 to 1.0 so what I did was open the .map in notepad and do a replace on all 0.5000000 to 1.0000000 and it worked fine.

Nightbringer

#1597 Posted by Lunaran [64.12.102.169], 27/08/2001 19:38 GMT

Right. sleepy's map converter fixes all those things. :)

#1598 Posted by necros [172.147.164.252], 27/08/2001 20:56 GMT , Refers to Post #1595

What was so peculiar about the brush? Is there something specific I should look for, or just delete all my brushes? =P

Grahf Thought A Title Wasn't Needed

#1599 Posted by Grahf [192.154.65.1], 27/08/2001 21:32 GMT

I have a different QBSP problem. I don't get a leak message, but QBSP does a FillOutside and doesn't make a prt. I get this one WAY too often...

#1600 Posted by necros [172.140.66.251], 27/08/2001 22:02 GMT

if it fills the outside, you can usually force a prt file, by using a bsp2prt, which will result in a normal .bsp for vis to work on. DO NOT bsp2prt a map which has not been filled out side, as this will take FOREVER to vis, (since it's got to calculate everything outside the map too, since it wasn't filled).

Sorry, but i don't have a link on my atm...

#1601 Posted by Seth [62.7.12.2], 28/08/2001 01:30 GMT

i also had this prob several times... if ur using wc then u may find that in clippin it made some fuked up brush which has no height/width/depth... im not sure if i recallin the right prob tho... either way u somehow need to find this brush and delete it....

i might b talkin crap tho... just advancin iains post

Methinks I Know

#1602 Posted by Jimbo [216.12.56.236], 28/08/2001 01:35 GMT , Refers to Post #1598

I had that problem a while back,
it is caused by a brush thats either inside
out or shares a face with another brush but doesn't touch the other brush (cause I moved it).
I hope that helps,
-Jimbo

The Way To Find A

#1603 Posted by Speedy [213.158.0.144], 28/08/2001 03:17 GMT

"broken" brush I use : just devide a map by half, seal all the holes and compile each part separately. Do the same with the half that caused compiler error, and so on. This way I found a bad brush in a large (2500+ brushes) map in no time.
Hope it helps..

#1604 Posted by Speedy [213.158.1.191], 28/08/2001 03:30 GMT

btw, leak just points to an ent that appears to be close to it, so its usless to delete it (ofcoures if its not the one that acidentely got outside the map structure)

#1605 Posted by Speedy [213.158.1.191], 28/08/2001 03:33 GMT

hmm. seems like we should start begging SleepwalkR to make a new version of his converter that would support q3 maps ! (so it`d change all texture scale)

#1606 Posted by Nightbringer [203.97.2.243], 28/08/2001 06:04 GMT , Refers to Post #1605

That, or suggest user-defined default texture scale as a feature to the GTKRadiant folks.

Ha. Ha Ha. Ha.

#1607 Posted by Lunaran [172.135.76.190], 28/08/2001 16:32 GMT

I can tell you right now suggesting features for GTKR is a waste of breath. They'll tell you to stop whining and go submit a bug report, and when you go and do that they tell you there's no time to code it.

#1608 Posted by Maj [193.128.238.146], 28/08/2001 18:32 GMT , Refers to Post #1607

Here's a list of GtkR bugs that have been marked as Resolved+Fixed. 64 at time of posting.

WQBSP Problems...

#1609 Posted by Skynet [195.138.42.163], 28/08/2001 19:30 GMT , Refers to Post #1595

It seems WQBSP has some weird errors. Yesterday, I used a trigger_teleport and an outside-triggered trigger_once to teleport in a Nehahra Quakeguy. After this, I started to fall out of the level on a certain plain wall. No leak, no VIS problem. Changing or altering the wall didn't help. I changed back the entity brushes to world brushes, and it was o.k. again. Then I deleted the whole room of this Qguy and put it and the teleporter somewhere else, replaced the trigger_once by a trigger_relay point entity, and it was also o.k. At least, I didn't find a similar error.

#1610 Posted by Speedy [213.158.0.136], 29/08/2001 01:09 GMT

Seems like GTK guys are happy with the editor, and they dont change much in it, just improve and polish.. I`m sure some ppl requested support for q1 and it was said they might make a plugin or smth like that. But I dont think it`ll happen ;(

#1611 Posted by Grahf [168.215.114.115], 29/08/2001 04:21 GMT

If you code it, it will come....

Necros Error Cont...

#1612 Posted by Iain [208.181.205.17], 29/08/2001 04:46 GMT

Yes, I found the "problem" brush by deleting every brush in the map. But that is the good thing about using WC vis-groups. Each room I build is given it's own vis-group.

I backed-up my map, then:
- used vis-group to view ONLY one area (then deleted that room).
- sealed the remaining map from the "possible" problem area, and ran the level.
- when the problem was found, I pulled out the backup map and deleted THAT brush.

Note: Even if you delete half your map at one go, that is still half as many brushes you must search through.

Crude, but it works.

Speedy... i DID know that... at ONE time. My memory is not what it used... what was i saying??

#1613 Posted by Iain [208.181.205.17], 29/08/2001 04:54 GMT

Speedy already answered this question...

I am losing my.... thinking machine?

Never mix beer, scotch and vodka

#1614 Posted by Maj [193.128.238.146], 29/08/2001 09:36 GMT , Refers to Post #1610

Well, that's guy singular since TTimo seems to be the only major coder atm. There's actually quite a bit going on behind the scenes - new plugin interfaces, map format, etc. - that will make a q1 plugin much easier to make. Strangely, given the number of q1 engine coders about, noone actually wants to make the thing.

#1615 Posted by QuakeTree [63.42.69.246], 29/08/2001 16:08 GMT

That happens to me sometimes also.

I have found that selecting the "Entire" level and copying it, then pasting the whole thing into a new, blank .map seems to fix it.

Irritating aint it.

I think it has something to do wit an illegal face on a brush but I am not sure.

Beta Testing & Hosting

#1616 Posted by Schmung [212.137.251.40], 29/08/2001 20:07 GMT

I have a DM Map that needs beta testing, so if anyone's interested please e-mail me. Also I was wondering if anyone knows of an FTP where I can upload it.. since cdrom has stopped accepting stuff.. and Fileplanet requires an existing mirror.

#1617 Posted by Seth [62.7.37.32], 29/08/2001 22:02 GMT

necros: it might be worth reloading the map from .map file instead of the .rmf... you may find that gets rid of the prob... tho once again i could b totally wrong

schmung: if u want u can mail it to me @ seth@barrysworld.com and ill have a butchers

#1618 Posted by Lunaran [205.188.199.182], 30/08/2001 22:28 GMT

The list's actually up to 75 now (for the record), and you will notice that only four of them are marked "enhancement."

#1619 Posted by Maj [193.128.238.146], 31/08/2001 09:37 GMT , Refers to Post #1618

That's cos GtkR is perfect.

Will Having

#1620 Posted by necros [172.132.121.49], 03/09/2001 21:37 GMT

a couple of sealed off areas which don't leak, but don't have any entities inside them mess up QBSP's filling process if there is a regular level?

ie: You have a regular level, but also some small little leftovers which are sealed but don't have entities inside to denote those areas as 'inside' vs 'outside'.

#1621 Posted by Speedy [213.158.0.154], 04/09/2001 01:15 GMT

they should be fine, and not chopped off

#1622 Posted by NotoriousRay [199.75.227.167], 06/09/2001 14:17 GMT

so i recently reinstalled q2 (what!!?) and had a go about making a dm map (kudos to lun for his hangar textures he released= j00 rule)
so, i'm guessing there are better compile utiilities than what originally comes with worldcraft. if so, what are they and where might i find them?

also, is it necessary to keep my .map files in my baseq2\maps directory? i tried to compile my map and qbsp3 said 'no quake2 in c:\worldcraft\q2test.map' which lead me to think i should haul everything over to baseq2\maps. eh?

tia

#1623 Posted by Vigil [193.229.255.17], 06/09/2001 14:24 GMT , Refers to Post #1622

There are new compiling utilites by Geoffrey DeWan. The URL is, ummm, lessee here... This. That'll get you a new BSP and a new VIS. The lighting utility of choice is Argh!'s ARGHRAD, right here.

And, with the new utilities, you don't have to store the .map files there. But you need to add some command line stuff (most likely, can't remember exactly what) to get them to work.

I've Always Wondered About This,

#1624 Posted by necros [172.136.154.149], 06/09/2001 22:00 GMT

but never bothered asking. Why are convex brushes not allowed?

#1625 Posted by Scampie [206.152.135.106], 06/09/2001 22:35 GMT , Refers to Post #1624

becuase they aren't! duh...

mostly, i believe, becuase convex brushes are harder to define and harder to interprate, thus slowing down the qbsp process. not allowing convex brushes just makes it simpler to read and compile.

Q2 Compile Command Lines

#1626 Posted by Shadowdane [64.20.65.60], 07/09/2001 02:11 GMT

well i use Geoffrey Dewan's BSP/VIS and Arghrad.. here is the .bat file i use for a full compile, fell free to edit it.

just so you know.. the -level command doesn't work in Q2 VIS. running it as shown does full VIS, if you add -fast that will do quick VIS.

@echo off
qbsp3 -gamedir c:\quake2\baseq2 c:\quake2\baseq2\maps\nexus4.map

qvis3 c:\quake2\baseq2\maps\nexus4.bsp

arghrad -gamedir c:\quake2\baseq2 -chop 32 -bounce 20 -extra c:\quake2\baseq2\maps\nexus4.bsp

Convex Brushes

#1627 Posted by metlslime [24.176.79.254], 07/09/2001 04:01 GMT

the way brushes are defined in the map file makes it impossible to have a concave brush.
Sure, this could be different, but it would make the editor, compiler and map format more complex, and needlessly so. After all, you can make any concave shape out of convex brushes.

Looking forward, things like mapobjects and patches are going to take the place of brushes for doing detailed 'modelling' in levels. That way you can use brushes for structure and triangle meshes for anything really complex/detailed/organic.

Models For Details...

#1628 Posted by necros|schoolxors [207.236.63.4], 07/09/2001 16:52 GMT , Refers to Post #1627

Um... I don`t really like that idea. It was done in SystemShock 2, and a lot of the levels got repetive because of it. (Same wall computer panels everywhere), plus if you break them all, then the hallway is really plain... =p

oh well.

#1629 Posted by Speedy [213.158.0.175], 07/09/2001 21:46 GMT

concave, not convex

No Activity On GtkRadiant?

#1630 Posted by TTimo [217.128.77.157], 07/09/2001 22:47 GMT

It's quite funny to hear people say that there's no activity around GtkRadiant and that I'm basically the only coder.

Look there:

http://zerowing.idsoftware.com/archives/gtkradiant/2001-September/date.html

that's the mailing list archive .. 116 messages (mostly bug fixing logs) since the beginning of this month

Look there:

dev log

that's the developer log. I am clearly NOT the only one involved in the editor developpement.

Just thought I would clarify a few things :-)

************ ERROR ************

#1631 Posted by XeNoN [195.8.88.87], 07/09/2001 23:42 GMT

---- MergeAll ----
8071 mergefaces
writing c:\quake\id1\maps\other\tbb.prt
************ ERROR ************
CanonicalVector: degenerate

yes, kids, compiling is fun fun fun!!!

I Think I Remember Seeing The Solution

#1632 Posted by necros [172.186.111.29], 08/09/2001 02:16 GMT

on quakelab...

something about a busted brush (try doing the cnp into a new file trick).

#1633 Posted by necros [172.186.111.29], 08/09/2001 02:21 GMT

"Error:CanonicalVector: degenerate

The great mysterious error. Several people have had the misfortune of seeing this error and yet none of gotten a clear answer of what the problem might be. I've talked with a number of professional editors and they are all stumped. It's been said that John Carmack, when asked about this error, would get a scowl on his face, mutter something under his breath, and stalk off. "

CNPed from: The Forge

Looks like qbsp has finally gotten to ya, Xenon. =\ My only suggestion would be to split up the map until you find the area which is causing this (and then, of course, delete it..) ugh, such fun.

#1634 Posted by Speedy [213.158.0.175], 08/09/2001 03:27 GMT

I thought CanonicalVector: degenerate is a sort of a joke. Never had it

Models For Details

#1635 Posted by metlslime [24.176.79.254], 08/09/2001 07:40 GMT , Refers to Post #1628

(necros: this isn't really directed at you alone, so don't take it personally. I hear a lot of similar complaints.)

Um... I don`t really like that idea. It was done in SystemShock 2, and a lot of the levels got repetive because of it. (Same wall computer panels everywhere), plus if you break them all, then the hallway is really plain... =p

No no no, you misunderstand, just like everybody misunderstands me. What did walt whitman have to say about that? No matter.

Anyway, i'm not saying you just pepper some sort of prefab crap all over your level, i'm saying YOU, the level designer, create the same details you would have created with brushes, with triangle meshes instead. You don't C'n'P the same damned model everywhere, unless you are lame. And people are just as capable of being lame with brushes.

I'm imagining people making rocky cliffs out of meshes, strange altars, spaceships in a hangar, piles of scrap metal, whatever. If you want to be a lame-ass mapper and fucking make bad maps, you can. WHY DON"T PEOPLE REALISE THAT JUST BECUAuse a tool or feature allows bad mappers to make bad maps, it must be a bad tool? I WANT features and tools and i will make good maps with them, Fuck the rest of you. You can make all the shit maps you want. I'm not going to help protect you from your lack of imagination.

CanonicalVector: Degenerate

#1636 Posted by metlslime [24.176.79.254], 08/09/2001 07:41 GMT

it's been a while since i looked, but i seem to recall that in the code, after this error, carmack left a comment that said something like "// this should never happen"

Well, It Does

#1637 Posted by Fat Controller [203.98.21.44], 08/09/2001 07:58 GMT

I had this lovely error crop up when Kona was on the OUM crew and I was inserting some door notches into the ends of a twisty corridor. On undoing this work, things went back to normal.

So I'd say there's a very complex lump of brushwork somewhere that QBSP can't make head or tail of, and Xenon'll either have to rethink or simplify whatever brought it on.

#1638 Posted by necros [172.130.37.240], 08/09/2001 16:23 GMT

I'm imagining people making rocky cliffs out of meshes, strange altars, spaceships in a hangar, piles of scrap metal, whatever.

That's already been done.

If you want to be a lame-ass mapper and fucking make bad maps, you can. WHY DON"T PEOPLE REALISE THAT JUST BECUAuse a tool or feature allows bad mappers to make bad maps, it must be a bad tool? I WANT features and tools and i will make good maps with them, Fuck the rest of you. You can make all the shit maps you want. I'm not going to help protect you from your lack of imagination.

Dude, calm down. I never said it was a bad idea, just that it can get repetitive (Ex: SS2) And if yer gonna do this kind of stuff the way your envisionning it, that means mappers also have to be modellers to be able to churn out the amount of mesh objects yer talking about. Not only that, but it can possibly take longer (more detail, and having to make new meshes for every little thing). Granted, making terrain would probably be infinitly easier with triangles, rather than brushes, which is a definate plus.

No no no, you misunderstand, just like everybody misunderstands me.

Well, maybe you should rethink your way of explaning things, then.

Interesting

#1639 Posted by XeNoN [212.126.136.58], 08/09/2001 16:29 GMT

OK, Carmack cant solve my error... thats enlightening.

Interesting you should say that, Fatty... In fact the map compiled fine hundreds of times, and it was just this one time where I tweaked a few bits of simple brushwork and added some entities when I got the error. I could understand it if I had added any really complex detailed architechture but it was only a few torchholders and simple rock brushes... I'll look into it...

Grahf Is Still Working On A Title

#1640 Posted by Grahf [168.215.114.115], 08/09/2001 20:33 GMT

The nearest I can tell, from what the quakelab says and my own experience, is that the CanonicalVector error appears as a result of large scale clipping operations, either in the editor or csg-ing by qbsp. Tough to say for sure though.

\'modelling\'

#1641 Posted by Gilt [64.20.60.70], 08/09/2001 20:55 GMT

You can make all the shit maps you want. I'm not going to help protect you from your lack of imagination.

Hehehe...

not to mention the facy that there are a lot of prejudices and dogma about what should or shouldn't be part of maps simply because some people in the past didn't have the skill to implement those things, and now most people don't have the balls/imagination/skill to prove otherwise.

I understand what you're getting at with the 'modelling'. I have the same feelings because of the clumsiness of brushes. It's more about control then just having a whole bunch of prefabs. It's more like being able to make one of Gehry's buildings, not a whole bunch of compter panels.

That's why I liked the ideas behind Max Ed. I still haven't had the chance to try it though so I'm not sure if its any good though.

I'm imagining people making rocky cliffs out of meshes, strange altars, spaceships in a hangar, piles of scrap metal, whatever.

If you're being misunderstood, it's because your giving out examples of props. It's more then that, it's about making things that are actually a part of the map.

(Of course all this assumes that I'm actually thinking of the same thing as you)

I'm really looking forward to having that kind of power and control in level design,(I've been playing around with q3, and hopefully when I'm done this map that I've got everybody'll will be able to understand my vision of what mapping should be.)

And if yer gonna do this kind of stuff the way your envisionning it, that means mappers also have to be modellers to be able to churn out the amount of mesh objects yer talking about. Not only that, but it can possibly take longer (more detail, and having to make new meshes for every little thing)

You're not making the props, the whole point of this is that you'll be able to make things that are directly relevant to the level much easier, faster and better then you ever could with brushes. Check out my post over in the Max ed thread.

And I don't see what's wrong with having to aquire the some of the skill of modellers. It's so similar anyway.

#1642 Posted by Gilt [64.20.60.70], 08/09/2001 20:56 GMT

oops, forgot to close the <bold> after "a part of the map."

@#$@$^modelling^^@$

#1643 Posted by metlslime [24.176.79.254], 09/09/2001 02:05 GMT

I'll concede that i suck at explaining myself properly, at least to the people who misunderstand me.

Yes, maybe mappers have to be modellers. It's really just 3D design; they don't have to be as different as they seem. Perhaps gilt is right in that my problem is that i keep giving props as examples. Well, first of all, as a mapper i want to be able to make my own props anyway. In fact, i want to blur the line between 'props' and 'architecture.' But secondly, there are many things that people make right now as level designers that can be clumsy with brushes: Window frames, terrain, torch holders, doors, the damaged part of ruined buildings, weird ornamental stuff that causes "cannonicaVector: Degenerate" errors... and many things more that we simply do not make becuase it is impractical, like trees.

I guess, if you consider a mapper simply someone who arranges the ingredients but doesn't actually produce anything from scratch, like textures or 'props' or monsters, then any dissagreement stems from the fact that I want control of everything:

I want to make trees so that i can have a wooded area in my level -- you can't do that with brushes. I want to make light fixtures that don't require me to realign textures on it every time i rotate it a little. I want to make terrain where each triangle doesn't have 3 extra vertices to worry about, and where each 'vertex' in the 'mesh' is actually 6 vertices belonging to six different brushes that happen to meet there, and they aren't even vertices at all becuase they are merely implied by the meeting of three or more infinite planes in the .map file, rather than explicitly defined and under my direct control.

However, i think there are some things that will always be easier to build out of brushes. I hope brushes are here to stay, but only as one of several alternatives.

Gilt, you do understand me.

Necros:

i am calm; i'm just being passionate.

The caveat "this feature could be used to make a bad map" may be true, but i don't think it is relevant.

As far as the effort required to "churn out mesh objects," this should be equal to or less than the effort required to make the same objects out of brushes -- otherwise you should still make them out of brushes.

Q3 Perspective

#1644 Posted by Nightbringer [203.97.2.243], 09/09/2001 07:03 GMT

All geometry in a Q3 map is saved to the bsp as raw triangles I think; misc_model md3s included. An extension would be to let mappers design arbitrary tri meshes in-place, like patch meshes. It'd definitely require editor and compiler (perhaps bsp only) support, but it might very well be possible*.

Things are kinda moving in this direction already; the 'new' brush primitive texture mode lets you texture brushes a great deal more precisely.

More generally, letting the mapper choose to decouple visibility and collision data from rendered polygons is a good thing imo. Increases flexibility no end; as long as it Does the Right Thing by default if people ignore these features.

*: I'm not really conversant with the q3tools codebase. so read "may or may not be possible; may or may not be pleasant."

Speedy Thought A Title Wasn't Needed

#1645 Posted by Speedy [213.158.0.180], 10/09/2001 02:33 GMT

models have only bounding boxes around them so you cant really make terrain from them.

Speedy Is Still Working On A Title

#1646 Posted by Speedy [213.158.0.180], 10/09/2001 02:38 GMT

and if you really want to you can start to use models in q1 maps. You`d need void ents (or some other qc code). .. and models ofcourse ;)

BTW, on one hand making pollygon models is far more easy than building stuff from convex brushes, but skinmapping is harder than traditional texturing IMO

Q3 Question

#1647 Posted by Speedy [213.158.0.180], 10/09/2001 03:28 GMT

How can you make rectangular/square curves (like those in Q3A-Addction by Peej), link to the tutorial would be nice

Square Cylinders

#1648 Posted by Shallow[BAP] [212.135.236.122], 10/09/2001 09:01 GMT , Refers to Post #1647

Use a square cylinder, which you get from the curves menu of course, with two extra rows added, redispersed, bent to shape, then snapped to grid. Manipulate the patch control points to adjust the curve shape afterwards if desired. Can't explain the nitty gritty without diagrams, so I'll point to Claudec's which has links to tutorials for everything imaginable for Q3.

BTW, does anyone have a reliable formula for getting the right length cylinders for 90deg/180deg bends? I tend to use trial and error, which wastes a lot of time.

#1649 Posted by Krash [203.19.8.224], 10/09/2001 10:31 GMT , Refers to Post #1648

Vertex edit instead. Much simpler.
Difficult to explain how though, and I can't post a pic right now.

- Krash

#1650 Posted by Scampie [206.152.135.106], 10/09/2001 11:10 GMT , Refers to Post #1648

rectangle cylinders suck becuase the lighting looks ass on them. make the curved retangle bits out of 4 simple patch meshes that are vertex maniped into position.

Hmm, No Title

#1651 Posted by Gilt [154.11.100.196], 10/09/2001 17:32 GMT

models have only bounding boxes around them so you cant really make terrain from them...and if you really want to you can start to use models in q1 maps.

You don't get it.

Modelling is an unfortunate term for this. I don't want to actually use real models. Everything that I want to do is possible with brushes right now, it's just it'd be a whole hell of a lot easier if I could use a tri mesh type tool. Again I'll refer to my post from the max ed thread about the prisms.

let mappers design arbitrary tri meshes in-place, like patch meshes.

that's more like it :-)

Things are kinda moving in this direction already;

yup, this was just kind of a fantasizing about the future type of conversation :-)
That's why we said things like "looking to the future"...

BTW, on one hand making pollygon models is far more easy than building stuff from convex brushes, but skinmapping is harder than traditional texturing IMO

yeah I guess, but that's the way it's going to be. If mappers have to learn how to be modellers then texture artists will have to learn how be skinners. It's all just a
blurring of the lines like metlslime said.

This type of stuff is already being done in movies. So when games/comps get more power, we'll get more power to do what we want.

Weird Error

#1652 Posted by alan [195.92.168.166], 13/09/2001 15:16 GMT

I get these errors whe nI goto compile a map, whats going on?

** Executing...
** Command: C:\Program Files\Worldcraft\Q1Tools\Qbsp.exe
** Parameters: C:\Program Files\Quake\id1\Maps\ROCKY

Transparent water QBSP with Hipnotic extensions
MultiWAD version 1.65
by Ken Alverson based on original code by John Carmack

************ ERROR ************
Error opening C:\Program.map: No such file or directory

** Executing...
** Command: C:\Program Files\Worldcraft\Q1Tools\Light.exe
** Parameters: C:\Program Files\Quake\id1\Maps\ROCKY

----- LightFaces ----
************ ERROR ************
usage: light [-threads num] [-extra] bspfile

** Executing...
** Command: C:\Program Files\Worldcraft\Q1Tools\Vis.exe
** Parameters: -fast C:\Program Files\Quake\id1\Maps\ROCKY

---- rvis+ ----
fastvis = true
************ ERROR ************
usage: vis [-threads #] [-level 0-4] [-fast] [-v] [-credits] [-nocount] bspfile

#1653 Posted by GlassMan [195.184.253.85], 13/09/2001 15:35 GMT

perhaps make it rocky.map rather than just rocky?

Its either that or qbsp doesn't like the space in "Program Files"..its trying to open something called Program.map

#1654 Posted by XeNoN [195.8.88.168], 13/09/2001 17:48 GMT , Refers to Post #1652

Save the map into a different directory, like, in your quake folder for instance, and make sure there are no spaces in the file path.

Qbsp sees the space in "program files", assumes it is the end of the path, and thus assumes 'program' is the name of the map youre compiling. And there's no need to use rocky.map like glassman said, it searches for the .map file itself.

Hope that makes sense...

#1655 Posted by Scampie [206.152.135.106], 13/09/2001 21:54 GMT

here's what will make sense. DOS does not support spaces in folder and file names. The compile utilities, based it DOS, cannot read where you mean for a space to be becuase it's the name of the folder, or if it's a space before a command.

Best way to do compiles and such (at least what I do for compiling): Put all your .wads, .maps, and compile utils into 1 seperate folder. I call mine "Qtex". All compiles go thru there. Makes everything simple, everything is in 1 spot.

If you get real industrial, you'll set up a .bat file which will bsp your map, then light with the settings you want, and vis if you specify it to. and then it starts quake with your map, all ready to go.

metlslime Thought A Title Wasn't Needed

#1656 Posted by metlslime [24.176.79.254], 14/09/2001 08:16 GMT

Some versions of windows can't handle those spaces in batch file paths. change "C:\Program Files\etc" to "C:\Progra~1\etc"

#1657 Posted by palldjon@uni [131.172.4.45], 18/09/2001 06:10 GMT

so I'm working on a Q1 project and using WC1.6. Now I'm implementing 4 player co-op functionality...no probs. However, I don't want the player spawn points to appear if someone is playing SP. Moreover, I'd like to double up on weapons but not have the duplicates appear in SP.

Making the co-op spawn points appropriate entities (e.g. func_wall) gives me some flag choices:
"Not in easy"
"Not in normal"
"Not in hard"
"Not in deathmatch"

and has the added bonus of not cutting up the BSP

.

So what's the story with co-op? Do I tick them all and insist the co-op players choose "nightmare". Does WC even recognize "nightmare" as an option? Further, a 1337 SP player might play nightmare at some stage and have to put up with too many weapons and unrequired spawn points.

Is it as simple as ticking all but "Not in deathmatch." That is, is co-op run (initially) just like any other multi-player mode but some universal code kicks in when the co-op option is chosen, to stop the items re-spawning but still allowing skill level selection???

Uuuuuuum...help!

#1658 Posted by Tyrann [203.56.239.111], 18/09/2001 07:32 GMT , Refers to Post #1657

There is no spawnflag for "co-op only".
Nightmare is the same as hard - monsters just fight harder.

#1659 Posted by czg [158.38.54.51], 18/09/2001 08:08 GMT

isn't there a func_coop or something? There is at least a func_deathmatch. I was going to look it up in a fgd file, but PQ seemed to be having a headache...

Func_deathmatch?

#1660 Posted by GlassMan [195.184.253.85], 18/09/2001 14:59 GMT

I've never heard of func_coop or func_deathmatch. Afaik there is only the spawnflag to exclude an entity from deathmatch.

Also, you don't need extra weapons in coop as the weapons dont disappear when they're picked up so everyone can grab them (once only though). A bit like dm with weapstay on.

#1661 Posted by GlassMan [195.184.253.85], 18/09/2001 15:19 GMT

when playing coop you still select a skill setting so if you mark an entity 'not in easy' it will not appear in easy on SP or coop.

#1662 Posted by XeNoN [195.8.88.136], 18/09/2001 17:19 GMT

I don't want the player spawn points to appear if someone is playing SP. Moreover, I'd like to double up on weapons but not have the duplicates appear in SP

Coop is really not that complex... It really is just SP with more players, except with the item pickup feature glassman mentioned. Skillsettings are set up the same too; say a level on skill 1 has 50 monsters in SP, it will have 50 monsters on skill 1 in coop too; there's no way you can change it through flags.

And for spawn points, well, its tough. You'll just have to spawn them on the plain floor or put up with extra teleport pads in SP... not that its a big deal or anything.

#1663 Posted by GlassMan [213.123.236.93], 18/09/2001 18:36 GMT

If you really want something special for the coop starts you could put them in extra little side rooms with doors that can only be opened from the inside. Playing under normal SP you would never know they were there.

I dont think regular coop players expect these kind of luxuries though ;)

#1664 Posted by necros [172.140.32.68], 18/09/2001 21:07 GMT

Palldjon, if you know a little bit of QC, you can code an extra key into all items, (say, a 'necros' key), and when you set that key to, say '1', then you can make those items only spawn in coop (you could probably do this with spawnflags, but this is much easier, and I've done it before, and it works: i made a 'nogib' key, to make monsters which had it set to 1 never gib).

Now, For My Problems...

#1665 Posted by necros [172.140.32.68], 18/09/2001 21:10 GMT

Map compiles Properly, no errors. I run quake (GL, Software, TQ, Nehahra) and they all say:

CALL1 468(precache_model)precache_model()
world.qc : worldspawn
(NO_FUNCTION)
PF_precache_model : overflow
Host_error : Program Error

At first, I thought this was because I had to many B-Models... but I don't (I have 230, and the max, afaik is 255).

So what could be the problem? (Oh, there are absolutly NO torches in there).

#1666 Posted by GlassMan [213.123.236.93], 18/09/2001 22:01 GMT

Did you get the number of b-models from using mcache? If not, check that.

#1667 Posted by palldjon [203.32.39.254], 19/09/2001 00:50 GMT

for the heads up on weaponstay for co-op Glassman. Ta also XeN and others for clearing up the lack of co-op flags.

As far as the spawn points are concerned, I do want co-op players to have such luxuries. So I'm in the shower this morning and I suddenly thought "der", just make the co-op pads func_wall, give 'em a common name then place a trigger_once around the player_start (with the same name as the co-op ports) that killtargets the port points. Vice-versa for the co-op points. Hhhhhhmm might work, other wise I'll use the one way door and seperate room idea.

Thanx all.

Or It Might Not..

#1668 Posted by GlassMan [213.123.236.93], 19/09/2001 01:35 GMT

I'm *fairly* sure that the regular info_player_start is also used as one of the coop starts..the player running the coop server spawns there. You might want to try it just to check.

OakelyDoakely...

#1669 Posted by palldjon [203.32.39.254], 19/09/2001 02:17 GMT

seperate room, with a one way door it is.

Not that I mind, maybe I'll give the co-op players a little pool to splash in and maybe a kiosk selling really good coffee, and...

they deserve it.

Max Number Of Monsters...

#1670 Posted by necros [172.139.0.245], 19/09/2001 22:51 GMT

Is there a max number of monsters that you can have in a given level? Would that cause a precache error? Right now, i've got 200 exactly.

Or can it be a combination of the two (lots of monsters, and lots of BModels)

Coffe?... Always!

#1671 Posted by Jaj [62.83.167.177], 19/09/2001 22:52 GMT , Refers to Post #1669

You're right, they deserve it.. while saving the world, some coffe is something unpayable...

(hey! coffe cup icon needed!)

Max Numbers

#1672 Posted by Jaj [62.83.167.177], 19/09/2001 22:55 GMT , Refers to Post #1670

Yes,there is a max number for .mdl models, i think, but i don't know which number exactly...

#1673 Posted by Nightbringer [203.97.2.243], 20/09/2001 00:22 GMT

- Added variable default texture scale in preferences
Whoever wanted q1-suitable default texture scale in radiant just got their wish:
GTKR 1.1.1 release candidate

Max Monster

#1674 Posted by Speedy [213.158.0.131], 20/09/2001 02:36 GMT

dont think there is a limit (may be there is for max ents in general) I `v compiled/played test map with over 400 baddies

Max Monster

#1675 Posted by Speedy [213.158.0.131], 20/09/2001 02:44 GMT

dont think there is a limit (may be there is for max ents in general) I `v compiled/played test map with over 400 baddies

Necros Et Al.

#1676 Posted by BlackLeatherJacket [203.32.39.254], 20/09/2001 06:44 GMT

The Glassman had this to say a while back:

The maximum number of entities including lights is 2048 so thats not your problem.

The precache error refers to the number of different models that are precached so a shambler say only counts once even if you have 20 of them. There is a command that will list the precached models in the console but I forget what it is. Someone should know.

I dont know why you want to exclude doors. Each separate func_* brush entity & trigger brushes will count as a model in that tally.

Found it with search string "entity"

~blj

#1677 Posted by XeNoN [195.8.79.86], 20/09/2001 18:12 GMT

It all depends. Say, the marvellous speedmap "sm20_amrik" had 186 monsters all in one room, and crashed every engine out there (except panquake), but on the other hand, czg07a had 240 monsters on hard and ran absolutely fine on all enigines afaik. , due to its spaced out and extensive layout.
But 200 sounds rather excessive. Either its a vary large level or has quad-massacre antics, the latter of which should be avoided like the plague. Basically if you get the packet overflow in any of the 3 main Qengines then thats too many in a room. But if you space them out enough then who knows?

256 Perhaps?

#1678 Posted by Jaj [62.83.165.18], 20/09/2001 22:58 GMT , Refers to Post #1670

I've just seen this just now

Here

Anyway im not sure,i need to read this with a coffe

No, No, Let Me Clarify/repeat Myself =p

#1679 Posted by necros [172.141.255.44], 21/09/2001 00:48 GMT

This map IS large. with 200 monsters evenly spaced out (although, i was tempted for the quad massacres

)

However, there is also 200 BModels (doors, func_walls, plats..etc) (Most of these are trigger_teleport, btw).

There are absolutly no wall torches, and only a few flames. (static models, btw).

the actual error:

CALL1 468(precache_model)precache_model()
world.qc : worldspawn
(NO_FUNCTION)
PF_precache_model : overflow
Host_error : Program Error

But, then, just to see i deleted all the monsters, and brought the bmodel count down to 150, and the map worked... so why the hell is the max 255 bmodels, when i can barely get it to work with 150 bmodels??

#1680 Posted by GlassMan [195.184.253.85], 21/09/2001 13:59 GMT , Refers to Post #1679

The limit is not 256 'bmodels'. Its 256 models of all kinds. That includes sprites, each type of monster, monsters heads, the bsp of the map itself, weapon models, the rocket model, the nail, gibs the lot. I doubt you would have enough space left for all these models if you have 200 'bmodels'.

I would guess you've gone over the top with the triggers for the teleporting in. Theres only so much of that you can do. With your coding skills maybe you could write some kind of monster spawn function to use instead of the triggers. I think custents has something like that.

#1681 Posted by czg [158.38.54.28], 21/09/2001 15:31 GMT

Rip out the spawnflag 64 code from Zerst�rer. I managed to do it once and it wasn't really so complicated, just a few lines of cut 'n paste, really simple.
That might just be the most ingenious bit of code ever created...

256 Of Every Models???

#1682 Posted by necros [172.145.206.107], 21/09/2001 22:23 GMT

Holy... no wonder it was fucking up. And I keep running out of edicts on one monster teleport (it teleports 8 monsters at the same time). Could this be related to it as well?

And thx for the idea, czg... i'll take a peek at that code.

Ok, Kids, Who Wants To Beta Test?

#1683 Posted by necros [172.130.34.102], 22/09/2001 02:06 GMT

Finally finished asunder1 (CZG, monster spawning is a life saver!). Now, I need some testers. It's in early beta stage, so the more the merrier. One thing, tho... You must use panquake to play... I'm sorry, i really am, but there just isn't enough edicts in normal glquake... =\ (I'll even send ya panquake if you don't have it).
And you'll also need an additional progs.dat, with some models, and sounds (total is about 2.6 MB, maps 'n' all)
if you want to, just mail me.

btw, Aard, is it ok if i include your panquake.exe with the pack? it'd make it a lot easier for people who aren't familliar with this kind of stuff. i'll include yer text file, and everything. (don't worry).

I Wanna Test

#1684 Posted by Speedy [213.158.0.145], 22/09/2001 04:02 GMT

I want to test the map

Button Problems

#1685 Posted by Asriel [203.98.21.44], 22/09/2001 10:21 GMT

I have a problem concerning buttons.

I have two buttons, one that triggers 'exitplat' and door that acts as a platform and another button that triggers 'exitdoor' a door.

The problem is, that pressing the button to trigger exitplat doesnt do anything at all, but when i press the exitdoor button, it triggers both exitdoor and exit plat.

I have no idea what is wrong, but was wondering if anyone else does?

btw, necros, can i please beta test? (email me if its a yes)

A Question From A Newbie...

#1686 Posted by catflap [213.48.229.16], 22/09/2001 12:20 GMT

I'm trying to create a lift in Q3Radiant which stays in it's elevated position for longer than the default 1 second. I've used a func_plat for the lift, and so far, I've tried func_timer to re-trigger it, but that doesn't work too well (the lift cycles, but doesn't stay put).

Can this sort of lift be created?

Many thanks in advance,
Catflap

#1687 Posted by Scampie [206.152.135.106], 22/09/2001 16:22 GMT , Refers to Post #1686

i think there may be a 'wait' key that you can set on the func_platform

if not, i'd try using a func_door that will 'open' vertically. that you can set with a 'wait' for sure.

#1688 Posted by necros [172.173.168.212], 22/09/2001 19:30 GMT

The problem is that the doors are getting linked together, and the 'exitdoor' one is being defined as the master door, whereas the other is the child door... (I forget the exact terms =p) In anycase, the way to fix that is either to make both doors not touch, or check the "Doors don't link" flag on both doors.

Assuming it's for

Cheers Necros

#1689 Posted by Asriel [203.98.21.44], 22/09/2001 21:16 GMT

Thanks for that necros, I can see where I have gone wrong exactly.

Thanks muchly

#1690 Posted by palldjon [203.29.11.254], 27/09/2001 02:11 GMT

My mapping sys has crashed badly. I'll be off line for a week or so while it gets an enema, but just before I go...

I found this gem on a search through the Qboard archive. Most of it applies to Quake as well as Quake2. A more succint and informative piece I have never seen.

A Quake 2 .map file is a collection of convex brushes. Each brush is made up from a number of plane surfaces. Each plane surface has a set of properties. The area the .map covers is a cube, extending 4096 units from the origin coordinates (0,0,0) in the X, Y, Z directions.

QBSP3 reads all the brush information from the .map file, checks for conflicting surface properties, invalid brushes and brushes which extend further than the 4096 unit limit. Intersecting brushes can cause mess later on, and so all intersecting brushes are subtracted from each other.
Next QBSP begins to split up the negative (non-solid-brush) space in the map into solid convex volumes called "nodes", each described by its own set of planes just like a brush. To start with, it selects the best candidate plane it can find, and cuts the whole map into two areas, along this plane - the cut is called a "portal". Brush planes with a larger surface area are considered to be better candidates to be used to cut portals. To save time finding the best candidate in large maps, it just cuts the map literally in half along the plane X=0. The two halves are the first branches of a binary tree. The next cut splits the first half in half again, along the plane Y=0, the next splits the second half in half again along Y=0 and so on. Each area is split in half and in half again until the map is split into 64 1024*1024*8192 unit areas called blocks, which are now the lowest 'branches' of the binary tree. Most of these blocks do not contain any brushes, so they are each a solid convex volume and do not need splitting again - they are known as leaves, and each leaf terminates the branch of the tree it is on.
The negative space in each of the remaining branches is split again to create more branches, this time using the best candidate plane surface of all the brushes in the branch. This is repeated over and over until the branches are convex leaf-nodes and do not need to be split again.

All surfaces with the "solid" property are candidates to be used by QBSP3 to create "portals", splitting up the space through which the player can move in the map. This information is saved in a BSP tree form - each node is a leaf of the tree.

Portals are cuts in the map chosen by qbsp3 from brush planes. All surfaces along a portal will be split by the cut it makes. The cuts can run the whole length of the block, or just the width of the brush, depending on how far down the tree they are created.

Leaf-nodes are convex, like brushes. When you run QVIS3, it goes through each leaf of the tree, calculating which of the other leaf-nodes it can "see", records this information in a table, compresses it, and writes it back to the BSP.

When you run around the map in Quake2, you're moving through the space which has been broken up into leaf-nodes. At any one instant in time, your position is determined to be in a single leaf-node, so Q2 uses the information which QVIS3 recorded, to decide which of the other leaf-nodes in the map are visible to you. As you move from one node to another, different areas become 'visible', this is very well illustrated by using gl_showtris 1 and walking around any fully compiled Q2 level.

Hint surfaces are candidates for creating portals. In QBSP3, they are given a higher priority than normal solid brushes, and are used earlier to create portals. Using them in your map allows you to more reliably control the location and extent of the portals, and therefore control the shape, position, and number of leaf-nodes in the BSP tree. Theyre called hints because they allow you to give QBSP some "hints" on the most efficient arrangement of the portals and nodes.
Using hints creates new surfaces for qbsp to consider when choosing planes for portals, so more cuts are made in the map, increasing bsp complexity and increasing the number of polys created from each surface. To best avoid increasing complexity using hints, try to place hints aligned with the architecture in the map as much as possible. QBSP3 merges faces which are on the same plan and sharing the same properties, however there is a limit on the size of faces in Q2, any face with a dimension >=256 units will be split up, and it will not merge two faces if the resulting face is >=256 units high/wide.

When Willits made Q2dm1 I guess hint brushes were pretty new to him, so he hadn't had time to experiment to get the best use out of them. He's definetly done a better job of it in Q3test1, aligning hints to walls and using them in much larger numbers, and the map layout is also a little more bsp-friendly than Q2dm1. Despite this theres a lot more you can do with hints to improve the efficiency of qbsp3 and qvis3.

-SPoG

Thank you SPoG

#1691 Posted by Asriel [203.98.21.44], 27/09/2001 13:08 GMT

I was wondering if someone could please explain some of the uses of vis or more specifically rvis+.

Anyway, what does verbose (-v) do?
Also, in terms of 'percentages' -level 4 being 100%, what would -fast be?

Seems silly, but I would like to be inlightened.

cheers

Who Needs A Title Anyway

#1692 Posted by wrath [213.67.120.164], 27/09/2001 16:44 GMT

bsp tech makes my head hurt.

#1693 Posted by Starbuck [213.122.35.157], 27/09/2001 18:43 GMT

sorry, my brain exploded

I Piss Vis.

#1694 Posted by necros [152.163.204.43], 27/09/2001 22:38 GMT

never use -fast. it's quite pointless, considering it only calculates the base of the vis tree. basically, it does a piss-poor job, and still takes a while to do. (with hardly any performance gain) You'd be better off using a normal vis. As for percentages... i don't really know (or care =\ ) I guess -fast would be 15% or something...

rvis+ is basically rvis, except there's a counter added in there.

-v outputs extra information... none of which i've found useful... =P I suppose it's good for debugging the program itself.

What exactly do you mean by: I was wondering if someone could please explain some of the uses of vis or more specifically rvis+.? You mean you really dont know what vis does?

well, then:

vis bascially takes all the leaf information (read above post, if you can take it) and creates a visibility data set for quake to read. it's infinitly faster than having the game calculate vis 'on the fly', (-novis in glquake), since all of that is done prior.

If you don't know what i mean, just consider that vis tells quake when to draw certain walls depending on where you are in the map.

Hope you got that. (I'm a crappy teacher)...

Who Needs A Title Anyway

#1695 Posted by Tyrann [203.56.239.116], 28/09/2001 03:03 GMT , Refers to Post #1694

Using -novis on the command line doesn't make the engine calculate visibility "on the fly", it just makes it ignore the PVS and draw everything.

#1696 Posted by Maj [193.128.238.146], 28/09/2001 11:52 GMT

Well, technically, z-buffering is a visibility algorithm :]

#1697 Posted by Tyrann [203.56.239.200], 28/09/2001 12:58 GMT , Refers to Post #1696

Hehe, yeah I suppose it is.

necros Thought A Title Wasn't Needed

#1698 Posted by necros [152.163.204.137], 28/09/2001 17:14 GMT , Refers to Post #1695

well, whatever... it's novis 1 in the console though, not a command line...
And anyway, i just remember reading that somewhere.

Custom Textures In Qeradiant

#1699 Posted by Memento [129.240.241.84], 30/09/2001 02:39 GMT

Memento has a huge problem. How can I tell radiant that I want to use other tex in my Q2 map than those in pak0.pak? In the preferences-screen, one can only setup 1 pak, but what do I do if I want to use textures from other paks/wal-dirs AS WELL?

Map Wars - Episode 5 - The Empire Maps Back

Can't Take A Screenshot

#1700 Posted by Smite [24.4.253.41], 30/09/2001 02:58 GMT

When I try to take a screenshot it comes out looking like a lo-res jumble of the shot I took.

Can anybody offer any suggestions?

#1701 Posted by XeNoN [212.126.132.160], 30/09/2001 11:12 GMT

Well, it might help if you said what game you wanted to take a screenshot of. I'm gonna presume its q2 seeing as i got that error with it a while ago...

Try switching to higher resolution, OpenGL mode (if your GFX card supports it) or windowed mode. One of those should work.

#1702 Posted by Smite [24.4.253.41], 30/09/2001 13:48 GMT , Refers to Post #1701

I was referring to Q1. the window idea helped a great deal. Thank you.

#1703 Posted by Asriel [203.98.21.44], 04/10/2001 12:36 GMT

Cheers necros and co, those posts did help explain vis, a fair bit.

Pretty Easy

#1704 Posted by kanaeda [64.71.235.99], 04/10/2001 19:53 GMT , Refers to Post #1699

if you want to use textures that are in another .pak file, you need to extract them. qeradiant can only read textures from one .pak file at a time (i'm not 100% certain on this one, tho).

to use other textures in your /baseq2/textures directory you need to go to the project settings and simply set the correct texture path. restart radiant and you should find a bigger list of textures.

#1705 Posted by Hanz [193.229.255.17], 08/10/2001 16:42 GMT

I heard there's a program that converts Q2 map format to Q1 map format.. Now where can I find that piece of useful software?:) (I'm asking this because I'd wanna map with QERadiant rather than Worldcraft)

tack s� mycket

#1706 Posted by XeNoN [195.8.79.77], 08/10/2001 17:33 GMT

http://rem.fov120.com/projects.php4 - there!

It's the "map converter" link, if you couldn't guess...

#1707 Posted by Shadowdane [208.203.4.100], 08/10/2001 18:12 GMT , Refers to Post #1706

acually Sleepwalker's map converter just converts the .map file to Q1 format. It doesn't convert textures to Q2 .wal format...

Wally supports this, you can use the batch process to do em all in one pass.

Wally - http://www.telefragged.com/wally/

#1708 Posted by Shadowdane [208.203.4.100], 08/10/2001 18:13 GMT , Refers to Post #1706

acually Sleepwalker's map converter just converts the .map file to Q1 format. It doesn't convert textures to Q2 .wal format...

Wally supports this, you can use the batch process to do em all in one pass.

Wally - http://www.telefragged.com/wally

Shadowdane Thought A Title Wasn't Needed

#1709 Posted by Shadowdane [208.203.4.100], 08/10/2001 18:14 GMT

sorry about the double post..

the first time i posted i got an error.

Hanz Thought A Double Post Wasn't Needed

#1710 Posted by Hanz [193.229.255.17], 08/10/2001 19:39 GMT

Thanks heaps for the info you both. I'm just sick of Worldcraft crashing and 3d-view picking not working :P

#1711 Posted by czg [158.38.54.39], 09/10/2001 07:53 GMT

Disable hardware acceleration in WorldCraft. Just about everyone who's having exceptionally horrible problems with WC are trying to run it with hardware. Just doesn't work.

Func_Trains...

#1712 Posted by necros [172.158.24.17], 10/10/2001 01:41 GMT

A while ago, just for fun, I made a silly map with func_trains which raced around through canyons. (This was after I saw StarWars Ep1 btw...)

Anyway, I noticed that after the trains moved more than 1000 or so units, the train entity disapeared... is this an engine limitation?

#1713 Posted by hanz. [193.167.5.167], 10/10/2001 05:01 GMT

I tried without acceleration and it did work, but then the program was horribly slow to use. Software rendering is just too slooow.

Clipping Weirdness.

#1714 Posted by Biff_Debris [12.93.210.236], 11/10/2001 01:19 GMT

Hey guys, if you clip a leak in q1, you get weird portal errors. Asaki just found this out (using QBSP and WQBSP -- while TomazQBSP found the leak). Just thought it'd make a good Tip O' The Day =)

Clip A Leak?

#1715 Posted by czg [158.38.54.48], 11/10/2001 08:35 GMT

Please explain. I do not follow.

#1716 Posted by Scampie [206.152.135.94], 12/10/2001 01:05 GMT , Refers to Post #1715

you put a clip brush over it so you don't fall out!

#1717 Posted by czg [158.38.54.74], 12/10/2001 12:19 GMT

And that would help how?

#1718 Posted by Asriel [203.96.152.184], 13/10/2001 08:41 GMT

If you 'accidentally' made the texture covering a leak a clip texture?
I dunno, that may have been a reason.
Maybe?

Newbie Qbsp Problem

#1719 Posted by venomus [152.163.204.51], 13/10/2001 14:29 GMT

I am running txqbsp (modified version of qbsp that comes with Quark) to compile my map, but it isn't generating a .prt file. Therefore I can't run Rvis . Here is my compile log:

TXQBSP 0.6 - based on QBSP by John Carmack. Modified by Armin Rigo
--------------------------------
with extensions for QuArK (Quake Army Knife) :
floating-point coordinates and enhanced texture positionning
http://www.planetquake.com/quark
--------------------------------
outputfile: D:\Program Files\Quake\editing\compiler\bob.bsp
--- LoadMapFile ---
D:\Program Files\Quake\editing\compiler\bob.map
986 brushes
2 entities
67 miptex
266 texinfo
building hulls sequentially...
--- Brush_LoadEntity ---
980 brushes read
---- CSGFaces ----
7645 brushfaces
38277 csgfaces
5357 mergedfaces
----- SolidBSP -----
6588 split nodes
3307 solid leafs
3282 empty leafs
0 water leafs
12526 leaffaces
11145 nodefaces
----- portalize ----
WARNING: CutNodePortals_r:new portal was clipped away
----- FillOutside ----
2308 outleafs
----- SolidBSP -----
4024 split nodes
2246 solid leafs
1779 empty leafs
0 water leafs
9180 leaffaces
7871 nodefaces
--- FinishBSPFile ---
WriteBSPFile: D:\Program Files\Quake\editing\compiler\bob.bsp
added 8 texture frames
3126 planes 62520
14109 vertexes 169308
7373 nodes 176952
266 texinfo 10640
12585 faces 251700
6241 clipnodes 49928
4448 leafs 124544
14378 marksurfaces 28756
49869 surfedges 99738
33389 edges 133556
75 textures 500384
lightdata 0
visdata 0
entdata 162
568.0 seconds elapsed

What gives?

#1720 Posted by czg [158.38.54.64], 13/10/2001 15:16 GMT

I am still very confused about what 'clipping a leak' would be. It makes no sense whatsoever.

As for your compile problems venomus, that is sadly something that will happen from time to time. Try doing some crap with the map and compile again, maybe it will jut work fine. I doubt that the Qbsp is b0rked, but you never know. Maybe try another one? (Though you prolly won't fint that 'enhanced texture positionning' trinket in any other Qbsp. (If it is what I think it is.))

It Probably Means That

#1721 Posted by aguirRe [195.163.201.171], 13/10/2001 17:37 GMT , Refers to Post #1719

you have a leak in your map. Unfortunately Txqbsp 0.6 has a bug that sometimes inhibits the leak information. I have sent an updated version to the QuArK guys (that I think fixes this problem) but they haven't made it public yet.

In the meantime you might try to add the switch "-verbose" and see if that helps displaying the leak information. In any case, you have to follow CZGs advice and change the map.

No .prt File

#1722 Posted by QuakeTree [205.186.177.110], 14/10/2001 00:01 GMT , Refers to Post #1719

This happens to me also sometimes. While I don't know what causes it I do know that somewhere you have a brush that is at least acting like a fuc_wall somewhere in your map.

What I usually do is select the entire map and move it 128 units (up/down whatever), I have no idea why this works for me but it does (note that I am using WinQoole and various versions of QBSP so this sounds like a problem with the bsp programs).

Good luck...

#1723 Posted by necros [172.138.138.193], 14/10/2001 01:47 GMT

i hate it. i used to use it, and it gave me more errors than i have shit in the last five years... er... yes.

My advice is use WQBSP, it works much better, and generates PTS files properly.

And I do use Quark with wqbsp, and it's fine.

Who Needs A Title Anyway

#1724 Posted by Speedy [213.158.0.189], 14/10/2001 03:05 GMT

Quark with wqbsp ? you prolly use some old quark. 6 requires TXqbsp for reading it`s .map`s

's What I Said.

#1725 Posted by necros [172.129.100.20], 14/10/2001 15:34 GMT

quark 4.07. i hate all those new quarks. too many wierd thingys that i can't be arsed to learn. =P

venomus Is Still Working On A Title

#1726 Posted by venomus [64.12.107.29], 14/10/2001 23:10 GMT

Well I recompiled with wqbsp, and found that there was indeed a leak, complete with pointfile amd all! I only use Quark for the entity placement anyway.

Thanx to everyone who replied.

#1727 Posted by NotoriousRay [199.75.227.29], 15/10/2001 03:53 GMT

clipping a leak means (probably accidentally) putting a clipbrush over where the level sees into the void. since clip is nonvisible it still counts as a leak.

#1728 Posted by Asriel [203.96.152.183], 16/10/2001 05:37 GMT

NR - thats exactly what i ment

Void Colour

#1729 Posted by Asriel [203.96.152.183], 16/10/2001 05:41 GMT

Is there a way to change the colour of the void?
A bright yellow or something like that might make leaks easier to see?

And going along with the leak thing : Has anyone tried coding a better pointfile system?

QC?

#1730 Posted by Speedy [57.66.134.250], 16/10/2001 13:42 GMT

in q3radiant - it`s the best editor for leak searching imo (and it it loads most q1 maps)

Or try some other editors that loads pointfiles and shows them (bsp does that but not the best way)

#1731 Posted by aguirRe [195.163.203.149], 16/10/2001 16:06 GMT , Refers to Post #1729

you can use "gl_clear 1" in the console to make the void bright red.

#1732 Posted by Scampie [206.152.135.94], 16/10/2001 19:21 GMT , Refers to Post #1731

you can use "r_clear 1" for a bright purple void.

In Software Q1...

#1733 Posted by Fat Controller [203.79.68.64], 16/10/2001 21:34 GMT

You can use r_clearcolor <0..255> to change the void colour.

I can understand about the pointfile system myself. There's nothing worse than waiting the better part of an hour while QBSP "writes" a .pts - honestly, that's happened to me! Mind you, WC's pointfile loading sucks something so unspeakably vile that I can't put a name to it. Eurgh.

Yaeh Uh Wow

#1734 Posted by [Tronyn] [24.66.247.146], 17/10/2001 23:53 GMT

So big Night Journey map, has a leak or ten, compiles fine otherwise. I attempt to load it in Quake:

"Error: SZ_GetSpace: overflow without allowoverflow set

C:\quake>"

ideas?

on clipping a leak. You know what's an amusing bad practice, when Qbsp refuses to render something solid (usually due to complexity), clipping it. Heh. Not that I do that or anything, ahem. And no, this has nothing to do with my problem :)

#1735 Posted by proj [158.252.33.140], 18/10/2001 02:02 GMT

I have been trying for some time to finalize my quake II mod. I created a level using the qoole level editor and exported it as a .map file. How can I save it as a .bsp file so that I can insert it into quake's pak1 directory using qped and play it as a multiplayer game? Or am I going about this entirely the wrong way? I'm so very new. Any suggestions would be greatly appreciated.
Thanks.

PROJ

Who Needs A Title Anyway

#1736 Posted by Speedy [213.158.0.179], 18/10/2001 02:16 GMT

lol
RTFM actually

#1737 Posted by Scampie [206.152.135.94], 18/10/2001 03:17 GMT , Refers to Post #1735

Alright... what you need to do is known as compiling. Your .map is run thru 3 processes: bsp, light and vis. Then, you put the .bsp in the quake/id1/maps.

bsp makes your .map into a .bsp which Quake can read. why not stop there? load it up in Quake and you'll see... It's fullbright and probably runs slowly.

light will light your map. simple eh?

vis optimises your map.

that's the basics of it. there are plenty of opinions availible to use with compiling, but that's a bit beyond this explaination.

NOW, to run the compilers, I believe Qoole has a Build command or a make or something similar in the menus which will bring up a window that you can use to select which process to run and if you want to start Quake after the compile.

Here's a link to QuakeLabs' Basics section. Probably best that you read thru the stuff over at QuakeLab, it'll teach you alot.

Hmm, No Title

#1738 Posted by Speedy [213.158.0.179], 18/10/2001 03:38 GMT

afair ctrl-b in winqoole..
yeah I still remember this

but really how can you map and not know how to compile shit ?
to sound less offending: read the manual/tutorial like "your first quake map"
but dont do CSG subtract and stick to grid and ... ditch qoole

#1739 Posted by Scampie [206.152.135.94], 18/10/2001 04:21 GMT , Refers to Post #1737

missed the 2 when you said Quake2... but the info i said still applies... just light is called rad and you put your map in quake2/baseq2/maps

#1740 Posted by The Lieutenant [144.32.128.132], 18/10/2001 19:30 GMT

I think this occurs when you overflow the entity limit.

Error: SZ_GetSpace: Overflow Without All

#1741 Posted by necros [172.158.137.192], 18/10/2001 21:42 GMT

Lth is right. The total number of precaches is going over 255 (all BModels, Monsters, Items, etc...). You'll have to remove some triggers and doors... (maybe you have a lot of teleporting monsters?)

#1742 Posted by [Tronyn] [24.66.247.146], 19/10/2001 02:19 GMT

well that's gh3y

man this map is massive
its like moonlit assault + the final threat + toum + all of czg07 in one bsp.

lol

actually, it's just the dazsp2 maps, redone, plus a bunch of new stuff all in one bsp. and if I ever load it in quake the gameplay will be the most overdone brutal fun gameplay ever.

#1743 Posted by The Lieutenant [144.32.177.155], 19/10/2001 11:58 GMT

In which casse I demand to beta test it!

Bounce In Quake RAD

#1744 Posted by venomus [152.163.207.67], 19/10/2001 19:46 GMT

I am a more used to Half-Life mapping than Quake 1 mapping, and in Half-Life there is a parameter within RAD that allows you to specify how many times light bounces (refracts). Is there anything like this in Quake 1 compilers because I noticed the lighting in my map was looking a bit stark. If not what can I do to improve lighting (with the compiler or otherwise)?

#1745 Posted by proj [158.252.33.226], 19/10/2001 20:04 GMT , Refers to Post #1737

actually, i had already tried to compile it and got the following self contradictory message...

process failed to start
--------------------------
process completed succesfully

and no .bsp

what is the mapping editor of choice? at this point it seems as if i should try to take my .map file and compile it elsewhere. i'm assuming from speedy's comment that qoole is quite buggy. i have been using csg subtract quite a bit and sometimes am not snapped to grid...

#1746 Posted by czg [158.38.54.40], 19/10/2001 20:41 GMT

Someone recently ported the half-life radiosity utils over to Quake, have a look about in last three weeks news and you'll prolly find it. The original lighting utils does not support any kind of bouncing.

#1747 Posted by Asriel [203.79.75.66], 20/10/2001 06:41 GMT , Refers to Post #1745

You will probably have to start map again, or just delete a whole heap of stuff, because if you can't compile it via qoole (does it come with the base qbsp?) the you won't be able to compile it with any other map editor.

Anyone care to elaborate?

Max_submodels Error In Q3 Radiant

#1748 Posted by Glizdu$ [195.205.248.86], 20/10/2001 07:17 GMT

my map contains almost 10000 brushes and 900 entities. when i want to load my map in Q3 (Urban Terror map) max_submodels error shows up. help me !!!

Skining The Md3 Models

#1749 Posted by Glizdu$ [195.205.248.86], 20/10/2001 07:19 GMT

why my mapobjects made in 3D Max Studio does not have skins on in ???

#1750 Posted by pjw [24.4.254.112], 20/10/2001 21:23 GMT , Refers to Post #1748

Clipped from the Q3World Level Editing Forum after searching for "max_submodels":

SUBMODELS are all the entities in your level that have a texture on them, including the trigger texture, such as func_static, trigger_hurt, trigger_teleport, func_door, etc. The hard coded into the .EXE limit for these entities is 256. Ent's that appear in the editor as a cube are not included, just the ones that can have a texture on them, regardless if they are drawn in the game or not.

#1751 Posted by NotoriousRay [4.17.67.90], 21/10/2001 04:27 GMT

so i finished one of the final sections in pbrsp1 today and when i compiled it, theres a weird error where a solid brush exists such that when you walk on it, you fall through. its only a 128unit long a slanted walkway and you only fall through where it meets a flat ground-ish area. anyone seen this before? i have a pretty complex func_wall below it (on the ground, not touched the actual brush). could this be messing it up somehow?

This Happens

#1752 Posted by czg [158.38.54.64], 21/10/2001 14:57 GMT

...at times...

(Sorry if you thought I had an answer... )

#1753 Posted by necros [172.149.52.13], 21/10/2001 15:10 GMT

I hate that error... it's usually caused by some wierd angles which are intersecting the floor with this problem. There are two ways to fix this. 1. Delete it all, and restart, or 2. Make any fancy walls, or anything you may thing which is causing this, into func_walls (these won't interfer with the world brush). Simply cover the back of the func_walls with a brush so it doesn't leak, and compile. do this until the problem goes away... sorry, but this is the only way i found of 'fixing' it.

#1754 Posted by Tyrann [203.56.239.112], 21/10/2001 18:20 GMT , Refers to Post #1751

Try placing a clip brush a pixel or two above the problem area. The player won't notice that they're walking a pixel or so higher and it usually does the trick.

#1755 Posted by venomus [152.163.197.209], 21/10/2001 20:57 GMT

Ummm can't find the post but thanx for your reply to my request for bounce-supporting radiosity program CZG! This (q1rad) is excellent! Half_life style environment (sky) lighting! Texture lights! All you Q1 mappers who don't know what I'm ranting about have to try this!

GL Settings

#1756 Posted by Jaj [62.83.163.37], 25/10/2001 23:17 GMT

This is not exactly a "mapping question", but a technical one.

I'm trying to tune up my graphic card, an old TNT and i don't know exactly how it works "Buffer flipping mode" and what exactly is "Vertical sync." that appears in the Open GL settings menu.

Thanks, and if someone want to explain more related concepts... perfect!, because i'm a bit confused with all these concepts.

Re: GL Settings

#1757 Posted by necros [172.186.136.83], 26/10/2001 00:21 GMT

Vertical Sync: When it's on, the max refresh rate (frame rate) will be sync'ed to your monitor's refresh rate (Most are between 60 to 80 Hz i believe). Obviously, some people prolly want more (me, 80 fps is great, but some people just want more). Disabling vsync will get you much better frame rates (I can get 250 FPS in TomazQuake!!!

) but at the risk that it could damage yer monitor... I've never seen this happen, but i've read that it can.

I'm not fomiliar with Buffer Flipping Mode, though... sorry =\ I think it has something to do with the way the card buffers the video in it's ram, but i could be talking out of my ass... i believe there are two settings: "Use block transfer" and "Use Page Flip". Just try switching between the two and see...

I don't know If TNT cards have this, but if your looking for performance, consider disable FSAA (Full Screen Anti-Aliasing). This will signifigantly improve frame rate.

#1758 Posted by cyBeAr [213.64.67.243], 26/10/2001 07:35 GMT

The electron gun/cannon updating your screen starts at the top of your screen and then goes down row by row updating the screen.

With vsync on the image in your videomemory won't be displayed on the screen until the gun has drawn one full screen and restarted at top. Your videocard is however likely to compute new frames either faster or slower than the monitor refresh.

With vsync off the electron gun will start using information from a new frame as soon as that exists wich will result in that the image will be updated at the pace your cpu/videocard manages to keep. This might however result in that one screen consists of several frames (for example top half shows one frame and bottom the next frame) wich might not always look good.

I don't think the biggest "problem" with vsync lies with fps being higher than the monitor refresh rate but when it's lower than the refresh rate. If it takes 1.5 monitor refreshes for a new frame to be drawn to video memory the screen will only be updated every 2nd vertical retrace.

(Hmm now this is such a mess i don't know what to say, suppose I should make some kind of summary..)

The choice to have vsync on or off is most important for lower fps,

vsync on: the visible fps might become lower than what your computer setup is capable of
vsync off: Might not look good if fps is fairly low since you'll be able to actually see different frames on screen at the same time

I've never heard anything about disabling vsync might damage your monitor.

Re: GL Settings

#1759 Posted by Gilt [207.245.223.94], 26/10/2001 15:25 GMT

When I was learning about video cards I found this site to be very helpful...

Double Buffering, Page Flipping, & Unchained Mode

Thank You Guys

#1760 Posted by Jaj [62.83.166.171], 27/10/2001 00:46 GMT

Now i understand better all those concepts.
And Gilt, good link

Reducing Brushes&r_speeds

#1761 Posted by Jaj [62.83.168.78], 01/11/2001 22:44 GMT

Well, i'm making a Quake1 level and in order to reduce the number of brushes and consequently the r_speeds, i'm combinating some texes.
But i have this doubt: When you put on a brush, a texture of, let's say "160 (units height)*128 (units width)", then the Quake engine will split that brush into 2, being the same using two brushes with the 2 texes for each one, that one only brush with the 160*128 texture, and being the same for the r_speeds.

Note: I'm not sure if it could be each 128 units or each 256. ;p

Please Tell Me...

#1762 Posted by kanaeda [207.67.87.176], 03/11/2001 16:27 GMT

how tall is mr. dick knuckle (q1 marine), and at what height is the camera set?

Hmm, No Title

#1763 Posted by XeNoN [195.8.79.126], 03/11/2001 18:00 GMT

how tall is mr. dick knuckle (q1 marine), and at what height is the camera set?

His name is Phil, you ass :P
And he's 64 units tall... not sure of his eye-height though

#1764 Posted by cyBeAr [213.64.67.243], 03/11/2001 21:35 GMT , Refers to Post #1763

he's not that high

#1765 Posted by Fat Controller [203.79.109.168], 03/11/2001 23:27 GMT

I think the good Richard "Skippy" Knuckle stands about 56 units tall, with an eye height maybe 48 units high. I'm unsure but I think he's about 40-something units wide.

#1766 Posted by kanaeda [207.67.87.176], 04/11/2001 00:01 GMT

Phil is the nehahra marine. totally different animal from the old-skool, battle hardened corproal Knuckle. :)

thanks a bunch guys. this info will be put to very good use.

Yeah, Yeah...

#1767 Posted by XeNoN [212.126.136.183], 04/11/2001 00:06 GMT

I thought the old version was "Ranger" anyway?

#1768 Posted by kanaeda [207.67.87.176], 04/11/2001 00:58 GMT

ranger is the silly cloned version they tossed into q3:a. he doesn't come close to comparing to the real thing. ;p

#1769 Posted by Scampie [206.152.135.94], 04/11/2001 03:58 GMT

i always thought his name was captian buckethead

Dilvish Is Still Working On A Title

#1770 Posted by Dilvish [172.188.32.26], 04/11/2001 13:22 GMT

Richard "Skippy" Knuckle stands about 56 units tall, with an eye height maybe 48 units high
that would give him a forehead 8 units high! Didn't know Boris Karloff had the main role in Q1!

Who Needs A Title Anyway

#1771 Posted by Fat Controller [203.96.147.123], 04/11/2001 22:23 GMT , Refers to Post #1770

Well, I'm just guessing about his eye level.

It Does Seem About Right

#1772 Posted by kanaeda [207.67.87.176], 04/11/2001 22:44 GMT , Refers to Post #1771

so i'd say it was a damn good guess. mostly likely educated even.

Hey, It Was Too

#1773 Posted by Fat Controller [203.79.95.38], 04/11/2001 22:51 GMT

Just went for a walk around in Quake, and my eyeline is close as dammit to 48 units off the ground. It's actually a little bit less, but no matter.

#1774 Posted by joco50 [12.74.22.82], 05/11/2001 00:32 GMT

My map compiles,but when I try to run it I get "Error: PF_SETMODEL:NULL". Using QERadientb147 (Lazarus), Quake2 map. Can you please tell me what causes this error? Thanks.

Speedy Is Still Working On A Title

#1775 Posted by Speedy [213.221.48.32], 05/11/2001 02:50 GMT

eye level ! that is one insane map

Texture Alert

#1776 Posted by Biff_Debris [12.93.209.34], 05/11/2001 02:57 GMT

Anyone know where I can get some q1 bathroom-tile tex? Im remember there being some halfway-decent ones in the old QED texture pack, but theyre site isn't up anymore...

And YES, there will be a toilet in imp1sp3 =)

Q2 Textures

#1777 Posted by Electro [210.50.32.111], 05/11/2001 10:12 GMT

anyone know where i can get a wad of the q2 textures for q1?

Q1 Player Specifics

#1778 Posted by The Lieutenant [144.32.177.168], 05/11/2001 12:54 GMT

The Quake1 player is exactly 32x32x56 in size. His eye level is 22 units above his origin, which is 24 units above the ground, for a big 46 unit-height eye level, which of course bobs slightly.

Interestingly though, the player seems to require gap wider than 32 units to be able to pass through it, even though the QC gives his size as 32x32...

#1779 Posted by czg [158.38.54.76], 05/11/2001 15:12 GMT

The player is 36 units fat

#1780 Posted by XeNoN [212.219.57.59], 05/11/2001 16:14 GMT , Refers to Post #1777

Do you have q2? There's a small utility you can use to extract and convert them yourself if you have the game. If so, I can email it to you when I get home if you want. If not, its best just extracting them from various custom Q1 levels

#1781 Posted by DaZ [213.122.127.222], 05/11/2001 16:55 GMT

theres the easy way :

Use Worldcrafts built in texture extractor...

And yes it does work!

#1782 Posted by kanaeda [207.67.87.176], 05/11/2001 18:55 GMT

you should be able to get them thru opiates texture site on PQ if any of the links still work. the sunet.com (sweden) ftp should still be working. i was able to get a bunch of really old quake maps thru that server.

#1783 Posted by The Lieutenant [144.32.128.132], 05/11/2001 19:30 GMT , Refers to Post #1779

in defs.qc:

VEC_HULL_MIN = '-16 -16 -24';
VEC_HULL_MAX = '16 16 32';

Clipping Hull Sizes

#1784 Posted by metlslime [24.4.254.155], 06/11/2001 05:41 GMT

vec3_t hull_size[3][2] = {
{ {0, 0, 0}, {0, 0, 0} },
{ {-16,-16,-32}, {16,16,24} },
{ {-32,-32,-64}, {32,32,24} }

};

(taken from qbsp\brush.c)

Collision detection between an entity and the world is done by treating the entity as a point and colliding it against one of the two clipping hulls (one for player sized ents and one for shambler sized ents.)

The clipping hulls are created by running the bsp process again on 'expanded' brushes, i.e. brushes where each brushface (which is actually an infinite plane) is expandaed outward a certain distance, determined by the hull_size array. The actual function to do this is ExpandBrush. An excerpt:

for (i=0 ; i<numbrushfaces ; i++)
{
p = &faces[i].plane;
VectorCopy (vec3_origin, corner);
for (x=0 ; x<3 ; x++)
{
if (p->normal[x] > 0)
corner[x] = hull_size[hullnum][1][x];
else if (p->normal[x] < 0)
corner[x] = hull_size[hullnum][0][x];
}
p->dist += DotProduct (corner, p->normal);
}

As for why a 32-wide player can't walk through a 32-wide doorway, i guess the reason is that if you have two opposing brushfaces 32 units apart, and each one is moved 16 units towards the other, then you end up with two brushes touching each other. Qbsp seals zero-width gaps between brushes, of course, and even a point-sized entity can't pass through a solid wall.

Re: Clipping Hull Sizes

#1785 Posted by Tyrann [203.56.239.112], 06/11/2001 13:23 GMT , Refers to Post #1784

Thanks Metlslime, that's a great explanation!

Quark Help!

#1786 Posted by Timberwolf [195.121.231.81], 06/11/2001 22:00 GMT

Question on quark:
Can somebody tell me how I can put a .tga file on a box? Because when I choose a .tga file I've downloaded I get an error that says its not a tga file. And something with special past.. Please help!

#1787 Posted by R.P.G. [64.12.104.46], 06/11/2001 22:23 GMT , Refers to Post #1784

I wish I could conf00se people like that.

#1788 Posted by project [63.178.120.214], 06/11/2001 23:19 GMT

i get the following error...
ERROR:cmod_loadbrushmodel:
maps/X.bsp has wrong version number
(xxx should be 38)

???
also, what editor would you reccommend?
where can I find it? I've been hitting a lot of links to nowhere these days...

#1789 Posted by XeNoN [212.126.136.127], 07/11/2001 00:28 GMT , Refers to Post #1788

It'd help alot if you said what game... there are many mapped for round these parts...

Opening Q3radient

#1790 Posted by cmo [61.9.157.161], 07/11/2001 04:12 GMT , Refers to Post #1789

when i open q3radient it looks for a .prj or .qe4 file, i dont have any and its the first time ive run it.

any ideas O_o?

#1791 Posted by metlslime [24.4.254.155], 07/11/2001 06:24 GMT

i guess i forgot to mention that the second chunk of code is also taken from qbsp\brush.c.

No Qe4 File

#1792 Posted by Shallow[BAP] [212.135.236.122], 07/11/2001 09:47 GMT , Refers to Post #1790

Usually this seems to happen where people have downloaded an old patch version of q3radiant instead of a full install. Go to QERadiant.com and dig out the latest version of GTKRadiant.

#1793 Posted by project [168.191.115.86], 07/11/2001 11:30 GMT , Refers to Post #1789

im mapping for for quake II using qoole.

#1794 Posted by Requiem [24.127.29.20], 08/11/2001 07:22 GMT

I've tried a couple different front-ends for compiling my latest Quake2 creation under WindowsXP but alas nothing happens. A Dos-Box is created and then terminates just as quickly.

I can compile the map using QERadiant 147 and I could compile the map launching the DeWan compilers separately from the command prompt. Any idea why front-ends like Q2Beaver and Q2Compile Center aren't working in WindowsXP?

BTW, XP is using NTFS in case that has anything to do with it.

If you respond, please email me at rqm@planetquake.com just in case I don't get to return to the board asap.

#1795 Posted by palldjon@i-cafe [61.9.128.142], 10/11/2001 06:56 GMT , Refers to Post #1776

You've prolly had an answer on #rtf but why not try the fat one's site. Hooligan Circus had some tile and plumbing texes. Fatty used 'em in OUM if I remember correctly. One of the HFX wads also had a crateload of tiles.

Imp1sp3 ?????? I thought you were moving over to a Q2 project. If you're still keen on Quake the door is still open at The 0ther 0peration

. Oh, I'll be up for a test on Imp1sp3 if you need

Hmm, No Title

#1796 Posted by gibbie [213.46.20.56], 10/11/2001 17:47 GMT

Timberwolf:
open pic in photoshop or something, select all, ctrl-c.
then goto quarks texture browser and paste it in a subdir.
rename and use in your maps.

thats how i do it :)

Hmm, No Title

#1797 Posted by gibbie [213.46.20.56], 10/11/2001 17:47 GMT

Timberwolf:
open pic in photoshop or something, select all, ctrl-c.
then goto quarks texture browser and paste it in a subdir.
rename and use in your maps.

thats how i do it :)

#1798 Posted by necros [172.153.200.92], 10/11/2001 21:47 GMT

you can just press f3 and then select all the files to import... They have to be bmps though... i just run a batch to convert all the textures to bmp format, then import em into quark.

Beta Testing

#1799 Posted by Cygnus-x1 [213.93.162.164], 10/11/2001 22:50 GMT

So I made a q2tdm map :)

I would apreciate feedback so I can improve.
Many thanks

.tga Has His Own File-format Now!!??

#1800 Posted by DeFrag [66.152.71.4], 13/11/2001 07:08 GMT

Speedy Is Still Working On A Title

#1801 Posted by Speedy [213.221.48.180], 14/11/2001 04:00 GMT

Morpheus Playtesters?

#1802 Posted by Nobski [203.134.46.70], 15/11/2001 01:09 GMT

Hey all,
I was wondering if anybody is interested in playtesting my conversion of Unreal's Morpheus? I haven't 'vised' it yet due to time limitation's and my computer, I'll vis it if everything is close to perfect though.... I need playtester's to find problem's with it. (If someone has a beast of a computer and would like to help in it's compiling, give me a yell).
The map file is available if needed.
Ahwell gg,
Cheers

Nobski

#1803 Posted by necros [172.142.41.20], 15/11/2001 02:00 GMT , Refers to Post #1802

You'd better vis the level anyway. No one wants to play a slideshow.

But when you do, just send me a link, and I'll test it.

#1804 Posted by DaZ [213.122.121.246], 15/11/2001 14:34 GMT

Vis'ing in the unreal engine takes no time at all. I re-compiled dm-fractal by accident and it took about a minute... Thats light, bsp, vis, everything...

Mind you, fractal is a very small map

#1805 Posted by Starbuck [213.122.55.14], 15/11/2001 16:58 GMT

Yeah i'll help test that map for you, i quite liked the unreal version. Just mail me and i'll check it out.
Cheers

#1806 Posted by Nobski [203.134.15.198], 16/11/2001 09:32 GMT

Sorry I didn't specify enough... :)
I converted Morpheus to Quake 1.

Nobski

#1807 Posted by Lunaran [63.237.13.2], 16/11/2001 20:18 GMT

All this talk of player proportions raises the gripping question ... does this red armor make me look fat?!

Who Needs A Title Anyway

#1808 Posted by DeFrag [66.152.70.193], 16/11/2001 20:32 GMT

hehe "No, your face does."

#1809 Posted by The Lieutenant [144.32.128.132], 16/11/2001 21:38 GMT , Refers to Post #1808

#1810 Posted by Asriel [203.79.80.8], 17/11/2001 10:01 GMT

That was off a david spade movie, wasnt it?

Not the red armour bit though.

DeFrag Thought A Title Wasn't Needed

#1811 Posted by DeFrag [66.152.70.32], 17/11/2001 10:42 GMT

Tommy Boy with Spade & the late Farley

Quake 2 Compilers

#1812 Posted by necros [172.148.237.167], 18/11/2001 01:30 GMT

Can someone point me towards a set of

Compilers? I wanted to try this out, and I'm somewhat at a loss...

Stupid Question

#1813 Posted by Edgecrusher [66.19.67.39], 18/11/2001 01:39 GMT

Why is it that when i compile in my level for quake2, everything is fullbright? The level has no leaks

#1814 Posted by necros [172.150.101.129], 18/11/2001 02:12 GMT

Well, i'm not all that versed in Q2 Map making, but In Quake, if you don't put any lights into the level, it will be full bright. Either that, or your not processing the light information... heh.

#1815 Posted by Edgecrusher [64.156.21.246], 18/11/2001 04:00 GMT , Refers to Post #1814

Uh, yeah, i know. The lights work fine in quake, no problem there, but when i try to implement lights in q2 it's to no avail, as it's always fullbright.

Mr Crusher And Mr Necros

#1816 Posted by Vigil [193.229.255.17], 18/11/2001 07:37 GMT

Mr Necros, you can get a set of Q2 compilers here. Just don't use QRAD3, but ArghRad, here.

Mr Crusher, you either haven't VISed your level before lighting it, or you've messed up the settings somehow. Shed some more light on the problem, please. And no pun intended, really.

#1817 Posted by DeFrag [66.152.70.222], 18/11/2001 07:42 GMT

MS Flight Simulator Pro 2002 now shipping with gmax!

Lucky for me I just bought MSFSP2K2 last week!

Help Wanted

#1818 Posted by Ramu [195.82.219.217], 18/11/2001 10:53 GMT

i do not have enny ideas. I try to focus more on gamplay now, but I do not have the ideas. I want to create something new, something that havent been done before.

Thanks, Vigil,

#1819 Posted by necros [172.156.121.239], 18/11/2001 15:36 GMT , Refers to Post #1816

but it appears www.planetquake.com/radiosity is broken.

Problem With Coagula Map!

#1820 Posted by Starbuck [213.122.111.83], 18/11/2001 19:08 GMT

here is the problem i have:

my map has been practically finished for about a week, the "only" things i have had to do since then are bug fixes and final compiles. Well, i ironed out the bugs and got everything sorted, so now if you run a problem check in WC all that comes out are the standard 'unused keyvalues' for entities garbage, so all appears to be fine.

run wqbsp and you get no problems,
run tomlite and everything is goodo
but run a full vis and what happens?
...Well, the base vis is calculated just fine in about 1/2 an hour or so, and then the full vising begins:
All is fine up to about 8% of the operation (around 3500 of 37000) but then the process slows down tremendously:
I left it going overnight and in the morning it had got to.......13%! Using only fast-vis isnt an option as the map is too big for fast vis and causes a 'vismap expansion overflow' error....

Any suggestions? Otherwise I will have to pull out of the competition because obviously an unvised void map isnt gonna run at an acceptable rate

Also, if anyone with a good computer would be willing to actually vis it, i'd be very grateful indeed

Please help! thanks!

#1821 Posted by Scampie [206.152.135.94], 18/11/2001 22:33 GMT , Refers to Post #1820

i'll donate my 1ghz athlon to vising your map.

if you want me to, just slap me in #tf

#1822 Posted by ChilloMonkey [64.160.200.30], 19/11/2001 00:10 GMT

Horde link is in neeed of some maps. I have created an all new .wad file for this purpose. If you can map, please let me reply. What I am looking for is a mapper who is willing to make a few maps for a game project. There will be many prefabs, and the style of maps will be futuristic. If you have any other questions, reply.

Why I Can't See The Triangles

#1823 Posted by KQ [211.100.0.34], 19/11/2001 03:44 GMT

I loaded a map with the devmap command and typed /r_showtris in the console, but nothing changed, no triangle was shown. Could anybody tell me why's that and how can I get rid of it?

#1824 Posted by pjw [24.4.254.112], 19/11/2001 04:10 GMT , Refers to Post #1823

I assume you're talking about Quake 3, and I assume that you're running the latest point release (1.30). If these assumptions are both true, then you also need to enter "/developer 1" at the console in order to enable showtris. This is the result of some anti-cheat measures that were implemented in 1.30. Hope this helps.

#1825 Posted by necros [172.149.107.113], 19/11/2001 22:50 GMT

Why is it that visage always slows down after a while... I never really understood that. I assume it has to do with the way Vis orders the calculations...

Anyway, I can also vis yer map for ya, Starbuck, if scampie's unavailable.

Thanks Necros

#1826 Posted by Starbuck [213.122.131.192], 19/11/2001 23:48 GMT

scampie is availible though and is vising the map at this moment i think

Hehe the thing is that with this map, the visage doesn't just slow down on my computer, it just hits a 3 foot thick brick wall at about 3500 portals. I don't know why vis slows in general though, but theres always SPoG ;)

#1827 Posted by Scampie [206.152.135.94], 20/11/2001 08:08 GMT

bout 15 hours into vising Starbuck's map... with 45% done! woo.

Thank You Pjw

#1828 Posted by KQ [211.100.0.34], 20/11/2001 08:57 GMT , Refers to Post #1824

Though I'm new to 3d mapping, I'v already found a lot of fun. Thanks for your help!

Why Vis Slows Down

#1829 Posted by czg [158.38.54.26], 20/11/2001 09:13 GMT

(I think, might be a bit off.)
If you run most vis'es with the -verbose option you'll see it dumping lots of crap like "Portal 1234: MightSee 345, canSee 123." which means Portal 1234 has the posibility of seeing through 345 other portals (or leafs, it might be couting leafs instead.) , but really can only see 123.
Now this is the bit I'm uncertain about:
Either Vis goes through the bsp tree from the bottom and up, looking down towards the trunk for possible visible leafs/portals,
or it goes from the tip of the branches down towards the bottom, looking up to the sky.
Either way the first portals it goes through will only have a very small MightSee, (You can notice this with the -verbose option, it starts on MightSee 0 or 1 and goes step by step up.) and thus is easier to compute CanSee for. As it progresses, and you get up to MightSee <insert very high number here> it will ofcourse slow down. When it does happen that it stumbles onto a MightSee with a CanSee of 12 or something though, it will ofcourse go a bit quicker for that one portal, but then it's back to the slowing down again...

Codemonkeys attack!

#1830 Posted by Scampie [206.152.135.94], 20/11/2001 18:16 GMT

Starbuck, you may have made a new champion for the "how long vis will take"

hope there are no more bugs in the map ;D

#1831 Posted by XeNoN [194.117.133.196], 20/11/2001 18:59 GMT

Nice color change btw :)

And theres always neh3m2 and kasteel...

Loser And Still Chump-een

#1832 Posted by Fat Controller [203.96.147.166], 20/11/2001 19:46 GMT , Refers to Post #1830

Starbuck, you may have made a new champion for the "how long vis will take"

Just remember my dear old Towne took 41 hours 28 minutes 28 seconds. J00 ain't even touched muh harfway mark, boyee...

#1833 Posted by Dilvish [172.188.120.166], 20/11/2001 20:14 GMT

I'm sure Starbuck's map isn't even worth a rat's turd. Why don't you scramble it a little with,let's see... dunno, fucked-up textures, irregular brushes, sodomistic ogres, anything, it's up to you, you can only make it better anyway.

/me hides in the Chunnel expecting Starbuck's outraged scream at seeing the truth about his mapping "talents" revealed at last

Another Q2 Mapping Question...

#1834 Posted by necros [172.159.41.183], 20/11/2001 22:02 GMT

How the heck do you get QBSP3 to accept new textures? I always crashes with an illegal function call when I use new texs, but when I use stock Id ones, it compiles fine.

#1835 Posted by necros [172.159.41.183], 20/11/2001 22:03 GMT , Refers to Post #1834

*It always crashes...

#1836 Posted by Starbuck [213.122.50.83], 20/11/2001 22:49 GMT , Refers to Post #1830

im sorry vising is taking a ridiculously long time as this scamp, but i do really appreciate you taking the time to help out, dude

p.s. nice to see you getting touch with your feminine side btw hehe

#1837 Posted by Starbuck [213.122.50.83], 20/11/2001 23:05 GMT

I'm sure Starbuck's map isn't even worth a rat's turd. Why don't you scramble it a little with,let's see... dunno, fucked-up textures, irregular brushes, sodomistic ogres, anything, it's up to you, you can only make it better anyway.

/me hides in the Chunnel expecting Starbuck's outraged scream at seeing the truth about his mapping "talents" revealed at last

gee, thanks Dilvish, way to make me feel depressed! And thanks also for threatening to kill me in the Coagula thread!

Hopefully He Was Kidding,

#1838 Posted by necros [172.159.41.183], 20/11/2001 23:09 GMT , Refers to Post #1837

in anycase, let's leave this up to the judges, eh?

Let's see some sportsman ship here, people!

#1839 Posted by necros [172.159.41.183], 20/11/2001 23:15 GMT , Refers to Post #1836

Don't worry about the visage. I really don't give a rat's ass how long it takes to compile, just as long as it eventually get's done. I want to see as many entries as the next guy, and I'm curious about what map could make 35000 vis portals.

#1840 Posted by The Lieutenant [144.32.128.132], 20/11/2001 23:23 GMT

I thought Aard held the VISing record of 29 days or something?

#1841 Posted by Starbuck [213.122.50.83], 20/11/2001 23:34 GMT , Refers to Post #1839

lol..im curious why my map has 35000 vis portals too =)
Oh and its good to hear you think that way

#1842 Posted by necros [172.153.101.99], 21/11/2001 00:55 GMT

Anyone have any tips when converting Q1 textures to Q2? Quake2's palette is so different from Quake's that the textures look absolutly horrendous.

Can I maybe put quake's palette in quake2?

#1843 Posted by Scampie [206.152.135.94], 21/11/2001 03:51 GMT

this is fun... =) the vis seems to be slowing down! =) THE PROGRESS COUNTER LIES!

#1844 Posted by Scampie [206.152.135.94], 21/11/2001 04:58 GMT

i just quickly peeked at your map again while vising... and there is a sortof large error... you know the area where you have to kill the orges before going to get the gold key? the door from the floor below opens when you run over where it is and it pokes thru the floor about 32 pixels :|

i'll leave vis going tonight, but if you want to fix the error, i'll stop and restart (if I do, would you mind me looking thru the .map and seeing if I can help the vis time?)

#1845 Posted by Scampie [206.152.135.94], 21/11/2001 05:50 GMT , Refers to Post #1844

nm... BSOD killed the vis... :(

fix the error. i'm going to search for a copy of netvis (network capable vis utility :D)

we'll get your map compiled! even if it takes forever.

Don't Worry, Starbie

#1846 Posted by Dilvish [172.190.195.87], 21/11/2001 06:53 GMT

I'm only joking.

#1847 Posted by XeNoN [212.219.57.59], 21/11/2001 13:36 GMT

Scared of being beaten?

And Fatty, take A hike... I'm sure I mentioned that neh3m3 took over 8 days, and Aard's "Kasteel" went on for 5 weeks (on a low PC mind...) So j00 aint even gotten anywhere yet!

nm... my personal record is only 9 hours.

#1848 Posted by Starbuck [213.122.154.159], 21/11/2001 17:33 GMT

the vis got killed? *cries*
in that case i'll definately fix the bug...
hope there arent any more though :)
maybe i should get someone to check it through as well
Do you still want the .map?
(or the .rmf, but if i remember correctly you use qer?)

#1849 Posted by Starbuck [213.122.154.159], 21/11/2001 17:33 GMT

my god, that last post was incoherent

If You Want To Try Yet

#1850 Posted by aguirRe [195.163.202.185], 21/11/2001 18:08 GMT , Refers to Post #1843

another version of RVis that makes a serious attempt to display useful progress information without delaying the overall process, take a look at my pathetic homepage at http://user.tninet.se/~xir870k

The generated BSP output is of course exactly the same as the original RVis.

#1851 Posted by Dilvish [172.190.17.57], 21/11/2001 18:20 GMT

I'd rather appear to be the yellow-streak-down-the-back guy than the bad guy, that's all :)))

#1852 Posted by Scampie [206.152.135.94], 21/11/2001 19:11 GMT , Refers to Post #1848

i use WC so rmf will be good. i bet a little magic and tender lovin can reduce at LEAST 1 portal =)

#1853 Posted by Lunaran [64.109.168.131], 21/11/2001 23:06 GMT

You're not allowed to claim any vis time records; your computer runs on peat, aye? :)

Speedy Is Still Working On A Title

#1854 Posted by Speedy [213.172.2.185], 22/11/2001 02:39 GMT

ok kids. Me to the rescue
I`ll youse my majik to vis your map in no time. A dash of speed, you know..

But no guarantee - if the map has errors I wont be able to help.
Send me the .map/wad.
No joke

RTCW Map Editing

#1855 Posted by Gandhi [194.18.231.22], 22/11/2001 10:10 GMT

anyone know what tools i need to make rtcw maps (i'm guessing qeradiant). since i skipped the whole q3 thing i'm a bit lagged :) any good pages that cover this?

#1856 Posted by Starbuck [213.122.11.205], 22/11/2001 20:04 GMT

i cant find you! come on terrafusion so i can send you all the shit!

For The Record...

#1857 Posted by O-face [24.51.105.241], 22/11/2001 21:18 GMT

Aard's Kasteel map took 5 weeks to vis on an UltraSparc server (fast, expensive 64bit UNIX server made by Sun). And that was for a level 2 vis. I think he holds the record, for now.

I... I... I...

#1858 Posted by Tronyn. [24.66.247.146], 23/11/2001 03:35 GMT

help me
jesus oh my god

if i can ever put together a coherent description of the size-induced problems with nj1 and nj2, i will post it here. these are the largest maps i have ever made, and they, have problems! haha!

how the HELL does czg manage to make such big maps.

Who Needs A Title Anyway

#1859 Posted by Edgecrusher [67.25.165.54], 23/11/2001 04:52 GMT , Refers to Post #1858

hehe, this map is goodfun

#1860 Posted by Scampie [206.152.135.94], 23/11/2001 20:25 GMT

a manged to chop about 3000 portals just by cleaning up the brushwork and chopping the large pile of crates in the gold key room (complete with vis killing little pixel wide gaps everywhere). few othe minor things as well... (Starbuck, we're going to have a chat about clean mapping ;)

but I can't make it perfect... there are still loads of portals and the vis is going to still take a week i'd say. there are just a bunch of portals that take forever for vis to optimise... woowoo fun.

Starbuck, I suggest you just light the current .bsp I have and submit it to the contest... then we can release the vis'd map when it's done.

Damn You SB

#1861 Posted by Speedy [213.172.2.26], 24/11/2001 01:52 GMT

if you want a map to be vised as soon as I get it just give a d/l location with a map and wad (much better than mailing it to me).

Could Use Some Help

#1862 Posted by necros [172.162.22.233], 24/11/2001 01:55 GMT

with beta testing that Q2DM I was flaunting around in the screen shot thread...
Email me for a link.

#1863 Posted by Scampie [206.152.135.94], 25/11/2001 05:48 GMT

i give up. fucking computer doesn't like long vis's.

#1864 Posted by Joey j. [202.161.127.18], 26/11/2001 13:09 GMT

Duke3d's Build Can do all that stuff...

yes....

DUKE3D!!

#1865 Posted by DaZ [213.122.61.58], 26/11/2001 16:36 GMT

can you download that anywhere, no not warez, but legally?

Most Likely

#1866 Posted by kanaeda [207.67.87.176], 26/11/2001 17:06 GMT , Refers to Post #1855

seeing as how RTCW was recently released, there aren't any publicly available editing tools. most essential piece would be the entity .def file for wolf as opposed to q3:a. they might have some unique features added to q3r that are game specific, as well. there's also the possibility of custom texture format exporters for photoshop... and if they're like the guys at Ritual they might have added new shader functions.

#1867 Posted by Shadowdane [208.203.4.100], 26/11/2001 20:11 GMT , Refers to Post #1865

i found a copy of that at CompUSA in the bargin bin for $2.95! :)

only problem is that I cant seem to get the sound to work on WinXP. oh well.. any windows ports of Duke3d out???

#1868 Posted by kanaeda [207.67.87.176], 26/11/2001 20:54 GMT

same thing happened when i tried to load up duke 2 on my new machine. stupid sblive and it's lack of DOS drivers. kinda wish i had kept my A3D card.

#1869 Posted by cyBeAr [213.64.67.243], 26/11/2001 22:23 GMT

No funny formats there.

If I remember right grey matter used their own version of radiant for wolf and hopefully that will be released otherwise there'll probably be some sort of wolf suport for gtkrad.

Let's just hope we get the ability to make mods and script docs and any tools that might be needed.

#1870 Posted by Starbuck [213.122.79.164], 27/11/2001 17:50 GMT

scampie could you email me your rmf and ill light it and leave it

#1871 Posted by infidel [217.10.132.19], 29/11/2001 17:12 GMT , Refers to Post #1855

There's a link on the QMap front page - or it may have been Bluesnews - can't remember. But there's a kit and manual detailing how to use GtkRadiant to make RtCW maps.

Mapconv.exe

#1872 Posted by necros [172.136.75.6], 01/12/2001 22:53 GMT

Ok. I write this:
mapconv -toq1 ne1_q2dm.map ne1_q1dm.map

and mapconv spits out this:
------ Map File Convert ------
Version 1.2.2 Build 38
written by Kristian Duske
Email: k.duske@gmx.net
WWW: http://www.planetquake.com/rem
------------------------------
Using mode Q2 > Q1
Parsing File ne1_q2dm.map ...

Then it justs sits there... forever. Is there certain lines that aren't accepted by mapconv.exe?

#1873 Posted by cyBeAr [213.64.67.243], 02/12/2001 01:52 GMT

I dunno really, I've only used it for maps that have been intended for quake all the time so I don't have any experience converting actual q2 maps (I'd guess that's what you're doing).

Ah, Got It.

#1874 Posted by necros [172.168.101.84], 02/12/2001 02:52 GMT

It appears Quark is just stupid when it exports .map files. I imported it into QER and it worked out fine. Dunno why, but if SleepwalkR reads this, he may want to take that down as some kind of silly bug incompatibility...

#1875 Posted by inertia_ [24.164.64.185], 02/12/2001 23:15 GMT

3d Studio To Quake Map

#1876 Posted by jonny seed [203.29.47.1], 04/12/2001 03:45 GMT

hi everyone..

could anyone tell me if there is a plug-in for 3d studio max. that converts a map made in 3ds to quake 3..

any help would be great..

regards
Jonny.

#1877 Posted by H-Hour [65.101.212.45], 04/12/2001 05:14 GMT

I feel stupid enough for having to ask this, but I've never done much MP mapping... in Q2, how do I make the deathmatch spawn points NOT have that little spawn platform?

#1878 Posted by Fat Controller [203.79.109.92], 04/12/2001 06:34 GMT , Refers to Post #1877

The trick is to sink them a small amount into the floor (8 units?) so the platform's hidden.

#1879 Posted by H-Hour [65.101.212.45], 04/12/2001 07:09 GMT

#1880 Posted by infidel [217.10.132.19], 04/12/2001 16:24 GMT , Refers to Post #1876

Dunno, but G MAX (which is either coming out soon, or is already available - free) can output as a .bsp, I think. It's one of the examples they're using to sell G MAX to developers as a development tool, so they'll support it in their products.

As for when this will be available (if G MAX isn't yet), I don't know. It may never be - they may just be using it for demonstration purposes. But it is possible.

I hope that made sense - I swear my grasp of the English language is declining by the day...

Q3Radiant .def Files

#1881 Posted by infidel [217.10.132.19], 04/12/2001 16:25 GMT

I need to get my hands on the .def files for Team Arena and CCTF (Threewave CTF). Anyone know where I might get hold of them?

Cheers,
infidel

Anyone Want To Fix A Leak For Me?

#1882 Posted by Asriel [203.79.80.3], 04/12/2001 23:16 GMT

Quake 1 Map

#1883 Posted by simon [210.74.190.241], 05/12/2001 02:39 GMT

i want to know how to install the map file to my QUAKE directory. i know the file is .bsp. but after copy it . noting found newly.
pls .tell me why.

#1884 Posted by Scampie [206.152.135.94], 05/12/2001 03:22 GMT , Refers to Post #1883

You need to put the .bsp in the quake/id1/maps directory. Then you can run it in quake by typing 'map [filename of the map without the .bsp extension]'

Bots + Q2 + DM

#1885 Posted by H-Hour [65.101.212.45], 05/12/2001 20:17 GMT

Anybody wanna give me some info, point me in the direction of some downloads/tutorials? It seems Eraser bots are the best, at least the only name I've heard, but I've been unable to find a download(the frag.com site says it's down). I'd also like to find some tuts on how to set up .aas files and what not. I'm completely new to this whole DM thing, so I could use the help of anyone.

Thanks.

Hmm, No Title

#1886 Posted by Speedy [213.172.3.88], 06/12/2001 01:52 GMT

http://www.botepidemic.com/gladiator - prolly the best q2 bot (by Mr Elusive).
Still it sucks, the hardest one on the top skill is easy to beat with 50 -5 score on q2dm1.

Search botepidemic for other bots.

Hmm, No Title

#1887 Posted by DeFrag [66.152.70.204], 06/12/2001 03:05 GMT

I've got both bots avail for download from my FTP. ICQ meh & I'll hook yup. #45772874 between 1800-0000 PST

#1888 Posted by Speedy [213.172.2.52], 06/12/2001 03:55 GMT

check this tutorial on optimising your brushwork. Its for q2, but alot of things are same for all q1/q2 based games.
Check it Starbuck ;)

Good Day Sir

#1889 Posted by [Tronyn] [24.66.247.146], 06/12/2001 04:46 GMT

could anyone tell me why Quake insists on booting me out like a rejected whore when I attempt to run my map? That is, it says, 'Error: bad surface extents.'

I finally get this map to compile, and this is the thanks I get!!!

Tronyn Sans [ ]...

#1890 Posted by palldjon [203.29.11.38], 06/12/2001 06:57 GMT

Does this exchange between Jimbo and Tyrann help?

JIMBO:
Can ANYONE HELP?
Using "iklite.exe" to lite a q1 map
and I'm getting the following error...

*** BEGIN LIGHT ***

76 entities read
Starting lighting thread.
Lighting 7213 faces total.

*** Error ***
Bad surface extents

What does "Bad surface extents" mean?
(I'm using txqbsp for the main compile
and rvis for the vis.)

TYRANN:
It usually means there's some kind of invalid brush in your map. If not then some particular part of your map is confusing QBSP.

Try to either:
1. find and eliminate the problem brush(es) 2. perhaps just a diferent QBSP will help (but probably not).

JIMBO:
I tried another qbsp(qbsp256) but got lot's of little gaps in the walls I'm thinkin it's the floating point textures so I've decided to:
<br>
1. find and eliminate the problem brush(es)
<br>
By the simple expedient of restoring from backup and rebuilding that section of the map
(`bout 200 brushes).

#1891 Posted by H-Hour [65.101.212.45], 06/12/2001 07:48 GMT

Anybody ever run into really wierd stuff happening with their plats in Q2? Right now I've got one plat that does some very strange things. First, it does this thing where, before going up, it dips down, then goes up. And then before going down, it jumps up, and then goes down. Second, it will slow down to a crawl about 32 units before it hits the height it should be at and creep up, taking up to 5 or 6 seconds just to get the other 32 units. Does anybody know what causes this and how to fix it?

I Really Don't Know

#1892 Posted by czg [158.38.54.63], 06/12/2001 12:54 GMT

But I think Q2 plats have an "acceleration" field or something like that. Knowing this will do you just about nothing good.

#1893 Posted by kanaeda [207.67.87.176], 06/12/2001 15:16 GMT , Refers to Post #1891

would be what czg mentioned. the acceleration key field is really whacky. any time i've changed it very far from the default setting strange things started to happen. try setting the acceleration back to 400 (the default value) if it isn't already. if it is, i'd say ungroup the entity and recreate it.

Bad Textures

#1894 Posted by Jimbo [164.106.40.96], 06/12/2001 16:32 GMT , Refers to Post #1889

Try opening your wad in texmex or whatever and saving it again.

then recompile the map.

That works sometimes when i get that error.

-Jimbo

Bad Surface Extents

#1895 Posted by GlassMan [195.184.253.85], 06/12/2001 16:59 GMT , Refers to Post #1889

I think I've had that when theres been a sky brush overlapping water or lava or something. Check out those kind of brushes.

If You Want To Try Yet

#1896 Posted by aguirRe [195.163.205.202], 06/12/2001 17:43 GMT , Refers to Post #1889

another pair of QBSP compilers, take a look
here.

Thanks Guys

#1897 Posted by [Tronyn] [24.66.247.146], 06/12/2001 17:59 GMT

I'll try those. Actually I wasn't using any textures at all, since QBSP256C is the only compiler that I have that will compile this map, and it won't support multiple texture wads (either that or something similar, but not just the length of the texture entry specified in the .map). so instead of constructing one wad of all the textures from all the wads I used, I decided to just to compile it without textures, just to compile it at all!

so, bizarre brushes, textures, or liquids/skies: the usual suspects :)

Different Map This Time:

#1898 Posted by [Tronyn] [24.66.247.146], 06/12/2001 19:21 GMT

so I get soe1m1 from Xenon, it has a few leaks. so I fix the leaks. so then it says "canonical face: degenerate" or somehing like that, why? BECAUSE TH EMA{ HAS NO LEAKS>!!! if it has leaks it will bsp, if it does not IT WILL NOT! WTF IS THIE SHITTASRIHATEIPHOPHOSRGP!!!!R#QW

#1899 Posted by [Tronyn] [24.66.247.146], 06/12/2001 19:23 GMT

WHY must EVERY SINGLE MAP I make have the gayest most inexplicable errors! I swear of everyone here, I have gotten the most gay, ridiculous, technically IMPOSSIBLE errors.

#1900 Posted by [Tronyn] [24.66.247.146], 06/12/2001 19:26 GMT

WHY must EVERY SINGLE MAP I make have the gayest most inexplicable errors! I swear of everyone here, I have gotten the most gay, ridiculous, technically IMPOSSIBLE errors.

#1901 Posted by XeNoN [194.117.133.196], 06/12/2001 19:44 GMT

I had that error in soe2m1 originally. Maybe some evil force crossed them over before i emailed them....

#1902 Posted by H-Hour [65.101.212.45], 06/12/2001 21:37 GMT

czg and kanaeda.

From The Brains Trust...

#1903 Posted by palldjon [203.29.11.38], 07/12/2001 00:28 GMT , Refers to Post #1898

METLSLIME:
"CanonicalVector: Degenerate"
it's been a while since i looked, but i seem to recall that in the code, after this error, carmack left a comment that said something like "// this should never happen"

FAT CONTROLLER:
Well, It Does
I had this lovely error crop up when Kona was on the OUM crew and I was inserting some door notches into the ends of a twisty corridor. On undoing this work, things went back to normal.

So I'd say there's a very complex lump of brushwork somewhere that QBSP can't make head or tail of, and you'll either have to rethink or simplify whatever brought it on.

GRAHF:
The nearest I can tell, from what the quakelab says and my own experience, is that the CanonicalVector error appears as a result of large scale clipping operations, either in the editor or csg-ing by qbsp. Tough to say for sure though.

CZG:
I have no idea what the error actually means, but I think you should say yourself lucky as it didn't crash the compile as it usually does to me.
Anyway, the best way to get rid of them is to try to compile only half of the map, and see if the error appears then. If it doesn't you'll know that it is in the other half of the map, and you can then compile half of that, and half of that again, until you've narrowed it down to as few brushes as you like. It is most likely some overly complex brush, and when you find the cause of the problem, you'll just have to either delete it and maybe rebuild it, or just try to replace it with something else that works... Sorry I can't be anymore accurate, but I really don't know what this error really means. Maybe some of the engine wizards hanging out here knows? <nudge nudge>

#1904 Posted by [Tronyn] [24.66.247.146], 07/12/2001 03:38 GMT

it's simply a result of the universe conspiring against me.

but at least I'm getting somewhere with my maps, kind of...

CanonicalVector: Degenerate

#1905 Posted by metlslime [12.228.72.232], 07/12/2001 04:27 GMT

Here is what happens in the CanonicalVector() function in tjunc.c: A vector is first normalized (scaled so that its length equals 1.) Then, each component is tested to see if it is longer than 0.001. If the x, y, and z values are all less than 0.001 in length, the vector cannot have length equal to 1, and the vector is degenerate. How could this happen to a normalized vector? Well, if the vector was '0,0,0' to begin with, it would still be zero length after being normalized.

This whole process occurs in the tjunc calculations, once per edge for each face. This vector is the difference between two consecutive points on a face, i.e. two points that would define an edge. So, by my limited understanding of BSP, my guess is this error occurs when one edge of a face has length = zero. Does this sound right, for those of you who have actually had this bug and fixed it?

Re: CanonicalVector: Degenerate

#1906 Posted by Tyrann [203.56.239.112], 07/12/2001 05:46 GMT , Refers to Post #1905

Yes, that's the correct technical description. If you get the bug though, it's caused by either:

a) Your editor made an invalid brush
b) Floating point rounding error ( => random error hell )

Best course of action is to track down the offending brush(es) and start deleting. Brushes where more than three edges meet at a point (e.g. pyramid or cone shapes) are the most likely culpurit.

I Recently Had This Error

#1907 Posted by czg [158.38.54.100], 07/12/2001 16:41 GMT

During the compile of czg05, and it turned out to be one single brush. The brush wasn't very complex at all really, just a wedge that in all forms possible was legit. (Yup, it was legit. I did the patented 'WC clip across the middle of it to see if it deforms' test.) The area it was placed in too wasn't really much to talk about. It was that outdoor area where you emerge up from the underground cave with the slimeflow.
Anyway. Found brush through method of elimination. The error only occured when the map didn't leak, so I boxed in the entire map for test compiles. Deleted brush and replaced it with a similar one. It worked. Too bad the rest of the map sucked like flaming hairy goat feces though.

Sucky sucky.

More Errors :/

#1908 Posted by XeNoN [194.117.133.196], 07/12/2001 18:29 GMT

Can some remind me on the cause and solution of the "Too many portals on a Leaf" error, please?

#1909 Posted by [Tronyn] [24.66.247.146], 07/12/2001 23:04 GMT

well if CZG05 sucked, then that hardly says much for every other map ever released!

Anyway I think I can figure out that vector error, especially thanks to metlslime's description.

#1910 Posted by Speedy [213.172.2.154], 08/12/2001 02:35 GMT

treeqbs doesnt perform t-junk calculation

#1911 Posted by metlslime [12.228.72.232], 08/12/2001 03:14 GMT

but tjunc calculations are good. so you should enable them even if you use treeqbsp, by using -tjunc. Why are tjunc calculations good? two reasons. First, tjunctions can cause 'cracks' between polygons which can ruin the feeling of solidity in a level. Second, for you wankers who use GLquake instead of the glorious winquake, tjunctions will make your underwater warping polygons warp apart from each other, causing hunge HOM gaps and serious overlapping polys. Check out the underwater area in The Crawling Chaos for an example of this.

#1912 Posted by metlslime [12.228.72.232], 08/12/2001 03:15 GMT

in case it wasn't obvious, tjunc calculations are the process that eliminates tjunctions.

#1913 Posted by Speedy [213.172.9.122], 08/12/2001 03:56 GMT

Iv noticed how treeqbsp produces a map with more sparkles.

btw, how do you manage to run winquake not crashing ?

#1914 Posted by metlslime [12.228.72.232], 08/12/2001 04:34 GMT

i use win2k. the only problem i get is my windows color scheme gets a bit corrupted when i exit winquake -- start button is the wrong color, mirc windows are too dark, and toolbars in some apps have messed up colors.

#1915 Posted by [Tronyn] [24.66.247.146], 08/12/2001 21:35 GMT

Oh my god, this is so gay!

WC for some reason decided to handle all entities not in my FGD in this one map, as solid entities. So when I run the map it teleports all of them to the origin and they (being NON solid entities) just sit there, stuck together. is that not the gayest thing you've ever heard?

How would I fix this?

lol, there will be a lot of posts by me here in the next few weeks...

#1916 Posted by [Tronyn] [24.66.247.146], 08/12/2001 22:01 GMT

I defeated it by reverting to an old map which had the entities, while they were still entites, and systematically getting all of them and all of the solids in the new maps and replacing them.

that was very gay sir.

#1917 Posted by Asriel [203.79.80.62], 08/12/2001 23:06 GMT

When i create a brush in WC it doesn't have a top, so I can see inside it. Kinda weird, but this fux0rs qbsp im sure.

I think its to do with how you create your brush, like -64,-64,64 for example. Having made it 'backwards' perhaps.

#1918 Posted by necros [172.173.37.91], 08/12/2001 23:13 GMT , Refers to Post #1915

's why I never use WC, dear Tronyn.

Your probably not interrested in quark, but QER is really cool, and I'd actually map with it if I knew how.

Wc 3.3 Maybe ?

#1919 Posted by Speedy [213.172.2.177], 09/12/2001 01:54 GMT

Thanks For The

#1920 Posted by aguirRe [195.163.203.158], 09/12/2001 02:54 GMT , Refers to Post #1911

great info. Now it's rather obvious why -tjunc is A Good Thing. I've tried it in a couple of maps and it really makes a difference; the sparkle reduction is significant.

I wonder why Greg Lewis in TreeQBSP changed the defaults to off. Are there any apparent performance/size/whatnot penalties for always having it on ?

#1921 Posted by Speedy [213.172.2.47], 09/12/2001 03:13 GMT

It can create more face/edge splits. And it usually does. It takes more time. It can cause bugs. But two first are minor downsides

#1922 Posted by H-Hour [65.101.212.45], 09/12/2001 09:03 GMT

wc certainly loves the cock. mouthfulls of it.

#1923 Posted by czg [158.38.54.100], 09/12/2001 14:10 GMT

Post censored by moderator (wrath).

#1924 Posted by czg [158.38.54.100], 09/12/2001 14:12 GMT

Bah! Forgot a closing bold tag. Someone please censor or delete that above post.

Is it really so hard to edit your fgd file? It's goddamned simple I tell you!

@PointClass base(Targetname, Appearflags) color(0 0 255) size(-32 -32 0,32 32 64) info_entity : "Your entity Name" = [

anInt(integer) : "Your int here" : 8
aString(string) : "Your String here"
aChoice(choices) : "Pick one" : 0 =
[
1:"Evil"
2:"Good"
3:"1337"
5676:"Arse"
]
spawnflags(Flags) =
[
256 : "Not in Easy" : 0
512 : "Not in Normal" : 0
1024 : "Not in Hard" : 0
2048 : "Not in Deathmatch" : 0
]

]

Where:

The @ indicates a new entry

PointClass, SolidClass or BaseClass indicates what kind of entity: point, solid or a base entity that won't show up in your entity list but that many other entities share fields with. You can refer to a BaseClass in the next bit which is:

base(Other fgd entries) (Optional, defaults to none.) is a comma separated list of other entries in the fgd. Here you can put the name of baseclasses or any other class whatsoever. The entity specified in the entry you use the base() in will inherit the same fields from those entities. Common bases are Appearflags, (which are the spawnflags that set skill settings,) Target & Targetname, Light and Trigger.

color(RRR GGG BBB) (Optional, defaults to some purpleish color.) is pretty self explanatory. Only applicable for pointEnts unless you don't use 3d textured preview.

size(-x -y -z, x y z) (Optional, defaults to (-8 -8 -8,8 8 8).) is the max/min corners of the bounding box of the entity. Only applicable for PointEnts. Many of these in the original Quake fgd are very, VERY wrong.

The next bit is the actual classname of the entity. Followed by a colon and...

The "Common" name of the entity, or a short description of it. (Optional, defaults to none.) Seems like it was originally planned for WC to browse entities by such common names, but thank god it never happened. I have been dumbed down enough by the "common" field names already.

That finishes the Header of the entry, then comes a = and we indicate the start of the main entity info with a [

anInt(integer) means that the key value "anInt" is an integer.
: "Your int here" is the text string that will appear in place of "anInt" in WC's entity dialog. Seems to be optional.
: <some integer> is an optional default value for this key. And here comes some trickery. If you leave out this bit, WC won't write that key/value pair to the .map file. If you put it in, but you give a wrong value compared to what's default in the qc, and you don't make any changes to it in your map, WC won't write it to your .map file then either because it assumes it should be at default. However, since the QC default is different from the fgd default, you'll get results that can deviate a lot from what you had intended. This applies to all default values you specify in the fgd. You'll have to do some thinking for yourself to figure out what is best for your fgd. As an example; The original fgd files that come with WC has the func_button default speed set to 100. In the Qc it is 40. This means that if you want a button that really has a speed of 100, WC will think it is the default value, won't write it to the .map, and you'll end up with a button that has a speed of 40. Yeah it sucks.

aString(string) : "Your String here" means that the aString key/value pair is a text string. Here though, you can't set a default, WC won't allow it.

aChoice(choices) : "Pick one" : 0 indicates that the aChoice key/value pair is a list of choices of various things, each choice corresponding to a given integer value. The default value is optional. This must be followed by a = and then we start a new block with a [ and then follows the list of choises as this:

1:"Choice #1"
2:"Choice #2" Which I think is pretty self-explanatory. If you choose Choice #1 from the drop down menu you get in WC it will set this key to 1. Choice #2 sets it to 2 and so on. The integer values doesn't have to be in order, and will appear in the drop down menu in the order they are listed in the fgd. They don't have to be all 1 2 3 4 5 ... and so on, they can easily be 1254 12 -85 9 -5556 or any wild combination of values. Note that it can take negative values. This is often used for various func_ entities that have a "wait" field that sets when it should reset. You put in something like this:
wait(choices) : "Wait before return" : 4=
[
-1 : "Never return"
]
...which will make the entity have a "wait" field that defaults to 4 (that's what it says in the qc), but has a dropdown menu that allows you to set -1 as a "Never return" value. Easy as that. Close the list with a ].

spawnflags(Flags) The (Flags) datatype is reserved for the spawnflags key/value pair only and describes what spawnflags are optional on the Flags tab in the WC entity dialog. The setup is identical to the (choices) datatayp as you can see, only difference is that you can't set a "common" name for this key/value because it will appear on a tab of it's own, and you can't set a default value directly in the header there. However, in the choices list, you may specify if the given flag defaults to on (1) or off (0) after each item in the list.

These two you won't be needing too often:
targetname(target_source) : "Name" and target(target_destination) : "Target"
These are in most fgd files only used in the two baseClasses Target and Targetname. As you probably understand these two are used for target and targetname fields, and I won't go anymore into those.

There. These are all the datatypes available to you in a fgd entry. Use them as much as you like. (Except for the Flags type.) Now close the entry with a final ] and you're all set.

That is how easy it is to edit a fgd.

Now go make some of your own and stop whining about WC sucking cock.

Thank You Wrath

#1925 Posted by czg [158.38.54.100], 09/12/2001 14:35 GMT

Or Just Don't Use WC...

#1926 Posted by necros [172.130.74.160], 09/12/2001 15:03 GMT , Refers to Post #1924

#1927 Posted by Vigil [193.229.255.17], 09/12/2001 16:50 GMT

Obviously WC is very evil and causes stuff like forgetting to close the bold tag. It was all WC's fault, bad editor!

Damn You Vigil

#1928 Posted by czg [158.38.54.78], 09/12/2001 18:07 GMT

May a thousand gay horses haunt your dreams for eternity.

#1929 Posted by Vigil [193.229.255.17], 09/12/2001 19:32 GMT

Looks like my nightmares of Shambler's naked mum are over.

Hmm, No Title

#1930 Posted by The Lieutenant [144.32.177.104], 09/12/2001 19:58 GMT , Refers to Post #1929

#1931 Posted by The Lieutenant [144.32.177.104], 09/12/2001 19:58 GMT

Questions, Questions

#1932 Posted by iART [208.181.205.12], 10/12/2001 00:03 GMT

Has anyone successfully created lit textures in

using DuLight?

Does it require a special progs.dat? If so... fuck it... I hate maps requiring a modified progs.dat.

Wow You Guys

#1933 Posted by [Tronyn] [24.66.247.146], 10/12/2001 00:42 GMT

And Btw Necros..

#1934 Posted by [Tronyn] [24.66.247.146], 10/12/2001 00:45 GMT

I do have Quark, I use it for textures, debugging, sometimes model editing, ect. overall a very useful tool.

WC doesn't suck, it just has some gay tendencies, but at this point in my 'mapping career' I'm not going to go about switching editors, given that I'm quitting in a few weeks. Additionally, if I was switching editors, I would just go to a new game/engine, like Unreal. Wait... I already did that (Rune maps with my final update.. you'll see).

#1935 Posted by Speedy [213.172.2.110], 10/12/2001 00:56 GMT

`cmon dont say fucking `Quit`
just have a break and come back
cause if you say quit you establish a mental barrier and you might want to come back to mapping someday, so dont say quit - it`s not a job or a slag you got sick of.

#1936 Posted by necros [172.166.156.225], 10/12/2001 01:10 GMT

I'm with speedy on that one. Quitting sounds so final. Mapping is a hobby, and shouldn't be regarded as the same thing as a job.

I also considered changing editors to QER, but there is just so much to learn, and I don't think i'd enjoy the process... maybe if I start to map for Q3, I might try Q3Radiant or something, but I'm content with quark for now. (besides, I use the 'good' version, 4.07. I don't understand v6 and up...)

Well, That Is,

#1937 Posted by necros [172.166.156.225], 10/12/2001 01:10 GMT

unless you really do map for a living...

FGD Update:

#1938 Posted by czg [158.38.54.78], 10/12/2001 08:11 GMT

I forgot one datatype which you might find in handy:

_color(color1) : "RGB Color" This makes a standard windows colorpicker appear in the entity dialog, and selects colors as 0-255 RGB values.
Though I haven't found it used anywhere, I think there might be a color2 datatype too, that gives color values as relative (0.0-1.0). I have no proof on this one though, so I might be a bit wrong. But the color1 one works for sure...

Oh Yeah, One More Thing.

#1939 Posted by czg [158.38.54.78], 10/12/2001 08:17 GMT , Refers to Post #1938

Thing is with FGDs, you'll rarely want to use the integer datatype really, because qc only uses floats, and if you try to put in say 3.24 in an integer field in worldcraft, it will round it off to the nearest int. Therefore I have found it smartest to just use string for all fields, since they're all stored as strings in the .map file anyway...

Worldcraft 3.3 Problem

#1940 Posted by The Lieutenant [144.32.177.19], 10/12/2001 12:46 GMT

Is there a texture brightness control in WC3.3? I can't find it, and all my texes are appearing *way* too dark. Which is a shame, because in all other respects wc3.3 seems a fine piece of software (certainly an improvement over wc1.6!).

#1941 Posted by The Lieutenant [144.32.177.19], 10/12/2001 12:47 GMT

Haven't all your maps released to date used custom progs? Just a thought, y'know...

Check This Shit Out:

#1942 Posted by [Tronyn] [24.66.247.146], 10/12/2001 22:40 GMT

On yet another map, Quake crashes thus:

Error: SZ_GetSpace: 8126 is > full buffer size

C:\quake>

Any ideas?

BTW, thanks CZG for the fgd info... basically I just needed to specify a bunch of entites as point-entities.

Tronyn, It's Either:

#1943 Posted by necros [172.173.29.104], 10/12/2001 23:06 GMT , Refers to Post #1942

1. Too many entities (I was getting this error a lot in n3sp04, until I removed the 50 trigger_teleports and put in func_spawns instead).

2. Too many textures in the bsp. I think so, anyway, since some compilers let you put more than 2mb of textures in a bsp, but quake won't let you, and crashes... (I think.. I got this error a bit in n3sp02 way back in the day, before I got rid of some of the textures).

#1944 Posted by [Tronyn] [24.66.247.146], 10/12/2001 23:28 GMT

must be entities, as this map is very giant but has a very limited texture set. thanks.

back to the grind... I mean hobby :)

#1945 Posted by iART [208.181.205.6], 11/12/2001 07:17 GMT

...you caught me on that one Lieutenant. Yes, but I would like my next release to be for the "regular old quake"....
... + TQ's func_snow.
Radiant lighting would be SOOOOOO cool if it didn't need a modified progs.

Soooo? Can anyone tell me if it does?

Test, test... is this thing on??

#1946 Posted by metlslime [12.228.72.232], 11/12/2001 10:02 GMT

i don't see how radiosity lighting would need a modified progs.dat ... either it produces normal lightmaps that quake can read, or it produces some sort of alternate bsp format or external .lit file which would require a new engine, not a new progs.dat.

#1947 Posted by DaZ [213.122.20.157], 11/12/2001 13:35 GMT

Iain, my latest dm - crdm2 - mechanical tears used radiosity lighting and works just fine in glquake, software etc...

dunno why your having such problems ?

#1948 Posted by iART [208.181.205.7], 12/12/2001 06:56 GMT

q1rad.zip came with:

lights.rad
progs.dat
q1rad.exe
radtest.bsp
radtest.lit
& a readme.txt

maybe i should read that again...

#1949 Posted by iART [208.181.205.7], 12/12/2001 06:59 GMT

This readme says something about a Halflife tutorial. Is that what you used to figure out radiant lighting?

#1950 Posted by Fat Controller [203.79.69.131], 12/12/2001 07:40 GMT

Try this tut I wrote.

It's for the original Q1RAD, but same diff.

#1951 Posted by DaZ [213.122.27.146], 12/12/2001 10:01 GMT

fatty's said tutorial...

Quake1 Mapping

#1952 Posted by protomor [65.9.36.69], 13/12/2001 04:06 GMT

Im trying to map for quake and I already know how to use worldcraft for CS maps. The compile tools I use now for quake in worldcraft 3.3 give me parse errors when i put more than 7 things in the maps. How do you guys map. like what programs. or do you know how to fix my problems?

#1953 Posted by DaZ [213.122.12.203], 13/12/2001 20:27 GMT

Worldcraft 3.3 only supports HL maps, you need WC 1.6 to make quake maps. Someone here will know where to download it, but I am not sure...

I think that will fix all your problems.

#1954 Posted by XeNoN [194.117.133.196], 13/12/2001 20:53 GMT

#1955 Posted by The Lieutenant [144.32.177.191], 13/12/2001 23:28 GMT

Worldcraft 3.3 is soooooooo much nicer than 1.6 - any of you q1 whores still stuck on 1.6, I suggest you grab Riot's Qonverge tools and go get Wc3.3.

LTH: Do You Have EYES?

#1956 Posted by XeNoN [194.117.133.196], 13/12/2001 23:53 GMT

The compile tools I use now for quake in worldcraft 3.3 give me parse errors when i put more than 7 things in the maps.

#1957 Posted by The Lieutenant [144.32.177.191], 13/12/2001 23:54 GMT

What are these 'eyes' of which you speak?

#1958 Posted by Seth [158.152.186.247], 14/12/2001 00:45 GMT , Refers to Post #1955

can i get ver3.3 from?

#1959 Posted by Speedy [213.172.2.19], 14/12/2001 03:19 GMT

Iv made a pretty room in 3,3 and put in some monsters for test - it worked fine.

Maybe guy puts wrong things there (like purely HLis stuff) ? :)

S.dkfgblsdkbg

#1960 Posted by The Lieutenant [144.32.177.195], 14/12/2001 12:10 GMT

Seth: voodoofiles.com has a download of it I think. Go search on Google or something.

Cheerzor Dood

#1961 Posted by Seth [158.152.186.247], 15/12/2001 00:24 GMT , Refers to Post #1960

Brush Counts In Q1.

#1962 Posted by necros [172.174.192.191], 15/12/2001 19:09 GMT

How many brushes for a q1sp would be considered 'alot'?

And what's the maximum number of brushes that QBSP can handle?

The reason I'm asking, is that I've got 2000 brushes, and not even half done my map yet...

#1963 Posted by NotoriousRay [4.17.66.107], 15/12/2001 19:15 GMT

mine is over 3000 atm, pretty final, it compiles leak and error free fine

Let's See,,,

#1964 Posted by Vigil [193.229.6.165], 16/12/2001 09:39 GMT , Refers to Post #1962

The original QBSP can handle 4096 brushes, any more than that and it freaks out and stabs you to death. Newer versions can handle a lot more. Moonlight Assault had 5500-6000 brushes, I think, and Tyrann had loads of problems with random leaks, errors and crashes. So that's definitely too much. Also, A3 seemed to be hell on QBSP, can't remember how many brushes it had though.

I also got a level with just over 3000 brushes in the works, no strange errors encountered yet.

#1965 Posted by Tronyn. [24.66.247.146], 18/12/2001 02:55 GMT

try this:

Page fault at eip=00030774
eax=ffb0f400 ebx=007c24cc ecx=000c0d38 edx=00710908 esi=00000002 edi=000003ce
ebp=007c24cc esp=000ea29c cs=00a7 ds=00af es=00af fs=00d7 gs=00d7 ss=00af
Call frame traceback EIPs:
0x00030774
0x00000004

C:\quake>

Not "general protection fault" but rather *page* fault. Hm. 3175 brushes, 140 monsters, and will play in Quake for 10-20 seconds before crashing. Gives a long series of "too many efrags!" errors before loading.

Is this a problem with too many entities?

Hmm, No Title

#1966 Posted by Tronyn. [24.66.247.146], 18/12/2001 03:54 GMT

Page fault at eip=00030774
eax=ffc0fee0 ebx=0079542c ecx=000c0d38 edx=006e93a8 esi=00000001 edi=000002b6
ebp=0079542c esp=000ea29c cs=00a7 ds=00af es=00af fs=00cf gs=00cf ss=00af
Call frame traceback EIPs:
0x00030774
0x00000018

C:\quake>aww yee
Bad command or file name

C:\quake>why must this be
Bad command or file name

C:\quake>will thou not fix thine self?
Bad command or file name

C:\quake>I do beseech thee!
Bad command or file name

C:\quake>exit if suckage > 0

#1967 Posted by czg [158.38.54.27], 18/12/2001 19:31 GMT

I used to get those errors in bucketloads when I first got Quake in '97. Turned out I was allocating 12 megs of RAM, because I thought I had 16, but one of the ram chips turning out to be b0rked so I had really only 8 megs. I don't know how this'll help you though.

Yeah, I *think*

#1968 Posted by [Tronyn] [24.66.247.146], 18/12/2001 22:23 GMT

it has something to do with size, so pulling a cheap shot I deleted the first 10% of the map and tacked it on to the one before.. so THAT works now.

however, I've now run into a bad surface extents on the next map. oh what fun :)

#1969 Posted by necros [172.130.35.103], 18/12/2001 22:38 GMT

out of curiosity, What is this map that keeps trying to stab you?

And what Quake are you using? (SW, WQ, GL, other...)

#1970 Posted by [Tronyn] [24.66.247.146], 20/12/2001 06:23 GMT

it's not so much what map IS as what map ISNT sir

let me see -

add2, compiled fine, gameplay half done - made a couple architecture changes, finished gameplay - leaf with too many portals - attempt to fix that generated a "general protection fault" upon trying to load the map in quake

arabian nights remix (night journey) -more visportals than a starbuck coagula map, more errors (first, it was a too many clipping surfaces, then too many torches, then plain old general protection fault, then *page* fault) than a tronyn map! hah. actually though I did fix it, I think, though Tyrann tells me it will take weeks to vis.

the haunted hills (first nj map) gazillions of invalid solid errors, point off plane up the ass, compiler freezes/crashes, bad surface extents quake crash, general protection fault quake crash. all suspect solids have been deleted, at least 20% cut off of the begining and end of the map, large areas cut up into smaller pieces, torch count and overall entity count reduced.. but still...

soe2m2 (until recently) - isnt it great when you make a map, do 80% of the lights, then it crashes and u loseit all? then months later when you're doing the gameplay you lose the map that the gameplay was done on and have to redo it from scratch? throw in a lot of leaks, compiler errors.. good fun.

night journey will most likely end up spilling over into january given these errors.

sorry, I guess this should have gone in the hate thread

Leaf With Too Many Portals

#1971 Posted by XeNoN [194.117.133.196], 20/12/2001 10:14 GMT

Yay, my favourite error!

Skill Levels

#1972 Posted by NotoriousRay [199.75.227.58], 20/12/2001 17:23 GMT

q1sp mappers: how do the majority of you impliment skill levels? one at a time, starting at one end of the spectrium(easy or nightmare)? or just do all 4 as you go? (aimed for those that don't place monsters as they build..)

kthx

Skill Levels

#1973 Posted by metlslime [12.228.72.232], 20/12/2001 17:36 GMT

i usually place monsters/ammo/health in a way that is about right for me, then once i've got that done i treat that as "hard" (it should be harder for other people to play the first time than it is for me the hundredth time.) Then to get easy and medium i go through and remove monsters or add health, as appropriate. (vore becomes ogre, two hknights become one, a shambler becomes shambler with 50 health)

Gmax 4 Quake 3

#1974 Posted by The Cream Enjin [213.122.127.78], 20/12/2001 20:06 GMT

I just downloaded gmax, and noticed that you can download a file called "gmax tempest" which allows you to make quake 3 maps in gmax.
has any1 tried it? is it any good?

My Skill Levels

#1975 Posted by Fat Controller [203.79.68.58], 20/12/2001 20:54 GMT

I tend to place entities and things for Normal skill, then add more monsties for Hard/Nightmare and take 'em out for Easy.

#1976 Posted by cyBeAr [213.64.67.243], 20/12/2001 21:14 GMT , Refers to Post #1974

Can't say I've given it much chance but the general idea seems to be that it is aweful.

#1977 Posted by The Cream Enjin [213.1.177.248], 20/12/2001 21:27 GMT

Generally, And Stupidly..

#1978 Posted by [Tronyn] [24.66.247.146], 20/12/2001 23:56 GMT

I tend to build the entire level, then light it, then put in gameflow (doors and buttons, basically) then put in all items/monsters/other entities. when I do this I do it area by area, placing monsters for all skill levels at once - I have normal in mind as a standard, and add for hard and subtract for easy. but I do this area by area, not the whole map at once. and then after that if the map's going to have DM support, then I do that.

Hm... Interresting...

#1979 Posted by necros [172.131.220.61], 21/12/2001 01:11 GMT

I tend to do it all at once... this generally leads to me running into some silly problems... but I could never stand NOT lighting my map, as it usually looks so bad fullbright anyhow... I usually do leave out the monsters, though, until the end, as they tend to annoy me more than anything. (Typing Notarget each time you start the map is very annoying, or Trying to find a leak while monsters are shooting at you...

)

The step by step approach sure has some advantages though.... all I can say is: good luck with yer maps.

#1980 Posted by palldjon [203.29.11.38], 21/12/2001 01:28 GMT

metlslime's approach, with one exception. Set the enemy up for a single skill level (usually normal) then send the level out for beta testing. I ask the testers to rate the skill as is and suggest changes where necessary to solidify that level but also tweak it for the remaining two. I love beta testers

#1981 Posted by Speedy [80.70.224.147], 21/12/2001 02:43 GMT

What do do to them ? Its strange you have so many problems.

metl: neat idea to have monsters with reduced health (you add health key or what ?)

#1982 Posted by metlslime [12.228.72.232], 21/12/2001 03:27 GMT

no, i meant a shambler accompanied by two +25 health boxes. i think it's almost never a good idea to change nonobvious monster traits like health or damage per shot.

#1983 Posted by Lunaran [64.109.175.211], 21/12/2001 05:08 GMT

That's such a fucking great idea I'm going to use it for CF.

and that's a yay dammit. :)

#1984 Posted by palldjon [203.29.11.38], 21/12/2001 05:15 GMT , Refers to Post #1983

#1985 Posted by Fern [141.222.141.1], 21/12/2001 14:41 GMT

Efrags errors usually disappear after I vis my map...

I'm Apparently A Moron.

#1986 Posted by pjw [12.246.133.99], 21/12/2001 23:08 GMT

All I wanted to do was update/redo some of my Q2 level screenies on my site, and I have now wasted about an hour arsing around with Google and old Q2 sites trying to find the console command to turn off the frigging HUD (health, etc.). I was able to find every other obscure frikking console command but this one. Anyone wanna help a brotha' out?

#1987 Posted by Tyrann [203.56.239.111], 22/12/2001 03:07 GMT , Refers to Post #1986

Try "sizeup", and "sizedown" to get it back again.
Usually bound to the +/- keys. That's what it is in Q1, I assume it's the same in Q2.

#1988 Posted by pjw [12.246.133.99], 22/12/2001 04:23 GMT

Thanks, but not exactly what I had in mind--all that does is put a varying-width border around the screen as it up- or downsizes it. I want to keep the screen the same size, but lose the health/weapon/ammo/armor icons and numbers so I can get a clean screenshot without all the extra crap on it. Thanks, though.

(In Q3 it's /cg_drawgun 0 and /cg_draw2d 0.)

#1989 Posted by Tyrann [203.56.239.111], 22/12/2001 04:28 GMT , Refers to Post #1988

Well, in Q1 you keep pressing '+' (sizeup) when there are no borders, and the status bar also disappears. Try "r_drawviewmodel 0" to get rid of the gun...

#1990 Posted by pjw [12.246.133.99], 22/12/2001 04:59 GMT

on either suggestion. Ah, well, maybe I'll just sizedown and then manually crop the border plus HUD, but seems a pain in the ass . . . there has to be an easy way, I would think. Eh. Thanks again anyway.

#1991 Posted by pjw [12.246.133.99], 22/12/2001 05:02 GMT

I can get rid of the gun, sort of, by changing the "handedness" of the player to "center", which makes the on-screen gun go away, but leaves yet another icon on the bottom of the screen.

.ENT FILE FOR LAZARUS MOD

#1992 Posted by zip [144.137.148.120], 22/12/2001 10:47 GMT

PLEASE HeLp me i am a very big qoole user i have recently downloaded the lazarus mod and i can't find an entity set for qoole please tell me where i can get one

Latest Sm36 Compile Error

#1993 Posted by XeNoN [194.117.133.196], 22/12/2001 17:38 GMT

This time it cruelly waited for half an hour till _after_ I ran vis before the fatal error occured.

---- vis ----
testlevel = 4
fastvis = true
9084 portalleafs
27279 numportals
basevis donetal 54528 of 54558
************ ERROR ************
Vismap expansion overflow

I'm using Hvis, by the way, cos rvis+ has a lower max-portals-on-a-leaf limit, and it wouldn't run. Someone on IRC suggested fullvising, but take into account the number of portals (27279) and the fact it took 30 mins for a fastvis...
Basically does anyone know what the hell this means?

#1994 Posted by necros [172.169.147.73], 22/12/2001 17:49 GMT , Refers to Post #1993

whoever said full vis is right AFAIK.

it's another Starbuck map!

I would try at least a regular vis, anyway... just leave it on over night.

XeNoN, That Vis Error Message

#1995 Posted by aguirRe [195.163.205.103], 22/12/2001 18:02 GMT , Refers to Post #1993

means that the vis data size (that will be put into the BSP file when finished) is too big.

The limit is set to 1MB and even if it could be raised in a modified vis program, (GL)Quake might not be able to load the map. The vis would then most likely take forever to finish.

And you're probably right; if you can't make it through fastvis, you shouldn't even think about fullvis - since fastvis is always done before fullvis anyway ...

#1996 Posted by necros [172.155.46.165], 22/12/2001 18:53 GMT , Refers to Post #1995

during a full vis, the fast vis data is NOT stored inside the BSP yet. It is compressed again through the Full Vis stage, and it may be small enough to work.

#1997 Posted by XeNoN [194.117.133.196], 22/12/2001 19:27 GMT

fullvis is the only option as it stands, yeah? Hmmm...

I would try at least a regular vis, anyway... just leave it on over night.

Vis time is roughly proportional to number of portals isn't it? If oxymoron had 33000 after optimisation and takes in excess of 3 weeks to vis, then this is hardly gonna be an overnight job. All I want to do is test how the lighting looks! :(

Would adding visblockers lower the visdatasize?

#1998 Posted by cyBeAr [213.64.67.243], 22/12/2001 19:38 GMT , Refers to Post #1997

You don't ahve to vos to see how the damn lights look silly. And fastvis will produce much larger visdata so the 1meg limit is probably exceeded fairly easy.

#1999 Posted by XeNoN [194.117.133.196], 22/12/2001 19:52 GMT , Refers to Post #1998

I thought I had mentioned this already but I seem to have forgotten...

The map WILL NOT RUN in an unvised state in either Quake, Winquake, GLquake or TomazQuake. It loads the title, sits at the console for a bit moentarily goes all bright and brings up the "illegal operation" box.

Basically it needs to be vised.

One other thing worth mentioning is that the map fastvised and ran fine (albeit VERY slowly) when I had it surrounded in a box.

Momentarily...

#2000 Posted by XeNoN [194.117.133.196], 22/12/2001 19:53 GMT

(ps. post 2000 :P)

Oxymoron VS. SM36

#2001 Posted by necros [172.155.46.165], 22/12/2001 19:58 GMT

Cybear's right. (I thought I had conveyed the same idea in my last post...) oh well.

A regular vis will take less time, and MAY (not will) compress the vis data size down to less then 1024kbytes... but it's a risk though, as it MAY not compress it that much. In that case, you'll have to do a full vis... =\

i'm thinking 1 1/2 to 2 weeks (2 1/2 to 3 maximum) vis time for 27000 portals... Vis blockers would definatly lower vis data size, (as well as make it go faster) I'm guessing you have a lot of sticky outy parts too... making those parts into func_walls will probably increase vis speed (er... decrease vis time) A good example of this would be the hoops along the walkways in Oxymoron.

In anycase, if you really need a viser, I can try sm36 too, but It'll still take long. I am going away on holidays next week (jan 1 around) If you want, you can give it to me, and I'll leave it going for that week and see how far it goes.

It would be usefull to know what would be the maximum portals that vis will do and still compress it below 1meg...
Elek, you've done high portal maps (Coagula series) how many portals did any of the Coagula maps have?

Hey Look...

#2002 Posted by necros [172.155.46.165], 22/12/2001 20:00 GMT , Refers to Post #2000

I missed post 2000.. soo........

Post# = Year# (soon, anyway).
2002 = 2002

er... right.

#2003 Posted by XeNoN [194.117.133.196], 22/12/2001 20:05 GMT

Some visblockers might do the job, although they're untidy. The func_wall method I've been using to a degree already; guess I need more of them :/

Thanks for the advice, anyway.

A Couple Of Things

#2004 Posted by Tyrann [203.56.239.117], 23/12/2001 01:02 GMT

If the map crashes Quake with "Illegal operation", then vising probably won't help. It's most likely that one of the other bsp lumps is over the maximum allowed size. Judging by the huge number of portals, it may be edges or verticies, but if you're lucky it might just be textures. If you have a lot of textures, try removing a few from the set to decrease the bsp size.

Also, a full vis will (almost) always take up less space than a fast vis. This is because the data is compressed using run-length encoding. Because less polygons will be seen from a single portal when fully vis'd, there are longer strings of zeros in the data, which compress well.

I Stand Corrected, But

#2005 Posted by aguirRe [195.163.204.97], 23/12/2001 02:45 GMT

I'm still convinced that the vis will take forever to finish with XeNoNs apparently very large PRT file (how big is it anyway ?).

The best idea is probably to start thinking about unpleasant medicine, like splitting the map in two, lowering detail or some hi-tech visblocking methods ...

I mean, how many times do you want to wait several days (or weeks ...) each time you test your map seriously ?

BTW, XeNoN, are you sure that you don't have leaks in your map - most Q1 compilers have IMHO flat out inferior leak handling ...

Maybe that could be the reason for your huge PRT file ?

XeNoN, Have You Tried

#2006 Posted by aguirRe [195.163.203.196], 23/12/2001 09:52 GMT

running bspinfo on your BSP file ? You could post the output (it's rather small) here and then someone might see if any of the numbers are abnormally high.

I had that exact problem before that a map leaked, but I couldn't check out the PTS file in GLQuake because it GPF:ed. Then I ran bspinfo and saw that several numbers were very high which probably caused Quake (any version) to crash.

I assume that if a large map leaks, the total amount of generated data (leafs, faces, portals etc) could very well exceed the capabilities of the engine.

If the compiler then also refuses to present the leak for you and instead generates a ridiculously large PRT file - well, there you are ...

XeNoN Thought A Title Wasn't Needed

#2007 Posted by XeNoN [194.117.133.196], 23/12/2001 14:07 GMT

---BSP Info--
version 1.1
---------------------
other/sm36/sm36b.bsp
4731 planes 94620
32267 vertexes 387204
17273 nodes 414552
1917 texinfo 76680
28208 faces 564160
20916 clipnodes 167328
9846 leafs 275688
30973 marksurfaces 61946
111437 surfedges 222874
68886 edges 275544
0 textures 1601972
lightdata 806210
visdata 0
entdata 35124
---------------------

I dont understand why it says there are "0 textures", there's actually bitchloads (over 100). As tyrann said, it could be something to do with the problem. Reducing the number of textures was on my 'to-do' list anyway.

And I'm pretty sure it doesn't leak, because otherwise vis wouldn't have run in the first place, correct? The prt file is pretty large though, 2.22mB.

Since last night though I've added a few visblockers; one including a twisty airvent to get from one big room to the next, hehe.

#2008 Posted by necros [172.145.43.116], 23/12/2001 16:50 GMT

the textures aren't the problem. the size is only at 1601972, which is far below the limit (~2048000 bytes (2mb)).

I'm affraid the rest of that information means little to me though... =\

#2009 Posted by necros [172.145.43.116], 23/12/2001 16:59 GMT

I was under the impression that the maximum volume for a quake map was 4096 (2048 from the origin in all direction.)

Just for fun, I opened up CZG07a and I find that there is a whole section which goes off into the 3000s. (A certain Light Ent there had the origin of "-3744 -448 688")

Now Does that mean that the max volume is not, in fact 4096, but larger?

Has anyone ever found out for sure?

#2010 Posted by XeNoN [194.117.133.196], 23/12/2001 17:35 GMT , Refers to Post #2009

It's 4096 in each direction from the origin; IE. -4096 to 4096 on each axis.

Basically 8192^3

XeNoN, If You Try To Use

#2011 Posted by aguirRe [195.163.202.29], 23/12/2001 17:44 GMT

the original bspinfo instead of the 1.1, you'll see the correct # textures in your BSP (the size is probably correct).

For comparison, check the following bspinfo output for a map from a well-known author :

damaul2leak.bsp
2637 planes 52740
36628 vertexes 439536
17007 nodes 408168
993 texinfo 39720
33565 faces 671300
9880 clipnodes 79040
10530 leafs 294840
36057 marksurfaces 72114
133427 surfedges 266854
84753 edges 339012
44 textures 247080
lightdata 0
visdata 0
entdata 39110
=========================
damaul2orig.bsp
2900 planes 58000
15873 vertexes 190476
4756 nodes 114144
993 texinfo 39720
12030 faces 240600
9695 clipnodes 77560
2352 leafs 65856
14591 marksurfaces 29182
57966 surfedges 115932
29227 edges 116908
46 textures 249888
lightdata 299405
visdata 84336
entdata 39097

It's easy to see that the leak in the first version causes several of the numbers to sky-rocket. It cannot be loaded into most Quake engines (they all GPF).

Compare these numbers with the ones in your map and you can see that either your map is a lot larger and more complex than Damaul2 (which is already rather big), or you might have a leak in your map.

I must emphasize again that qbsp producing a PRT file does NOT guarantee that the map is leak-free. Noclip outside of your map, look at the inside and see if it's visible. If you can't see inside, you have a leak.

What qbsp are you using ? Try a different one and get a 2nd opinion ...

Q2 Screenshots

#2012 Posted by Jaj [62.83.163.83], 23/12/2001 18:03 GMT , Refers to Post #1991

To take proper screenshots without the bottom icons, you can do this:

Press the "?" or "-" key two times to reduce the image, then you'll see those icons out of the image. Then, make the screenshot and after,with some program as photoshop you select the center of the screen and you have it :) .

If you have Q2 with a resolution of 800*600 the image you'll obtain will be 640*480.
Or if you want a 800*600 final screenie, you must have Q2 at a 1024*768 first and ....
It's a bit clumpsy

but don't know another method, i've been unable to find a command that make dissapear those bottom icons.
Hope this helps you.

#2013 Posted by necros [172.136.98.199], 23/12/2001 18:30 GMT

in each direction? In Quake?

...
...
Holy F***asaurus.

Whoa... and here i was always watching not to go over 2048...

hehe, this map is gonna be huge.

AguirRe, My Map...

#2014 Posted by XeNoN [194.117.133.196], 23/12/2001 19:28 GMT , Refers to Post #2011

is pretty damn huge, probably moreso than damaul2. (nearly 2900 brushes)

And it's pretty hard to compare:
(Updated info taken from qbsp when compiling...)
---- WriteBSPFile ----
4597 planes 91940
30718 vertexes 368616
16249 nodes 389976
1875 texinfo 75000
26632 faces 532640
20535 clipnodes 164280
9268 leafs 259504
29226 marksurfaces 58452
105236 surfedges 420944
65573 edges 262292
139 textures 1514360
lightdata 0
visdata 0
entdata 32497

The number of planes is almost twice the size, yet other values come in quite a bit lower than damaul2leak (edges, leafs). I'm not sure whether or not this proves anything.

(This is after making several changes like large visblocks, func_wall-age, reducing textures)

I've somehow managed to lower the amount of portals on one certain leaf below 128, so rvis+ now runs; but still gives the vismap expansion overflow I got with hvis :/
-------------------------------------

Onto other things, I've been using treeqbsp on this map for a while now, as wqbsp kept crashing (illegal operation) halfway through earlier compiles, and took twice as long anyhow. I can try wqbsp again though, it's an idea (/me does it as he's typing this...)
And the fly-outside-to-check-if-it's-leaked method is hardly gonna be worthwhile when I can't even get the map to run in quake :/

++++WQBSP live update!++++

Just reported leak treeqbsp didn't...
----- FillOutside ----
!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
reached occupant at: (-1024,-224, 544)
no filling performed
leak file written to c:\quake\id1\maps\other\sm36\sm36b.pts
!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Hrm. Leak in an unloadable map. That's not nice.

Update: it didn't crash
Update: it took 505 seconds as opposed to treeqbsp's 277- wtf?

/me scratches head

#2015 Posted by NotoriousRay [4.17.67.82], 23/12/2001 20:54 GMT

what i did to find leaks in the 3000+ brush sp map i'm workin on, is load it in gtkrad and compile (regardless of them issing textures, it will show you leaks)

the unloadableness (as i ran into it, at least)has to do with having too much, stay with me here, stuff in the map that glquake crashes. when i got all leaks fixed this obviously went away. i'd suggest fixing them until all bsp compilers report no leaks, works/worked for me

#2016 Posted by XeNoN [194.117.133.196], 23/12/2001 22:01 GMT

Thanks for the suggestion. I got GktR1.1 installed it, and tried loading the map, but I get 'WARNING: textures\radiant\shadernotex.tga has no alpha channel' in the console, and the program crashes. I love computers.

So This One Time...

#2017 Posted by [Tronyn] [24.66.247.146], 23/12/2001 22:28 GMT

Treeqbsp tells me that the clipnodes in my map exceed 3xxxx (forget specific #), which I assume is the limit. Since these are clipnodes, I can solve this by clipping things off, like say for instance, a pentagram you don't touch anyway, by putting a large clip brush over it and making it clip as one big flat surface. Right?

#2018 Posted by pjw [12.246.133.99], 23/12/2001 23:22 GMT , Refers to Post #2016

you don't go in the wrong direction.

That warning is always there in GTKR--doesn't mean anything. If it's crashing for you, it's doing it for some other reason. If you can't get it working, maybe try Q3Rad v. 202, as GTK just vomits on some people for mysterious reasons.

#2019 Posted by pjw [12.246.133.99], 23/12/2001 23:24 GMT , Refers to Post #2012

Thanks Jaj! I was kinda guessing that was my only option, but it's good to have it verified.

#2020 Posted by XeNoN [194.117.133.196], 23/12/2001 23:31 GMT , Refers to Post #2018

Scampie got it working :)

He's fixing up the leaks for me right now, the good lil crustacean :)

Ladders In Q1

#2021 Posted by R.P.G. [165.247.137.41], 24/12/2001 00:34 GMT

I have some ladders in my Q1DM map. I'm using clip brushes to make the player step up. They are rotated on the XY axis to 45 degrees. The height of the steps is 16 units, and the width is 0.5 units. The player seems to climb them slower than it takes Bal to finish a map.

Can anyone help me out with this? I'd send it off for gameplay and layout testing if this were fixed...

Yay For Crustaceans!

#2022 Posted by Lunaran [64.108.13.162], 24/12/2001 00:47 GMT

Especially with garlic butter and a little marinara ... mm!

#2023 Posted by Scampie [206.152.135.94], 24/12/2001 01:24 GMT

what the fuck did i tell you people about shrimp jokes? ;D

oh, and the map is fine, compiles perfect except for a strange nonsolid rock which is unnessicary in daz's section.

#2024 Posted by XeNoN [194.117.133.196], 24/12/2001 13:47 GMT , Refers to Post #2021

I have some ladders in my Q1DM map. I'm using clip brushes to make the player step up. They are rotated on the XY axis to 45 degrees.

XY axis? X is an axis, and Y is an axis... you mean the Z axis? Try extending the horizontal distance to 2 units/step; that value worked for me.

#2025 Posted by XeNoN [194.117.133.196], 24/12/2001 13:48 GMT

Scampie! I wub j00!

#2026 Posted by Lunaran [64.109.175.80], 24/12/2001 18:28 GMT

I, uh, I'm having problems getting sm40 to compile. Yeah. You wanna do that for me too?

#2027 Posted by necros [172.149.19.215], 24/12/2001 18:56 GMT , Refers to Post #2021

you have a step that is .5 units? wqbsp will just round the number to 1 which could be skewing the clip brushes...

Just leave them all as integer values, no floats.

#2028 Posted by R.P.G. [165.247.155.226], 25/12/2001 00:15 GMT

They are rotated on the XY axis to 45 degrees should be they are rotated along the z-axis to 45 degrees.

I will try what XeNoN suggested.

CZG(or Others Who Could Shed Some Light)

#2029 Posted by [Tronyn] [24.66.247.146], 25/12/2001 00:49 GMT

Since you have made maps bigger than.. the actual world, can you help me out with a map, which, though not the size of say CZG07b, is still much larger than anything else I've made? I want some tips as to how to get around limitations as you seem to have done.

Technically it's the tidiest map I've made, quite neat, in visgroups and all, and nothing really fancy or questionable to QBSP. It's 4062 brushes, and currently Treeqbsp tells me that I've gone over the clipnode limit. Now, by deleting approximately 200 brushes at a time I have discovered that I must delete approximately 600 brushes in order to be below the limit. I have also tried clipping large sections off with clip brushes or just giant blocks (got that from Tyrann), but that doesn't seem to help. Have you run into this and if so how were you able to defeat it. It does have a leak, and I am probably wrong here but based on my very limited understand of compilation processes I think that fixing the leak would reduce the clipnodes, due to Qbsp not having to worry about the outside parts of the map.

Re: Clipnodes

#2030 Posted by Tyrann [203.56.239.200], 25/12/2001 05:20 GMT , Refers to Post #2029

Fix the leak before you bother with anything else. This will massively reduce the clipnodes, since it won't have to extend the clip hull all the way around the outside of the map.

#2031 Posted by R.P.G. [165.247.160.182], 25/12/2001 09:23 GMT

It doesn't seem to have anything to do with the step size. Rather, it was darkplaces.exe that was doing the slowing. It only did it when I changed the maxplayer value to 2 or higher. But using PanQuake seems to work just fine.

Oh My God, That Is So Gay

#2032 Posted by Tronyn. [24.66.247.146], 26/12/2001 18:40 GMT

Treeqbsp doesn't report leaks in my map, however, Quark does. I have been compiling sections this map to try and find out which one the leak is in. Quark only reports the entity nearest the leak wheras Treeqbsp would give you a pts file to work with. So I know the area of the (first) leak but I swear that it is not possible for there to be a leak there. However, the full map still won't compile due to too many clipnodes, which can only be solved by fixing the leak(s). I am quite sure that one cause of general protection faults is attempting to load a map that does have a leak, only treeqbsp has still written a .prt instead of a .pts. bah. this probably doesn't even make any sese. I guess I'll try some different compilers.

#2033 Posted by Fern [172.129.136.63], 26/12/2001 19:06 GMT

a cheap fix for a leak going through a solid brush would be to put a huge block of skip texture behind it... ;)

#2034 Posted by XeNoN [194.117.133.196], 26/12/2001 19:50 GMT , Refers to Post #2032

I quote from a recent email from AguiRe:

Anyway, the problems with leak detection and huge PRT files are exactly the ones that I've tried to fix in my modified versions. Both TxQBSP (QuArK) and TreeQBSP run very well now, low memory footprint, speedy processing and, above all, *really* improved leak handling.

Refferring to his own enhanced versions available at http://user.tninet.se/~xir870k/.

The updated TreeQBSP should not generate a .prt file when you get a leak. Read up on some of the other features too...

#2035 Posted by [Tronyn] [24.66.247.146], 26/12/2001 21:02 GMT

yes that should prove most helpful. Unfortunately now the map crashes Quake because of no free edicts; however I think I have a solution to this (we had this problem in OUM).

fern, heh, cheap fixes are awesome - like clipping brushes that QBSP renders non-solid, lol!

& hey necros, how effective is loading a BSP in Quark - that is, say I load a BSP in Quark, export it to map, and use it in Worldcraft - this is not going to be all messy like bsp->map programs, or is it?

Tronyn, The Leak Finder In QuArK Is

#2036 Posted by aguirRe [195.163.205.185], 26/12/2001 23:07 GMT

by no means perfect. It may very well present a leak where there is none (at least according to the compiler). The people behind QuArK admit this and refer to the compilers for true leak detection. The feature is still very useful in some situations (mainly for smaller maps).

As for using QuArK as a bsp->map conversion tool, I don't think that is possible. You can load the BSP into QuArK and modify some things (like entities), but I can't find any option to save it as a MAP. You need bspc from the Q3Tools to do that (or the older winbspc). And yes, it often gets rather messy after decompilation (especially if it's a large map) ...

If you get a problem with the compiler reporting a leak and when you check the pointfile in GLQuake, the leak trail goes right through a solid brush, then try the following :

First, if you are using TreeQBSP, you can activate the older variant of leak file with the option "-oldleak", which generates a longer and wilder trail, but possibly more accurate (you might need the "-particles #" option in GLQuake as well).

Second, in QuArK, I've found that sometimes a brush gets messed up even if it is very simple in structure. If the leak trail goes through this brush, try just to resize or otherwise manipulate it slightly and see if that helps. There is something strange going on in QuArK that causes this effect, unfortunately rather often.

If anyone knows how to avoid it, please share the knowledge.

#2037 Posted by Speedy [80.70.224.98], 27/12/2001 03:20 GMT

Just.. avoid Quark. And I think you have to use qbsp thats supports floatpoint coordinates with version 6+, even if you map on grid.

Well, Now You Have Two

#2038 Posted by aguirRe [195.163.202.3], 27/12/2001 18:08 GMT , Refers to Post #2037

choices of compilers that works with the floating points in QuArK, TxQBSP and TreeQBSP, both found here.

Hopefully one of them will meet your mapping requirements - they both work with other editors as well and if you got leaks, you get help.

As for avoiding QuArK altogether, I wouldn't say that. It's not without problems, but it's really easy to get acquainted with for newcomers and its performance is very good IMHO.

What are the main advantages of other editors ? I have only tried BSP 0.93b, WC 1.6 and QuArK 6.3.

Speedy Is Still Working On A Title

#2039 Posted by Speedy [80.70.224.119], 28/12/2001 04:03 GMT

bsp got mouse texturing. that beats all the rest. WC 3.3 is cool aswell

#2040 Posted by Fern [172.167.36.78], 29/12/2001 21:25 GMT

anyone know what the hell is causing this? the map only has 700 brushes in it so far. this never happened with any other unfinished maps :(

www.suspenlute.com/sz.jpg

#2041 Posted by Maj [193.128.238.152], 29/12/2001 21:34 GMT

I have a very vague feeling that the SZ_ prefix has something to with strings. Anything odd in your worldspawn or target_print's?

#2042 Posted by Fern [172.138.135.179], 29/12/2001 22:29 GMT

nothing that I know of. And if there were something strange in the worldspawn, I think it would make itself apparent immediately when you load the level. this is happening at random times when a weapon is fired.

Fern, I Got Exactly The Same Error

#2043 Posted by aguirRe [195.163.200.144], 29/12/2001 23:00 GMT , Refers to Post #2040

today when I was testing how different qbsp compilers handle excessive amounts of entity data (> 64K). Using copy & paste I quickly generated a large entity area in the map file.

When starting GLQuake I either got the "ED_Alloc: no free edicts" error or the "SZ_GetSpace: overflow without allowoverflow set".

The first one I think means too many entities (which may include e.g. gibs as well during play), but the other one I'm not sure of. Obviously it's something that has exceeded its limits, but what and why ?

In the GLQuake source code it happens when overflowing a buffer (which could be anything).

#2044 Posted by Fern [172.148.230.241], 30/12/2001 00:35 GMT

Thanks! I deleted all brushmodels from the map and compiled it. No problems. Now I just need to check them one by one to see which one is causing this =)

And I always thought edicts were modeled entities but I could be wrong... =)

#2045 Posted by necros [172.139.145.61], 30/12/2001 02:29 GMT

are all dynamic entities, (ie, not the static ones, which are made with the makestatic statement in qc.)

Edicts count for everything in the level; everything which is not static.

I forget the max # for this, though, but I'm sure someone here knows.

If you have no alternative, Panquake increases the max edicts a lot, so you should never run into this problem with it. (Also, most other custom engines as well.)

Fuck Mapping

#2046 Posted by Fern [172.151.210.46], 30/12/2001 02:40 GMT

deleted every brushmodel in the map, worked fine.

restored brushmodels one by one, error reappeared after reaching a certain number.

deleted groups of brushmodels completely at random, error did not reappear as long as the total number of bmodels was kept ridiculously low.

tried creating a map with 64 func_walls, wouldn't load, gave a weird error with invalid characters in the message.

tried compiling with txqbsp, same.

tried saving with Quark and compiling, same.

tried making a map in WC3 with a single func_wall, dubsp crashed.

Perssp3 will most likely not fucking be completed so fucking there. Fuck it. Looking forward to SM36.

#2047 Posted by Speedy [80.70.224.73], 30/12/2001 02:55 GMT

brushmodels limit is about 255 afair, if you crash on 64 you have some issues

The Saga Continues...

#2048 Posted by Fern [172.151.210.46], 30/12/2001 03:39 GMT

deltreed and reinstalled quake just in case I changed something without knowing it...

reinstalled wc1.6...

Maps with large numbers of func_walls (96) now load in quake and do not cause overflows

deleted every brushmodel in perssp3 and pasted the 96 func_walls, map ran fine

pasted the brushmodels back in, crashed.

So apparently there's something fucked up about that cluster of brushmodels, even though I can't narrow the error down to a single model.

Which means that in order to finish this, I'll have to start from the map with everything cut out and rebuild the models from scratch.

argh.

http://www.suspenlute.com/perssp3b.gif

#2049 Posted by Fern [172.146.111.145], 30/12/2001 03:55 GMT

now you can see through the floors for no reason as if draworder were on...

#2050 Posted by Tyrann [203.56.239.200], 30/12/2001 04:17 GMT , Refers to Post #2045

from quakedef.h, line 107:

#define MAX_EDICTS 600 // FIXME: ouch! ouch! ouch!

#2051 Posted by NotoriousRay [199.75.227.226], 30/12/2001 15:22 GMT

i heard you say in irc that you're using alot of hipnotic stuff. i can say through experience that the wallsprite stuff and/or the bulletholes from just shoooting a wall, used to cause problems for me when i would load a semi-big unfinished map in hipnotic. dunno if thats yer case though. also would crash a few hipnotic maps with the edicts message (i guess each bullethole is a type of ent? who knows..)

#2052 Posted by necros [172.128.170.131], 30/12/2001 15:47 GMT

if your using the rotating entities, then that's your problem. They are evil, and eat up edicts like nuts.

Also, do you have a lot of teleports in the level? if so, try replacing the monster teleports with spawns... (via qc, of course)

#2053 Posted by [Tronyn] [24.66.247.146], 30/12/2001 18:45 GMT

lol. that's all I can say.

"deleted every brushmodel in perssp3 and pasted the 96 func_walls, map ran fine"

so check this out, what would cause this particular Quake crash:

Error: SZ_GetSpace: 8138 is > full buffer size

C:\quake>

Situation...

#2054 Posted by Tronyn. [24.66.247.146], 30/12/2001 21:01 GMT

Alright, here is the situation I'm having trouble with. A large map, around 1,300 entities and 4,000 brushes.

Problems:

-If the full map is run without clipping off or deleting large areas, QBSP gives a too many clipnodes error.

-Map cannot be viewed in quake. Various crashes include General Protection Fault immediately, General Protection Fault after 5-10 seconds, SZ_GetSpace: 8138 is > full buffer size, overflow without allowoverflow set, too many static entities, no free edicts.

Attemped solutions:

-The too many clipnodes problem could be fixed if the remaining leaks could be fixed. However for that to happen I have to be able to view the whole map in Quake, since I compiled the map in sections and rid each section of leaks - these last leaks are at the joints.

-Upon slicing off the first third of the map(2,800 brushes as opposed to 4,000 now), plugging the void off with a giant brush, and reducing the entity count from 1300 to around 600, the map STILL GIVES A GENERAL PROTECTION FAULT and so I cannot go in and fix the leak(s).

For chrissakes, what am I supposed to do with this. I wish to fix the leaks and remove enough entites so that the overflow/no free edicts/too many statics errors go away. But I really don't know how I'm going to get this done.

For starters, what exactly qualifies as a static entity - torches, flames, barrels, ambient sounds, right? What exactly is the limit. Is there a program which can count the number of static entites in a map. Is there a program which can delete all of the static entities in the map.

Will fixing the leak and getting the map vised + running the edict-freeing program solve the general protection fault crash? I think it might.

yeah, and happy goddamn new year. what a gay map.

Tronyn, If You're Referring To Soe2m4,

#2055 Posted by aguirRe [195.163.201.65], 30/12/2001 22:08 GMT , Refers to Post #2054

I've found two of the leaks and going for the third (tomorrow). But it's one big map and it's really a struggle since the map can't normally be loaded into GLQuake to inspect the pointfile. One has to do it in an indirect manner.

I've so far been using both WC (which can load the pointfile) and QuArK in order to identify the leaks and then patch the map file manually. It works, but it's a major pain.

But I have an idea : When getting the leak coordinates and the corresponding PTS file, then just chop out all other parts of the map (including entities) around this area and compile again. Make it rather brutal, no sealing off.

Then you get a lot of leaks and whatnot but you get a BSP that is small enough to be loaded into GLQuake together with the original PTS file that identifies the leak. This works and should probably be easier ...

Can Someone Make These Maps ?

#2056 Posted by Link [212.186.255.4], 30/12/2001 23:19 GMT

http://www.challenge-eu.com/smackdown/north/columns/link/

It's Quake maps

Thanks for helping out whomever you are =)

#2057 Posted by [Tronyn] [24.66.247.146], 31/12/2001 01:06 GMT

Hey, I never thought of that!!!
that is a very good idea - beats the crap out of what I've been doing - basically banging my head against the wall since I sent you the map.

upon fixing the last one though, be ready for some major problems with Quake about the map's size (I think).

Re: Situation...

#2058 Posted by Tyrann [203.56.239.117], 31/12/2001 01:57 GMT , Refers to Post #2054

If your heapsize isn't big enough, that can cause GPFs as well. 12 or 16 Megs should be enough for just about any map...

I Vaguely Recall...

#2059 Posted by XeNoN [194.117.133.196], 31/12/2001 02:00 GMT , Refers to Post #2058

...having to allocate more on neh3m2 and gmsp1. That's all though :)

Transparent Floors

#2060 Posted by Fern [172.173.140.110], 31/12/2001 03:13 GMT

(sigh) bad and good news. I just watched some SDA demos on n3sp03 and noticed the same effect where brushes seem to have large holes in them or something (hard to describe) and I certainly didn't notice anything like that when I first played the map. So the bad news is that Quake is uglier, but the good news is that at least the problems I'm having now with perssp3 aren't due to my incompetent unmitred mapping ;)

BTW I know nobody cares about any of this shit so I'll probably stop whining so much in this thread

#2061 Posted by Speedy [80.70.224.89], 31/12/2001 04:15 GMT

wellcome back to mapping Fern ;)

Re: Lighting

#2062 Posted by QuakeTree [65.141.121.150], 01/01/2002 02:54 GMT

Ok, I've got a question...
I'm lighting a gothic map that has both outdoor and indoor elements, I'm using the _sunlight and the _sun_mangle option's in Tomlight. Who uses what settings for the following:

1) Sunlight intensity
2) Background Light
3) Wall Light's (torches ect) + wait
4) Non sourced lights + wait

The reason I ask is when (if) I release it I want it to be as compatable with both software and most GLQuake engines as possible (although with todays PC's I would have to lean towards GL).

Thx

#2063 Posted by Fern [172.155.230.31], 01/01/2002 03:37 GMT

sunlight works fine in both GL and software as long as you're building a bsp29 and not bsp30 (colored lights in the bsp and not a .lit file.) are you sure you meant tomlight and not tyrlite? :)

Oh... Yes...

#2064 Posted by Fern [172.155.230.31], 01/01/2002 03:38 GMT

and everything else in your list works fine as well with that stupilation =)

#2065 Posted by Lunaran [64.109.168.248], 01/01/2002 05:06 GMT

that's "stipulation"

#2066 Posted by Fern [172.149.34.76], 01/01/2002 08:15 GMT

loll tahnks i'm fcuking tried it's 3:00am in the morning =)

QuakeTree Is Still Working On A Title

#2067 Posted by QuakeTree [65.139.29.94], 01/01/2002 09:24 GMT

Actually what I was looking for was related more to the avg gamma being used by most players out there. I did not want it too bright or too dark. And yes I did mean tomlight 1.2.

A cut and paste from the Tomlight 1.2 read me...

The only difference between this prog and Tyrann's TyrLite.exe is that his prog puts colored light in the .bsp and saves it as BSP30... My version of it still keeps it as BSP29 which is q1 original... instead it saves the color information in a separate .lit file... So anything u could do in TyrLite 0.8 u can also do with this... and everything is done EXACTLY the same way... only changed thing is the way it saves the color information.... And all credits for this goes to Tyrann and NO credit goes to me...

So as far as I know it is a bsp 29 unless the read me is wrong.

I was wondering about what "most" mappers use as an average lighting amount for the above mentioned lighting sources. I can make it look just fine on my screen but how would it look on others (if you know what I mean).

Cheers and happy new years

#2068 Posted by Fern [172.165.131.176], 01/01/2002 16:47 GMT

BSP29 + LIT can be played on any engine, including winquake and glquake. The colored lights might not appear but the map will still work. As for trying to get the lighting just right for everybody's monitor/gamma level, you're basically screwed. It's impossible. =) What I've done in the past is set my gamma level to something that makes the original maps look tolerable, and then light to that level, frequently comparing it to iD maps.

#2069 Posted by QuakeTree [65.139.28.81], 01/01/2002 19:45 GMT

Thanks. Thought I would try though.

#2070 Posted by [Tronyn] [24.66.247.146], 01/01/2002 21:00 GMT

with reoccuring func_spawns from the hipnotic pack, does this mean that it spawns something whenever triggered (can be triggered multiple times) or that upon being triggered it just keeps spawning stuff?

#2071 Posted by Tyrann [203.56.239.111], 02/01/2002 00:34 GMT , Refers to Post #2070

Spawns once for each time triggered.

Need Help (specially Coding...

#2072 Posted by nx [195.23.214.20], 02/01/2002 02:02 GMT

Hi all
Hope the new year party was good for all :-)
i'm going to work with virtual reality
in education (want to use Q1 as engine and a helmet VFX1 with cyberpuck for stereo3d and tracking). At this moment, i decided to create a castle (realistic one)
so that students can learn how a siege was made a�d see the castle defenses.
I also would like to create real medieval scenarios (the daily life in the castle).
I decided to use Quake 1 because i managed to get a VFX1, so my students can
realy go in for a field trip.
If i can pull this through , at the end of 2002 a university project will start with
Quake 3 and i'll be recruiting help (maybe with payment and all). We will search for ruined and no longer
existing monuments and rebuild them virtually.
Before all that, i've to pull through my personal project... (have no experience, i'm just a history and education teacher trying to go further - and like quake :-))
my main problem is coding...
i want place new models, not just replace the monsters with humans and oher animated mdl(knights, soldiers, peasants, etc) but also insert some inert models. The problem is that my insert mdl (books, trees,etc), when i replace ammo or keys (for example) can be "eaten" by the user/player. how can i place mdl's that just stay there (like if yhey were brushs)?
how can i place them with the editor
(used qoole)? qoole only allows to place the ones that come in the game...
i also would like to insert new sounds.
is there somone willing to give me hand?

thank you all

Nelson

Short Answer

#2073 Posted by Nightbringer [203.109.252.15], 02/01/2002 03:20 GMT , Refers to Post #2072

You can't without QC; however it's trivial to code.

Hmm, No Title

#2074 Posted by nx [195.23.214.20], 02/01/2002 03:39 GMT , Refers to Post #2073

not realy... at least not for me... never done it, have no idea...

#2075 Posted by Speedy [80.70.224.134], 02/01/2002 04:27 GMT

this is mainly mapping board, visit inside3d.com for quake coding (there are some tutorials that might help)

#2076 Posted by Speedy [80.70.224.134], 02/01/2002 04:36 GMT

question on tyrlite
why -nominlimit switch makes map about 50% brighter overall ?

#2077 Posted by pjw [12.246.133.99], 02/01/2002 05:12 GMT , Refers to Post #2072

Maybe you should talk to someone who shares your interest in Quake in the classroom. Maybe you guys could help each other out in some fashion? There's also some info and ideas in that thread that might help you . . . dunno.

Try Using Func_illusionary

#2078 Posted by Fat Controller [203.79.68.183], 02/01/2002 09:08 GMT , Refers to Post #2072

This is a wierd little trick I spotted in the CZG05 map source. And it works in normal Quake!

Basically, you set a func_illusionary as a point entity with a "model" parm that points to the model (e.g. "progs/h_player.mdl") and a "frame" parm (e.g. 60). If the model has more than one skin you can select one with a "skin" parm.

The result: custom-tailored eye candy.

In theory this could work with func_walls or anything else that usually takes a brush model, like a train or door...

#2079 Posted by XeNoN [194.117.133.196], 02/01/2002 10:03 GMT

question on tyrlite
why -nominlimit switch makes map about 50% brighter overall ?

From what I've gathered, with that switch enabled, it will add the values of 2 lights lighting the same area, instead of subtracting the lowest value. The main problem comes with using both minlight and sunlight; if you have a minlight of 50 and a sunlight value of 120, then all sunlit areas will appear as 170. Simply lower the sunlight value by 50 and all will be fine again.

#2080 Posted by XeNoN [194.117.133.196], 02/01/2002 10:06 GMT , Refers to Post #2078

My god, I honestly never new that was possible. Goes to show you learn something new everyday!

Someone needs to stick up a tutorial about all the different hacks you can do to the Quake entities without altering code... there seem to be are loads.

There Seem To Be Loads.

#2081 Posted by XeNoN [194.117.133.196], 02/01/2002 10:07 GMT , Refers to Post #2080

#2082 Posted by Nightbringer [203.109.252.19], 02/01/2002 10:19 GMT , Refers to Post #2078

so that's he did it; I thought it was done by setting a info_notnull's .think to player_dieX().

Fern Is Still Working On A Title

#2083 Posted by Fern [172.186.32.80], 02/01/2002 15:23 GMT

Someone needs to stick up a tutorial about all the different hacks you can do to the Quake entities without altering code... there seem to be loads.

Please email all your submissions to suspenlute@aol.com =)

Need Coding Help For Different Project

#2084 Posted by nx [195.23.214.174], 02/01/2002 16:29 GMT

Hi all
i'm lloking for someone that can collaborate (coding) with the project.
Need a coder for educational project with quake. I wany to create a virtual Environment
so that my students can do virtual reality field trips to a medieval castle. Why q1?
because a managed to get a VFX1 (helmet for stereo 3d) and it works with q1.

i need...

- 30 inert models (mdl with just one frame, kind like a key or ammo but
can't be taken, be "eated", just stay there like a brush) numbered
from "o1" (that's for object 1 :-) to "o30". by the way, how can i place them? i know to replace but how can i place new mdl with the editor?

- besides the monsters (i will use them to replace for others) i still need
more 10 animated mdls

a) 3 mdl with almost the same behaviour as the dog: 5 frames for "stand"
behaviour (frames will be stand1, stand2 etc) and 15 to "walk" (frames will be
walk1, walk2, etc) just need stand and walk (that's all the'yre going to do).

b) 7 mdl with almost some behaviour as the ogre (or orther): 5 frames for "stand"
behaviour (frames will be stand1, stand2 etc) and 15 to "walk" (frames will be
walk1, walk2, etc) just need stand and walk (that's all the'yre going to do).

can anyone do this for me? i realy can't code and it's difficult for me...
please guys, give me a hand on this. let me show that quake is a good engine with educational potential!

Nelson

Re: Need Coding Help For Different Proje

#2085 Posted by Preach [213.122.222.29], 02/01/2002 18:22 GMT , Refers to Post #2084

>can anyone do this for me? i realy can't code and it's difficult for me...
>please guys, give me a hand on this. let me show that quake is a good engine with
>educational potential!

I'll give it a go, check your e-mail

Three Questions:

#2086 Posted by [Tronyn] [24.66.247.146], 02/01/2002 23:36 GMT

these are all to do with reducing entity count:

1) is there a way to do spotlights without info_nulls - with angles or something?

2) do pointlights contribute to entity crashes, or is it just things like torches, monsters - things with models.

3) what is the limit for entities per map in the quake engine - overall, for invisible point entities, for solid entities, and for model entities?

#2087 Posted by Starbuck [213.122.130.222], 02/01/2002 23:42 GMT

tronyn in tyrlite you can give spotlights a _mangle key, with key values * * 0, where the first number is the direction 0-360, and the second is the pitch 90 to -90 up to down, i think

mind you this is all in the readme far more accurately

#2088 Posted by palldjon [203.29.11.38], 03/01/2002 00:02 GMT , Refers to Post #2086

1) Tyrlight rules in the spotlight stakes, no info_null required.

2) Point lights don't lead to edict crashes, but if you hit max entities...you hit max entities.

#2089 Posted by palldjon [203.29.11.38], 03/01/2002 00:05 GMT , Refers to Post #2086

3) I believe the max number of entities per .bsp is 2048.

#2090 Posted by Fern [172.136.67.136], 03/01/2002 02:45 GMT

brush entities are limited to 255
"static" entities (which, from my experience, only refers to flaming lightsources) have the same limit I -think-, I hit it in perssp2 ;)

Re: Nominlimit Problems

#2091 Posted by Tyrann [203.56.239.116], 03/01/2002 02:58 GMT , Refers to Post #2076

That sounds like a bug. XeNoN's explanation doesn't really make sense to me, but I'll do some tests when I get some time.

#2092 Posted by Speedy [80.70.224.90], 03/01/2002 04:21 GMT

You culd actually get rid of static torches, and recreate them as QC-based models.
To get rid of any lights - use q1rad (not the best idea imo)

On Nominlimit: looks like Xen idea is right. At least it LOOKS like that ;)

Hmm, No Title

#2093 Posted by XeNoN [194.117.133.196], 03/01/2002 13:30 GMT , Refers to Post #2091

XeNoN's explanation doesn't really make sense to me, but I'll do some tests when I get some time

I'm basing it on my own experience, with xnq1002 :P
I used nominlimit so I could get the antiliights working in the underground caves, but the outdoor areas all appeared really bright... when I lowered the sunlight value by the value of the minlight it was back to normal...

This is v8 btw, is it fixed in v9?

Re: Nominlimit Stuff

#2094 Posted by Tyrann [203.56.239.200], 03/01/2002 14:36 GMT , Refers to Post #2093

No, nothing that would affect that was changed from 0.8 -> 0.9. Just to clarify, your explanation does make sense in itself, but the effect you are describing doesn't make sense from a coding point of view. It just means I'll have to look more carefully when I do.

Nominlimit + Sunlight Bug - Question

#2095 Posted by Tyrann [203.56.239.111], 04/01/2002 13:40 GMT

Ok, I think I worked out the bug. I think it only happens if you use sunlight + nominlimit and no color (works ok with color as far as I can tell).

XeNoN or Speedy:
Is this true? Were you using color or not?

I'll upload a new release soon.

#2096 Posted by XeNoN [194.117.133.196], 04/01/2002 16:11 GMT

No color. Have you tried placing two spotlights about 192 units apart and shining them into eachother so the path crosses? I vaguely recall nominlimit altering that also (the bit where they cross is twice as bright) .. I could be wrong though...

#2097 Posted by Tyrann [203.56.239.116], 04/01/2002 17:38 GMT , Refers to Post #2096

Now it seems clearer. Nominlimit never worked properly unless you used color. Every light would get cast twice, causing the double brightness effect. I think I've got all that sorted now. I'll test a bit more tommorow and upload a new version if it's all working as expected.

#2098 Posted by Speedy [80.70.224.86], 05/01/2002 04:39 GMT

Tyrann is the man !

#2099 Posted by Fat Controller [203.79.109.245], 05/01/2002 05:09 GMT

Nominlimit never worked properly unless you used color.

Could you get around this bug by setting a color of '255 255 255'?

#2100 Posted by Tyrann [203.56.239.111], 05/01/2002 06:09 GMT , Refers to Post #2099

Nope. Only if you compile with "-colored", which will generate a bsp30.
New (fixed) version is now up on my site, though you'll have to wait a bit for the fileplanet mirrors to catch up of course.

#2101 Posted by DaZ [213.122.37.194], 05/01/2002 12:56 GMT

Could you modify Tyrlite to output a .lit file instead of a BSP 30. makes much more sense to me...

#2102 Posted by Tyrann [203.56.239.117], 05/01/2002 13:25 GMT , Refers to Post #2101

Damn GS Pay DL

#2103 Posted by Jimbo [216.12.43.21], 05/01/2002 15:31 GMT , Refers to Post #2101

Can you please upload it somewhere other than GS/FP cause I can't dl it without a pay account there.

thanks,
-[Jimbo]

#2104 Posted by Tyrann [203.56.239.117], 05/01/2002 15:34 GMT , Refers to Post #2103

Yes you can. Just wait for it to be mirrored (should be within 24 hours).

#2105 Posted by Jimbo [216.12.43.21], 05/01/2002 16:42 GMT , Refers to Post #2104

#2106 Posted by Speedy [80.70.224.125], 06/01/2002 04:20 GMT

does output bsp29 +lit, its the same as tyrlite 0.8 in all ways
the proper one (older)
www.planetquake.com/speedy/tomlite.zip

#2107 Posted by DaZ [213.122.114.61], 06/01/2002 04:43 GMT

yeah I know tomlite does, but skylight seems to be broken in it, and you have to light the map **twice** if you are using color.

Pointless... Yes

and "tyrlite" is a much cooler name

Damn Straight

#2108 Posted by Asriel [203.79.80.82], 06/01/2002 09:52 GMT , Refers to Post #2107

its a cool name

#2109 Posted by necros [172.159.224.9], 06/01/2002 15:46 GMT , Refers to Post #2108

Tyrlite + onelite. Perfect combo.

onelite takes about 1 second to run.

#2110 Posted by DaZ [213.122.47.109], 06/01/2002 18:10 GMT

but having tyrlite just output a .lit would be much easier, damn Im lazy

#2111 Posted by Fern [172.168.244.51], 06/01/2002 21:19 GMT

rename tyrlite.exe and make tyrlite.bat :P

#2112 Posted by necros [172.133.204.125], 07/01/2002 02:10 GMT

like this:

in a batch file:

light.bat:

@tyrlite %1 -nominlimit -colored
@onelite %1

See? Simple!

Speedy Thought A Title Wasn't Needed

#2113 Posted by Speedy [80.70.224.129], 07/01/2002 04:05 GMT

mahhhn

I give you the PROPER tomlite (not the newer, fucked up one)
I mean what I say, and if you question the correctness of my words, please bother to try what I say, then whine.

Er... When Running Quake:

#2114 Posted by necros [172.159.39.36], 08/01/2002 01:09 GMT

ED_ParseEntity: closing brace without data

The map is about 3000 brushes, and has very little bmodels so far...

The map, however, did vis, and light, and compile properly.

#2115 Posted by DaZ [213.122.59.221], 08/01/2002 02:01 GMT

Check all yer entity text, I **think** I may have had an error like this before where something you typed into an entity f00ked the game, I could be wrong tho...

#2116 Posted by Fern [172.133.103.198], 08/01/2002 02:31 GMT

quotes or commas anywhere in the fields will kill the game. not sure what the error message is though.

#2117 Posted by necros [172.129.124.227], 08/01/2002 02:35 GMT , Refers to Post #2115

hm.. quite interresting. I checked out the entity list in adquedit (of the bsp), and the last two or three entities were _totally_ fucked. They had been turned into a mish mash of odd characters... Is there any reason for this? I had left wqbsp running during the night, so I don't see why this process would have been so dully fuxored...

#2118 Posted by Tyrann [203.56.239.117], 08/01/2002 07:39 GMT , Refers to Post #2117

I'm assuming you looked at the bsp's entity text, not your map file.

Likely thing is that one of the compilers is overflowing one bsp lump into another. Try looking at the map with just bsp (no light or vis) and see if it's ok that way. If not, try using TreeBSP since that allocates the memory it needs dynamically and the corruption won't occur.

#2119 Posted by Tyrann [203.56.239.111], 08/01/2002 07:41 GMT

Ok, you looked at the bsp. I must be half asleep...

Q3Radiant Tutorials

#2120 Posted by Pablosky [205.188.199.182], 09/01/2002 06:43 GMT

Dudes

For some reason I got this urge to make Q3 maps, so i got Q3Radiant202 and I wanna know if there are any tutorials for newbies. Yeah, heh.

#2121 Posted by pjw [208.192.76.75], 09/01/2002 08:05 GMT

Suggestions:
1. Switch to GTK Radiant.
2. Read the manual.
3. Go here for tutorials.

Have fun.

#2122 Posted by Pablosky [152.163.197.207], 09/01/2002 22:25 GMT , Refers to Post #2121

#2123 Posted by necros [172.156.163.179], 10/01/2002 01:44 GMT , Refers to Post #2118

Right, so I recompiled the map with no light, and no vis. Worked fine.

Compiled Light... Fuxored. Only about 14000 faces (think) with about 550 lights.

Interesting...

#2124 Posted by Tyrann [203.56.239.200], 10/01/2002 01:58 GMT , Refers to Post #2123

If you're using tyrlite, I'd like to see that bsp... (before corruption, so I can test)

Who Needs A Title Anyway

#2125 Posted by Speedy [80.70.224.73], 10/01/2002 02:31 GMT

I wouldnt trust ALL the tutorials linked from claudec. Some outdated info and not-great techniques there.

#2126 Posted by [Tronyn] [24.66.247.146], 10/01/2002 02:54 GMT

anyone know of a better way to track down a 'leaf saw into leaf' error than cutting off pieces of the map, compiling it, and seeing if it vises?
I've been doing this for about 3 hours straight without much success; I've foudn the general area, or at least I thought I had, but now I can't replicate (that is, get rid of the error by deleting the same area) what I did before. aaaargh.

#2127 Posted by pjw [208.192.76.75], 10/01/2002 03:57 GMT

You are correct. It is the best place I know to start, though . . .

History Of Mapping?

#2128 Posted by Asriel [203.79.75.8], 10/01/2002 10:00 GMT

In earlier fps games (Wolf3d, DOOM, etc), was the compiling process like q1 etc?

Like, a basic compile, lighting, then a VIS type process?

#2129 Posted by Maj [193.128.238.152], 10/01/2002 10:52 GMT

There was a compile step for Doom (BSP + REJECT + BLOCKMAP, IIRC), but it was pretty fast even on the P60 I had back then.

#2130 Posted by Maj [193.128.238.152], 10/01/2002 11:07 GMT

'Fast' isn't exactly precise. The default compile from DoomEd (sortof equivalent to not running vis in quake) took a few seconds. Proper BSP'ing (sortof equivalent to vis) took a few minutes.

Vis For Doom

#2131 Posted by Fern [172.173.134.72], 10/01/2002 16:21 GMT

consisted of generating nodes =)

#2132 Posted by Speedy [80.70.224.76], 11/01/2002 02:34 GMT

I recall there was some zenode (node building) prog and some vis and it all took few seconds on 486 133+ /16 ram. Tho I`v never made really big maps.
Compare it to fucking hours that a quake map can take on the modern puter.. Doom was mapping heaven ;)

Node Building

#2133 Posted by Shadowdane [67.161.48.48], 11/01/2002 03:45 GMT

acually i remember making this rather huge map in Doom2 it took up nearly the entire map grid that took maybe 20-30 minutes to run threw the node builder on my P75 / 24mb RAM..

I have no clue where that level is today though.. I think i might of uploaded it on cdrom.com but I lost my copy of it on my HD a while ago.

oh well...

Maps With .lit Support

#2134 Posted by Tyrann [203.56.239.117], 11/01/2002 13:45 GMT

Can anyone point me to some maps that have .lit support?
I'm testing the new tyrlite... I'll find some myself, but if someone can save me some time, that'll be great.

#2135 Posted by DaZ [213.122.19.80], 12/01/2002 14:08 GMT , Refers to Post #2134

[ crdm2 ]

Misdm12 (dunno the link tho)

[ lthsp 1,2,3,4 ]

#2136 Posted by R.P.G. [165.247.128.131], 12/01/2002 18:48 GMT

Asriel: Duke3D (Build) didn't have a compiling step that was directly invoked by the author. I don't know if it was done while editing, or at the start of each level, but either way it wasn't noticeable. As a result, any map you downloaded could be quickly opened and edited as there was no need to decompile.

Tyrann: RPGSP1 had a small bit of coloured lighting via .lit file. Source is available. Visit my website to get it, or skip right to the map's page.

Leaf Saw Into ...

#2137 Posted by Mike Woodham [217.34.75.217], 12/01/2002 19:46 GMT , Refers to Post #2126

This can be caused by tiny brushes (drawn in error) and if it gives this error only on a quick vis and not on a full one, it's worth looking at the map file in Wordpad (or whatever txt editor) and looking through the brush codes.

I know this sounds very labour intensive, but I found an similar error on a 1500 brush map this way, in about one hour.

#2138 Posted by R.P.G. [165.247.161.161], 13/01/2002 00:29 GMT

MapSpy is great for tracking bad brushes. Quite likely completely irrelevant, but everyone should know of it and use it. It saved me from sodomising this map I'm converting.

TyrLite 0.92

#2139 Posted by Tyrann [203.56.239.111], 13/01/2002 02:38 GMT

TyrLite 0.92 has been released.
This version adds support for generating .lit colored light files.

Download from here:
tyrlite-0.92.zip
tyrlite-0.92-src-GPL.zip

Click here for more...

Interesting

#2140 Posted by Asriel [203.79.75.56], 14/01/2002 01:32 GMT

Thinknig of ways to make maps run could almost be as hard as coding it.

Maybe.

No.

Of course not.

But still, intersting.

#2141 Posted by Shambler [194.117.133.84], 14/01/2002 17:05 GMT

Weird RTCW Compile Error.......

Posted by zF0Rm [217.80.0.14], 14/01/2002 16:56 GMT

alright, here it is:
i have a little test room ready for compile. i use the q3map.exe modified by pointy for rtcw for compiling. when i try to compile through radiant, it tells me that bsp moniting failed and that the map probably wasnt compiled. guess what, radiant is right. when i try to use wolfcompile on this map, i get folling error message in the win32 shell:
<*********ERROR*******
SetQdirFromPath: no 'wolfenstein' in C:\Programme\Return to Castle Wolfquake\main\maps\Only.map>

hope anyone will read this post....

#2142 Posted by cyBeAr [213.64.67.243], 14/01/2002 17:15 GMT , Refers to Post #2141

Sounds like you need to have "wolfenstein" somehere in your wolf dir.

For q3 you had to ahve "quake3" or soemthing in your dir name.

#2143 Posted by Whittal [194.117.133.196], 15/01/2002 21:35 GMT

Um i am a newbie to map making and i wanted to make a map for quake 2 how can i make one? do i use a program and if so what one is the best and free?

#2144 Posted by DaZ [213.122.43.176], 15/01/2002 22:27 GMT

What you want is either Qer or Worldcraft, most people here prefer Qer for Q2 editing, Im sure one of them will provide a link because I have no idea where the site is as I dont use it myself

You may also want to find yourself some good tutorials, I geuss Rust is the best place for that, again could someone please provide a link

Q2 Mapping Stuff...

#2145 Posted by kanaeda [64.71.235.99], 15/01/2002 22:39 GMT

you can get the latest install and patches/plug-ins for QeRadiant here. I highly recomend downloading an off-line copy of the quake 2 editing tutorials from RUST, as well.

hope that helps you along some. :)

WC3.3 With Dubsp

#2146 Posted by BlackPope [64.180.248.173], 16/01/2002 00:44 GMT

Okay i've set up worldcraft 3.3 to compile quake maps with dubsp... it seems to work fine... but once the map is a certain size... like 50 brushes or 200 surfaces or something.. (im not sure of the specific #)
wc compiles... and dubsp runs but it just crashes... and closes...
I had this problem with Tyrlite aswell...

I think it has something to do with the progress indicator... because if its on it usually just stalls... and when its off it just closes down wc completely and doesn't complete anythign...

I'm also running w2k , which Im sure has soemthing to do with this...

#2147 Posted by DaZ [213.122.49.252], 16/01/2002 01:03 GMT

If you run progs which use a progress bar in the WC compile window then it will crash it. try compiling outside of Wc and see if that helps, if not then I cant help im afraid...

#2148 Posted by kanaeda [64.71.235.99], 16/01/2002 01:24 GMT

sure am glad I avoided WC in favor of the radiant family. bugs like that are just... stupid. ;p

#2149 Posted by Tyrann [203.56.239.116], 16/01/2002 01:54 GMT , Refers to Post #2146

I don't know if you can specify extra command line parameters, but with tyrlite you can add "-nocount" to get rid of the progress counter. There's probably a similar option for dubsp as well...

#2150 Posted by Pablosky [172.138.93.121], 16/01/2002 10:23 GMT

Dudes:

well, I got Radiant for it didn't work on my pc, tried a few times so i gave up, downloaded WC v1.6 and started mapping for Q1. Now. I got mapping and when I ran it Boom! Leaks. man, I never had this kind of problem before. i ran the pointfile thingy and man, so many fucking red lines! I took a screenshot of it. I wanna know if the map is really fucked up, 'cause if it is, then I guess I'll start all over again, don't wanna waste time fixing stuff that might take days... well, is the first time i see something like this, never had this problem...'cause i never edited before. = )

here's the link to the pic: http://dictterp.tripod.com/Images/pdq1leaks.jpg

Pablosky.

p.s
if you think you can fix it...tell me about it.

The Map Ain't Fucked Up

#2151 Posted by czg [158.38.54.23], 16/01/2002 10:44 GMT

WC's pointfile processing is. Only thing those lines will do is confuse you.
Instead, start up your map in quake, and type
pointfile on the console. Now follow the dotted trail until you see where they go out of the level. Then plug the hole.
Oh, and use a bigger screen res would ya?

#2152 Posted by czg [158.38.54.23], 16/01/2002 10:44 GMT

Pablosky Thought A Title Wasn't Needed

#2153 Posted by Pablosky [172.138.93.121], 16/01/2002 10:50 GMT , Refers to Post #2151

whoa, now that's a relief. = )
gonna try that. heh, its a newbie thing...

...higer resolution? pfft! i don't care 'bout that. i'm happy w/ anything, even if it's 320x200 or whatever da hell it is.

Thank dude. = )

tobotobo Is Still Working On A Title

#2154 Posted by tobotobo [195.179.158.135], 16/01/2002 15:30 GMT , Refers to Post #2150

So many red lines, looks funny, thought it was a hoax...
Why does Worldcraft's leak finder freak up that?

River Sideways

#2155 Posted by M�nch [195.179.158.135], 16/01/2002 15:34 GMT

Hello!

I'm working with IonRadiant for Daikatana, and I built a waterfall. Now sadly the water doesn't flow in the correct direction. It flows sidewards! I tried various ways of altering the direction of the flow, but none of them worked. Can anyone tell me how to adjust the texture flow direction in IonRadiant/QeRadiant?

I'd appreciate any help.

Thanks,
M�nch

Who Needs A Title Anyway

#2156 Posted by wrath [217.208.233.74], 16/01/2002 16:59 GMT

tilt your head.

voila!

#2157 Posted by GrindSpire [213.1.128.191], 16/01/2002 21:04 GMT , Refers to Post #2155

Rotate the texture 90 degrees...

Who Needs A Title Anyway

#2158 Posted by Speedy [80.70.224.116], 17/01/2002 02:29 GMT

or maybe mess with surface flags ? I might look into that later, stay tuned ;)

Hmm, No Title

#2159 Posted by DeFrag [66.152.70.42], 17/01/2002 03:14 GMT

Rundown Of Solutions

#2160 Posted by M�nch [195.179.158.135], 17/01/2002 08:44 GMT , Refers to Post #2155

Hmm, I tried tilting my head, now the waterfall is ok, but the whole level is rotated 90�! (-: uuuuhhh...

Rotating the texture by 90� might not be a good choice for all textures, I mean it will probably be ok for a water texture, but what if I want some other texture animated that way?
There must be some way of specifying the flowing direction of the texture...

Surface Flags...I haven't found any that set a direction. You can set directions for the whole water brush (like a river current, so you will flow that way), but I haven't found any flags for texture movement on individual faces. Tried adding a direction value in the "value" box (value according to those that you set in the entity dialog, for instance 90 for north), but it didn't do anything.

I also have another problem with my transparent water. It looks all fine from above, but when you dive into it you have a black plane above you (the surface), no transparency and no lighting at all. Any solutions for this?

Texture Rotating

#2161 Posted by iART [24.64.223.204], 17/01/2002 19:09 GMT , Refers to Post #2155

I think Grindspire means, rotate the texture in your MAP editor... not a GRAPHICS editor.

Like this >>> screen shot

Yeah I Understood That Right...

#2162 Posted by M�nch [195.179.158.135], 18/01/2002 09:00 GMT , Refers to Post #2161

but what if I experience this problem with other textures. Like if I want to make a scrolling advertising slogan or so and it just scrolls up/down. If I rotate the texture then the text will be...rotated (-:
Get it?
Anyway, don't know if I tried that texture rotating. If not then D'uh! Will check that out.

#2163 Posted by Jimbo [216.12.57.166], 18/01/2002 20:31 GMT

I'm working on a q1 dm map, about 800 brushes, using Quark.
When I'm walking around the map in quake I keep falling through solid brushes. anyone know how to fix this?

(I tried remaking the same brush from scratch but it still lets me fall through)
The brushes in question look solid and they aren't illusionary entity brushes, but they act like them.

any suggestions?

-Jimbo

C'est Une Petite Probleme

#2164 Posted by xen [194.117.133.196], 18/01/2002 23:08 GMT

Got a custom progs.dat to work with which features ambient sounds a la:

ambient_general will play any sound you put in the 'noise' key. (ambience/windsuck.wav etc...) You'll have to loop the sound, though. Volume, and speed(attenuation) are configurable, but will default to volume:0.5 speed:3

The bit about looping I really don't get... I tested it in a level with a quake2 sound and it reported "error: ambience/fan1.wav not looped" or something. Yeah so it's hardly mapping help but wth :/

#2165 Posted by xen [194.117.133.196], 18/01/2002 23:10 GMT

Necros, if you're about, I would have emailed but the servers are playing up... it's your code that I'm using.

#2166 Posted by necros [172.150.71.249], 18/01/2002 23:17 GMT , Refers to Post #2165

code? sm36? ah...

yes, well, the code isn't the problem. the sound file itself must be looped (doable with a program like CoolEdit2k).

Basically, it involves putting start and end markers into the sound file. If you can't do this, Just tell me which sound in q2, and I'll do it for ya.

#2167 Posted by xen [194.117.133.196], 18/01/2002 23:23 GMT

I've tried faffing about in Goldwave with the sounds, but the "insert markers" option seem to unaffect it.

I'll try searching for Cooledit2k in a bit, but I'd be grateful if you could hax0r them for the time being. They are:

amb4
amb14
amb19
fan1

...all in the world subfolder.

Thanks.

Coming To A Mailbox

#2168 Posted by necros [172.150.71.249], 18/01/2002 23:38 GMT , Refers to Post #2167

Get A Job !

#2169 Posted by Speedy [80.70.224.76], 19/01/2002 02:16 GMT

http://www.humanhead.com/headhunt.htm

Get A Life !

#2170 Posted by Vigil [193.229.6.165], 19/01/2002 08:23 GMT

http://www.gamespystore.com/product.asp?pid=020626711760

Hmm, No Title

#2171 Posted by wrath [217.208.233.88], 19/01/2002 13:56 GMT , Refers to Post #2170

what? does that mean I'll have to buy two copies?

#2172 Posted by Drannerz [143.52.2.203], 19/01/2002 16:55 GMT , Refers to Post #2163

I've had that problem a few times. I deleted the brush and build a differnt shaped one.

Wierd Brush.

#2173 Posted by necros [172.155.196.238], 19/01/2002 22:08 GMT , Refers to Post #2172

try this:

stick a func_wall over the funky brush. As long as it fills, and vises, it should work fine...

#2174 Posted by Jimbo [216.12.57.205], 19/01/2002 23:10 GMT

I fixed the thing where you fall through a solid floor.

I cut up the main floor brush into 4 parts and that seems to have worked.

Now I have to worry about the "too many Efrags" error when it loads.

Can someone tell me exactly what that means?

Someone on quakelab said the map needed to be fully vised to fix it, but it IS fully vised (level 4).

could it have anything to do with the excessive # of flames for lighting?

-Jimbo

#2175 Posted by Tyrann [203.56.239.111], 20/01/2002 01:02 GMT , Refers to Post #2174

could it have anything to do with the excessive # of flames for lighting?

Yes, that's probably it.
Efrags are entity fragments. An entity in open space should only generate one efrag, but an entity in close proximity to complex geometry could generate dozens. I had the same problem with Moolight Assault and it turned out to be the flames I had mounted all over the level. I took a few out and then it was ok.

#2176 Posted by DaZ [213.122.177.200], 20/01/2002 15:16 GMT

I dont care how it works, but it looks fucking good, heh

#2177 Posted by cereal [212.151.41.29], 20/01/2002 16:29 GMT

hi i need a mapper to join my team. we are making a mod based on Mission Impossible.
to contact join mirc chan #qmi on quakenet server.

//cereal

I Have A Suggestion

#2178 Posted by cereal [212.151.41.29], 20/01/2002 16:31 GMT , Refers to Post #2163

dont use quark for mapping use qoole.

//Cereal

Ce'st Une Petite Solition

#2179 Posted by mathias [212.151.41.29], 20/01/2002 16:34 GMT , Refers to Post #2164

goto inside3d.com and click ont the link to q1 tutes, look up "ambient sounds" under category "Misc"

//GOD [mode]

#2180 Posted by kanaeda [64.71.235.99], 20/01/2002 18:17 GMT , Refers to Post #2178

the simple fact that you are telling somebody to use Qoole to build maps proves you have no clue as to what you are doing.

#2181 Posted by DaZ [213.122.76.79], 20/01/2002 18:30 GMT

And Then There's The Ips Too...

#2182 Posted by necros [172.134.78.136], 20/01/2002 18:51 GMT

#2183 Posted by czg [158.38.54.65], 20/01/2002 19:28 GMT

You get those warnings if you have any solid entities spanning large areas of the level too. Say you made all tiny sticky-outy bits of your level into one freaking huge func_wall or illusionary, you'll bump into that. If that's the case, split it/them up into several smaller entities so they cover less ground.

DeFrag Is Still Working On A Title

#2184 Posted by DeFrag [66.152.70.109], 21/01/2002 00:00 GMT

but qoole is so UN!

#2185 Posted by killazontherun [211.28.55.25], 21/01/2002 01:44 GMT

Speedy Is Still Working On A Title

#2186 Posted by Speedy [80.70.224.114], 21/01/2002 03:27 GMT

q3/ogl question
For q3 textures must be dimensions of 2 ?
or 8 ? will 516x516 texture work ? or got shrunk

#2187 Posted by Nightbringer [203.109.252.14], 21/01/2002 03:36 GMT , Refers to Post #2186

Opengl textures have to be sized to a power of 2. I don't know how q3 deals with ones that aren't. Probably resizes them to the nearest, or to the next lowest.

#2188 Posted by Mathias [213.65.80.243], 21/01/2002 19:35 GMT , Refers to Post #2180

I bet you use QUARK? :P

#2189 Posted by [Tronyn] [24.66.247.146], 22/01/2002 05:02 GMT

this is such a gay error:

trigger_once or trigger_multiple says "map name by map author" upon stepping in front of a portal

trigger_changelevel *within* portal changes level.

IN THEORY, THAT IS.

in reality, you can get the message from the trigger_once or trigger_multiple, but move one virtual centimeter closer to the portal, AND IT CHANGES THE LEVEL! is that not an error of exceeding stupidity? it's as if the trigger_changelevel is created within the trigger_multiple/trigger_once, with a tiny margin, as opposed to where it ought to be, within the portal, a few feet away.

am I on crack here, or... well.. how do I cause this set-up to function in such a manner as befits what such a simple set of two entities in their respective responsibilites of function, ought to be doing!

Thats Fucked

#2190 Posted by Asriel [203.79.75.1], 22/01/2002 05:18 GMT

^

Anyway I have a question, which im sure has a tutorial somewhere, but...:

I want to trigger a series of lights to go on after triggered.

So, you walk through trigger brush, then four lights all go on, then a second later another 4, then another etc etc.

Any ideas?

Use Trigger_relays

#2191 Posted by Fat Controller [203.79.69.146], 22/01/2002 07:14 GMT , Refers to Post #2190

That is, have your triggering object aim at a set of trigger_relays which target the light banks.

Each trigger_relay should have its "delay" key set to some rising value to stagger the lights coming on.

This Is Gonna Sound.....

#2192 Posted by QuakeTree [65.139.32.58], 22/01/2002 07:32 GMT

stupid but:

what the hell is the real difference between hard and nightmare.....

</stupid>

#2193 Posted by Nightbringer [203.109.252.18], 22/01/2002 08:04 GMT , Refers to Post #2192

monsters refire faster (double-fire, some of them) and don't go into pain animations at all.

#2194 Posted by kanaeda [64.71.235.99], 22/01/2002 16:23 GMT , Refers to Post #2188

I'm strongly grounded in the radiant family of editors. learn one editor and you can build maps for a multitude of games. it's the obvious, logical choice.

Qoole has severe technical issues at the core of the progmram. the designers have been made aware of these issue many times and have not fixed the problems.

i think those reasons alone should indicate why qoole should be avoided at all costs.

#2195 Posted by R.P.G. [165.247.133.89], 22/01/2002 16:47 GMT , Refers to Post #2193

monsters refire faster (double-fire, some of them) and don't go into pain animations at all.

This is true in Quake 2. In Quake 1, for each higher skill level, the monsters have a higher rate of fire. In nightmare, the rate of fire is constant, e.i. there is no pause in between shots. Also, the vore balls go faster on each higher skill. On nightmare (in Q1) all monsters still have pain animations, but not in Q2 (which is why Q2DQ2 is done on hard skill and not nightmare, unlike QDQ).

I'm Back...

#2196 Posted by palldjon [203.29.11.38], 23/01/2002 02:47 GMT

well rested from my holiday =)

[Tronyn]: I used a trigger_multiple / trigger_changelevel close combination for the first 100b start map and had no problems. The only thing I can think of is that a rogue flag has been included in one of the entities, something along the line of an unchecked "don't link".

Asriel: Wot Fatty said. but be careful about how often you use this trick. It sends certain of the level parameters through the roof and you can easily end up with heaps of "too many light styles on a face" errors.

#2197 Posted by Nightbringer [203.109.252.18], 23/01/2002 04:04 GMT , Refers to Post #2195

My bad; you're right, nightmare causes pain framing to happen less often, not never. Firing speed is the same at all skill levels except nightmare, where most monsters fire twice before reloading (except the shambler, which fires for one frame longer), and the vore pod flies faster.

Cool, Thanks

#2198 Posted by Asriel [203.79.80.13], 23/01/2002 09:00 GMT

Thanks a lot Fatty and Palldjon.

#2199 Posted by QuakeTree [65.139.31.159], 23/01/2002 11:03 GMT

Ok, I was just wondering about that nightmare thing...

Now I need 1 or 2 experienced people to look at my current project and give me some feedback. It currently consists of a start map and a finish map. (With two more in between yet to be done). I mainly need some feedback on overall style and such. (Keeping in mind that I have not set up for difficulty levels yet).

#2200 Posted by Fat Controller [203.79.68.7], 23/01/2002 18:55 GMT

I finally understand what you were asking about those triggers (Space Cadet, right?), and I know what the problem is.

Triggers just use the associated brush entity to generate a bounding box; the brush shape doesn't really constrain the shape of the trigger. Hence with those angled gates, the triggering area sticks well out from the surface itself.

The only way around is to make lots of little triggers that fit the shape of the teleport better and send the model count through the roof.

Aaaaaaaaaah

#2201 Posted by Tronyn. [24.66.247.146], 24/01/2002 00:13 GMT

well, heh, thanks. too late now though ;)

it wasn't THAT big of a problem, it just seemed like a really stupid thing that I should have been able to fix.

#2202 Posted by necros [172.137.248.207], 24/01/2002 01:00 GMT , Refers to Post #2200

It has to do with the way quake defines the triggers. It uses mins and maxs, so it's really only the top left corner, and the bottom right corner (or whichever way you look at it) that matter. You can't have a concave(convex is it?) trigger...

#2203 Posted by NotoriousRay [199.75.227.79], 24/01/2002 02:11 GMT

i first noticed this when i tried to make a slanted func_particlefield (from hipnotice .qc). it of course showed particles as if it was one full block encompassing the selection-box in worldcraft.

.mdl Inputtingage

#2204 Posted by Asriel [203.79.80.41], 24/01/2002 10:20 GMT

How do you put .mdl's into a map (Q1).
WC specfic if possible.

#2205 Posted by GlassMan [195.184.253.85], 24/01/2002 11:58 GMT , Refers to Post #2204

The below is based on my experience, not any particular technical knowledge so it may be mistaken in the reasoning :)

You can't put an mdl into a map without creating a function for it in the QC.

The only exception is if the mdl has already been precached when the map is loaded.

You can then use the trick that czg came up with to attach the model to a func_illusionary used as a point entity with the model key (eg model - progs/bolt.mdl, also frame-frame number if relevant).

This means, in the example of the bolt, that when the map loads the engine needs to find the lightning gun & its associated precached mdls before it tries to load your func_illusionary. If it does't the level will give a no precache type loading error.

The simple answer I have found is that when making the map make sure your lightning gun (or whatever) is added after the func_illusionary so that it comes before it in the list of entities in the bsp. That works at least in radiant type editors which make the latest entity added the first in the list of entities in the map/bsp. WC may work differently.

#2206 Posted by BARiUM [213.67.132.133], 24/01/2002 17:11 GMT , Refers to Post #2205

you can edit entities in quark... just load the bsp into quark and move the entitie so it's just after worldspawn...

Indeed Sir.

#2207 Posted by Tronyn. [24.66.247.146], 25/01/2002 04:32 GMT

Error: mod_numknown == MAX_MOD_KNOWN

C:\quake>

#2208 Posted by }}-BlackHawk-> [12.250.91.161], 25/01/2002 08:22 GMT

I am new to Q3 mapping and have fooled around with radiant some. I was wondering if there are any other editors to make Q3 maps with. Can you use WC3? I really don't like radiant much at all..and was kinda hoping there was something else...:-/

Hmm, No Title

#2209 Posted by DeFrag [66.152.71.55], 25/01/2002 08:26 GMT

#2210 Posted by }}-BlackHawk-> [12.250.91.161], 25/01/2002 09:28 GMT

Yah, Frag...

#2211 Posted by Biff the Bad Punster [12.93.208.191], 25/01/2002 10:09 GMT

Don't put -BlackHawk- DOWN! ;)

#2212 Posted by Nightbringer [203.109.252.18], 25/01/2002 10:31 GMT

#2213 Posted by }}-BlackHawk-> [12.250.91.161], 25/01/2002 21:13 GMT

Forgot all about old Gmax...
Has any one tried it for mapping though?
Any other editors?

Little Edicts Question:

#2214 Posted by necros [172.163.157.73], 25/01/2002 23:58 GMT

How many edicts should i leave free, for use with in game objects (nails, rockets, etc) 50? 100?

Just cause i've run into this problem, and want to shave off only what's necessary...

#2215 Posted by Speedy [80.70.224.104], 26/01/2002 02:04 GMT

quark supports q3

Re: Little Edicts Question:

#2216 Posted by Tyrann [203.56.239.117], 26/01/2002 02:19 GMT , Refers to Post #2214

How many edicts should i leave free, for use with in game objects (nails, rockets, etc) 50? 100?

Probably at least 30, and 50 if you really want to be safe.

Hmm, No Title

#2217 Posted by Speedy [80.70.224.104], 26/01/2002 02:22 GMT

how do you count them ?

#2218 Posted by Tyrann [203.56.239.116], 26/01/2002 02:42 GMT , Refers to Post #2217

Console command: edictcount

Right Then...

#2219 Posted by necros [172.167.74.3], 27/01/2002 00:20 GMT , Refers to Post #2216

which of the ones are important?

num_edicts
active
view
touch
step

?

#2220 Posted by Tyrann [63.12.14.14], 27/01/2002 04:01 GMT , Refers to Post #2219

As far as I know, just num_edicts. If it goes over 600, quake will crash.

#2221 Posted by Tronyn. [24.66.247.146], 27/01/2002 17:56 GMT

I'm patching ADD2 and its pak, and have fixed the first batch of sound errors that couldn't be found in "ambience." Now there are a few more sounds that are in the PAK, but upon loading Quake complains about "no precache" for these sounds. So how do I fix this, get it to precache them or whatever?

#2222 Posted by necros [172.135.58.160], 27/01/2002 17:58 GMT , Refers to Post #2220

What about if there's a SUB_Remove(); in the function. (say for a monster). Will that get rid of an edict?

Best Way Is To Precache Sounds...

#2223 Posted by necros [172.135.58.160], 27/01/2002 18:00 GMT , Refers to Post #2221

in world.qc

just find some lines which say

precache_sound ("sound name...")

copy and paste the line, and change the stuff in the brackets to whatever your sound is.

Now, quake'll precache it automatically.

A Texture Thing

#2224 Posted by Pablosky [172.153.227.160], 28/01/2002 09:33 GMT

Dudes:

I started making this base map (Q1), and I wanna use something more than the original base textures. I remember there was the Malice TC wad file on Opiate's texture warehouse, but the site is been without an update since 98! The file is in there but the link is broken. I can't find it anywhere. Do you guys know where I can get it from?

Doesn't Biff

#2225 Posted by necros [172.152.34.117], 28/01/2002 15:40 GMT , Refers to Post #2224

make extra idbase texs? I remember him mentioning that on the GA thread...

#2226 Posted by Fern [141.222.141.9], 28/01/2002 17:34 GMT

Link is there. It's a great .wad too

What To Use?

#2227 Posted by Pieces of Quake [195.102.201.164], 28/01/2002 21:56 GMT

What is the best Quake 2 level editor to use out there?

#2228 Posted by kanaeda [64.71.235.99], 28/01/2002 22:32 GMT , Refers to Post #2227

whichever editor works the best for you. there are many to choose from, the more popular being either Worldcraft 1.6 or QeRadiant. there's also options like qoole, bsp, quark, and many more!

my suggestion is to download and try out as many as possible. get a feel for what kind of features each one has, and then pick whichever suits you the best.

#2229 Posted by iART [24.64.223.204], 30/01/2002 08:24 GMT

No, its not Quake related, but all the AvP2 editing forums are screwed...

I've made a single player level named mymap.dat. Then rezed it. Now i have mymap.rez (Very Good). Placed mymap.rez into C:\progra~1\fox\aliens~1.pre\custom\
Finally, at the command line i typed -rez custom/mymap.rez
No custom maps found.... anywhere.

I've also tried:
C:\progra~1\fox\aliens~1.pre\custom\worlds\singleplayer\
C:\progra~1\fox\aliens~1.pre\worlds\custom\
C:\progra~1\fox\aliens~1.pre\worlds\singleplayer

C:\progra~1\fox\aliens~1.pre\avp2\custom\
C:\progra~1\fox\aliens~1.pre\avp2\worlds\custom\
C:\progra~1\fox\aliens~1.pre\avp2\worlds\singleplayer\
blah blah blah

My Question:
Where the hell does the "custom" directory go, to run these maps????????

Avp2 Forums

#2230 Posted by iART [24.64.223.204], 30/01/2002 08:28 GMT

how are they screwed?????

Same question, asked at three different sites... got three diferent answers.

At least HERE i can get consistant wrong answers.

Map Compiling Error

#2231 Posted by TheToadWarrior [64.91.146.126], 30/01/2002 23:06 GMT

I made a map, compiled it fine, etc. Put it online, despite having some balance issues, because I didn't think I'd ever do anything with it. Well I wanna make it 0wn. So I reinstall Worldcraft, use maketex to get my textures again, open the map, it opens fine, looks fine and when I check for errors, it finds none. So I compiled it and qbsp crashes. So I think it could be WC. I go into DOS, and manually compile. Qbsp didn't compile it, I forgot to move the wad. So I move it and recompile. It crashes again. So I assume the wad is causing problems. I installed Worldcraft in the same exact spot, I'm 99.9% sure the wads are the same name (they should be I assume since the textures show up in WC) and I never edited the map or rmf file. They just sat on a Zip disk until now.

Does anyone have an idea what's causing the problem exactly nd how to fix it?

#2232 Posted by iART [24.64.223.204], 30/01/2002 23:19 GMT , Refers to Post #2231

...opening the old .bsp in TexMex, and save the file (while in TexMex) to a .wad of a different name (so that you don't overwrite the original).
Load the new .wad in Worldcraft and remove the old one. Restart worldcraft. Fly around the level (in the 3D view) to check for missing textures.
Run QBSP with VIS or LIGHT.

That will rule out a .wad problem.

#2233 Posted by iART [24.64.223.204], 30/01/2002 23:21 GMT , Refers to Post #2231

Run QBSP (without) VIS or LIGHT.

Figured It Out, I Think

#2234 Posted by TheToadWarrior [64.91.146.126], 30/01/2002 23:46 GMT

Before doing that, I removed my rouge, hip and q2 wad. It compiled fine.

So I'm thinking, either there's duplicate textures in the rogue and hip wads, causing problems or having all of the wads loaded is causing problems.

Ah...... Ya.... That Would Do It.

#2235 Posted by iART [24.64.223.204], 31/01/2002 00:07 GMT , Refers to Post #2234

Flip Quake Textures In WC?

#2236 Posted by M�nch [195.179.158.135], 31/01/2002 09:18 GMT

Hello!

I just started mapping for Quake 1. I'm using Worldcraft 1.6.
I want to build this exit arch, but the texture is only one half of the arch. I'd have to flip the texture horizontally for the other half, but I don't know how it's done. Please help!

#2237 Posted by cyBeAr [213.64.67.243], 31/01/2002 11:17 GMT , Refers to Post #2236

negative texscale means the texture is flipped.

Texture Flipping Works

#2238 Posted by M�nch [195.179.158.135], 31/01/2002 11:32 GMT , Refers to Post #2237

Rouge Textures

#2239 Posted by Fern [141.222.141.9], 31/01/2002 15:54 GMT

include lipstick

#2240 Posted by iART [24.64.223.204], 31/01/2002 16:28 GMT

does scale -1 really work????

For the last 4 years I've been flippng the texture in a graphics editor, then adding it into the .wad under a new name.

No Worries....

#2241 Posted by iART [24.64.223.204], 31/01/2002 16:37 GMT

...I figured out my AvP2 problem.

Don't Fret...

#2242 Posted by palldjon [203.29.11.38], 31/01/2002 23:37 GMT , Refers to Post #2240

I did that for a while till I worked it out. Not 4 years tho'

Although, I did have a bizarre experience with one texture alignment on a test map. Strange angled face, couldn't get the tex to line up no matter what combo of negs and angles. Gave up and used the old copy and flip in TexMex. Applied new tex, slight angular adjustment - voila! Worldcraft is weird sometimes.

I Finally Broke Down...

#2243 Posted by QuakeTree [65.139.32.187], 01/02/2002 19:49 GMT

And learned WC1.6 (switched from winqoole due to massive frustration).

While it is MUCH more accurate in brush placement (my primary source of frustration) it seems to take about twice as much mouse-work (clicking, selecting ect.) to create something, anything.

Example: in WQ it is a simple left click/drop down menu/choose to create a simple block or column and then scale to correct size. (3)

While in WC it is: make sure the right shape is selected, right click on create object, scale to size, right click create object and then select object if you need to further manipulate it. (5)

Also the vertex manipulation system in WQ seems easier.

But unfortunatly with WQ's poor brush alignment I am now using WC.

</lamenting>

Who Needs A Title Anyway

#2244 Posted by Fern [141.222.141.9], 01/02/2002 19:57 GMT

While in WC it is: make sure the right shape is selected, right click on create object, scale to size, right click create object and then select object if you need to further manipulate it. (5)

Uh, I just draw a box and press enter...

Probably Been Asked About 6,000 Times

#2245 Posted by underworldfan [172.160.105.203], 01/02/2002 20:56 GMT

....before , but what is the best place to find all the Quake 1 Map Level Editors, and which do you recommend to a new Quake 1 mapper, ie me :).

I have made a small map for Q1 SP so far using WorldCraft1.6a shareware.

Thanx

Screenshots In Software Quake

#2246 Posted by GlassMan [217.35.48.19], 01/02/2002 21:16 GMT

Does anyone know why when I take a screenshot in software quake the pcx comes out all streaky & in greyscale?

#2247 Posted by cyBeAr [213.64.67.243], 01/02/2002 21:25 GMT , Refers to Post #2246

try looking at it in some other program... I think I remember that it wouldn't be displayed proporly in photoshop but in imaging (comes with windows or whatever)...it's also possible I don't remember anything right...

Another Question

#2248 Posted by underworldfan [172.160.105.203], 01/02/2002 21:27 GMT

i try to apply a 64*128 texture to a solid in WC1.6 and it applys it so that the top half is at the bottom and the bottom half at the top.

what am i doing wrong?

Fern Is Still Working On A Title

#2249 Posted by Fern [141.222.141.9], 01/02/2002 21:42 GMT

i try to apply a 64*128 texture to a solid in WC1.6 and it applys it so that the top half is at the bottom and the bottom half at the top.

what am i doing wrong?

you probably need to adjust the texture by 64 along the y-axis =)

#2250 Posted by GlassMan [217.35.58.208], 01/02/2002 21:48 GMT

No your memory is excellent Cybear. Photoshop is at fault. I had to save it as a tiff in Imaging & that loaded okay into Photoshop. Thanks.

#2251 Posted by Asriel [203.79.75.178], 01/02/2002 23:29 GMT , Refers to Post #2248

Open the texture application thingy.
Input the amount (64 on y-axis in this case)you wish to 'move' the texture.
Make sure it says 'Apply All' on that little button thingumy.
In the 3d view (with textures on) click where you want the texture to be 'moved'.

there you go. Hopefully.

Hmm, No Title

#2252 Posted by underworldfan [172.153.173.210], 01/02/2002 23:33 GMT , Refers to Post #2251

thanx for your help. and thanx fern too. :)

#2253 Posted by necros [172.151.245.152], 02/02/2002 00:39 GMT

not really mapping help, but related none-the-less...

Does anyone know any

models of gore and dead bodies?.. sorta like the hanging dudes from Doom and Doom2?

#2254 Posted by NotoriousRay [4.17.67.88], 02/02/2002 06:47 GMT

thats my main gripe with worldcraft, that it requires lots and lots of clicking and/or selecting.

#2255 Posted by Starbuck [213.122.9.22], 02/02/2002 12:25 GMT

you could use the deadstuff patch, which basically inserts any quake monster or player into the level in its dead state. It's used in 'from hell' and a few other things.

alternatively, hexen II has two human corpse models, but you might have to reduce the faces to use them, as ive found that h2 models are too high polycount and cause a comedy fuckup in-game....

#2256 Posted by necros [172.130.245.83], 02/02/2002 21:23 GMT , Refers to Post #2255

Having dead bodies is easy, i was leaning more towards just plain gore... (pools of blood, bones, eviscerated dudes, etc...) I dunno if you remember those doom sprites will the impaled guys, and hanging guys, and skulls and all that...

unfortunatly, I'm not the proud owner of Hexen 2. Anyone willing to send them over, however, is welcome... (isn't that considered illegal though?)

See If Painkeep's Available

#2257 Posted by Fat Controller [203.79.65.239], 03/02/2002 00:49 GMT

That had dangling corpses and stuff.

Dunno if it's available on FartPlanet though.

#2258 Posted by xen [194.117.133.196], 03/02/2002 01:14 GMT

PainKeep.

Seeing as the old Worldcraft debate looks set to crop up again soon I'll state that it's only real problems are lack of documentation for the more serious mapper, like how to use shortcuts and techniques to your advantage; WC was made one hell of alot easier to use simply by taking the advice from CZG, Than and various others here - I hardly ever notice the mode changes now. Oh, and the export/map builder feature sucks balls, granted - I compile using batchfiles. And the full verison is here, so quit complaining about shareware issues. End of.

WC Full Version

#2259 Posted by QuakeTree [65.139.29.77], 03/02/2002 03:55 GMT

Is that an illegal copy or is it free now because of WC 2.x and 3.3 being free?

Jedi Knight

#2260 Posted by Asriel [203.79.80.33], 03/02/2002 05:47 GMT

My friend wants to get into Jedi Knight mapping, but he suxors at it. So he wants me to help him. Problem is that I can't seem to find a working link for any jediknighrt editor.

Cna anyone help me out?

P.S

I know JK suxs.

Re-Jedi Knight

#2261 Posted by Abyss [203.29.150.3], 03/02/2002 09:40 GMT

Jedi Knight "Dark Forces II" ???
I think I have 1 or 2 JK editors stored away on CD somewhere. Don't know which they are, think one is called "Jed" or something, anyway I'll have a look tommorrow, and see if I can find them, may take a while, that's going back a few years worth of CD's, but I'll see what I can do.

Re RE-Jedi Knight

#2262 Posted by Abyss [203.29.150.3], 03/02/2002 10:59 GMT

You can download Jed.v.95 from here

link

#2263 Posted by Asriel [203.79.80.97], 05/02/2002 02:54 GMT , Refers to Post #2262

Thanks heaps Abyss, you've helped a lot.

Model Meshes In QeRadiant?

#2264 Posted by M�nch [62.104.214.78], 05/02/2002 09:28 GMT

I'm new to Quake engine editing. Can anyone tell me there's any possiblity to display the actual model meshes instead of the boxes in IonRadiant/QeRadiant? The boxes kinda suck.

#2265 Posted by Tef Johs [217.70.229.40], 05/02/2002 12:22 GMT , Refers to Post #2264

...you can do that in QERadiant.

In the .def file, just add a line like

model="models/items/ammo/shells/medium/"

(for ammo_shells) or something similar at the end of a particular entity that you wish to show up in the editor.

In QERadiant 147 it works, at least. If you have that version, these lines should already be in there, although some of them are missing, or are completely wrong.

#2266 Posted by M�nch [62.104.214.93], 05/02/2002 18:16 GMT , Refers to Post #2265

So I have to do this for EVERY entity? That would take tons of time, since in Daikatana (which I'm editing for mainly) there are hundreds of decoration entities etc. It would be very convenient to be able to see the, say, differnet plants and trees in the editor, rather than place them all and check it out ingame to find the correct one.

Make A Macro Perhaps?

#2267 Posted by Asriel [203.79.80.15], 05/02/2002 21:01 GMT

Anyway I have a few questions.

1. I know that overlaping brushes is bad, but why is it bad?

2. Sorta still on the overlaping brushes; If an elevator goes through a brush (Say its support for instance). Is that bad as well?
And again, why?

I'll Try To Answer These

#2268 Posted by Fat Controller [203.79.69.84], 05/02/2002 22:39 GMT

1. A peculiar effect called "Z-fighting". Particularly noticeable if two brushes have different textures or differently aligned textures. Sort of like how two objects can't occupy the same space at the same time.

Also, I believe BSP gives precedence to the first brush there (in the list), so you may get strange looking brush cuts or (as I have) texture wierdness.

2. An elevator sliding "through" a support beam? If we're talking along the edges, that's just bad design. Someone could get caught on the support and crushed.

OTOH, if you mean the elevator's own support beam (holding the platform up), naw, nobody'll care, unless it ends up sticking right through a wall where players can see and laugh at it.
---
"The Truth is Out There. But It's Best To Just Ignore It."

#2269 Posted by necros [172.134.35.213], 05/02/2002 22:55 GMT

for plats, I usually put a part of the bmodel as a brush outside of the level to define it's height, since I'm too lazy to actually use the height key.

StarrrrrrrrrrrrrrrBUCK!

#2270 Posted by Biff_Debris [12.93.208.197], 05/02/2002 23:31 GMT , Refers to Post #2255

Where can I find that deadbodies patch? It would work wonderfully with some of the q1sp stuff I've got in mind... (cue malicious laughter)

Fat Controller;

#2271 Posted by necros [172.186.61.126], 06/02/2002 01:01 GMT , Refers to Post #2257

thanks for that (Pain keep). Almost perfect. (Skin is ugly though... Maybe i'll paste on the zombie' skin... :)

I also found some amazing models from ZDoom, as they have an .md2 pack for it. (Been playing a lot of that recently).

Actually, all the models are quite amazing, as they're all very detailed, and have better skins that Q2, and they look very true to the original sprites (The demon even has the blood spots fly out of it's mouth when it dies), and the archvile death is amazing. Also, what's really incredible is that that you can have like 100 of them on the screen at the same time with little slow down, but that's another story. :)

#2272 Posted by Speedy [80.70.224.69], 06/02/2002 03:49 GMT

Dead Bodies

#2273 Posted by xen [194.117.133.196], 06/02/2002 11:09 GMT

Biff, you'll find it in the zip for the old Q1SP- From Hell. On another point of interest there's a film coming out soon with the same title, based on the same story...

#2274 Posted by Tronyn. [24.66.247.146], 06/02/2002 21:23 GMT

You want dead guys, I've got a few tortured-zombie models that we never used from Anevil - two different ones for a zombie hanging (one by neck, one by wrists), and one spitroasting! nice nasty stuff

sorry I haven't sent feedback yet on your map, my mail's screwed (again) and well, that's my best excuse, other than that, just having some troubles with 'other' stuff..

it's very good though (but you already know that).

#2275 Posted by necros [172.158.226.39], 07/02/2002 00:45 GMT

I'd be really interrested in those models. Maybe if you could upload them (since yer email is broke), i'd really appreaciate it. Don't worry about the feedback, i'm not in much of a hurry. It was more of a pre-beta anyhow... (Alpha?) Still interrested in your feedback though, so whenever you get the chance...

Speedy: The md2s are from ZdoomGL, and they were made by a few different people. They replace almost everything in the game, and look _really_ _really_ amazing. Some animations are a little off (Both Baron and Hell Knight's ball throwing anims are odd, and CyberDemon death is crap without explosions...), however, but for the most part, they're quite good.
ZDoomGL
ZDoom
The md2 pak is located on the ZDoomGL site.
(All of doomworld looks a bit dead ATM, though...)

#2276 Posted by Scampie [206.152.135.94], 07/02/2002 01:55 GMT , Refers to Post #2273

you mean, there already is a movie out based on the same graphic novel as that map, right?

oh, wait, your 'over there' and you guys get things years after us... sorry. :D

Who Needs A Title Anyway

#2277 Posted by Speedy [80.70.224.136], 07/02/2002 03:13 GMT

cant get to that site
may you post those mdls ?

MAy be you making pack with qc to have all monsters working in q ?

Ta Necros And Fatty

#2278 Posted by Asriel [203.79.80.118], 07/02/2002 09:02 GMT

I've noticed the first brush in, first brush showing thing.

And yeah, the 2nd one you said, how the bottom sticks through the level. But don't worry, no one will see it.

could someone (necro?) explain what a bmodel is?

Blocking See-through-sky Effect

#2279 Posted by Tef Johs [217.70.229.40], 07/02/2002 10:28 GMT

I know I have read about this on many occasions, but here goes...

Would someone kindly repeat for me: what are the more effecient ways of blocking vis in regards to the annoying "see-through-sky" effect that sometimes appears in maps?

I know putting in areaportals in proper places (Q2, Q3 engine) will help, but sometimes that isn't possible due to the architecture etc.

Clip brushes? Doesn't seem logical.

Q3 engine games even have the "caulk" texture, but that didn't seem to help much either.

Some suggestions would be appreciated. Plz.

#2280 Posted by Biff_Debris [12.93.209.43], 07/02/2002 10:49 GMT , Refers to Post #2273

Thanks man -- DLing it now... =)

From The Q3Radiant Manual...

#2281 Posted by Tef Johs [217.70.229.44], 07/02/2002 11:09 GMT , Refers to Post #2278

..."When you build a brush entity (a.k.a. b_model), mark all the brush sides that you will never see with caulk. Otherwise, the game draws every one of them. "

So, a bmodel (or b_model) is a brush or a group of brushes created by the user, and joined together in an entity, having that particular entity's special features and properties.

(The last paragraph were my words, hope they're not too far off the truth).

#2282 Posted by Shallow[BAP] [212.135.236.122], 07/02/2002 13:04 GMT , Refers to Post #2279

I prefer to call it a feature, since if you can see a room interior through sky it means that the walls in the outside area are not as tall as they would be on a real structure with that much stuff inside - you don't get houses with roofs lower than their ceilings.

If, however, you favour Tardis-like buildings, you should be able to stop it happening if you can get your vising right - so that the interior (or at least the troublesome part of it) is not in the PVS from the outside area. Then, it isn't going to get rendered.

Inarealhurry Here...

#2283 Posted by necros [172.147.36.114], 07/02/2002 15:20 GMT

Error: EDICT_NUM: bad number 600

(quake.exe spits it to dos before quitting)

GtkRadiant 1.2.4

#2284 Posted by Tef Johs [130.67.135.2], 07/02/2002 17:03 GMT

I'm not sure how many here really is interested in GtkRadiant 1.2.4 (the Wolfenstein version), but I have some issues with this version, compared to the 1.1-TA version for Q3Arena that came earlier:

1. I have noticed the angle/rotation speed of the 3D window is completely slowed/broken even at fastest setting in preferences (using the mouse, and with the new "freelook" feature turned off). I checked the 1.1-TA version, and there it works as it should.

2. Also, the entity window does not remember its size, and goes back to the original "crippled" size every time one selects a new entity. This was also OK in 1.1-TA. This is such a hampering thing when working, and should be fixed.

3. The Z-window (height checker) does not work properly, as in QERadiant for Q2. This is not just my preferance, it is a true technical glitch.

4. In WolfRad that came with the SDK for RtCW, the shortcut "F" for filter options work fine, but not so in GtkRadiant, at least not on my computer. Minor issue, though.

Anyway, if points 1 and 2 could be remedied, I think GtkRadiant would be a very good and stable editor. I have tried to put these issues forward on their bugs page, but the form didn't load, so I'm bugging you guys instead... :)

#2285 Posted by GlassMan [217.35.49.80], 07/02/2002 22:19 GMT , Refers to Post #2284

On the 3D window rotation speed..you need to edit radiant.ini & find Anglespeed, which is stuck on 7. Make it 150 or something. Problem is every time you go into preferences it resets to 7 :-/

This bug is known to Ttimo.

Mmm Architechture Linkage

#2286 Posted by Asriel [203.79.75.247], 08/02/2002 03:26 GMT

very nice linkage here Big ups to some guy in NZ that no one here will know

#2287 Posted by necros [172.130.111.46], 09/02/2002 02:53 GMT

What is the maximum amount of Static Entities, (non edicts)?

#2288 Posted by necros [172.130.111.46], 09/02/2002 02:57 GMT , Refers to Post #2278

BModel is any kind of brush model which is compiled into a map. (Not Brush Models, which is a different thing... Is there a different name though? ;)

Bmodels are any func_s or trigger_s or .... yeah. That's it. :) There's a limit of 255 of them in a map, but, they count as edicts as well, so since you can only have 600 edicts, it's tough to come up to 255 Bmodels limit.

You Can Have 128 Static Entities

#2289 Posted by Fern [141.222.141.9], 09/02/2002 04:54 GMT

here's how I found out (any more gave me the error message)

#2290 Posted by QuakeTree [65.139.29.184], 09/02/2002 18:57 GMT , Refers to Post #2289

What were your epolys on that one eh? And what was the error message, because I don't think that you can only have 128 torches maximum(for example)in a single level. I could almost swear that I have had more than that in the same level before. But then again maybe not, I dunno, never counted them nor even thought about it.

Cheers Necro

#2291 Posted by Asriel [203.79.80.49], 10/02/2002 00:12 GMT

Freaking The Buttons

#2292 Posted by Pablosky [205.188.197.163], 10/02/2002 01:59 GMT

Dudes:

I have a simple question:
How do you get a message to pop-up right after getting a button pressed?

#2293 Posted by Fern [141.222.141.9], 10/02/2002 02:13 GMT

I don't know what my epolys were.

The message was "too many static entities."
I don't think it has anything do do with epolys. I ran into the static entity limit in perssp2 and had to delete a few to get it working. Walking through it just now and counting every torch and flame (see what I do for you? ;)) I found I had to settle for around 116 so it looks like it makes no difference how spread out the static entities are.

(I also found another amusing bug but I'm not gonna post another frigging new version

#2294 Posted by QuakeTree [65.139.29.25], 10/02/2002 10:46 GMT

Actually, I was just thinking of all those torches within the same FOV and thinking "Damn, what were the epolys on THAT one"

But it's nice to know that the static entity limit is ranged right around 116 to 128. (I'll have to file that away for later reference).

But thanks for "Doing that for me" (put that in IRC LOTD eh?).

Cheers dude.

#2295 Posted by xen [194.117.133.196], 10/02/2002 17:53 GMT

How do you get a message to pop-up right after getting a button pressed?

What game? What edito--- oh, forget it.

Add an attribute named "message" to the func_button entity and give it a value of the message you want to appear.

#2296 Posted by necros [172.128.81.120], 10/02/2002 21:10 GMT , Refers to Post #2289

thanks fern. Great way of finding out to, btw.

Quakey Freaky Buttoned

#2297 Posted by Pablosky [152.163.195.207], 11/02/2002 02:14 GMT , Refers to Post #2295

I though the icon thing was kind of clear for which game it was... The editor is worldcraft, the game is Quake 1.

Anyway, How you get the message thing for the func_button added?

#2298 Posted by QuakeTree [65.141.121.115], 11/02/2002 07:31 GMT

click the smart edit button on the dialog box for the button to add keys and values

Blah Blah Blah

#2299 Posted by Pablosky [152.163.197.58], 11/02/2002 19:59 GMT , Refers to Post #2298

thanks, gonna try that.

Model Swappin'

#2300 Posted by Biff_Debris [12.93.210.211], 12/02/2002 23:21 GMT

Hay -- is it possible to use custom player models for q1 as monsters, or custom monster models for monsters OTHER than the ones used (such as one used as an enforcer to be switched so as to be used with the actual enforcer monsters)? I'm guessing there is some way to do it, since there are so many "be the monster" mods out there, but seeing as how I am the s4wk at that stuff, I have no idea how.

#2301 Posted by necros [172.153.168.140], 13/02/2002 00:04 GMT

If you mean: Can I use a different .mdl file for a given monster?

Then yes... sort of. The way Quake calls the frames is based in the order they are stored in the .mdl file. If you simply swap one .mdl for another, the model will be there, except the frames will probably not be the same (unless your lucky, and all the frames are in the same position, in which case it would work fine).

You'd need to go into the monster's qc files, and fix up the frames called in the monster's code... (ie: player's pain frames aren't the same order as a fiend's frames). It's a lengthy process. On the other hand, you could use a model program, and re-arrange the order of the frames to fit the other models order. (Qme and Quark can do this).

Either way, it's quite some work. (unless, like i said, your in luck, and most of the frames match up...)

Sorry if I make no sense.

#2302 Posted by distrans [203.29.11.38], 13/02/2002 01:30 GMT

Finally got the sound working on my machine again

And I jumped into a DM level I've been working on for Q1 using Bulow.wad

The teleport tex triggers the usual sound but the sky seems to be completely silent?

Any ideas?

Hmm, No Title

#2303 Posted by Speedy [80.70.224.110], 13/02/2002 04:55 GMT , Refers to Post #2301

I`v made some things like that (q2 models for q1 monters), not very hard
http://www.planetquake.com/speedy/quake06.jpg

Thanks Guys

#2304 Posted by Biff_Debris [12.93.208.77], 13/02/2002 10:06 GMT

I'm just revamping existing .qc and creating new monsters for the models, thanks mainly to metlslime, electro and nekroe =) If all goes well, this will indeed r4wk.

No Sky Sound

#2305 Posted by QuakeTree [65.139.30.221], 13/02/2002 16:08 GMT

Did it vis properly? If not then that will keep the sky and water from making any sounds. Other than that I don't know

Make Sure A .prt File Is There

#2306 Posted by Apollo [62.7.54.153], 13/02/2002 20:35 GMT

QuakeTree & Apollo...

#2307 Posted by distrans [203.29.11.38], 14/02/2002 01:59 GMT

Ta much, yeah I was expecting those sounds too early in the build sequence

Updated Editors?

#2308 Posted by psyence [68.10.107.237], 16/02/2002 23:52 GMT , Refers to Post #2289

Greets,

I am resuming Q3 mapping, previously used Q3Radiant202. Any current editor preference feedback?

psyence

#2309 Posted by DaZ [213.122.80.243], 17/02/2002 01:46 GMT

GTKradiant is great

#2310 Posted by pjw [12.246.129.137], 17/02/2002 04:12 GMT

Get the latest GTKRad and also be sure to use the latest version of q3map available in this thread:

http://www.quake3world.com/ubb/Forum6/HTML/019997.html

as it will shave a shitload off your compile times and has a lot of sweet lighting options (and will have more soon).

#2311 Posted by Tef Johs [217.70.229.40], 17/02/2002 20:08 GMT

If you are only going to work on Q3A or TA maps, I'd suggest sticking to the GtkRadiant 1.1 - TA version that came earlier.

This version is "final", and does not contain some re-entered bugs that the new (Wolf) version unfortunately has.

Oh, By The Way

#2312 Posted by Tef Johs [217.70.229.40], 18/02/2002 15:44 GMT

I have gotten a little out of sync with the latest Q1 map compilers, like tyrlite and rvis+, and I would like to download the very latest (and greatest, presumably).

Any links to these files, or hints of a site that's keeping track on Q1 compilers? I can't seem to find them easily...

Re: Oh, By The Way

#2313 Posted by Tyrann [203.56.239.111], 18/02/2002 16:39 GMT , Refers to Post #2312

You can always find TyrLite and Rvis+ on the utils page on my site.
http://www.planetquake.com/tyrann

#2314 Posted by Tef Johs [217.70.229.40], 19/02/2002 00:59 GMT , Refers to Post #2313

Need...Quake1 Textures...please...help

#2315 Posted by E-werd [24.154.169.128], 19/02/2002 22:49 GMT

i need Q1 texture wads...someone give me some pages to find good texture wads please...i am going nuts

Who Needs A Title Anyway

#2316 Posted by Fern [141.222.141.9], 19/02/2002 23:22 GMT

www.suspenlute.com/teamfern ;)

(doesn't have those new chicoverde textures yet though, will upload soon...)

#2317 Posted by E-werd [24.154.169.128], 19/02/2002 23:47 GMT

Thanks Fern...hopefully i'll find what i need!

You Could Also Try...

#2318 Posted by distrans [203.29.11.38], 20/02/2002 00:09 GMT , Refers to Post #2317

Mr. Fribble's place

OR

Fatty's Shed

Can You Cast Shadows From Nothing?

#2319 Posted by xoltan [128.95.190.220], 20/02/2002 15:52 GMT

I've been making plans to have some nice trees in a level. I'm going to be using an .mdl (acutally, a .md2) for the trees themselves, and placing clip brushes in the trunks and larger branches. What I'm curious about is - how do I get a shadow on the ground from that? I'd like the tree to have a nice shadow, but light isn't going to cast one from a model and a few clip brushes. How did the shadow of the quad on the floor of e1m5 work? Wasn't that a trick involving the sky? Anyway, if anyone has a clue, I'd be greatful.

my stuff

#2320 Posted by R.P.G. [165.247.155.171], 20/02/2002 16:57 GMT , Refers to Post #2319

I dunno, but maybe Tyrann's skip/caulk prog would work. It's sort of like a cross between clip brushes and solid brushes. I think they'd cast shadows.

#2321 Posted by R.P.G. [165.247.155.171], 20/02/2002 16:59 GMT

And Opiate's Texture WareHouse (now defunct) is also a good place to find textures.

#2322 Posted by iART [24.64.223.204], 20/02/2002 19:45 GMT

I beleive that id used a func_door OR func_train to cast the shadow.
They Placed a light on the door/train to cast a shadow, then set that entity to open/move upon starting the map.

i think... It was a door.

#2323 Posted by Fern [141.222.141.9], 20/02/2002 19:55 GMT

brushmodels don't cast shadows. light shines through sky textures as if there was nothing there. in e1m5, there's just a quake logo hanging in the sky with a box of sky texture around it so you can't actually see the solids making it up.

I Once Tried This...

#2324 Posted by necros [172.165.233.58], 20/02/2002 23:06 GMT

You make a seperate room, away from the actual room, and have the same main lights in both room. The floor, however, in the second room is a func_door. You cast whatever shadows you want on it, then have it move to the first room... It sort of works, but it won't always match up to the edges. If I was you, i'd just leave it and not worry about shadows from trees...

#2325 Posted by necros [172.165.233.58], 20/02/2002 23:07 GMT , Refers to Post #2315

Good to see ya around, E-Werd!

CnP Ala Ztn Re: Md3 Shadows

#2326 Posted by DeFrag [66.152.70.3], 21/02/2002 03:02 GMT

> I was wondering how you got those barrel lamp md3's to possess
> > the properties of showing bullet marks, player clipping, and allow
> > light to emitted from them. You used these to cast those cool
> > shadows in an arched ceiling of Blood Run for Q3A. I tried making
> > them structural and detail and put a light in the center of the md3,
> > but to no avail. Help would be appreciated.
>
> Ah, this is the problem I intially encountered as well...and
> made me bang my head to the wall until I found a solution...
> it's quite simple actually:
>
> 1) to make the md3's cast shadows: add line "models.shader"
> to your shaderlist.txt. place a light entity inside the model.
>
> 2) to make the md3's seem solid: place a similarily shaped
> brush made out of common/weapclip texture around the md3.
>
> Hope it was helpful,
> -Sten Uusvali

Speedy Is Still Working On A Title

#2327 Posted by Speedy [212.46.198.121], 21/02/2002 03:37 GMT

Too bad its q3 defrag.

Xoltan: if you are using your own engine you could make gl_shadows for certain models only, it`d look cool. Lightmaps are too low res to produce goodlooking shadows from small no-axial details.

Or you could just use antilights to fake rough shadows.

Building trees from skip might work, but dont overuse it and dont make them big, since they are still used in vis calculation.

Or you could code a prog that allows manual lightmap editing ! (there is such tool for q3)
Thats all I can think of ;)

DeFrag Is Still Working On A Title

#2328 Posted by DeFrag [66.152.70.3], 21/02/2002 05:54 GMT

ya I know.. thought it might have sparked some similarity :)

Thanks Everybody

#2329 Posted by Xoltan [128.95.190.220], 21/02/2002 15:55 GMT , Refers to Post #2327

I think the anti-lights sound like the best way to go. I'd forgotten about those.

I was almost getting ready to modify a toolset to have 'shadow' brushes, that don't clip or affect vis, but do cast shadows. I suppose that still isn't a horrible idea, but I don't think I'll go to the trouble right now.

#2330 Posted by R.P.G. [165.247.161.85], 21/02/2002 16:11 GMT , Refers to Post #2329

Shadow brushes that don't affect VIS would be l33t! Make a detailed object, clone it, make one copy a shadow brush and the other a func_wall. Very little increase in VIS compile time and you still get a shadow!

Speedy Thought A Title Wasn't Needed

#2331 Posted by Speedy [212.46.202.221], 22/02/2002 03:08 GMT , Refers to Post #2329

yes, do it xoltan ! I want shadow brushes

It's On The Todo List Then...

#2332 Posted by Xoltan [128.95.190.220], 22/02/2002 16:00 GMT

I fried a 1.2 GHz Athlon the other day putting a new heatsink on it improperly, so I don't actually have a computer at the moment.

But I'll give shadow brushes a shot when I get the chance. If I do get it done, I'll try to make the changes as modular as possible so they can be worked into other utilities. Right now its just a thought though, so don't hold your breath.

Any Help Please . . .

#2333 Posted by MasterMind [12.229.175.36], 23/02/2002 04:30 GMT

I recently finished a map and it works great! The only problem however, is that its 1.9megs in size! The map itself isnt very big, probably suitable for 2-4 people. I dont use very many textures either, so that shouldnt be an issue. I use a modifired qbsp I found at the old worldcraft site (the planetquake one), tyrlite, and rvis+ as my tools to compile with. I tried using the old tools, and still, the level turned out to be 1.9 megs, except it had worse r_speeds.

Like I said earlier, my map works great, r_speeds no higher than 800 in one spot. The problem is that it is a huge 1.9MB file! Does anyone know why this is and how it can be fixed? Thanks

-MasterMind-

Any Help Please . . .

#2334 Posted by MasterMind [12.229.175.36], 23/02/2002 04:30 GMT

I recently finished a map and it works great! The only problem however, is that its 1.9megs in size! The map itself isnt very big, probably suitable for 2-4 people. I dont use very many textures either, so that shouldnt be an issue. I use a modifired qbsp I found at the old worldcraft site (the planetquake one), tyrlite, and rvis+ as my tools to compile with. I tried using the old tools, and still, the level turned out to be 1.9 megs, except it had worse r_speeds.

Like I said earlier, my map works great, r_speeds no higher than 800 in one spot. The problem is that it is a huge 1.9MB file! Does anyone know why this is and how it can be fixed? Thanks

-MasterMind-

#2335 Posted by MasterMind [12.229.175.36], 23/02/2002 04:31 GMT

Sorry about double post, I dont know how that happened.

Who Needs A Title Anyway

#2336 Posted by Speedy [212.46.202.53], 23/02/2002 05:23 GMT

any chance there is "anti-leak box" around the thing ?

#2337 Posted by MasterMind [12.229.175.36], 23/02/2002 06:56 GMT

Nope. I didnt make a box around my level. And there are no leaks. I have no clue what to do =(

Large Bsp Size

#2338 Posted by iART [24.64.223.204], 23/02/2002 07:22 GMT

How many brushes and entities were used?

My last map had 3000 brushes and 800 entities, creating a bsp of 1.70MB

Sometimes the most simple brushes can be cut severely by qbsp... that is why file size is also one thing to keep an eye on when building. But if the polys only peak at 800, then who cares?!?!

This Many . . .

#2339 Posted by MasterMind [12.229.175.36], 23/02/2002 08:03 GMT

Solids : 601
Faces : 3797
Point Entities : 151
Solid Entities : 20

I want file size small so people dont have to download forever when they join a server.

If You Want To Try Yet

#2340 Posted by aguirRe [195.100.154.229], 23/02/2002 10:57 GMT , Refers to Post #2339

another pair of compilers, take a look here.

They are significantly faster than most other compilers and they're really helpful if you've got leaks (which you may very well have - many compilers just don't tell you about them).

Also, you can inspect the information that is printed out at the end of the compilation session (the FinishBSPFile info). The numbers to the right are the size in bytes that the various objects occupy in the BSP.

You can even list that info here, then maybe someone can give you a hint what's going on ...

#2341 Posted by Tyrann [63.12.14.38], 23/02/2002 14:42 GMT , Refers to Post #2333

Even if no leaks were reported, there still may be one. Use "noclip" to go outside the level. If all you can see is the inside of the level, then there is no leak. If you can see surfaces on the outside of the map, then there is some kind of leak that the compiler didn't pick up.

How many portals does vis report when you run?
Did it take a long time to vis?

#2342 Posted by MasterMind [12.229.175.36], 23/02/2002 18:22 GMT

Im pretty sure there are no leaks. I noclipped through the whole level and the pointfile command brought up no particles. Using fast vis and normal lighting, the compile takes about 4 1/2 minutes. Extra lighting and full vis takes about 5 1/2 minutes.

When I used the alternative compilers suggested by aguirRe, it took less then a minute to compile! Still, the level is 1.9MB.
Heres some more info I cannot decipher.

------ FinishBSPFile -----
WriteBSPFile: c:\quake\id1\maps\MMDM5C.bsp
Added 16 textures frames
1065 planes 21300
3365 vertexes 40380
1069 nodes 25656
699 texinfo 27960
2478 faces 49560
2584 clipnodes 20672
590 leafs 16520
3111 marksurfaces 6222
11897 surfedges 47588
6100 edges 24400

Elapsed time : 0:05
Peak memory used : 5.8 MB

455 portalleafs
1202 numportals
average leafs visible: 103
c_chains: 1537257
visdatasize:15742 compressed from 25935

I got this information from using the tools arguirRe suggested.
Hope I gave the right info and I hope you can help me! Thanks

Sry For The Late Hello

#2343 Posted by E-werd [24.154.169.128], 23/02/2002 18:29 GMT

hey necros, long time no see, i am finally deciding to get into the mapping community...i figure mapping is useless in the coding community ='p

Who Remembers Sm25_werd?

#2344 Posted by E-werd [24.154.169.128], 23/02/2002 18:37 GMT

Well...i'd like to know who remembers sm25_werd, and if you think it was good (for a speedmap). If i get good enough results, i will continue development of that map and call it werddm2 (besides, i need something better to make up for the shitty werddm1)

-E-werd

SM25 Map Pack If You Need It

#2345 Posted by E-werd [24.154.169.128], 23/02/2002 18:42 GMT

forgot to include a link there, you can get sm25 pack here.

The Numbers You List Are

#2346 Posted by aguirRe [195.163.205.57], 23/02/2002 19:00 GMT , Refers to Post #2342

not indicating a large map. The Peak memory used (5.8 MB) is also rather low, Vis is not appending any large data amount but maybe Light is.

However, you left out some of the numbers at the end of this list (after the edges part), like this :

128 textures 1262956
lightdata 0
visdata 0
entdata 124643

Especially the texture part can be quite large (1.2 MB) as you can see in the example above from a very large map.

If you wish, you can send the zipped map+wad to me and I'll take a look at it and try to find an explanation of the BSP size.

#2347 Posted by Asriel [203.79.75.227], 23/02/2002 21:38 GMT

Pointfile hardly ever works for me.

#2348 Posted by Tyrann [63.12.14.38], 24/02/2002 02:38 GMT , Refers to Post #2342

Those numbers look reasonable, not large at all. As aguiRe pointed out, the texture number isn't listed which could be a big contributor to the size. The part at the start that says:

Added 16 textures frames

Indicates that you are using some animating textures, and that qbsp added 16 extra textures to make up for the extra animation frames.

Hmm, No Title

#2349 Posted by Speedy [212.46.204.97], 24/02/2002 04:25 GMT

what`s the lightmap resolution ? (in map units)

#2350 Posted by MasterMind [12.229.175.36], 24/02/2002 05:08 GMT

The only animated textures im using is the sky texture, 2 water textures (one for slime and the other for teleporter) and one button texture. Thats not a lot of animated textures is it? And heres the part I missed:

99 textures 531640
lightdata 0
visdata 0
entdata 11566

#2351 Posted by Tyrann [63.12.14.191], 24/02/2002 07:13 GMT , Refers to Post #2350

Sky and water textures don't count as animated (not in the same way). It must be something else then. The above numbers indicate about half a meg of textures. 99 textures does seem like quite a lot for a small map though.

#2352 Posted by Tyrann [63.12.14.191], 24/02/2002 07:14 GMT , Refers to Post #2349

Lightmaps are 1/16th of the resolution of the texture of the face you are lighting. If you scale the texture, the lightmap scales with it.

99 Textures....

#2353 Posted by iART [24.64.223.204], 24/02/2002 07:24 GMT

...thats a whole-lot-o textures.

If even 20 of those are 128sq in size, then THERE is the reason for your large file size.

Who Needs A Title Anyway

#2354 Posted by Edgecrusher [63.159.214.71], 24/02/2002 18:18 GMT

outputfile: c:\quake\id1\maps\ARCHCOMP.bsp
--- LoadMapFile ---
c:\quake\id1\maps\ARCHCOMP.map
124 brushes
2 entities
13 miptex
122 texinfo
building hulls sequentially...
--- Brush_LoadEntity ---
122 brushes read
---- CSGFaces ----
1052 brushfaces
5889 csgfaces
682 mergedfaces
--- SolidBSP ---
837 split nodes
459 solid leafs
379 empty leafs
0 water leafs
1400 leaffaces
1327 nodefaces
----- portalize ----
--- FillOutside ---
350 outleafs
--- SolidBSP ---
536 split nodes
361 solid leafs
176 empty leafs
0 water leafs
991 leaffaces
926 nodefaces
342 outleafs
************ ERROR ************
Mixed face contents in leafnode

I got this trying to compile a simple U hallway i made. I'm pretty sure it doesn't leak, but i have no idea what the error is.
Anyone have any idea what this means?

Mixed Face Contents In Leafnode

#2355 Posted by czg [158.38.54.78], 24/02/2002 18:31 GMT

usually means that you have a brush with conflicting contents properties, such as all normal textures but one face has a sky texture or a water texture, or if you have a water brush, but one of the sides has a solid or sky or lava or slime texture.

Re: Mixed Face Contents

#2356 Posted by lurker [207.69.16.200], 24/02/2002 20:38 GMT , Refers to Post #2355

I saw the error once when I had a sky brush touching a water brush, even though each of the problem brushes had only one texture applied.

#2357 Posted by czg [158.38.54.78], 24/02/2002 20:41 GMT

that can cause it too

#2358 Posted by Fern [141.222.141.9], 24/02/2002 20:55 GMT

you can have mixed face contents and still play the map but sky touching liquid crashes the compiler, if I remember correctly.

Who Needs A Title Anyway

#2359 Posted by Edgecrusher [63.159.198.132], 24/02/2002 20:59 GMT

Thanks, that was the problem.

What happened was i put eight 32 squares in the corner of my map, so that i could just have those textures show up as my used textures. When i finished that section of the map i forgot about them.

Edgecrusher

#2360 Posted by aguirRe [195.163.202.192], 24/02/2002 22:00 GMT , Refers to Post #2359

That error and others are a lot easier to understand and fix if you use one of the compilers found here.

You'll not only get the approximate coordinates but also the contents type of the conflicting faces, e.g. (Water, Lava).

#2361 Posted by MasterMind [12.229.175.36], 25/02/2002 05:59 GMT

I am in fact using a lot of textures. I never realized that I used a such large variety of textures! When playing my map, you would never notice how many textures are in use, because a lot of them look alike. The total number of textures im using is 83, and I dont know why it says im using 99 in the compiler! I will try eliminating a few of those textures and see if that helps.

#2362 Posted by Fern [141.222.141.9], 25/02/2002 06:23 GMT

When playing my map, you would never notice how many textures are in use, because a lot of them look alike.

I think that would indicate that you don't need so many textures

Who Needs A Title Anyway

#2363 Posted by distrans [203.29.11.38], 25/02/2002 06:44 GMT

#2364 Posted by iART [24.64.223.204], 25/02/2002 07:53 GMT

Ya, if you've got 83 textures, and 2 button textures with 8 animated frames each... then there's your 99 textures.

Thanks For The Help

#2365 Posted by MasterMind [12.229.175.36], 25/02/2002 21:25 GMT

Thanks for the help everyone, once I get some time to work on my map I will make the neccessary changes. Then I will post again telling you whether it worked or not =)

FAO: AguiRe

#2366 Posted by xen [194.117.133.196], 26/02/2002 22:00 GMT

Does your enhanced VIS utility display co-ordinates for vis-related errors? I mean things like a leaf with too many portals and suchlike...
I ask this because I noticed a similar feature with your version of TreeQBSP - I could locate the exact place of an error similar to the one Edgecrusher had a while back; very useful indeed.

I Need A Few Things...

#2367 Posted by E-werd [24.154.169.128], 27/02/2002 01:53 GMT

I need a few things for mapping...after extensive testing, I have concluded one thing...QuArK 5.1 is the best and easiest there is. Now, down to business. I need the best qbsp, the best vis, and the best light program available. I cannot run GL, so it has to be completely based or compliant with software mode.

#2368 Posted by necros [172.137.51.103], 27/02/2002 02:11 GMT

AFAIK, compilers don't really have any bearing on GL/Software compatibility (unless you count transparent water, of course, but that won't break compatibility).

WQBSP is the compiler I use, although, if you are using Quark, the guy recommends TXQbsp or something(that's available at www.planetquake.com/quark)... Tyrlite and rvis+ (www.planetquake.com/tyrann) are good light and vis progs, ther is also q1rad too (and another I think).

for wqbsp, dink around in FP... or maybe one of the ftp archives (if you can find one) ;)

QuArK 5.1 is the best and easiest there is I wouldn't be so quick to say that... There are a lot of editors out there... :)

#2369 Posted by aguirRe [195.163.202.14], 27/02/2002 17:47 GMT , Refers to Post #2366

No, I haven't made any error/warning message improvements to Light/RVis yet, mainly because I haven't seen any. I've heard others mentioning them, though.

If you have a map (i.e. bsp+prt) that produces error/warning messages from Light or RVis, you could send it to me and I'll look into it. Preferrably not a map that takes 5 weeks to process before the error message appears ... ;)

Right now I'm doing a major overhaul to my Tree/TxQBSP versions in order to improve floating point calculation accuracy, which is a problem in some maps.

#2370 Posted by Tyrann [203.56.239.111], 28/02/2002 03:54 GMT , Refers to Post #2369

Right now I'm doing a major overhaul to my Tree/TxQBSP versions in order to improve floating point calculation accuracy, which is a problem in some maps.

#2371 Posted by Zero.G [192.92.126.162], 28/02/2002 13:44 GMT

I'm new to qMapping, and I'm currently trying it for Quake1. I'd like to use some extra stuff from the web as new monsters and weapons. There's a way to merge their "progs.dat" files into one to use more than one add-on at the same time?

No Simple Way

#2372 Posted by czg [158.38.54.71], 28/02/2002 14:05 GMT

You'd have to get the qc code and merge the files by hand, which can be a drag if there's lots of stuff altered in, uhm, "shared" qc files, and then recompile it.

#2373 Posted by aguirRe [195.163.205.72], 28/02/2002 16:41 GMT , Refers to Post #2370

I need large and complex Q1 source maps to test the new double (64-bit) precision versions. A while ago you had some problems with such a map.

I'd appreciate if you could send it to me so I can see if the improved precision is of any help or there are other issues also.

In other maps it seems to have helped a lot.

If all goes well, these new versions will run at roughly the same speed and same amount of memory as the previous versions.

#2374 Posted by Tyrann [203.56.239.111], 01/03/2002 09:50 GMT , Refers to Post #2373

There are other issues. Trust me.

#2375 Posted by Zero.G [192.92.126.162], 01/03/2002 13:02 GMT , Refers to Post #2372

Ok, thank you, maybe I'll try to learn some QuakeC... Have you some suggestion about where to find tutorials? Thnx.

#2376 Posted by E-werd [24.154.169.128], 01/03/2002 20:51 GMT

try the QuakeC Tutorials at Inside3D, you'll probably find what you need

Some Help Please

#2377 Posted by Abyss [203.29.150.3], 01/03/2002 22:55 GMT

Hello all, I started playing around with Worldcraft a couple of weeks ago, it's alot of fun, but very time consuming, anyway I was wanting to add some water, so I loaded up my little test box map thingy, where I like to try things out, I created a small box pool type thing, created a brush to put inside, textured that brush with a water texture, same texture on all faces, ran the compile tools but it would not compile, It said something like this
"qbsp caused an error in qbsp.exe and will now shut down, if you continue to experience bla bla bla"
"EXP.bsp was not created do you wish to continue"
If I remove the water brush all is fine, but if I put it back in again, the same thing happens. So I tried using another qbsp program qbsp162(TreeQbsp) and everything worked fine with the water brush in the map.
So, is the qbsp that comes with Worldcraft the problem, or was I missing something ?
I find it hard to beleive that anyone using the standard WC build tools would not be able to have water in their maps, so I guess it was my lack of knowledge.
Sorry for rambling on, but any help/explanations would be appreciated.

Also...................................

#2378 Posted by Abyss [203.29.150.3], 01/03/2002 23:06 GMT

If anyone has any links to mapping tutorials, they would be most welcome. Useful utilities, for that matter, anything useful that is mapping related

And where do I find all the command line variables for use with qbsp, light and vis programs. The readmes of the ones that I have don't say much, and I am very new to this.

Thanx again

#2379 Posted by necros [172.130.124.124], 01/03/2002 14:57 GMT

the qbsp that comes with worldcraft is shite. (I don't have WC, but it's what i've heard). I recommend you get WQBSP (There's one more, but I forget the name). You also want Both of Tyrann's Light and Vis programs (tyrlite.exe and rvis+.exe) which are on Tyrann's site (www.planetquake.com/tyrann).

Thank You Necros.....

#2380 Posted by Abyss [203.29.150.3], 01/03/2002 16:05 GMT

I will try to track down WQBSP.

Hmm, No Title

#2381 Posted by Speedy [212.46.201.194], 01/03/2002 17:53 GMT

wc comes with a good help file.. eerr not really ;)
It has good info on ents, but teaches you to CSG (at least the one that was in wc 1.3 did)
You should read it anyway, it has all the basics.

Then go to http://www.planetquake.com/binaryshi/atc_c12pipes.htm
and
http://gamedesign.net/?file=rust/content
(most tuts are true for any quake engine)
And search qmap for tips (how you map and edditing tip threads)

Thats only worthy stuff I can think of.
Still there is alot to learn on yourself

#2382 Posted by necros [172.141.126.102], 01/03/2002 17:58 GMT , Refers to Post #2380

read xen's new tut Very good.

#2383 Posted by Fern [141.222.141.9], 01/03/2002 23:05 GMT

www.bsphq.com, slightly editor-dependent but not really

#2384 Posted by Fern [141.222.141.9], 01/03/2002 23:06 GMT

bsphq is gone!! bsphq is gone!! bsphq is gone!! bsphq is gone!! bsphq is gone!! bsphq is gone!! bsphq is gone!! bsphq is gone!! bsphq is gone!! bsphq is gone!! bsphq is gone!! bsphq is gone!! bsphq is gone!! bsphq is gone!! bsphq is gone!! bsphq is gone!! bsphq is gone!!

Abyss's Water Brush

#2385 Posted by iART [24.64.223.204], 02/03/2002 02:33 GMT

Do you have a sky brush touching the water brush?

OR

Do you have another liquid texture (lava, slime, teleport, or 2nd water) touching that water brush??

WorldCraft Tutorials

#2386 Posted by R.P.G. [165.247.148.170], 02/03/2002 07:30 GMT

Cousin Of The Sparklie?

#2387 Posted by ~gilt [24.102.24.203], 02/03/2002 09:26 GMT

index

Q1

I'm getting some visual errors where black lines form between brushes that are together (touching, but not overlapping). The lines only develope when viewed from a very large distance away.

Any ideas as to why this is caused, and what to do about it?

1
2

#2388 Posted by DaZ [213.122.1.202], 02/03/2002 12:07 GMT , Refers to Post #2387

That has something to do with the Z-buffer on your graphics card. if Im right about this then there is nothing you can do about it unless you get a newer graphics card. If im wrong then slap me in the face with the paralised bunny.

Thank You All

#2389 Posted by Abyss [203.29.150.3], 02/03/2002 14:21 GMT

For the info on where to get tutorials and stuff, I already have some of it, but will surely check the rest out, thank you all again.

iART, No, there is no sky brush touching the water brush, in fact, there is no sky brush

And there is no other liquid texture touching the water brush. It was just basically a pool (box) with a water brush, I was just seeing how it worked in a little box map I use for trying things out. But when I used a different qbsp prog (Treeqbsp162) it compiled fine, but it just wouldn't compile with the standard qbsp included with WC, unless I removed the water brush. Oh well I have some other compile programs now so I'll just use them and leave the standard WC stuff alone.
Thank's for your input.

Unless It's Not In Gl

#2390 Posted by nb [203.109.252.13], 02/03/2002 18:12 GMT , Refers to Post #2387

in which case it may be a weird artefact of software (does it go away in gl?), or perhaps a lightmap or geometry problem (if you go right up to it with noclip, are the tris touching each other at all their vertices?)
No, I have no clue either.

Re:daz & Nb

#2391 Posted by Gilt [24.102.24.203], 03/03/2002 09:29 GMT

The problem occurs with any gl engine. (I'm not sure about software, as it crashes my comp when I run it)

My brush work is very neat, and it looks perfect up close. The problem only occurs when the player is at least ~1/8th of the total grid away from the brushes.

daz: I guess I'll have to get somebody with a better card then mine to test your idea.

nb: hmm..how very interesting. I was thinking that it was somehow related to the clipping errors that occur with angled brushes, and therefor a geo/bsp error. However when I run it in fullbright mode, the problem dissappears...

The map still leaks though, so I haven't tried it when all the useless planes are culled. Maybe its a z-buffer thing where the unlighted planes get drawn a bit?

#2392 Posted by Gilt [24.102.24.203], 03/03/2002 21:14 GMT

well I haven't had time to seal the leak, but I artificially removed the unseen planes using skip and that solved the problem, or at least it made the problem moot.

QERadiant HELP!

#2393 Posted by Panzer [66.69.2.164], 03/03/2002 21:25 GMT

I'm new to mapping for Q1 and Q2. I found out that you can use Radiant to create maps but I can't even get the map to compile. The error message I get when I run the compiler is as follows:

SetQdirFromPath: no 'quake2' in c:\progra~1\/qeradi~1\/maps/test1.map

If anyone knows how to correct this please let me know. Also, if it helsp (no flames please) I'm not even sure how to enter console commands. I cut my teeth on "playing" Q2 and mapping for Q3A. Q3A and it's editing progs can be run fairly easy, but going backward to Q1 mapping is giving me fits! Any help would be greatly appreciated.

Change The Path

#2394 Posted by Tef Johs [217.70.229.45], 03/03/2002 22:13 GMT , Refers to Post #2393

Don't work in /programfiles/qeradiant/maps/, you have to work in /quake2/<workdir>/maps/, because the compiler needs the word "quake2" somewhere in the path you're working in.

You could for instance compile in /quake2/baseq2/maps/, so that <workdir> = baseq2 (the main q2 dir).

This is a rough description, but it should make sense to you. If not, I'll try to explain it better...

#2395 Posted by Gom Jabbar [212.185.248.120], 04/03/2002 08:57 GMT , Refers to Post #2389

Paul from MultiplayerQuake is currently working on a beginners guide to Q1 mapping. I don't know how far he proceeded with that tutorial but keep an eye on MultiplayerQuake and, of course, the QMap News.

Radiant For Q1

#2396 Posted by cyBeAr [213.66.231.28], 04/03/2002 09:34 GMT

I think you're better off with gtkradiant. I think mapconv should work just as well on q3 maps since .map format doesn't appear to be the same as q2. Make your own project and don't forget to change the default tex scale to 1.

#2397 Posted by R.P.G. [165.247.135.117], 04/03/2002 17:19 GMT

mapconv should work just as well on q3 maps since .map format doesn't appear to be the same as q2

That should be does appear to be the same as q2.

#2398 Posted by cyBeAr [213.66.231.28], 04/03/2002 18:03 GMT , Refers to Post #2397

I wrote something else at the end first and then when I changed that I obviously screwed up.

QERadianf For Q2

#2399 Posted by Tef Johs [217.70.229.39], 05/03/2002 09:12 GMT

...is simply the better QERadiant, if you are not going to work with the Q3 enginge (of course).

QERadiant build 147 for Q2 contains everything one can possibly want (entity animation preview, no other editor has that, not even Q3 or GtkRadiant), and is as stable as a rock (unlike WolfRad and Gtk 1.2.4)

Just my opinion of course, but I have used Radiant exclusively since 1997....

#2400 Posted by Tef Johs [217.70.229.39], 05/03/2002 09:13 GMT

"enginge" = engine

#2401 Posted by cyBeAr [213.66.231.28], 05/03/2002 12:30 GMT , Refers to Post #2399

Personally I much prefer gtkradiant and will use that when I resume work on some quake maps. For me that got to know radiant through q3 some things are really missing in qer.

Another Problem

#2402 Posted by MasterMind [12.229.175.36], 06/03/2002 00:03 GMT

Very simple problem, yet very annoying: I can't select any of the objects using the 3d window in WorldCraft 1.6. I tried looking under the options for some kind of option I might have accidently turned on or off but couldnt find anything that had to do with my problem. Does anyone know what I'm supposed to do to fix this problem? Thanks.

To Select...........

#2403 Posted by Jaj [62.83.170.44], 06/03/2002 00:37 GMT , Refers to Post #2402

You must press the "red arrow"(arrow=pointer, not sure :P) icon or "shift+s" before go to the 3d window, once made this you can select what you want (3d or any 2d window), if you'd want to select more than 1 at a time then you must select them holding pressed the "ctrl" key.

Hunk_Alloc:??

#2404 Posted by nx [195.23.214.79], 06/03/2002 11:57 GMT

hi all
i build a map, runed qbsp, light and vis -fast

after calling the console, write "map mapname" and... it doens't load... quake crashes and

Hunk_Alloc: failed on 120880 bytes

what is this?
how can i see my map??

nx

Hunk_Alloc:??

#2405 Posted by iART [24.64.223.204], 06/03/2002 13:25 GMT

need to allocate more ram with
-heapsize 32000

Unless You're Using A Software Engine

#2406 Posted by Fern [141.222.141.9], 06/03/2002 13:53 GMT

in which case it's -winmem 32

Yes, I Know That

#2407 Posted by MasterMind [12.229.175.36], 07/03/2002 00:45 GMT

I have been mapping for 3 or 4 years with WC. I know how to select stuff in the 3d window =). The problem is, I was working on my map, closed the window to do something else, reopened WC a little while later, and for some strange reason, I can not select any object in the 3d window. I dont know if I accidently hit some wierd key combo that changed an option or what, but I really need help to figure this out! Ive tried reinstalling and that doesnt seem to help either. Thanks

That WC...........

#2408 Posted by Jaj [62.83.163.17], 07/03/2002 01:53 GMT , Refers to Post #2407

I thought you probably knew that but i had to try .... who knows?

The next i had in mind was to reinstall it but you've done that yet and it still doesn't work!!... well, then i don't know any other solution... sorry i'm an incompetent =).
I'm thinking just now, how about when you uninstall it, if you manually try to erase totally all the related registry entries from the windows registry and then reinstall it again... it's a desperate way but maybe it could work.

#2409 Posted by bleh [194.117.133.196], 07/03/2002 02:04 GMT

You using the shareware version? It happens alot with that, I saw someone post a link to the full version at mpq somewhere.

#2410 Posted by Vigil [193.229.6.165], 07/03/2002 06:18 GMT , Refers to Post #2407

I got that when I updated some drivers and tried to run WC with hardware 3D view. So try disabling that and see how it works.

BetaTesters Wanted

#2411 Posted by Zero.G [192.92.126.162], 07/03/2002 11:05 GMT

Hi,
I'm new to mapping and I've just finished the Beta Version of my 1st DM map for Quake. If you want to give it a try and then send me comments please write me at: gabbi@lycosmail.com

Thank you to everyone!

#2412 Posted by Fern [141.222.141.9], 07/03/2002 12:42 GMT

beta this guy's map, I think he's the first new mapper in months smart enough to notice that you don't start discussion threads to find beta testers.

#2413 Posted by necros [172.138.116.173], 07/03/2002 21:14 GMT , Refers to Post #2412

I don't have anyone to beta test a dm map with. I would though. I haven't beta tested in ages...

Bleh, Your Right.

#2414 Posted by MasterMind [12.229.175.36], 08/03/2002 05:15 GMT

Thanks bleh, I had the 3d acceleration option on, so I turned it off, restarted WC, and now it works. Simple! Thanks again, and for those that offered help.

Hmm, No Title

#2415 Posted by Gom Jabbar [212.185.248.124], 08/03/2002 15:03 GMT , Refers to Post #2411

If you're map is Quake 1 (Got some ppl telling about mapping for Quake and it wasn't even Quake, just something called Quake with weird numbers attached) you're free to send me the URL where to download the beta. I can't promise spending lots of time checking it but you can be sure that I write at least a small comment.

<--- He Did Use The Q1 Icon...

#2416 Posted by Fern [141.222.141.9], 08/03/2002 21:49 GMT

(and not something called the Q1 icon with weird nails attached) hehe

#2417 Posted by MadKap [62.254.64.5], 09/03/2002 11:53 GMT

How do, I'm not new to mapping but most of the stuff I've done has been for my own enjoyment and my mates on a LAN. This means I haven't a clue how to PAK files together for Q2, or anything else for that matter. The reason I'll need to PAK instead of just using the .bsp is that I'm using custom skyboxes and textures. Am I on the right track here? How do I PAK stuff? Thanks for your time.

DeFrag Thought A Title Wasn't Needed

#2418 Posted by DeFrag [66.152.71.43], 09/03/2002 18:54 GMT

QPed
PakExplorer
Winpack

Another Good One:

#2419 Posted by Mr Fribbles [210.49.92.13], 10/03/2002 06:33 GMT , Refers to Post #2417

PakScape, not sure if this is the most recent version (v 0.11) but its the one I have here on my compy. Here's one place to grab it from:

[download]

edit: the above is a wankplanet link, its only 106k so you might want a direct link, here we go:

http://www.archangels.de/downloads/pakscape/pakscape_011.zip

Compiling Error

#2420 Posted by TheToadWarrior [64.91.145.241], 10/03/2002 07:32 GMT

I did some brush editing to get a bridge end to look broken with a pipe and lava coming out of it for Quake 1. Well, I'm getting this error.

** Executing...
** Command: Copy File
** Parameters: "C:\TOADWA~1\QUAKE\WORLDC~1\MAPS\NEWMAP.map" "C:\ToadWarrior\Quake\quake1\ID1\maps\NEWMAP.map"

** Executing...
** Command: C:\ToadWarrior\Quake\WorldCraft\QTools\Qbsp.exe
** Parameters: C:\ToadWarrior\Quake\quake1\ID1\maps\NEWMAP

outputfile: C:\ToadWarrior\Quake\quake1\ID1\maps\NEWMAP.bsp
WARNING: brush plane with no normal
************ ERROR ************
Line 458 is incomplete

http://jove.prohosting.com/~toadw/wcerror.html
Those are the pics of the only things I added after my last successful compile. It may be one of the brokeb bridge brushes but I'm positive it's the lava (mainly because I did a cut (it was easier! :D ) and I did allot more unsnapped grid moving, so I included the whole Worldcraft window for that one.

#2421 Posted by metlslime [12.228.72.232], 10/03/2002 08:46 GMT

open the mapfile in a text editor. My guess is that line 458 is incomplete.

E L I T I S T

#2422 Posted by DaZ [213.1.187.87], 10/03/2002 17:17 GMT

#2423 Posted by Asriel [203.79.79.213], 11/03/2002 00:29 GMT

Once upon a time when I was making paddydm1, i would delete a broken line, save file, but when I opened it in WC again, nothing had changed...

weird.

#2424 Posted by TheToadWarrior [64.91.148.254], 11/03/2002 04:40 GMT

I'll check try that. Hopefully I can scan the list and spot the problem rather than count the lines. :D

#2425 Posted by czg [158.38.54.64], 11/03/2002 09:12 GMT

sometimes, WC also takes a LONG time to export the map to .map format, if there's a lot of brushes. Then you have to wait until WC has completed it's stuff before you compile.

And don't use the wc process window!
No!

#2426 Posted by R.P.G. [165.247.155.72], 11/03/2002 16:30 GMT

edit.com has a nice feature that counts all the lines for you, so you just hold "Page Down" until you get near the line you're looking for. Just open a MS-DOS window and type edit

#2427 Posted by necros [172.129.72.139], 12/03/2002 02:56 GMT

How to make map for teh game Wolfenstein!!!!111

No, really. I've been wanting to try for ages. ;) I've got Q3Radiant, but how do you get the Wolf Entities to work in there? Is there like a tut or something that explains the setting up process?

#2428 Posted by Mr Fribbles [210.49.92.13], 12/03/2002 06:41 GMT , Refers to Post #2427

GtkRadiant.

Get the stuff you need from [http://www.qeradiant.com/]

Specifically, you will need the GtkR 1.2.1 which supports Wolf editing [mirror list for that] and the 1.2.5 update wouldn't hurt [mirrors for that]

Finally, you'll notice that when you compile any RTCW map which has light shaders in it with the Q3map.exe included with these distributions, your map will crash the game when you try to load it. : (

Brilliantly enough, this fact is not mentioned anywhere and you'd probably have to hunt through 30 pages of old message board discussions on some site you've never seen before to find out what was up (at least, I had to). The workaround for this problem is to use an earlier Q3map.exe, where to get it? I don't know. The one I have that worked came from an older install of GtkR, so you may have to download some earlier version of GtkR to get that, or get a working q3map from someone.

Wolf Compilers

#2429 Posted by Tef Johs [217.70.229.50], 12/03/2002 11:13 GMT

The most sensible thing to do regarding getting Wolfenstein compilers that actually work (and an editor that actually work as well, IMHO), just download the official SDK that were released.

These utilities WORK. I use that Q3map.exe, and it has never failed me yet.

Please don't get me started on these Gtk versions....

Get Started!

#2430 Posted by metlslime [12.228.72.232], 12/03/2002 15:08 GMT

#2431 Posted by Tef Johs [217.70.229.50], 12/03/2002 19:00 GMT

Let me be slightly provocative, then...:

I know the people behind Gtk Radiant works hard, they don't get any money, they're very talented etc. etc. blah blah, but...

How do they manage to screw up things that originally works so well in the Radiant they're basing it on?

That is what I simply don't get. And the so-called "features" they've input and changed in the Gtk versions, with all due respect, for the most part, does not work at all in practice.

For instance, what's with this new orientation of the mouse arrow in the menus? Gimme a break! It's not helpful, it's just annoying (can it be changed? Who knows).

Gtk just doesn't work well in practice. At least not for me (maybe I'm just too used to the original QERadiant for Q2, still unbeatable IMO).

Therefore, honestly speaking, I'm using WolfRadiant, not GtkRadiant. I'd would probably be using Q3Radiant for Q3A, although I see that Gtk v. 1.1.1-TA is quite up to the standard (but somehow things are broken again in recent versions). Yep, must be hard handling all that code.

I will be using Gtk for Wolf, when they release a version that's up to the standards of the version 1.1-TA for Q3A. This means a 3D window that's not broken, and an entity list that at least remembers it position between selections.

I admire the work put into Gtk, but I only wish they'd produce a version that is more effecient and practicall useful than the original(s) they're basing it on. If not, it's kinda wasted, isn't it?

I'm just asking, I'm not demanding anything.

Sigh...guess this means I can expect to get yelled at (again). Well, bring it on :D

Oh, By The Way

#2432 Posted by Tef Johs [130.67.137.135], 12/03/2002 19:12 GMT

I have to add that whatever Gtk version, I would not dream of using their in-editor compilers.

Compiling larger maps in-editor is simply total waste of CPU and RAM resources. Who does that, anyway? I tried running the Gtk q3map.exe in a DOS window, but it was totally useless.

A clean DOS prompt, and batch files. And executables that work from the SDK. That's my clear recommondation.

Ah, well, don't listen to me. I've just used this now for almost 2 months already without any problems .

Suit yourself :)

#2433 Posted by Maj [193.128.238.152], 12/03/2002 19:29 GMT

Have we got any more concrete complaints than 'mouse cursor acquires aesthetically uncomfortable orientation'?

If so, you might want to add them to bugzilla, so that TTimo doesn't have to waste his psychic powers attempting to divine them.

#2434 Posted by Tef Johs [217.70.229.50], 12/03/2002 20:39 GMT

They're concrete enough for me not wanting to use it.

Got that?

Fine.

#2435 Posted by Tef Johs [130.67.136.173], 12/03/2002 20:44 GMT

There is not point adding the "mouse orientation" to their bug page, seeing this is a "feature", not a bug.

I could say the same thing about this "let's keep the camera at fixed size while zooming" too. It's not helpful either. It's just annoying, not necessarily a bug (at least not in their book).

DeFrag Thought A Title Wasn't Needed

#2436 Posted by DeFrag [66.152.70.235], 12/03/2002 20:59 GMT

QER is the shit for as many reasons as Tef said for me as well. Q3R a bit better.

DeFrag Is Still Working On A Title

#2437 Posted by DeFrag [66.152.70.235], 12/03/2002 21:00 GMT

I didn't however give GTK a fair shake but it put me off from the beginning.

#2438 Posted by Maj [193.128.238.152], 12/03/2002 21:02 GMT

The sequence of events we have here is:

1) Tef Johs notices bug.

2)

3) Bug gets fixed.

PS: Features are bugs.

#2439 Posted by necros [172.146.140.183], 12/03/2002 21:53 GMT

Thank Frib and Tef Johs.

Could someone email me the working version of Q3map.exe? I don't really want to download a whole editor just for one executable...

#2440 Posted by Gilt [24.102.24.203], 13/03/2002 00:42 GMT

While we're on the subject of stupid editor features/bugs, let me add my list for Q3R:

Note: I'm used to WC, so I'm using the quad window setup and so most of my peeves relate to this fact.

Redundancies/inefficiencies:

*There are two sets of Zoom buttons: up/down for camera, insert/delete for grid. There should be only one set that will work for both grid and camera windows.
*Flip/rotation buttons: Why not just have one key that will flip the brush depending on the grid window you're in?
*When box is made with left mouse- there should be a key to select brushes(ex:enter), while esc creates brush

View:

For Quad window:
*console should be at bottom. entities/texs/groups on the side.
*need key that will center all grid views on selected object

For floating:
* windows be able to snap onto each other
* be able to create/delete custom windows if needed

For all:
*grid should have major axis, for orientation.
*There should be limits on how far you can scroll the grid

3d window:
*control should be similar to WC, instead of silly "rotate depending on distance from arbitrary center point" method

This list is just the problems I can think of right now. However they are also the most commonly encountered ones, and I'm not so anal as to care about rarely encountered problems, like having to press ctrl-shift-alt-f-u-rmb just to texture something.

I want to note that I haven't really given Q3R a great going through, and that some of these problems might simply be chalked up to me not finding the fix yet (in other words, a non-intuitive design problem :-p). In that case, I'd be very happy if somebody could point me in the right direction before I waste the time of the bug fixing dudes.

#2441 Posted by Gilt [24.102.24.203], 13/03/2002 00:48 GMT

I'd like to add that I realize that some(most) people might like things the way they are, and would see my settings as uncomfortable/bad.

So I dont necessarily want these things to take over what is already there. All I want is the ability to customize the editor to my liking.

Shadowdane Is Still Working On A Title

#2442 Posted by Shadowdane [68.49.88.146], 13/03/2002 01:07 GMT

blah.. dont change the camera in Radiant.
its fine.. if you ask me its WC which has weird camera control.

if you must, have a option in the menu for camera control.

Random Radiant Ramblings

#2443 Posted by nb [203.109.252.19], 13/03/2002 01:49 GMT , Refers to Post #2440

Yes, GTK widgets kinda suck compared to native widgets if you're used to Windows. Apparently this is being worked on.

Dragging in a 2d view creates an actual brush, not a select box like in WC. If you e.g 'select all inside' it gets deleted.

What's also irritating about the flip/rotate commands is there are no hotkeys for them (this may have changed in the latest builds, I don't know.)

The lack of a 'center on selected' command is annoying, yeah; hope this is fixed or at least on the bug tracker.

You can remap most of the keys in GTKR (and some in Q3R iirc) via an ini file.

There are seperate zooms for grid and camera because it's really forwards/backwards for the camera, and you can do so without the 3d window having to have the focus.

You can use keyboard controls to move around with the camera - arrows to look, a/z for forward and backward, ',' and '.' for strafing, d/c for up and down, pgup/pgdn for next/previous floor.

I think there's a freelook-style camera control option in the most recent GTKR.

Speedy Thought A Title Wasn't Needed

#2444 Posted by Speedy [212.46.198.48], 13/03/2002 03:29 GMT

why oh why there is no perfect editor...

q3r selection method is inferior to prehistoric editors like BSP.

Now tell me this is implemented in latest GTK:
-Shift+mouse drag to select multipy brushes
-Brushes with central "knobs" for easy select and more readable view (to tell a brush from space between lines)

#2445 Posted by killazontherun [211.28.55.25], 13/03/2002 07:33 GMT

why oh why there is no perfect editor...

Stop BITCHING and start mapping.

#2446 Posted by Maj [193.128.238.152], 13/03/2002 10:56 GMT

#2447 Posted by Mr Fribbles [210.49.92.13], 14/03/2002 01:45 GMT , Refers to Post #2431

Well I don't really want to get into Q3R vs GTK vs editorX, but I will say that I found GtkR useable, whereas Q3R wasn't. : )

Since I've been updating now and then I've noticed that they are adding features and making changes that have been requested by the users, eg freelook in the 3D view.

I can put up with a few bugs which I know will be fixed eventually, since the editor is still in development.

The main problems I have with gtk are usually attributed to user stupidity rather than bugs. But as Maj was hinting at above, if you find bugs, or want changes made, get involved in the development and have your say. Maybe later on down the track they'll release a version of the editor more suitable for you.

Who Needs A Title Anyway

#2448 Posted by Gilt [24.102.24.203], 14/03/2002 02:10 GMT

RE Shadowdane:

if you must, have a option in the menu for camera control.

You probably missed my previous post(maybe you loaded the page after I wrote it..), but I already commented on that.

My preply

RE MAJ:

I'll just quote myself as to why I posted my list.

In that case, I'd be very happy if somebody could point me in the right direction before I waste the time of the bug fixing dudes.
I wanted to first make sure that it wasn't me that was the problem.

RE nb:

Thanks for the info, but I'm that much of newbie with radiant :)

Your comments on zooming/forwarding and brush selection are a matter of semantics, and that is not excuse imo.

RE Frib:
I tried GTK, but it crashed when trying to install. I figured it was similar to Q3R anyway (ie: GTK is to Q3R, as Tomazquake is to glquake)

I'll try a newer version.

The main problems I have with gtk are usually attributed to user stupidity rather than bugs.

Could you please enlighten me with the more common stupidities, so that I won't do the same thing?

Who Needs A Title Anyway

#2449 Posted by nb [203.109.252.13], 14/03/2002 04:22 GMT , Refers to Post #2448

The zoom/forward distinction is entirely semantic, yeah; though the focus issue isn't - you can move the camera at the same time as doing pretty much anything elsewhere.

The selection process distinction isn't; that's actually how it works. Every lmb drag in a 2d window actually creates a brush, and you can use any brush to select others. Yes, this is completely ass-backwards compared to worldcraft and pretty much every other editor.

Newbie Wc Question

#2450 Posted by MadKap [62.254.64.5], 14/03/2002 13:19 GMT

alreet,
now, ive tried alot of stuff and I can't ffigure it out:

how do I use keys in wc for Q2?

It mite be something I've overlooked or whatever but basically I want to know how you make a button or door entity only activateable once the player has a particular key (powercube, blue key, whatever) also, I'd like to know how you make the key reappear in a particular place - like placing a power cube in a slot to power up a door / machine etc. If anyone can point me to a site that explains this or can explain the basics, I'd preciate it. Cheers.

Who Needs A Title Anyway

#2451 Posted by Gilt [24.102.24.203], 14/03/2002 13:26 GMT

though the focus issue isn't - you can move the camera at the same time as doing pretty much anything elsewhere.

Yeah, but I'm not talented enough to multitask like that :) I'll revise my need though; I'd like the ability to bind a key to multiple commands.

The selection process distinction isn't; that's actually how it works. Every lmb drag in a 2d window actually creates a brush, and you can use any brush to select others.

Well the only way the user knows that it's a brush being made and not a bounding box is the use of the escape key, and lack of select key.

If there was a select key nobody would know the difference, and it would no longer be ass-backwards.

#2452 Posted by Maj [193.128.238.152], 14/03/2002 13:50 GMT

The whole point is that there is no distinction. Why should there be?

Making brushes and selection boxes seperate things would achieve nothing[*] and prevent neat things like triangular/odd-shaped selections.

[*] except not forcing WC users to actually think about something.

Hmm, No Title

#2453 Posted by Gilt [24.102.24.203], 14/03/2002 19:27 GMT

RE MAJ:

umm... isnt that what I said?

I was just saying that by having a key to select brushes with (instead of those 4 buttons) would lessen the distiction even more.

-----
And just for the record, I never meant my note about WC to be a "this editor is better then yours" comment. I just put that in so you might get a better idea of where my pov is coming from.

Actually I happen to like radiant (other then the above notes). It's brush control is very direct and elegant, and most of its other features are superbly done.

If I truly despised radiant and thought of myself soley as a WC user who's using Q3r simply out of necessity (as you imply), I wouldn't have wasted my time coming up with that list of ways to improve Q3r, and instead just waited until UT2 came out...

#2454 Posted by Maj [193.128.238.152], 14/03/2002 19:46 GMT

I think I misunderstood your original idea. Having a special autoselect doesn't sound too bad, although I'm not sure which of the four it should be like...

Oh, and do you honestly expect me to talk about Radiant without taking a potshot at WC? I mean, it'd be rude not to...

Heheheh, Maj

#2455 Posted by R.P.G. [165.247.156.190], 14/03/2002 20:31 GMT

#2456 Posted by killazontherun [211.28.55.25], 16/03/2002 02:06 GMT

After compiling a wolf map fine, when I run wolfsp, sv_pure 0, devmap mymap ; it loads fine then it comes up with a picture of all the sprites loaded then wolfsp crashes. Can anyone help, much appreciated??

It wasn't doing this when I loaded the map before.

#2457 Posted by Tef Johs [217.70.229.50], 16/03/2002 15:47 GMT

Use spdevmap for SP maps.

spmap also works (but no cheats).

Jago Is Still Working On A Title

#2458 Posted by Jago [194.251.240.107], 18/03/2002 10:09 GMT , Refers to Post #2443

Yes, GTK widgets kinda suck compared to native widgets if you're used to Windows.
God, NO ! I don't want this windows-looking crap on my machine.

P.S: Don't whine, submit your ideas, feature request, bug reports to BugZilla. If the developers don't know about it, it will never get fixed and you'll be able to whine about it for years. Is that what you want ?

P.P.S: Also, what kind of an editor is exactly this "WolfRadiant" ? I thought there were only QERadiant for Q2, Q3Radiant for Q3 and GTKRadiant for Q3 + Wolf. You can indeed get Q3Radiant to work with Wolf, but thats a pitiful hack.

#2459 Posted by Maj [193.128.238.152], 18/03/2002 10:48 GMT

If the developers don't know about it, it will never get fixed and you'll be able to whine about it for years. Is that what you want?

IMO, yes, that's exactly what a lot of people want. Or they're really fucking stupid. Either way...

EngineMaker Ask Mappers

#2460 Posted by Tei [80.24.125.235], 18/03/2002 11:02 GMT

new engine:

ftp://ftp.berlios.de/pub/telejano/teiq2for17march2002.zip

Tested with the 99% maps show in the shambler page. Works fine.

- - -

I am thinking about to make a "fake" sun with lens flare that dinamically change the global light briggness.. doing a traceline to a point far in the zenit and placing the "flare" where hit the skybox/skymesh (2048 u up, 1200 u size, alpha 80 ).

What mappers think about?
Maybe I can add very much light fx to engine, and speedud the rendering a bit..

Please help me with feedback.

1 saludo
Tei

WolfRadiant

#2461 Posted by Tef Johs [217.70.229.50], 18/03/2002 20:27 GMT , Refers to Post #2458

WolfRadiant is the native Wolf version that came with the RtCW SDK released by Gray Matter in January.

It looks more like Q3Radiant, not GtkRadiant.

WolfRadiant

#2462 Posted by Jago [194.251.240.107], 19/03/2002 07:54 GMT

Is there a Linux port of WolfRadiant avaible ? I would like to try it out, but I don't have any win32 boxes around.

#2463 Posted by Tef Johs [217.70.229.50], 19/03/2002 08:32 GMT

Only NT binaries of WolfRad and its compilers were included.

Prefered Quake Editor?

#2464 Posted by Lord_Santa [213.67.94.30], 19/03/2002 13:06 GMT

Question to all you level editing Guru's (and newbie's) out there:

I've been creating levels for Quake for some time now... (since '97 or something like that) Never got any released though (mainly created for my own pleasure. =)

Now I have been away from the Quake mapping community for a few years (I hooked up on UnrealEd), but am slowly going back to "the good old Quake engine", and wondering which editor is the best one out there?

(I've always prefered WC, but want to check if there's any "better" out there)

Re:Pref.q.Ed

#2465 Posted by czg [158.38.54.107], 19/03/2002 15:52 GMT

The best editor you can find is the one that you feel most comfortable with yourself.
In terms of brush manipulation etc there isn't really anything in particular that you can do with one editor and you can't with another.

Mapping Textures Onto Terrain...ouch

#2466 Posted by Tef Johs [130.67.136.100], 19/03/2002 18:36 GMT

Hmmm...I thought I knew how to do this, but for some reason, q3map.exe won't find my textures while compiling when I try to use a (meta)shader mapping them onto a terrain mesh.

I don't know if I should get more technical, or if anybody here is so familiar with this that you can give some immediate hints to what may be wrong?

The textures are .jpg, they're (as far as I can see) in the correct texture subdirs, and the meta-shader is correctly refered to in the .map file's terrain entity (func_group), using the "common/terrain" texture (phew...difficult, I know).

Oh, this is for RtCW...but should be identical to Q3-TA for that matter.

A challenge for anyone here?

#2467 Posted by Tef Johs [130.67.134.214], 19/03/2002 19:48 GMT , Refers to Post #2466

I discovered what I had done wrong...

I just had to move my new .shader file to the correct location. Ouch...I didn't think I could make such a mistake anymore :)

It's never too late to become a nOObie...

#2468 Posted by Fern [141.222.141.20], 19/03/2002 21:23 GMT

You will find a fierce advocate at Qmap for every piece of Quake mapping software in existence. Check out the -uh- "suggestions" in threads like this and go with whatever feels comfortable.

QUestion For Jawl.

#2469 Posted by Biffmasta [68.58.131.17], 20/03/2002 04:30 GMT

I would use QERadient for Q1, right. Or is that too current. Or do I use the over simplistic Quark? Quark costs money, which is dumb.

QERadient? Q1SomethingRather?

BM

Similar Here

#2470 Posted by Mr Fribbles [210.49.92.13], 20/03/2002 05:21 GMT , Refers to Post #2469

I'd use gtkradiant for q1, with riot's conversion tools, works nice

Quark Cost's Money?

#2471 Posted by QuakeTree [204.30.201.120], 20/03/2002 09:42 GMT

QER/Q3R/GTKRadiant For Q1

#2472 Posted by R.P.G. [24.136.171.6], 20/03/2002 15:44 GMT

...Or SleepWalkR's conversion tools or nightbringer's conversion tools...

#2473 Posted by Biffmasta [68.58.131.17], 21/03/2002 00:09 GMT , Refers to Post #2471

I remember a while back they were charging for it. of course, that was back in 96 when i first tried to map and i couldn't subtract a hole in a wall for a door (not like I can now).

#2474 Posted by Biffmasta [68.58.131.17], 21/03/2002 00:28 GMT

where can i find Gtkradient?

GTK, Q3 And QE Radiant,

#2475 Posted by necros [172.162.46.126], 21/03/2002 01:37 GMT , Refers to Post #2474

all available here: www.q3radiant.com

Help, Please!

#2476 Posted by Dilvish [172.186.4.172], 22/03/2002 14:02 GMT

I've got this message this morning:

Hi,

My name is Eric and I'm running a (custom map) Quake 1 "Requiem" server (one
of the last). I wanted to tell you that your map Karagee gets a great deal
of praise and email comments! I started running Orthanc in the rotation but
there is a little glitch I thought I would tell you about. Although the
teleporters work fine in single player mode, when I run it in the server
rotation list, the telleporters move. To clarify, instead of jumping into
the outside "arches" for teleportation (they no longer work), you could be
running down an indoor hallway and suddenly be telleported. Very odd but the
map is so cool I keep it in. Any fix for this? In addition, I would love to
run Kinny but I got some complaints about the bright white sections being
too much for some folks. Is there a way for me to tone those sections down
to say a gray tone? Great maps! Keep up the awesome work!

Thanks,

Eric

This is very kind to get such praises, but:

Does anyone knows of the "moving" teleporter phenomenon and how to fix it?

And, about the map "Kinny", I have a big prob: I no longer have the .rmf nor the .map file, but I still have the textures i used in it and so can change them to fit the guy. Is there a way to "inject" textures in a .bsp file, or do I have to decompile the map (with winBSP?), change the texes and recompile it?
Thanks in advance

wrath Thought A Title Wasn't Needed

#2477 Posted by wrath [195.58.111.103], 22/03/2002 14:43 GMT

adquedit and texmex both can change textures in a .bsp I think.

#2478 Posted by QuakeTree [205.184.158.15], 23/03/2002 10:12 GMT

As I recall The Forge has a file named updbsp that will do just that, swap textures without needing the original source material. If you can't find it I can e-mail it to you as its very small.

#2479 Posted by Dilvish [172.181.23.84], 23/03/2002 12:57 GMT

Wrath and QuakeTree; i'll try with AdQuedit or Texmex, and then turn to you, QTree, if it doesn't work.

No ideas about the self-teleporting teleporters? I've never heard of anything like that before ! That could be a really cool feature: getting beamed without warning to some other place without the enemy being able to follow you!

Wc Question

#2480 Posted by Vondur [195.128.67.194], 26/03/2002 07:24 GMT

Wc Blind To Wad Files After I Point To It
Posted by -1 [12.219.228.32], 26/03/2002 04:01 GMT

I'm new to worldcraft and mapping :\
WC says there's no textures availible and pops up options window for me to set them, but they're all ready pointed to where they are. I remove them, and repoint them out to WC and still no dice, I can't start a new map or edit an old rmf file. I'm really stuck.

----
Moved from threads....

Evil Vis Error.

#2481 Posted by Tronyn. [24.66.247.146], 27/03/2002 22:22 GMT

So the last mapping chore for SOE is fixing this error, checkstack: leaf recursion in soe1m1. Vis gets about halfway done then gives me this. Anyone have any wonder-solutions or is it picking the map apart piece by piece for me?

Speedy Thought A Title Wasn't Needed

#2482 Posted by Speedy [212.46.194.230], 27/03/2002 22:37 GMT

wrath Thought A Title Wasn't Needed

#2483 Posted by wrath [195.58.111.103], 27/03/2002 22:50 GMT

Max_vis Error

#2484 Posted by atilla [62.238.23.172], 31/03/2002 21:46 GMT

Does someone knows what the outer limits for q3arena maps are, because im getting a max_visabilletie error when i compile a big map.

Thanks.

Another Q2 Mapping Newbee

#2485 Posted by Timbo [129.42.208.140], 01/04/2002 21:45 GMT

So here I am with everything I need to make great Quake2 maps except the answers to a world of questions. What are clip, skip and hint textures ? How do I use light emitting textures ? What's up with detail/structural choices ? My player start position kills me at startup. Why don't these textures line up nice ? And many more, but rather than ask them all here, I'm sure many others have been where I am and found some worth while tutorials. Can anyone recommend a good tutorial or a good whats-what and how-to-use it document ? Appreciate the help...

General Info

#2486 Posted by kanaeda [216.144.139.132], 01/04/2002 22:52 GMT

you should be able to find answers to the majority of your technical quiestions at gamedesign.net under the content section, and then Quake 2.

I suggest grabbing a copy of the entity specific tutorials so you can easily refer to them without having to load up the site and click thru the menus. helps a lot when you are first starting off.

hope that helps! :)

Hmm, No Title

#2487 Posted by DeFrag [66.152.70.107], 02/04/2002 02:36 GMT

hint: skip the clips

er.. no wait!

#2488 Posted by Shadowdane [68.50.252.23], 04/04/2002 20:18 GMT

hmm.. I recently decided to work again on a old Q3 map I started last year. But I cant get it to compile?? It tells me the shaderlist.txt file cant be found, when its right where it should be. Can anyone help??

C:\Quake III Arena\baseq3>q3map "C:\Quake III Arena\baseq3\maps\shad3dm1.map"
Q3Map - v1.0r (c) 1999 Id Software Inc.
Q3Map (GtkR) - v1.2.1-y10
GtkRadiant - v1.2.1 Jan 23 2002
Default game config: Quake III Arena
qdir: C:\Quake III Arena\
gamedir: C:/Quake III Arena/baseq3/
VFS Init: C:/Quake III Arena/baseq3/
---- q3map ----
1 threads
Script file C:/Quake III Arena/scripts/shaderlist.txt was not found
Loading map file C:\Quake III Arena\baseq3\maps\shad3dm1.map
entering C:\Quake III Arena\baseq3\maps\shad3dm1.map
WARNING: Couldn't find image for shader textures/shad3hipoly/shad_grate
WARNING: Couldn't find image for shader textures/shad3hipoly/shad_padwall_red
WARNING: Couldn't find image for shader textures/base_light/baslt4_1_2k
WARNING: Couldn't find image for shader textures/base_light/ceil_white5k
WARNING: Couldn't find image for shader textures/base_light/proto_light_2k
WARNING: Couldn't find image for shader textures/base_floor/clangfloor_noisy
WARNING: Couldn't find image for shader textures/base_light/light5_10k
WARNING: Couldn't find image for shader textures/base_light/baslt4_1_4k
WARNING: Couldn't find image for shader textures/base_light/ceil1_38_10k
WARNING: Couldn't find image for shader textures/shad3hipoly/shad_lightgreyfog
WARNING: Couldn't find image for shader textures/shad3hipoly/shad_lghtred_5k
WARNING: Couldn't find image for shader textures/shad3hipoly/shadblue_clouds
WARNING: Couldn't find image for shader textures/base_light/ceil1_22a_8k
WARNING: Couldn't find image for shader textures/base_trim/border11_250
0 areaportals
size: -1344, -544, -352 to 1611, 1320, 704
691 leafs filled
writing C:\Quake III Arena\baseq3\maps\shad3dm1.prt
0 triangle surfaces
0 triangle vertexes
Writing C:\Quake III Arena\baseq3\maps\shad3dm1.bsp
4 seconds elapsed

#2489 Posted by R.P.G. [24.136.135.19], 04/04/2002 23:07 GMT

In my map there are some brushes with duplicate plane errors. I'm feeling quite lazy and I don't want to rebuild them unless I have to. So obviously my question is, Is this going to bork my map -- either now or later? If it is, then of course I'm going to rebuild the brushes, but if not...

#2490 Posted by kanaeda [216.144.139.132], 05/04/2002 00:02 GMT

load it up in qeradiant and use the rogue brush repair plugin to make em go away. it's cool like that.

qeradiant.com

#2491 Posted by R.P.G. [24.136.135.19], 05/04/2002 00:09 GMT , Refers to Post #2490

/me HUGS kanaeda

I forgot about that! Thanks!

#2492 Posted by kanaeda [216.144.139.132], 05/04/2002 00:48 GMT , Refers to Post #2491

they also happen to work great in q3radiant. they will generate an incorrect interface version error (1.0 not 1.5) but that doesn't prevent them from killing duplicate planes and evil polys.

What About GTKR?

#2493 Posted by R.P.G. [24.136.135.19], 05/04/2002 01:08 GMT

Will they work wit GTKRadiant?

Shadowdane Is Still Working On A Title

#2494 Posted by Shadowdane [68.50.252.23], 05/04/2002 02:46 GMT

anyone know whats going on with my compile problem..

---- q3map ----
1 threads
Script file C:/Quake III Arena/scripts/shaderlist.txt was not found
ect...

but that is exactly where I copied the shaderlist.txt file.. I'm running q3map from C:\Quake III Arena\baseq3\, does it matter what dir/folder I run it from??

#2495 Posted by kanaeda [216.144.139.132], 05/04/2002 03:54 GMT , Refers to Post #2493

haven't tried it before. i know they work fine with our in-house breed of radiant so i'd assume they do unless the plug-in code was drastically changed.

Shadowdane Is Still Working On A Title

#2496 Posted by Shadowdane [68.50.252.23], 05/04/2002 04:10 GMT

speedy & scampie helped me figure it out, i should visit #tf more often.

File Space For Maps---

#2497 Posted by RogeR [65.80.252.51], 05/04/2002 07:26 GMT

If you want a fast FTP server (soon to be two servers)to add your map or any other persons Quake3 map to, www.PlanetQuake3.net can help. By filling out a form with a temporany link to the map you will get your map mirrored on PlanetQuake3.net's FTP server within hours. If you can't find a temporany place to store your map you can e-mail me the file if it's less then 10megs. I think this will help everyone out by getting your map on a server that won't cut you off for bandwidth. Use this form to add maps to PlanetQuake3.net:

http://www.planetquake3.net/download.php?op=AddDownload

If you need any help or to e-mail me a map:
roger@planetquake3.net

Shaderlist Prob

#2498 Posted by Tef Johs [217.70.229.50], 05/04/2002 10:30 GMT , Refers to Post #2494

The shaderlist.txt should not be where the editor tells you, i.e. in

Quake III Arena/scripts/shaderlist.txt

rather, it should be in

Quake III Arena/baseq3/scripts/shaderlist.txt

where baseq3 may be another working directory of your choice.

Spot the error there?

#2499 Posted by GrindSpire [213.122.200.167], 07/04/2002 11:16 GMT , Refers to Post #2493

I've no idea, but BobToolz can do the same thing (and more! :). Check it out here...

#2500 Posted by Fern [141.222.141.20], 07/04/2002 19:26 GMT

h0w d0 i makex0r teh m4px0r?

#2501 Posted by necros [172.143.24.156], 07/04/2002 21:25 GMT , Refers to Post #2500

And what a fitting post... (Or not.

New Project

#2502 Posted by nx [195.23.214.29], 08/04/2002 17:35 GMT

Wanna start a project. looking for help
check it!
http://planeta.ip.pt/~ip250620/project_tm/

#2503 Posted by Vrajgh [213.1.173.160], 09/04/2002 20:20 GMT

Are there links available where I can read up on details about how a binary space partition actually works? I was reading the rvis thread and realised that have no idea about any of it! :)

I read some stuff once before and kinda understood it "ish" but I'd be interested to read some more.

Thanks

#2504 Posted by necros [172.158.66.114], 10/04/2002 01:28 GMT

Are you still around? I remember vaguely you mentioning you had made some new BSP tools for quake... Or did you?

Re: Hmm BSP

#2505 Posted by Tyrann [203.56.239.111], 10/04/2002 04:23 GMT , Refers to Post #2503

Well, actually vis doesn't even look at the bsp. But if you want to find out more about it, you should probably start with Spog's technical page.

Vrajgh Thought A Title Wasn't Needed

#2506 Posted by Vrajgh [213.1.176.107], 10/04/2002 16:02 GMT , Refers to Post #2505

Thanks Tyrann. :)

/me goes off to read.

Necros: Yep, I'm Still Around

#2507 Posted by aguirRe [195.163.234.191], 10/04/2002 17:57 GMT , Refers to Post #2504

and the new double precision compilers can be found here.

I'm just about to update my RVis version there also with some small changes that might help tracking down errors, e.g. the annoying "Leaf portals saw into leaf".

#2508 Posted by necros [172.151.208.112], 10/04/2002 20:30 GMT

Incidentally, I remember someone having that "CanonicalVector: degenerate edge" error, and while reading the changes for your new txqbsp, I came to this part:

5. Fixed a bug in printout of "CanonicalVector: degenerate edge" error and turned it into a warning.

nice!

I Am Such A Moron

#2509 Posted by QuakeTree [204.33.130.109], 12/04/2002 02:27 GMT

I came across a (windows) free smallish (~680kb) batch file creator for those who are not comfy with making their own from scratch.

btrun410 at C-net.com

I tried it and it does work quite well.

Batch File Creator?

#2510 Posted by Fern [141.222.141.20], 12/04/2002 03:22 GMT

you mean like notepad.exe?

Batch File Creator?

#2511 Posted by R.P.G. [24.136.135.27], 12/04/2002 12:29 GMT

Or even edit.com?

#2512 Posted by QuakeTree [204.30.200.112], 12/04/2002 22:36 GMT

I just thought some of the peep's here who did not know how to do it would benefit by it. If you don't need it then fine. But if you look back in the thread there are a few that don't know how and might like to use something like it.

Speedy Is Still Working On A Title

#2513 Posted by Speedy [212.46.201.210], 12/04/2002 23:33 GMT

You are right quaketree, and it is usefull.
But that wouldnt stop Fern from smartassing

Glquake Error

#2514 Posted by GlassMan [217.35.62.179], 13/04/2002 13:39 GMT

GLQuake is crashing to the desktop with the error Allocblock: Full when I try to load my map. Darkplaces & Tq work fine as does dos & winquake but not other close derivatives of glquake (pan, gq, etc)

The suggestion has been that this is due to being able to see very long distances in a map but I dont have any of these. The map is big but no bigger than others of mine which work okay. Deleting large portions does eventually result in it working but I can't identify what it is that is being deleted or is reducing that is allowing the map to work again. Any ideas? Anyone know what limits have been raised or removed in darkplaces/TQ that allow them to load the map?

This is from TreeQBSP output

---- Portalize ----
3887 vis leafs
10847 vis portals
---- MakeFaceEdges ----
---- GrowRegions ----
Processing hull 1...
Processing hull 2...
---- WriteBSPFile ----
5297 planes 105940
27285 vertexes 327420
9895 nodes 237480
3496 texinfo 139840
21994 faces 439880
22579 clipnodes 180632
5020 leafs 140560
26153 marksurfaces 52306
87012 surfedges 348048
59274 edges 237096
87 textures 1273732
lightdata 0
visdata 0
entdata 120649

Thanks for any advice.

GlassMan, What Version Of TreeQBSP

#2515 Posted by aguirRe [195.163.204.83], 13/04/2002 14:07 GMT , Refers to Post #2514

are you using ? If it's the old one (<= 1.63), then you might have a leak that the compiler isn't reporting. You could try one or both compilers found here to see if there's any difference.

Of the numbers listed, I would say that the surfedges and entdata are pretty high. The high surfedges number could indicate a leak, while the large entdata is probably a result of a massive number of entities.

In one of the engines that you can load the map in, try noclipping outside and fire the RL. If it detonates immediately in your face (enter god mode ...), then the outside void is filled and the map is sealed (at least in hull 0). Otherwise, there is one or more leaks that you must seal.

You could also try temporarily to delete a large portion of the entity section to see if it loads then in GLQuake. The newer engines might have some limit raised that either gets rid of the problem or just postpone the inevitable crash/malfunction.

Allocblock: Full

#2516 Posted by nb [203.109.252.18], 13/04/2002 14:43 GMT

...is caused when no more lightmaps can be fitted into their limited storage space. (not necessarily too much lightmap data per se; they're packed into textures, and some space will probably be wasted).

#2517 Posted by R.P.G. [24.136.135.27], 13/04/2002 15:19 GMT , Refers to Post #2512

Sorry, QuakeTree.

#2518 Posted by GlassMan [217.35.62.179], 13/04/2002 16:21 GMT

The same error happens with 1.63 & 1.69. I'm running 1.70 now.

There is no leak.

I will try deleting all entites & recompiling.

nb - not run light yet.

GlassMan, Regarding Entities

#2519 Posted by aguirRe [195.163.201.7], 13/04/2002 17:04 GMT , Refers to Post #2518

the original Q1 limit was 64k and you have now about 120k. For the mission pack, Hipnotic raised this limit to 128k.

It's possible that the [GLQuake] engine doesn't allow more than 64k if "-hipnotic" or "-rogue" options are missing. I haven't verified that.

It could also be that it's not the total size that's the culprit; it could be the actual entity content.

In any case, I haven't seen that particular error message when exceeding entity limits. The only time I've seen it is when you have *very* large brushes in the map.

Let us know what you find out.

#2520 Posted by GlassMan [217.35.62.179], 13/04/2002 17:51 GMT , Refers to Post #2519

Deleting all the entities has worked although I don't know why. I have another map with entdata of 163363 so the total size can't be the problem. Some of the func_doors are rather complex so I'll try selectively deleting some of them.

qbsp output is now:

---- Portalize ----
3880 vis leafs
10829 vis portals
---- MakeFaceEdges ----
---- GrowRegions ----
Processing hull 1...
Processing hull 2...
---- WriteBSPFile ----
4686 planes 93720
25110 vertexes 301320
8629 nodes 207096
3338 texinfo 133520
20297 faces 405940
20248 clipnodes 161984
3881 leafs 108668
24388 marksurfaces 48776
80165 surfedges 320660
55379 edges 221516
64 textures 1153720
lightdata 0
visdata 0
entdata 253

#2521 Posted by Scampie [66.231.198.47], 13/04/2002 22:28 GMT

AllocBlock: Full generally occurs when you make a single brush with a huge surface. It will work fine in software, but crash GL. Aardappel once had this problem on a otherwise fine map, but he had used a single huge brush for the floor. He chopped the single brush into 4 smaller brushes and it worked without a hitch.

Also, it sometimes happens when you do funky vertex manipulations or CSG cutting... ie, have a Bad Brush... for unknown quirks in the ways of bsp, a face will be displayed as an infinte plane in software.

#2522 Posted by nb [203.109.252.12], 14/04/2002 01:50 GMT , Refers to Post #2518

Even if you haven't run light yet, the lightmaps are still created - they're just fullbright. AllocBlock is used in precisely one place, and that's while building lightmap textures in GL; hence the error is certainly related to this.

Speedy Is Still Working On A Title

#2523 Posted by Speedy [212.46.204.252], 14/04/2002 02:09 GMT

try to run qbsp -subdivide 240 (or what switch tell it size of splits)

#2524 Posted by GlassMan [217.35.62.179], 14/04/2002 11:58 GMT

Getting rid of all the func_doors has produced a working map so I'm now trying to narrow it down by selectively deleting/simplifying them. That means that I've either got a problem with one or more of these doors or that collectively they are pushing the map over some limit or other.

nb-the lightmap is only added when you run light which you can tell because the size of the bsp goes up accordingly. Is a default blank lightmap added on the fly when you run glquake? I'm not sure what you mean when you say AllocBlock is used in one place. You mean its a routine run by glquake.exe when loading the map? Is the lightmap texture limit a combined one with the normal textures in the map?

scampi- I dont think I have any brushes bigger than 2048 in any one dimension which doesn't seem too big (?).

speedy- A subdivide of 240 is the default. Would you suggest a larger or smaller figure?

Thanks for the ideas guys.

Hmm, No Title

#2525 Posted by Speedy [213.172.3.133], 14/04/2002 20:25 GMT

Well, I tried using 256 one time and it gave me same error, lowered to 240 and error gone

#2526 Posted by nb [203.109.252.14], 15/04/2002 02:02 GMT , Refers to Post #2524

Sorry, I should have been more clear. On map load, each lightmap in the bsp is placed into one of several large opengl textures (which are different beasties to quake textures; thus the same limits don't apply). If the bsp has no lightmaps, fullbright is used instead, but the textures are still generated and used.

AllocBlock is run on map load for each lightmap. It finds a place to put it somewhere in one of the opengl textures, like fitting small different-sized boxes into a few large crates (it packs them in as rectangles; so sometimes, I think, space is wasted. Do the func_doors in question have lots of little odd-shaped faces?). If the lightmap is too large and won't fit, or all the textures are full, it'll complain with the ": full" error.

(Of course, the problem could be somewhere else entirely, and only show up here through some mechanism I haven't understood.)

#2527 Posted by GlassMan [195.184.253.85], 15/04/2002 08:26 GMT

Do the func_doors in question have lots of little odd-shaped faces?

Yes they do. Also some not so little odd shaped faces. Like one func_door consists of about 30 non-axial brushes and covers an area of about 1024 units in all directions. Deleting this one alone does not solve the problem though. Deleting most of them including this one does. Are lightmaps on brush entities stored in a particularly inefficient way?

Also I do have a lot of dynamic lighting in the map so tonight I will test the map with this removed.

Is there a way of looking at the lightmaps & is there anything to keep in mind to optimise them?

#2528 Posted by GlassMan [195.184.253.85], 15/04/2002 08:35 GMT , Refers to Post #2527

On second thoughts dynamic lighting can't be having any effect as the error occurs (or the map is error-free) regardless of whether tyrlite has been run. Or could it?

`the Damn Door Sticks...`

#2529 Posted by nb [203.109.252.29], 15/04/2002 14:11 GMT , Refers to Post #2528

Lightmaps are, I think, all stored in the same manner, whether they're on bmodels or the world. So you can try removing some particularly complex bits of the world, but keep all the doors; this should have the same effect as keeping the world and removing the doors.

Dynamic lighting has no effect here (though it does mean the lightmap textures get altered and uploaded a lot in-game, slowing things down a bit).

The most important thing to bear in mind is that space for a surface's lightmap in the texture is allocated in a rectangular block - like putting the surface, whatever shape it is, in a rectangular box; and packing many of these into a few big crates. So weird-shaped surfaces will waste more space than perfectly rectangular surfaces. (You might want to check how the doors etc are being cut up, with r_drawflat in software or gl_showtris on a custom engine.)

Altering the subdivide size in qbsp, as speedy suggests, alters the maximum size of the surfaces, I think. Tweaking it a bit either way might get you a better packing of lightmaps.

There are 64 lightmap textures to fill, and 1 lightmap pixel is 16 world units square; so that's some serious real estate you're covering. I look forward to seeing this when it's released

Since We Are In The Engine Mood:

#2530 Posted by czg [158.38.54.71], 16/04/2002 13:11 GMT

What does the "Backup past 0" warning mean?
Seems to pop up at random times when playing random maps...

Ok I Need Help With Q1Rad

#2531 Posted by Starbuck [194.117.133.196], 19/04/2002 16:11 GMT

Of course, it's helluva cool, but of course, I suck at it

.

Main Point:
When i use surface lights i hardly get any contrast in lighting in my maps, and i'd like to get the light to focus around the source more (like using a wait of >1 in tyrlite or something).
Can this be achieved somehow? i know _lights have scale but i can't figure out how to do it avec les surface lights.

Minor Point:
Whenever I add a _light it adds a message (to the console) in GlQuake. I noticed this happened with light_environments in crdm2 and i don't want the error with every _light i place. Can this message be stopped? Maybe i got glquake set up weird or something.

Thanks if any of you can help me!

#2532 Posted by Scampie [66.231.198.47], 19/04/2002 17:48 GMT , Refers to Post #2531

http://www.qmap.org/qthread.php3?id=20020401173740&pos=0

It now lets you use "light" keys instead of just "_light"

not that i've used it, but maybe that's an answer you're looking for.

#2533 Posted by Starbuck [194.117.133.196], 19/04/2002 18:26 GMT

i get no problems when using the light key but i'd like to use _light, i forget why, maybe the light key doesnt work with colored lighting in q1rad or something. Plus i'd like to use the 'right' key rather than to have to use the stifle q1 lights command.

#2534 Posted by DaZ [213.1.170.116], 20/04/2002 01:00 GMT

You can get a proggie off riots site that allows surface lights using tyrlite, which will give the desired effect, if thats what your looking for ?

Q1rad attenuates ALL the lights on the map I think to make the whole look more "real" but it does tend to wash out the map (see crdm2...) I haven't found a way around this yet...

Speedy Is Still Working On A Title

#2535 Posted by Speedy [213.172.9.227], 20/04/2002 01:56 GMT

-bounce 1 (or even 0) will make light more contrast

#2536 Posted by gibbies [213.46.20.13], 22/04/2002 13:31 GMT

... do you remove fullbrights from a texture? Texmex doesnt work and grafixer only works for textures smaller then 200 x 320... couldnt find any other programs.

Please help!

Thanks.

#2537 Posted by Fern [141.222.141.20], 22/04/2002 15:34 GMT

Texmex DOES work. You need to edit your workspace preferences not to allow fullbrights, then open the individual texture and copy/paste it pack into the slot. (this looks much more natural than using "remove fullbrights," which I assume you're talking about)

gibbies Thought A Title Wasn't Needed

#2538 Posted by gibbies [213.46.20.13], 22/04/2002 20:19 GMT

that works, thanks.

#2539 Posted by Starbuck [194.117.133.196], 22/04/2002 20:44 GMT

k cheers for help dudes, I went the Daz suggested route and it seems to be working quite well!

AllocBlock: Full

#2540 Posted by R.P.G. [24.136.169.92], 23/04/2002 22:53 GMT

I'm seeking some clarification. I added a new room to this map, compiled it, and it leaked. I got the "AllocBlock: Full" error while loading it in PanQuake. I trimmed back the number of faces in a vain effort to get rid of the error. If the map is no longer leaking, the error should not come back if I add those faces back in, right? That is to say, the reason I got AllocBlock: Full is because the unseen sides of the brushes were not being removed, correct?

Most Likely.

#2541 Posted by necros [172.144.13.203], 23/04/2002 23:09 GMT , Refers to Post #2540

On average, it means there are 5 more faces per brush for quake to draw, plus it isn't vised. That's a lot of wpoly to draw. I think there are other reasons for AllocBlock errors, but I can't think of them atm. (Was there something to do with lightdata or entdata?)

Another Question

#2542 Posted by R.P.G. [24.136.169.92], 24/04/2002 19:27 GMT

Why do I get five (5) "CutNodePortals_r:new portal was clipped away" when compiling with TyrQBSP, but I only get one (1) when compiling with WQBSP?

I get nasty clipping errors as a result of the five errors from TyrQBSP, but WQBSP seems to yield higher r_speeds. Help?

#2543 Posted by R.P.G. [24.136.169.92], 24/04/2002 21:55 GMT

Why does this texture animate while using TyrQBSP but not animate when I use WQBSP?

added 0 texture frames

I'm using +0button3 on the button face.

#2544 Posted by necros [172.152.56.221], 24/04/2002 22:55 GMT , Refers to Post #2543

Doesn't add all the other animation texture frames automatically. (Obviously, TyrQBSP does...) To get around that problem with wqbsp, just make a dummy brush with the other tex frames on each side.

#2545 Posted by R.P.G. [24.136.169.92], 24/04/2002 23:07 GMT , Refers to Post #2544

#2546 Posted by Speedy [217.195.94.86], 25/04/2002 03:37 GMT

I need a small test:
get map and play it with bots
sm89.pk3 (120k)

For me the bots just stand still on the uppper floor, I need to know is it problem with the map or my q3 is fuxored. I seem to get odd bot behaviour on the maps I make, but not stock levels.

#2547 Posted by Tyrann [203.56.239.111], 25/04/2002 04:40 GMT , Refers to Post #2542

If you have wierd problems with TyrQBSP, please try Bengt's TreeQBSP as well and see if they are different. If they are, that would indicate a problem with my stuff...

P.S. "Portal was clipped away..." errors really suck.

#2548 Posted by nb [203.173.208.13], 25/04/2002 06:47 GMT , Refers to Post #2546

AAS thinks the entire upper floor is a solid area. Why this is, I'm not sure. Are you using the latest bsp2aas?

#2549 Posted by R.P.G. [24.136.169.124], 25/04/2002 14:46 GMT , Refers to Post #2547

Thanks. TreeQBSP only spits out one "CutNodePortals...", as well. If you're interested in seeing the .map for bug fixing or whatever, I can send you a copy.

Re: Compilers

#2550 Posted by aguirRe [195.163.203.208], 25/04/2002 17:41 GMT , Refers to Post #2549

When comparing output from different compilers variants (and versions thereof), even the slightest change in compiler logic, compiler precision, map editor or even brush/face order in map file may have interesting effects on the result.

E.g. when using QuArK, every 2nd time you perform a save/quit/load/compile sequence, you wind up with a different version of the map file.

This in turn can easily lead to radically different compile times and appearing/disappearing warning/error messages (like the "CutNodePortals ...") or even leaks. Not nice at all.

I think Tyrann's calling it "Floating Point Hell" and it's rather frustrating, both for mappers and coders.

At least the situation has improved somewhat over time; there are now several improved tools available that offer various solutions.

Oh, AguiRe,

#2551 Posted by necros [172.128.141.200], 25/04/2002 20:25 GMT

I tried your version of TXQBSP, but it can't even compile maps. It almost always fails with some fatal error. (Much like the original TXQBSP did, which is why I stopped using it.) Does it have problems with large (3000+) maps, or is it just me?

(Sorry I don't have the actual errors with me.)

#2552 Posted by R.P.G. [24.136.169.124], 25/04/2002 21:21 GMT

In Q1, is there a way to spawn a monster so that it's "awake" before it sees you?

Hmm, No Title

#2553 Posted by Speedy [217.195.94.218], 25/04/2002 22:24 GMT

used version 2.1h, May 6 2001 16:15:03 and
1.7, Dec 22 1999 19:37:59 - results are the same, also got some warnings like

Entity 0, Brush 120: duplicate plane

But q3map had no warnings/erorrs (used one of the lates q3map2 build)

#2554 Posted by Fern [141.222.141.20], 25/04/2002 23:43 GMT

if you give the monster a target of a path_corner without a destination, it seeks the player at walking speed after reaching the path_corner. That's not quite as full-fledged as waking up, but it will get a similar effect :)

#2555 Posted by necros [172.170.82.216], 26/04/2002 00:36 GMT , Refers to Post #2552

If you are teleporting monsters in, all you do is give the monster the same targetname as the teleporter. That way, when you trigger the teleporter, you also trigger (wake up) the monster.

Problems With Items

#2556 Posted by Lucas [152.163.206.204], 26/04/2002 06:06 GMT

I'm in the process of making a map. Actually, I should say that I'm done with the map and only working with monsters and items now. In a hallway I put about five monsters in there and about five items. One of the items was a rocket launcher that showed up when I tested the map. The other four items were either shells or rockets. For some reason, the other four don't show up. Could it have anything to do with lighting or visibility? The rocket shows up just fine and it's next to the other items. Anyone have an answer?

#2557 Posted by metlslime [12.231.113.167], 26/04/2002 07:35 GMT

unlike monsters, weapons, and most items, ammo and health are bsp models. So, instead of spawning centered on the origin, they spawn with the origin as one corner of their bounding box. (top north west corner, i think.)

If your editor represents entities as zero-sized points, rather than boxes, you will need to make sure the origin is far enough from floors/walls that the bounding box is totally in empty space.

#2558 Posted by czg [158.38.54.87], 26/04/2002 10:12 GMT

You can trigger all the stuff you want without using any trigger brushes like thus:
{
"classname" "info_notnull"
"think" "SUB_UseTargets" /*Not sure about the spelling/caps there*/
"nextthink" "1"
"target" "delicious_target"
}

The nextthink should be the number of seconds after the map has loaded before it triggers.
(I posted this since I assumed this was yer bleedin' 100b map. Can't waste brushes on shitty triggers!)

Fern, Necros, And Czg

#2559 Posted by R.P.G. [24.136.169.124], 26/04/2002 13:03 GMT

Thanks!

P.S. czg, you are my hero! I love you!

#2560 Posted by aguirRe [195.163.205.225], 26/04/2002 13:52 GMT , Refers to Post #2551

I sent you an email earlier today regarding this. I'd be glad to help you but I need the zipped map+wad to see what's going wrong. Please also add any additional info (e.g. actual error message, editor used etc) that might help tracking down the cause of the problem.

I doubt there is any problem with the brush count; in TxQBSP that limit is 65536. I've used TxQBSP to build extremely large maps, like those in Tronyn's SoE (even before he had to split them up due to Quake engine problems) or Tyrann's yet unreleased.

I'm always interested in receiving troublesome source maps that I can use to test my compilers.

I have about 60+ maps from different authors that all compile very well with TxQBSP (or at least not worse than any other compiler).

By any chance, you are not running out of virtual memory ?

Shadowdane Thought A Title Wasn't Needed

#2561 Posted by Shadowdane [68.50.252.23], 27/04/2002 21:57 GMT

havent seen this compile error before.. How can I fix this?? I checked the area where it says below, but I couldnt find anything wrong. Do I really need to worry about it?

WARNING: node without a volume
node has 2 tiny portals
node reference point 128.00 896.12 640.00
WARNING: node without a volume
node has 2 tiny portals
node reference point 383.98 640.00 -252.00

Hmm, No Title

#2562 Posted by DeFrag [66.152.71.110], 27/04/2002 22:07 GMT

What's at those coordinates?
Tear apart the wall & see if some rogue-brush is embedded somewhere.. hmm

#2563 Posted by pjw [66.107.101.68], 28/04/2002 21:15 GMT , Refers to Post #2561

Try bob-tools brush cleanup (under plug-ins).

Also, from
http://quake3.qeradiant.com/errors.shtml

WARNING: Node without a volume / node has 0 tiny portals

An infinite brush. Delete it. The latest build of GtkRadiant has a debug tool that can help the mapper track down infinite brushes. Go to the BSP menu and select No_Vis (No light). After the compile process, a window will open up--assuming you've got bad brushes--and the first brush in the list will be selected and visible in the Z-Window. Merely press Backspace to delete this brush and repeat the No_Vis process. Or, you can use the Find Brush command (Misc menu) to find and then delete those bad brushes.

#2564 Posted by Lucas [152.163.201.69], 28/04/2002 23:38 GMT

I first want to thank the person who told me about items and health. It really helped and now they all appear in my map.

First I want to tell you that I can be a bit crazy and odd. Most of the maps I've attempted I have to delete them either because they suck or I get an error in it that won't let me compile it anymore. Anyway, I'm trying to stay with simplicity so I'm only using a few different textures, but I am not all that good at quake. At least, not as good as the guys at SDA. Anyway, is there anyone who would be willing to playtest it for me? It's on nightmare difficulty...so...

thanks

#2565 Posted by Abyss [144.134.90.15], 30/04/2002 06:35 GMT , Refers to Post #2564

If you haven't got any people to play test your map yet, I would be only to happy to give it a run through, so just let me know.

I would have Emailed you, but don't know if that is your correct email add or what.

Avp2 Compile Trouble...

#2566 Posted by DaZ [213.122.156.70], 01/05/2002 01:03 GMT

BSP tree 70.54% balanced.
Num detail nodes: 0
Finding leaves.
- VisBSP (9 polies)
** Couldn't find any textures.
** (Is project path set?)

-------------------
Lighting world
Ambient light (0.0, 0.0, 0.0)
** Unable to get texture lights.
** (Is project path set?)

ProdigyXL, help!

#2567 Posted by DaZ [213.122.156.70], 01/05/2002 01:04 GMT

I type in the location of the avp2.dep into the "project path" window on the compiler but it still says "is project path set" and I get errors. Argh!

#2568 Posted by iART [24.64.223.204], 02/05/2002 05:18 GMT

Are you using an understandable path?

Mine is...
c:\progra~1\fox\aliens~1.pre\avp2

The only way that i can generate these errors is by messing with this path.

#2569 Posted by DaZ [213.122.133.199], 02/05/2002 10:07 GMT

is at :e:\games\avp2

So the game/project path should be : e:\games\avp2\avp2\ right?

#2570 Posted by iART [24.64.223.204], 02/05/2002 14:45 GMT

Yes, that is right.

TO RULE THINGS OUT...

#2571 Posted by iART [24.64.223.204], 02/05/2002 14:56 GMT

in EDIT > OPTIONS...

under the "RUN" tab, you have

EXECUTABLE:
e:\games\avp2\lithtech.exe

WORKING DIRECTORY:
e:\games\avp2\

PROGRAM ARGUMENTS:
-rez AVP2 +runworld %WorldName%

Its A Shame

#2572 Posted by iART [24.64.223.204], 02/05/2002 17:35 GMT

about the time difference. Using forums for help can be so frustrating because answers are wanted 10mins ago, not 5 hours later.

#2573 Posted by DaZ [213.122.45.10], 03/05/2002 00:04 GMT

Ok I put in exactly what Iart said, but it still has the same error

/me goes back to dazsp4...

#2574 Posted by iART [24.64.223.204], 03/05/2002 01:19 GMT

visited the Research & Development forum @ www.aliensversuspredator.com?

I am going to ask your question there, because this is pissing me off now.

Posted Your Question

#2575 Posted by iART [24.64.223.204], 03/05/2002 01:35 GMT

#2576 Posted by iART [24.64.223.204], 03/05/2002 06:18 GMT

Check... and double check your path, because i'm getting the same answer from the people who should know... "should"...

One More Time

#2577 Posted by iART [24.64.223.204], 03/05/2002 19:37 GMT

This latest bit is from the avp2 above. Although I can NOT see how \Fox\ would be added to the path.

=========================================
OK, take a look at what I have in my processor project directory:

c:\Progra~1\Fox\Aliens~1.pre\AvP2\

This is because my game directory is:
C:\Program Files\Fox\AvP2

SO, from what I understand your directory is going to be:

e:\games~1\Fox\Aliens~1.pre\AvP2\

If you are not running this when you process, it doesn't matter what your project directory and executable are, it will ALWAYS give you the error message you're talking about...
=====================================

i take NO credit for this "odd ball" post.

Ignore The Above

#2578 Posted by iART [24.64.223.204], 03/05/2002 20:23 GMT

the path should be:

e:\games\avp2\AvP2\

this comes from a Monolyth level designer.

#2579 Posted by DaZ [213.122.111.216], 03/05/2002 22:38 GMT

well thanks for the help Iart, its appreciated, ill hax0r a little and see if I can get it to work

Shadowdane Thought A Title Wasn't Needed

#2580 Posted by Shadowdane [68.50.252.23], 07/05/2002 22:55 GMT

hmm.. didnt notice this before. but looks like I have some bad brushes. anyway I can acually tell which brushes are causing these warnings?? This only shows in the editor, not while compiling.

LOADED: textures/base_floor/clangspot2.tga
WARNING: brush plane with no normal
WARNING: brush plane with no normal
WARNING: brush plane with no normal
WARNING: brush plane with no normal
WARNING: brush plane with no normal
WARNING: brush plane with no normal
WARNING: brush plane with no normal
WARNING: brush plane with no normal
--- LoadMapFile ---
C:/Quake III Arena/baseq3/maps/shad3dm1_rc2.map

#2581 Posted by R.P.G. [24.136.169.124], 07/05/2002 23:23 GMT , Refers to Post #2580

Try MapSpy.

And I don't want to hear any comments about it being "only for Q2." I'm tired of people not realising that BSPs have hardly changed since Q1. Brush errors are brush errors, no matter the game.

Sorry. I'm not ranting at you, Shadow. But people always ask for solutions to these problems, and they don't like my answer. If they didn't want to fix it, they shouldn't have asked.

#2582 Posted by R.P.G. [24.136.169.124], 07/05/2002 23:25 GMT

<s4wk>That link should be http://mapspy.gamedesign.net.</s4wk>

#2583 Posted by Shadowdane [68.50.252.23], 07/05/2002 23:42 GMT

mapspy doesnt like the map...

*** Critical Error - cannot continue ***
Error parsing brush
Corrective action: Your map file contains an error. You'll probably need to fix it with a text editor.

#2584 Posted by Asriel [203.96.150.106], 10/05/2002 04:16 GMT

Why can't you have more than one sky in Quake1?

Having multiple sky textures in a map causes quake to only show one.
For example, having sky8 and skyik2, only sky8 will be shown.

Why is this?
And how does quake choose which one to show?

#2585 Posted by metlslime [12.231.113.167], 10/05/2002 05:17 GMT

at least in glquake, the sky texture displayed is the last sky texture encountered when loading the level's textures. (each sky texture found will overwrite the previous one.)

#2586 Posted by Asriel [203.79.75.85], 11/05/2002 22:51 GMT

#2587 Posted by NotoriousRay [199.75.227.166], 18/05/2002 03:31 GMT

speaking of idbase maps prone to problems, i got one more of qc nature (i think). see, i'm using custom qc (func_spawns, particlefields, etc) but like, in the status bar when i load my map, it says 'monsters 68 / 1' after i kill all 68 enemies. whats up with that 1? anyone know of any irregularities in the spawn code (from SoA) or similar? if it helps at all, all the spawn ents i use are one-time only, no recurring

#2588 Posted by E-werd [24.154.196.201], 18/05/2002 18:00 GMT

************ ERROR ************
SetQdirFromPath: no 'quake' in C:/Documents and Settings/E-werd/-saveprt

this happens everytime i go to compile my Q3 map...why the hell is it looking there?! my map is in 'C:\Quake3\baseq3\maps\'!!!!

Oh, And Btw

#2589 Posted by E-werd [24.154.196.201], 18/05/2002 18:02 GMT

i am using GTKRadiant

Hmm, No Title

#2590 Posted by Shadowdane [68.50.252.23], 18/05/2002 18:33 GMT

i dunno why.. but I could only get the compiler to run from this directory.

C:\Quake III Arena\baseq3\radiant

btw.. use Q3Map2 by Ydnar its a great compiler.

http://www.shaderlab.com/q3map2/

Who Needs A Title Anyway

#2591 Posted by Shadowdane [68.50.252.23], 18/05/2002 18:34 GMT

acually i should be more specific.. i could only get it to run from a directory that was in C:\Quake3\baseq3\xxxxx\

i think u get the idea..

#2592 Posted by necros [172.160.31.157], 19/05/2002 02:46 GMT , Refers to Post #2587

Well, all I know is that I had to fix the code myself, to work in ne_sp06. It was doing the same think your describing now, NotRay. It has to do with the way the monster count is called in the spawn function. It gets called late, and gets ignored for some reason.

#2593 Posted by NotoriousRay [199.75.227.41], 19/05/2002 03:20 GMT

could you be more specific regarding how you fixed it, i.e. codewise?

Jago Is Still Working On A Title

#2594 Posted by Jago [194.251.240.107], 19/05/2002 04:41 GMT

SetQdirFromPath: no 'quake' in C:/Documents and Settings/E-werd/-saveprt

I think the error is quite obvious. The word "quake" could not be found in the file path. Rename "E-Werd" to "quake" or put it into a directory called "quake" or "mahl33tQUAKEdir" and it should work.

#2595 Posted by czg [158.38.54.74], 20/05/2002 14:18 GMT

Or anyone else who has tried this:
Can antilights with tyrlite be toggled?
There was something in the readme about antilights only "sucking up" light of the same style, and since switchable lights are styles switchable antilights wouldn't effect the world lighting?
That bit in the readme was a bit confusing...

#2596 Posted by Tyrann [63.12.14.46], 20/05/2002 15:57 GMT , Refers to Post #2595

They can be toggled, but they probably won't do what you expect. If you have a bright room and switch on an anti-light, nothing will happen.

Switching on a light can only ever add to the light.

#2597 Posted by necros [172.133.231.18], 21/05/2002 00:03 GMT , Refers to Post #2593

but I'll give you da fixored .qc file: spawn.qc

#2598 Posted by E-werd [24.154.196.201], 21/05/2002 01:19 GMT

i cannot rename that dir because WinXP uses it for my settings...and for some reason, windows goes there...odd...

The N00b Alert-I'm Beginning

#2599 Posted by TheMagicalKuja [24.98.76.86], 21/05/2002 18:25 GMT

HEY! I'm a new guy, and since I have big plans to become a game designer, I first wish to learn how to design maps, preferably Quake 1 maps.

I have Quake 1 and Quake, scourge of Armagon. I've downloaded a few made maps (.bsp) but can't get them to work. And I also want to know waht programs I should start with when I make maps. Help please!

#2600 Posted by Starbuck [194.117.133.196], 21/05/2002 18:41 GMT

hey there,
make sure your maps are in your \quake\id1\maps\ folder, then all you need to do is run quake, bring up the console, and type map [mapname] where [mapname] is the name of the file, without the .bsp extension.
For creating maps, there are a wide range of programs availible. I would recommend Worldcraft 1.6, its one of the easier editors to get started in.
hope that helps a little

#2601 Posted by NotoriousRay [130.85.16.42], 21/05/2002 21:59 GMT

thanks for the .qc necros, but i actually went back and rebuilt my quakec and now everything works ok. i will have a looksee, though

#2602 Posted by necros [172.165.133.196], 22/05/2002 00:20 GMT , Refers to Post #2601

#2603 Posted by E-werd [24.154.196.201], 22/05/2002 02:05 GMT , Refers to Post #2599

Well, i suggest QuArK 5.1 for n00bs, since its alot easier to start off with 2 views rather than 4. At the QuArK site, you can get these 3 programs to build your maps: TxQBSP, RVis, ArghLight. With versions 5.1 and after, you need minipython, and thats also on the site.

QuArK Official Website
You need all of the following:
QuArK 5.1
MiniPython
the build pack for Q1

This is pretty much self explanatory, just experiment.

#2604 Posted by czg [158.38.54.104], 22/05/2002 10:56 GMT

MAX_MAP_CLIPNODES error should by all accounts disappear as soon as the map doesn't leak anymore, right? (Please g4wd let it be right.)

#2605 Posted by czg [158.38.54.104], 22/05/2002 12:32 GMT

or maybe I should get some hardcore clipping going on...

#2606 Posted by Tef Johs [217.70.229.38], 22/05/2002 13:11 GMT

Hey, czg, I'm not sure about your question (although I ought to know something about it), but...

You're in Trondheim, right? How is school going :). I'd consider it bit of an honour if I could, sometime, meet with you and discuss the finer points of level design, as I'm also in Trondheim...

Just a suggestion, don't feel obliged to take me up on that :)

#2607 Posted by Tyrann [63.12.14.75], 22/05/2002 14:09 GMT , Refers to Post #2604

Yes you're right, the error should go away once there are no leaks.

#2608 Posted by wrath [195.58.111.103], 22/05/2002 17:46 GMT

your first stalker! :)

Ah...well No

#2609 Posted by Tef Johs [217.70.229.38], 22/05/2002 19:57 GMT , Refers to Post #2608

I have no interest in stalking anyone, I assure you :)

It happens to be like this; me and czg are both norwegians, and in the same city. Not hard to get that info, seeing he has another homepage describing his whereabouts etc.

It would be fun meeting someone from these boards, and who wouldn't meet with one of the best? :)

I.. I.. I Don't Know What To Say...

#2610 Posted by czg [158.38.54.62], 22/05/2002 20:28 GMT

I mean, like, SCARY...

Ooooh.. Stalker

#2611 Posted by DiSTuRBeD [217.70.229.52], 23/05/2002 07:53 GMT

Pass deg n�, czg ;)

*wonders why so many norwegian people play older games*

Ah, Forget I Mentioned It.

#2612 Posted by Tef Johs [217.70.229.38], 23/05/2002 14:17 GMT

A Little Help With FGDs

#2613 Posted by TheMagicalKuja [24.98.76.86], 24/05/2002 12:54 GMT

I wish to use Armagon indentities in my maps... sadly, I can't figure out how to install it, and I'm not sure if Quark can even handle it. I have both Quark and Worldcraft. Which one will allow me to use Armagon monsters, and how can I install it?

MagicalKuja Dude

#2614 Posted by Starbuck [194.117.133.196], 24/05/2002 14:52 GMT

This is how you do it in WC 1.6

Go to tools --> Options
Choose the 'Game Configurations' Tab
Where it says 'Game Data files:' click Add
Browse to the file, choose it then click OK

If you think the file you're using might be corrupt here's a link to the one off the WC site: Clicky!

Good Luck!

#2615 Posted by NotoriousRay [199.75.227.186], 25/05/2002 03:23 GMT

worldcraft 1.6b. it exists right? this isn't another figment of my imagination? reason being, my wc install got b0rked so i had to reinstall 1.6(a) but my old fgds no longer work (stopped responding upon loading, i can see general differences between old fgds/quake.fgd that came with new install)

so now using quake.fgd i get that good ol things-arent-in-quake-where-they-are-in-wc thing which i had averted before by using a modifed fgd by CZG. soooo..........

worldcraft 1.6b. where can i get it? it is not even mentioned on the download page at the planetquake/worldcraft site, anyone wanna give me a heads up?

#2616 Posted by QuakeTree [204.33.132.249], 25/05/2002 07:23 GMT

WorldCraft 1.6 full version

#2617 Posted by NotoriousRay [4.17.66.92], 25/05/2002 16:26 GMT

already got full version (had it since 1.30), just got 1.6a patch and arbitrarily tried planetquake/greyvoid/quake.fgd and all works now.

K, One More Thing...

#2618 Posted by NotoriousRay [4.17.82.76], 26/05/2002 14:12 GMT

maps compiling that generate a .pts and then a .prt in qbsp, whats up with this? of course, i can't load the pointfile because its null after compiling (hasleaks/doesn't have leaks) and this only came about as of late last night when i modified some terrain/added some monsters. i tried a sealed-part of my map and it did the same, should i ignore this? it still vised fine.

You'll Probably Get Rid

#2619 Posted by aguirRe [195.163.247.47], 26/05/2002 15:14 GMT , Refers to Post #2618

of that problem if you try one of the compilers found here.

Older compilers have a thing for not finding leaks or finding leaks but not tell about it.

You probably have a "leak" in hull 1 or 2, e.g. a clipping problem. Use the pts file to find the culprit.

#2620 Posted by DiSTuRBeD [217.70.229.44], 27/05/2002 08:27 GMT

Is it possible? I find it's much easier to make terrain in WC, and now i wanna make a q3 terrain map :)

Creating Textures For Q1?

#2621 Posted by Bawb [62.20.222.20], 27/05/2002 09:17 GMT

How do I create custom textures for Q1? If someone could point me in the right direction with some links, I would be greatful.

Gom Jabbar Thought A Title Wasn't Needed

#2622 Posted by Gom Jabbar [217.83.94.86], 27/05/2002 10:34 GMT , Refers to Post #2621

I already gave a small introduction in #tf so no need to type anymore ;)

Custom Texures For Q1

#2623 Posted by Fern [66.31.244.127], 27/05/2002 15:07 GMT

1) draw something
2) convert it to Q1
3) repeat steps 1-3

Ah.. Beer.. Mm..

#2624 Posted by bawb [62.20.222.222], 28/05/2002 05:56 GMT

Gom Jabbar, you da man, you da man! Checked out your map too, good shit

Gom Jabbar Is Still Working On A Title

#2625 Posted by Gom Jabbar [217.4.99.203], 28/05/2002 19:35 GMT

#2626 Posted by Grahf [24.51.159.42], 28/05/2002 19:56 GMT

It is my understanding that if qbsp generates a 0k pointfile, there is no need to worry, unless of course qbsp decides not to generate a prt. Then there is probably a microleak somewhere.

#2627 Posted by metlslime [12.231.113.167], 29/05/2002 05:25 GMT

what the hell is a mircoleak?

Transparent Water

#2628 Posted by Styx1 [195.193.5.251], 29/05/2002 08:18 GMT

I'm looking for a simple windows based program to create transparent water, lava etc. in mainly older bsp's. Whit "simple" I mean: link to the bsp-file or load it into the program, run program and out comes the new bsp with transparent thingies.
Older dos-based programs don't seem to run under XP.
Anyone ?

TIA, Styx

Re : What The Hell Is A Mircoleak?

#2629 Posted by Paul [213.122.139.135], 29/05/2002 12:29 GMT , Refers to Post #2627

Its like a microELEK but without the chives or ice cubes.

Grahf: What You Describe

#2630 Posted by aguirRe [195.163.203.65], 29/05/2002 16:22 GMT , Refers to Post #2626

is probably the same problem NotoriusRay mentioned in post 2618 above and which I answered in 2619. It's a bug in older compilers when finding leaks in hull 1 or 2 (the invisible clipping hulls).

If you have a leak in hull 1 or 2, ignore this fact (since you get a prt file) and still build a final bsp, there will be a lot of unnecessary info in the bsp that the game engine must handle. Also, leaks in those hulls often result in clipping errors, e.g. you can fall out of the map through a seemingly solid wall/floor.

Microleaks generally refers to leaks that are not obvious to spot visually while examining the map; you have to zoom in very close to see it. Using "snap to grid" in the editor usually minimizes this problem.

Styx1: Search for a utility called bsp2prt. It is a small program that generates a prt file from the bsp without needing the original source map. This prt has by default support for transparent water etc. Then you perform a vis as usual.

Beware of lengthy vis processing time for some maps ...

Half Life Map Help

#2631 Posted by MasterMind [12.229.175.36], 29/05/2002 21:37 GMT

I need help with compiling one of my half-life maps. I compiled my map with ZHLT, and I had a few leaks in my level. I loaded my map up, and I found the leaks, went back to WorldCraft (or hammer as it is now called) and fixed the leaks. I compiled again with ZHLT, but now when I load up the level, its the same bsp file from the last compile, so none of my changes are in the map. Its really frustrating, because its like the compile tools arent even really compiling, they are just pretending to compile or something! If you could help me with this I will praise you!!! Thanks

QuakeWorld Mapping... HELP!!!

#2632 Posted by DT [24.150.9.75], 30/05/2002 01:47 GMT

Ok, ive recently been workin on completeing my first quake map and ive run into a problem. ive put both trigger_push and func_door entities into it. ive also edited the "speed" variable for both thiese entities. Now, the problem is that when i compiled the map and tried to load it on a QW server, an error message appears to the effect of "speed is not a field" multable times. when i go to use one of the func_door of trigger_push ents the perform thier action at the default speed setting and not at the value i put into the variable. i have no clue as to why this occurs and i must find a solution to this problem in order for this map to be playable. Any help anyone can give will be much apreciated.

www.geocities.com/domestic_terror/jump2.html

#2633 Posted by NotoriousRay [199.75.227.215], 30/05/2002 03:01 GMT

my map had a brush that, for weeks now since building it, compiled no problem, but then when i modified the particular room it was in (it was a rock/terrain brush, nothing complex though) and it gave a leak in hull 1. fixed it though, so all is good. aguire, that modified treeqbsp is worth the use just for the better leak-detectin and pointfiling

Need Prefab Help

#2634 Posted by ToadWarrior [64.91.144.190], 01/06/2002 21:44 GMT

I'd really appreciate it if someone could make a prefab of the Thundercats logo for Quake 1.

I'm not l33t enough to do it properly, unfortunately.

Naturally it wouldn't have to include the circle around the cat head and it doesn't have to include detail like the line that defines the ears and jaw bone. Basically just the outline of the head with the eye... if possible. The eye isn't a total must have.

I'd totally appreciate it if anyone can do this for me and will give you credit in my readme as well as anything else you may want me to add to the readme for you.

As far as the size of it, since it will be place on a wall or floor, I'd like it to be fairly big but obviously not too big. Whatever size it takes to make it look fairly decent is fine with me.

If you are good at doing shapes for WC but actually don't know what the logo looks like, here's a pic
http://www.speciale.net/pics/tcats%20shirt.jpg

I Could Use A Prefab Too

#2635 Posted by Fat Controller [203.79.76.62], 01/06/2002 22:22 GMT

I've been doing a LOT of searching, and it seems that nobody has a prefab for those Q2 drop pods - you know, that thing that crashes you at your destination.

Anyone know where/if there is one around? And if you've got it, could you send me a copy? I'd appreciate it.

#2636 Posted by metlslime [12.231.113.167], 02/06/2002 08:23 GMT

i remember seeing them somewhere, though i can't find them now. You could always copy the brushes out of base1.map which was released by id with the q2 tools.

#2637 Posted by iART [24.64.223.204], 02/06/2002 19:03 GMT

Fatty
Found that pod for you...

http://asp.planetquake.com/dl/dl.asp?qpp/q2pod.zip

ToadWarrior
Sorry, I don't build for Quake... any more.

Pod Found At

#2638 Posted by iART [24.64.223.204], 02/06/2002 19:08 GMT

http://www.planetquake.com/qpp/qpp2/

Damn frames pages....

its under:
Q2 Prefabs > Vehicles > page [5]

Hey Toadwarrior

#2639 Posted by Starbuck [194.117.133.196], 02/06/2002 21:47 GMT , Refers to Post #2634

i made a logo for you and sent it your way...hope you can find a use for it!

That really was a test of vertex manipulation, but it compiles fine and all. What are you doing which involves thundercats btw? i'd be interested to know...

#2640 Posted by Starbuck [194.117.133.196], 02/06/2002 22:32 GMT

Someone asked for a pic of it, so here one is :)

#2641 Posted by Starbuck [194.117.133.196], 02/06/2002 23:45 GMT

#2642 Posted by The Lieutenant [144.32.177.194], 03/06/2002 13:51 GMT

Nice, Starbuck.

#2643 Posted by NotoriousRay [4.17.82.104], 05/06/2002 01:35 GMT

so i made a few ambient .wavs in cooledit, how do i get them to loop so i can use them in quake? i tried selecting whole wav/view sampler info/add loop/set to sustain-infinite and i still get 'sound is not looped' error

help?

Who Needs A Title Anyway

#2644 Posted by Shadowdane [68.50.252.23], 05/06/2002 02:06 GMT

it should work fine.. I believe Quake requires the .wav be: Mono 8bit 11025Hz.

not sure about source ports, or GLQuake, ect..

#2645 Posted by NotoriousRay [4.17.82.104], 05/06/2002 02:19 GMT

yeah.... the files are 8 bit 11khz mono. still get error, still dont' loop.

Hmm, No Title

#2646 Posted by Shadowdane [68.50.252.23], 05/06/2002 05:32 GMT

hmm.. weird

i dunno then, I dont do enough Q1 editing.

#2647 Posted by metlslime [12.231.113.167], 05/06/2002 10:04 GMT

you need to set a marker at the beginning and end of the section you want looped (usually the entire sound, but sometimes a buildup is appropriate, like for doors or flamethrowers.) In soundforge the way to do this is called "insert ASF markers" and then select "region" and enter the start and end times. The tags can have any name; if you look at id's door effects they are called stuff like MARK 739 AND MARK 881. In Cooledit it may be a very similar procedure.

#2648 Posted by xen. [194.117.133.196], 05/06/2002 16:07 GMT

Just got an email...

I read your article for map building i would have to say thats pretty impressive on the stuff you did to that room to make it look veeeerrrryy NIIIIIICE.. anyway. had a question for ya I used to design Doom 2 levels not very hard since it was only 2d anyway I was wonder Im just starting on Quake 3 and I have LOTS to LEARN. I was just trying to make a simple room and and since it only took a few minutes to add the entities and walls etc.. I couldnt play it in Quake 3 any Ideas the tutorial says to put it in .pk3 and use winzip I have tried 10 different ways to play just this simple room and no luck. would you please help?

Could someone possibly provide a breif copy&paste-able set of instructions for me to reply with? I know prescisely FUCK ALL about q3 editing...

Who Needs A Title Anyway

#2649 Posted by Shadowdane [68.50.252.23], 05/06/2002 16:56 GMT , Refers to Post #2648

i would redirect him to the Q3W Forums.. there is plenty of threads on "Your First Q3 Map" type stuff.

#2650 Posted by pjw [66.107.101.68], 05/06/2002 18:11 GMT

You don't need to put the .bsp file in a pk3 for it to load. You just need to pull down the console and type "/set sv_pure 0", hit enter, and then type "/devmap mapname" and hit enter.

Whatever tutorial he's reading is most likely goofy--there are a bunch of bad ones out there. The Q3W level editing forum is a good place to go. While it's not quite as busy, MapCenter is even better IMO (lower signal to noise ratio). www.map-center.com

In the meantime, there are good tutorials here: http://fps.brainerd.net/Q3Radianthelp.htm

Information Theorists Unite!

#2651 Posted by metlslime [12.231.113.167], 05/06/2002 19:06 GMT , Refers to Post #2650

lower signal to noise ratio

... and that's a good thing?

Grahf Is Still Working On A Title

#2652 Posted by Grahf [24.51.159.42], 05/06/2002 20:39 GMT

lower signal to noise ratio would mean more quality threads and discussion per every easy to answer "RTFM" style post. Or have I got that backwards?

Further Escapades With Sound Looping

#2653 Posted by R.P.G. [24.136.186.2], 05/06/2002 22:23 GMT

So this mod has a trigger_push entity. When the entity is used, the sound plays, and then loops, causing it to play forever. AFAIK, the entity code and the sound have not been touched, but obviously something is different. Any suggestions on what's wrong and what should be done?

#2654 Posted by pjw [66.107.101.68], 05/06/2002 23:37 GMT , Refers to Post #2652

You have it backwards, and so did I. That's what I get for posting in a hurry, and not really thinking about what I was saying.

Let's make that "higher signal to noise ratio".

#2655 Posted by kanaeda [12.239.72.168], 06/06/2002 03:54 GMT , Refers to Post #2652

sound quality output is often measured in 'signal to noise ratio' (among other things, of course); the lower the percentage, the clean the sound. so in other-words, a lower signal to noise ratio is, indeed, a good thing.

#2656 Posted by pjw [66.107.101.68], 06/06/2002 14:10 GMT

Actually I went and looked this up to make sure that I wouldn't look silly a second time.

You want more signal than noise (obviously).

So signal-to-noise_ratio should be high, I'm pretty sure . . .

Aw.

FFS. Here:
http://searchnetworking.techtarget.com/sDefinition/0,,sid7_gci213018,00.html

Hmm, No Title

#2657 Posted by Grahf [24.51.159.42], 06/06/2002 17:41 GMT

Just say "better" signal to noise ratio and assume people know what you're talking about.

Signal To Noise Ratio

#2658 Posted by Tef Johs [217.70.229.38], 09/06/2002 15:54 GMT

Having a Ph.D. in natural sciences, I can assure you that it should be "HIGHER signal to noise ratio", if you want it to be a good thing.

When the said ratio increases, the signal gets better. Mathematically sound, isn't it? :)

A lower signal to noise ratio means, thus, more noise. More fuzzy messages. BAD.

Who Needs A Title Anyway

#2659 Posted by DeFrag [66.152.70.130], 09/06/2002 17:45 GMT

iow: MORE signal (to noise)

#2660 Posted by Lunaran [64.108.165.121], 12/06/2002 00:36 GMT

less fucking noise?

In Anticipation ...

#2661 Posted by Lunaran [64.108.164.113], 15/06/2002 14:16 GMT

of that guy's Quake3 Curves thread being moved here :)

The edges of your curves have to line up with brush edges perfectly. If there's two brushes up against one curve edge (so the joins make a shape like a T) then you get those hairline sparklies.

Reorder the geometry around the curves so the corner vertexes match up with surrounding geometry.

#2662 Posted by Shambler [194.117.151.69], 15/06/2002 21:57 GMT

Curves, Quake3, Cracks.
Posted by sTiVen [202.138.47.172], 15/06/2002 10:48 GMT
How do I fix up hairline cracks in quake3 maps? I do have them caulked (though I really don't know why you caulk them, all the tutorials just say 'always caulk your curves' I assume this means the devil will take my soul if I don't).

#2 Posted by Eggman [162.83.139.245], 15/06/2002 16:26 GMT
The vertexes of your curves have to be aligned with the vertexes of surrounding geometry and curves. You cannot have a curve from 0-32 units in height be adjacent to a brush that is 0-64 units in height. You will get a sparkly along the border of this curve and brush. However if your curve is 0-32 units in height and its adjacent brush is 0-32 in height then all will be fine.

When I say 0-32 units in height I don't mean any height value in between 0 and 32, I mean (0,32) as specific height coordinates for the brush/curve vertexes.

After rereading your question I still can't tell if you are talking about cracks in-between curves and brushes or cracks in-between curves and curves. What I outlined should fix the former, and is generally a good practice.

An Easy Way To Find Spots To Fix..

#3 Posted by Fingers [195.156.200.188], 15/06/2002 19:58 GMT
..is using showtris. Look for any place where there is a "T junction" of lines, and you're likely to find sparklies there. For example, this could be where the "seam" between two adjacent brushes meets the side of another brush. (Like in a brick wall above and below a brick)

Most consumer video cards don't render T junctions correctly, so you get that little glitch... To avoid this, align your brushes/curves by their corners (vertices).

(q3map tries to automatically fix t-juncs by adding a vertex to the affected brush.. it's just doesn't always seem to work)

Question On Clipping...

#2663 Posted by distrans [203.29.11.38], 16/06/2002 06:37 GMT

I'm well into a Q1DM level and am using variations on a structural wall pillar throughout. some are 64units square at the base, some 64 wide and 32 deep, some 32 x 32. I figure the largest don't need to be clipped to the walls (even with slope clips), but what about the others? When does a structural component need to be clipped? Or maybe, how deep into the playing area does a structural component need to extend before it stops needing clipping?

Rule Of Thumb On Clipping

#2664 Posted by Fingers [195.156.200.191], 16/06/2002 10:04 GMT

if the structure is useful (as cover, or as a walking surface) without clipping, don't clip it. It's just weird when you try to take cover behind a big pillar and get stopped by an invisible barrier. 64 is definitely large enough for someone to hide behind, 32 may or may not be depending on the location... definitely clip 16's and below.

Also, tight spaces (hallways and such) are more critical on clipping and should be made as slick as possible...

Thanx Fingers...

#2665 Posted by distrans [203.29.11.38], 17/06/2002 02:49 GMT , Refers to Post #2664

#2666 Posted by Biff_Debris [12.93.211.206], 20/06/2002 01:23 GMT

I remember telling someone THE SAME EXACT THING in #TF, but don't remember being thanked... ;)

Texture Problem

#2667 Posted by Qine [212.138.47.11], 20/06/2002 01:28 GMT

I have started making levels for Q3A in GTKRadiant 1.2.1 two day ago, reading it's online tutorial, and bubba's basic tutorials (http://planetquake.com/bubba/tutorial.html) I have come to make a PLAYABLE level with bots and everything yet I now have a problem with my textures, its that I scale them and then compile using the GTKradiant's BSP (I tryed them all) yet in game the textures are the wrong size !!! (this only happens to SOME textures...

and if its not too much I have a nother question, how the hell do you get the sky or water shaders to work, I cant seem to be able to get them to work (sky's black, water is solid)...

plz somone help me here...thnx in advanced :)

#2668 Posted by pjw [24.128.56.74], 20/06/2002 01:45 GMT

GTK 1.2.1 had some issues--I would suggest upgrading to 1.2.9. That may solve your scale issues--I'm not sure. Do you mean that you scale the textures using the surface inspector (S) but they don't look the same way in-game as they do in-editor?

For your sky or water, make sure that you're using a shader and not a plain texture--shaders have white lines around them in the texture window.

#2669 Posted by Qine [212.138.47.17], 20/06/2002 02:11 GMT , Refers to Post #2668

yes I use (S) but in game the texture is the wrong scale...BTW where can I get this latest version ?... and I do use the white outlined shaders, yet in game there solid with a black and white checkers texture !

#2670 Posted by Qine [212.138.47.11], 20/06/2002 02:15 GMT

found the link, thnx anyhows :)

#2671 Posted by distrans [203.29.11.38], 20/06/2002 04:45 GMT , Refers to Post #2666

...seems age is starting to take its inevitable toll on someone's brain cells.

/me HUGs Biff and puts aside a special case of Coonawarra Shiraz for the time when/if we ever meet.

#2672 Posted by Biff_Debris [12.93.208.71], 20/06/2002 09:38 GMT

Since Xenon Asked It To Be Done...

#2673 Posted by Shambler [62.30.112.1], 01/07/2002 21:26 GMT

Quake Crashing
Posted by MisYu [213.76.244.129], 30/06/2002 19:51 GMT
Hi!

I had a problem with my MisSP1 - Titan map, I was bitching about it for serveral times at #tf, but there were so many solutions, that finally none of them worked well.

So, what have we there?

- properly created wad file with no duplicated textures' names

- about 2400 brushes which are being castrated each time I decide to fix my map

- WorldCraft Hammer 3.4 + duBSP or WorldCraft 1.6 + treeBSP

- winquake, glquake, a custom engine (I checked TQ148, fitzq, gq)

- no "invalid brushes" in check for problems, neither in Hammer nor in craft1.6

- map is unlighted and unvised with many opened arenas

- map doesn't contain any weird funcs, triggers or entities, all except lights/player had been deleted

- I deleted almost everything of a section, which from everything had started

- I deleted almost all spikes/cylinders/curves, which were being interconnected with other solids

- player is properly placed and consist no wicked keys within

This happens randomly, pick one possibility:

- soft loads map, hangs over my cpu when spawning player

- glquake hangs over my cpu while loading map in the console

- glquake crashes with "abnormal program termination" message

- glquake runs map, but it looks like you were all the time outside the level, in the void

- custom engine: hangs over

During the compile process, map says something like:

- so many of CutNodePortals
- some PointOffPlanes (only in DUBSP)

And these are solution, which I've stolen from #tf:

- too high r_speeds in unvised/opened map!
+ okay, but even when I castrate it for 200 or more brushes, it still doesn't work

- close your map, moron!
+ okay, I closed it, but I received a new message about "too big brush's side", you know

- use another compilator, man!
+ okay, I checked wqBSP (doesn't make BSP file, crashes), txBSP (glq crashes), treeBSP (glq crashes), DUBSP (glq crashes, lots of error messages), besidse I'm not able to use any other compilator but DUBSP in Hammer 3.4

- textures have duplicate names, run it with +map missp1 to avoid demos' maps
+ okay, but all textures are properly named

- delete all entities except light/spawns
+ okay, but I don't have any but them

What do you think?
Right now, map doesn't have any wicked/after carving/mad vertex manipulating/curved architecture, but it still doesn't run.

Yes, I'm really pissed off, but I'll first become ghey, before I decide to close that project.

Any ideas?
Help?

Latest News | Board Menu

Misyu

#1 Posted by Fern [66.31.244.127], 30/06/2002 20:39 GMT
close the map off but scale the texture on all visible faces of the box to 100000
[Reply]

Drannerz Is Still Working On A Title

#2 Posted by Drannerz [62.172.86.28], 30/06/2002 20:47 GMT
I'm so confused
[Reply]

.....

#3 Posted by ELEK [24.50.194.71], 30/06/2002 21:02 GMT
highlight the entire map, and move it several units in one direction or the other...then compile....believe it or not sometimes this actually works.
[Reply]

Zing!"

#4 Posted by xen. [194.117.133.196], 30/06/2002 22:05 GMT
I'm pretty sure I know what the problem is, it bogged sm36 down for over a month (anyone who asks about that map now will get their scrotum skewered on a rusty knitting needle).

Basically it seems like the map has too much information in the unvised bsp for Quake to handle. You'll just need to vis it every time you run. Be very careful not to cause leaks though, as you won't be able to load the map into Quake to find them.

Read up about it here
(http://www.qmap.org/qthread.php3?id=20000621191550&pos=1992), before Shambler C&P's all this stuff to Mapping Help and deletes the thread.
[Reply]

Ooh

#5 Posted by xen. [194.117.133.196], 30/06/2002 22:07 GMT
I thnk I linked too early in that thread there... read Tyrann's post #2004
[Reply]

2400 With Leaks Everywhere?

#6 Posted by [Kona] [202.37.101.12], 30/06/2002 22:44 GMT
misyu plugging all your leaks should help alot.
[Reply]

EL

#7 Posted by DeFrag [66.152.70.206], 30/06/2002 23:36 GMT , Refers to Post #3
I've had success with that method under Radiant as well.
[Reply]

Dodgy Sky Texture?

#8 Posted by Tron [203.12.165.8], 01/07/2002 02:39 GMT
You most probably just have too much information for an unvised map, but this reminds me of a strange problem I had a while ago where I made a custom sky texture (by editing an existing one) and it crashed the game whenever the sky came into view.
[Reply]

I'll Help...

#9 Posted by Tyrann [63.12.14.21], 01/07/2002 03:48 GMT
I'll take a look if you mail me the map + wad. If it's a problem with TreeQBSP I'll have a go at fixing that as well.
[Reply]

Miss You

#10 Posted by Vondur [195.128.67.197], 01/07/2002 06:12 GMT
seems you should vis it properly first

and yes, send .map + wad to me too
i love fixing errors ;)
[Reply]

Vondur

#11 Posted by Dietz [198.68.205.228], 01/07/2002 06:30 GMT
You're a freak
[Reply]

Tron,

#12 Posted by necros [172.135.61.11], 01/07/2002 17:37 GMT
that happens when the sky texture has a complete black on the non-transparent side.
[Reply]

Necros

#13 Posted by Fern [66.31.244.127], 01/07/2002 21:07 GMT
I'm using such a sky right now without any problems.

Register Worldcraft 1.6a?

#2674 Posted by :=) [12.27.23.134], 01/07/2002 22:25 GMT

Just a beginner here.

I have a shareware version of Worldcraft 1.6a for making Quake-1 maps. I want to be able to use the prefabs, but cannot unless the version is registered. I have checked with Valve and can no longer register the software :=(

Can anyone tell me how I can get a registered version or turn on prefabs in my shareware version?

#2675 Posted by Fern [66.31.244.127], 02/07/2002 03:43 GMT

#2676 Posted by NotoriousRay [162.33.176.229], 02/07/2002 14:54 GMT

plug those leaks and vis the map, mis. glquake gives up loading unvised maps around the 2000-2500 brush mark. At least thats what did it for me. (also closing wc when running helps random hangs)

#2677 Posted by xen\' [194.117.133.196], 03/07/2002 10:22 GMT , Refers to Post #2673

In Responce To Mister ":=)"

#2678 Posted by xen\' [194.117.133.196], 03/07/2002 10:23 GMT

Check the 'Q1 editor' thread, I posted a link to the regged version.

Rising Lava

#2679 Posted by Zero.G [80.116.47.183], 03/07/2002 12:58 GMT

Hi, there's a way to obtain a "Raising Lava" effect in Quake1? Like a brush that cause damage and moves upwards when triggered...
Thnx!

RE: Rising Lava

#2680 Posted by Preach [217.36.1.87], 03/07/2002 14:36 GMT

I think that what you want can be found in a mod here:

http://dynamic.gamespy.com/~paroxysm/ikonboard/ikonboard.cgi?act=ST;f=10;t=9

Hmm, No Title

#2681 Posted by killazontherun [211.28.96.5], 04/07/2002 02:14 GMT

arghh

329 curve brushesWARNING: AAS_CreateCurveBrushes: no winding
330 curve brushesWARNING: AAS_CreateCurveBrushes: no winding
395 curve brushesWARNING: AAS_CreateCurveBrushes: no winding
WARNING: CM_AddFacetBevels... invalid bevel
WARNING: CM_AddFacetBevels... invalid bevel
WARNING: CM_AddFacetBevels... invalid bevel
WARNING: CM_AddFacetBevels... invalid bevel
412 curve brushesWARNING: AAS_CreateCurveBrushes: no winding
422 curve brushesWARNING: AAS_CreateCurveBrushes: no winding
423 curve brushesWARNING: AAS_CreateCurveBrushes: no winding
424 curve brushesWARNING: AAS_CreateCurveBrushes: no winding
431 curve brushesWARNING: AAS_CreateCurveBrushes: no winding
434 curve brushesWARNING: AAS_CreateCurveBrushes: no winding
434 curve brushes

WARNING: CM_AddFacetBevels... invalid bevel
(x4)

what do these warnings mean when compiling aas files??

#2682 Posted by pjw [24.128.56.74], 04/07/2002 03:43 GMT , Refers to Post #2681

Don't worry about the warnings . . . if something says "ERROR--etc." then it's something to worry about. See your bspc.txt in your Radiant directory for a more detailed explanation.

Who Needs A Title Anyway

#2683 Posted by Zero.G [80.116.47.22], 04/07/2002 08:17 GMT , Refers to Post #2680

Thnx! Unfortunately:

1) I already want to use another compiled QuakeC add-on, and I know that it's not possible to use more than one without merging them and re-compiling (and I'm unable to do so and anyway don't have the sources...)
2) I'm unable to download it :-(

Anyway, Thank you very much

Who Needs A Title Anyway

#2684 Posted by Grahf [24.51.159.42], 04/07/2002 18:41 GMT

There's actually been two subsequent releases of pOx's extra's mod, now he has some bitchin particle system stuff that I really wanna try out sometime:

http://dynamic.gamespy.com/~paroxysm/ikonboard/ikonboard.cgi?s=3d24935e56b7ffff;act=ST;f=10;t=12

#2685 Posted by :=) [208.187.45.136], 05/07/2002 00:53 GMT , Refers to Post #2678

Hey,

Thanks for the DL Xen.
You are the best!

:=)

#2686 Posted by necros [172.140.192.125], 05/07/2002 01:13 GMT

is the WC 3d preview window supposed to be that slow? Am i configuring wc wrong or something?

#2687 Posted by Zero.G [62.211.173.91], 05/07/2002 11:29 GMT

Thnx to Preach and Grahf

#2688 Posted by R.P.G. [165.247.152.20], 05/07/2002 16:33 GMT , Refers to Post #2686

Yes, it is supposed to be that slow. Ben Morris hates you. Only solution is mighty QER.

Speedy Thought A Title Wasn't Needed

#2689 Posted by Speedy [213.172.2.8], 06/07/2002 01:48 GMT

toilet is the spawn of a devil!
I mean how evile this tool must be if it was used to create the most disastrous game ever

A Problem And A Question.

#2690 Posted by Tron [203.12.165.8], 06/07/2002 03:50 GMT

I tried fully vising trondm3 today and ran into problems. While I knew that the r_speeds would be high because of its very open layout, I thought I would be able to just creep in across the borderline. It's getting a fair bit of greyflash in software though which makes me raise this question. Would it be right for me to release a map and say that to use it you need to either use gl_quake or add that command to one of the quake .cfg files to increase the number of polys visible in software? What is that command anyway? I could probably fix the problem through a partial rebuild but it would really alter the feeling of the map which I don't want to do.

#2691 Posted by Fern [66.31.244.127], 06/07/2002 06:10 GMT

r_maxedges 36000
r_maxsurfs 9000

#2692 Posted by Tron [203.12.165.8], 06/07/2002 09:32 GMT , Refers to Post #2691

Water And Sky

#2693 Posted by Zero.G [80.116.47.138], 08/07/2002 10:53 GMT

How can I paint custom Water or Sky textures? They're more that simple image as applying them to a brush changes the way it acts or looks. I have searched in TexMex for tools that assign some kind of property to textures but found none. How can I do?

Mapping Help

#2694 Posted by Zero.G [80.116.47.138], 08/07/2002 10:56 GMT

Since I'm very newbie to Quake mapping and I don't want to bore you with too many questions about simple problems I may encounter, I'll appreciate suggestions on website with help, faqs, tutorials (I've already visited QuakeLab and FatController's), or even tools and prefabs.

Deceptively Simple

#2695 Posted by Vigil [192.100.124.219], 08/07/2002 12:04 GMT , Refers to Post #2693

You have the name them right. Liquid textures start with a *, and skies start with "sky", without the quotes, obviously.

So, if you wanted water, you could name the texture *zerowater, as an example, and it would be water. Slime and lava are done with names, too. *lava(something here) for lava and *slime(something here) for slime.

An example of sky would be skyzero.

And now that I think about it, I'm not even sure if it's done like this, yay! Somebody please back me up?

#2696 Posted by Vigil [192.100.124.219], 08/07/2002 12:05 GMT , Refers to Post #2695

Now that was confusing.

Vigil And Zero

#2697 Posted by Fern [66.31.244.127], 08/07/2002 15:32 GMT

Vigil's right about the texture names giving the textures properties. You also need to remember that liquid textures need to be 64x64 and sky textures must be 256wx128h split into two halves of 128. look at the originals to see how it works. :)

#2698 Posted by necros [172.142.160.151], 08/07/2002 16:31 GMT , Refers to Post #2697

not to put any complete black on the right side, as that is the bottom layer, and will cause quake to crash when you look at the skybrush.

Not 64*64 Liquid Textures...

#2699 Posted by Tron [203.12.165.8], 08/07/2002 16:40 GMT

non-standard size liquid textures look pretty funky, I tried making teleporters once that looked like q3 style portals (used a 64*128 image of where the tele went to as the texture) it made me feel like I was on drugs.

#2700 Posted by necros [172.142.160.151], 08/07/2002 16:50 GMT

can handle larger sized liquids (i think they still have to be equal w 'n' h, ^2 though), but software users will see a funked up effect when they see it.

#2701 Posted by Fern [66.31.244.127], 09/07/2002 07:16 GMT

I repeat, the bug you describe with completely black sky textures has NEVER HAPPENED TO ME with any id or custom engine I've used so far. Where is it you encounter this? I want to know just in case it means doing weird things to perssp3

Perhaps Completely 255?

#2702 Posted by nb [203.109.252.14], 09/07/2002 13:33 GMT , Refers to Post #2701

(That fetching salmon pink used to denote transparency.)

Isn't That Q2?

#2703 Posted by Tron [203.12.165.8], 09/07/2002 14:37 GMT

That thing with using pink to define transparency is q2 isn't it?

I Hope It's Q2

#2704 Posted by Fern [66.31.244.127], 09/07/2002 15:27 GMT

since Q1 doesn't have transperency in textures.

#2705 Posted by metlslime [12.231.113.167], 09/07/2002 17:19 GMT

/me smacks fern and tron with sprites, statusbar icons, and menu graphics.

#2706 Posted by NotoriousRay [162.33.176.86], 09/07/2002 20:14 GMT

ok so my map pbrsp1 is in beta. it has some modified quakec, sounds/etc. you can save games, but loading them gives you an error and leaves you at console (all gl engines i have.) the error is something like
Loading game from c:\quake\pbrsp1\test.sav...
Couldn't spawn server maps/___kills__0/_15____.bsp
Couldn't load map

any ideas? i'm totally at a loss. tried id maps, they load/save fine...

I Think That Could Happen

#2707 Posted by aguirRe [195.163.213.135], 09/07/2002 20:43 GMT , Refers to Post #2706

if you have linefeeds ("\n") in the map title. If so, replace it with a space character. Linefeeds in the title screw up the savegame file.

#2708 Posted by NotoriousRay [162.33.176.86], 09/07/2002 20:59 GMT

u da man, that seemed to have fixed it

#2709 Posted by necros [172.156.213.142], 09/07/2002 22:13 GMT , Refers to Post #2701

only happens in dosquake.

I can't, however, confirm this, as this system refuses to run it, however, both gl and wq are fine with complete black sky texes.

if you recall the speedmap i made, with the complete blue sky? it was supposed to be black, but since it was crashing my dos quake before, i had to substitute it for a dark grey, which converted to blue in quake's palette which i didn't have time to fix it before i sent it in...

#2710 Posted by necros [172.156.213.142], 09/07/2002 22:14 GMT

sorry i didn't notice you saying anything about it before.

Alrighty :)

#2711 Posted by Fern [66.31.244.127], 10/07/2002 00:04 GMT

I've used dosquake to view my maps but not any of the maps with the black sky so I'll be sure to use something else since lots of SDA guys use dosquake :)

Sky & Water Help

#2712 Posted by Zero.G [62.211.173.100], 10/07/2002 11:03 GMT

Thank you all guys! This forum rocks!

Messages And Testing

#2713 Posted by Zero.G [80.116.46.60], 11/07/2002 10:00 GMT

Hi, sorry I have two more questions:

1) How can I trigger a simple text display? I've not found an entity right to do it. I'd can convert some brush in the area into a func_door with a message key and a targetname key (that will never be triggered)... Some of you knows a better way?

2) How can I have a long text (like congratulations) in the end-of-level screen?

I have the first sp map (without lights and with very few monsters and items) near-finished.
Someone could check it for possible problems? When I'll be sure the layout is free of problems I'll lighten and "populate" it.

Thnx

Hmm, No Title

#2714 Posted by metlslime [12.231.113.167], 11/07/2002 10:42 GMT

for #2 you need to write some custom quakec. The end of episode text is stored in the progs.dat, so you would need to 1. change the text, and 2. write code so that it gets triggered when your level ends.

for #1 you can use a trigger_once or trigger_multiple with a "message" key.

Re: Messages And Testing

#2715 Posted by necros [172.165.62.195], 11/07/2002 22:08 GMT , Refers to Post #2713

i can beta test yer map.

#2716 Posted by Zero.G [80.116.47.227], 12/07/2002 09:51 GMT , Refers to Post #2715

Great! Can I mail the map to you? To what address? I haven't a website yet, so I cannot upload it. (This will be a problem onche finished, someone will want to host my final job, once done?)

Click Mah Name...

#2717 Posted by necros [172.142.202.30], 12/07/2002 18:38 GMT

duck duck duck, he said. duck he said 80 times...

WTF I Forgot What Detail Did

#2718 Posted by BLAL CHAMBERMAN!!! [12.235.249.55], 13/07/2002 21:19 GMT

Can someone remind me what applying 'detail' does to a brush in q2? I used to know but i quit q2 for half a year and forgot. TY
E-mail

Detail Brushes

#2719 Posted by R.P.G. [24.136.186.183], 13/07/2002 22:22 GMT , Refers to Post #2718

Here's a quote I took from this tutorial on Rust:

Detail brushes are usually recommended as a method for speeding up a lengthy vis, since they are not included in vis calculations. Qbsp3 will not use the planes of detail brushes to split your map, so sometimes the use of detail brushes will decrease the number of polygons in your map - this is what we want.

Detail brushes can generally safely be used on any object which does little or nothing to block visibility. If restricted to small objects which don't block the view of other objects, the use of detail brushes usually does not cause an increase in r_speeds. And in fact, in the 3rd roof beam example detail brushes actually improve r_speeds since the planes of the beams are no longer used to split up the map.

Weapon Respawn Times

#2720 Posted by distrans [203.29.11.38], 14/07/2002 07:30 GMT

Game = Quake
Game Type = DM

In "vanilla" deathmatch, what is the (coded) time period between weapon respawns?

#2721 Posted by nb [203.109.252.11], 14/07/2002 08:20 GMT , Refers to Post #2720

#2722 Posted by distrans [203.29.11.38], 14/07/2002 08:28 GMT , Refers to Post #2721

Thanks Nightbringer

#2723 Posted by NotoriousRay [162.33.177.72], 14/07/2002 14:45 GMT

does anyone know of/have a quake1 wad file thats a conglomeration of sky textures, with maybe custom ones that are rarely seen/used? i need one that matches the reds in my sp map but have yet to find one that fits. (or, if there is an industrious graphic person that would like to make me one, mail me)

#2724 Posted by necros [172.163.46.197], 14/07/2002 16:41 GMT , Refers to Post #2723

give me an example (or a screen) of the red, and i can probably whip up a couple for ya.

If This Can Help......

#2725 Posted by Jaj [62.83.161.124], 14/07/2002 22:35 GMT

Nothing new but, i made these ones some time ago, they're only the classic purple sky tinted in different colors orange, brown and red:

Skyorange
Skybrown
Skyred

Well, now i look at them the brown doesn't seem really brown, but some kind of gold and brown

Ah Of Course....

#2726 Posted by Jaj [62.83.161.124], 14/07/2002 22:40 GMT

Needless to say but if you think some of them could be ok on your map, tell me and i'll mail a .wad.

Speedy Thought A Title Wasn't Needed

#2727 Posted by Speedy [213.158.1.238], 15/07/2002 01:37 GMT

Accidentaly came across
Basic Quake2 Mapping Techniques Working withTread:
http://www.pscclan.com/MWM/index.htm
Its rather interesting and some things could be applied to any DM game mapping

#2728 Posted by Grahf [24.51.159.42], 17/07/2002 02:04 GMT

I recon the brown one is green/yellow. :P

#2729 Posted by Tef Johs [217.70.229.52], 17/07/2002 21:09 GMT , Refers to Post #2719

And, not to mention, the proper use of detail on small non-vis-blocking brushes will reduce the memory requirements for the vis compilation, sometimes severely so.

At least in RtCW this is indeed true. At one time, I reduced the vis memory requirements by about 38 mb (RAM) just by using proper detailing in the map.

Large RtCW maps (> 4000 brushes) can require from 150 - 200 mb of RAM to vis compile, but this can fortunately be reduced by detail marking on brushes that does little to block visibility anyway.

Just wanted to add this.

#2730 Posted by Jaj [62.83.167.199], 17/07/2002 23:45 GMT , Refers to Post #2728

Now that you say, yes... green too

.
I must be drunk that day =)

#2731 Posted by distrans [203.29.11.38], 18/07/2002 00:27 GMT

I've been hanging with some CG people recently and one of their big dreams is actual "radiosity." Do we have that in Q1?

It's just I'm a bit confused, for instance...to make a convincing spotlight one must use three light sources; one for the cone, one for spill from the source, and one for reflection off the surface(s) the cone intersects. However, when I shoot a rocket down a hallway the hallway lights up and the spill from the rocket travels along the walls. Is this just because of the light value "attached" to the rocket model?

Hmmmm...not sure any of that made sense, but I'm interested as lighting has always seemed to be of utmost importance for ambience, atmosphere and highlighting structural work.

#2732 Posted by Tyrann [63.12.14.173], 18/07/2002 00:39 GMT , Refers to Post #2731

For radiosity see here.
There is a light source attached to the rocket and the engine adjusts the lightmaps on the surfaces that are close enough.

#2733 Posted by distrans [203.29.11.38], 18/07/2002 03:13 GMT , Refers to Post #2732

...a link to ponder over and cherish.

At the core of it all, radiosity just can not be effectively simulated with ambience values or additional lights in conventional lighting utilities.

/me goes to investigate q1rad, especially to RTFM

Can Anyone Help Me?

#2734 Posted by fire reign [66.19.38.57], 18/07/2002 14:01 GMT

Is there anyone an experienced map maker that can help me reduce my r_speeds on my maps? My r_speeds exeed 1500, is that bad or not that bad? I heard that it creates immence lag, is that true? However, above all, I really need to know how to lower r_speeds. Thank You for your help and if it is needed, I will send you a copy of my maps.

I Need Help Please

#2735 Posted by Dark Myth [66.19.38.57], 18/07/2002 14:12 GMT

If anyone out there has been very experienced in map-making, would you mind helping me?
I love to make Quake One maps on Worldcraft 1.6 Everytime I make one, I show it to the runeqw players and they enjoy playing in it. However my r_speeds are around 1500. My friend who is a map maker told me to keep my r_speeds around 700. I also have a tendoncy to make my maps highly detailed, but that just increases my brush count. I always end up with a little over 500 brushes. I need to know what would be the best brush count to stay level with.
If anyone can help me I would be grateful. I long to get a map on a server. I can send my map to anyone who helps me so they can see it. Thank you.

-Dark Myth

I hope to get a reply soon.

#2736 Posted by necros [209.161.217.7], 18/07/2002 14:49 GMT

what the--

that was incredibly stupid... what are you hoping to accomplish?

anyway: visblockers are your friend.

#2737 Posted by Scampie [66.231.198.47], 18/07/2002 14:57 GMT

r_speeds are basically a count of all the polygons visible from a given area. So if you can see lots of 'stuff', your r_speeds will be high, and will affect you framerate. 700 is probabally a good average to stick around, altho you shouldn't worry too much about going 100 or 2 over.

as for reducing r_speeds, that's harder to do once you're 'finished' the map. It's much easier to create the mao from scratch with speed in mind, which means you use hallways and 'visblockers' (vis is one of the map compilers. it is the one that determines what the engine will see from every differant area of your map) in a way the will make it so the engine won't see more than just the current area. David Hyde wrote a very good tutorial on rust which details lots of tricks to reduce r_speeds in Quake2, but many of the tricks except detail brushes, nodraw, and transparent water apply for Quake as well.

brush count itself won't affect your r_speeds unless you make all of them visible at once.

Distrans...

#2738 Posted by DaZ [213.122.2.85], 18/07/2002 19:34 GMT , Refers to Post #2733

If you wanna see what a compiled q1 map looks like with radiosity lighting, check out my Crdm2 [here].

#2739 Posted by Scampie [66.231.198.47], 18/07/2002 22:35 GMT , Refers to Post #2738

and if you'd like to see a GOOD q1 map made with q1rad, look at biff's impdm6.

Grahf Is Still Working On A Title

#2740 Posted by Grahf [24.51.159.42], 18/07/2002 23:03 GMT

harsh scampie, harsh.

Hmm, No Title

#2741 Posted by Speedy [213.158.1.97], 19/07/2002 01:06 GMT

only biff`s map uses "bounce 0" , so you dont see radiocity

I Dont Understand

#2742 Posted by Dark Myth [66.19.52.134], 19/07/2002 15:02 GMT

Well thanks Scampie...

However, I don't understand what you mean by visblockers. Could you please elaborate more on that.

#2743 Posted by Tron [203.12.165.8], 19/07/2002 16:19 GMT

there should be some good explanations on how vis works around the place, I don't know of any off hand.

Basically when you run vis, it breaks the map up into lots of little cubes called portals. It then works out which other portals can be seen from each one. Quake then uses this information to only render the faces you can see. (if your map is unvised quake has to render every face, even ones you cannot see)

So basically a vis blocker is just anything like a wall that blocks your views of the maps. I'm not fully sober at the moment so I'm not sure if that's a good enough explanation, if you need more just say. 8)

#2744 Posted by metlslime [12.231.113.167], 19/07/2002 20:00 GMT

tron's about right, as long as you ignore any of the technical bits in his post, which are entirely fabricated.

Basically, the vis process decides what you can see from each part of the map. Your job as a mapper is to make sure you can't see too much of the map from any one place. Walls and other objects that you can't see through are how this is accomplished. However, you should know that vis always errs on the side of marking a little too much as visible. So your walls and stuff that block visibility have got to really agressively block it. (pretend that beams of light can actually bend around corners a little bit.)

Map Problem In QW

#2745 Posted by Speedy [213.158.3.43], 20/07/2002 01:25 GMT

Tha map I`v made crashes QW/zquake, but works just fine in ANY netquake (GL/WIN/DOS/TQ/any)
And also works in some QW port (I think its called MQW)

What could cause this ? I suspect some texture errors, but have no clue what exactly

#2746 Posted by Tron [203.12.165.8], 20/07/2002 05:26 GMT , Refers to Post #2744

Hows that different to what I said? 8)

#2747 Posted by Dilvish [172.180.31.204], 20/07/2002 08:53 GMT

metlslime is intelligible...

Also, maybe our newbie mapmaker ought to know that doors and any moving brush are no use as visblockers.

#2748 Posted by GrindSpire [213.1.129.141], 20/07/2002 09:17 GMT

and any moving brush are no use as visblockers.

Or any brush entity in fact :)

Another Tutorial, For Example.....

#2749 Posted by Jaj [62.83.164.176], 20/07/2002 11:51 GMT

I did a quick search on google and found this tutorial. It's focused on how to use the Hint brushes but also explains what Vis Blockers are.
Click here.

Let's Generalise Even More

#2750 Posted by Dilvish [172.180.100.207], 20/07/2002 12:12 GMT , Refers to Post #2748

and say that anything else than brushes cannot be visbockers.
For instance, spoons, rats, mammoths, pieces of cheese (even cut very thick), politicians, grindspires and my moms are NOT visbockers.
Only brushes.

On a very bad taste note, I'd add that the twin towers were very effective 747blockers.

/me ducks very low

#2751 Posted by DaZ [62.6.74.64], 20/07/2002 17:20 GMT

tell that too one of the grief stricken families of that tradgedy...

You bastard

#2752 Posted by Dilvish [172.186.88.29], 20/07/2002 19:11 GMT

and I didn't mean to make fun of them. But don't you think humor is the best weapon against fanaticism? I mean, ben Laden or Hitler don't strike me as very funny fellows, and the real problem is that too many people took them seriously and so believed in the racial or religious junk they fed them.

I'd rather laugh lest I cry.

Mapconv & Textures...

#2753 Posted by necros [172.158.74.169], 20/07/2002 19:46 GMT

once the map has been converted from q2 to q1, how does one get the q1 textures into the map, so that qbsp can add it into the .bsp?

#2754 Posted by wrath [195.58.111.103], 20/07/2002 20:30 GMT

shut the fuck up you hypocritical bastard.

ooh, the grief. ooh, the sadness!
it's what, 2500 people in one hit? something like that.

19 000 children die every day because of the economical policies of the western world, led bravely by the governments of the united states and the united kingdom. who cries for them, who builds plazas in their memory?

or how about the fact that half a million (and counting) iraqi children have died because of the sanctions against iraq? the poor bastards can't even get sutur thread or proper antibiotics.
let's put stuff in it's correct perspective, shall we?

it's been about ten months and dilvish can't crack a (rather bad, but still) joke without getting jumped by some frothing-at-the-mouth defender of the free world on an internet board?

how about you tell us when we can crack a joke about 11/9 - and I'll make a list of all the funny ones I can come up with, and we'll meet at high noon and settle this like the trolls we are?

I'm sorry for the harsh tone, but this drives me bugshit.

Hmm, No Title

#2755 Posted by Gom Jabbar [217.4.105.252], 20/07/2002 21:16 GMT , Refers to Post #2753

Just add the flag
"wad" "wadname.wad"
into the worldspawn of your map and compile it...

Wrong Thread Bithces

#2756 Posted by Speedy [213.158.1.179], 20/07/2002 21:27 GMT

#2757 Posted by DaZ [213.122.25.112], 20/07/2002 21:52 GMT

from now on, no more human emotion on this board...

#2758 Posted by cyBeAr [213.66.231.202], 20/07/2002 22:51 GMT , Refers to Post #2757

Let's only have emotions of your favourite pet from now on.

#2759 Posted by DeFrag [66.152.71.116], 20/07/2002 23:48 GMT

People in 3rd world countries die because they've got dirt & scrub-brush to eat. If I were in that position, I'd definately walk through the desert (which ain't no different than where they're currently living) to FUCKING MACDONALDS! Or at least a civilized nation & wash dishes.

Jesus Horatio Christ man. Walk to the ocean & eat fish. Get the hell out of the stinking cesspool that is most villages. Seek a better life. I realize they were BORN into this but they still have a choice. Stay there & die or get up off they're callused asses & do something about it. The average bum in the street should rob his way to the top. & if he gets caught.. better for him, 3 squares/day. FFS.. some even make more money than I do begging.

Life's tough.. wear a fucking helmet.

/god

Hmm, No Title

#2760 Posted by wrath [195.58.111.103], 21/07/2002 01:16 GMT , Refers to Post #2759

your bill hicks routine just doesn't work.

and quoting leary... nah, not on this subject.

I Thought That Was Sam Kinison

#2761 Posted by metlslime [12.231.113.167], 21/07/2002 02:12 GMT , Refers to Post #2760

or did he steal it from hicks?

#2762 Posted by Blitz [66.119.33.135], 21/07/2002 02:27 GMT

Religion or government. As neither is concrete enough to argue over.

#2763 Posted by metlslime [12.231.113.167], 21/07/2002 02:31 GMT

actually, looking over your post, there is only one really bad technical error is the part about splitting the map into cubes called "portals". The level is a BSP tree, where the smallest units of volume are "leaves." The leaves can be any convex shape. Portals are the polygon-shaped openings where two non-solid leaves touch. (so if there were two adjacent cube-shaped leaves, they would share a square-shaped portal.) Vis determines what portals can be seen from from what other portals in the level. If portal A can see portal B, then any leaf that touches portal A can see any leaf that touches portal B. The vis information in a bsp file is a list of what leaves can be seen from what other leaves in the level.

I didn't go into this before because i figured it wouldn't help my explanation to that other guy about how to lower r_speeds.

DeFrag Thought A Title Wasn't Needed

#2764 Posted by DeFrag [66.152.71.103], 21/07/2002 03:11 GMT

Who is Bill Hicks?

Metlslime...

#2765 Posted by Tron [203.12.165.8], 21/07/2002 05:34 GMT , Refers to Post #2763

Yeah I could remember it had something to do with either portals or leaves, but was a bit too drunk to remember the details so just guessed that bit. 8)

Bill Hicks Is...

#2766 Posted by Fat Controller [203.98.49.151], 21/07/2002 08:59 GMT , Refers to Post #2764

* A foulmouthed US comedian or something.

* Dead (according to the blurb on the CD which I was looking at in store).

* To be heard about halfway along the second half of the Hour of Slack Unclean Special doing a routine about childbirth.

* Absolutely nothing to do with mapping.

#2767 Posted by Tef Johs [217.70.229.38], 21/07/2002 11:22 GMT

If I had recieved a penny for each time the topic of "11/9" had arisen in every f***ing internet board, I'd be a millionaire by now.

Now, back to mapping.

Serious Question:

#2768 Posted by metlslime [12.231.113.167], 21/07/2002 16:26 GMT , Refers to Post #2767

do you hear more about 11/9 or 9/11?

#2769 Posted by DeFrag [66.152.71.39], 21/07/2002 21:02 GMT

* Absolutely nothing to do with mapping.

I've seriously & irrevocably breeched the essence that is QMap. Please all line up & slay me.

Anyway.. tks for the info. :)

Visblockers...how And What

#2770 Posted by -Dark Myth- [208.187.45.132], 21/07/2002 21:30 GMT

What are visblockers and how do you get them?

I am almost done with a map and the r_speeds are ok but can be better.

Visblockers...

#2771 Posted by Fat Controller [203.98.48.151], 22/07/2002 08:02 GMT

A "visblocker" is a chunk of map that "blocks off" one section of map from another. That is, it prevents the player - and vis - from seeing from one region into another.

One way is to have a little antechamber in between the areas you want to separate, with offset exits - that is, from area A you can only see into the little chamber, and depending on where you are in the antechamber, you can only see into one of area A or area B - not both. It's really a glorified S-shaped hallway, but it'll look nicer. Variation: A vertical shaft, with or without lift.

Another is the mighty "donut" - a classic example is in the first map of "Contract Revoked", just past the gold key door. It's a fat wall that the path forks around, and the fatter the better. Variation: Y-shaped path. Good for two areas in line with each other.

A general design trick that I used when mapping is to alternate big and small areas to create a nice rhythm.

Oh, and Defrag: Yeah, Carlin never mapped, but nobody's perfect

Fat Controller

#2772 Posted by Dark Myth [64.24.54.104], 22/07/2002 17:14 GMT

Thanks for the reply. I think I understand it. However, when I compile the map vis is one of the compilers. It says for vis: no, fast, full. What does that all mean? Does that help lower r_speeds in a way. And it is weird...I have a doughnut hall and a right angle hallway, and the r_speeds are in the thousands when you look at them. WHY???!!!

I am full of questions am I?

#2773 Posted by Starbuck [194.117.133.196], 22/07/2002 17:38 GMT

vising your map reduces the r_speeds, and you should be using a full vis if you want to see those r_speeds reducing.

Even so, the r_speeds should not be that high if all you've got is a ring shaped corridor with a corner in it. Have you used any carving in making this level? That can often be a cause cos it does some crazy shit

#2774 Posted by metlslime [12.231.113.167], 22/07/2002 21:33 GMT

My girlfriend left me becuase of carving.

#2775 Posted by Dark Myth [208.186.189.133], 22/07/2002 23:28 GMT , Refers to Post #2773

Starbuck....
I only used carving for the arches to enter a new room. Nothing else.

Don't Carve.

#2776 Posted by necros [172.149.128.130], 23/07/2002 00:41 GMT , Refers to Post #2775

it's like rape. it's not good.

Hmm, No Title

#2777 Posted by Speedy [213.158.1.155], 23/07/2002 01:34 GMT

carving is ok if you know what your doing
and you can use L shaped corridors for visblocking too

#2778 Posted by Blitz [216.148.244.38], 23/07/2002 05:37 GMT

I beleive in some walks of life they call it 'circumcision'

#2779 Posted by GrindSpire [213.122.200.249], 23/07/2002 10:11 GMT

On a very bad taste note, I'd add that the twin towers were very effective 747blockers

hehehe

Oh, and YAY WRATH!

I Tried Visblockers

#2780 Posted by Dark Myth [208.186.189.160], 23/07/2002 15:12 GMT

For some weird reason my visblockers allow high r_speeds. Does thickness matter?

I mean.... I cant see the other rooms. Why is it still allowing high speeds? Or is it worldcraft?

Is there a way to merge brushes to one in worldcraft version 1.6?

Visblockers

#2781 Posted by fire reign [208.186.189.160], 23/07/2002 15:58 GMT

I'm utilizing s hallways and the r_speeds do not change, they stay at what they used to be. I dont understand why. Why arent my visblocker working properly?

Re:Visblockers

#2782 Posted by aguirRe [195.163.212.140], 23/07/2002 15:58 GMT , Refers to Post #2780

Assuming that you've properly used the compile tools (qbsp/vis) and that you're using solid brushes for visblocking, there are at least two cases when vis still can "see" through the walls, causing high r_speeds.

The first is when you have small gaps (leaks) between the brushes. Make sure your brushes are snapped to grid.

The second is when qbsp for various reasons creates "corrupt" brushes that you can see but you can still walk right through them. Manipulate/recreate the corrupt brushes until the problem goes away.

Also, remember that vis is very ambitious; it peeks around corners ...

Why Do You Do That?

#2783 Posted by necros [172.140.180.122], 23/07/2002 16:47 GMT

referring to #s 2781 and 2780. you realize, the ip makes it obvious, add to the fact that it's nearly the same question.

Why Do You Care?

#2784 Posted by Dark Myth [208.186.189.114], 23/07/2002 22:22 GMT , Refers to Post #2783

Well Necros, I don't know why you care if we post the same message. We are brothers (fire reign and I) and we are twins too. We end up thinking of a lot of things the same way.

But I was at the site first and I did not know that he posted the same question. We don't spy on what we say or we don't do the things we do together.

Does that answer your question?

#2785 Posted by Dark Myth [208.186.189.114], 23/07/2002 22:26 GMT

To aguirRe....
Thanks for the help. I understand what you mean. I have a map with thick visblockers and the rooms are far apart. My r_speeds are low enough to satifaction.

Simple Q3 Question

#2786 Posted by Eggman [162.83.135.250], 23/07/2002 23:09 GMT

I'm finishing up a Q3CTF that I've had on my HD for too long. Anyhoo, how do you prevent a flag from dropping into the void and staying there? Isn't there some kind of NODROP brush or entity or something?

Who Needs A Title Anyway

#2787 Posted by DeFrag [198.26.118.36], 24/07/2002 00:07 GMT

..when you have small gaps (leaks) between the brushes. Make sure your brushes are snapped to grid.

OR bandaid-brushes if you use Qoole! hee

#2788 Posted by pjw [24.128.56.74], 24/07/2002 00:13 GMT , Refers to Post #2786

I think common/nodrop should do it for you, but I haven't made a CTF map--it at least works on weapons.

What Pjw Said.

#2789 Posted by Scampie [66.231.198.47], 24/07/2002 00:15 GMT

it does work with flags, or in a broader sense, anything the player can carry and drop.

#2790 Posted by necros [172.158.58.16], 24/07/2002 00:53 GMT

We don't spy on what we say or we don't do the things we do together.

it's not a matter of 'spying' on what yer 'bro is saying. all it takes is to look at the one post at the bottom...

and besides, it's nothing to get hot and bothered about. i was just asking.

Dark Myth And Fire Reign...

#2791 Posted by distrans [203.29.11.38], 24/07/2002 03:15 GMT

...if you pump "r_draworder 1" in at the console, you'll be able to see for yourself how far vis can see...and also how far around corners.

Type "r_draworder 0" to turn off this inspection tool.

Hey I Have A Serious Problem!

#2792 Posted by Blitz [216.148.244.38], 24/07/2002 05:08 GMT

This is for Worldcraft 1.6...never had problems before.

I went to quit GLQuake after I had successfully compiled my not yet done turtlemap, and GLQuake froze!

So to make sure it wasnt a fluke, I kept trying the same thing, compiling, playing the map fine, then it would freeze on quitting.

Then I just played GLQuake on its own, and it shutdown fine. I don't know what the problem is, but it's really pissing me off.

Thanks for any help.

Speculation...

#2793 Posted by necros [172.149.159.247], 24/07/2002 16:25 GMT , Refers to Post #2792

maybe something in the map is not flushing properly? a texture? maybe try removing and replacing some textures?

#2794 Posted by Dark Myth [208.186.189.151], 24/07/2002 16:43 GMT

Thanks distrans :)

TyrLite Sky Lighting Problem

#2795 Posted by R.P.G. [24.136.186.178], 25/07/2002 13:27 GMT

So I have this map with two outdoor areas. I put this in the worldspawn:

"_sun_angles" "256 -60 0"
"_sunlight" "210"
"_sunlight_color" "220 220 255"

I know that something is happening because the outdoor areas are lit with coloured lighting of the appropriate brightness. But there are no shadows outside. Anywhere. It's just that one solid light value. Everywhere.

Any ideas?

#2796 Posted by fire reign [208.186.189.146], 25/07/2002 13:44 GMT

Does anyone know a good site for downloading textures? I'm usually good at making metal maps, so if there is any good maps that have metal textures in it, please tell me. Thanks.

#2797 Posted by GrindSpire [213.1.128.145], 25/07/2002 13:49 GMT , Refers to Post #2796

Check the Bighouse texture page for original TGA/JPG texture packs here; http://www.planetquake.com/bighouse/textures.asp

Or there are some WADs for Q1 at Fern's site here; http://www.suspenlute.com/teamfern/textures.html

To Grindspire

#2798 Posted by fire reign [208.186.189.146], 25/07/2002 13:52 GMT

Thank you for your help.

#2799 Posted by -Dark Myth- [208.186.189.145], 25/07/2002 16:32 GMT

I like star skies. What is a good site to download stars?

#2800 Posted by fire reign [208.186.189.155], 25/07/2002 22:20 GMT

I was told that info null guides the light to areas that you want them to shine on. I took a look at a map with a lot of info null and it looked nice. Please tell me how you get the info null to work, thank you.

#2801 Posted by Scampie [66.231.198.47], 25/07/2002 22:47 GMT , Refers to Post #2800

what you are talking about are spotlights. what you do is create a light, give it a 'target' key. then you create a info_null with a 'targetname' key that matches the light's 'target' key.

#2802 Posted by DaZ [213.122.160.199], 25/07/2002 22:59 GMT

adding on what Scampie said, you need Tyrlite or another program that has spotlight support for them to work at all. And yeah they are funky

#2803 Posted by Jaj [62.83.167.60], 25/07/2002 23:06 GMT , Refers to Post #2795

Try with "_sun_mangle" instead of "_sun_angles" , it should work.

#2804 Posted by Scampie [66.231.198.47], 25/07/2002 23:21 GMT

don't listen to Daz. not only is he talking before he thinks, he's just generally confused in the world...

spotlights have been in light compilers since John Carmack coded them... how else do you think they make spotlights in the original Quake maps you dweeb?

What has Daz confused is that Tyrlite and some other light compilers have support to define spotlights with only a light. no need for a info_null.

#2805 Posted by necros [172.129.148.177], 26/07/2002 00:24 GMT

if you have it, you can use mangle (or _mangle?) to define the angles at which they shine.

angle will determine the size of the cone.

#2806 Posted by Fern [66.31.244.127], 26/07/2002 03:11 GMT

I've been told that tyrlite mangles are somehow better than info_null spotlights, so believing that might be DaZ's problem. :D If anyone would post here with the relative merits of either, that would be nice ;)

#2807 Posted by Scampie [66.231.198.47], 26/07/2002 05:46 GMT , Refers to Post #2806

If anyone would post here with the relative merits of either, that would be nice

no target/targetname stuff to worry about so you can quickly CnP lots of spotlights. they are defined as pointing in X direction. not at X object.

less entities = more ent limit breathing room.

and it's just plain l33ter.

#2808 Posted by distrans [203.29.11.38], 26/07/2002 09:42 GMT

Scampie has it right. Realistic spotlights using Tyrlite + CZG.fgd use three entities. Info_null sys uses four. This can make a real diff in a large level.

Wood Texture

#2809 Posted by Zero.G [62.211.172.197], 26/07/2002 11:23 GMT

Hi,
some times ago I've wrote a tutorial on how to create a simple wood texture from scratch. It was planned for the TA community but I think it could be useful for 3D mappers, too. It's a very simple one but maybe some people could find it worth of reading. I'm also finishing another tutorial on metal textures...

What's the point? may you ask.
I don't have (for now) a personal website so maybe someone could suggest me one (or more) website(s) that could host my tutorial(s)...

Thnx

Thank You For Spotlight Help

#2810 Posted by fire reign [208.187.45.223], 26/07/2002 13:04 GMT

Thank you for your help on spotlights everyone and a special thatnks to scampie telling me how to make one step by step.

#2811 Posted by fire reign [208.187.45.223], 26/07/2002 13:08 GMT

I've been wondering for a long time, what is a sigil? I put it in my map to see what it is but it wouldnt show.

Ambient Thunder And Event Lightning

#2812 Posted by fire reign [208.187.45.223], 26/07/2002 13:12 GMT

Everytime I put an ambient thunder in my map it always says that the ambient has to be looped...how do you do that?

I also try event lightning, but how do you rtigger it? I read in the tutourial that it had to be triggered but I dont know how to do that, can someone please tell me how to do that?

Thank you

Event Ligtning

#2813 Posted by Tef Johs [129.241.80.131], 26/07/2002 13:33 GMT

I'm not sure, but as I can rembember neither of the entities you mention there will work in vanilla Q1 (that is, with the original .qc code).

To trigger stuff, though, you'll generally need to use target/targetnames. At least in Q1 you do :)

Visblockers

#2814 Posted by fire reign [208.187.45.224], 26/07/2002 17:51 GMT

I dont understand, I dont have corrupt brushes or leaks, and yet the rspeeds go up. I have a lot of visblockers too. I dont get it, when I face a visblocker, the rspeeds go up.

#2815 Posted by GrindSpire [213.122.201.230], 26/07/2002 19:34 GMT , Refers to Post #2814

Are you running a full vis? (ie, what compile options, compilers, editor, etc do you use.)

We need more info than that I'm afraid...

OHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH

#2816 Posted by fire reign [208.187.45.220], 26/07/2002 21:44 GMT

I wasnt running any vis when I was making my map. I ran a full vis just now and the r speeds went down dramatically. Is that considered in the other maps that are on servers? (i.e. a map on Bluecherry where people can play the map on. Is the vis on the server maps full or no?)

#2817 Posted by GrindSpire [213.1.129.12], 26/07/2002 21:45 GMT

I've been having problems with my current Q3DM and HOM. Normally I'd sort these fine, but the HOM only exists when looking at the surfaces (it happens in 3 places) from certain angles, the rest of the time it is textured/lit normally.

On top of this, whether all/some/none of these semi-HOMs occur seems entirely random. I've tried every level of VIS/light and they sometimes appear and sometimes don't appear with whichever compile options I try.

I'm using GTK 1.2.9 and the compilers that came with it.

#2818 Posted by GrindSpire [213.1.129.12], 26/07/2002 21:48 GMT , Refers to Post #2816

Any released map should have a full vis done on it.

Without VIS being run, Quake is drawing the entire map, all the time...

Shadowdane Thought A Title Wasn't Needed

#2819 Posted by Shadowdane [68.50.252.23], 27/07/2002 00:15 GMT , Refers to Post #2817

i would try some placing some hint brushes that enclose the are where the HOM is. If that doesnt work, I would maybe try a newer verison of Q3Map2.

Q3Map 2.2.0-b12 - Full Package
Q3Map 2.2.0-b14-pr - Binary Only

#2820 Posted by Shadowdane [68.50.252.23], 27/07/2002 00:17 GMT , Refers to Post #2819

opps.. made a mistake on those URLS.

Q3Map 2.2.0-b12 - Full Package
Q3Map 2.2.0-b14-pr - Binary Only

#2821 Posted by pjw [24.128.56.74], 27/07/2002 02:35 GMT , Refers to Post #2817

Are the brushes around those spots structural and unusually complicated and/or non-axial? Or do you possibly already have hint brushes in the area that might be causing the vis errors? Play around a bit with hints--like Shadowdane said, that might fix it, but if that doesn't work, you will most likely be able to fix it by turning any funky brushwork in the area to detail and adding an axial caulk structure underneath that vis won't mess itself over.

#2822 Posted by Fat Controller [203.98.49.151], 27/07/2002 04:55 GMT

item_sigil - this is a rune. You need to have spawnflags set for them to appear, as these flags affect which rune it is.

ambient_thunder - you need to extract the thunder sound from the pack, then open it in your paid for edition of Cool Edit. There's a complex dialog box where you can edit the looping info, whichever that was. Otherwise, fergeddit.

event_lightning - the discharge that affects Cthon. You need two doors that target the lightning entity when triggered (or is it the other way around?) There's tuts around but I'm unsure where they've got to... Or just break open E1M7 in QuArK and check the ents out.

#2823 Posted by Tron [203.12.165.8], 27/07/2002 07:58 GMT

If you don't run a vis (preferably a full one) it makes all your efforts in trying to lower speeds useless.

#2824 Posted by Fingers [4.65.248.138], 27/07/2002 19:48 GMT

There's something funky in q3map that simply does that sometimes. Like pjw says, it can be caused by odd shaped brushes... Another thing I've noticed is this happens more often in locations that are close to (0,0) in the top down view... In ik3dm2 I kept having weird HOM in one of the hallways when looking across the bridge; it went away when I simply moved the entire map a little bit without changing the geometry itself. (so that the "zero line" in radiant wasn't on the bridge)

Q3map divides the entire map into 1024x1024 sized cells, in addition to the usual bsp tree generation.. Perhaps q3map VIS has an "optimization" that makes it use a faster and less precise algorithm when looking from one of the big cells to another (or whatever). It probably helps to align your geometry to these cells, e.g. you might want to align corners of a courtyard to (0,0) and (1024,0) etc.

This, of course, is complete voodoo...

#2825 Posted by GrindSpire [213.122.204.42], 27/07/2002 20:50 GMT

All the HOMs were well away from 0,0 (and only one was near the edge of a block).

Got it fixed now anyway (mixture of hints and caulk/detail).

Thanks for everyones' help.

Boojah... Q3radiant

#2826 Posted by necros [172.168.180.178], 27/07/2002 23:20 GMT

k... trying to finish the damn ne_sp07. i've converted it to q2, from q1 map format... added the right texture path.

i open it in q3radiant... i get a load of errors like this:

WARNING: H:/lunmetq1/textures/ruins/rtgriff.tga has empty alpha channel
LOADED: H:/lunmetq1/textures/ruins/rtgriff.tga

for all the textures that were used (not just that one).

then is crashes with this error (both in the console and as an error box:

parsing brushParseEntity: { not found GetLastError: Access is denied.
glGetError: 0
An unrecoverable error has occured. Would you like to edit Preferences before exiting Q3Radiant?

i took a look through the .map file looking for a misplaced { but there doesn't appear to be anything wrong with it.

has anyone else every tried doing this (q2 --> q1)?

#2827 Posted by Scampie [66.231.198.47], 27/07/2002 23:26 GMT , Refers to Post #2826

first error is because you converted the textures to 32 bit .tgas and didn't make alpha channels for them. make them 24 bit or use .jpgs.

second... donno exactly but it sounds like it's trying to access a file that it's not allowed to.

#2828 Posted by necros [172.142.228.7], 27/07/2002 23:48 GMT

but i figured it out... as usual, it was quark which was the culprit. .. stupid useless brush things... argh.

i used texmex to export the textures as tga... it doesn't really matter anyway, the textures still load... :)

#2829 Posted by Dark Myth [208.186.189.112], 28/07/2002 17:46 GMT

I have a cool map that I want to get on Bluecherry. However, it can not be admitted until I find out a way to reduce my speeds. So I find out that the problem is comming from a leak in my map. Well it seems to me that there is no leak that I can find very easily...but there is one. So can someone please tell me if there is a command to use to find a leak?

#2830 Posted by DaZ [62.6.94.130], 28/07/2002 18:07 GMT

bring down the console and type "pointfile" without the quotes, then you will get lines in your map made of particles that will show you where your leak is. Just look for where the particles reach to the "outside" of the map and there ya go, a bitch ass leak!

Leakfinding

#2831 Posted by Grahf [24.51.159.42], 28/07/2002 19:14 GMT

If your map has a leak, then QBSP will hopefully have generated a .pts file. Place this file into id1/maps along with the map itself, load up quake, bring down the console, and type "pointfile." (no quotes) A bunch of white dots arranged in wierd lines should appear. follow these lines around the map (they go outside the map too, so go into noclip mode). Somewhere in your map these lines should cross from the "outside" of your map to the "inside." That spot is where your leak is.

This is a imperfect method, and it very often doesnt work. I assume you are using Worldcraft? I believe it has some kind of leak finding function (I don't know how it works though as I don't use WC myself - read the manual). Another method some people use is to cover one half of their map in one giant brush, and compile. If no leak was reported, then the leak was somewhere inside the big brush. Then split that area in half with a big brush and compile.... and on and on, until you've isolated the leak down to a small area.

Another method might be to encase the map in a massive box (a hollow one this time), compile, (vis will most likely run this time, though the map itself will run slower in game). Run the map in software quake, go outside the map (but inside the big box), and use r_draworder 1. You should be able to see inside the map at a point near where the leak is.

That's about all I can think of. Most of leak finding comes down to combing the entire map very carefully, and looking in every crevice.

#2832 Posted by GrindSpire [213.1.129.9], 28/07/2002 19:25 GMT , Refers to Post #2831

Most of leak finding comes down to combing the entire map very carefully, and looking in every crevice.

Which is why a good, clean build technique is an important thing to develop.

'nother Q3radiant Question...

#2833 Posted by necros [172.144.143.205], 28/07/2002 19:45 GMT

is there a way a set q3radiant so that it doesn't automatically make textures 0.5 scaled? i remember hearing you can do this for gtkradiant, but have been unable to find anything in q3r...

#2834 Posted by Scampie [66.231.198.47], 28/07/2002 19:49 GMT , Refers to Post #2833

there is a version of GTK that allows you to change the default texture scale... but it seems they removed it from the main menus in the latest versions... you'll probabally have to change something in the config files...

Silly Scampie

#2835 Posted by cyBeAr [213.66.231.202], 28/07/2002 21:42 GMT , Refers to Post #2834

he was asking about q3r not gtkr, and in that case I don't think you can do it.

Who Needs A Title Anyway

#2836 Posted by Grahf [24.51.159.42], 28/07/2002 22:58 GMT

Which is why a good, clean build technique is an important thing to develop.

Yep yep.

Map Accepting

#2837 Posted by fire reign [66.19.48.200], 28/07/2002 22:58 GMT

Yesterday, I tested my map on a server on gamespy arcade. There seemed to be nothing wrong and there was nothing wrong come to think about it...but eversince I learned how to locate leaks, I found out that there is a leak in my map. Is it possible for my map to be on the server with a leak or do I have to change that?

#2838 Posted by Dark Myth [66.19.48.200], 29/07/2002 01:32 GMT

Ok thanks DaZ and who else helped me witht the leak finding

#2839 Posted by -dark myth- [208.186.189.124], 29/07/2002 13:27 GMT

i need a site to really cool base texture downloads.

Base Textures

#2840 Posted by pjw [66.107.101.68], 29/07/2002 14:01 GMT , Refers to Post #2839

www.planetquake.com/hfx

Texture Conversion

#2841 Posted by Drannerz [143.52.4.47], 29/07/2002 15:53 GMT

Hello.

I've finally found some inspiration to map and some textures I like, only problem is that they're halflife tex

. So....

WHAT'S THE BEST WAY TO CONVERT HALFLIFE TEXTURES TO QUAKE?

I tried opening the halflife.wad with TexMex and re-saving as a quake WAD, but when I loaded the textures up in worldcraft the colours hadn't converted properly and looked crap (even though the textures looked fine in TexMex).

I thought perhaps TexMex sucks at colour conversion, so I copied all the images to PaintShop Pro, applied Bal's quake palette file and pasted back into TexMex. But still the colours were gh3y in worldcraft.

HELP!

#2842 Posted by Grahf [24.51.159.42], 29/07/2002 16:17 GMT

Honestly, Halflife's muted greys very likely won't convert to Q1 well no matter what you do.

#2843 Posted by Jimbo [216.12.58.175], 29/07/2002 16:31 GMT , Refers to Post #2841

Try this:
Open the wad with wally then export all the textures you want to a temp folder as
"(Quake 1 textures *.mip)".
Then open texmex create a new quake wad and import all the mips into it.

I think that should convert the pallette
correctly.

-Jimbo

Maybe You Should Map For Half Life

#2844 Posted by metlslime [12.231.113.167], 29/07/2002 20:54 GMT

Speedy Thought A Title Wasn't Needed

#2845 Posted by Speedy [213.158.1.184], 30/07/2002 00:46 GMT

this one is the worst of your jokes metl.

Is there any soft that converts HL wads to pcx without changing palette ?

#2846 Posted by necros [64.12.96.199], 30/07/2002 02:22 GMT

/me is using gtkradiant 1.2.9...

trying to map for quake3. i get to be a newbie all over again. :)

i compile the map (no leaks), just bsp, with the 'stock' compiler that comes with gtkr1.2.9. i try to load it up in q3a, but it just brings me back to the main menu.. not even an error message or anything...

is it just cause it's not the best compiler or am i supposed to do something else...

Shadowdane Thought A Title Wasn't Needed

#2847 Posted by Shadowdane [68.50.252.23], 30/07/2002 02:22 GMT , Refers to Post #2845

Wally will convert HL textures to pcx or bmp.

Link

#2848 Posted by pjw [24.128.56.74], 30/07/2002 03:17 GMT , Refers to Post #2846

Pull down the console and type "/set sv_pure 0" (without the quotes) and hit enter. This will allow Q3 to load raw .bsps that aren't a part of a pk3.

It's probably easiest to add this to your Q3 shortcut (+ set sv_pure 0).

Have fun learning new stuff.

Once you get to the point of being comfortable with GTKRad and working on lighting, I suggest you consider using the new q3map.exe for compiling thereby saving a ton of time and getting sweet new features to play with (e.g. true fog/distance clipping, radiosity/bounce lighting, etc.). Info at:

http://www.shaderlab.com/q3map2/

2.2.0-b12 is probably your best bet for a relatively stable bug-free version. 2.3 is pretty alpha-ish at this point . . .

GtkRad Stock Compiler(s)

#2849 Posted by Tef Johs [129.241.81.186], 30/07/2002 13:28 GMT

I hate complaining all the time (not that I do, heh heh), but I can't for the life of me understand what the Gtk people are doing with their stock compilers.

I mean, what is this "networking" stuff? And why the heck does it not work under console mode (i.e. DOS mode)? And, the last version I tried for RtCW couldn't even compile the DECAL textures correctly; it either got the decal right, or the wall in which it was put, but not BOTH at the SAME TIME. Imagine how this turns out when there also are areaportals in the same vicinity.

To cut it short, it was a complete mess. Needless to say, I hurried back to Gray Matter's original compilers. They work, and they work great. In DOS. And with decals.

#2850 Posted by necros [172.158.99.75], 30/07/2002 18:38 GMT

curves... are... non-solid! does that mean i have to clip the whole curve, or is there a way to get it solid?

#2851 Posted by GrindSpire [213.122.200.7], 30/07/2002 18:39 GMT , Refers to Post #2850

Should be solid.

#2852 Posted by necros [172.158.99.75], 30/07/2002 18:57 GMT

hm... well, i made a square 'cylinder' and bent it 90 degrees, yet i can walk right through it...

Could Be The Shader

#2853 Posted by cyBeAr [213.66.231.202], 30/07/2002 19:01 GMT , Refers to Post #2852

Are you sure you don't have a non-solid shader on it?

#2854 Posted by GrindSpire [213.122.200.7], 30/07/2002 19:16 GMT

Most non solid shaders have _trans on the end of the name...

#2855 Posted by necros [172.158.99.75], 30/07/2002 20:24 GMT

incidentally, what are the uses of the 'illusionary' textures?

#2856 Posted by fire reign [208.186.189.141], 30/07/2002 23:42 GMT

I have always wanted a sky that has pure stars in it...no clouds. Does anyone know a site download a sky texture with stars?

#2857 Posted by fire reign [208.186.189.141], 30/07/2002 23:47 GMT

How do you put a name on your map? I dont know how and I dont want my maps to be unnamed in the servers.

Ice Textures

#2858 Posted by fire reign [208.186.189.141], 30/07/2002 23:48 GMT

Sorry to ask so many questions at one time, but I want to make a map in a tundra cavern. Does anyone know where I can download tundra textures?

GTKR Compiler

#2859 Posted by Shadowdane [68.50.252.23], 30/07/2002 23:54 GMT , Refers to Post #2849

well the GTKR compiler.. is Q3Map2 by Ydnar. which is a modified version of the Q3 compiler. AFAIK he just recently added RTCW / JKII support, and right now it is still not working 100%. This compiler adds tons of stuff to allow for much better lighting, and faster compile times, ect...

Full RTCW support for the compiler should be coming soon.. just give him some time to fix it up and it should work just fine.

Re: Map Names

#2860 Posted by Tyrann [203.56.239.200], 31/07/2002 00:11 GMT , Refers to Post #2857

To name your map, put a message key in the worldspawn; This is for Quake which probably applies to Q2 and Q3 as well (you didn't specify).

e.g. "message" "Name Of My Map"

#2861 Posted by necros [152.163.201.43], 31/07/2002 00:21 GMT

is the easiest sky to make. open up paint.exe, set an image as 256x128. put random white dots everywhere for starts. boomshakalacka, there you go. :)

#2862 Posted by Tef Johs [129.241.81.186], 31/07/2002 09:46 GMT

I use GtkRadiant myself now, so I fully respect and appreciate the work and devotion put into making the original Radiant into something as versatile as it is turning out to be (with multiple games support etc.)

However, I would have thought that when they add RtCW support, they'd also supply a fully working q3map compiler; why not for instance bundle along the already working original one? Then they could take time to modify their own, and this particular complication would have been removed.

Anyway, they do what they do. I respect that, it's just that other people (who may not have even heard of the original package for RtCW) would quickly encounter more compiling problems than what they were asking for :)

#2863 Posted by fire reign [208.186.189.163], 31/07/2002 13:14 GMT , Refers to Post #2860

I dont know what you mean by this worldspawn, where is it in my map?

#2864 Posted by GrindSpire [213.1.130.78], 31/07/2002 13:43 GMT , Refers to Post #2863

It's an entity that defines the map settings.

How to change it's keys depends on what editor you're using, ie, what editor are you using? (worldcraft, radiant, etc)

Tundra Textures

#2865 Posted by khazmodan [200.218.176.14], 31/07/2002 15:22 GMT , Refers to Post #2858

If you have Half-Life: Counter-Strike, may be you could use the textures of as_tundra...
After tweaking on photoshop a little, cuz i think it's not a high quality texture.
=)

Try The Two Wads Here

#2866 Posted by Jimbo [216.12.61.175], 31/07/2002 17:11 GMT

http://qmap.org/qthread.php3?id=20010808235012&pos=0

-Jimbo

Newbie Mapping Help...

#2867 Posted by Dilvish [172.181.142.97], 31/07/2002 17:19 GMT

Just a thought: wouldn't it be a good idea to create a newbie mapping help thread? I've been following Fire reign's and Dark Myth's questions and they both seem really bent on learning how to map - great!
But if some other newbie comes in a few months and asks the selfsame basic questions, some of the more experienced mappers will have to answer them all over again.
In a thread of their own, they would be more accessible and more easily browsable, don't you think?

#2868 Posted by GrindSpire [213.1.137.156], 31/07/2002 17:23 GMT , Refers to Post #2867

Just a thought: wouldn't it be a good idea to create a newbie mapping help thread? I've been following Fire reign's and Dark Myth's questions and they both seem really bent on learning how to map - great!
But if some other newbie comes in a few months and asks the selfsame basic questions, some of the more experienced mappers will have to answer them all over again.
In a thread of their own, they would be more accessible and more easily browsable, don't you think?

This was one of the suggestions in the 'Save Qmap' thread.

Except someone deleted it so it couldn't be discussed...

/me glares at Vondur.

#2869 Posted by fire reign [208.186.189.158], 31/07/2002 18:51 GMT

Im using worldcraft and I dont know how to find the worldspawn there. Guess without that I cant put the title, but can someone please tell me how to use the worldspawn on worldcraft and put the map name on it? Thank You.

#2870 Posted by GrindSpire [213.1.131.172], 31/07/2002 20:09 GMT , Refers to Post #2869

OK, for worldcraft;

Goto Map->Map Properties...

Then just enter the title under the bit that says 'text on entering world'

Worldcraft is so nice to you :)

wrath Is Still Working On A Title

#2871 Posted by wrath [195.58.111.103], 31/07/2002 21:34 GMT

but it can give you herpes, so watch out.
always rubber up when mapping, that's what I've always said.

makes for some kodak moments in the office that...

Thank You/Problems

#2872 Posted by fire reign [32.101.120.206], 31/07/2002 22:56 GMT

Thanks for your help on giving maps titles. I found out how but my worldcraft gave me numerous errors. It said that the file was not built. I have 4 logins in my pc and all 4 of the worldcrafts were infected by this error. Now I think that I will have to reinstall the program. Anyone know what happened to my worldcraft?

#2873 Posted by -dark myth- [32.101.120.206], 31/07/2002 23:02 GMT

I want to make a really cool base map this time. I am kinda bored of these textures already that I have and I wanted to know if there is a good site to download base textures from the map efdm12 death by the dozen my Mr. Fribbles. Can anyone tell me where I can get the textures from that particular map? Thanks anyone!! :)

#2874 Posted by GrindSpire [213.122.186.215], 31/07/2002 23:16 GMT , Refers to Post #2873

You can extract the textures from a .bsp using mickey's TexMex which can be found here

Failing that, you can find lots of texture packs either on the BigHouse's texture page or on the TFQLR texture page.

If you d/l textures from the BigHouse you'll have to convert them to WADs (which you can do with TexMex)

Who Needs A Title Anyway

#2875 Posted by Speedy [213.158.3.7], 01/08/2002 01:57 GMT

Except someone deleted it so it couldn't be discussed...

There is no point in discussion - nobody will change QMAP

#2876 Posted by GrindSpire [213.122.151.245], 01/08/2002 02:12 GMT

There is no point in discussion - nobody will change QMAP

You mean change as in introduce new ways of running things, like a thread for news posts say (hi scampie :).

Nah, you're right. It'd never happen.

Q1, Worldcraft...

#2877 Posted by distrans [203.29.11.4], 01/08/2002 03:05 GMT

I'm using info_notnull with a self.use parm/ barrel_explode value. No problem, the thing works fine. However, Is there a hack to reduce the force of the explosion. I've tried various alternates in the value i.e. smallbarrel_explode, barrel_explode2 etc but I haven't tripped over the right one yet.

#2878 Posted by Fern [66.31.244.127], 01/08/2002 05:20 GMT

you can't use quotation marks in the title

Grahf Thought A Title Wasn't Needed

#2879 Posted by Grahf [24.51.159.42], 01/08/2002 06:40 GMT

dilvish/grindspire: how about a "newbie FAQ?" Something with answers to most of the common questions, some good links, etc... I don't mind answering questions, but a centralized base of knowledge would be quite useful.

I won't tackle the question of who would write/manage it...

I Second That

#2880 Posted by Fat Controller [203.98.48.151], 01/08/2002 06:43 GMT , Refers to Post #2878

you can't use quotation marks in the title

Actually, you can't use quote marks (") anywhere in your map. It's the way the tools work. I know from experience.

Instead of quotes, use apostrophes/single quotes (') as seen in rather a lot of books out there.

I Think It May Be Possible

#2881 Posted by necros [209.161.217.7], 01/08/2002 15:03 GMT

to set dmg to a number (usually default it 120). but i'm not sure. i think that variable gets set by qc. you'd have to h4x0r it so as it doesn't set the variable if it's been set in the map already...

#2882 Posted by necros [172.133.88.218], 01/08/2002 22:41 GMT

i searched this entire board, but no one seems to have posted how to change the default tex scale of GTKR 1.2

does anyone actually know?

#2883 Posted by GrindSpire [213.1.129.28], 01/08/2002 23:14 GMT , Refers to Post #2882

#2884 Posted by Speedy [213.158.1.179], 02/08/2002 02:21 GMT

Thanx Necros...

#2885 Posted by distrans [203.29.11.5], 02/08/2002 02:22 GMT , Refers to Post #2881

I'll just leave them as they are for the mo' then change the global level when we pack the whole thing up. Should be safe as I don't think anyone is using actual exploboxes in their levels.

/me puts another code problem on Nightbringer's to do list

Who Needs A Title Anyway

#2886 Posted by Speedy [213.158.3.29], 02/08/2002 04:05 GMT

<Vondur> go to the .game file
<Vondur> and add default_scale="1" there

#2887 Posted by czg [81.27.35.17], 02/08/2002 12:50 GMT

No, you cannot change how much damage the barrel_explode deals.
And afaik there is no difference between the two sizes of barrels, besides the size. duh.

I hate this keyboard!

#2888 Posted by fire reign [208.186.189.122], 02/08/2002 16:51 GMT

Im using worldcraft full version and whenever I select full vis when I compile the map, it selects it on no vis and my r speeds get high in the map. This is not the first time this sort of thing has happened to me. Does anyone know what is wrong? I just cant get my maps to compile with a full vis...

#2889 Posted by Fern [66.31.244.127], 02/08/2002 17:26 GMT

You can't vis a map with leaks in it, at least not with the worldcraft utilities. If you want to run full vis just to test the r_speeds while you're still making the map, seal off all areas open to the void with big brushes, compile it with full vis, take note of the r_speeds, then delete the brushes and go back to mapping. :)

Thank You Fern

#2890 Posted by fire reign [208.186.189.122], 02/08/2002 21:00 GMT

Thanks, I didnt know about that :)

#2891 Posted by Fern [66.31.244.127], 02/08/2002 22:18 GMT

Always glad to help whilst waiting for q1sp maps...

Re: <-- And Gtkr Q Again...

#2892 Posted by necros [172.145.115.228], 03/08/2002 04:07 GMT

fern: there should be a couple of q1 maps getting released soon.

q: when you make a brush a clip, (for q3 editing) gtkr makes the brushe invisible. you can still move the brush when it's selected, but if you deselect it, you can't find it anymore. how do you make gtkr display the clip brushes? (it does the same thing for detail brushes as well.) (the clip brushes do work in game though.

WARNING: Bad Diagram

#2893 Posted by Blitz [66.119.33.135], 03/08/2002 05:37 GMT

Ok about spotlights. I'm using Tyrlite and I want to get the face of the light texture to be bright!!

Now as we all know, a spotlight by nature makes light go something like this
------------------------------------------
0 = light
\ = rays

\ /
\ /
V
0
--------------------------------------------

Therefore, there is relatively no light at the beginning of the spotlight. What is the best technique to get the light face nice n' bright without messing the form of the spotlight. Thank you.

#2894 Posted by pjw [24.128.56.74], 03/08/2002 06:20 GMT

Toggle the clip filter (View--->Filter--->Clip, or Alt-7).

DeFrag Is Still Working On A Title

#2895 Posted by DeFrag [66.152.71.63], 03/08/2002 08:02 GMT

cheezus but this thread header-post is too fucking long

#2896 Posted by GrindSpire [213.122.203.100], 03/08/2002 09:02 GMT , Refers to Post #2893

Use another light entity next to the light brush, give it a fast falloff and make it fairly bright.

#2897 Posted by necros [172.130.201.184], 03/08/2002 17:30 GMT , Refers to Post #2894

i knew it was something really simple that i missed. :) thanks.

Blitz Is Still Working On A Title

#2898 Posted by Blitz [216.148.244.38], 04/08/2002 00:35 GMT , Refers to Post #2896

#2899 Posted by NotoriousRay [162.33.176.212], 04/08/2002 01:02 GMT

ED_Alloc: no free edicts

how do i fix this? what causes it? i am getting this on skill 2 in my sp map upon loading. i normally use qip_glquake or panquake which i guess have upped the edict limit hence, one of my testers noticed before i did =(

#2900 Posted by Fern [66.31.244.127], 04/08/2002 02:38 GMT

When does it occur? on loading, or later in the map? If it happens on loading, use bigger ammo boxes and ask necros.

#2901 Posted by NotoriousRay [162.33.176.212], 04/08/2002 02:41 GMT

just while/right before loading the map.. what do you mean use bigger ammo boxes? consolidate ammo into smaller caches of larger quantities? theres gotta be an easier way. someone wanna fill me in on what counts as an edict, the limits, and how i can get that number to a playable state????

Shit... It's Been A While...

#2902 Posted by necros [172.129.210.236], 04/08/2002 03:43 GMT

there's like a 255 limit, i think? erm no. 600. yes. 600 edicts. if you go over the limit, quake crashes.

the fact that quake is dying right upon loading, means there are already too many edicts. (you should always try to leave at least 50 edicts, for missiles, grenades, nails, etc...) if you can, try to streamline the map by removing large monster caches with smaller, more powerful ones. and by replacing small ammo boxes with less larger ones...

if that still doesn't work, then you can try to spawn in the monsters. ne_sp06 and czg07 (i think all of them) managed to stick in the huge amounts of monsters because they don't exist until they are needed, and get spawned in the moment the player walks into a room (or a little before they do). i haxored the hipnotic spawning code to fix the small monster count issues, or you can use CZG's method and grab the spawning code from Zerstorer.

i forget the command to display edict counts... (search the board, and you'll probably find it) and test it in panquake, to check how many edicts you have. (otherwise glquake will be crashing a lot...)

good luck with yer map! :)

#2903 Posted by necros [172.129.210.236], 04/08/2002 03:46 GMT

i forgot to mention: every single entity in quake (doors, monsters, ammo, weapons, shots)except static ones -> ie: torches and flames count as an edict. when monsters die, they remain as an edict. you also have to code a thing to remove monster corpses. (a simple SUB_Remove() at the last frame of the monster's death frame (after a self.nextthink = 5-ish) is good. shortening the life span of gibs also helps if your really stretched for edicts. don't forget to make the heads disappear as well. ;)

The Command Is

#2904 Posted by nb [203.109.252.14], 04/08/2002 06:03 GMT

edictcount
num_edicts is the total you're looking for.

TomazQuake?

#2905 Posted by snaga [213.67.10.14], 05/08/2002 10:42 GMT

Would like to give Riot�s qrad1 a try to experiment with colored- and bouncing light mapping. I guess I need TomazQuake to se what I�m doing so, any one knows where to get it these days? Homepage seems to be gone..

..and oh, for any one still remembering my map MetalConcrete, sent it to fileplanet last friday (changed the map name btw to Geotrupes)so it might actually be relesed soon ;)

SOUNDZ IN <quake>

#2906 Posted by TEh-N00-B13 [81.27.35.22], 05/08/2002 13:52 GMT

How do I make my 1337 sp map play a sound of my choix when I push the button?

Funny You Should Ask That...

#2907 Posted by czg [81.27.35.22], 05/08/2002 13:54 GMT

Because I happen to have the answer right the f here:

START C'N'P FROM TEXTPAD

Browsing through some of the original quake qc code last night I stumbled onto this little baby in plats.qc:

void() train_wait =
{
if (self.wait)
{
self.nextthink = self.ltime + self.wait;
sound (self, CHAN_VOICE, self.noise, 1, ATTN_NORM);
}
else
self.nextthink = self.ltime + 0.1;

self.think = train_next;
};

Why is this a little baby?
Check it out:

"classname" "info_notnull"
"targetname" "make_a_sound"
"use" "train_wait"
"wait" "-1"
"noise" "items/damage.wav"

Now make a button/trigger/item and target this with it; Voila! Instant noise!

A few things:
-The sound you wish to play must be precached! For the quad sound above, a quad must already be present on the level. For a shamblers roar, a shambler must be present.
-Unlike the barrel_explode info_notnull this one can be triggered any number of times. Hurrah for repetition!
-The wait is essential as you see for the sound to be played. However, if you set it to something positive, so the nextthink eventually will be called, train_next is as follows:

void() train_next =
{
local entity targ;

targ = find (world, targetname, self.target);
self.target = targ.target;
if (!self.target)
objerror ("train_next: no next target");
if (targ.wait)
self.wait = targ.wait;
else
self.wait = 0;
sound (self, CHAN_VOICE, self.noise1, 1, ATTN_NORM);
SUB_CalcMove (targ.origin - self.mins, self.speed, train_wait);
};

You don't want it going into here unless you have some really serious shit going on. You need it to target something and it needs a speed and it can play a second sound and it basicly starts behaving like a func_train. Cool if there's something you want with that I guess.

Also, I never bothered looking much more into the code when I found this now. There might be some other function(s) that can be called to produce sound as well, but I haven't found them yet and this one works it's magic anyway.

(15 seconds later:)

Found this in triggers.qc. Might be useful (Though untested atm) :

void() play_teleport =
{
local float v;
local string tmpstr;

v = random() * 5;
if (v < 1)
tmpstr = "misc/r_tele1.wav";
else if (v < 2)
tmpstr = "misc/r_tele2.wav";
else if (v < 3)
tmpstr = "misc/r_tele3.wav";
else if (v < 4)
tmpstr = "misc/r_tele4.wav";
else
tmpstr = "misc/r_tele5.wav";

sound (self, CHAN_VOICE, tmpstr, 1, ATTN_NORM);
remove (self);
};

The sounds in question are precached in the worldspawn, so no need for teleporters for this to work.
Plays one of the five teleport sounds at random ONCE. Dunno when you'd have use for that but hey, be creative.

There are probably loads more but Textpad just crashed on me and I cannot be arsed to battle with that now. Whenever that crashes I'm on my way to hell.

love

wrath Is Still Working On A Title

#2908 Posted by wrath [195.58.111.103], 05/08/2002 15:28 GMT

a child could figure that out without leaving the slip n' slide...

#2909 Posted by necros [172.145.99.11], 05/08/2002 18:36 GMT , Refers to Post #2907

czg, t3h l33t code hijacker!

#2910 Posted by Fern [66.31.244.127], 05/08/2002 18:51 GMT

f33l1ng j00r p41n

Wearing Paper Bag Over Head

#2911 Posted by snaga [213.67.10.14], 05/08/2002 23:03 GMT , Refers to Post #2905

guess fileplanet had TomazQuake after all

#2912 Posted by distrans [203.29.11.8], 06/08/2002 00:36 GMT

you are a gem.

A diamond in the rough so to speak.

Who Needs A Title Anyway

#2913 Posted by DeFrag [66.152.70.114], 06/08/2002 04:22 GMT

TextPad r0><oRz!

Mapping Help Question:

#2914 Posted by Shambler [62.30.112.1], 10/08/2002 09:05 GMT

24bit Textures And WC
Posted by MasterMind [12.229.160.243], 10/08/2002 05:14 GMT
Hey, I was just wondering if its possible to set up Quake with the Valve Hammer Editor. This would make mapping for quake a much more enjoyable experiance. I tried doings this awhile ago with those dubsp, dulight, and duvis utilities but I couldn't figure them out. Also, there is a new version of fuhquake out that supports 24bit textures for quake and I dont know how to load those textures into WC or VH(valve hammer) because they are in .tga format.

Latest News | Board Menu

Sorry...

#1 Posted by Tron [203.29.136.156], 10/08/2002 06:47 GMT
I still use Worldcraft 1.6 so don't know about any of this. :) I just wanted to post early however to tell any moderator reading this to NOT delete the thread. Thank you.
[Reply]

Yay!

#2 Posted by Vigil [193.229.6.165], 10/08/2002 08:34 GMT
I'll make a relevant post just to annoy anyone moving this thread, because they have ot move this post too. Maybe.

Firstly, Mastermind, I think the only way to edit Q1 levels with WC 3.3 or 3.4 is to use Qonverge: http://www.acsu.buffalo.edu/~ejlasota/ If you're having problems with it, I'm sure Riot can help you out.

As for the textures, you don't need to load them into the editor at all. As I understand it, you simply place the textures in the correct folder, and they automatically override the crappy ones when the level is loaded. You just have to distribute the level with the new textures and instructions on where to put them.

Thank You For Your Help All

#2915 Posted by fire reign [208.186.189.153], 10/08/2002 20:03 GMT

Thank you for your help everyone that helped me with my mapping struggles. I was able to get 3 maps on a runequake server with all your help. Thanks again.

-fire reign

#2916 Posted by MadHatter [207.173.103.31], 11/08/2002 01:38 GMT

is there a mac editor for q1?

Speedy Thought A Title Wasn't Needed

#2917 Posted by Speedy [213.158.1.37], 11/08/2002 02:16 GMT

fire reign: may be you can show us the maps /screenshots then.

MasterMind: to map with Hammer for quake you need to convert textures to wad3 (use texmex - file/save copy/save to wad3)
BUT compile maps with using wad2 (quake wad format) with Qonverge ( you better read Qonverge instructions, I dont remember all that).
32 bit textures used by engines like TQ are loaded externaly, just place them in id\textures (or where the engine looks for them). The textures should have same filenames.
I`v made quake map with external textures, you can check it.

cleaver

#2918 Posted by Tron [129.127.41.28], 11/08/2002 04:12 GMT , Refers to Post #2914

Shambler.........I knew it would be you who moved this...why..........god....why.......just let the poor threads be, for the love of god think of the children, won't somebody please think of the children?!?!?!

Madhatter: Yes, There Is.

#2919 Posted by Grahf [24.51.104.109], 11/08/2002 04:45 GMT , Refers to Post #2916

It's called Quiver. It hasn't been updated in several years, and is missing some key features (like vertex editing), but for what it's worth, it's pretty good. With some patience and skill it's quite possible to make great stuff with it.

I also recommend checking out pOx's Playhouse. There are a bunch of useful mac tools to go along with Quiver (like better compilers).

There is also a port of GTKRadiant in the works for Mac OS X/X Darwin. it's still in the pre-alpha stages, so nothing has been released yet, but you can read the mailing list archives of the porting effort here.

#2920 Posted by MadHatter [207.173.103.109], 11/08/2002 06:40 GMT , Refers to Post #2919

thanks Grahf! that really helps.
now is just up to me to get some stuff done.

Twas A Pleasure...

#2921 Posted by distrans [203.29.11.5], 11/08/2002 07:35 GMT , Refers to Post #2915

#2922 Posted by R.P.G. [24.136.186.143], 11/08/2002 17:01 GMT

I, for one, appreciate it when moderators move simple one-question threads to the appropriate main thread.

Blah, Map Errors

#2925 Posted by ToadWarrior [64.91.147.236], 12/08/2002 02:39 GMT

I've been working on another Quake 1 map and it's been awhile since I compiled.

I worried about that but I figured, I can't be doing anything. I assumed I was paying close enough attention to everything I've done. Well, I was some done with building the basic layout. I just had like one more room to go, so I just seal off the holes to compile with I have and see what it's like. It gives me two errors and then Quake tries to run it and crashes.

It tells me

"WARNING: brush with duplicate plane"

and

"Hullnum 1: No entities in empty space -- no filling performed"

Here's the complete contents of the process windpw:

** Executing...
** Command: Copy File
** Parameters: "C:\TOADWA~1\QUAKE\WORLDC~1\MAPS\NEWEST~1.map" "C:\ToadWarrior\Quake\quake1\ID1\maps\NEWEST~1.map"

** Executing...
** Command: C:\ToadWarrior\Quake\WorldCraft\QTools\Qbsp.exe
** Parameters: C:\ToadWarrior\Quake\quake1\ID1\maps\NEWEST~1

outputfile: C:\ToadWarrior\Quake\quake1\ID1\maps\NEWEST~1.bsp
WARNING: brush with duplicate plane (This is repeated a shit load of times but for the sake of the post, I just cut all out)

--- LoadMapFile ---
C:\ToadWarrior\Quake\quake1\ID1\maps\NEWEST~1.map
313 brushes
5 entities
9 miptex
124 texinfo
building hulls sequentially...
--- Brush_LoadEntity ---
299 brushes read
---- CSGFaces ----
2146 brushfaces
21105 csgfaces
905 mergedfaces
--- SolidBSP ---
1072 split nodes
533 solid leafs
540 empty leafs
0 water leafs
20055 leaffaces
19944 nodefaces
----- portalize ----
--- FillOutside ---
Hullnum 1: No entities in empty space -- no filling performed
MODEL: *1
MODEL: *2
--- FinishBSPFile ---
WriteBSPFile: C:\ToadWarrior\Quake\quake1\ID1\maps\NEWEST~1.bsp
added 0 texture frames
482 planes 9640
26091 vertexes 313092
960 nodes 23040
124 texinfo 4960
20948 faces 418960
1794 clipnodes 14352
417 leafs 11676
21194 marksurfaces 42388
82332 surfedges 164664
48717 edges 194868
9 textures 79280
lightdata 0
visdata 0
entdata 342

** Executing...
** Command: C:\ToadWarrior\Quake\WorldCraft\QTools\Vis.exe
** Parameters: C:\ToadWarrior\Quake\quake1\ID1\maps\NEWEST~1

---- vis ----
LoadPortals: couldn't read C:\ToadWarrior\Quake\quake1\ID1\maps\NEWEST~1.prt
No vising performed.

ToadWarrior

#2926 Posted by Tyrann [203.56.239.111], 12/08/2002 03:48 GMT

If you have duplicate planes, then your editor is buggy. It's only a warning, but it's an indication that your editor is doing something wrong.

To get rid of the "no entities in empty space" you'll need to make sure that you have at least one entity that is at least 32 units away from the nearest wall.

I can't tell you any more than that from what you've said. I guess you could try a newer version of TreeQBSP or TxQBSP from http://user.tninet.se/~xir870k/ and see if that helps.

Hunk_Alloc Error

#2927 Posted by LMW-S [64.109.204.74], 12/08/2002 12:47 GMT

I have an error for my Quake1 level. When I load up regular Quake and try to load it, I gett "Error: Hunk_Alloc: Failed on 488336 bytes" and Quake shuts down. When I try to load it on either TomazQuake or DMBQuake it says it has caused an error in unkown, and then shuts down. This only started happening recently and I don't know why it is being caused or how I can fix it. Any help would be appreciated.

You Could Try Adding

#2928 Posted by aguirRe [195.163.74.106], 12/08/2002 16:20 GMT

more memory to Quake. In DOSQuake you just add the option "-winmem 32" to the command line, in Win/GLQuake it's called "-heapsize 32768". This will reserve 32 MB for Quake to work with. Adjust upwards if still not enough.

I have a strong suspicion though, that it won't help you with this map. Normally you just hit another limit later or get a nice GPF (program crash).

If it still doesn't work after adding the options above, post your FinishBSPFile/WriteBSPFile log (the final part of the compile log) here.

#2929 Posted by ToadWarrior [64.91.145.203], 12/08/2002 17:13 GMT , Refers to Post #2926

I'm using WC 1.6. But, I still get that error and all my entities (except elevators) are more than 32 units away. I moveed them farther away and still get that error.

If anyone wants to take a peak at the map, here's a zip (46kb) that includes the error message I got with the TreeQbsp, the one custom texture the map uses as well as the rmf and map file. The map isn't near being complete, but I will listen to the critics. :P

http://home.uplink.net/~toadw/betamap.zip

#2930 Posted by NotoriousRay [162.33.176.73], 12/08/2002 18:25 GMT

dude. load the .map in worldcraft, you can see the MANY MANY INFINITE PLANES

delete them, rebuild those brushes.

Hmm, No Title

#2931 Posted by Grahf [24.51.104.109], 12/08/2002 19:01 GMT

brush with duplicate plane usually seems to result from doing fairly complex clipping/carving operations. It basically means what it says: there is a brush somewhere with multiple overlapping planes (the Quake .map format defines sides in terms of planes. If the editor does something weird, then a brush could get written that has two planes on top of each other. then you get the error)

Am I right there? Kinda sorta?

#2932 Posted by ToadWarrior [64.91.146.177], 12/08/2002 19:13 GMT

Yeah I see that now. :(

Thanks and I fixed it up.

Toad Warrior

#2933 Posted by Mike Woodham [217.39.11.192], 12/08/2002 19:51 GMT , Refers to Post #2925

Also, if your "worldspawn" entry has an "origin" key, it may be confusing QBSP(or whatever). Try deleting it and compiling again.

Also, check that your 'player start' is not inside a brush - even partly.

Toad Warrior

#2934 Posted by Mike Woodham [217.39.11.192], 12/08/2002 20:10 GMT , Refers to Post #2925

Brush With Duplicate Plane

This is an old Worldcraft error: I don't use it but am told that if you 'export' then re-import the map, the problem is solved.

I have also heard that importing the map file into QuakeMap (QuArk?) will show up the errors and correct them when exporting.

Never had the problem with Bsp Editor!

#2935 Posted by Fern [66.31.88.42], 13/08/2002 01:32 GMT , Refers to Post #2930

that screenshot made me burst into tears

#2936 Posted by Tyrann [203.56.239.112], 13/08/2002 02:18 GMT , Refers to Post #2929

Entities with brushes don't count for this, you'll need to make sure a point based entity is far enough away from the walls. Examples of what would qualify are info_[anything], light, monster_[anything], etc.

Dublicate Planes

#2937 Posted by Tef Johs [129.241.81.186], 15/08/2002 07:24 GMT

I think Grahf got this about dublicate planes quite right, as far as I have experienced it.

I get this error usually from doing edge-manipulation, and then trying to skew and/or resize the brush afterwards in some direction.

The error is of course related to the brush work, not to any particular editor (WorldCraft or other). Even using Gtk/QE/WolfRadiant you can get this compile warning message from times to times, luckily Radiant has tools (plugins) to get rid of it automatically.

However, my point was to advise getting rid of this error, as it can seriously screw up your level, at least if there gets to be too many of them. It's not an warning/error you should ignore (like many other warnings you may get).

Who Needs A Title Anyway

#2938 Posted by Speedy [213.158.1.32], 16/08/2002 00:39 GMT

is bsp the only editor that warns you when duplicate plane is created ?

Duplicate Planes

#2939 Posted by Tyrann [203.56.239.111], 16/08/2002 00:55 GMT , Refers to Post #2937

The error is created by the editor, and reported by the compile tool (Qbsp). I've never seen the editor give a warning about duplicate planes (yes, I use BSP).

Speedy Is Still Working On A Title

#2940 Posted by Speedy [213.158.1.32], 16/08/2002 01:15 GMT

It says something like "warning: brush exceeded world boundaries" when duplicate plane is created.

Hmm, No Title

#2941 Posted by Tyrann [203.56.239.200], 16/08/2002 06:28 GMT , Refers to Post #2940

No, it says that when a brush exceeds the world boundaries (i.e. it goes outside +/- 4096 units).

Duplicate Planes...

#2942 Posted by necros [172.168.248.47], 16/08/2002 18:10 GMT

well, gtkr will notify you if there is a duplicate plane (along with the brush #)

incidentally, i still haven't figured out how to get the default tex scale to 1 in gtkr1.2.9... i added DefaultTextureScale="1" in the q3.game file, but no go...

#2943 Posted by snaga [213.67.10.14], 16/08/2002 20:09 GMT

could I get any unwanted effects sticking a light inside a clipbrush? (haven�t experienced it, just want to make sure..

#2944 Posted by DaZ [213.122.61.253], 17/08/2002 00:34 GMT

Nope, none at all. And release the god damn map already!

#2945 Posted by Speedy [213.158.1.39], 17/08/2002 01:33 GMT

That happens when dup plane created, it remains looking small, but editor reports it exceeded world boundaries

#2946 Posted by snaga [213.67.10.14], 17/08/2002 01:44 GMT

It�s really up to the goodwill of FilePlanet now... and has bin for a couple of weeks now :(

The thing is I submitted it on the 1 of aug and it was up on the 2 but under the wrong name, and I�ve bin trying ever since to make them correct the mistake. Right now I can�t really afford the grand for a subscription ,guess they�re just demonstrating that fact..

#2947 Posted by Speedy [213.158.1.39], 17/08/2002 02:09 GMT

ask someone with pq hosting to do that for you

#2948 Posted by GrindSpire [213.1.130.188], 17/08/2002 08:38 GMT , Refers to Post #2946

snaga, email the file to chris@geneticrose.com and I'll stick it on my webspace (direct link!)

#2949 Posted by PabloD [207.173.103.12], 17/08/2002 14:01 GMT

where can i get the latest versions of qbsp3, qrad3 & qvis for q2?

hell?

Correct Me If I'm Wrong,

#2950 Posted by necros [172.175.42.93], 18/08/2002 01:43 GMT

but should mapconv be able to convert q3 maps to q1 as well as q2 to q1? q2 map format and q3 map format seem to be the same...

#2951 Posted by Scampie [66.231.198.47], 18/08/2002 01:44 GMT

#2952 Posted by necros [172.175.42.93], 18/08/2002 02:27 GMT

now why does it make wqbsp say there are incomplete lines in the .map file, when, upon investigation, they look perfectly fine?

The Map File Line Counter

#2953 Posted by aguirRe [195.163.215.141], 18/08/2002 09:34 GMT , Refers to Post #2952

in most Q1 compilers can be very misleading as it doesn't take comment lines in account.

Try one of the compilers found here instead and see if you can find the offending line.

Mapping Stuff

#2954 Posted by BirthMan [213.77.240.127], 18/08/2002 14:29 GMT

Why Can't I submit my maps? I can't send a Mail with a map attached to it! Everything should work fine,but no. Why?

Point me a good site with map TYPES tutorials please.

WC 1.6 3d View..

#2955 Posted by D13H4RD [68.1.67.209], 18/08/2002 15:06 GMT

I recently installed a geforce2mx, and ever since that worldcraft has been acting really strange.
The 3d view has become really pixelated and to make matters worse, when I select a brush in the 3d view it selects a totaly diffrent brush than what I selected =\.
I have the most recent drivers for the geforce and I have fooled with the video/3d window options in WC with no luck.
Any ideas?

screenshot

#2956 Posted by necros [172.162.187.40], 18/08/2002 15:41 GMT

Ok, i've tried the enhanced version of treeqbsp, and the line number has changed. :) it's still saying it's incomplete, and that line still looks fine, but now, it says the line right before it "has no normal".

here's the error:

---- LoadMapFile ----
*** WARNING 04: Line 3634: Brush plane with no normal
*** ERROR 54: Line 3635: Line is incomplete
what does that warning mean?

Necros, The Warning Message

#2957 Posted by aguirRe [195.163.194.8], 18/08/2002 16:43 GMT , Refers to Post #2956

Brush plane with no normal means that the brush face "normal" has no direction (0 0 0).

All faces in a map file are converted from the three-point coordinates to a normal/dist pair which indicates face normal direction (which is perpendicular to the face) and its distance from origo. If there is no direction, the face is considered invalid and is discarded.

I can help you more if you send me the zipped map file so I can inspect the offending brush. Include also the original Q3 map file so I can compare what happened in the conversion.

Or you can post those two lines (3634-3635) here, but such information has a tendency to get messed up in a confined space ...

#2958 Posted by Vigil [193.229.6.165], 18/08/2002 17:29 GMT , Refers to Post #2955

WC 1.6 doesn't like GeForce2. There may be drivers available that fix the problem, but changing to WC 3.3 should work. Unless you're doing Q2 levels.

Just My Luck..

#2959 Posted by D13H4RD [68.1.67.209], 18/08/2002 17:58 GMT , Refers to Post #2958

Yeah unfortunately im doing Q2 levels.

Thanks for the help though :), ill try looking around for driver info.

#2960 Posted by pjw [24.128.56.74], 18/08/2002 19:28 GMT , Refers to Post #2954

Where are you trying to submit your map? Here? If you want people to check it out, then you need to host it on your own webspace and supply a link.

If you tell us what kind of map it is (Quake? Q2? Q3? Unreal? RTCW?), then we might be able to help you with tutorials.

#2961 Posted by necros [172.138.154.79], 18/08/2002 22:21 GMT

qeradiant supports q2.

#2962 Posted by necros [172.138.154.79], 18/08/2002 22:26 GMT , Refers to Post #2956

hm... that explanation flew right over me. :) anyway, the maps should be in your inbox now.

Shadowdane Is Still Working On A Title

#2963 Posted by Shadowdane [68.50.252.23], 19/08/2002 03:07 GMT

yeah.. use QERadiant for Q2.
soo much better than WC :)

also once u learn QER, that basically means u shouldnt have a problem doing Q3 maps.. and of course Doom3 when it comes out.

Hmm, No Title

#2964 Posted by D13H4RD [68.1.67.209], 19/08/2002 03:22 GMT

Yeah ive been intending to learn to use Radiant anyways, I guess this just motivates me to get off my ass and do it now :).

#2965 Posted by necros [172.131.94.101], 19/08/2002 03:46 GMT

is pretty painless, i would imagine. just set qer's display to the 4 windows, and you should feel right at home... sort of. :)

Ctf Mapping

#2966 Posted by daftpunk [62.98.88.239], 20/08/2002 02:11 GMT

can you tell me if it has ever occured to you guys that when copying, moving and rotating one base to make another for ctf the copied one is messed up. i obviously know the mathematical reason, it's to do with the centre of gravity, ie the point around which it is rotated and moved. but is there a solution apart from making 2 separate bases. sorry if this sounds stupid...

also. a question on editors. having used qoole i know it is a little buggy. but can you tell me why some people seem to slag off wc. i will learn qeradiant and hopefully quark (the interface is totally new to me though..)

Id' Say You Best Bet Is

#2967 Posted by necros [152.163.204.43], 20/08/2002 16:19 GMT

either q3r or wc. qoole is awful (trust me, i learnt mapping on that thing), and quark has that floating point issue (although, it appears later version can disable it).

D13H4RD Is Still Working On A Title

#2968 Posted by D13H4RD [68.1.67.209], 20/08/2002 17:26 GMT , Refers to Post #2966

The only reason I could see why people tend to "slag" off of WC is that its support is limited to Q1/2 and Halflife.
Besides that its an excellent editor I think.

I wouldnt suggest using Quark, I used it for over a year and it led me down a road of frustration with its random errors.

But honestly if your going to take time to learn another editor I would suggest Radiant due to its support of so many of the newer fps games today(im doing the same myself).

#2969 Posted by Tef Johs [217.70.229.47], 20/08/2002 22:07 GMT

Let me put it this way:

For an aspiring level designer these days, not learning to use QE/Q3/Wolf/Gtk Radiant is like not wanting getting a driver's licence even if all you want to do is drive a car.

Uhm...or something like that.

#2970 Posted by D13H4RD [68.1.67.209], 21/08/2002 03:08 GMT

QERadiant noob question #1:

When I compile I get the error message reading "couldnt load pics/colormap.pcx"

Where should I put the colormap.pcx then, or is it a matter of directing radiant to a diffrent directory?
Im sure its something blindingly simple that only a jackass like myself would miss but thanks for any help :).

#2971 Posted by Tef Johs [129.241.81.186], 21/08/2002 09:21 GMT

The colormap.pcx should be in /pics/ directory, parallell to the /maps/ directory where you are compiling your map.

Make sure the basepath variable is set correctly (to the dir level above /maps/), if you are using the internal compilers.

And, if you compile the map with a batch file, and possibly in another location than the default, make sure a corresponding dir structure is set up so it (the compiler) can find the .pcx file where it expects it to be etc.

daftpunk Thought A Title Wasn't Needed

#2972 Posted by daftpunk [62.98.82.199], 22/08/2002 01:52 GMT

thanks for the editor tips although i thought qark was good (never heard of the random errors thing). i find wc so quick and intuitive, and the layout is like 3dstudio (well, not literally but sorta). i have tried qeradiant some time ago but then left mapping because of studies/sport/DJing. i will see what i can do this winter

CAN ANYONE HELP ME FOR MY PROBLEM WITH COPYING AND ROTATING A BASE IN CTF? thanks if you can

Try The Mirroring Functions

#2973 Posted by Fat Controller [203.98.49.151], 22/08/2002 02:55 GMT

Copy-paste the set of brushes, then select the X-Y view (i.e. click anywhere in the bounding box of the selection in that window. You know, the top-down view.)

Then hit CTRL-I, CTRL-L - which should do the same as spinning the brushes 180�.

Who Needs A Title Anyway

#2974 Posted by daftpunk [62.98.117.211], 22/08/2002 23:13 GMT

i understand you have done this more times than me but i still don't see how to avoid the brushes from being ever so slightly off the grid. is it mayhe a consequence of something else i did wrong? is my theory of the pivot point wrong (i.e. it is the AVERAGE of the brushes)?

i guess a solution is by moving them again a little with grid snap on.

Actually...

#2975 Posted by necros [152.163.213.43], 23/08/2002 02:03 GMT , Refers to Post #2974

i'm not sure why quark does that. all the brushes i made in quark looked fine to me, but, low and behold upon loading into gtkr, a lot of brushes were busted up...

Who Needs A Title Anyway

#2976 Posted by Speedy [213.158.1.74], 23/08/2002 03:50 GMT

When I loaded q1 map into gtk ALL brushes were "busted up". But Q3R 202 parsed it just fine.

#2977 Posted by necros [205.188.200.19], 23/08/2002 17:06 GMT

i'll have to try that sometime...

necros Is Still Working On A Title

#2978 Posted by necros [205.188.200.19], 23/08/2002 17:39 GMT

this is really wierd...

i went back in quark6.2whatever and checked some of the brushes which were getting fucked in gtkr. they appeared to be on the grid. to test, i gave one of the brushes a 'unique' texture and then looked it up in edit to check on the coords of the brush.

they're all integers. what i can't understand is why this brush gets fucked up in gtkr (and q3r202, thanks for the suggestion though, Speedy). if there aren't any decimals here, how can the get fucked the way they are in gtkr.

so my thought brought me to the only program i can't check... mapconv.exe. so, sleepwalkR (or anyone who experience this problem), converting a q1 map to q2/q3 seems to have some side effects... any ideas?

Palette.lmp Editing

#2979 Posted by Fat Controller [203.98.48.150], 24/08/2002 00:43 GMT

Well, thanks to CZG for that! That's real cool.

Anyway. Making a custom palette is mighty similar.

Again, I'm using PSP here, so open gfx/palette.lmpin RAW format, dimensions 3x256. You'll get three columns of greys: Left is Red, middle is Green and right is Blue.

For fun, I shifted all the columns for fullbrights (the bottom 32 rows) right 1 pixel. Result: Green slipgates, explosions, lava, fireballs, muzzle flares.

Once Again ....

#2980 Posted by metlslime [12.231.113.167], 24/08/2002 03:09 GMT

you guys are so weird with your preferred image dimentions. if you open palette.lmp with the following options:

- 16 width, 16 height
- 3-channel (RGB)
- header size 0
- interleaved (RGB RGB ...)
- order RGB
- not flipped

and then load the quake1 palette, maintaining indices, you get the color palette we are familiar with, with 16 rows of 16 colors, greys on top, fullbrights on the bottom.

DuBSP Error 42

#2981 Posted by LMW-S [67.39.33.241], 24/08/2002 18:08 GMT

When I compile my map using DuBSP I get Error 42: Didn't split the polygon in SubdivideFace., and the map doesn't compile. Can anyone help me fix this?

#2982 Posted by Tef Johs [217.70.229.47], 24/08/2002 22:24 GMT

I don't really expect many (anybody?) to have an answer to this, but...

The new camera system that came with RtCW SDK, and that id uses also for DOOM 3 is really, really great. Once you learn it, you can create whole cutscenes in a matter of minutes.

However, I've used it in one map, and the cameras showed all the monster models just fine (as it should, this is real-time after all).

But now, in another map, the monsters (soldiers in my case) vanish as soon as the camera starts playing! And I have done the exact same things in both maps. When I stop the camera, the model(s) reappear. It gets kind of frustrating, since I've done it quite successfully in another map.

Is there anyone at all with a solution to this? My hopes are really loooooow...

Speedy Thought A Title Wasn't Needed

#2983 Posted by Speedy [195.232.60.15], 25/08/2002 08:38 GMT

May be try to move camera around..

#2984 Posted by Tef Johs [217.70.229.47], 25/08/2002 13:27 GMT

The cameras are moving, they are interpolated between "start" and "end", and it moving relative to an equally interpolated target path.

Anyway...I'll figure it out somehow.

Re:DuBSP Error 42

#2985 Posted by aguirRe [195.163.75.100], 25/08/2002 16:43 GMT , Refers to Post #2981

This error is usually due to one or more textures scaled too low. Look in the map file for textures scaled lower than about 0.25.

The values to look for in the map file are the last two on each brush face line if your map is in standard Q1 format.

Or if you have a multiple undo/redo function in the editor (like QuArK), you can quickly revert to an older version of the map to see when the error was introduced.

Bad Surface Extents

#2986 Posted by necros [172.172.163.53], 26/08/2002 02:18 GMT

quakelab suggests that it's because of a missing texture, or a water/lava intersection.

neither are true. are there any other reasons for bad surface extents error in quake?

Re:Bad Surface Extents

#2987 Posted by aguirRe [195.163.215.201], 26/08/2002 16:37 GMT , Refers to Post #2986

If you get that error while loading a map in GLQuake, one reason is that you have one or more missing textures that are liquid or sky. Check the compiler log for the names.

Faces with these textures are not cut up during the qbsp process as all other normal solids. This means that there can be large faces with missing textures.

Then, since the engine can't find the texture, it replaces it with some weird "texture" that actually *is* solid.

Finally the engine realizes that it can't handle the large faces with the suddenly "solid" texture. That's when you get the "Bad surface extents" message.

If you can't find the correct textures, replace them with a normal solid texture(like "xyz"), rebuild and the error should go away.

Thanks, AguiRe.

#2988 Posted by necros [172.162.162.98], 26/08/2002 17:50 GMT

it was exactly that problem. turns out my wad file was broke. thanks.

Who Needs A Title Anyway

#2989 Posted by daftpunk [62.98.82.235], 27/08/2002 15:55 GMT

thanks arguiRe for the explanation, it think it will help a lot of other mappers too

Need Testers

#2990 Posted by LMW-S [67.39.35.69], 28/08/2002 04:58 GMT

My Quake1 SP map is almost done, and I could use some betatesters if anyone is interested in helping me with bugs or making the map better. This is my first map so any help would be appreciated. If you're interested e-mail me
and I'll send the map file when I feel it's about ready.

Suggestion..

#2991 Posted by D13H4RD [68.1.67.209], 28/08/2002 12:24 GMT , Refers to Post #2990

Why not post it over in the 'Screenshots and Betas' thread?
Your likely to get more feedback that way.

daftpunk Thought A Title Wasn't Needed

#2992 Posted by daftpunk [62.98.88.135], 28/08/2002 23:53 GMT

zerglingxx@operamail.com

didn't work so a)you have a full box
b)you changed adress long ago
c)my server is shit (infinite shit), pun intended.

if you read this, send your map to daftpunk@infinito.it and post on the BETA board

Allocblock: Full

#2993 Posted by necros [172.147.112.148], 29/08/2002 22:59 GMT

is that an insufficient ram problem?

i put in -heapsize 96000, but still get it... mind you, the map is 2400 brushes, and i'm trying to track down a leak.

#2994 Posted by Scampie [66.231.198.47], 29/08/2002 23:06 GMT , Refers to Post #2993

allocblock:full occurs in glquake engines only. it happens when you have a single large face on a brush. alotting more ram does nothing.

donno what the acual dimension limit is, but this can be due to either (a) you made a fucking huge ass brush which you should remake into multiple smaller ones, or (b) a quark of vertex manipulation/csg craving which has resulted in a brush getting corrupted into a single, almost infinitly large face. you can find these by loading up software quake and no clipping.

#2995 Posted by R.P.G. [24.136.186.19], 29/08/2002 23:22 GMT , Refers to Post #2993

I encountered this while making the 100 brush map. Large map + unvised = Allocblock: Full. Try to track down the leak using other methods.

Please note also that I'm dizzy, presumably from lack of nutrients (perhaps oxygen) in my blood supply. Take this as you wish.

#2996 Posted by Dilvish [172.181.105.216], 30/08/2002 07:08 GMT

Try breathing, it helps sometimes.

That Sounds Weird

#2997 Posted by cyBeAr [195.58.111.103], 30/08/2002 08:39 GMT , Refers to Post #2994

Since brushes don't exist after compiling and I thought quake had a max face size (make a huge empty box and walls will still be split up into parts of a particular size).

#2998 Posted by nb [203.109.254.51], 30/08/2002 09:32 GMT , Refers to Post #2997

The infinite face gets split into an awful lot of parts, hence the error.

Glquake Lightmaps

#2999 Posted by metlslime [12.231.113.167], 30/08/2002 10:31 GMT

there can be up to 64 lightmap textures in glquake. Each texture can hold a bunch of individual polygons' lightmaps. The lightmap texture size is 128x128. Since the largetst possible (lightmapped) polygon is 240x240 in quake, then the largetst possible polygon lightmap will be 16x16.

It seems like you can fit plenty of 16x16 and smaller chunks into 64 different 128x128 spaces. Of course, if you did manage to have a chunk that was 129 wide, then it woudln't fit anywhere. But i don't see how qbsp would let that happen.

#3000 Posted by necros [172.138.28.4], 30/08/2002 16:40 GMT

it would appear to be the problem, Scampie... i can get the map running in winquake. but i've split up the large surfaces into smaller brushes, and i'm still getting the error in glq.

is it because of wide open spaces? i have an outdoor section which probably will be around 2048+ units from one end to another. would this cause errors?

#3001 Posted by necros [172.175.129.184], 30/08/2002 18:38 GMT

i just realized that was post #3000... rats.

anyway, the map is working now. thanks for all the help.

daftpunk Is Still Working On A Title

#3002 Posted by daftpunk [62.98.80.177], 30/08/2002 19:53 GMT

tried the gtkradiant conversion tool link in the sticky post but the server asks me for authorization. is this maybe because it is busy? will try later just in case

if anyone can give me the filename so i can search it in google cheers

daftpunk Thought A Title Wasn't Needed

#3003 Posted by daftpunk [62.98.80.177], 30/08/2002 21:16 GMT

ok i geddit now. it's just the q2map to q1map converter. i was thinking of gtk as a q3 only program so i thought it was yet another converter (i just noticed the link for qerad and gtkrad converter at the top of the page is the same)

THEREFORE i have found the solution and have posted 3 nice useless posts. oh well

qmap loads sooo fast compared to any other site so compliments to the programmers

#3004 Posted by Scampie [66.231.198.47], 30/08/2002 22:02 GMT

the server asking for auth was due to sleepwalkr's site moving. link is fixed now.

UnrealEd Link ^^^^^

#3005 Posted by Abyss [203.220.202.29], 30/08/2002 23:25 GMT

Would the link to UnrealEd ^^ up the top there be correct?, or is it that they just go about things in an unusual way ?

#3006 Posted by Grahf [192.154.63.186], 31/08/2002 04:53 GMT

I don't think anybody noticed. I don't have a clue about Unreal stuff, so I'd recommend just poking around Planetunreal a bit if you need Unreal info...

#3007 Posted by Abyss [203.220.203.222], 31/08/2002 07:55 GMT

Thanx Grahf, yeah I know where to get stuff for UED, just thought I'd poke a bit of fun at the link.

#3008 Posted by GrindSpire [213.1.135.114], 31/08/2002 11:58 GMT

Bollocks. The link used to work....

Oh well, changed the link and stuff.

#3009 Posted by daftpunk [62.98.115.122], 31/08/2002 14:13 GMT

yep it worked. i think my net was slowed and bugged by the fact that i was dloadin lots

#3010 Posted by MadHatter [207.173.103.124], 31/08/2002 14:22 GMT

do you guys know where i cant find some rusty metal textures or industrialish textures? for q1 that is.

You'd Probably Want

#3011 Posted by necros [172.145.149.22], 31/08/2002 15:41 GMT

Ogro textures. go to here to suspenlute.com/teamfern
and look at all these textures.

#3012 Posted by nac [134.161.73.212], 31/08/2002 21:19 GMT

I'm in the process of dl'ing gtk right now, planning to try it out for q1 mapping. i see that i have to change the default texture scale .. what do i change it to?

#3013 Posted by nac [134.161.73.212], 31/08/2002 22:20 GMT

Is there a site that explains how to get gtk up and running for q1 mapping? I tried following the instructions in the map converter zip, but I'm not doing something right, can't get textures to load. i suck :(

#3014 Posted by LMW-S [67.39.35.78], 31/08/2002 22:51 GMT

What is Error 56: line 7: token too large in DuBSP and how can I fix it?

Don't Use Quotes In Anything

#3015 Posted by Fat Controller [203.98.49.151], 31/08/2002 23:01 GMT , Refers to Post #3014

Do any of your messages have double quotes (") in them?

If they do, then that confuses BSP when reading the .map file - it thinks a line ends sooner than it does. Then the wheels fall off.

(It took me ages when I first ran into this with RC3...)

You Should Be Able To Escape Them...

#3016 Posted by metlslime [12.231.113.167], 31/08/2002 23:14 GMT

like this:

"welcome to \"The Pit\""

i haven't tested this, however.

Re: Gtk + Q1

#3017 Posted by necros [172.173.33.85], 31/08/2002 23:46 GMT

make sure you have 1.2.10.
install it blah blah.

go in: /quake3/baseq3/scripts and find entities.def that is the q3 entities file. change the extension, because gtkr will scan for all .def files in the dir and add them to the list. it gets stupid when you have q3 and q ents. now, take the entity file in the mapconv.zip archive, and copy it to the /quake3/baseq3/scripts dir and make sure it's now called entities.def (i know i said you could name it anything you want, but just do as i say.)

now that you have your entities straightened out, take your texture wad, and load it in texmex. (if you don't have texmex, get it.) export all the textures as either 24bit tgas or jpegs. extract them into /quake3/baseq3/textures/#YOURTEXTUREDIR#

replace #YOURTEXTUREDIR# with whatever name you want -- it could be easier to keep them in the same folder as your map is called...

now, go in /gtkradiant/games/ and find the q3.game. copy it to a new file called q.game. open up the newly copied file and look for the line
<game name="Quake III Arena / Quake III: Team Arena and modifications" gametools="G:\Quake3\Radiant/"/>

change it to this:
<game name="Quake 1" gametools="G:\Quake3\Radiant/" default_scale="1"/>

now, your all set. go in gtkr, and in the preferences, and choose Quake 1 in the drop down list. and, boomshakalacka, right in the ass, you've got it! your ready for q1 mapping in gtkr.

set up some batch files and whatever...

mine ease the pain a lot, and do everything for me. remember you can use %1 %2 %3 etc... to take commands from dos into the batch file... (ie: batchfile map will make %1 = map... you can add stuff onto the name by doing %1.bsp or whatever, which makes it map.bsp... fuck. i suck at explaining.)

if i missed something sorry. i will never post this information again. cheers.

I Think I Had Error 56 Once

#3018 Posted by Blitz [216.148.244.38], 01/09/2002 01:56 GMT , Refers to Post #3014

The problem I had was that I was using too many wads, and it was just a matter of condensing them down, and removing them from the editor.(WorldCraft)

Anyway, if you have alotta wads goin, myabe thats the problem. =)

Hmm, No Title

#3019 Posted by nac [134.161.73.212], 01/09/2002 03:05 GMT , Refers to Post #3017

thank you sir :)

Vis Problems

#3020 Posted by LMW-S [67.39.35.78], 01/09/2002 21:48 GMT

Sorry I have a LOT of mapping problems. Whenever I try to use Vis for my map it says it couldn't load portal file, even though the .prt is in the same directory as Vis is. i've tried re-compiling, and I noticed that when I compile the map using DuBSP I get "Warning 12: New portal was clipped away in CutNodePortals_r" a bunch of times when it tries to portalize.

Re: Vis Problems

#3021 Posted by necros [172.167.46.108], 02/09/2002 00:46 GMT

hmm... i used to get loads of CutNodePortal warnings, but they never gave me any grief... i've heard however that sometimes qbsp programs don't make prt files even though the level is filled.

are you sure the map isn't leaked, and isn't making a .pts file instead? a good way to check (asides if there are obvious leaks) is to noclip outside the map, and move a good ways away. if you can see the 'outer' wall, ie: you can't see inside the level when you have noclipped out of it, then the map isn't filled properly.

try typing pointfile.

if the map IS filled and qbsp refuses to make a portals file, you can force the creation of one with bsp2prt.exe (i don't have a link handy. if you need it i can email it to ya.)

Hmm, No Title

#3022 Posted by LMW-S [67.39.35.78], 02/09/2002 01:19 GMT , Refers to Post #3021

There are leak files, but two of the three I have are the middle of light entities, and the other is like (2028 -6069 -16) and I can't reach it.

What The...?

#3023 Posted by necros [172.170.30.84], 02/09/2002 02:04 GMT

two of the three? your only supposed to have one leak file... this is quake were taking about, right?

LMW-S Is Still Working On A Title

#3024 Posted by LMW-S [67.39.35.78], 02/09/2002 02:43 GMT , Refers to Post #3023

Well two of three leaks written to the file is what I meant.

#3025 Posted by metlslime [12.231.113.167], 02/09/2002 04:33 GMT

leak -> no .prt -> no vis. So fix the leak(s).

Help With Bfp

#3026 Posted by joesabazios [172.151.204.167], 02/09/2002 05:47 GMT

how can i test my maps on q3 and bfp dbzuniverse? everytime i put:map test it starts to load and then it goes back to the main men. on both games?

joe

#3027 Posted by LMW-S [67.39.35.78], 02/09/2002 11:57 GMT

WEll therein lies the problem, because when I try to fix the leak at the co-ordinates it gives, there is no leak. One leak isn't even on the map grid. How am I supposed to fix that?

#3028 Posted by LMW-S [67.39.35.78], 02/09/2002 12:07 GMT , Refers to Post #3027

Oh, and there was a .prt file for my map, but it must have been from an earlier compile. But regarding the .pts, it keeps pointing to point entities in my level. First it pointed to light entities in my level, then I deleted them and recompiled, then it started to point to monster entities in my level.

Ok, I've An Idea

#3029 Posted by LMW-S [67.39.35.78], 02/09/2002 12:13 GMT , Refers to Post #3028

Is there some general rule not to copy-paste point entities? Because pretty much all the entities I have are copied and pasted so I don't have to edit its proprerties again.If that's a problem then I might have to delete all of the entities in my level.

Leak Co-ordinates

#3030 Posted by Preach [217.35.11.17], 02/09/2002 14:25 GMT

When quake looks for a leak, it tries to trace a path from the outside of your level to any entity within, and if it can, then there is a leak. The co-ordinates it reports are the origin of the entity it finds, not the coordinates of the leak. So, it's not the entities that are at fault.

If you want to find a leak, one way is to load the pointfile into the map. Run the map in quake, even if it's unvised. Then, type pointfile in the console. Somewhere in the level there will be a line of dots leading from the entity to the outside. Find where the line goes from the inside to the outside and you've got the leak.

#3031 Posted by LMW-S [67.39.35.78], 02/09/2002 15:32 GMT , Refers to Post #3030

I tried that and it said there weren't enough particles available or something. But I will retry it.

#3032 Posted by necros [172.151.215.214], 02/09/2002 15:39 GMT

glquake -particles 20000

or winquake -particles 20000.

20000 should be enough.

#3033 Posted by R.P.G. [24.136.186.19], 02/09/2002 16:10 GMT , Refers to Post #3032

I hope so. I typically use 99999 though, just to be safe.

(&%)*&%$)*&% Leak

#3034 Posted by LMW-S [67.39.35.78], 02/09/2002 16:12 GMT , Refers to Post #3032

OK I tried the pointfile thing, and I found the dots that run all over the map. They only go through 2 brushes in the map, which from what I can tell are solid and have no leaks around where the dots were. I checked in WorldCraft several times , but I still don't see any. Should I delete the brushes it goes through and re-make them?

#3035 Posted by necros [172.151.215.214], 02/09/2002 16:19 GMT

that happened with the map i'm working on right now. i just deleted it and re made it.

364

99999?! jeeeeeeeeeesuhs. :P

#3036 Posted by LMW-S [67.39.35.78], 02/09/2002 16:20 GMT , Refers to Post #3035

Didn't Work

#3037 Posted by LMW-S [67.39.35.78], 02/09/2002 16:31 GMT , Refers to Post #3035

I remade the brushes that the dots went through, but when I compiles it still has the same leak.

#3038 Posted by Dilvish [172.186.180.126], 02/09/2002 17:23 GMT

that you haven't got any entity outside your map. I had left a light outside the hull once and even though there was no leak, I got a big leak alarm when I compiled. Spent hours searching for a hull breach before someone tipped me off.

#3039 Posted by LMW-S [67.39.35.78], 02/09/2002 17:27 GMT , Refers to Post #3038

Well I did have an info_null outside, but I deleted like a week ago. The other entity I have that is outside is a trigger_hurt, but it overlaps from the inside. I'll try making it smaller.

Speedy Is Still Working On A Title

#3040 Posted by Speedy [195.232.53.75], 02/09/2002 17:33 GMT

what editor do you use ? it might be better to use in-editor leak hunting

Worldcraft 3.4

#3041 Posted by LMW-S [67.39.35.78], 02/09/2002 17:39 GMT , Refers to Post #3040

I use worldcraft 3.4 to make the map, and DuBSP to compile and convert it to quake. I made the trigger_hurt fit inside the room I have it in, but it still didn't work. But, the only other entity that I can think of that is outside the hull is a door that rises from the floor. I have it hanging beneath the floor, so I'll try to see how that works.

#3042 Posted by LMW-S [67.39.35.78], 02/09/2002 17:43 GMT , Refers to Post #3041

Who Needs A Title Anyway

#3043 Posted by daftpunk [62.98.118.184], 02/09/2002 18:17 GMT

sometimes it helps making a box around some solids which might have tiny leaks (although it'brute force rather than intelligence) can't help you if it's only to do with ents

on another note i seem to remember that quark has a feature so you can open maps, change stuff and recompile. no bad intentions. just i made my first map a year ago and lost the map file and now i realise the lighting is way too dark so i wanna redo it. does anyone know the exact command.

also compliments to fatty for his site. i like the personal articles and other tips. keep doing those, they are very useful as is your list of tools and scripts

For Quark...

#3044 Posted by necros [172.128.125.147], 02/09/2002 20:02 GMT , Refers to Post #3043

at least the older versions,

you can just open it up like a regular .map file. goof around with the entities, then recompile the lighting after your done. you can do that with all ents.

Only Point Entitys Can Cause Leaks

#3045 Posted by metlslime [12.231.113.167], 02/09/2002 20:34 GMT

... not brush entities.

#3046 Posted by LMW-S [67.39.38.141], 02/09/2002 22:40 GMT

OK I've tried everything I can think of, but I can't figure it out. Unless anyone wants to try and help me find the problem, I'm just going to delete my maps and start over.

Because You Said 'Poop',

#3047 Posted by necros [172.128.125.147], 02/09/2002 23:21 GMT , Refers to Post #3046

i'll offer to take one map of yours and have a look at it. if you want, obviously.

Another Leak Finding Method

#3048 Posted by Preach [217.35.31.54], 03/09/2002 12:17 GMT

Sometimes pointfiles aren't that accurate, or loop around so much they get confusing. However, there is another way to track down a leak, if there is only one in your map. Cover half of the map with a large brush, and then recompile. If it still leaks, the leak is in the uncovered half. If the leak is gone, then it's somewhere in the half you covered up.

Then, repeat this method in the half of the map the the leak is in, covering up half of the section with a brush, and so on. Eventually you can get the brush down to a size that covers the leak accurately, while being small in size. If you delete the brush, and can see the leak, it should be easy to find.

Of course, if the brush is small enough, prevents the leak, and isn't obtrusive, you can always just leave it in, and make it a part of your map.

#3049 Posted by Starbuck [80.192.10.38], 03/09/2002 14:47 GMT

good tip, i find this works quite well actually. It's also fun, in a boring sort of way.

Re: Strange Leaks

#3050 Posted by aguirRe [195.163.74.28], 03/09/2002 16:41 GMT , Refers to Post #3046

From your previous posts, I assume you're using the DuBSP compiler. This is just the old TreeQBSP 1.63 slightly remade to handle map files in other formats than Q1.

This means it has the same leak (.prt) file bugs as 1.63 (which btw are fixed in the compilers found here, Note: Q1 format only). These bugs sometimes make it look like the leak line goes right through solid brushes when in fact the leak is in a different place.

Using DuBSP (or Tree1.63), you can add the option "-oldleak", which generates an oldstyle leak file that is a lot longer and wilder, but more accurate in the hull breach point. This is when you need the GLQuake "-particles 80000" option mentioned in previous posts.

Another problem with DuBSP/Tree1.63 is that you'll only get leak files for leaks in hull 2 (the clipping hull for shambler sized entities), even if there is a leak in hull 0 (the visible hull) somewhere else. If this sounds confusing, it's because it is. The leak handling in most Q1 compilers is extremely buggy.

If you can't proceed using the "-oldleak" option with DuBSP, I'd suggest that you convert your map to standard Q1 format (using mapconv ?) and use one of the compilers found at the link above. You will notice a huge difference in leak handling.

If you wish, I can also give it a shot if you send me the zipped map+wad.

zXc Is Still Working On A Title

#3051 Posted by zXc [217.113.225.158], 03/09/2002 19:00 GMT

I had the same problem wit my zxcar3 map. The compiler said, that there are leaks, alhough there obviously wasn't any [i couldn't find them using 'pointfile']. I think it's a problem of some illegal brushes - infinitely big, or very small. You can't see them in the editor ant they cause no problem while editing. I found the bad brushes using tthe utility called 'mapspy'. It's made for q2 maps, but you can easily convert your map using sleepwalkr's conversion tool. Mapspy will give you numbers of illegal brushes and all you should do is simply delete them.

I don't remember link to the mapspy, but it should be somewhere in this thread.

[hope it's readable --> sorry for my english]

Necros Read This

#3052 Posted by daftpunk [62.98.118.70], 03/09/2002 20:11 GMT

maspy is ultra cool, hope you all know its existence. saved me when some custom texture names where causing the compiler to crash

onto gtkrad editing and this is for necros

thanks necros. sounds strange but after following ALL your steps gtk still only loads q3 and wolf as games. the only thing i haven't done is unzipping q1 textures because i can't dload texmex (the popup NEVER starts the filesave window, can anyone help. found no mirror, does anyone have a solution like uploading it on their site, speedy's map dloaded fine from FP...)

i checked the .game file and the syntax is correct. i renamed the quake3 def file to entities.definition

here's the game file:<?xml version="1.0" encoding="iso-8859-1" standalone="yes"?>

< game name="Quake 1" gametools="e:\Quake III Arena\gtkRadiant/" default_scale="1" />

have i forgotten some of these """""""?

oh, also for anyone using qerad with G400, take off busmastering, also gives probs with SOME other apps, not many luckily. also don't use nearest for the tex rendering, it makes textures warp when cam view is not ortho to them

daftpunk Thought A Title Wasn't Needed

#3053 Posted by daftpunk [62.98.118.70], 03/09/2002 20:20 GMT

i am a bit confused because i have gtk radiant installed in e:gtkradiant but it has installed a dir in quake iii arena canlled gtkradiant. which is the important one and what files should i make sure are in place.
all compile progs are under the q3a dir and the e:gtkradiant contains the .game files, the manual and other .dll libraries.

think i made some mistakes, maybe reinstall under q3a will help or does that confuse the program even more?

Your Gametools Dir...

#3054 Posted by necros [172.147.235.154], 03/09/2002 20:24 GMT

"e:\quake III Arena\gtkradiant/"

is this where you installed gtkradiant? or is it the working folder made by gtkr upon installation? (do you have a /radiant folder?)

Fuck.. Posted At The Same Time As Me! :)

#3055 Posted by necros [172.147.235.154], 03/09/2002 20:26 GMT

the dir in the q3a dir is some type of working directory, contains the compilers and other things necessary for making compiled maps... this is the one you point the gametools too. (which you've done already).... so i honestly don't know what's wrong with your setup...

you've checked in gtkr's preferences and "Quake 1" isn't in the list?

daftpunk Is Still Working On A Title

#3056 Posted by daftpunk [62.98.118.70], 03/09/2002 22:31 GMT

failed to load textures/radiant/notex

GetLastError:can't find specified path (i trasnlated it cos it gives it in italian, the language of my italian pc)

so i guess i should reinstall and call directories radiant. i prefer wc preferences where you can set almost anything but i will get used to gtk as long as i doesn't give me texture errors or random errors like qerad (hope to solve that after a big format e:)

will keep you up to date. if your instructions on the site are correct then i am happy and 100% sure that the prob is with my installation (it narrows it down)

ps, is there any way of converting wc prefabs (.ol) into .map or .rmf? would be useful since i have the shareware version. would buy the registered if wc didn't have probs with the texture selection (to texture different faces in the camera view): i have it also on my uk pc which DOESN't thank god have a G400 but a simple intel740

#3057 Posted by daftpunk [62.98.118.70], 03/09/2002 23:27 GMT

just to remind anyone to tell me if they know where to get texmex apart from FP

my main question though is about VIS. we all know that vis takes a long time cos it has to calculate all the viewable areas from all poss views (portals) so big areas=slow vis.

if for example we have a big open area with high sides (think q2dm1 but without the high passages, only with the bottom floor) would it be poss to somehow exclude the high parts from vis. with this i mean that if you play on ground level unless you cheat with fly you will never reach maybe height x so in theory your portals should be less. is there a way of doing such thing with brushes.

if not, is anyone planning to do this in future engines (to prevent errors you could have phisical barriers and anyway if you use noclip you get the same effect as when flying out of a map, just the rendering is not the same as IN the map)

hope my post is clear and relevant with the mapping topic :-)

I Don't Think That's Possible In Q1.

#3058 Posted by necros [172.137.211.226], 04/09/2002 00:14 GMT

q2 or q3 on the other hand...

hint is amazingly cool.

Hmm, No Title

#3059 Posted by Speedy [213.158.1.100], 04/09/2002 04:12 GMT

if I got you right, I dont think its possible at all

and big areas=!slow vis
lots of portals=slow vis

#3060 Posted by necros [172.159.201.166], 04/09/2002 20:31 GMT

that map is for worldcraft! :) i can't open the sucker.

Hmm, No Title

#3061 Posted by daftpunk [62.98.86.125], 05/09/2002 21:39 GMT

for those who use valve hammer, and conversion tools for q1, how does it compare with wc16?

having had trouble with texturing (couldn't select from the cam view) i might get valve hammer and use that. hope it's nice and stable

#3062 Posted by LMW-S [67.39.37.42], 05/09/2002 22:39 GMT

After months and months of work on my map, this leak problem became too much for me, and after trying everything I could think of I couldn't figure out how fix it, so I just deleted my maps. Sorry for wasting all your time with my problems, I really appreciate the time all of you spent trying to help me, but I just couldn't get anything to work right. I tried all sorts of techniques, and all sorts of programs, but nothing worked. Once again thanks for your time, but this map is gone.

Never Give Up!

#3063 Posted by DaZ [213.122.34.119], 05/09/2002 23:28 GMT

Do you know how many maps I made before even making dazdm1? At least 10 or 20! And seeing as I never released anything up until dazdm5 I learned a shitload about fixing errors.

The 1st map you make will always been close to your heart, and when you cant fix it its a pain in the fucking arse, but just load up that editor and start on something new.

Its surprising how much BETTER the next map will turn out!

I Never Understood

#3064 Posted by necros [172.167.192.206], 06/09/2002 01:31 GMT

why people delete maps they don't want to work on anymore. i have about 10 maps which aren't being worked on, and some are from as far back as 2000... it's good as a reference sometimes. you never know when you might need them. and sometimes you get around to finishing them anyway.

Speedy Thought A Title Wasn't Needed

#3065 Posted by Speedy [213.158.1.181], 06/09/2002 02:58 GMT

and finding leaks is dead easy

#3066 Posted by czg [158.38.54.108], 06/09/2002 05:34 GMT

1: Daftpunk; you had a matrox right? iirc that is the source to your problems in WC3 (Hammer! OMG!LOL!)

2: Well, this LMW-S guy... Yarrr!

#3067 Posted by Eggman [162.83.138.34], 06/09/2002 16:44 GMT

What's the name of the entity that gives your location to your teammates in team msgmode?

Also is it in the default entities.def file or do I need an updated one?

I Don't Do Much CTF

#3068 Posted by pjw [66.107.101.68], 06/09/2002 18:06 GMT , Refers to Post #3067

but aren't target_location entities used for that purpose, or am I being ignorant?

Hmm, No Title

#3069 Posted by Eggman [162.83.138.34], 06/09/2002 18:23 GMT , Refers to Post #3068

I figured it was either target_location or target_position. Thx

Reply To Czg

#3070 Posted by daftpunk [62.98.80.95], 07/09/2002 11:42 GMT

ya the matrox card is a pain but wc16 still gave me probs in my p2 300 with intel 740 so thats why i am curious. to get round not being able to texture in wc16 (well actually the strange thing is that it worked for 1 year and then didn't so it might be some obscure setting on both my pcs, reinstalling didnt work but perhaps i never reformatted so settings remained on my hd...)

i was saying that i did the texturing in qoole (nice and quick although it crashes a lot but maybe not for the texturing).

how do people vert edit in gtkrad? i tried it but when you move one vertex it slightly moves the others like if it wants to keep certain angles proportional..can't be useful then...unless there is a setting to hold the others...

#3071 Posted by necros [172.175.166.63], 07/09/2002 16:15 GMT

i haven't had any problems with vert editing in gtkr. the reason the other verts are getting moved is either because: 1. you don't have face splitting on. this setting is reallky l33t, and splits the face up so that you get two triangles instead of a square face. you can do really awsome shit with that. or 2: your trying to move the verts too much. in edge mode, it will compensate for invalid brushes by moving other sides so that the brush remains concave. this is a GOOD thing -- it stops you from making invalid brushes, unlike qoole, which is very easy to break brushes in vertex editing.

underworldfan Is Still Working On A Title

#3072 Posted by underworldfan [64.169.155.193], 07/09/2002 16:28 GMT

How do you get Valve hammer 3.4 to work with Quake 1, as per Tronyn recent screenshots in the screenshot thread?

Is there anything special you need/have to do?

Speedy Thought A Title Wasn't Needed

#3073 Posted by Speedy [213.158.1.153], 08/09/2002 03:55 GMT

At q3w they say dont use vert manipulation, you can get dup planes and other brush errors ;/

Not Sure Who "they" Are

#3074 Posted by pjw [24.128.56.74], 08/09/2002 05:55 GMT

but in general, I would say that it's better to use the clipper. gtkr is far less buggy than it used to be when doing edge/vertex manipulation, but I'm pretty sure it's still possible to mess things up if you're not paying attention to what you're doing.

If you know what you're doing, then more power to you.

The only time I normally use vert manipulation is when messing about with a tri-souped floor or wall.

#3075 Posted by necros [172.165.18.102], 08/09/2002 15:59 GMT

yeah, duplicate planes crop up often. doesn't seem to bother qbsp though... it just ignores the duplicate plane...

Q1 Compilers?

#3076 Posted by Shadowdane [68.50.252.23], 09/09/2002 05:59 GMT

im going to make a Q1SP map, made with Tenebrae in mind. But I need some good compilers.

What should I use?? URLs please.

#3077 Posted by metlslime [12.231.113.167], 09/09/2002 08:50 GMT

[21:14] <metlslime> tyrlight, treeqbspbjp
[21:14] <metlslime> rvis+
[21:14] <_blackpope> tho I have it queued up from others too
[21:14] <DaZ> how do u make a type 3 TGA?
[21:14] <_blackpope> to if they open up I can get a better rate
[21:14] <metlslime> http://user.tninet.se/~xir870k/
[21:15] <Mr_White> oh FINE, Im not good enough for U!
[21:15] <metlslime> http://www.planetquake.com/tyrann/utils.html

That Reminds Me :)

#3078 Posted by DaZ [213.122.113.125], 09/09/2002 12:49 GMT

<DaZ> how do u make a type 3 TGA?

I ask cos tenebrae says it only uses type3 TGA images, Ive tried all the saving options in psp7 for TGA images with no luck, any ideas?

#3079 Posted by czg [158.38.54.120], 09/09/2002 13:00 GMT

That it means you need an alpha channel in your tga?
Maybe?
Perhaps?
Potentially?
Could be?

If so just select entire image and go;
Selections->Save selection to alpha channel...
And save!!! AND SAVE! AND SAAAAVE!!!!

Type Byte 3

#3080 Posted by nb [203.109.254.59], 09/09/2002 13:34 GMT , Refers to Post #3078

...describes an uncompressed single channel (greyscale) image.

#3081 Posted by Shadowdane [68.50.252.23], 09/09/2002 15:58 GMT , Refers to Post #3077

thx.. i had thought I bookmarked those when I was in #terrafusion.

#3082 Posted by DaZ [213.122.81.219], 09/09/2002 17:38 GMT

Cheers nb, and also thanks to the tenabrae author who helped me also, with the bump/gloss maps in place it makes the textures look so much better its untrue!

#3083 Posted by underworldfan [172.170.228.101], 09/09/2002 21:10 GMT , Refers to Post #3072

no-one answered my post 3072, am i just being stupid, and missing something really obvious?

I Think It's Just A Matter Of...

#3084 Posted by necros [172.168.164.119], 09/09/2002 21:17 GMT

using dubsp... it was riot that made those utils, right?

url:

he's got some pretty cool stuff there...

Darren Emerson

#3085 Posted by daftpunk [62.98.89.33], 10/09/2002 10:24 GMT

underworld fan.
have you tried any tutorials in the program pages. prolly something like what necros does with gtk to make q1 maps. i cant be any more specific but i will let you know since i am going to use the same prog if wc16 still gives me probs.

use gtk for now, so you can learn q3 mapping

#3086 Posted by Tef Johs [129.241.81.186], 12/09/2002 12:32 GMT

Use Gtk for now so you can learn RtCW mapping... :)

It is really fun. It IS.

daftpunk Is Still Working On A Title

#3087 Posted by daftpunk [62.98.118.253], 12/09/2002 21:16 GMT

is playing rtcw dm good though? i shall pick up a copy in november probably (depending on my finances). what games are most popular. ctf, team games or straight dm?

#3088 Posted by necros [172.151.130.72], 12/09/2002 21:31 GMT

all rtcw multiplayer is teamgames.

#3089 Posted by daftpunk [62.98.117.142], 16/09/2002 18:51 GMT

PLEASE can anyone mail it to me. fp has a 31 minute wait and 100/100 people on it. haven't found any mirrors and there is no way i have been able to dload it!

if you feel like sending anything please write a mail first telling me so

just in case daftpunk@infinito.it doesn't work i also have daft-punk@libero.it

cheers-a-lot

#3090 Posted by Shadowdane [68.50.252.23], 16/09/2002 20:34 GMT , Refers to Post #3089

here ya go..

TexMex v3.4 - 1MB

#3091 Posted by metlslime [12.231.113.167], 17/09/2002 03:37 GMT

/me notes that you waited 1 hour and 42 minutes to get a direct download link to avoid the 30 minute wait on fileplanet.

Ya Ya Ya, Eins Zwei Polizei

#3092 Posted by daftpunk [62.98.87.164], 17/09/2002 21:20 GMT

ya metslime you got sense of humor. thing is, my modem is slow so i can't stay connected for 30 mins and whatever the dload takes cos ppl in the family need the phone line. anyway i always got time during the night, true, but not when i am working and doing a few other things...

thanks to shadowdane

#3093 Posted by Mike Woodham [217.39.21.123], 18/09/2002 19:30 GMT , Refers to Post #3090

Link says: Server has internal error.

What, like an upset tummy?

daftpunk Thought A Title Wasn't Needed

#3094 Posted by daftpunk [62.98.84.132], 18/09/2002 21:22 GMT

maybe shadowdane deleted the file OR the server is overloaded if it belongs to a big provider with not many servers...

#3095 Posted by Scampie [66.231.198.47], 19/09/2002 00:29 GMT , Refers to Post #3094

or maybe it was a joke, altho maybe a bit unfunny, and nobody cares what happened to the server :D

Doesnt Matter Anyway

#3096 Posted by daftpunk [62.98.88.238], 19/09/2002 10:55 GMT

i finally managed to dload it from fuckplanet with no probs so dunno what was wrong a week ago.
using it now actually to check about 15 wads before i choose some catchy textures for my map. will be long process but hopefully a satisfactory one when my map will not contain ONE id texture. still love orig q textures so maybe the next map will be a homage to the great texturing that q2 never had...

Shadowdane Thought A Title Wasn't Needed

#3097 Posted by Shadowdane [68.50.252.23], 19/09/2002 14:58 GMT , Refers to Post #3094

no i didnt delete the file.. I think the server is having problems, I get the same error. Try it again later.

Ok Ok I Read The Thingy On Textures

#3098 Posted by daftpunk [62.98.119.232], 19/09/2002 15:52 GMT

at the top of the page.

i am still looking for textures converted from major games to quake classic.

in particular duke nukem, malice and any others you can think of.

all i ask is maybe the filenames if you have such wads or any other info. i tried major sites and i have to say i found lots of stuff like wads from scourge of armagon. still missing halflife though

flame me if you wanna...

#3099 Posted by daftpunk [62.98.119.232], 19/09/2002 16:03 GMT

oh ut and serious sam would be quite nice too: basically if there is a site dedicated to converting everything (a food mixer into a dj mixer, a railgun into a useful laser pointer...ok nuff messin...)

Hmm, No Title

#3100 Posted by Grahf [192.154.63.186], 20/09/2002 00:15 GMT

I have on my computer wads of all the texes from a number of commercial games... However these are a) farking big and b) technically illegal to publically distribute. I've got UT, Rune (actually [kona] posted that wad on qmap not too long ago), Kingpin, HL, Deus Ex... If anybody wants 'em, talk to me and mebbe we could set something up.

This site has wads for the 4 daikatana episodes, btw.

#3101 Posted by cyBeAr [195.58.111.103], 20/09/2002 08:11 GMT , Refers to Post #3100

It gets legal if you do it secretely!

I'm Not Super Sure

#3102 Posted by mcgruff [24.112.59.57], 21/09/2002 09:06 GMT

is this where i'm supposed to post questions?
i hope so =) i was just wondering if there is any way to conv. q2/q3/hl bsp's to q1. doesn't matter if it has to be retextured and ent'd (although it would be nice if ents and tex's didn't have to be redone). i'm from the q3toqw team, we have already had some moderate successes as far as models, sprites, particles, and sounds go, but q3 bsp support would blow what we've done so far out of the water. anyone? thanks in advance.

#3103 Posted by GrindSpire [62.6.119.57], 21/09/2002 14:19 GMT , Refers to Post #3102

It's debatable whether it's actually worth it...

Apart from anything else, id really doesn't like it.

But no, AFAIK there are no conversion programs, and the scale would be wrong if you did a direct conversion anyway.

#3104 Posted by cyBeAr [213.66.231.124], 21/09/2002 17:04 GMT , Refers to Post #3102

I looked your site rofl

#3105 Posted by mcgruff [24.112.59.57], 21/09/2002 22:05 GMT , Refers to Post #3103

alright thanks mang... btw, cybear, what's so funny?

Who Needs A Title Anyway

#3106 Posted by Speedy [213.158.2.78], 22/09/2002 00:09 GMT

Serach the web for q3 maps converions.
There are few, like q3dm6, q3dm2, q3dm17, q3dm7...

#3107 Posted by Scampie [66.231.198.47], 22/09/2002 19:43 GMT

QW in Q3 has already been done... see CQA for details...

and straight conversions are quite illegal. you'll have to remake all the maps by hand if you don't want to get in any legal trouble.

#3108 Posted by cyBeAr [213.66.231.124], 22/09/2002 20:04 GMT , Refers to Post #3107

didn't you read their about page?

We Don't Want

#3109 Posted by mcgruff [24.112.59.57], 22/09/2002 20:25 GMT , Refers to Post #3107

qw in q3, we want q3 in qw ;P

#3110 Posted by czg [158.38.54.65], 23/09/2002 07:24 GMT

type at console:
sv_maxspeed 50
cl_forwardspeed 20
cl_sidespeed 10
error OMG!LOL!

Instant Q3

#3111 Posted by Scampie [63.167.210.202], 23/09/2002 16:20 GMT , Refers to Post #3109

WHY THE FUCK WOULD YOU WANT THAT!?

wrath Thought A Title Wasn't Needed

#3112 Posted by wrath [195.58.111.103], 23/09/2002 16:23 GMT

because he's a retard.

#3113 Posted by mcgruff [24.112.59.57], 23/09/2002 20:17 GMT , Refers to Post #3112

#3114 Posted by mcgruff [24.112.59.57], 23/09/2002 20:23 GMT , Refers to Post #3111

yea, you're right, why would anyone want better graphics? sort of like that project you posted, which seems dedicated to making quake3 look like it came out of somebody's ass. that's some good work there champ. put that one on your resume. i should have known better than to ask mappers to help, they get pissed off when you distract them from their discussions on how much fun AD&D is. k...thx....bye.

#3115 Posted by Scampie [66.231.198.47], 23/09/2002 21:51 GMT

rofl

that's all.

#3116 Posted by NotoriousRay [162.33.176.25], 23/09/2002 23:41 GMT

looks like someone here put the redard in flame retardant suit

#3117 Posted by NotoriousRay [162.33.176.25], 23/09/2002 23:41 GMT

looks like someone here put the retard in flame retardant suit

#3118 Posted by NotoriousRay [162.33.176.25], 23/09/2002 23:41 GMT

#3119 Posted by pjw [24.128.56.74], 24/09/2002 02:44 GMT

I love this place, but sometimes some of you folks make me really sad.

#3120 Posted by cyBeAr [195.58.111.103], 24/09/2002 08:30 GMT

I was going to tell everyone (again) that hadn't to go read their about page but then I saw that it wasn't any funny anymore.

Who Needs A Title Anyway

#3121 Posted by wrath [195.58.111.103], 24/09/2002 09:45 GMT

#3122 Posted by Maj [193.128.238.152], 24/09/2002 12:47 GMT

Remember when you used to be funny? Before you began just spitting cliched insults at anyone who disagreed with you? That was cool. Then. Now it's just tragic.

#3123 Posted by pjw [66.107.101.68], 24/09/2002 13:49 GMT

wrath,

I'm assuming from your eloquently-worded inquiry that you harbor some confusion regarding my previous post. Let's try this:

I started coming to this place on a daily basis back when it was the Qboard and I didn't know squat about level editing. I now make it a point to visit here on a daily basis, sometimes more often, and I get a lot out of it. It makes me happy to feel like I'm a part of this community.

But it makes me sad when (as happens on a regular basis) someone new to the board shows up and posts, asking for help or information, and manages to catch one of you guys on one of your "heavy days" and is then subjected to ridicule, scorn, and juvenile insults.

It makes me wonder how much of a near miss I had a few years ago. I could have shown up, asked an innocent question, been shit on, and concluded that this place was a worthless cesspool of idiocy and never came back. I would have missed out on a hellava lot of good stuff.

Does that help?

Hmm, No Title

#3124 Posted by wrath [195.58.111.103], 24/09/2002 14:12 GMT

pjw;

I was going to write something like 'to each his own', or YMMV or a short blurb about the great thing about people liking different stuff and how it makes this place a dynamic and interresting read, but when I put my fingers to the keys...
I realised that it was just retarded.

q2 in qw, qw in q3, q1 in pong...
It's all been done a hundred ways from sunday by happy-go-lucky mod people who thinks it's this nifty thing, when it's actually, and let's be honest here, retarded.

what's so hard about that?

maj;

no one told you? jaded and bitter is this seasons mindset.
mr pot, meet mr kettle, btw...

#3125 Posted by Maj [193.128.238.152], 24/09/2002 15:10 GMT

I know I'm not perfect, but I try to aspire to something better than "because he's retarded". It wasn't funny. It didn't add anything. All it did was punish someone for offering an opinion. Congrats. You're not even a cunt anymore - just a little voicebox that says 'retard' every time you push its button.

Hmm, No Title

#3126 Posted by wrath [195.58.111.103], 24/09/2002 16:13 GMT

I know I'm not perfect, but I try to aspire to something better than "because he's retarded".
Oh, don't be so modest.

It wasn't funny.
that's beacuse I wasn't joking.

All it did was punish someone for offering an opinion.
I think we've been over this before, if someone offers me an opinion that I think is retarded, that makes that person a (wait for it, here it comes...) retard!!!
And that's my opinion.

See the circles we're running in?

#3127 Posted by pjw [66.107.101.68], 24/09/2002 16:57 GMT

"I don't enjoy/appreciate something, so therefore the people who do are retarded."

Self-centered much?

Not much more to say, I guess. I'll leave you to play in your circle; you might want to switch to your off-hand every now and then though.

wrath Is Still Working On A Title

#3128 Posted by wrath [195.58.111.103], 24/09/2002 17:31 GMT

self-centricity?
welcome to the internet, it's gonna be a whole lot worse, bring your hard-top and mind the bullshit.

btw, are we arguing if q3 in qw is retarded or not, or are we talking about how ones persona shines through when making statements on A GOD DAMNED MESSAGE BOARD ON THE ARSE END OF THE IMPORTANCE SPECTRA?!

I hereby state that all this game incest/crossover idea is the biggest waste of hard drive space since the launch of realplayer. And I swear by that.

You otoh may think that it's great, and me taking such a callous stance against the cute, cuddly, fuzzy modmakers is retarded.
Fine by me, then a retard I'll be.

And if you can't handle a one-line off-hand remark on your mental status, stay on aol or get up-wind, we're pissing over here.

#3129 Posted by Maj [193.128.238.152], 24/09/2002 17:52 GMT

Lets say you're at the pub watching the football, one of your mates introduces you to someone else, and the conversation goes:

"Hi"
"Hi. You support [team]?"
*deadpan* "No, you're retarded"
*takes it as joke* "Heheheh"
"No, really, you're fucking retarded" *walks off*

Twat, right? That's you. C'mon, there's a difference between this "haha, I'm a cunt, you're a cunt" stuff and just being obnoxious.

#3130 Posted by D13H4RD [68.1.67.209], 24/09/2002 17:57 GMT

You guys are funny, in a sad sort of way.

#3131 Posted by Maj [193.128.238.152], 24/09/2002 18:05 GMT

(Last one was posted before I read your last post btw)

...so now we're on to the 'hey, the internet's a hard place, so that excuses everything!! fuckface!!' argument? Grow up. Do you think anyone wants to talk to someone whose only argument is "you're retarded"?

#3132 Posted by wrath [195.58.111.103], 24/09/2002 19:05 GMT

diehard;
thank you, I guess, no... wait. retard!

...

listen maj, arguing on the internet/competing in the paralympics-jokes aside, please, when you start to armchair psycho-analyze me, "aspire" to atleast do it with some finesse. and without putting words in my mouth.

'hey, the internet's a hard place, so that excuses everything!! fuckface!!' argument?
That wasn't was I was saying, sorry for the confusion, mea culpa.
However, if catching a quiet 'retard' from a bitter old fart on a message board drives you away, I marvel at what happens when you get messages in your inbox that hints at you having a dick in need of artificial improvement. Hell, I didn't even try to sell him anything.

I'm not the only one here who thinks that the q3-in-qw mumbojumbo is a terrible abomination to humanity to begin with, and if that idea monkey had taken the time to check both lanes before he tried crossing bullshit road, he'd have seen the clue bus coming a mile away, and honking...

Do you think anyone wants to talk to someone whose only argument is "you're retarded"?
That isn't my only argument, it isn't an argument at all, it's an observation, and a personal opinion. I wasn't offering my argument against this particular mod, because the most obvious one is self evident, and the second has been proven time after time again.

now, re: your pub scenario, I wouldn't call him a retard. I'd stab him in the face. what do you think I am, some kind of amateur evil? I know very well where you're going with that, and you know very well that I won't bite.

scampie hollered bloody murder asking who'd ever want q3 in qw. and knowing that scampie aint the sharpest knife in this particular drawer, I helped him along.

there's a line between calling someone a retard for saying this or that, and to seriously believe that the person in question IS in dire need of lace-less shoes.

and you're tip-toeing it, blind-folded, on fire.

#3133 Posted by DaZ [213.122.62.29], 24/09/2002 19:47 GMT

#3134 Posted by Maj [193.128.238.152], 24/09/2002 19:50 GMT

This is better.

However, if catching a quiet 'retard' from a bitter old fart on a message board drives you away, I marvel at what happens when you get messages in your inbox that hints at you having a dick in need of artificial improvement. Hell, I didn't even try to sell him anything.

*shrugs*, and? I don't see how that answers anything.

now, re: your pub scenario, I wouldn't call him a retard. I'd stab him in the face. what do you think I am, some kind of amateur evil? I know very well where you're going with that, and you know very well that I won't bite.

Well, I don't know where you thought I was going with that, but I thought I was going in the direction of "so if you wouldn't do it in real life, why is it ok if you're sitting 5000 miles away". Really, I don't see how your post above was any different to walking up to a complete stranger and calling him a retard.

here's a line between calling someone a retard for saying this or that, and to seriously believe that the person in question IS in dire need of lace-less shoes.

Ok, before I embarrass myself further, were you being sarcy or not?

At least look at it from whatsisnames point of view. You happen to find this little msgboard, offer a harmless opinion, and bang, apparently in all seriousness, "you're a retard". How would you feel? Maybe, because you're such a hard internet bastard after all, you'd just go "hahah funny". I think most people would mutter "twat" and walk away. Are they undesirable just because they don't like people insulting them for no reason?

#3135 Posted by Maj [193.128.238.152], 24/09/2002 19:51 GMT

OOooooOOOoooOOO

#3136 Posted by DaZ [213.122.62.29], 24/09/2002 20:07 GMT

Keep yer pants on

This Shit'll Drive Me To The Bottle.

#3137 Posted by wrath [195.58.111.103], 24/09/2002 20:18 GMT

Ok, before I embarrass myself further, were you being sarcy or not?
what I mean is that just cause I blurt out a 'retard' more or less by rote it's more 'you're being/acting like a total retard', not that he is a lesser life form in dire need of online acridity.

At least look at it from whatsisnames point of view. You happen to find this little msgboard, offer a harmless opinion, and bang, apparently in all seriousness, "you're a retard".
I tried to answer that already, if you hang back and check the jargong, you should be able to pick up that yours truly happily insults people left and right and expect to be insulted in return, in a back-slapping mens locker room fashion, sans the actual mens locker room. and with fake names. and drunken postings.

Are they undesirable just because they don't like people insulting them for no reason?
hell no, when did I ever say that?

but if you're just gonna spew some lame act on ad&d and storm out instead of telling me to piss off, speak out and drop dead?
*shrug*

I'll be on the front porch seeing him off.
"Thanks for calling in, I don't even play AD&D, BYYYEEEE!"

personally, I think you're making this into a way bigger thing then it really is, but I could be wrong.
Four hundred years from now skittery-eyed people in furs may very well be telling apocalyptic stories about me in hushed voices as they sit around a camp-fire in the ruins of down-town new york.

Wouldn't be a bad way to be remembered, huh?

Fuck off, Daz.
I second that, and raise you a public flogging with urine loaded super-soakers for the crowd.

mcgruff Thought A Title Wasn't Needed

#3138 Posted by mcgruff [24.112.59.57], 24/09/2002 21:32 GMT , Refers to Post #3124

apparently, the 30,000 people who downloaded the mod disagree with you =/

besides, you seem to think stalking some internet map board throwing around juvenile insults is a great way to spend your time.

criticize my mod when you've made your own. but you wouldn't have time to do that, inbetween finger painting and trying to cover up your own insecurities by insulting people whilst hiding behind your monitor.

Who Needs A Title Anyway

#3139 Posted by mcgruff [24.112.59.57], 24/09/2002 21:46 GMT , Refers to Post #3128

self-centricity?
welcome to the internet, it's gonna be a whole lot worse, bring your hard-top and mind the bullshit.

great, i'm arguing with a toothless scumbag limey. mind the social assistance more like, "mate".

btw, are we arguing if q3 in qw is retarded or not, or are we talking about how ones persona shines through when making statements on A GOD DAMNED MESSAGE BOARD ON THE ARSE END OF THE IMPORTANCE SPECTRA?!

if this board was so unimportant here, you wouldn't be working so hard to defend your status on it. iiiiiiironic, you cockmaster.

I hereby state that all this game incest/crossover idea is the biggest waste of hard drive space since the launch of realplayer. And I swear by that.

you've probably never even tried one of those mods, you just summed them up as "way too complicated for me to understand" and started to deride 'em. sort of like how you insulted me before you had read more than 3 lines of what i had written here. why? so you could look hard in front of people you don't know and will never meet anywhere but over the internet. that's pretty pathetic.

You otoh may think that it's great, and me taking such a callous stance against the cute, cuddly, fuzzy modmakers is retarded.
Fine by me, then a retard I'll be.

no arguement there. you're a fucking idiot.

And if you can't handle a one-line off-hand remark on your mental status, stay on aol or get up-wind, we're pissing over here.

i can handle anything you dish out. you just caught me off guard with your "i'm a faggot for no reason over the internet because it makes me forget about how much my life sucks" attitude.

what's funny? you're reading the mapping help section on a game map board, and it's probably as close as you'll ever get to a real friend.

#3140 Posted by GrindSpire [213.120.56.37], 24/09/2002 21:48 GMT

Can we get back to the point in hand.

That is, Q3 in QW is a bloody stupid idea. I have no problem with people liking Q3, I just don't see the point in putting it into QW.

Why not just play Q3? Is that such a difficult concept?

May I Add Further Drivel To This?

#3141 Posted by R.P.G. [24.136.214.230], 24/09/2002 21:55 GMT

Porting a game backwards seems silly. Porting forwards can have advantages.

Furthermore, wrath is giving us a perfect example of why QMap is thought of as elitist, and everyone else is taking it too seriously.

Hmm, No Title

#3142 Posted by mcgruff [24.112.59.57], 24/09/2002 22:00 GMT , Refers to Post #3140

That is, Q3 in QW is a bloody stupid idea. I have no problem with people liking Q3, I just don't see the point in putting it into QW.Why not just play Q3? Is that such a difficult concept?

1) q3toqw runs faster than q3
2) q3toqw is free
3) q3toqw preserves qw physics, which is the reason there still is a qw community at all.
4) qw netcode is better, in that it is lighter on bandwidth, and less taxing on server-side CPU
5) using q3 models in qw = better graphics

comprende? i didn't think so, but oh well. i'm not going to continually defend my project to limey assmasters who are too retarded to know how to install it (not that you'd even try to install it, i'm just using the difficulty of the install process, which includes such tasks as unzipping and moving files, as a general benchmark for stupidity).

=/

#3143 Posted by R.P.G. [24.136.214.230], 24/09/2002 22:04 GMT , Refers to Post #3142

I shall decline on arguing against your reasons for Q3 to QW, but instead argue that you're trying to apply stupidity and wrath's traits to those whom it does not fit.

#3144 Posted by mcgruff [24.112.59.57], 24/09/2002 22:06 GMT , Refers to Post #3141

ok, look

qw players still play qw because of physics. i gather none of you here are qw players, because you would have known this. but qw has the disadvantage of its shitty 1996 graphics. q3toqw is there to update the qw graphics, while retaining the preferred qw physics. THAT's why we port backwards.

[qmap people] BUT WHY NOT JUST PLAY Q3? IS THAT SUCH A DIFFICULT CONCEPT TO GRASP?

[qw players] BECAUSE Q3 IS A GIANT PILE OF FAGGOT IN EVERY RESPECT OTHER THAN ITS GRAPHICS IN COMPARISON WITH QW. IS THAT SUCH A DIFFICULT CONCEPT TO GRASP?

[qmap people] oi, i'm confused.

Who Needs A Title Anyway

#3145 Posted by R.P.G. [24.136.214.230], 24/09/2002 22:19 GMT

GrindSpire
wrath
scampie
NotoriousRay
cyBeAr

Um... We play QW.

QW players don't play QW just because of the physics. It's the entire experience -- which includes the gameplay and high-quality maps as well as all the other factors -- that they're after.

Moreover, CPM aims to add better physics and gameplay to Q3. Several popular Quake/Quake3 mappers have made maps designed for it.

Hmm, No Title

#3146 Posted by mcgruff [24.112.59.57], 24/09/2002 22:34 GMT , Refers to Post #3145

QW players don't play QW just because of the physics. It's the entire experience -- which includes the gameplay

the physics ARE the gameplay. you're arguing with me just to argue, aren't you?

high-quality maps as well as all the other factors -- that they're after.

so wouldn't it make sense to have high quality models and skins to go along with those high quality maps and "other factors"?
[R.P.G.] OF COURSE NOT YOU IDIOT
why? who knows, noone has yet explained why better graphics is a bad thing, especially since it's not an fps sacrifice.

Moreover, CPM aims to add better physics and gameplay to Q3. Several popular Quake/Quake3 mappers have made maps designed for it.

wow, that's great. Q3toQW aims to add better graphics and sounds to QW. but apparently, that's a stupid idea.

#3147 Posted by GrindSpire [213.1.128.156], 24/09/2002 22:36 GMT

limey assmasters

Yeah, and you can take you racist comment and shove it up your... no... I shall be polite... anus.

And there's a difference between adding better graphics to QW and illegally ripping the Q3 content. The fact you were after a conversion program shows a lack of effort (as well as knowledge).

Speaking of which, you still haven't addressed the issue of breaking id's intellectual property rights (which is a crime under both national and international law).

#3148 Posted by NotoriousRay [162.33.176.25], 24/09/2002 22:37 GMT

since when is having older (notice i dont say 'worse', quake graphics still evoke a feel and uniqueness that i have yet to see in any game with 'new' graphics) graphics a disadvantage? and if thats what your after, why are you porting q3 gameplay to quakeworld engine and not making a quake engine mod to spice up its graphics? seems pretty ass backwards imo. also as a side note i'm not entirely sure of the legality of q3toqw anyways, but then again...

#3149 Posted by Scampie [66.231.198.47], 24/09/2002 22:38 GMT

will you morons just drop it? just becuase someone took a joke a wrong and started being an idiot doesn't mean you all have to join him. jeez.

(and to help everyone in unterstanding this, it's the same thing Generations ran into... Unless you completely remake EVERYTHING, it's not legal. From the sound of their website, they're just discovering this and claim they will continue on... oh well... good luck to you guys. maybe you'll accually finish unlike the millions of half finished mods in the world.)

Hey, Look A Squirrel!

#3150 Posted by Paul [217.39.131.74], 24/09/2002 22:44 GMT

Who Needs A Title Anyway

#3151 Posted by mcgruff [24.112.59.57], 24/09/2002 22:44 GMT , Refers to Post #3147

limey assmasters

Yeah, and you can take you racist comment and shove it up your... no... I shall be polite... anus.

"british" isn't a race, you jackass. and thanks for taking an insult seriously over the internet.

And there's a difference between adding better graphics to QW and illegally ripping the Q3 content. The fact you were after a conversion program shows a lack of effort (as well as knowledge).

yes, i admit, i'm NOT a mapper, and all the mappers i have met so far have called me retarded when i asked them for help. no wonder i wanted a conversion program.

Speaking of which, you still haven't addressed the issue of breaking id's intellectual property rights (which is a crime under both national and international law)

i have on the page. q3toqw is releasing an ORIGINAL pak now. not that you would care, you prefer posting stupid shit on this board to playing quake. but don't worry, apparently, you're not alone.

#3152 Posted by GrindSpire [213.1.128.156], 24/09/2002 22:45 GMT

the physics ARE the gameplay

Damn, and I thought that the weapons and maps had an part in it too. Obviously I'm mistaken. Doesn't making it play with Q3 weapons change the gameplay?

why better graphics is a bad thing, especially since it's not an fps sacrifice

Someone explain to me how this works... And possibly to John Carmac too.

wow, that's great. Q3toQW aims to add better graphics and sounds to QW. but apparently, that's a stupid idea

It's a stupid idea if you do it by illegal ripping of other games content. CPM contains original content, your mod doesn't.

2) q3toqw is free

Would warez by any other name be just as wrong? (if you want help understanding that reference, just ask)

mcgruff Is Still Working On A Title

#3153 Posted by mcgruff [24.112.59.57], 24/09/2002 22:50 GMT , Refers to Post #3148

since when is having older (notice i dont say 'worse', quake graphics still evoke a feel and uniqueness that i have yet to see in any game with 'new' graphics) graphics a disadvantage?

well, then don't use the mod. but this concept escapes qmap peeps. instead of thinking "i don't like that, i don't think i'll use it", you people have to say "that sucks you retard fuck you mate man-u for life".

and if thats what your after, why are you porting q3 gameplay to quakeworld engine and not making a quake engine mod to spice up its graphics? seems pretty ass backwards imo.

that's because you're an idiot. we didn't port over ANY q3 gameplay. not a bit. we simply edited a client, and ported over graphics and sounds. i don't know how 30,000 other people were able to understand this project, but it's beyond EVERY SINGLE PERSON ON QMAP.

also as a side note i'm not entirely sure of the legality of q3toqw anyways, but then again...

it's not legal.

#3154 Posted by GrindSpire [213.1.128.156], 24/09/2002 22:52 GMT

"british" isn't a race, you jackass. and thanks for taking an insult seriously over the internet

Well I would have used the word xenophobic, but I wasn't sure whether you'd understand it. (Oh, and racism is generally, as in this case, used as an all encompassing term to describe xenophobic behaviour and beliefs).

And isn't taking an insult seriously over the internet what you did?

yes, i admit, i'm NOT a mapper, and all the mappers i have met so far have called me retarded when i asked them for help. no wonder i wanted a conversion program.

Actually, you asked for a conversion program before we insulted you...

I'm going to go read your update on the original pak now, comments in a minute.

mcgruff Thought A Title Wasn't Needed

#3155 Posted by mcgruff [24.112.59.57], 24/09/2002 22:54 GMT , Refers to Post #3152

Damn, and I thought that the weapons and maps had an part in it too. Obviously I'm mistaken. Doesn't making it play with Q3 weapons change the gameplay?

no, because they ARE THE EXACT SAME, THEY JUST LOOK DIFFERENT. understand? i didn't think you would.

Someone explain to me how this works... And possibly to John Carmac too.

i would, but since you obviously can't master such concepts as "think" or "eat", i don't think i'll waste the time.

It's a stupid idea if you do it by illegal ripping of other games content. CPM contains original content, your mod doesn't.

CPM did the exact same thing, only they did it for Q3, which makes it legal. besides, q3toqw is moving to an entirely copyright free format.

Would warez by any other name be just as wrong? (if you want help understanding that reference, just ask)

blah blah blah blah blah. q3toqw is moving to an entirely copyright free format. q3toqw is moving to an entirely copyright free format. q3toqw is moving to an entirely copyright free format. q3toqw is moving to an entirely copyright free format.

#3156 Posted by R.P.G. [24.136.214.230], 24/09/2002 22:59 GMT

"british" isn't a race, you jackass.

My retort:

race (rs)
n.
1. A local geographic or global human population distinguished as a more or less distinct group by genetically transmitted physical characteristics.
2. A group of people united or classified together on the basis of common history, nationality, or geographic distribution: the German race.
...

So, British is not a race? I'll be sure to ask you next time I'm unsure of the meaning for a word. Evidently all the dictionaries I have access to are incorrect.

Please also elaborate on what you mean by better graphics. If you're going to include bezier curves, a lovely shader system (please be sure to not make the same mistakes id did (scroll down to "comments on the Quake3 shader system")), the Q3 .bsp format, regional fog, and the whole lot, than that's great. But if you're just including high-res textures and skins, I will be much less than impressed. If you actually are going to include all this, please let me know, as there are many, many features I would love to see.

#3157 Posted by GrindSpire [213.1.128.156], 24/09/2002 23:01 GMT

CPM did the exact same thing, only they did it for Q3

Actually, CPM did completely the opposite thing.

no, because they ARE THE EXACT SAME, THEY JUST LOOK DIFFERENT

Fair enough, I was under the impression that you'd replaced the Q1 weapons with Q3's. That point is no longer valid then.

q3toqw is moving to an entirely copyright free format.

Yes, but you weren't. You WERE (note past tense) ripping.

i would, but since you obviously can't master such concepts as "think" or "eat", i don't think i'll waste the time.

1) Why do you presume I can't master the concepts of thinking and eating. I appear to be alive (suggesting I can in fact eat) and responding to your points (suggesting thought).

2) No, really, I'd be fascinated as to how you've managed to get an increase in poly count with no corresponding decrease in frame rate. Because by doing so you've just rendered the development of new hardware pointless.

mcgruff Is Still Working On A Title

#3158 Posted by mcgruff [24.112.59.57], 24/09/2002 23:02 GMT , Refers to Post #3154

Well I would have used the word xenophobic, but I wasn't sure whether you'd understand it. (Oh, and racism is generally, as in this case, used as an all encompassing term to describe xenophobic behaviour and beliefs).

xenophobe? i don't like brits because i lived in britain for 2 years, and experienced the 'people' (using term loosely) first hand. "OI POOINT HEEE-AH THERE'S A LOVE".

And isn't taking an insult seriously over the internet what you did?

i didn't take it seriously. in all honesty, if i had, i would have started crying long ago and thrown away my computer. no, the reason i'm still here is because i enjoy a good flame war. this one especially, since not one single person here agrees with me, supports me, or is "on my team".

Actually, you asked for a conversion program before we insulted you...

same difference. i came here for the first time, i asked a question, and i recieved a boot in response. who's the xenophobe now?

#3159 Posted by R.P.G. [24.136.214.230], 24/09/2002 23:04 GMT

no, because they ARE THE EXACT SAME, THEY JUST LOOK DIFFERENT.

So the railgun is an exact copy of which weapon from Q1?

There is no hit-scan machine gun in Q1. In Q1, the rocket launcher is actually useful. In Q1, the projectile-based machine guns don't look like an ejactulating penis, unlike the plasma gun. In Q1, the player runs at a decent speed. Etc.

mcgruff Thought A Title Wasn't Needed

#3160 Posted by mcgruff [24.112.59.57], 24/09/2002 23:06 GMT , Refers to Post #3156

bezier curves

i don't know what that is. elaborate, i'll throw it to the coders.

a lovely shader system

already complete, although not up on the page. not at all like the iD system, it's actually more like doom3.

the Q3 .bsp format

coders tried, found difficult. that's why i came here asking for a converter. if anyone has info on q3bsp, lemme know.

regional fog, and the whole lot

regional fog is in. the whole lot? elaborate.

mcgruff Is Still Working On A Title

#3161 Posted by mcgruff [24.112.59.57], 24/09/2002 23:08 GMT , Refers to Post #3159

So the railgun is an exact copy of which weapon from Q1?

the TF engineer's railgun. thanks!

There is no hit-scan machine gun in Q1. In Q1, the rocket launcher is actually useful. In Q1, the projectile-based machine guns don't look like an ejactulating penis, unlike the plasma gun. In Q1, the player runs at a decent speed. Etc.

i, regretfully, don't know what a "hit-scan" machine gun is. but i assure you, q3toqw didn't add any to qw :P

Hmm, No Title

#3162 Posted by wrath [195.58.111.103], 24/09/2002 23:10 GMT

mcgruff;
apparently, the 30,000 people who downloaded the mod disagree with you =/
That's quite alright, I'll just add these to the list of people I'll have to kill before I can die a happy man.

besides, you seem to think stalking some internet map board throwing around juvenile insults is a great way to spend your time.
As opposed to making bloody stupid mods(thx grind)? Yeah.

criticize my mod when you've made your own. but you wouldn't have time to do that, inbetween finger painting and trying to cover up your own insecurities by insulting people whilst hiding behind your monitor.
see? that knee-jerk "do it better yourself" reaction? A typical trademark of the internet dwelling idea man. Now let's watch him defend his territory against the roaming frothing-at-the-mouth internet dwelling cockmaster. (that would be me, for those of you out there keeping score)

For starters, you're right, I don't have time do roll my own mod, I work for a living.

great, i'm arguing with a toothless scumbag limey. mind the social assistance more like, "mate".
first, I'm not british. second, I'm not toothless. third, I don't understand what you're trying to say, try it with one syllable words and shorter sentences. I'm stupid, you see. fourth, I'm not australian either.

if this board was so unimportant here, you wouldn't be working so hard to defend your status on it. iiiiiiironic, you cockmaster.
I'm not really working hard, in fact, I'm doing this with one hand while drafting a design doc for a mod I'm thinking about with the other. it's called doomquake3, we'll do doom style monsters and weapons for q3 and pray to god carmack won't send us a cease and decist. plus, I'm finger painting, but I won't tell you what "digit" I'm doing it with.

you've probably never even tried one of those mods, you just summed them up as "way too complicated for me to understand" and started to deride 'em.
I've played those types of mods.
but no, I haven't played your mod. In fact, if someone held a gun to my head and told me to, I'd ask them to empty the clip into my cranium and then reload it and do it all over.

sort of like how you insulted me before you had read more than 3 lines of what i had written here.
sometimes, less than 3 lines are all I need.

why? so you could look hard in front of people you don't know and will never meet anywhere but over the internet.
People around these parts call me 'death walking', 'the legend' and 'king of all men', I don't need to show off.
(Sometimes, they call me 'garlic breath' and gives me wedgies, but my point still stands.)

that's pretty pathetic.
getting shut down by id after that has already happened to numerous mods of your kind, cause you didn't bother to do your homework, that's pathetic.

no arguement there. you're a fucking idiot.
there you go stating the obvious again...

i can handle anything you dish out. you just caught me off guard with your "i'm a faggot for no reason over the internet because it makes me forget about how much my life sucks" attitude.
handle anything I dish out? caught you off guard?! what do you think this is, some kind of contest? second, you don't know jack about my life, so don't go making assumptions...

what's funny? you're reading the mapping help section on a game map board, and it's probably as close as you'll ever get to a real friend.
I read more or less every post at this board, in more or less every thread, always has. And why did you come here? to play mistar wicked mod-designer?

i gather none of you here are qw players, because you would have known this.
yours truly have been playing quake since qtest, and I still think that the sequels are a fart in a shitstorm compared to the original. hit me again with your gloves of quick conclusions!

Q3toQW aims to add better graphics and sounds to QW. but apparently, that's a stupid idea.
It took a couple of days, but then the dime dropped. welcome to the land of the intellectually enlightened, it is a bad idea.

yes, i admit, i'm NOT a mapper, and all the mappers i have met so far have called me retarded when i asked them for help.
And why is that again?

instead of thinking "i don't like that, i don't think i'll use it", you people have to say "that sucks you retard fuck you mate man-u for life".
that's because you're an idiot.
I have a spare hat of consistency (+3 to basic rethorics), care to borrow it?

i don't like brits because i lived in britain for 2 years
funny that, I don't like you, and I haven't even met you in person yet.

no, the reason i'm still here is because i enjoy a good flame war. this one especially, since not one single person here agrees with me, supports me, or is "on my team".
I have a take-a-hint hat too.

same difference. i came here for the first time, i asked a question, and i recieved a boot in response. who's the xenophobe now?
It's not xenophobia, it's coulrophobia.
look it up, it's a real thing. google it. I dare you.

and finally, LEARN HOW TO USE THE GOD DAMN QUOTE TAG, ASSHOLE!

I swear guys, you pay the airline ticket, and I'll go give this one a swift shovel to the noggin, free of charge.

#3163 Posted by GrindSpire [213.1.128.156], 24/09/2002 23:20 GMT

same difference. i came here for the first time, i asked a question, and i recieved a boot in response. who's the xenophobe now?

Damn right, because I didn't give a valid answer to your question initially.

And yes, I'm a xenophobe because I obviously am merely disagreeing with you based on nationality.

(lowest form of wit it may be, but it does the job).

xenophobe? i don't like brits because i lived in britain for 2 years, and experienced the 'people' (using term loosely) first hand. "OI POOINT HEEE-AH THERE'S A LOVE".

I'm presuming that's supposed to represent a cockney accent (in much the same way Dick Van Dyk meant to in Mary Poppins), and even so, do you realise that there a range of different accents, attitudes and areas in the UK (as well as 4 different countries)?

I've met stupid people from a variety of places, that doesn't mean I begin to hate their country of origin as well as its populace.

And just because you lived here, doesn't mean your nationality based negative stereotyping isn't xenophobic...

#3164 Posted by GrindSpire [213.1.128.156], 24/09/2002 23:25 GMT

and finally, LEARN HOW TO USE THE GOD DAMN QUOTE TAG, ASSHOLE!

I second that motion.

I swear guys, you pay the airline ticket, and I'll go give this one a swift shovel to the noggin, free of charge.

I'll pay for my airline ticket and do it myself, I need a holiday :p

#3165 Posted by mcgruff [24.112.59.57], 24/09/2002 23:29 GMT , Refers to Post #3162

look who's toes i stepped on. WRATH IS PULLING OUT THE BIG GUNS. =~(

i don't know how long it took you to read all of my posts, and then write that long-ass response, but however long it was, is how much of your time i just wasted.

btw, i'm not going to read all that, apparently my retardation affects my attention span as well.

thanks!

#3166 Posted by mcgruff [24.112.59.57], 24/09/2002 23:30 GMT , Refers to Post #3164

look who's a tough guy when he's hiding behind a monitor and a modem!

wrath Is Still Working On A Title

#3167 Posted by wrath [195.58.111.103], 24/09/2002 23:32 GMT

it was worth every second.

and try not to backpedal through your own bullshit when you leave.

#3168 Posted by GrindSpire [213.1.128.156], 24/09/2002 23:41 GMT

Has the retard run out of counter arguements yet?

Who Needs A Title Anyway

#3169 Posted by R.P.G. [24.136.214.230], 24/09/2002 23:45 GMT

#3170 Posted by R.P.G. [24.136.214.230], 24/09/2002 23:46 GMT

That was well worth reading. Cheers. I enjoyed myself.

Hmm, No Title

#3171 Posted by necros [172.138.241.120], 25/09/2002 00:01 GMT , Refers to Post #3169

re: beziers...

mmmmmmm... there are also nurbs. i remember some article mentioning those in q3. or is beziers and nurbs the same thing?

+-+

holy shit! i haven't seen this much action in this thread forever!

+-+
but it's beyond EVERY SINGLE PERSON ON QMAP.

hey! fuck off.

so far, i think it's only been about a dozen or so people who've flamed you, mcgruff. i resent this grand sweeping generalization that you've implied and applied to me.

Excuse Me...

#3172 Posted by kanaeda [66.180.121.115], 25/09/2002 00:03 GMT

but could you kindly refrain from blindly tossing everyone here at qmap into one huge, stinky pile. You've managed to drag out a pointless arguement between 5 or 6 people... i'm glad that constitutes "all you qmap peeps'. Blindly insulting every person on a messageboard is certainly not a good way of gaining popularity for your mod project, regardless of how silly many people here might think it is, myself included. Now politely return to the void of intelligence and courtesy from whence you came.

mcgruff Thought A Title Wasn't Needed

#3173 Posted by mcgruff [24.112.59.57], 25/09/2002 00:42 GMT

hah
blindly insulting? take a look at how qmap responded to my one post here. i don't care if any of the 7 people who post here like my mod project, and i certainly didn't post here to boost its popularity. 30,000 downloads. if you took every single map everyone on this board has made, took the amount of times each one has been played on, added them all together, multiplied that number by 1000, you'd still be about 29,000 short of q3toqw's totals (and think of the countless hours you spent on your maps. that makes me want to laugh) but this ISN'T a popularity contest. all i wanted was to know if you could convert q3 maps to qw. it's qmap people who started this arguement. as far as the "void of intelligence" goes, that would fit qmap better than wherever it is i'm from.

Who Needs A Title Anyway

#3174 Posted by mcgruff [24.112.59.57], 25/09/2002 00:44 GMT , Refers to Post #3170

wow.
you're like a little wrath lapdog

funny to see you slurp on his dong over the internet

#3175 Posted by mcgruff [24.112.59.57], 25/09/2002 00:51 GMT , Refers to Post #3171

sorry, i should have said, every single person on qmap who has posted on the matter.

i came here for 2 seconds worth of help, and i recieved 15 hours worth of flames, and nothing but. if you feel you've been slighted by my generalization, then sorry, but i'm sure you can see where i'm coming from.

wrath Is Still Working On A Title

#3176 Posted by wrath [195.58.111.103], 25/09/2002 00:54 GMT , Refers to Post #3174

you're just jealous cause you don't have one yourself.

#3177 Posted by GrindSpire [213.122.202.62], 25/09/2002 00:55 GMT

Damn right, no one who posted in this arguement (let alone QMap) ever has any of their stuff played...

Hang on, aren't both wrath and kanaeda professional mappers? (with kanaeda working at Ritual, you may have heard of them).

And 30,000 isn't much for a mod. I get about 5000-6000 d/ls per Q3 map, and I'm not even popular (or good :)

Hmm, No Title

#3178 Posted by mcgruff [24.112.59.57], 25/09/2002 00:58 GMT , Refers to Post #3176

at least none on qmap, you're right :P

Who Needs A Title Anyway

#3179 Posted by necros [172.138.241.120], 25/09/2002 01:00 GMT , Refers to Post #3177

thank you, GrindSpire.

mcgruff Thought A Title Wasn't Needed

#3180 Posted by mcgruff [24.112.59.57], 25/09/2002 01:00 GMT , Refers to Post #3177

a professional mapper? is that supposed to impress me? and if wrath told you he's a pro-mapper, he lied. wrath's a professional board-poster. ask him yourself.

30,000 isn't much for a mod? how many dl's did your last qw mod get? ??? ?? /? / ??

Who Needs A Title Anyway

#3181 Posted by mcgruff [24.112.59.57], 25/09/2002 01:02 GMT , Refers to Post #3179

thank him? for what? for perpetuating a flame war against a person who just came here asking for 2 seconds worth of help?

For Pointing Out

#3182 Posted by necros [172.138.241.120], 25/09/2002 01:05 GMT

that us mappers are not mapping (as you would think) for nothing. and honestly, it's not really about the downloads. (well, for some maybe...) mapping is for fun(mostly), and i don't tend to think in terms of how many downloads i'm going to get when i release a map.

#3183 Posted by GrindSpire [213.122.202.62], 25/09/2002 01:07 GMT

a professional mapper? is that supposed to impress me?

No, just pointing out that our stuff gets played.

Who Needs A Title Anyway

#3184 Posted by wrath [195.58.111.103], 25/09/2002 01:10 GMT

I'm a man of many talents, I plot for the rule of earth, I pour my vitriol online for your entertainment, I drink copious amounts of alcohol, I also aspire to be a tiny bit better than Maj at everything I do, and I bash heads for money and sport.

that, and I'm able too keep a position at starbreeze studios, sweden.

but I digress, there are more people here who's working in the industry. cybear, with whom I share offices. and don't forget fingers, he's at 2015 I believe.
doesn't killer work as a level designer too?

mcgruff Is Still Working On A Title

#3185 Posted by mcgruff [24.112.59.57], 25/09/2002 01:10 GMT , Refers to Post #3182

then my point is proven. i don't make mods for downloads, and i don't think map-making is pointless; i was simply trying to show people that you make maps for the same reasons i make mods. if people like it, then fine, if they don't, fine. it's just frustrating when people can't/won't respect the work that went into such projects, whether they like them or not, isn't it?

mcgruff Thought A Title Wasn't Needed

#3186 Posted by mcgruff [24.112.59.57], 25/09/2002 01:11 GMT , Refers to Post #3184

and you took some time out of your busy life to shit on me? I'M SO PROUD.

#3187 Posted by GrindSpire [213.122.202.62], 25/09/2002 01:14 GMT

i don't make mods for downloads

Then why quote your download stats at us?

Who Needs A Title Anyway

#3188 Posted by wrath [195.58.111.103], 25/09/2002 01:14 GMT

I don't even take myself seriously, why should you?

Who Needs A Title Anyway

#3189 Posted by mcgruff [24.112.59.57], 25/09/2002 01:27 GMT , Refers to Post #3188

i don't take you seriously. i came for help, and i stayed for the arguement.

look, would anyone really take the criticism of someone like you seriously?

....

#3190 Posted by DaZ [212.159.37.100], 25/09/2002 02:01 GMT

* DaZ gets the popcorn

#3191 Posted by Scampie [66.231.198.47], 25/09/2002 02:35 GMT

Speedy Thought A Title Wasn't Needed

#3192 Posted by Speedy [213.158.1.3], 25/09/2002 03:13 GMT

damn it, this is mapping help

go create another thread for your personal bullshit arguement

#3193 Posted by distrans [203.29.11.8], 25/09/2002 03:15 GMT

I need to make a door in my map. How do I do it?

Damnation...

#3194 Posted by distrans [203.29.11.8], 25/09/2002 03:16 GMT

Speedy got there first

Bezier Curves VS Nurbs ...

#3195 Posted by metlslime [12.231.113.167], 25/09/2002 04:57 GMT , Refers to Post #3171

they may be related ... i think NURBs are Non Uniform B-Splines, and i think a b-spline is a bezier curve.

Break It Up, Thank You Very Much. PLEASE

#3196 Posted by Fat Controller [203.98.49.151], 25/09/2002 06:58 GMT

This is the Mapping Help thread. Please take this flaccid flame war over to General Abuse, so that when I need to ask a question I can be assured I can spot any answers without wading through several buckets of flamage.

Now.

Medieval textures that aren't ripped from other games, in, or portable to, Q1 format.

Where can I find same to use in the Ontranto Project? Need to fit marshy, underground and town scenes.

Excuse Me ?

#3197 Posted by Abyss [203.220.202.200], 25/09/2002 07:33 GMT

Sorry to interupt, but could someone give me a little help. I am completely new to using IRC programs, (Sorry, hope that doesn't make me a retard (:
But could someone tell me where, what server, whatever, I could find #terrafusion, I think thats one of the ones you guys use?. If it's not to much trouble.

mcgruff, I also think that dumping ALL Qmap users into the same pile, is not a good idea, I didn't like it, but then again, I really don't care, I'm to old to worry about that crap.
Good luck with your mod, if that's what you want to do, and that's what you like, that's all that really matters, doesn't matter one iota what others think of it. Spending your time arguing, insulting/being insulted will get you nowhere fast.

Having said that, it's been a good read so far, carry on!

Oh, anyone?, please don't forget my question at the top, anyhelp greatly appreciated.

Quake on people!!

#3198 Posted by GrindSpire [213.1.134.113], 25/09/2002 08:00 GMT , Refers to Post #3196

I'm presuming you looked through the TeamFern/BigHouse pages (links in thread introduction).

Just trying to think of other textures.

Maybe some of Undule's stuff would fit what you want?

#3199 Posted by GrindSpire [213.1.134.113], 25/09/2002 08:03 GMT , Refers to Post #3197

1) Get mIRC
2) Connect to GamesNet (irc.gamesnet.net but it should already be in the list of servers to choose from.
3) Join #terrafusion
4) Be afraid, be very afraid

Grindspire...

#3200 Posted by Abyss [203.220.202.200], 25/09/2002 08:20 GMT

I am using mIRC, and thank you very much for info

And yes, I am VERY afraid

Thank you again Sir.

#3201 Posted by Maj [193.128.238.152], 25/09/2002 10:29 GMT

i gather none of you here are qw players

Oh dear. I apologise, wrath. You were right, and I was wrong.

#3202 Posted by GrindSpire [213.1.18.166], 25/09/2002 10:43 GMT , Refers to Post #3201

I apologise

Quick! Someone get a photo!

wrath Is Still Working On A Title

#3203 Posted by wrath [195.58.111.103], 25/09/2002 10:52 GMT

maj;
I told you, but you didn't listen. elitist, am I? more like the prophet of mount bullshit.

:)

wrath Is Still Working On A Title

#3204 Posted by wrath [195.58.111.103], 25/09/2002 12:47 GMT

ooh, damn, how could I forget, gandhi started working at starbreeze a short while back.

he's flying mad, that one. :)

To The Moderators

#3205 Posted by daftpunk [147.197.200.13], 25/09/2002 12:58 GMT

is it poss to move the last 100 posts in a different section (like it happens on other forums when you post in the wrong section)

i have been off the site for about 5 days because i have started my uni year and flied from italy to the uk and hell, i havent yet had time to read all posts in case there IS one asking for help in WC or some editor.

i wont even reply to all the senseless posts i have read but then again i dont wanna get caught flaming

take it easy folks.
oh, also if i dont get too involved (i know i wanna) in the fomula student racing and the piano lessons i should have an alpha of a map soon (the first of 3 floors of a map) in about 2 weeks.

#3206 Posted by Scampie [63.167.210.202], 25/09/2002 13:11 GMT

just ignore the posts. that's the best way to deal with it. there wasn't any questions in there anyway.

#3207 Posted by daftpunk [147.197.200.13], 25/09/2002 14:26 GMT

cheers for the texture link. they are kinda good for urban mapping like hl or various mods. hell, fatcon, was there really nothing on bighouse worthwhile.
actually i have to get round dloadin all their textures and look through them with mex. do any of you make your own wad for a particular map. WC unfortunately doesnt like lots of wads (rather the amount of textures) AND i have found duBSP doesnt like a long string (line 3 in my case) with all the wads used whereas qbsp doesnt mind. should i report this to the author as a bug. any solutions (treebsp?)

#3208 Posted by pjw [24.128.56.74], 25/09/2002 18:25 GMT

Oh dear. I apologise, wrath. You were right, and I was wrong.

I'm feeling somewhat the same way (and guessing that all internet communication will be reduced to screetching and flinging of feces (via the ShitFlinger v. 2.34 internet module) in a few more years).

I'm now officially sorry that I asked you to "leave the nice visitor alone".

/me hands wrath a beer

#3209 Posted by GrindSpire [212.140.155.232], 25/09/2002 18:33 GMT , Refers to Post #3208

(via the ShitFlinger v. 2.34 internet module)

Complete with relavent hardware...

/me shudders

:)

ShitFlinger V 2.34

#3210 Posted by Shallow[BAP] [217.158.43.50], 25/09/2002 20:48 GMT , Refers to Post #3208

Based on the same technology as this?

#3211 Posted by pjw [24.128.56.74], 25/09/2002 22:36 GMT , Refers to Post #3210

Most outstanding use of technology EVER.
[/simpsons comic-book guy]

(and I am now shutting up and not bogging down the mapping help thread anymore)

A Map Without A Leak

#3212 Posted by fire reign [66.19.126.151], 26/09/2002 23:50 GMT

Hi again,

I have a map that doesnt have a leak in it. However, it has many windows and skys. I hate covering the skys with brushes so that in servers that use hooks can hook on to the sky. I've been wondering, everytime I fire a grenade on to the skies that are in my map, they always bounce off. Does that mean in a server that uses hooks can hook on to my skies, without having a brush behind my skies to catch the hook?

#3213 Posted by necros [172.140.101.74], 27/09/2002 00:23 GMT

i think so...
there's a reason the grenade doesn't disappear in a sky brush... something to do with the pointcontents not getting checked often or something... (?) anyway, you could always try the map out yourself... ie: compile with no brushes covering sky, and start a local server.

Sky Contents

#3214 Posted by Fingers [205.158.143.224], 27/09/2002 18:53 GMT

Sky in Q1 (I assume that's what you're talking about) acts much like water. If the sky is contained within the level (ie there's solid walls around it), the sky brush is non-solid and rockets/grenades disappear into it rather than exploding or bouncing off (unless the sky is too thin and the projectile travels in and out in less than 0.1 seconds).

If there's nothing behind it, the sky brush is the boundary between the level and the void. It will act like a solid wall and weapons impact with it. I presume the grappling hook will too. So if you want this behavior for some reason, you don't put brushes behind the sky. I don't think it makes any sense to have a solid sky though...

#3215 Posted by Gilt [24.102.24.203], 28/09/2002 01:12 GMT

I don't think it makes any sense to have a solid sky though...

well for purely gameplay reasons, it's sometimes nice to have a solid sky for splash damage. esp. around camping spots that you don't want to clip out.

also see dm6's solid sky in the RA room, which is very useful against RJumpers.

#3216 Posted by Fat Controller [203.98.49.151], 28/09/2002 06:34 GMT

With modern tools (like QBSP) sky brushes touching on the void are given the CONTENT_SKY property, so missiles disappear into 'em.

#3217 Posted by Tef Johs [217.70.229.44], 29/09/2002 19:49 GMT

I just want to know, from anybody who knows german, is it called

"�bersoldat" or "Obersoldat"?

Strange question, heh heh...okay, so I don't know shit about german, and I'm trying to finish up this little RtCW single player pack of mine.

#3218 Posted by nonentity [213.1.45.14], 29/09/2002 20:14 GMT

#3219 Posted by daftpunk [147.197.200.13], 30/09/2002 08:27 GMT

im not german but from what i remember from school

uber means: on top (like for sparrow hawk hovering on top of a bird), better

ober means: higher up, better ranking (if i am not much mistaken)

therefore ubersoldat might mean supersoldier
obersoldat might mean higher ranking soldier.

do i make any sense...er...no!

this probably wont help so try an online dictionary to be sure

#3220 Posted by Tef Johs [129.241.81.186], 30/09/2002 10:50 GMT

Thanks, daftpunk, for the info. That is what I thought also.

Expect my "Operation Vorsichtig", a 40 mb download, to be available sometime on Tuesday October 1st (depending on where you are in the world).

An official release text will follow.

Stay tuned :)

daftpunk Thought A Title Wasn't Needed

#3221 Posted by daftpunk [147.197.200.13], 30/09/2002 13:08 GMT

is operation then pronounced the german way? sorta like operazion. ja..

40 mb is a chinch now that i can use broadband so yep i will dload it as soon as you update up here on qmap.

Wc Hates Big Wads

#3222 Posted by daftpunk [147.197.200.13], 30/09/2002 16:07 GMT

hell, i keep on posting after my previous posts. its 5 o clock now tho...

is there a way of curing the wc dislike of big wads. i KNOW you are gonna tempt me into using quark (which i am sorta scared by because of the converting you have to do to use the .map in other progs) or qeradiant (ok, but yet to learn how to do the vertex editing properly...)

having dloaded all these tasty wads i dont see why i cant have em all. ok so during compule the tools have to do HEAVY work to search for the textures. is there any way of...like extracting the textures OUT of the wad and feeding those to the tools to relieve the strain. doesnt make much sense but its kinda like what you can do for q2.

i do make my own wads but only once i know what texture i have used. so...if i am making a map and choose an additional texture i guess i just need to grab it from the wad and add it to mine.

k, makes enough sense but any suggestions welcome

Use Something Like Texmex.

#3223 Posted by necros [172.150.149.179], 30/09/2002 19:53 GMT

take the textures you want, then make a new .wad file of them. then just use that one wad, instead of using multiple wads.

Tips For Optimization

#3224 Posted by daftpunk [147.197.200.13], 01/10/2002 09:45 GMT

i'll do that. (do i have to export the textures as jpeg and then wad them or is there like special command in the menu: dont answer the question if its totally stupid...)

nobody has replied to my post on the beta section. hmmm, hope there arent probs with my site...
anyway about optimization. what can i do in quake to decrease the number of polys rendered by the engine. in q2 and q3 i know it is done with caulk textures.
in q1 what do i apply to unseen faces? do i then have to make each solid, apply said texture to all faces and then apply another texture to the visible faces.
PLEASE i'd love some tips on this, because all the rest (vertex editing, subtracting, leaks, compiling) has given me no probs which is why my map has turned out just as complicated as i designed it (i now run the p4 so i can't test with the p2 300 which is why, apart from r_speeds and r_drawflat, i can't see how bad it's gonna run on a lower sys.

also. clip brushes arent rendered right? so for instance a ladder can be made with less visible brushes yes? i hope to reduce my step ladders from ~24 brushes to maybe 12.

views on coloured lighting (i dont like strobing lights and all that because it slows down so a tech explanation on how coloured lights MIGHT cause slowdown is useful), and surface lights anyone? transparent lava?

Grahf Thought A Title Wasn't Needed

#3225 Posted by Grahf [192.154.63.186], 02/10/2002 03:20 GMT

The only thing that can really actually help your r_speeds in Q1 is better design. (i.e., making you can't see too much of the map from any specific point)

As for colored lighting, i'd imagine the performance hit is negligable to the point of being nonexistant (granted, to get colored lighting, one must run a modified engine, and those usually are a bit/a lot slower than vanilla glquake...

#3226 Posted by daftpunk [147.197.233.116], 02/10/2002 09:06 GMT

ok, thanks for that. it means i dont need to change too many things. i will make a netplay version of my map with simplified brushes (because octagons and all of those tend to spilt the surfs they touch (like a floor for example) and add more polys)

#3227 Posted by daftpunk [62.252.64.5], 02/10/2002 20:41 GMT

quake has no such thing as avoiding rendering of unseen faces. only unseen brushes yea?

i make most of my brushes so they are dual purpose, like a ceiling which is also the floor of the room above etc.

That's Bollocks.

#3228 Posted by metlslime [12.231.113.167], 02/10/2002 23:44 GMT

#3229 Posted by Jaj [62.83.170.202], 02/10/2002 23:55 GMT , Refers to Post #3227

There is a Qbsp and Vis version that supports Hint, Detail and Skip brushes as in Quake2&3.
You can download it <a
http://quest-ed.sourceforge.net/dl/index.html>here and try it out.

Ehemmm......

#3230 Posted by Jaj [62.83.170.202], 02/10/2002 23:56 GMT , Refers to Post #3229

Correctly wrote now, i hope =)
Download

Speedy Is Still Working On A Title

#3231 Posted by Speedy [213.158.1.170], 03/10/2002 03:09 GMT

just read up some thech docs and r_speed optimisation tutorials to get the better idea

#3232 Posted by daftpunk [147.197.200.13], 03/10/2002 09:29 GMT

#3233 Posted by Grahf [192.154.63.186], 05/10/2002 20:19 GMT

I forgot. I believe it is tyrann (planetquake.com/tyrann) who has a extra compiling utility (run after qbsp) that will essentially remove any poly faces with the texture name "skip." The faces are not rendered, so they show up as HOM in game. Could be useful for putting on roofs or the tops of beams where the player would never go.

The Quest compiling utils do (kinda) do hint, skip, and detail, but many people say they are quite lacking in other respects.

Remove-skip

#3234 Posted by Fern [66.31.244.138], 05/10/2002 21:39 GMT

#3235 Posted by cyBeAr [213.66.231.29], 06/10/2002 10:56 GMT

Isn't it almost only usefull for unseen faces on brush entities?

#3236 Posted by Fern [66.31.244.138], 06/10/2002 18:02 GMT

I use it for one-pixel faces on 2-d details (signs, arrows, etc.) and also for realistic glass that deflects bullets without using the trigger_once/spike trick.

Who Needs A Title Anyway

#3237 Posted by daftpunk [147.197.200.13], 07/10/2002 10:20 GMT

cool, got the quest tools but dunno if i will get round to using them. my best bet is to do all this in a q2 map where i will use these features from the word go.

surface flags are so useful...

sahders for q3 also useful but a rather more complicated in some cases

#3238 Posted by Scampie [63.167.210.202], 07/10/2002 12:42 GMT , Refers to Post #3235

cybear: skip == q3 caulk

#3239 Posted by metlslime [12.231.113.167], 07/10/2002 15:50 GMT

tyrann's skip != q2 skip.

All in all, a confusing choice of name!

Hmm, No Title

#3240 Posted by Speedy [213.158.2.102], 08/10/2002 01:55 GMT

applying the texture that is not in the wad used for compile gives the same effect as this "skip", doesnt it ?

#3241 Posted by daftpunk [147.197.236.119], 08/10/2002 14:47 GMT

checker isnt skip tho...? actually thats q2

doesnt it give you the error surface bad extent or some error when you load the map in q?

Hmm, No Title

#3242 Posted by Speedy [213.158.1.204], 09/10/2002 01:24 GMT

I was wrong. It gives white face with lightmap in gl and hom in some other engines

New Question For Me, Old For You

#3243 Posted by daftpunk [62.252.64.6], 10/10/2002 20:47 GMT

how do i make a brush with a texture but so that it isn't solid (doesnt matter if the player walks over it)

my main objective is to avoid the engine making extra faces on the brush it lies on top.

in short: i wanna put floorlights and weapon markers without carving (i have seen it possible from r_drawflat on quite a few maps i looked at)

dont get pissed of if you heard this question 1 zillion times...sorry bout that...

#3244 Posted by necros [172.139.130.113], 10/10/2002 21:16 GMT

func_illusionary for quake.
quake3 has 'detail' brushes

Daftpunk And Necros

#3245 Posted by Fern [66.31.201.33], 10/10/2002 23:10 GMT

In q1 you should use func_wall instead of func_illusionary if you want the player to walk on the lights and markers instead of passing through them. Neither funcwalls nor illusionaries affect the structure.

#3246 Posted by pjw [24.128.56.74], 11/10/2002 01:18 GMT , Refers to Post #3243

Detail brushes don't really have much to do with what he's talking about (assuming that I didn't misunderstand the question). What you would need in Q3 for that sort of thing is a decal shader (which would be applied to one face of a nodraw brush for your marker). I get the feeling that you weren't referring to Q3, but if I'm wrong, say so and I'll say more and post a sample shader for you . . .

(And yeah, the nodraw brush would be detail, but that's sorta incidental . . .)

Also, Custom Textures

#3247 Posted by Fat Controller [203.98.49.151], 11/10/2002 05:25 GMT

As well as using func_[illusionary|wall] brushes, one can create customised textures where the light and any trim is already in place. The advantage is that brushes are fewer and broken up less, since trims and lights are already in place. Take a look at Vondur's ceiling in ZED2 for an example.

Zenk Yu Messeurs

#3248 Posted by daftpunk [147.197.200.13], 11/10/2002 10:20 GMT

true, i just loaded about 100 maps yesterday in quake (no bots, just looking round and sorting the ones i like) and saw a couple maps with said textures. seems a good idea but i am a bit lousy at textures (also because i am not yet good at making brushes dependent on the textures: i do the opposite which is wrong but i am gradually switching...)

thanks for func wall and illusionary, it will make some of my stuff easier. but if i make crates should i make them walls or brushes. i remember someone talking about not having too many func walls in a map. i just wanna reduce face splits in stuff like floors and also where i have irregular rocks it tends to make all sorts of triangles on the surface they rest on.

so maps had nice grassy bits sticking out the earth. LOVE that, gotta read all the readme files now to send love mail to those funky mappers!

Trigger_push Problem

#3249 Posted by MisYu [213.76.244.129], 12/10/2002 12:03 GMT

Hi!

Check this one, please: http://www.planetquake.com/misyu/pusz.zip

Let me copypaste the readme:

Check pusz2.bsp to see, how it should work properly. Go to the opposite corner and you'll be pushed up by just touching the trigger.
Now load pusz.bsp and again go to the opposite corner. You won't be pushed until you jump on your trigger. Notice how weird it looks when you're glued to trigger_push.

pusz2.bsp was made in Worldcraft 1.6 with TreeBSP, everything works fine. It is obvious, that we aren't able to "convert" our map from 3.4 to 1.6 and compile it there, because of total mess in textures alignment, some brushes' shapes, different entities et caetera.

pusz.bsp was made in Valve Hammer Editor 3.4 with DuBSP. Now, Hammer doesn't do anything unusual with our trigger. Ignore "angles" key instead of "angle", it's hammer's and it works properly in Q1. Anyway, I'll mention that: changing angles to angle, messing around with various values of those keys doesn't help.
All in all it seems that something is corrupted with DuBSP, the only one bsp compiler that hammer users are forced to use. But maybe I'm wrong?

Anyone can help?

P.S. Forgive me that there's no light, no vis and push is just an invisible block in one of the corners. You should find it anyway, you're smart. Or, at least, you ought to be :P

Trigger_hurt

#3250 Posted by MasterMind [12.229.160.243], 12/10/2002 21:24 GMT

Is there anyway I can get a trigger hurt to start OFF rather than ON? Im trying to get a button to trigger the trigger_hurt so it'll kill everyone in the level. Thanks.

#3251 Posted by Fern [66.31.201.33], 12/10/2002 22:43 GMT

why not just have a massive skip-textured func_door with a high speed and damage rating directly above the level that passes through the level when you press the button? :)

only problem is, this will only work as a one-time thing because if the "toggle" flag is set, the door will snap back open when it hits something instead of crushing everything else in its path

Don't Know If This Will Help But....

#3252 Posted by Jaj [62.83.167.124], 13/10/2002 02:28 GMT , Refers to Post #3249

I've seen that pusz uses an "info notnull" meanwhile pusz2 doesn't.
I erased the "info notnull" and put "angle" "-1", also added "delay" "0" and voila it worked. (I had to make another changes to make it compatible with my qbsp compiler)

Btw, pusz2 crashes on Gl_Quake, i think it is because its trigger texture is 32x32 instead of 64x64.

32x32 Is Fine In Glquake

#3253 Posted by metlslime [12.231.113.167], 13/10/2002 06:48 GMT

Not Sure . . .

#3254 Posted by MasterMind [12.229.160.243], 13/10/2002 07:38 GMT

Im not sure if that will work because as soon as it hits one player it will automatically go back up, so the people on the floor below wouldn't be effected. Im going for nuke style death here, ala crossfire from half-life. Thanks for the help though.

Not Sure Continued . . .

#3255 Posted by MasterMind [12.229.160.243], 13/10/2002 07:41 GMT

Oops skipped that last paragraph you wrote. Yeah, im going for a half-life crossfire effect. Im going to make a bunker so no one will get killed if they are inside it. Thats also where the button will be.

Jaj Is Still Working On A Title

#3256 Posted by Jaj [62.83.171.62], 13/10/2002 13:29 GMT , Refers to Post #3253

Yes in most of cases, but not in GlQuake v0.97&v0.98.
I made a prove with Gl 0.98 and it crashed, so i assumed that it'd be the same with the rest of engines, but no, it works with newer versions as gqquake, fitzquake, darkplaces etc... it also works in winquake.
And crashed again with D3dquake =).

Mastermind...

#3257 Posted by distrans [131.172.4.45], 14/10/2002 03:59 GMT , Refers to Post #3255

If you are going to target the trigger_hurt with a button then you'll need to give the brush entity a name. As far as I can tell, giving a brush entity a name in

makes them dormant until triggered.

#3258 Posted by Fern [66.31.201.33], 14/10/2002 06:10 GMT

not a trigger_hurt. I tried it.

I've Been Through The Code...

#3259 Posted by Wazat [144.38.206.25], 14/10/2002 17:32 GMT

...and I can tell you that trigger_hurt doesn't wait for anything. :( You've gonna have a tough time doing it in vanilla quake, but you might try a mod of some sort (ie voidents on my site).

#3260 Posted by necros [172.157.156.213], 14/10/2002 18:32 GMT

coding a triggerable trigger_hurt wouldn't be too hard. remove the self.touch function and put that function as a self.use. set up a small part to control delay and wait and all that stuff (probably can be cnped from regular trigger code).

#3261 Posted by MasterMind [12.229.160.243], 15/10/2002 01:00 GMT

. . . so how would I do that in Worldcraft? If it requires programming I wont be able to do that then. I have no knowledge of programming.

You Can't Edit QC In Worldcraft

#3262 Posted by Fern [66.31.201.33], 15/10/2002 01:21 GMT

Suggestion 2...

#3263 Posted by distrans [203.29.11.102], 15/10/2002 03:21 GMT , Refers to Post #3261

Oh, and thanx Fern - it would be the one brush entity that doesn't...

So, maybe target each of the monsters in the scenario with 2 incoming beasties. That is name each of the monsters then target each name with two teleporting zombies. The teleporter names would all be the same and that name would be triggered by the switch. Doesn't matter if the targetted monster is dead or alive as the incoming beasties will instafrag each other at the spot where a dead monster died.

#3264 Posted by MasterMind [12.229.160.243], 15/10/2002 05:17 GMT

Im not lookin' at making a single player level. Im trying to recreate the gameplay of the map crossfire for half-life. In the level, there is a huge bunker in which there is a button that calls in a nuclear air strike. Once pushed, everyone in the level will hear the sirens screaming and they will have about 30 seconds to run from one end of the level to the bunker where they will be safe from the air strike. After the time is up the level is flashed in a bright light and everyone outside the bunker dies.

Im trying to do the same effect with quake deathmatch. Im not neccesarrily trying to figure out how to make a siren call or a bright flash when it happens. Maybe just a simple counter in the middle of the screen would do so they know how much time they have left to get to the bunker.

When I originally had this idea I thought I could just have a button and make it target a trigger_hurt that started off and put a 30 second delay on it. If I could do that, everything would be peachy. I've done this for half-life, but it seems impossilbe to do for quake.

Aaaaaaahhhhh...

#3265 Posted by distrans [203.29.11.102], 15/10/2002 07:23 GMT , Refers to Post #3264

Easy!

Several large teleport brushes that cover all the level except the bunker.

The brushes all have the same name and delay before trigger (or you could use CZGs on screen countdown using bouncing relays...I'll try and track down the set-up for this tonight).

Target the tele brushes with the button.

The tele destination for the tele brushes is a smallish room with a very deadly trigger_hurt in the top half, which is matched to a Full bright *white texture.

The walls/floor/ceiling of the room are "black" and the bottom half of the room is separated by a func_illusionary "black" brush so the players get blown into a black void after being instagibbed in a blinding flash.

Any better?

#3266 Posted by distrans [203.29.11.102], 15/10/2002 07:44 GMT

...and why the need for the trigger_hurt if all the extant players are being teleported to the same point?

Last man/woman standing

or in case there's only one extant player.

#3267 Posted by Wazat [144.38.206.24], 15/10/2002 19:16 GMT

You'll be giving people telefrag points for getting killed though. They get taken away by the guy that in turn telefrags them, but will someone there possibly come out on top?

That's an interesting idea though. You won't get to see any gibbage, but it'll do quite nicely.

#3268 Posted by MasterMind [12.229.160.243], 15/10/2002 21:41 GMT

Great idea!! Im going to go work on it NOW!!! Thanks!!!

#3269 Posted by MasterMind [12.229.160.243], 15/10/2002 22:57 GMT

I figured maybe I could make a whole ton of trigger_teleports around the level teleporting the player to a bunch of different spots in the 'death room' so no one would get telefragged. But this results in very high epoly's. If I could just figure out how to make a trigger_hurt start OFF, it would make my life a lot easier.

#3270 Posted by necros [172.167.140.191], 15/10/2002 23:24 GMT

you can try, but you won't get anywhere. it's impossible with the regular code.

you could make a big door, with a 'Wait' of -1, and the 'toggle' flag on. then, have the door trigger once. this will cause the door to crush *everything* and stop in the 'open' position. the have a trigger_relay to close the door back to it's original position.

that's the only way i can see to do what you want to do.

#3271 Posted by distrans [131.172.4.45], 16/10/2002 03:00 GMT

Wazat - the trigger_hurt is there to take care of the last person standing after the telefrag festa.

Mastermind - who cares if they're telefragged or not, you just want to kill 'em...right?

Why not:

1. Design the level so the bunker is at the highest point, lowest point or hanging off the side of the main body.

2. Use a single teleport brush to cover all the level except the bunker.

3. Use a small telefrag/_hurt room with a single teleport_destination.

4. Check out CZGs first 100 brush offering and track down a copy of his level "Sky Palace" both of which use the all level teleport to death routine. The .txt for Sky Palace also outlines the relay setup for the on screen countdown.

#3272 Posted by metlslime [12.231.113.167], 16/10/2002 09:02 GMT

I figured maybe I could make a whole ton of trigger_teleports around the level teleporting the player to a bunch of different spots in the 'death room' so no one would get telefragged. But this results in very high epoly's.

1. brush models are wpolys, not epolys.

2. triggers aren't drawn, so there are no wpolys to worry about either.

3. there are other things to worry about, though, like efrags. And edicts.

4. Most quake players don't like those sorts of gimmicks anyway. Is this worth it?

5. if yes, do what necros suggests in 3270.

#3273 Posted by Wazat [144.38.206.25], 16/10/2002 17:14 GMT

Sounds like the door would work wonders, as long as it was fast. I believe you can make a door out of clip textures (so it will be invisible and won't disrupt bullets), as long as at least one brush on it is not clip. So, put some brush that won't be seen on it, like at the top, never to pierce the sky. 'course, if the door's fast enough, this may not even be needed...

I'd still say use a mod, as then you could get exactly the effect you needed, could have the countdown and everything, and could print the correct deathmessages and stuff. But, then people couldn't play their fav mods in your map. :(

Didn't Somebody Already Say..

#3274 Posted by Fingers [205.158.143.224], 16/10/2002 21:49 GMT

..that the door won't work because it'll go right back up after it hits the first victim. (whoever is at the top floor of the map)

#3275 Posted by metlslime [12.231.113.167], 16/10/2002 21:50 GMT

if wait = -1, it will crush any obstacle and keep going.

#3276 Posted by daftpunk [62.252.64.6], 17/10/2002 10:24 GMT

to avoid crushing the ppl in the bunker you can make the door a special shape right. then all you need to do is make your map so there are no areas on top or below the bunker, right?

and if you can do all of it in vanilla quake it would help. nothing wrong with mods, just make 2 versions of the map if you can...
keep it up

Actually...

#3277 Posted by Wazat [144.38.206.24], 17/10/2002 15:57 GMT

You could have areas above and below the bunkers as well. You can have multiple doors, each taking care of it's part of the map, going only as far as they need to. They're all targeted the same.

I've Always Observed...

#3278 Posted by Fern [66.31.201.33], 17/10/2002 18:41 GMT

that when I have a door toggled, it does NOT continue to its destination when encountering an object, but returns to the prior position. I've used this in maps to make monsters block barriers (like the zombie/fiend trick in e1m3.) without the toggle flag checked, the door just crushed the monster without rebounding back.

bleh, somebody else try it :P

And Also...

#3279 Posted by Fern [66.31.201.33], 17/10/2002 18:42 GMT

without the toggle flag checked, the door just crushed the monster without rebounding back.

I suppose that's what you want except the catch is that it'll only work once.

Who Needs A Title Anyway

#3280 Posted by MasterMind [12.229.160.243], 17/10/2002 20:16 GMT

Well thanks for all your help but I think I'll ask Rocketman (coder of the Rocketland mod) to create a new trigger_nuke entity or something. I've already talked to him about it and says he could do it, although he never mentioned IF he would do it =).

Metlslime: Yeah it is kind of a gimmick, but I mostly just make maps for one server (Rocketman's server) and everyone there likes new fun twists in maps. And if I could get it to work right, I think it could be as fun as crossfire was in half-life. I really, really likes that map.

#3281 Posted by necros [172.129.90.227], 19/10/2002 03:03 GMT

if you put wait -1, w/toggle, on. the door will behave like a wait -1 door (crush until dead) but retain the ability to go back to it's starting position (unlike a wait -1 door).

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